Old SubTalk Archive Posts 2000-2999
NEXT>2003
PREVIOUS>1991
POSTER>Philip Dominguez
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SUBJECT>Re: IRT Model R110 Subway Cars
DATE>Jun 21 13:11:25 1997
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Posted by Philip Dominguez on June 15, 1997 at 08:37:05:
In Reply to: [5]IRT Model R110 Subway Cars posted by Phil Dominguez on
June 13, 1997 at 15:43:13:
Please disregard the last message that has my name on it.
I Happen to dis-like the R-110a's and whoever used my name.
-Phil
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NEXT>
PREVIOUS>1999
POSTER>Michael Berson
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SUBJECT>Re: J/Z "EXPRESS" Service ???
DATE>Jun 21 13:11:26 1997
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Posted by Michael Berson on June 15, 1997 at 12:28:23:
In Reply to: [6]Re: J/Z "EXPRESS" Service ??? posted by M.J.S. on June
12, 1997 at 21:51:31:
I think they stopped the express service between Myrtle and Eastern
Parkway when the skip-stop service was introduced. Making either the J
or Z express would probably upset some riders east of Eastern Parkway,
because one line would have to remain as a local.
How about this...
The express tracks between Myrtle and Eastern Parkway could be used by
trains to/from Canarsie. You could establish a new route beginning at
Rockaway Parkway. After Atlantic Avenue, the train would take the
un-used cutoff and ride the express tracks to Marcy Avenue. From there
the trains would go over the Wiliamsburgh Bridge and take the un-used
cutoff to 6th Avenue. This would be like the old K (KK) route except
the train would run express in Brooklyn and terminate at Rockaway
Parkway. The old K failed because it was too slow. This would give
Broadway-Brooklyn service to Wall Street and Midtown.
Any Thoughts??
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NEXT>2016
PREVIOUS>1938
POSTER>Michael Berson
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Haven't seen you in 10 years.
DATE>Jun 21 13:11:27 1997
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Posted by Michael Berson on June 15, 1997 at 12:34:28:
In Reply to: [6]Re: Haven't seen you in 10 years. posted by Bill=Dodo
on June 12, 1997 at 21:55:45:
I completely agree regarding the blue stripes.
I didn't care much for the blue stripe on the old trains (pre R-32's)
but stripe on the R-40M's, R-42's, R-44's and R-46's did give the
trains personality.
I also miss the blue doors on the R-32 and the single thin light blue
stripe on the R-38's.
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NEXT>2085
PREVIOUS>2000
POSTER>l
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SUBJECT>Re: IRT Model R110 Subway Cars
DATE>Jun 21 13:11:28 1997
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Posted by l on June 15, 1997 at 17:36:05:
In Reply to: [5]Re: IRT Model R110 Subway Cars posted by Philip
Dominguez on June 15, 1997 at 08:37:05:
Why can't you consider the fact that someone might have the same name
as you?
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NEXT>2060
PREVIOUS>1975
POSTER>Steve
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SUBJECT>Re: A train
DATE>Jun 21 13:11:29 1997
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Posted by Steve on June 15, 1997 at 23:33:41:
In Reply to: [6]A train posted by Sammy on June 14, 1997 at 07:20:11:
The Rockaway Branch of the LIRR is used by the A train from The
Rockaways to Liberty Junction where the A train changes to the Fulton
St. Line. The LIRR ROW continues north through Ozone Park and Across
Atlantic Ave, At one time, there were connections to the Brooklyn
Branch there. It continues to run parallel to Woodhaven Blvd. into
Forest Hills where it joined the LIRR main line at the 'White Pot
Underjump' (city bound).
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NEXT>2008
PREVIOUS>1984
POSTER>Steve
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SUBJECT>Re: IRT Track Connections to BMT/IND
DATE>Jun 21 13:11:30 1997
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Posted by Steve on June 15, 1997 at 23:40:16:
In Reply to: [6]IRT Track Connections to BMT/IND posted by Peggy
Darlington on June 13, 1997 at 22:21:10:
The two main connections between the B division and the A division are
the 207th Street flyover which connects the #1 B'Way line with 207th
St. Yard and 5 track in Concourse yard which leads to the #4 line
south of Bedford Park.
Please note that these connections are accomplished via yard
connections while the one at Queenssboro Plaza does not. This is
because the cars on the #7 line are equiped to operate with B division
signals while no other IRT equipment is.
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NEXT>2062
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>Steve
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>For the record.
DATE>Jun 21 13:11:30 1997
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Posted by Steve on June 15, 1997 at 23:58:05:
In Reply to: [5]Re: Welded Rail - Facts posted by M.J.S. on June 12,
1997 at 16:00:16:
I don't intend to continue to trade barbs with you over this subject.
I disagree with you and you will not change my mind. Let me conclude
it by giving you 2 bits of information to end this innocuous
discussion.
1). Your statement about riding the trains is totally incorrecct.
Unless there is a motorman (train operator) or conductor contributing
to this site, I likely log more subway miles than you & any ten other
contributers.
2) Yes, I do smell the urine and see the feces , and the garbage, aand
the gum and sometimes, even the graffiti. They are, sadly enough, part
of the system although not by choice. They are symbols of the lack of
moral character of a very small percentage of the riders. However,
despite the urine, feces, gum, garbage and graffiti the NYCT subways
run 30,000,000
(thats 30 million) miles per month with an astounding safety record.
The system operated 24 hours per day, 365 days per year without a
break. The cars are operating with an MDBF of over 70,000 miles. Say
what you will, no system in the world comes close to those numbers.
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NEXT>2056
PREVIOUS>1949
POSTER>Jimmy
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SUBJECT>Re: What are interlocking signals?
DATE>Jun 21 13:11:31 1997
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Posted by Jimmy on June 16, 1997 at 00:02:38:
In Reply to: [5]Re: What are interlocking signals? posted by Bingo on
June 13, 1997 at 10:16:44:
It sounds like you have inside information. As cavalair as it may
sound, we have a saying for such unfortunate occurrences:
"SHIT HAPPENS"
BTW, did anyone lose their job?
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NEXT>2025
PREVIOUS>2005
POSTER>Gerry O'Regan
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: IRT Track Connections to BMT/IND
DATE>Jun 21 13:11:32 1997
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Posted by Gerry O'Regan on June 16, 1997 at 09:51:25:
In Reply to: [6]Re: IRT Track Connections to BMT/IND posted by Steve
on June 15, 1997 at 23:40:16:
It would make sense if 207th St. Shop (as opposed to Coney Island) was
the primary overhaul/heavy repair site for the main line IRT cars
since there is direct access. Is this the case?
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NEXT>2010
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>Mark S Feinman
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Javits Center Service Idea
DATE>Jun 21 13:11:33 1997
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Posted by Mark S Feinman on June 16, 1997 at 13:32:57:
Hi all.
What about the possibility of running a shuttle consisting of LIRR
equipment from Penn Station to a new island platform that would be
built on the northern-most portion of the LIRR Caemerrer (sp) yard in
Manhattan? The shuttle would run only during Javits Center events (a
la the now-defunct Aqueduct special). A free transfer using MetroCard
could be utilized instead of building a separate transfer to the
shuttle.
It's not a one-seat ride to the Javits Center but it would be
inexpensive if compared to other alternatives like extending the 7 or
the L. The Caemerrer yard borders 34th St and so does the Javits
Center, making it a short walk from the proposed station.
Thoughts?
--Mark
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NEXT>2021
PREVIOUS>2009
POSTER>Peter Rosa
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Javits Center Service Idea
DATE>Jun 21 13:11:34 1997
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Posted by Peter Rosa on June 16, 1997 at 15:49:32:
In Reply to: [6]Javits Center Service Idea posted by Mark S Feinman on
June 16, 1997 at 13:32:57:
[re LIRR shuttle from NYP to Javits Center]
It sounds to me like a terrific idea. There's a pressing need for a
major expansion of the Javits Center, as it's already very much a
second-rate convention center in terms of size. Trouble is, increasing
the center's capacity will be only a second-rate solution unless
something can be done about transit access.
In addition to being far easier and cheaper to build, an LIRR shuttle
might prove more popular with some convention-goers. Sad to say, there
are still many people from other parts of the country who are scared
to death of the subway (I know, what a bunch of cowards ...), but who
presumably would be willing to ride LIRR trains.
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NEXT>2013
PREVIOUS>1978
POSTER>Gary Jacobi
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: R-10
DATE>Jun 21 13:11:35 1997
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Posted by Gary Jacobi on June 16, 1997 at 16:27:45:
In Reply to: [5]Re: R-10 posted by WILLIAM A. PADRON on June 12, 1997
at 17:29:10:
I have a question for you. I too fondly remember the r-10's, but
cannot recall one detail. What was the original floor covering? I
recall that it was rather striking, and that late 50's efforts to
refinish it were a disaster; looking something like cheap driveway
resealer.
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NEXT>
PREVIOUS>1940
POSTER>Gary Jacobi
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: I GOTZ A QUESTION HEA!
DATE>Jun 21 13:11:36 1997
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Posted by Gary Jacobi on June 16, 1997 at 16:45:22:
In Reply to: [5]I GOTZ A QUESTION HEA! posted by Name on June 12, 1997
at 16:23:58:
This is a very humorous mock question, and if I had seen it first I
would have answered that the subway is like the armed services in that
it's great to reminisce about it, but nobody in their right mind would
want to live in it. I can't believe that your Brooklynese spelling
offended some. I'm always glad to "hear" it, even in print.
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NEXT>2014
PREVIOUS>2011
POSTER>WILLIAM A. PADRON
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: R-10
DATE>Jun 21 13:11:38 1997
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Posted by WILLIAM A. PADRON on June 16, 1997 at 16:50:17:
In Reply to: [5]Re: R-10 posted by Gary Jacobi on June 16, 1997 at
16:27:45:
Based upon my personal recollection of the R-10's, the original floors
were of a substance covering over the underframe known as "tucolith"
with very
decorative steel-like groove patterns that were shaped like diamonds
around the center stanchions (poles) and double lines surrounding the
passenger seating. After the normal wear and tear on the floor, it
would be subject to repainting or surfacing (a normal practice that
even continues today on the museum cars R-7A #1575 and R-12 #5760).
Starting with the repainting of the R-10's to the "turquoise"
blue/white scheme of 1965-66, the cars' floors were starting to have
either new checkboard tiles (the first known car was #3331) or whole
grey linoleum covering (which the NYCTA obviously prefer). During the
1984-1986 GOH Rehabilitation Project of the selected 110 Westinghouse
units repainted in the "Green Hornet" scheme, all floors had received
a new beige linoleum covering design.
-William A. Padron
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NEXT>2049
PREVIOUS>2013
POSTER>WILLIAM A. PADRON
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: R-10
DATE>Jun 21 13:11:38 1997
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Posted by WILLIAM A. PADRON on June 16, 1997 at 16:50:41:
In Reply to: [5]Re: R-10 posted by Gary Jacobi on June 16, 1997 at
16:27:45:
Based upon my personal recollection of the R-10's, the original floors
were of a substance covering over the underframe known as "tucolith"
with very
decorative steel-like groove patterns that were shaped like diamonds
around the center stanchions (poles) and double lines surrounding the
passenger seating. After the normal wear and tear on the floor, it
would be subject to repainting or surfacing (a normal practice that
even continues today on the museum cars R-7A #1575 and R-12 #5760).
Starting with the repainting of the R-10's to the "turquoise"
blue/white scheme of 1965-66, the cars' floors were starting to have
either new checkboard tiles (the first known car was #3331) or whole
grey linoleum covering (which the NYCTA obviously prefer). During the
1984-1986 GOH Rehabilitation Project of the selected 110 Westinghouse
units repainted in the "Green Hornet" scheme, all floors had received
a new beige linoleum covering design.
-William A. Padron
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NEXT>
PREVIOUS>1968
POSTER>Gary Jacobi
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Elevated Stations
DATE>Jun 21 13:11:39 1997
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Posted by Gary Jacobi on June 16, 1997 at 16:53:24:
In Reply to: [5]Re: Elevated Stations posted by Dave Pirmann on June
13, 1997 at 21:02:54:
By field trip, what did you have in mind? The stretch of ex BERR on
Fulton St. between Alabama ave and Crescent street I hope. By the way,
I've been out of circulation for about eight weeks for Cancer surgery;
It's good to be back among felow subway nuts.
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NEXT>2027
PREVIOUS>2002
POSTER>Gary Jacobi
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Haven't seen you in 10 years.
DATE>Jun 21 13:11:40 1997
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Posted by Gary Jacobi on June 16, 1997 at 17:02:22:
In Reply to: [5]Re: Haven't seen you in 10 years. posted by John on
June 12, 1997 at 19:39:07:
A great retired car summary, John, but what does LAHT stand for. I
deduce non-stainless steel from the context.
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NEXT>2026
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>Pete Brush
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>B-Train
DATE>Jun 21 13:11:41 1997
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Posted by Pete Brush on June 16, 1997 at 18:54:42:
Surely there are enough letters in the alphabet so that the B could be
called something else when it's going to Queens?
Stuck on Roosevelt Isle
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NEXT>2019
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>Lefty
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Yankees vs. Mets subway series
DATE>Jun 21 13:11:42 1997
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Posted by Lefty on June 16, 1997 at 19:35:25:
wouldnt it have been cool if the mta took like 2 cars, painted one in
mets colors and one in yankees, and had the mets symbollically take
that 2 car train from shea stadium to yankee stadium, and get media
coverage etc.. and maybe keep those 2 cars for future series going to
yankee stadium or to shea stadium.. it would be cool..
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NEXT>2020
PREVIOUS>2018
POSTER>Zack
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Yankees vs. Mets subway series
DATE>Jun 21 13:11:43 1997
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Posted by Zack on June 16, 1997 at 20:38:15:
In Reply to: [6]Yankees vs. Mets subway series posted by Lefty on June
16, 1997 at 19:35:25:
that would be cool. maybe refurbished redbirds all fixed up fancy
becouse they probally dont want to ride in stock subway cars
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NEXT>2023
PREVIOUS>2019
POSTER>Charles
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Yankees vs. Mets subway series
DATE>Jun 21 13:11:44 1997
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Posted by Charles on June 16, 1997 at 20:40:25:
In Reply to: [6]Yankees vs. Mets subway series posted by Lefty on June
16, 1997 at 19:35:25:
It is funny you mentioned that. I hear that the TA was planning to
make an ad train of Flushing R33's in a METS paint scheme.I do not
know if this plan is going to take place. But I do know that the cars
that they are going to do it with are still sitting in Coney Island
Yard.
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NEXT>2022
PREVIOUS>2010
POSTER>Charles
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Javits Center Service Idea
DATE>Jun 21 13:11:44 1997
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Posted by Charles on June 16, 1997 at 20:48:00:
In Reply to: [6]Javits Center Service Idea posted by Mark S Feinman on
June 16, 1997 at 13:32:57:
Just a techinical question. I never heard of Caemerrer yard. Are you
refering to West Side Storage facility?
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NEXT>2035
PREVIOUS>2021
POSTER>Andrew Huie
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Javits Center Service Idea
DATE>Jun 21 13:11:45 1997
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Posted by Andrew Huie on June 16, 1997 at 20:58:24:
In Reply to: [6]Re: Javits Center Service Idea posted by Peter Rosa on
June 16, 1997 at 15:49:32:
Actually, why not combine two ideas? If the service to JFK is created
on the LIRR ROW, why not have an LIRR route going direct from JFK to
Javits, with a stopover at Penn Station? That would allow
convention-goers to go directly to the center, without having to
switch trains or deal with traffic. Also people from Newark airport
could take NJT to Penn, and transfer to this new route to go either to
Javits or JFK.
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NEXT>2036
PREVIOUS>2020
POSTER>Andrew Huie
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Yankees vs. Mets subway series
DATE>Jun 21 13:11:46 1997
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Posted by Andrew Huie on June 16, 1997 at 21:05:12:
In Reply to: [6]Yankees vs. Mets subway series posted by Lefty on June
16, 1997 at 19:35:25:
Hmm, wouldn't it take a long time to get a single train from Shea to
Yankee Stadium? How about 2 2-car trains, the first done in Mets
colors and running on the 7 to GCT, the other in Yankees colors
running the rest of the way to Yankee Stadium?
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NEXT>
PREVIOUS>1989
POSTER>Andrew Huie
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: 55th anniversary of death of 2nd Ave El.
DATE>Jun 21 13:11:47 1997
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Posted by Andrew Huie on June 16, 1997 at 21:19:11:
In Reply to: [6]55th anniversary of death of 2nd Ave El. posted by
David Pirmann on June 13, 1997 at 22:49:02:
I'd love to be optimistic about it, but my cynical side tells me,
"election year". Once the election is over, everyone will conveniently
forget the need for the 2nd Ave subway. *sigh*
On a related note, do any signs still exist in the system mentioning
the 2nd Ave el? I read years ago that such a sign was at 111th St on
the 7 ("for lower Manhattan take the 2nd Ave el"), but I missed it. It
is possible the sign is still there but they put a sticker on it, or
has it been replaced completely?
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NEXT>2032
PREVIOUS>2008
POSTER>Lefty
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: IRT Track Connections to BMT/IND
DATE>Jun 21 13:11:48 1997
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Posted by Lefty on June 16, 1997 at 21:19:36:
In Reply to: [6]Re: IRT Track Connections to BMT/IND posted by Gerry
O'Regan on June 16, 1997 at 09:51:25:
i happen to know this because im a 1/9 train person:
the connection to the 207th street yard is one track that merges with
the uptown 1/9 track just a few feet north of the end of the 207th st
station platform. so if they wanted to use that track regularly it
would greatly disrupt service at the 207th st stop..
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NEXT>
PREVIOUS>2017
POSTER>John
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: B-Train
DATE>Jun 21 13:11:49 1997
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Posted by John on June 16, 1997 at 21:26:33:
In Reply to: [5]B-Train posted by Pete Brush on June 16, 1997 at
18:54:42:
What's wrong with B?
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NEXT>
PREVIOUS>2016
POSTER>John
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Haven't seen you in 10 years.
DATE>Jun 21 13:11:49 1997
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Posted by John on June 16, 1997 at 21:33:50:
In Reply to: [5]Re: Haven't seen you in 10 years. posted by Gary
Jacobi on June 16, 1997 at 17:02:22:
LAHT: Low Alloy High Tensile. And yes, LAHT cars are not stainless
steel.
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NEXT>2033
PREVIOUS>1973
POSTER>David Pirmann - Web Site Host
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Subtalk via NNTP?
DATE>Jun 21 13:11:50 1997
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Posted by David Pirmann - Web Site Host on June 16, 1997 at
In Reply to: [6]Subtalk via NNTP? posted by David Pirmann - Web Site
Host on June 13, 1997 at 15:32:46:
Please point your browser to [7]news://nycsubway.org/subtalk to see
the NNTP version of the archives. Let me know if there's problems.
P.s. Don't post there yet... continue to post via the web.
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NEXT>2030
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>Jack Bleiberg
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Grade Crossings
DATE>Jun 21 13:11:51 1997
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Posted by Jack Bleiberg on June 17, 1997 at 01:36:17:
Are there any grade crossings on the new york subway system and are
there any places where there are freight sidings for coustomers to
receve goods.
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NEXT>2037
PREVIOUS>2029
POSTER>Jack Bleiberg
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Grade Crossings
DATE>Jun 21 13:11:52 1997
EMAILNOTICES>no
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Posted by Jack Bleiberg on June 17, 1997 at 01:37:01:
Are there any grade crossings on the new york subway system and are
there any places where there are freight sidings for costomers to
receve goods.
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NEXT>
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>steve lowenthal
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>broad channel ind new relay track
DATE>Jun 21 13:11:53 1997
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Posted by steve lowenthal on June 17, 1997 at 03:43:27:
does anyone have details of the track
layout---proposal
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NEXT>2096
PREVIOUS>2025
POSTER>Julio Perez
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: IRT Track Connections to BMT/IND
DATE>Jun 21 13:11:54 1997
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Posted by Julio Perez on June 17, 1997 at 07:27:45:
In Reply to: [6]Re: IRT Track Connections to BMT/IND posted by Steve
on June 15, 1997 at 23:40:16:
The 7 is the only A-division line equipped to handle B-division
signals. Is it difficult (read: EXPENSIVE) to make the balance of the
A-division compatible with B-division signals so that only one
standard is required systemwide?
Also, with the R-14xs coming into service into the 7 by century's end,
will they still need those induction coils to tell the switches
whether they are local or express trains?
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NEXT>2038
PREVIOUS>2028
POSTER>Julio Perez
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Subtalk via NNTP?
DATE>Jun 21 13:11:54 1997
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Posted by Julio Perez on June 17, 1997 at 07:31:22:
In Reply to: [6]Subtalk via NNTP? posted by David Pirmann - Web Site
Host on June 13, 1997 at 15:32:46:
David, your idea is pretty good, provided that all of us have access
to newsgroup service via our browsers. The medium I am using to access
the Internet does not have a news server set up so I can check on my
favorite newsgroups, and they have not established a timeframe for
availability. If SubTalk could remain available for a while as it
exists today, that would be great.
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NEXT>
PREVIOUS>1953
POSTER>Julio Perez
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: New Routes n' stuff
DATE>Jun 21 13:11:55 1997
EMAILNOTICES>no
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Posted by Julio Perez on June 17, 1997 at 07:41:30:
In Reply to: [6]Re: New Routes n' stuff posted by Gerry O'Regan on
June 13, 1997 at 08:40:20:
Concrete on Roosevelt Avenue east of 46th Street could be done if the
sidewalks were narrowed by about 3-4 feet, providing more area for
asphalt once the steel columns were removed and replaced by concrete
ones down the center of Roosevelt. Parking on the street would have to
be eliminated as well.
As for concrete beds amplifying sounds, MDTA (Metro-Dade Transit
Agency, Dade County, FL) solved that problem by placing concrete
barriers high enough to cover the trucks of the trains, thus reducing
noises when the trains pass close to residential neighborhoods.
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NEXT>2064
PREVIOUS>2022
POSTER>Charles Fiori
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Javits Center Service Idea
DATE>Jun 21 13:11:56 1997
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Posted by Charles Fiori on June 17, 1997 at 08:10:36:
In Reply to: [5]Re: Javits Center Service Idea posted by Charles on
June 16, 1997 at 20:48:00:
Just a historical note. John Caemerrer was a NY politician, from L.I.,
I believe, who died some years back from cancer. Tragically, his
daughter Lisa, was a passenger in a van full of friends who tried to
go around a lowered crossing gate and beat a train on L.I. She was the
only person in the van to survive.
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NEXT>2058
PREVIOUS>2023
POSTER>Dan
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Yankees vs. Mets subway series
DATE>Jun 21 13:11:57 1997
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Posted by Dan on June 17, 1997 at 09:19:26:
In Reply to: [5]Yankees vs. Mets subway series posted by Lefty on June
16, 1997 at 19:35:25:
Some private buses have advertisements covering the entire bus. A
similar
process could be used to create 'Mets' and 'Yankees' subway cars, with
the
ad sponsor picking up the cost as on the buses.
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NEXT>2120
PREVIOUS>2030
POSTER>Peter Rosa
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Grade Crossings
DATE>Jun 21 13:11:58 1997
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Posted by Peter Rosa on June 17, 1997 at 09:21:08:
In Reply to: [6]Grade Crossings posted by Jack Bleiberg on June 17,
1997 at 01:37:01:
There are no longer any grade crossings of public roads on the NYC
subway. The last one was on the L train, close to the Canarsie
terminal, but was eliminated about 25 years ago (someone else may have
a more accurate date on that). I have heard that a yard track at the
238th Street yard in the Bronx (2 train) crosses a public road, though
I haven't been up there to see for myself.
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NEXT>2040
PREVIOUS>2033
POSTER>David Pirmann
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Subtalk via NNTP?
DATE>Jun 21 13:11:59 1997
EMAILNOTICES>no
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Posted by David Pirmann on June 17, 1997 at 10:09:44:
In Reply to: [6]Re: Subtalk via NNTP? posted by Julio Perez on June
17, 1997 at 07:31:22:
Your provider doesn't need to run a news server for you to access
SubTalk via nntp. In fact, it doesn't matter if he does or not-- his
server will not have the SubTalk articles on them anyway! That's one
of the benefits-- browsers can access nntp servers anywhere on the
Net. You simply point your browser to our news server.
In Netscape (and presumably in IE) you simply go to URL
[7]news://nycsubway.org/subtalk. I think current versions of Lynx
support newsreading also.
If you have a UNIX account you can use the popular Tin newsreader by
first setting an environment variable as follows. If you use C-Shell
(or tcsh):
setenv NNTPSERVER nycsubway.org
If you use sh/ksh/bash,
NNTPSERVER=nycsubway.org; export NNTPSERVER
Then invoke tin as "tin -r subtalk". I'm sure other newsreaders work
in a similar manner (using the NNTPSERVER variable).
--Dave
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NEXT>
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>Mark Greenwald
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>The DC metro grows again
DATE>Jun 21 13:12:00 1997
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Posted by Mark Greenwald on June 17, 1997 at 10:19:35:
Just a quick note---he Blue Line on the DC Metro will be extended to
its planned terminus in Virginia---Franconia/Springfield--on June
29th. There are celebrations and free rides on the Metro for anyone
boarding at the new station to anywhere else in the
system--see----www.wmata.com
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NEXT>2043
PREVIOUS>2038
POSTER>Mark Greenwald
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Subtalk via NNTP?
DATE>Jun 21 13:12:01 1997
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Posted by Mark Greenwald on June 17, 1997 at 10:41:34:
In Reply to: [6]Re: Subtalk via NNTP? posted by David Pirmann - Web
Site Host on June 16, 1997 at 22:05:07:
What I saw worked well---kinda like reading e-mail.
Is the entire history of subtalk in there? If it is--I couldn't find
it--If it isn't, good, that means I'm not screwing up.
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NEXT>
PREVIOUS>1981
POSTER>Bingo
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: DISBAND THE WASTEFUL MTA!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
DATE>Jun 21 13:12:01 1997
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Posted by Bingo on June 17, 1997 at 11:21:02:
In Reply to: [5]Re: DISBAND THE WASTEFUL MTA!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! posted by
M.J.S. on June 14, 1997 at 12:53:54:
Yes, if the transit company orders it. Toronto did, from Bombardier.
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NEXT>2045
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>Bingo
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>METRA
DATE>Jun 21 13:12:02 1997
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Posted by Bingo on June 17, 1997 at 11:46:54:
Does anyone know where I can get information on Chicago's Metra
system, or the elevated train?
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NEXT>
PREVIOUS>2040
POSTER>David Pirmann
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Subtalk via NNTP?
DATE>Jun 21 13:12:03 1997
EMAILNOTICES>no
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Posted by David Pirmann on June 17, 1997 at 13:20:45:
In Reply to: [6]Re: Subtalk via NNTP? posted by Mark Greenwald on June
17, 1997 at 10:41:34:
That's about 60% of the total articles ever posted. So far there have
been about 1,950 articles posted and about 1,000 are in the NNTP
archive so far.
--Dave
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NEXT>2047
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>M.J.S.
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>FREE E-MAIL FOR WILLIAM (sorry for disrupting)
DATE>Jun 21 13:12:04 1997
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Posted by M.J.S. on June 17, 1997 at 13:55:08:
In Reply to: [6]Re: R-10 posted by WILLIAM A. PADRON on June 16, 1997
at 16:50:41:
William, I also found another free E-mail service similar to Hotmail,
Rocketmail:
[7]Follow Ups:
* [8]Re: FREE E-MAIL FOR WILLIAM (sorry for disrupting) WILLIAM A.
PADRON 17:07:52 6/17/97 (0)
* [9]Re: FREE E-MAIL FOR WILLIAM (sorry for disrupting) WILLIAM A.
PADRON 17:07:12 6/17/97 (0)
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NEXT>2046
PREVIOUS>2042
POSTER>Ed Sachs
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: METRA
DATE>Jun 21 13:12:05 1997
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Posted by Ed Sachs on June 17, 1997 at 14:37:37:
In Reply to: [6]METRA posted by Bingo on June 17, 1997 at 11:46:54:
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NEXT>2055
PREVIOUS>2045
POSTER>Ed Sachs
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: METRA
DATE>Jun 21 13:12:05 1997
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Posted by Ed Sachs on June 17, 1997 at 14:39:51:
In Reply to: [6]METRA posted by Bingo on June 17, 1997 at 11:46:54:
Try the following web pages:
METRA: http://www.metrarail.com/
CTA: http://www.transitchicago.com/
CHICAGO TRANSIT-METRA RAILFAN:
http://members.aol.com/chirailfan/railfan.html
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NEXT>2048
PREVIOUS>2044
POSTER>WILLIAM A. PADRON
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: FREE E-MAIL FOR WILLIAM (sorry for disrupting)
DATE>Jun 21 13:12:06 1997
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Posted by WILLIAM A. PADRON on June 17, 1997 at 17:07:12:
In Reply to: [6]FREE E-MAIL FOR WILLIAM (sorry for disrupting) posted
by M.J.S. on June 17, 1997 at 13:55:08:
Thank you very much for everyone, including you, for suggesting that I
get
an e-mail address...FAST!!! Based upon certain recommmendations, I
have selected with www.hotmail.com. For anyone who wishes to contact
me on any
questions or certain matter relating to the R-10's (a true speciality,
of course), you may find me at wapadron@hotmail.com. Again, thanks a
bunch!!!
Sincerely,
WILLIAM A. PADRON
P.S. Okay, Dave and M.J.S., start talking...it's showtime!
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NEXT>
PREVIOUS>2047
POSTER>WILLIAM A. PADRON
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: FREE E-MAIL FOR WILLIAM (sorry for disrupting)
DATE>Jun 21 13:12:07 1997
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Posted by WILLIAM A. PADRON on June 17, 1997 at 17:07:52:
In Reply to: [6]FREE E-MAIL FOR WILLIAM (sorry for disrupting) posted
by M.J.S. on June 17, 1997 at 13:55:08:
Thank you very much for everyone, including you, for suggesting that I
get
an e-mail address...FAST!!! Based upon certain recommmendations, I
have selected with www.hotmail.com. For anyone who wishes to contact
me on any
questions or certain matter relating to the R-10's (a true speciality,
of course), you may find me at wapadron@hotmail.com. Again, thanks a
bunch!!!
Sincerely,
WILLIAM A. PADRON
P.S. Okay, Dave and M.J.S., start talking...it's showtime!
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NEXT>2050
PREVIOUS>2014
POSTER>WILLIAM A. PADRON
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: R-10
DATE>Jun 21 13:12:08 1997
EMAILNOTICES>no
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Posted by WILLIAM A. PADRON on June 17, 1997 at 17:18:48:
In Reply to: [6]Re: R-10 posted by Dave Pirmann on June 13, 1997 at
15:29:01:
Thank you very much in sharing your interest of putting information of
the
R-10's, my all-time favorite New York subway car fleet. To repeat, you
have my permission to use any data and facts about the R-10's that I
submit to the SubTalk page without any problems at this time...even to
update the R-10 web page in the car roster section. The E-mail address
is, for the record, wapadron@hotmail.com.
Sincerely,
WILLIAM A. PADRON
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NEXT>2051
PREVIOUS>2049
POSTER>WILLIAM A. PADRON
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: R-10
DATE>Jun 21 13:12:09 1997
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Posted by WILLIAM A. PADRON on June 17, 1997 at 17:19:11:
In Reply to: [6]Re: R-10 posted by Dave Pirmann on June 13, 1997 at
15:29:01:
Thank you very much in sharing your interest of putting information of
the
R-10's, my all-time favorite New York subway car fleet. To repeat, you
have my permission to use any data and facts about the R-10's that I
submit to the SubTalk page without any problems at this time...even to
update the R-10 web page in the car roster section. The E-mail address
is, for the record, wapadron@hotmail.com.
Sincerely,
WILLIAM A. PADRON
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NEXT>2052
PREVIOUS>2050
POSTER>WILLIAM A. PADRON
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: R-10
DATE>Jun 21 13:12:10 1997
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Posted by WILLIAM A. PADRON on June 17, 1997 at 17:37:40:
In Reply to: [6]Re: R-10 posted by WILLIAM A. PADRON on June 13, 1997
at 17:14:43:
There is some clarification that has to be made on certain previous
topics on the R-10's to get a much better picture:
1. In terms of the original "tucolith" floor design, the chemical
compound of the covering was made of magnesite placed over the
aluminum truss plate underframe. This type of design would be subject
to wear and tear, and require repainting and resurfacing in whole or
"patches" (especially around the areas near the door panels).
2. The technical terms for the R-10's side window type by the NYCTA's
definition is "single drop-outside hung" (this also applies to the IRT
R-12/14/15's).
3. In terms of train operation and electrical controls, the R-10's are
only compatible with other R-10's and newer equipment up to the R-42
units.
By the way, cars 1803-1827 (renumbered as 2950-2974 in 1970),
3000-3049 and 3100-3224 have Westinghouse motors and controls, while
cars 1828-1852 (renumbered as 2975-2999 in 1970), 3050-3099 and
3225-3349 have General Electric motors and controls...as they were
originally built and delivered.
4. The "actual final cost" of each R-10 car when brand new was more
than $77,300 apiece in 1948-49. The GOH Rehabilitation project of the
selected 110 Westinghouse cars came in at $65,000 apiece (this was
during between December, 1984 and February, 1986).
Sincerely,
WILLIAM A. PADRON
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NEXT>2053
PREVIOUS>2051
POSTER>WILLIAM A. PADRON
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: R-10
DATE>Jun 21 13:12:11 1997
EMAILNOTICES>no
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Posted by WILLIAM A. PADRON on June 17, 1997 at 17:37:59:
In Reply to: [6]Re: R-10 posted by WILLIAM A. PADRON on June 13, 1997
at 17:14:43:
There is some clarification that has to be made on certain previous
topics on the R-10's to get a much better picture:
1. In terms of the original "tucolith" floor design, the chemical
compound of the covering was made of magnesite placed over the
aluminum truss plate underframe. This type of design would be subject
to wear and tear, and require repainting and resurfacing in whole or
"patches" (especially around the areas near the door panels).
2. The technical terms for the R-10's side window type by the NYCTA's
definition is "single drop-outside hung" (this also applies to the IRT
R-12/14/15's).
3. In terms of train operation and electrical controls, the R-10's are
only compatible with other R-10's and newer equipment up to the R-42
units.
By the way, cars 1803-1827 (renumbered as 2950-2974 in 1970),
3000-3049 and 3100-3224 have Westinghouse motors and controls, while
cars 1828-1852 (renumbered as 2975-2999 in 1970), 3050-3099 and
3225-3349 have General Electric motors and controls...as they were
originally built and delivered.
4. The "actual final cost" of each R-10 car when brand new was more
than $77,300 apiece in 1948-49. The GOH Rehabilitation project of the
selected 110 Westinghouse cars came in at $65,000 apiece (this was
during between December, 1984 and February, 1986).
Sincerely,
WILLIAM A. PADRON
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NEXT>
PREVIOUS>2052
POSTER>Gary Jacobi
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: R-10
DATE>Jun 21 13:12:12 1997
EMAILNOTICES>no
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IMAGE>
LINKNAME>
LINKURL>
Posted by Gary Jacobi on June 17, 1997 at 18:13:15:
In Reply to: [5]Re: R-10 posted by WILLIAM A. PADRON on June 17, 1997
at 17:37:40:
Thanks for the refresher course on the flooring. As soon as I read
your description, I could almost SEE it again! It contained a gritty
material that caused it to almost sparkle. That is the aspect of it
that was missing in all the refinishing attempts. It reminds me of all
the great first generation diesel paint schemes that were replaced by
b paint in the late fifties. Maybe those weren't such great times
after all.
By the way, you are having the same trouble sending multiple followups
that I had at first. There is a 5-10 second delay before a followup is
accepted that looks exactly the same as if you didn't hit Trust me,
wait longer for confirmation, and you won't send multiples any more.
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NEXT>
PREVIOUS>1952
POSTER>Gary Jacobi
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Welded Rail - Facts, to set the record straight
DATE>Jun 21 13:12:13 1997
EMAILNOTICES>no
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Posted by Gary Jacobi on June 17, 1997 at 18:20:21:
In Reply to: [5]Re: Welded Rail - Facts, to set the record straight
posted by M.J.S. on June 12, 1997 at 22:05:33:
And they made sweaters out of it too, didn't they?
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NEXT>2142
PREVIOUS>2046
POSTER>Bingo
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: METRA
DATE>Jun 21 13:12:14 1997
EMAILNOTICES>no
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LINKURL>
Posted by Bingo on June 17, 1997 at 19:03:40:
In Reply to: [5]Re: METRA posted by Ed Sachs on June 17, 1997 at
14:39:51:
Thank you kindly!!!
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NEXT>2183
PREVIOUS>2007
POSTER>Bingo
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: What are interlocking signals?
DATE>Jun 21 13:12:15 1997
EMAILNOTICES>no
IP_ADDRESS> REMOTE_HOST: ; REMOTE_ADDR:
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Posted by Bingo on June 17, 1997 at 19:14:16:
In Reply to: [5]Re: What are interlocking signals? posted by Jimmy on
June 16, 1997 at 00:02:38:
The motorman lost his job, and deservedly. He was totally incompetent
and had made the same error (running the trip) thrice previously
without disciplinary action. You see what I mean about poor
management?
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NEXT>2059
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>Bingo
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>R-44's and 46's
DATE>Jun 21 13:12:16 1997
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Posted by Bingo on June 17, 1997 at 20:09:37:
Are there any people out there who actually like these cars? (I'm not
being sarcastic) Why do tube riders hate them so? These cars were
among the last built in the States, and are representational of their
era.
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NEXT>
PREVIOUS>2036
POSTER>Gerry O'Regan
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Yankees vs. Mets subway series
DATE>Jun 21 13:12:16 1997
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Posted by Gerry O'Regan on June 17, 1997 at 21:26:00:
In Reply to: [6]Yankees vs. Mets subway series posted by Lefty on June
16, 1997 at 19:35:25:
At least the Yankees and Mets is a series between two fairly good
teams and might attract a few subway riders!
Now the Northeast Corridor Worst Series - The pathetic Red Schlocks
versus the Phillies! That one is a true sleeper! (10 innings and
decided by a hit batsman [yawn].........
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NEXT>2099
PREVIOUS>2057
POSTER>John
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: R-44's and 46's
DATE>Jun 21 13:12:17 1997
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Posted by John on June 17, 1997 at 23:23:21:
In Reply to: [5]R-44's and 46's posted by Bingo on June 17, 1997 at
20:09:37:
They're okay, but I like straight-side cars better (especially the
older ones).
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NEXT>2061
PREVIOUS>2004
POSTER>Peter Furuhashi
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: A train
DATE>Jun 21 13:12:18 1997
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Posted by Peter Furuhashi on June 18, 1997 at 02:31:41:
In Reply to: [5]Re: A train posted by Charles on June 14, 1997 at
09:22:04:
This is probably a stupid question, but exactly how do the new subway
cars arrive? By truck?
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NEXT>2066
PREVIOUS>2060
POSTER>Charles
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: A train
DATE>Jun 21 13:12:19 1997
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Posted by Charles on June 18, 1997 at 09:51:59:
In Reply to: [6]Re: A train posted by Peter Furuhashi on June 18, 1997
at 02:31:41:
It is highly dependant on the equipment. The R46's arrived with
trailer wheels in place of it's truck. The R68's were delivered by
having SBK N-1 pull it on to the West End Line and down to Coney
Island Yard. The R62's arrived in a similar way. I am not sure how the
TA plans to have the R142's delivered.
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NEXT>
PREVIOUS>2006
POSTER>Nathan
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: For the record.
DATE>Jun 21 13:12:20 1997
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Posted by Nathan on June 18, 1997 at 16:12:28:
In Reply to: [5]For the record. posted by Steve on June 15, 1997 at
23:58:05:
I totally agree; the NYCMTA does a good job maintaining the system,
considering how large it is.
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NEXT>2095
PREVIOUS>1977
POSTER>Nathan
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Toronto Tube (was Re: NYC screen saver ideas...
DATE>Jun 21 13:12:21 1997
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Posted by Nathan on June 18, 1997 at 16:19:44:
In Reply to: [5]Re: Toronto Tube (was Re: NYC screen saver ideas...
posted by Bingo on June 14, 1997 at 12:24:45:
When were the GO Cars interior changed to blue and white? Weren't the
alarm
strips always in the go cars? I remember when (In 1995) GO Cars were
used to supplement west coast express cars in Vancouver until the WCE
contract was completed, the alarm strips were there, just they had
signs that said
"do not use" or something.
Now, does ANYONE have pictures of the old Aluminum G-Cars? I have
NEVER seen one, and I would really like to!! I will be in TO this
summer,and oops! Sorry, the 50th birthday is in 2004! D'oh!
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NEXT>2081
PREVIOUS>2035
POSTER>Gary Jacobi
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Javits Center Service Idea
DATE>Jun 21 13:12:22 1997
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Posted by Gary Jacobi on June 18, 1997 at 16:35:34:
In Reply to: [5]Re: Javits Center Service Idea posted by Andrew Huie
on June 16, 1997 at 20:58:24:
You guys have great ideas. This stems from being logical and
intelligent. Unfortunately, the entities that would have to get
together and agree on any arrangement like this show no signs of
either attribute.
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NEXT>2089
PREVIOUS>1987
POSTER>Nathan
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Toronto H-6's
DATE>Jun 21 13:12:23 1997
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Posted by Nathan on June 18, 1997 at 16:37:04:
In Reply to: [5]Toronto H-6's posted by Brian W on June 14, 1997 at
19:40:28:
Ok, there was an H-1, H-2, H-4, H-5, and H-6 (no H-3) the cars that
you mention, 55XX and 56XX refers to H-2 to H-5 cars, so I am not sure
which specific car you are talking about. The H-6's were built by UTDC
between 1986 and 1990, but I am not sure, these are probably the icky
orange cars,
but I am not sure. (Oh, by the way, Spadina LRT opens July 27!)
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NEXT>2074
PREVIOUS>2061
POSTER>Gary Jacobi
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: A train
DATE>Jun 21 13:12:24 1997
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Posted by Gary Jacobi on June 18, 1997 at 16:47:56:
In Reply to: [5]A train posted by Sammy on June 14, 1997 at 07:20:11:
Before 1965 I'm pretty sure all cars were delivered by car float to
either the bush terminal area of brooklyn, or the dykman street
facility in upper manhattan. This was at a time when most freight cars
were delivered by car float. From what I read about "no traffic on the
LIRR Bay Ridge branch", I must conclude that this no longer occurs. Do
I smell the Teamsters again? Jeez, guys. I don't hate trucks, can't
your union stop backstabbing everything that runs on rails?
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NEXT>
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>Submit Follow Up
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>MTANYS not NYCMTA
DATE>Jun 21 13:12:25 1997
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Posted by Submit Follow Up on June 18, 1997 at 18:16:45:
In Reply to: [5]Re: For the record. posted by Nathan on June 18, 1997
at 16:12:28:
* [6]GO HERE!!!!!!!!!!!
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NEXT>2077
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>David Lee
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>What happened to J/Z skip stop and express between Marcy and Myrtle?
DATE>Jun 21 13:12:25 1997
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Posted by David Lee on June 18, 1997 at 21:43:18:
I was riding the J train to Jamaica just for the heck of it and while
riding I noticed that the J was not running express from MArcy Ave to
Myrtle Ave. Then after Myrtle Ave, the J made all stops from Myrtle to
Jamaica Center. I was riding on the J at 7:00. What happened to the
express and skip/stop service?
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NEXT>2082
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>~airplane
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Green Line in Boston
DATE>Jun 21 13:12:26 1997
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Posted by ~airplane on June 18, 1997 at 22:29:05:
Question for Bostonians:
1-On my last trip to Boston, I noticed that the D branch of the Green
Line (to Riverside) is much longer than the other branches and has
fewer stops. I assumed that it was converted from an existing rail
line of some sort to a T line. What is the history of this branch?
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NEXT>2073
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>Zack
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>What Happen to the "subway"in this site
DATE>Jun 28 17:49:58 1997
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Posted by Zack on June 19, 1997 at 01:38:15:
i am just curious how come there are more eleveted shots then actual
underground shots. i know the eleveted and the subway are one and the
same but there dont seem to be thet many undergrond shots, unlss
clouds have invaded the subway :)
thanks
zack
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NEXT>2148
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>Nathan
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>San Jose LRT
DATE>Jun 28 17:50:00 1997
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Posted by Nathan on June 19, 1997 at 01:52:14:
Just wondering, the ALRV's used on the San Jose light rail system (I
do not know the present name of the operating organization, they are
rather schizophrenic with their name)are double ended or not. I only
have seen pics of one end of the vehical.
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NEXT>2078
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>subway-buff
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>RE: New Routes & Stuff
DATE>Jun 28 17:50:03 1997
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Posted by subway-buff on June 19, 1997 at 03:26:44:
I have sevral sugegstions:
1- Run N in Manhattan as Express from Canal to 57. Express on 4th ave
Brooklyn at all times.
2- During rush hours in peak direction run a B express as every other
train using the center track on the west end El.
3- Run the B to Queensbridge at all times except when the shuttle.
3-Run the C to 168 at all times,
4- run a D express in Bronx in peak direction to replace C Rush
hour.(every other train is a D express.)
5- Run J/Z on center track to Eastern Parkway in peak direction.
6- Swap the 3& 4 terminals. Run 4 to New Lots at all times, and the 3
to Utica. (They would still run as 4 to Woodlawn and 3 to 148). During
rush hours in both directions a 3 express could run to New Lots giving
those riders an option of East Side or West Side Manhattan. The 3
would still run das it presently does with no Midnight service. The 3
would still run Brooklyn Local and the 4 as Brooklyn Express.
7-Swap E & F Queens Terminal with F going to Jamaica Center and E to
179. During Midnight hours the E would replace F to Queensbridge..
This would give Jamaica patrons 1 train to Coney Island.
8- Run the G to Church Ave using local track and the F as Express to
Church Ave using express tracks and lower level at Bergen.( Yes, I
read the page- they can remove the tile from the stairs to lower level
! )
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NEXT>2083
PREVIOUS>2070
POSTER>Ben-Zion Y. Cassouto
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: What Happen to the "subway"in this site
DATE>Jun 28 17:50:05 1997
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Posted by Ben-Zion Y. Cassouto on June 19, 1997 at 04:18:19:
In Reply to: [6]What Happen to the "subway"in this site posted by Zack
on June 19, 1997 at 01:38:15:
Unfortunately good bright subway shots are difficult to find...
"Gotham Turnstiles" has a couple. BTW, that book have incredibly good
color photography from the early 60s -- a rarity!
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NEXT>2075
PREVIOUS>2066
POSTER>Ben-Zion Y. Cassouto
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: A train
DATE>Jun 28 17:50:08 1997
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Posted by Ben-Zion Y. Cassouto on June 19, 1997 at 04:27:54:
In Reply to: [6]Re: A train posted by Charles on June 18, 1997 at
09:51:59:
By carfloat to NY Regional Rail (the "Cross Harbor") at Bush
Terminal's
51st Street carfloat. Worth trying to see!
Those who don't know should check out Bill Russel's Carfloat WWW Page
[INLINE]
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NEXT>2121
PREVIOUS>2074
POSTER>Ben-Zion Y. Cassouto
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: A train
DATE>Jun 28 17:50:10 1997
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Posted by Ben-Zion Y. Cassouto on June 19, 1997 at 04:34:21:
In Reply to: [6]Re: A train posted by Charles on June 18, 1997 at
09:51:59:
(Let me try that page tag again...)
By carfloat to NY Regional Rail (the "Cross Harbor") at Bush
Terminal's
51st Street carfloat. Worth trying to see!
Those who don't know should check out Bill Russel's Carfloat WWW Page
[7]
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NEXT>2100
PREVIOUS>1995
POSTER>Ben-Zion Y. Cassouto
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Subtalk and Pictures
DATE>Jun 28 17:50:11 1997
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Posted by Ben-Zion Y. Cassouto on June 19, 1997 at 04:39:47:
In Reply to: [6]Re: Subtalk and Pictures posted by M.J.S. on June 14,
1997 at 22:47:23:
(One last try at inserting a page tag...)
By carfloat to NY Regional Rail (the "Cross Harbor") at Bush
Terminal's
51st Street carfloat. Worth trying to see!
Those who don't know should check out Bill Russel's Carfloat WWW Page
[7]
Bill's Carfloat Page
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NEXT>2079
PREVIOUS>2068
POSTER>Ben-Zion Y. Cassouto
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: What happened to J/Z skip stop and express between Marcy and Myrtle?
DATE>Jun 28 17:50:13 1997
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Posted by Ben-Zion Y. Cassouto on June 19, 1997 at 04:43:13:
In Reply to: [6]What happened to J/Z skip stop and express between
Marcy and Myrtle? posted by David Lee on June 18, 1997 at 21:43:18:
If it was 7AM -- wrong direction...
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NEXT>2092
PREVIOUS>2072
POSTER>John
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: RE: New Routes & Stuff
DATE>Jun 28 17:50:14 1997
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Posted by John on June 19, 1997 at 06:59:18:
In Reply to: [5]RE: New Routes & Stuff posted by subway-buff on June
19, 1997 at 03:26:44:
How you gonna get the E to Queensbridge?
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NEXT>2118
PREVIOUS>2077
POSTER>John
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: What happened to J/Z skip stop and express between Marcy and Myrtle?
DATE>Jun 28 17:50:16 1997
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Posted by John on June 19, 1997 at 07:02:05:
In Reply to: [5]Re: What happened to J/Z skip stop and express between
Marcy and Myrtle? posted by Ben-Zion Y. Cassouto on June 19, 1997 at
04:43:13:
But if it was 7 PM, it was too late. The Z train stops running at
5:30, and therefore, all-local service resumes at that time.
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NEXT>2088
PREVIOUS>1897
POSTER>Julio Perez
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Questions on Refurbished R-40 Modifications
DATE>Jun 28 17:50:17 1997
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Posted by Julio Perez on June 19, 1997 at 08:23:01:
I remember the R-40s in their
[6]original form with the
large route letter in the front and the large glass on the doors, and
am disappointed in the
way they look today with the
[7]small route sign and
[8]smaller glass on the doors.
Did the TA perform these modifications to save money (less fabric or
other material needed
for route signs, less plexiglass for the windows), or did people
actually complain that these
characteristics were too obnoxious?
Also, why didn't the TA ever procure subsequent train orders with
slanted noses? Was
there a safety concern involved (wider gap between slanted nose cars
even though they
were draped with gates), or did the train drivers complain of reduced
operating quarters?
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NEXT>2094
PREVIOUS>2064
POSTER>Julio Perez
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Javits Center Service Idea
DATE>Jun 28 17:50:19 1997
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Posted by Julio Perez on June 19, 1997 at 08:36:48:
In Reply to: [6]Re: Javits Center Service Idea posted by Peter Rosa on
June 16, 1997 at 15:49:32:
Why not just extend the 7 to the Javits Center as someone else
suggested in the thread?
I understand there are some old IND/BMT tracks that are not being used
that currently hampers that expansion. But, because they are not being
used now, can't they be used for this purpose now, or are they
positioned such that an R-33/R-36 can't curve into the existing
tracks? Or again, since the IND/BMT tracks are not being used, the ROW
could be cleared away and the tracks rerouted to create the Javits
Center station and extend its terminus somewhere along the
Broadway/7th Avenue tracks...?
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NEXT>2122
PREVIOUS>2069
POSTER>Gerry O'Regan
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Green Line in Boston
DATE>Jun 28 17:50:20 1997
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Posted by Gerry O'Regan on June 19, 1997 at 09:00:37:
In Reply to: [6]Green Line in Boston posted by ~airplane on June 18,
1997 at 22:29:05:
The Riverside Line was converted from a former commuter rail route in
the late 1950s. The original line connected to the B&A main line near
Kenmore Sq and at Riverside forming a loop which was used in
operations. The inner part of the Lower Falls branch, formed the
connection at Riverside, but is now abandoned, the track connection to
the T is not used much but was revived during last October's flood to
provide temporary service from Riverside to South Station. The
connection near Kenmore was broken to construct the necessary subway
portal. The line opened on July 4, 1959. At first service consisted of
alternating trips to Riverside and short turns to Reservoir. After a
few months, heavy riding on the outer end dictated that all trips run
to Riverside. An interesting aspect of this line has been rough track
which persists today after several rebuildings. The riding quality was
so poor that resilient wheels were removed to cut maintenance expense
and field shunting disabled to slow down the cars.
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NEXT>2108
PREVIOUS>2073
POSTER>David Pirmann
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: What Happen to the "subway"in this site
DATE>Jun 28 17:50:22 1997
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Posted by David Pirmann on June 19, 1997 at 09:05:28:
In Reply to: [6]What Happen to the "subway"in this site posted by Zack
on June 19, 1997 at 01:38:15:
It's not easy to take good pictures in the subway.
First, flash bulbs and tripod use is against regulations. So you need
fast film and a real steady hand (and a good lens). Also, slide film
tends to be a lot slower than common print film, so the people who
shoot slides are at a disadvantage.
Secondly, the stations are not the best for photography, with the
columns and stairways in the way of your shoot.
Third, the "subway" stations tend to be more crowded and have people
in the way of your picture and/or you're in the way of their
movements. The former makes for bad pictures and the latter can get
you thrown out (also see #1 about tripods).
Fourth, there's more steel dust and dirt in the subway stations, both
bad for lungs and cameras. \
Fifth, subway station lighting sucks. The sun does a much better job
of lighting a scene.
Also, there's the fact that the elevated stations are much more
picturesque, IMHO. Wouldn't you rather see a train climbing up to
Smith/9th St or Broadway Junction, or on the 125th St. viaduct (#1
train), or the redbirds out at Corona Yard? It beats a cut-off view of
the front of a train at West 4th Street any day. Almost every picture
I've seen of a train in a subway station is a front view looking down
the length of the train.
Besides, I think the more interesting subway stations are pretty well
represented-- the Disused and Abandoned stations, for instance, 168th
St on the #1, Grand Central on the #7, City Hall...
Does anyone know, in terms of route miles, what percent of the
"subway" is actually elevated or otherwise outdoors? I suspect more is
elevated than in subway which would also contribute to the fact that
there are more pictures of trains on the Els.
--Dave
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NEXT>2102
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>Charles
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>NYC BUS PHOTOS
DATE>Jun 28 17:50:23 1997
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Posted by Charles on June 19, 1997 at 10:57:29:
Does anyone know of any New York City Bus photos on the internet other
than the NYCT's Home page?
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NEXT>3121
PREVIOUS>2003
POSTER>Charles
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: IRT Model R110 Subway Cars
DATE>Jun 28 17:50:24 1997
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Posted by Charles on June 19, 1997 at 11:13:22:
In Reply to: [6]Re: IRT Model R110 Subway Cars posted by David Pirmann
on June 14, 1997 at 19:31:00:
The answer to this dilemma is clear. Anyone who wants to contribute by
putting R110A pictures Should try to obtain photos from some
photographers whom reguarly attend the NY Division Electric
Railroaders associaton Meeting. The Meeting is this Friday night at
the college of insurance on Murray Street in downtown manhattan. Just
ask around, I am sure that someone has pictures of the train. They are
pretty common.
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PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>Brian W
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Toronto Tube
DATE>Jun 28 17:50:25 1997
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Posted by Brian W on June 19, 1997 at 12:05:20:
In Reply to: [6]Re: Toronto Tube (was Re: NYC screen saver ideas...
posted by Nathan on June 18, 1997 at 16:19:44:
I don't have any pictures of the old aluminum G-Cars. Sorry!!
If you really want to see some, however, when you're in Toronto, ride
the subway by both Davisville yard (between Davisville and St. Clair)
and Wilson yard (between Wilson and Downsview). Look for
silver-coloured cars that are kind of old-looking, have only three
doors on either side (instead of four), and have a yellow "racing
stripe" running across them. Sometimes they're there, and sometimes
they're not.
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NEXT>2139
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>Brian
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>T.O. Signal Maps
DATE>Jun 28 17:50:27 1997
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Posted by Brian on June 19, 1997 at 12:53:26:
This site offers a track map of the Toronto subway, and that's great.
But does anyone know where I can get a SIGNAL map, that is, a map with
the track on it that includes the signals and indicates their type
(standard, interlocking, repeater)?
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NEXT>2090
PREVIOUS>2080
POSTER>David Pirmann
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Questions on Refurbished R-40 Modifications
DATE>Jun 28 17:50:28 1997
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Posted by David Pirmann on June 19, 1997 at 13:04:34:
In Reply to: [6]Questions on Refurbished R-40 Modifications posted by
Julio Perez on June 19, 1997 at 08:23:01:
Greetings,
First, about the safety concerns... the slanted fronts proved
dangerous when passing between cars. There's a lot more space between
the ends of the cars and the original handrails (as you can see in the
picture) were not that large. Safety concerns prompted the additions
of the extra "orthodontics" on the fronts of the cars, easily making
them the ugliest rapid transit cars anywhere :-)
So that probably answers the question about why they didn't use the
technique again. In fact, halfway through the delivery of the order
the front ends were changed to the "R40M-R42" style (which I think is
pretty nice).
I would guess that the route signs were changed so that the indicator
on the car was similar to the letter-in-colored-circle that began to
be used on the maps and on station signage. I'm not sure when the
changeover was made-- 1979 I believe. So as the old roll sign
mechanisms wore out and overhaul time came around they were changed to
be similar to that on newer cars (the R44's were around for 5-8 years
by that time).
From personal observation the R40's look like they are in terrible
shape even after overhaul. I have a feeling that the new order of cars
for the IND/BMT, when it is placed, will end up replacing the R40's,
leaving the R38-R38 cars in service for some time longer.
By the way, the R-40 style was designed by Raymond Lowey (hope I got
that name correct) who also designed the Pennsylvania Railroad's GG1
locomotive. Ya win some ya lose some I guess. :)
--Dave
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NEXT>2140
PREVIOUS>2065
POSTER>Bingo
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Toronto H-6's
DATE>Jun 28 17:50:29 1997
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Posted by Bingo on June 19, 1997 at 13:06:10:
In Reply to: [5]Re: Toronto H-6's posted by Nathan on June 18, 1997 at
16:37:04:
The H-6's (Thank you, they have a name!) were originally scheduled for
delivery in 1986, but were held back with a serious flaw in their
coupling system. They were released sometime later (I don't know
when.)
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NEXT>2103
PREVIOUS>2088
POSTER>Steve
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Questions on Refurbished R-40 Modifications
DATE>Jun 28 17:50:31 1997
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Posted by Steve on June 19, 1997 at 13:24:15:
In Reply to: [5]Re: Questions on Refurbished R-40 Modifications posted
by David Pirmann on June 19, 1997 at 13:04:34:
The R-40s are in questionable shape structurally. They were overhauled
by The Sumotomi Co. and have not held up. They will likely be scrapped
when the R-143s come on line.
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NEXT>2093
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>Bingo
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>New R-142's and 143's
DATE>Jun 28 17:50:32 1997
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Posted by Bingo on June 19, 1997 at 13:29:27:
O.K., I've browsed this system, and found out that there will be new
trains arriving for the MTA, or the IRT or whatever. I am intrigued.
Now I ask:
1) Which transit system will they be serviced upon?
2) Who is their manufacturer? Bombardier? Kawasaki? Does Westinghouse
still make trains?
3) Will they replace any rolling stock currently in service?
4) Will they be made of steel? What is their buff strength?
5) Will they have these surveillance cameras on board?
6) Are they equipped for full automation? (driverless remote)
7) Why should I care? I'm a fucking Canadian living hundreds of miles
away.
8) What will their series #'s?
9) When can I hope to ride on one?
I have a zillion more questions, but I know when to shut up. (Or maybe
I don't. If you feel my questions are too long, I invite you to
express your anger toward me through this message.)
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NEXT>2112
PREVIOUS>2078
POSTER>Steve
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: RE: New Routes & Stuff
DATE>Jun 28 17:50:34 1997
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Posted by Steve on June 19, 1997 at 13:32:26:
In Reply to: [5]RE: New Routes & Stuff posted by subway-buff on June
19, 1997 at 03:26:44:
It's likely that the C will run to 168th St. before long. The C
service on the Concourse line will be replaced by the B train. Your
plan is okay but you'd have to add 8 trains (64cars) to the Concourse
fleet to support the Local/Express service. Coney Island is the only
other yard that has R-68s (121 of them). If you move 64 cars what does
Coney Island do with 57 R-68s? Can you really afford to use 64 of some
of your newest (and best performing) cars for 1 am trp and 1 pm trip?
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NEXT>2098
PREVIOUS>2091
POSTER>Steve
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: New R-142's and 143's
DATE>Jun 28 17:50:35 1997
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Posted by Steve on June 19, 1997 at 13:40:45:
In Reply to: [5]New R-142's and 143's posted by Bingo on June 19, 1997
at 13:29:27:
The answers to some of your questions:
1) The R-142 will replace the Redbirds. They will run on the Westside
IRT and the Corona lines. I am not sure if they will run on the East
Side IRT because of the Gap-fillers.
2) The cars will be built by Kawasaki Heavy Industries and Bombardier.
Westinghouse still builds cars under the corporate name of ADTRANZ.
3) Yes - the redbirds will be replaced on the A division and it's
likely the R-40s will be replaced on the B division
4) Who cares..
5) Probably not
6) No
7) See #4 (language is inappropriate)
8) Probably beginning with 6300 but I am not sure.
9) Try mid 1999
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NEXT>2153
PREVIOUS>2081
POSTER>Peter Rosa
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Javits Center Service Idea
DATE>Jun 28 17:50:37 1997
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Posted by Peter Rosa on June 19, 1997 at 13:43:40:
In Reply to: [6]Re: Javits Center Service Idea posted by Julio Perez
on June 19, 1997 at 08:36:48:
Extending the 7 to serve the Javits Center certainly may be possible,
but would require at least some tunnelling. In contrast, adding a
platform at the LIRR West Side yards co
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NEXT>2136
PREVIOUS>2063
POSTER>Bingo
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Toronto Tube (was Re: NYC screen saver ideas...
DATE>Jun 28 17:50:38 1997
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Posted by Bingo on June 19, 1997 at 13:47:55:
In Reply to: [5]Re: Toronto Tube (was Re: NYC screen saver ideas...
posted by Nathan on June 18, 1997 at 16:19:44:
The GO trains originally did not have the strip-alarms because they
were built by CN and they hadn't a clue about them, (nor did there
seem to be the need) but after the incident, they were added. If you
go on a GO car, you will see how obvious it is that they're add-on's.
They just don't look right in their placement. The strip-alarm system
in my opinion is a complete joke for GO trains because they're double
deckers, and the train is so huge it would take very long for the
staff to find the offending alarm. (The walk-through doors are also
reaaaaaaally heavy!!)
Why would you want to see the silver G's? Some of the muuuuuch older
cars still in service in New York are far more fascinating and less
depressing. (As I said before, they're now garbage trains. Oh god, I
think I need another shot of my fluvoxamine)
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NEXT>2097
PREVIOUS>2032
POSTER>Steve
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: IRT Track Connections to BMT/IND
DATE>Jun 28 17:50:41 1997
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Posted by Steve on June 19, 1997 at 13:49:24:
In Reply to: [5]Re: IRT Track Connections to BMT/IND posted by Julio
Perez on June 17, 1997 at 07:27:45:
The A division signals are different in the mechanical design. That
is, the trip cocks & trippers are located on the cab side. In
addition, the IRT home signal aspects are different from the B
division aspects for the same indications. Chaos would result from any
sudden changes. Currently, it is expected that the entire NYCt signal
system will take 30 years to replace. This is why the R-142 will not
be equipped to use the new signal system being implemented.
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PREVIOUS>2096
POSTER>Steve
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: IRT Track Connections to BMT/IND
DATE>Jun 28 17:50:43 1997
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Posted by Steve on June 19, 1997 at 13:55:25:
In Reply to: [5]Re: IRT Track Connections to BMT/IND posted by Gerry
O'Regan on June 16, 1997 at 09:51:25:
This happens to be the case for the most part.
Coney Island Overhaul shop handles cars from all of the B division
lines except the A & C line. They also handle the #7 line cars.
207th St. Overhaul handles all of the A division cars except the #7
line . In addition, they also handle the A & C line cars.
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NEXT>2101
PREVIOUS>2093
POSTER>Bingo
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: New R-142's and 143's
DATE>Jun 28 17:50:46 1997
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Posted by Bingo on June 19, 1997 at 13:55:35:
In Reply to: [5]Re: New R-142's and 143's posted by Steve on June 19,
1997 at 13:40:45:
1999!?!! That's #@%!!?! insane! Why the &%$@ is it taking so long? (My
guess is red tape and paperwork. BTW, Kawasaki built those PA class
cars for PATH, did they not?)
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NEXT>2109
PREVIOUS>2059
POSTER>Steve
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: R-44's and 46's
DATE>Jun 28 17:50:47 1997
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Posted by Steve on June 19, 1997 at 14:01:00:
In Reply to: [5]R-44's and 46's posted by Bingo on June 17, 1997 at
20:09:37:
As a matter of fact, I happen to be very partial to the R-46s. The
R-46 cars are probably the best made of all the NYCT cars. 752 of the
original 754 cars are still in service after a quater century of use.
They are the quietest and smoothest riding, even after the removal of
the air-bag suspension. They are also the nicest as far as car
appearance goes. The interiors are the most appealing. I think that
they'll likely be the only cars which undergo a second overhaul and
will likely run 45-50 years as compared to the average of 30-35 years
for other cars.
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NEXT>2107
PREVIOUS>2076
POSTER>Bingo
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Subtalk and Pictures
DATE>Jun 28 17:50:49 1997
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Posted by Bingo on June 19, 1997 at 14:02:45:
In Reply to: [5]Re: Subtalk and Pictures posted by David Pirmann on
June 14, 1997 at 21:39:22:
What about animations, or small Hypercard or Macromedia stick-ons?
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NEXT>2104
PREVIOUS>2098
POSTER>David Pirmann
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: New R-142's and 143's
DATE>Jun 28 17:50:50 1997
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Posted by David Pirmann on June 19, 1997 at 14:14:57:
In Reply to: [6]Re: New R-142's and 143's posted by Bingo on June 19,
1997 at 13:55:35:
1999 is only 18 months away. To build 1050 subway cars in 18 months
probably isn't all that bad considering the budget to pay for them
hasn't actually been approved yet (so whether work has even started
yet is doubtful). Assuming they take till December 1999 to deliver
them all that's averages between the two manufacturers more than 1 car
completed per day.
Kawasaki built Path's PA-4 class cars (800 series). The prior PA class
cars were built by St. Louis Car and Hawker-Siddeley of Canada. All of
the PA classes are still in service although I've seen some PA cars
coupled to flatcars and such in work service. (The earlier St. Louis
cars, the MP-52 and K classes, are mostly all still around as work
cars. There were 50 total MP-52/K cars. Last weekend I think I saw
about 50% of them still in use.) See [7]Path Roster for details.
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NEXT>2131
PREVIOUS>2084
POSTER>Bryan Layne
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: NYC BUS PHOTOS
DATE>Jun 28 17:50:51 1997
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Posted by Bryan Layne on June 19, 1997 at 14:21:06:
In Reply to: [6]NYC BUS PHOTOS posted by Charles on June 19, 1997 at
10:57:29:
There are a couple at the [7]Busspot Website .
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NEXT>2105
PREVIOUS>2090
POSTER>Gary Jacobi
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Questions on Refurbished R-40 Modifications
DATE>Jun 28 17:50:53 1997
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Posted by Gary Jacobi on June 19, 1997 at 14:21:40:
In Reply to: [5]Re: Questions on Refurbished R-40 Modifications posted
by David Pirmann on June 19, 1997 at 13:04:34:
Raymond Loewy is either dead, or about a hundred years old. Either
way, I don't think he has a hand in day to day operations. His work
was always striking, but very often impractical. He was also
responsible for the "which way is it going " late forties Studebaker,
which looked much better in the next, toned down restyling.
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NEXT>2113
PREVIOUS>2101
POSTER>Bingo
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: New R-142's and 143's
DATE>Jun 28 17:50:54 1997
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Posted by Bingo on June 19, 1997 at 14:31:38:
In Reply to: [5]Re: New R-142's and 143's posted by David Pirmann on
June 19, 1997 at 14:14:57:
How much will the 42's and 43's cost for each car? Will they be built
in Thunder Bay like the T-1's were?
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NEXT>2106
PREVIOUS>2103
POSTER>Bingo
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Questions on Refurbished R-40 Modifications
DATE>Jun 28 17:50:55 1997
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Posted by Bingo on June 19, 1997 at 14:44:20:
In Reply to: [5]Re: Questions on Refurbished R-40 Modifications posted
by Steve on June 19, 1997 at 13:24:15:
The company is Sumitomo Inc., a huge conglomerate in Japan that also
made the JNR inter-city trains. (The ones painted in all the nice
colors, different for each route)
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NEXT>2119
PREVIOUS>2105
POSTER>David Pirmann
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Questions on Refurbished R-40 Modifications
DATE>Jun 28 17:50:57 1997
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Posted by David Pirmann on June 19, 1997 at 14:47:26:
In Reply to: [6]Re: Questions on Refurbished R-40 Modifications posted
by Gary Jacobi on June 19, 1997 at 14:21:40:
Obviously he doesn't have a hand in day to day operations. His
contribution to the R40 was over 30 years ago. I didn't imply he was
still around, simply that he designed the look of the car. Sheesh.
--Dave
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NEXT>
PREVIOUS>2100
POSTER>David Pirmann
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Subtalk and Pictures
DATE>Jun 28 17:50:58 1997
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Posted by David Pirmann on June 19, 1997 at 14:49:00:
In Reply to: [6]Re: Subtalk and Pictures posted by Bingo on June 19,
1997 at 14:02:45:
What about them? You can use html in your post to link to anything on
the web no matter what it is.
In terms of the formats you describe, it's up to the user's browser or
add-on software to be able to see it. Fortunately I am macromedia
shockwave-free and don't have to deal with all those whells and
bistles.
-dave
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NEXT>2110
PREVIOUS>2083
POSTER>Gary Jacobi
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: What Happen to the "subway"in this site
DATE>Jun 28 17:51:00 1997
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Posted by Gary Jacobi on June 19, 1997 at 14:50:47:
In Reply to: [5]Re: What Happen to the "subway"in this site posted by
David Pirmann on June 19, 1997 at 09:05:28:
I'm surprised that the percentage of above ground lines is not a well
known figure. I did a " Quick and dirty " count from Adler's map, and
think one third above ground is close. The original IND was "all
underground" with the exception of yards and the Gowanus Canal
crossing. The other elevated sections, Liberty Ave and McDonald St.
are taken over BMT lines. BMT had the most above ground, having
started as a purely elevated system. I have always considered the
Coney Island ex Steam lines to be above ground, includind Brighton
Beach.The greater percentage of IRT in the Bronx and Queens is above
ground, and about 25% of the Brooklyn lines. However, subway sections
are more often four tracked, whereas els tend to be two or three
tracked. This further diminishes the track miles of the above ground
portion, which I considered in coming up with one third. I'm sure
someone with better resources will come up with an exact figure.
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NEXT>2114
PREVIOUS>2099
POSTER>Julio Perez
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: R-44's and 46's
DATE>Jun 28 17:51:01 1997
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Posted by Julio Perez on June 19, 1997 at 14:57:31:
In Reply to: [6]Re: R-44's and 46's posted by Steve on June 19, 1997
at 14:01:00:
Don't forget some of the R-1s and derivatives were running in revenue
service for about 40 years or so too...
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NEXT>
PREVIOUS>2108
POSTER>David Pirmann
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: What Happen to the "subway"in this site
DATE>Jun 28 17:51:02 1997
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Posted by David Pirmann on June 19, 1997 at 15:28:48:
In Reply to: [6]Re: What Happen to the "subway"in this site posted by
Gary Jacobi on June 19, 1997 at 14:50:47:
The Facts and Figures booklet has the route miles statistic.. I didn't
think about it at the time, but here's the stats:
Underground - 137 route miles (61%) - 277 stations (61%)
Elevated - 93 route miles (39%) - 191 stations (39%)
Total - 230 route miles - 468 stations
Okay, so the original poster is correct-- subway stations are
underrepresented in our photographs in terms of both route miles and
stations.
(Odd that there are both 39% of route miles AND 39% of stations on the
elevated/surface lines... I wouldn't have guessed that they would be
so evenly distrubuted.)
--Dave
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NEXT>2246
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>Peter Rosa
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Javits Center Service Idea (second try!)
DATE>Jun 28 17:51:04 1997
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Posted by Peter Rosa on June 19, 1997 at 16:18:41:
In Reply to: [6]Re: Javits Center Service Idea posted by Peter Rosa on
June 19, 1997 at 13:43:40:
Sorry about the first attempt, it got cut off before all was posted.
In any event, my point is that extending the 7 train to the Javits
Center would require at least some tunnelling, while adding a "Javits
platform" to the LIRR's West Side yard wouldn't. The latter therefore
would be a quick and dirty solution, which is probably the best we can
hope for :-)
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NEXT>2147
PREVIOUS>2092
POSTER>subway-buff
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: RE: New Routes & Stuff
DATE>Jun 28 17:51:05 1997
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Posted by subway-buff on June 19, 1997 at 16:58:06:
In Reply to: [6]Re: RE: New Routes & Stuff posted by John on June 19,
1997 at 06:59:18:
At first I thought I'd need the oops! train but then I remembered:
There are switches at /near the south end of West Fourth that will
alllow 8tyh ave trains to move over to 6th ave and vice versa. When
the JFK Express ran it did just that.
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NEXT>2160
PREVIOUS>2104
POSTER>Steve
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: New R-142's and 143's
DATE>Jun 28 17:51:08 1997
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Posted by Steve on June 19, 1997 at 17:00:07:
In Reply to: [5]Re: New R-142's and 143's posted by Bingo on June 19,
1997 at 14:31:38:
Best estimate is about $1.2 million per car however because of the new
technology involved in these cars, NYCT will be requesting many hi
tech frills like diagnostic computers and parts catalogs on CD-ROM and
many spare parts. It's likely that the final cost will likely be
somewhat higher.
As for where the cars will be built, I think you'll find that the
final assembly will be done in NY State. Kawasaki has a plant in
Yonkers, NY, already.
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NEXT>2126
PREVIOUS>2109
POSTER>Steve
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: R-44's and 46's
DATE>Jun 28 17:51:10 1997
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Posted by Steve on June 19, 1997 at 17:03:29:
In Reply to: [5]Re: R-44's and 46's posted by Julio Perez on June 19,
1997 at 14:57:31:
How can we forget? But that was when the cars were built like tanks.
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NEXT>2117
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>subway-buff
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>New Cars for PATH ?
DATE>Jun 28 17:51:13 1997
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Posted by subway-buff on June 19, 1997 at 17:16:41:
I see one possible problem with full width cabs (transverse cabs) on
PATH-
Platform length=-
Exchange Place at present allows 7 carss to open-the conductor to WTC
must open only the doors to the cars behind the first car.
Also- platforms on the 33rd street line only hold 7 cars and the lead
car on the 6th ave stations at 14 and 23 is almost off the platform.
There is only a very narrow platform.
Of course, PATH may keep the conductor in which case the modification
is unneeded (or they have to add a lock out on the lead car to be
controleld by the motorman.)
I am looking forward to the PA-5 cars. The PA 1- PA 3 cars are
shopwign their age. If you will look the the roof you can see rust or
corrosion at the rivet lines and several have watch appears to be
patches elsewhere ont he roof. The PA 1-PA 3 only have two sets of
doors on each sider while the PA-4 have 3 sets. The PA 1 to PA 3 may
have been advanced for their time, but the have done their work and
need to retire.
I do ride PATH every weekend.
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NEXT>2124
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>Steve
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Subway Car Costs.
DATE>Jun 28 17:51:16 1997
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Posted by Steve on June 19, 1997 at 17:18:45:
The estimate of $1.2 million per car for the R-142s & R-143s may seem
astounding but consider the cost of these cars:
R-32 $114,951 new in 1964 $419,913 overhaul in 1988
R-33 (Corona) $108,500 new
R-36 (Corona) $110,563 new
R-38 $111,733 new 1966-67 $376,901 overhaul in 1988
R-40 $115,517 new 1969 $376,000 overhaul in 1988-89
R-46 $275,381 new 1975-77 $490,000 overhaul in 1990-91
R-62 & 62A new $845,000 & 798,700 respectively
R-68 & R-68A new $915,000
no price was available for the R-9s but the R-10s were about $77,000
the R-12s were about $71,500 but the R-11s were $121,373. All were
built in 1949. This should explain why the R-11s were never built in
any quantity.
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NEXT>2123
PREVIOUS>2115
POSTER>Jim
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: New Cars for PATH ?
DATE>Jun 28 17:51:18 1997
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Posted by Jim on June 19, 1997 at 17:22:11:
In Reply to: [5]New Cars for PATH ? posted by subway-buff on June 19,
1997 at 17:16:41:
Since Path cars are just standard IRT cars, Path should not be buying
new cars. They should wait until the R-142s are delivered and they can
then buy the redbirds for about $100 each.
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NEXT>2149
PREVIOUS>2079
POSTER>Garfield
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: What happened to J/Z skip stop and express between Marcy and Myrtle?
DATE>Jun 28 17:51:21 1997
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Posted by Garfield on June 19, 1997 at 17:22:29:
In Reply to: [5]What happened to J/Z skip stop and express between
Marcy and Myrtle? posted by David Lee on June 18, 1997 at 21:43:18:
I noticed that as well too. I recently posted up a question concerning
J/Z skip-stop express service. As of now, I don't want the hell is
going on. What, is the T.A eliminating express service from Myrtle to
Marcy Ave. The whole thing is just ludicrous. First they eliminate
express service between Marcy Ave and Eastern Parkway, now they want
to do the same with Marcy and Mrytle. It's obvious that when trains
during the PM rush enter Eastern Pkwy, they packed out of proportion
due to A train riders.
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NEXT>2125
PREVIOUS>2106
POSTER>Steve
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Questions on Refurbished R-40 Modifications
DATE>Jun 28 17:51:23 1997
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Posted by Steve on June 19, 1997 at 17:25:55:
In Reply to: [5]Re: Questions on Refurbished R-40 Modifications posted
by David Pirmann on June 19, 1997 at 14:47:26:
Thanks for the clarification. I had heard that the actual Car-Body
design was done by a local industrial arts design class (Pratt
perhaps). Of course, this could just be another bit of NYCT folk lore.
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NEXT>
PREVIOUS>2037
POSTER>Steve
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Grade Crossings
DATE>Jun 28 17:51:26 1997
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Posted by Steve on June 19, 1997 at 17:31:28:
In Reply to: [5]Grade Crossings posted by Jack Bleiberg on June 17,
1997 at 01:37:01:
Actually, the last grade crossing was at the north end of the 105th
St. Station on the 'L' line. There are many crossings within the many
yards of the system but these crossings are unprotected and not for
public use.
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NEXT>2166
PREVIOUS>2075
POSTER>Jim
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: A train
DATE>Jun 28 17:51:28 1997
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Posted by Jim on June 19, 1997 at 17:35:57:
In Reply to: [5]Re: A train posted by Peter Furuhashi on June 18, 1997
at 02:31:41:
The latest acquisition, the vacuum train was delivered by truck. I'm
sure that much of the new equipment will be delivered by truck to
207th St.
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NEXT>2144
PREVIOUS>2082
POSTER>FRED WELLMAN
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Green Line in Boston
DATE>Jun 28 17:51:30 1997
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Posted by FRED WELLMAN on June 19, 1997 at 19:33:28:
In Reply to: [5]Re: Green Line in Boston posted by Gerry O'Regan on
June 19, 1997 at 09:00:37:
I lived in Boston from 1980 to 1986 and have used the D line alot. How
did they turn the PCC's at Resevior? I remember a few years ago when
they
built the yard and connections to Cleveland Circle. Was that the
second
rebuild? BTW if you are going to Boston and don't need your car
Riverside
station is a cheap safe place to park. It is about 5 minutes from the
MA
pike and 128.
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NEXT>2128
PREVIOUS>2117
POSTER>David Pirmann
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: New Cars for PATH ?
DATE>Jun 28 17:51:32 1997
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Posted by David Pirmann on June 19, 1997 at 19:39:23:
In Reply to: [6]Re: New Cars for PATH ? posted by Jim on June 19, 1997
at 17:22:11:
Why would anyone want a fleet of cars older than what they currently
have???? The redbirds are rusted and corroded (take a look at the area
where the wall meets the flooring on the outside of the cars). No one
is going to buy them for any price--PATH isn't that desperate.
--Dave
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NEXT>2127
PREVIOUS>2116
POSTER>David Pirmann
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Subway Car Costs.
DATE>Jun 28 17:51:34 1997
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Posted by David Pirmann on June 19, 1997 at 19:50:30:
In Reply to: [6]Subway Car Costs. posted by Steve on June 19, 1997 at
17:18:45:
The high price of the R11 might also be explained by its *LACK* of
quantity building. If they had built more than 10 of them the economy
of scale could have contributed to a lower cost per car. (Probably not
THAT much but maybe the cost could have been lowered to $100K.)
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NEXT>2129
PREVIOUS>2119
POSTER>John
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Questions on Refurbished R-40 Modifications
DATE>Jun 28 17:51:37 1997
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Posted by John on June 19, 1997 at 19:55:47:
In Reply to: [5]Re: Questions on Refurbished R-40 Modifications posted
by Steve on June 19, 1997 at 13:24:15:
Every time I ride in an R-40, I always hope that the train will not
loose a truck. The wheel trucks are constantly making funny squeeky
and crunching noises, especially when the train is coming to a stop.
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NEXT>2130
PREVIOUS>2114
POSTER>John
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: R-44's and 46's
DATE>Jun 28 17:51:39 1997
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Posted by John on June 19, 1997 at 20:07:04:
In Reply to: [5]Re: R-44's and 46's posted by Steve on June 19, 1997
at 17:03:29:
Just about everything about the R-1s - R-9s were tank like. The only
thing I didn't like was when the wicker seats had tears in them,
because they pinched the skin.
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NEXT>
PREVIOUS>2124
POSTER>Steve
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Subway Car Costs.
DATE>Jun 28 17:51:41 1997
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Posted by Steve on June 19, 1997 at 20:38:29:
In Reply to: [5]Re: Subway Car Costs. posted by David Pirmann on June
19, 1997 at 19:50:30:
Could be but I suspect that the choice of Stainless Steel might have
also been a factor.
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NEXT>2137
PREVIOUS>2123
POSTER>Jim
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: New Cars for PATH ?
DATE>Jun 28 17:51:42 1997
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Posted by Jim on June 19, 1997 at 20:40:14:
In Reply to: [5]Re: New Cars for PATH ? posted by David Pirmann on
June 19, 1997 at 19:39:23:
I know that and you know that but to read some of the postings here
you'd think the redbirds were the greatest thing since the bikini.
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NEXT>2134
PREVIOUS>2125
POSTER>Steve
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Questions on Refurbished R-40 Modifications
DATE>Jun 28 17:51:45 1997
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Posted by Steve on June 19, 1997 at 20:42:46:
In Reply to: [5]Re: Questions on Refurbished R-40 Modifications posted
by John on June 19, 1997 at 19:55:47:
I doubt that would really happen but as long as you raised the
question, do you know what holds the carbody to the trucks? (On all
subway cars except the R-68 and 68As that is)
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NEXT>
PREVIOUS>2126
POSTER>Steve
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: R-44's and 46's
DATE>Jun 28 17:51:47 1997
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Posted by Steve on June 19, 1997 at 20:44:45:
In Reply to: [5]Re: R-44's and 46's posted by John on June 19, 1997 at
20:07:04:
They were terrible for sleeping on also. When you'd get up your face
had the impression of the wicker.
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NEXT>
PREVIOUS>2102
POSTER>David Pirmann
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: NYC BUS PHOTOS
DATE>Jun 28 17:51:50 1997
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Posted by David Pirmann on June 19, 1997 at 21:19:21:
In Reply to: [6]NYC BUS PHOTOS posted by Charles on June 19, 1997 at
10:57:29:
I just put up some bus pictures that I had sitting around that Bob
Redden had posted to the net some time ago.
http://www.nycsubway.org/nyctabus
Enjoy!
Dave
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PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>What is that big hole on the right side of the Southbound Track between 36
DATE>Jun 28 17:51:52 1997
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For those who ride the Brooklyn Bound G or the Manhattan bound R
heading into Queens Plaza. Have you noticed this BIG hole on the side
of the wall where you can see daylight coming in? Does anyone know
what that is? That would happen to be part of the construction of the
63 St tunnel connection to the Queens Boulevard line, would it?
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PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: What is that big hole on the right side of the Southbound Track between
DATE>Jun 28 17:51:54 1997
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In Reply to: [5]What is that big hole on the right side of the
Southbound Track between 36 St and Queens Plaza? posted by David Lee
on June 19, 1997 at 22:36:39:
The southbound local track is designated as D1 track. That big hole,
as you put it, is actually the beginning of pushing the wall outward
so that D1 track can be re-aligned. Once it is moved, the area between
D1 track and D3 track will be excavated and will become the southbound
connection for the 63rd Street connection. On the northbound side, D5
track has been removed. D4 track (the northbound express track) will
be re-aligned to pass through the area formerly occupied by D5 track
the northbound connection with 63rd street will be between D2 and D4
tracks.
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NEXT>2135
PREVIOUS>2129
POSTER>Zack
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Questions on Refurbished R-40 Modifications
DATE>Jun 28 17:51:56 1997
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Posted by Zack on June 20, 1997 at 01:50:21:
In Reply to: [6]Re: Questions on Refurbished R-40 Modifications posted
by Steve on June 19, 1997 at 20:42:46:
most likely a bolster attached to the frame unless its a bolsterless
connection that is but i do not know how thoes work
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NEXT>2146
PREVIOUS>2134
POSTER>Zack
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Questions on Refurbished R-40 Modifications
DATE>Jun 28 17:51:58 1997
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Posted by Zack on June 20, 1997 at 01:50:28:
In Reply to: [6]Re: Questions on Refurbished R-40 Modifications posted
by Steve on June 19, 1997 at 20:42:46:
most likely a bolster attached to the frame unless its a bolsterless
connection that is, but i do not know how thoes work
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NEXT>2162
PREVIOUS>2095
POSTER>Nathan
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Toronto Tube (was Re: NYC screen saver ideas...
DATE>Jun 28 17:52:01 1997
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Posted by Nathan on June 20, 1997 at 02:03:08:
In Reply to: [5]Re: Toronto Tube (was Re: NYC screen saver ideas...
posted by Bingo on June 19, 1997 at 13:47:55:
No, the GO cars were built by the UTDC, not CN! besides, I know the
doors are heavy, but one time in Van some woman got sick, pressed the
alarm, and the conductor was there in about 2 minutes. Yeah, their
double deck, they even have the alarms in the bathrooms! ("Help! My
laxitive hasn't kicked in yet and I am in pain!). Hmmm, the GO Trains
really need coffee bars...
ANyway, I do not even know what the silver G's look like! That's why!
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NEXT>2138
PREVIOUS>2128
POSTER>Nathan
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: New Cars for PATH ?
DATE>Jun 28 17:52:03 1997
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Posted by Nathan on June 20, 1997 at 02:08:33:
In Reply to: [5]New Cars for PATH ? posted by subway-buff on June 19,
1997 at 17:16:41:
who will build the PA-5's?
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NEXT>2159
PREVIOUS>2137
POSTER>Nathan
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: New Cars for PATH ?
DATE>Jun 28 17:52:04 1997
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Posted by Nathan on June 20, 1997 at 02:09:36:
In Reply to: [5]New Cars for PATH ? posted by subway-buff on June 19,
1997 at 17:16:41:
who will build the PA-5's?
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NEXT>3123
PREVIOUS>2087
POSTER>Nathan
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: T.O. Signal Maps
DATE>Jun 28 17:52:06 1997
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Posted by Nathan on June 20, 1997 at 02:11:47:
In Reply to: [5]T.O. Signal Maps posted by Brian on June 19, 1997 at
12:53:26:
I'll be in T.O. for about 6 weeks this summer, and I have a relative
who
was a ttc motorman on the subway almost since it's conception. Anyway,
he probably has oodles of ttc maps, signal stuff, manuals hanging
around.
If i can scrounge something up I'll let you know.
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NEXT>2161
PREVIOUS>2089
POSTER>Nathan
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Toronto H-6's
DATE>Jun 28 17:52:07 1997
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Posted by Nathan on June 20, 1997 at 02:19:40:
In Reply to: [5]Re: Toronto H-6's posted by Bingo on June 19, 1997 at
13:06:10:
Weren't the H-6's withdrawn from service within the past 2 years
because of some faulty axle that cause a train derailment outside (i
believe, i am probably wrong) Kipling station? I heard the ttc did
some ultrasound test on all the H-6 axles, but I do not know what the
results were.
Now! DOES ANYONE HAVE A PICTURE OF A SILVER "G"??? I'M DESPERATE TO
KNOW WHAT THEY LOOK LIKE!!
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NEXT>2151
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>Nathan
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>TTC Small Witt RT-10
DATE>Jun 28 17:52:09 1997
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Posted by Nathan on June 20, 1997 at 02:22:41:
I know the TTC used (at one time) a Small Witt car (that was converted
to 3rd rail power collection) as a garbage car. Is this ancient car
still in use, retired, scrapped, or sitting on the ttc property?
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NEXT>
PREVIOUS>2055
POSTER>Nathan
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: METRA
DATE>Jun 28 17:52:10 1997
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Posted by Nathan on June 20, 1997 at 02:25:59:
In Reply to: [5]METRA posted by Bingo on June 17, 1997 at 11:46:54:
Sorry, but if you want to see a good example of el train operations,
an unusual one car consist, and a "riders viewpoint", watch the old
tom cruise movie "Risky Business". I can not guarantee that you will
NOT
barf, it is rather, er, unusual...
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NEXT>325
PREVIOUS>1211
POSTER>Charles Fiori
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Bus Photos
DATE>Jun 28 17:52:11 1997
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Posted by Charles Fiori on June 20, 1997 at 07:42:16:
David--Great collection of photos. I am still very interested in
tracking down any and all bus destination signs. Special wants would
be the older black and white versions. ANY HELP AT ALL WOULD BE
APPRECIATED. THANKS.
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NEXT>2221
PREVIOUS>2122
POSTER>Dave
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Green Line in Boston
DATE>Jun 28 17:52:13 1997
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Posted by Dave on June 20, 1997 at 09:33:06:
In Reply to: [6]Re: Green Line in Boston posted by FRED WELLMAN on
June 19, 1997 at 19:33:28:
The cars at Resevoir were turned on a loop around the yard
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NEXT>2165
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>David Pirmann
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Transit in Movies - Again
DATE>Jun 28 17:52:14 1997
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Posted by David Pirmann on June 20, 1997 at 10:19:24:
A while ago we were talking about subway scenes in movies. Well here's
one no one mentioned... Saturday Night Fever. Yes, I watched it on TNT
last night. Never saw it before actually. But seriously, there's a few
subway scenes. The film opens with a number of shots of the West End -
B train on the el in Brooklyn. R-38 cars with the old-style signs
(e.g. plain white "B" in a plain white circular outline). I think this
film was made in either '77 or '78 which predated the current
colored-circle line indicators.
Near the end John Travolta's character rides the RR line in Bay Ridge
which was made up of a train of R27/30 cars, with the off-brown/orange
seats and checkerboard floors, and the vent holes above the windows.
Some good views of the interior of the otherwise empty car. This train
had an "RR" indicator in big letters with no circle. There's also a
brief scene where a R44/R46 train passes by on the express track.
Well, nothing to do with the plot, anyway, but some interesting
scenes.
--Dave
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NEXT>2155
PREVIOUS>2135
POSTER>Gary Jacobi
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Questions on Refurbished R-40 Modifications
DATE>Jun 28 17:52:15 1997
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Posted by Gary Jacobi on June 20, 1997 at 11:39:59:
In Reply to: [5]Re: Questions on Refurbished R-40 Modifications posted
by David Pirmann on June 19, 1997 at 14:47:26:
I forgot how much time has passed since the R-40 was introduced. It
turns out that Loewy lived almost a hundred years, not passing on
until 1986. So he did probably nput in the project, as well as the
Studebaker Avanti, which still looks good. I apologize to both of you.
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NEXT>2157
PREVIOUS>2112
POSTER>Gary Jacobi
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: RE: New Routes & Stuff
DATE>Jun 28 17:52:17 1997
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Posted by Gary Jacobi on June 20, 1997 at 12:27:35:
In Reply to: [5]RE: New Routes & Stuff posted by subway-buff on June
19, 1997 at 03:26:44:
Re #5, the Broadway Express did operate on the center track all the
way to Eastern Parkway at the time they instituted skip-stop on
Jamaica Ave. I have been noticing many entries citing Marcy to Myrtle,
and was wondering why. Apparently they stopped the arkway express
segment some time ago, which boggles the mind, because two stops
between ENY and Williamsburg was one quick trip! The only thing
standing in the way of full peak direction express service had been
the 1893 two track line between Eastern Parkway and Crescent Street,
as the Jamaica Ave construction had room for a center track. There was
discussion of an overhead third track above the Fulton St. stretch,
but it also included eliminating the Crescent St. curve, at least for
the express track. This would have ment tearing up neighborhoods, and
the idea died.
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NEXT>2150
PREVIOUS>2071
POSTER>Gary Jacobi
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: San Jose LRT
DATE>Jun 28 17:52:18 1997
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Posted by Gary Jacobi on June 20, 1997 at 12:33:05:
In Reply to: [5]San Jose LRT posted by Nathan on June 19, 1997 at
01:52:14:
Yes, they are double ended, which is a good thing, because they still
run on an incomplete system with stub ends. The cars were built in
Japan; Kawasaki I think, and are OK, but far from perfect.
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NEXT>2158
PREVIOUS>2118
POSTER>Gary Jacobi
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: What happened to J/Z skip stop and express between Marcy and Myrtle?
DATE>Jun 28 17:52:19 1997
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Posted by Gary Jacobi on June 20, 1997 at 12:44:15:
In Reply to: [5]Re: What happened to J/Z skip stop and express between
Marcy and Myrtle? posted by Garfield on June 19, 1997 at 17:22:29:
I suspect the MTA, or whatever it is called nowadays, is looking to
abandon the J/Z line. Consider, if you will: They cut off the Jamaica
end. They have made no improvements of note on Fulton Street in one
hundred years.They dropped the express in two easy stages. What is
left but tearing it down?
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NEXT>2436
PREVIOUS>2148
POSTER>Nathan
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: San Jose LRT
DATE>Jun 28 17:52:21 1997
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Posted by Nathan on June 20, 1997 at 12:44:41:
In Reply to: [5]Re: San Jose LRT posted by Gary Jacobi on June 20,
1997 at 12:33:05:
No, the San Jose cars were built by the UTDC (now part of bombardier)
in kingston On, in 1988. The LA Metroblah-blah LRT cars were made by
(i think) kawasaki.
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NEXT>2152
PREVIOUS>2141
POSTER>Dan Lawrence
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: TTC Small Witt RT-10
DATE>Jun 28 17:52:22 1997
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Posted by Dan Lawrence on June 20, 1997 at 12:55:53:
In Reply to: [5]TTC Small Witt RT-10 posted by Nathan on June 20, 1997
at 02:22:41:
As far as I know the TTC is on it's THIRD garbage car - I believe that
the Witt was replaced after the Glouster car fire with a custom built
Japanese body on salvaged Glouster trucks and equipment. That car was
retired just this year and replaced with newer equipment.
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NEXT>2164
PREVIOUS>2151
POSTER>Dan Lawrence
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: TTC Small Witt RT-10
DATE>Jun 28 17:52:23 1997
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Posted by Dan Lawrence on June 20, 1997 at 12:56:31:
In Reply to: [5]TTC Small Witt RT-10 posted by Nathan on June 20, 1997
at 02:22:41:
As far as I know the TTC is on it's THIRD garbage car - I believe that
the Witt was replaced after the Glouster car fire with a custom built
Japanese body on salvaged Glouster trucks and equipment. That car was
retired just this year and replaced with newer equipment.
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NEXT>2154
PREVIOUS>2094
POSTER>Mark S Feinman
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Javits Center Service Idea
DATE>Jun 28 17:52:24 1997
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Posted by Mark S Feinman on June 20, 1997 at 13:19:23:
In Reply to: [6]Re: Javits Center Service Idea posted by Charles on
June 16, 1997 at 20:48:00:
Yes, I do refer tot he West Side sotrage facility - I think there's a
big sign at the entrance that calls it Caemerrer Yard.
--Mark
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NEXT>2205
PREVIOUS>2153
POSTER>Mark S Feinman
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Javits Center Service Idea
DATE>Jun 28 17:52:25 1997
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Posted by Mark S Feinman on June 20, 1997 at 13:21:38:
In Reply to: [6]Re: Javits Center Service Idea posted by Julio Perez
on June 19, 1997 at 08:36:48:
While extending the #7 (or the L) to Javits Center is certainly
feasible and a good idea, it'll cost money - lots of it. Building a
platform in the Caemerrer Yard would require no tunnelling and would
be a much cheaper solution that extending the #7. And cheaper
solutiions (those that save the City and NYC Transit money) are more
likely to get accomplished.
--Mark
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NEXT>2156
PREVIOUS>2146
POSTER>Charles Fiori
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Questions on Refurbished R-40 Modifications
DATE>Jun 28 17:52:27 1997
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Posted by Charles Fiori on June 20, 1997 at 14:00:25:
In Reply to: [5]Re: Questions on Refurbished R-40 Modifications posted
by Steve on June 19, 1997 at 20:42:46:
It is simply the weight of the carbody itself. There is a protrusion
upward from the truck which fits into a receptacle in the carbody.
Simple male/female connection.
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NEXT>2191
PREVIOUS>2155
POSTER>John
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Questions on Refurbished R-40 Modifications
DATE>Jun 28 17:52:28 1997
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Posted by John on June 20, 1997 at 15:14:40:
In Reply to: [5]Re: Questions on Refurbished R-40 Modifications posted
by Charles Fiori on June 20, 1997 at 14:00:25:
I don't mind the truck being connected to the carbody this way, just
as long as the carbody doesn't become pregnant. (The male/female
connection - if you know what I mean!)
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NEXT>2228
PREVIOUS>2147
POSTER>John
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: RE: New Routes & Stuff
DATE>Jun 28 17:52:29 1997
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Posted by John on June 20, 1997 at 15:19:52:
In Reply to: [5]Re: RE: New Routes & Stuff posted by Gary Jacobi on
June 20, 1997 at 12:27:35:
They discontinued express service between Myrtle and Marcy? I don't
have the latest subway map - is it shown on the latest map?
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NEXT>2200
PREVIOUS>2149
POSTER>John
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: What happened to J/Z skip stop and express between Marcy and Myrtle?
DATE>Jun 28 17:52:31 1997
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Posted by John on June 20, 1997 at 15:22:53:
In Reply to: [5]Re: What happened to J/Z skip stop and express between
Marcy and Myrtle? posted by Gary Jacobi on June 20, 1997 at 12:44:15:
Why would the Transit Authority do something like that? If it turns
out that they will tear it down, will they make it a bus line?
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NEXT>2196
PREVIOUS>2138
POSTER>Bingo
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: New Cars for PATH ?
DATE>Jun 28 17:52:32 1997
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Posted by Bingo on June 20, 1997 at 15:35:50:
In Reply to: [5]Re: New Cars for PATH ? posted by Jim on June 19, 1997
at 20:40:14:
You must remember that older rolling stock don't perform as well as
newer stock, and are prone to many problems. Paying any price, no
matter how low it is, for older equipment is risky business. Transit
services want to make money, not piss their customers off through
needless delays.
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NEXT>2163
PREVIOUS>2113
POSTER>Nick
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: New R-142's and 143's
DATE>Jun 28 17:52:33 1997
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Posted by Nick on June 20, 1997 at 15:42:10:
In Reply to: [6]Re: New R-142's and 143's posted by Steve on June 19,
1997 at 17:00:07:
If your talking about December 1999, it's 30 months till they arrive,
not 18. But that's still not bad. Getting new cars is a slooooow
process! -NICK
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NEXT>2170
PREVIOUS>2140
POSTER>Bingo
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Toronto H-6's
DATE>Jun 28 17:52:36 1997
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Posted by Bingo on June 20, 1997 at 15:42:18:
In Reply to: [5]Re: Toronto H-6's posted by Nathan on June 20, 1997 at
02:19:40:
Let's make a deal! I'll trade you a picture of the silver G's in their
natural habitat (Davisville Yard) if you can give me information on
whether TTC is planning on updating the LRV's anytime soon. We've done
the trains, we've done the buses, now all that's left are the
streetcars! (We'll let the Scarborough RT rot in hell, ahem hem)
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NEXT>2167
PREVIOUS>2136
POSTER>Bingo
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Toronto Tube (was Re: NYC screen saver ideas...
DATE>Jun 28 17:52:38 1997
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Posted by Bingo on June 20, 1997 at 15:57:17:
In Reply to: [5]Re: Toronto Tube (was Re: NYC screen saver ideas...
posted by Nathan on June 20, 1997 at 02:03:08:
No way, that can't be! (I'm really, really sorry! Please don't hurt
me!) The cars run on CN track, on the CN guage, and were manufactured
by the same people who make the VIA Lr cars. The cars are pulled by
the same CN locomotive that is used for their freight operations,
(AmTrak and METRA use them too) and they also SOUND the same as the CN
locomotives. Anyway, I get this sinking feeling i'm wrong, and I guess
I'll have to ride the system and ask some questions to justify that. I
do like that coffee idea! I want all the coffee that I can get on my
way to HAMILTON and OSHAWA...
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NEXT>2168
PREVIOUS>2160
POSTER>David Pirmann
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: New R-142's and 143's
DATE>Jun 28 17:52:40 1997
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Posted by David Pirmann on June 20, 1997 at 16:00:13:
In Reply to: [6]Re: New R-142's and 143's posted by Nick on June 20,
1997 at 15:42:10:
Right. 1999 starts in 18 months... I was saying that it's not as far
away as it seems.
I used 30 months to figure there would be an average of more than 1
car per day- there's approx 900 days in 30 months, and 1050 cars to be
delivered. I think that's a pretty good rate.
--Dave
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NEXT>2253
PREVIOUS>2152
POSTER>Bingo
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: TTC Small Witt RT-10
DATE>Jun 28 17:52:41 1997
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Posted by Bingo on June 20, 1997 at 16:11:05:
In Reply to: [5]Re: TTC Small Witt RT-10 posted by Dan Lawrence on
June 20, 1997 at 12:56:31:
If there was any new equipment purchased for garbage collection, I
would have seen it by now. I am usually on the system late at night
when the pickup is done (around midnight, 1 a.m.) and have seen the
following cars:
2 sets of Hawker-Siddelly round windows garbage cars
1 set of Gloucester silver garbage cars (only on Y-U-S line)
1 set of (I think) MLW garbage cars (They are characterized by a
totally black roof) (Only seen once, on B-D line)
Garbage is collected by truck for the RT line
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NEXT>2169
PREVIOUS>2145
POSTER>Bingo
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Transit in Movies - Again
DATE>Jun 28 17:52:43 1997
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Posted by Bingo on June 20, 1997 at 16:16:10:
In Reply to: [5]Transit in Movies - Again posted by David Pirmann on
June 20, 1997 at 10:19:24:
Why is it that in Jurassic Park: The Lost World when Malcolm is on the
MTA, the doors close with THREE chimes like in Toronto and not TWO? Do
movie companies share sound bites with each other, totally
disregarding detail, detail, detail? (By the way, I think Ghost was
filmed in Toronto)
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NEXT>
PREVIOUS>2121
POSTER>Bingo
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: A train
DATE>Jun 28 17:52:44 1997
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Posted by Bingo on June 20, 1997 at 16:20:07:
In Reply to: [5]Re: A train posted by Peter Furuhashi on June 18, 1997
at 02:31:41:
No, you're totally correct! And if they need to be shipped longer
distances, they do it by ship. Same thing goes for streetcars.
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NEXT>
PREVIOUS>2162
POSTER>Nathan
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Toronto Tube (was Re: NYC screen saver ideas...
DATE>Jun 28 17:52:45 1997
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Posted by Nathan on June 20, 1997 at 16:33:06:
In Reply to: [5]Re: Toronto Tube (was Re: NYC screen saver ideas...
posted by Bingo on June 20, 1997 at 15:57:17:
Exactly, they were made by the same people who made the Via LRC cars!
CN Does not manufacture rolling stock! The Bi-level car (used on the
go trains) was made by the UTDC (now part of bombardier). The engine
that pulls the trains is made by GM EMD (electro-motive division i
think) and has the designation F-59** something or other. Anyway, the
Bi-level car was
designed through a co-operative effort involving the government of
ontario
and the UTDC. This car and engine are rather popular, and are in
service
in Toronto (for which they were originally designed) Miami (tri-rail)
Los Angeles (metrolink) San Diego (COASTER) San Jose (San Joaquin Rail
corridor, something or other) and Vancouver (West Coast Express). The
same base engine is used in (i believe) all of the above systems, with
the exeption that Vancouver and LA's engines have some sleek
streamlined fiberglass shell (which makes them look pretty good) and
the other systems
use the un-streamlined version. Proof that they are not made by CN is
seen
in Vancouver where the WCE Trains use the Canadian Pacific right of
way, and are operated/staffed by CP crews, except in the coffee bars
and at the stations. Sorry!
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NEXT>2176
PREVIOUS>2163
POSTER>Bingo
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: New R-142's and 143's
DATE>Jun 28 17:52:46 1997
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Posted by Bingo on June 20, 1997 at 16:36:49:
In Reply to: [5]Re: New R-142's and 143's posted by Steve on June 19,
1997 at 17:00:07:
Soooo, are we looking at an even 2 million? *grin* I know TTC paid
Bombardier a handsome sum for the T-1's, and most of them haven't
arrived yet! BTW, has transit car manufacturing become a monopolized
or at least curtailed business in North America? Maybe Hitachi can be
called on to give Kawasaki some competition (New PA-5 cars perhaps)
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NEXT>2174
PREVIOUS>2165
POSTER>David Pirmann
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Transit in Movies - Again
DATE>Jun 28 17:52:48 1997
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Posted by David Pirmann on June 20, 1997 at 16:38:08:
In Reply to: [6]Re: Transit in Movies - Again posted by Bingo on June
20, 1997 at 16:16:10:
Re: Ghost...
I heard that the platform scene was filmed at the lower level of 42nd
Street / 8Th Avenue. But it's been years since I've seen the movie.
From what I recall there is more than a passing resemblence.
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NEXT>2173
PREVIOUS>2161
POSTER>Nathan
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Toronto H-6's
DATE>Jun 28 17:52:49 1997
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Posted by Nathan on June 20, 1997 at 16:47:47:
In Reply to: [6]Re: Toronto H-6's posted by Bingo on June 20, 1997 at
15:42:18:
No, the TTC is (as i know) pretty much taking a status quo approach to
the
LRV's. For example, the Spadina LRT is going to use regular C/ALRV's
when
it establishes a through service with the Harborfront LRT. On the
track upgrade side, I know that when the TTC replaces LRV trackwork it
is now standard to replace the old rails with "floating track" to
reduce noise and
improve the ride. One thing though, some of the Subway stations are in
dire need of a face-lift, especially eye-sore stations like Lansdowne
on the BD.
Yeccchhhh!!!!
Anyway, the Scarberia RT rotting in hell? Hmmm, the TTC does not do a
very
good job at maintaining the SRT. Wait, not maintenance wise, but
modifications to the technology. The technology used (linear induction
motors, cab signalling) was relatively untried before the SRT, and the
only
city that has had real success with that technology is probably
vancouver (sorry for tooting my own horn, living in a small city means
you must learn
to love an equally small transit system, oh well, still beats LA).
BUT....
BC Transit had to make major modifications ($$$) and debug a few
things, such as reducing the squeal made by the forced steerable axles
etc. The main problem is cold; the pressure sensitive doors (required
because no operator is available to stick his head out and see if
anyone is stuck)
would have ice accumulate in the door-tracks, and the train wouldn't
start until the doors closed, and the entire system was up in knots
for days ($$$). The only other problem was when snow accumulated on
the tracks and
triggered the system that senses Foreign Body weight on the guideway,
again, the system was in knots and yes, it cost $$$. Now the line runs
(pretty much) flawlessly, is fast and efficient, and attracts growing
ridership, but it cost a lot of $$$!!!
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NEXT>2184
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>Bingo
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Coffee Bars and Bullet nosed Lada's (Was, um... I forget)
DATE>Jun 28 17:52:51 1997
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Posted by Bingo on June 20, 1997 at 16:49:55:
In Reply to: [5]Re: Toronto Tube (was Re: NYC screen saver ideas...
posted by Nathan on June 20, 1997 at 16:33:06:
What about the COFFEE BARS, Goddammit! The coffee bars! I need my
f------ coffee! Hamilton is just too much! *much sobbing, weeping,
whining etc. etc.* The people there are just so sad!
BTW, was this GM built engine a derivative of the funny looking train
that VIA used in the 70's for a couple of years until they found that
the service was unprofitable and the train was built like a Lada? You
know what I mean... it had like this bullet nose and was really
streamlined-like...
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PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>Nathan
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: TTC Small Witt RT-10/anti silver car message
DATE>Jun 28 17:52:52 1997
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Posted by Nathan on June 20, 1997 at 16:59:39:
In Reply to: [5]Re: TTC Small Witt RT-10 posted by Bingo on June 20,
1997 at 16:11:05:
so the Witt has been scrapped? Hmmm, why did they have to use the
SILVER Gloucester cars for garbage duty? I would so much rather see
my beloved RED G-cars on the system still, the subway lacks
personality
now, I hate sterile silver, and have since I was about 2.
"Daddy! Hurry up!! A red one!! Quick!! I don't want a silver one!"
anyway, i think silver sux and would much rather see RED cars on the
subway. What's next, are the LRV's going to be turned into stainless
steal
boxes, blinding everyone with their ugliness? Good god.
P.S. I know that cars 5098-99 are preserved at the Halton Radial Rlwy
Museum, but does that museum have any plans to maybe (idea) convert
one track circuit to 3rd rail, or even just add a 3rd rail and leave
the cantenary intact so trolleys could use the same line, I mean, they
have those beautiful G-cars, why not put them into operating order?
Then maybe they could acquire (if funds were available) some MLW cars,
and maybe a
silver "G" (WHICH I STILL HAVEN'T SEEN!!!) that would be something.
Silver
cars just don't scream "Ride the Rocket".
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POSTER>Bingo
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Toronto H-6's
DATE>Jun 28 17:52:54 1997
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Posted by Bingo on June 20, 1997 at 17:05:53:
In Reply to: [5]Re: Toronto H-6's posted by Nathan on June 20, 1997 at
16:47:47:
In my book, the ugliest station of them all has got to be Union. And
that's unfortunate, because it is the first station that most tourists
see when they come to T.O. It has immense historical value, and is at
the centre of the economic jungle that we call downtown Toronto. Right
now there is some organization that is pressuring the government to
protect the lands around Union for future travel and population
expansion. I think this is a good idea. I think that the TTC is stupid
in thinking that Union will be able to support both Skydome's and the
upcoming Air Canada Centre's venues. I think the Maple Leafs are
stupid for even considering the Union lands for their new arena. It's
high time they shut their fat asses up and started to think about the
fans for once. I'm certainly not going to one caught in a proverbial
zoo at the badly planned Union.
Vancouver, though small, is still a cool city. I stop by there now and
then after I go snowboarding at Blackcomb. I've never ridden the
subway there, though.
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PREVIOUS>2169
POSTER>Nathan
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Transit in Movies - Again
DATE>Jun 28 17:52:55 1997
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Posted by Nathan on June 20, 1997 at 17:08:21:
In Reply to: [5]Re: Transit in Movies - Again posted by Bingo on June
20, 1997 at 16:16:10:
Three chimes dadadadada. When (exactly) were the door chimes added
to the TTC Trains? I guess the conductors who blew the whistle when
the doors were closing got bored. Does the SRT not use three chimes
too (except the three notes go up the pitch-scale instead of down, as
seen on the subway). The best door closing thing I have heard so far
was on one of my mundane WCE trips; these lights flash, a series of
screeches is heard, and (prior to the screeching/beeps) the conductor
said, "The Doors are now closing, please make sure your wives are kept
clear of the doors". At the end of that trip it was, "Now arriving:
Waterfront station. This will be our last stop, please don't forget to
take your coats, umbrellas, and wives." !
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POSTER>Bingo
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: TTC Small Witt RT-10/anti silver car message
DATE>Jun 28 17:52:57 1997
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Posted by Bingo on June 20, 1997 at 17:12:01:
In Reply to: [5]Re: TTC Small Witt RT-10/anti silver car message
posted by Nathan on June 20, 1997 at 16:59:39:
How true! I totally second that!
Unfortunately, the Halton Museums storage does not allow for that.
There are also safety regulations that they must abide by. I also have
this feeling (from the pictures i've seen) that the trucks have been
tampered with and modified to fit in with the rest of the collection
at the museum!
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POSTER>Nathan
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: New R-142's and 143's
DATE>Jun 28 17:52:59 1997
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Posted by Nathan on June 20, 1997 at 17:20:34:
In Reply to: [5]Re: New R-142's and 143's posted by Steve on June 19,
1997 at 17:00:07:
Yes, I'm aware of the Kawasaki plant in Yonkers (the sign of no life,
I only live about 3000 miles away) but the Bombardier built cars would
probably be manufactured in Thunder Bay (brrrrrr, cold) at
Bombardier's Thunder Bay plant; the American Plants owned by
Bombardier (Aubern, Barre, etc) specialize in finish of the vehicals.
Bombardier would probably build
them in Thunder bay, same as the T-1's, and Ankara cars (which
resemble m-trains minus one front window). The Computer diagnostic
stuff won't be too much of a problem, New York won't receive these
cars until 1999, so any
troubles would be first encountered by the Toronto T-1s (using the
same technology), the Ontario tax-payer would be required to pay for
the solution/upgrade to the problem, and this solution would probably
be incorporated into the New York cars. As for the newfangled Computer
Diagnostic kits, well, I can just picture roving mechanics walking
around a train, slowly scanning it with a little beeping star trek
tricorder...
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POSTER>Bingo
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Transit in Movies - Again
DATE>Jun 28 17:53:00 1997
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Posted by Bingo on June 20, 1997 at 17:25:22:
In Reply to: [5]Re: Transit in Movies - Again posted by Nathan on June
20, 1997 at 17:08:21:
The chimes were added during TTC's "We care about our beloved
customers safety" extravaganza that went on during 1993-94. They
tested chimes, safety gates at the end of Davisville and Rosedale
stations, the blind peoples platform markers, Designated Waiting
Areas, and some other stuff I can't, nor want to, remember. It was all
stupid and pointless, and more that half of these moronic ideas were
thrown down the toilet. SRT sounds the same as the subways, except
they modified the sound that originally shipped with the cars (a
frighteningly loud, beeping sound) They still use whistles on the MLW
trains, though, and I always get this tear in my eye...
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POSTER>Nathan
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Montreal Subway
DATE>Jun 28 17:53:02 1997
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Posted by Nathan on June 20, 1997 at 17:26:18:
Ok, I basically know nothing about the montreal subway, except that
the rubber tired vehicals were built by bombardier. ANyway, i hear
that
the system is finally showing it's age, with leaks and other
mechanical
problems popping up all over the place. Is this true? Is there any
planned
subway expansion in the near future? Has anyone planned on throwing
the
Bloc-heads infront of a moving train? What is the daily ridership on
this
system?
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POSTER>Nathan
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Los Angeles (*gasp*) Red line Subway
DATE>Jun 28 17:53:04 1997
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Posted by Nathan on June 20, 1997 at 17:31:44:
Ok, I heard from a certain source that the LA Red Line is only
carrying
30'000 people per day. Is this true? Does this mean that I can
OFFICIALLY
rate the Los Angeles subway as THE shittiest subway line around? Is
ridership that appallingly low? God, in Toronto their expecting a 4
mile
stub line (heavy rail subway) to attract over 100 000 people per day,
but that damn "stub" is badly needed so I can see ridership being
higher than that. I know of quite a few light rail lines where each
single line carries
about 4 times the patronage seen on the red line.
Oh dear
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POSTER>Nathan
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Montreal Subway
DATE>Jun 28 17:53:05 1997
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Posted by Nathan on June 20, 1997 at 17:33:33:
Ok, I basically know nothing about the montreal subway, except that
the rubber tired vehicals were built by bombardier. ANyway, i hear
that
the system is finally showing it's age, with leaks and other
mechanical
problems popping up all over the place. Is this true? Is there any
planned
subway expansion in the near future? Has anyone planned on throwing
the
Bloc-heads infront of a moving train? What is the daily ridership on
this
system?
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POSTER>John
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Transit in Movies - Again
DATE>Jun 28 17:53:07 1997
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Posted by John on June 20, 1997 at 17:54:14:
In Reply to: [5]Re: Transit in Movies - Again posted by Bingo on June
20, 1997 at 16:16:10:
Another thing that I don't understand about that is that when Malcom
sat in the set of three longitudinal seats (the train was an R-46), it
was right against a window. In the R-44, R-46, R-68, and R-68A, the
longitudinal seats are not against any window. Explaination?
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POSTER>John
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: TTC Small Witt RT-10/anti silver car message
DATE>Jun 28 17:53:09 1997
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Posted by John on June 20, 1997 at 17:56:14:
In Reply to: [5]Re: TTC Small Witt RT-10/anti silver car message
posted by Bingo on June 20, 1997 at 17:12:01:
Were these cars all-red? How close in resemblance are they to the New
York subway's redbirds?
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POSTER>Nathan
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: What are interlocking signals?
DATE>Jun 28 17:53:10 1997
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Posted by Nathan on June 20, 1997 at 19:55:48:
In Reply to: [5]Re: What are interlocking signals? posted by Bingo on
June 17, 1997 at 19:14:16:
Oh, i thought the motorman died. Ooops, bastard deserved it though.
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POSTER>Nathan
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Coffee Bars and Bullet nosed Lada's (Was, um... I forget)
DATE>Jun 28 17:53:12 1997
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Posted by Nathan on June 20, 1997 at 20:01:15:
In Reply to: [5]Re: Coffee Bars and Bullet nosed Lada's (Was, um... I
forget) posted by Bingo on June 20, 1997 at 16:49:55:
Ah, the infamous turbotrain, yes. Now, coffee, chances are GO Transit
probably won't be including coffee bars anytime soon, seeing as they
do not
absolutely need to attract new riders (unless the evil-satan Mike
Harris chops down the subsidies). You see, in a new system, it must be
made
overly comfortable to attract new riders out of their cadillacs.
That's
why here the government of british columbia went overboard (oh well,
more than mike harris is doing) and with bombardier turned commuting
into some luxury type thing. Grey/blue soft insides, cushy seats (with
head rests that are actually at head level), coffee bars (yes, on
board coffee bars)
and my personal favorite: Alarm strips and passenger talk balk
intercoms...
hehehe
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SUBJECT>TTC Ugly Stations, Vancouver, everything else, life story, was Re: Toronto
DATE>Jun 28 17:53:14 1997
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In Reply to: [5]Re: Toronto H-6's posted by Bingo on June 20, 1997 at
17:05:53:
I know! Ack! What really sux is when you get off the GO Train (in
Union)
and take that glass elevator, and you go down that gross rainbow
elevator
shaft, yeecchhhh!!! No, the Union lands are not a good place for the
Maple Leafs, (yes, nothing like platforms that have support columns
everywhere!)
I'll be in TO this summer (Spadina LRT opens, July 27!!) but I think
that
the TTC should at least spruce up Union.
Yeah, one thing though. Ack! Small city alert! Ok, I realize our
paltry 2 million people is dwarved by almost every other clump of
civilisation on the planet, and the subway (which is only subway
downtown, the rest, i think 25km is elevated) but man, those els
deliver! (same tech as scarberia
RT, only on a much larger scale) Probably because, unlike the morons
down in Portland, speed and efficiency was a higher priority than land
use. Build one line which was very fast, and let malls etc sprung up
along the line, boosting ridership and livibility. Of course now the
city is so fucking choked citizens are demanding that construction of
the 3 proposed lrt lines begin at once, which will cost $$$ and the
politicians are stalling but, well, you know the story. They'll build
my lrt and it will be under budget (no, really, the ART was 10 million
under budget)...
I'm not making sense, weren't we talking about H-6's?
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POSTER>Nathan
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>MLW's still in service??? Re: Transit in Movies - Again
DATE>Jun 28 17:53:16 1997
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Posted by Nathan on June 20, 1997 at 20:18:52:
In Reply to: [5]Re: Transit in Movies - Again posted by Bingo on June
20, 1997 at 17:25:22:
How many MLW's (M-series) are still in service? I heard the BD, right?
I miss the whistle!! The MLW's have 4 doors, right?
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POSTER>Nathan
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: TTC Small Witt RT-10/anti silver car message
DATE>Jun 28 17:53:18 1997
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Posted by Nathan on June 20, 1997 at 20:35:28:
In Reply to: [5]Re: TTC Small Witt RT-10/anti silver car message
posted by John on June 20, 1997 at 17:56:14:
The G-Cars did not really resemble the Red-Birds. They went into
service in 1954 when the first line opened and were retired in August,
1991.
Yes, the cars were all red. Completely red, with the exeption of a
thin, gold line laterally traversing each side of the car at mid
height, and a gold "TTC" logo beside each set of doors. The gold was
more a yellow gold,
and like i said, the stripe was very, very thin, and the TTC logo used
very thin lines as well. (It accentuated the cars very well). The cars
looked rather modern, and were well cowled so head/tail lights did not
stick out (unlike most cars I've seen built during that time). The
cars had three sets of bi-parting sliding doors, 3 on each side for a
total of 6 per car.
The front resembled later ttc subway car fronts, with one observation
window, an end door with a narrower window, and a window on the
operators cab, the same size as the observation window. The cars
looked bright red in daylight, but in the darkened tubes looked
burgundy, very royal and impressive. The windows used either (can not
remember) drop sash or sliding
sash openings.
The point is, the red cars gave the system a lot of personality, were
nice to look at, and very nostalgic in their later years. I am going
to write a letter to the ttc recommending that, by 2004, a "nostalgia
T-1" (hopefully number 5000, which was the number of the first red
G-train) be painted in that original red colour scheme. If anyone
agrees (ie Bingo) write to the ttc too, th emore letters we can get
in, the harder our point will be driven across.
BTW, the last time I ever saw a G-Train was in Dundas Station, I was
going north and it was going south
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POSTER>~airplane
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SUBJECT>Re: Montreal Subway
DATE>Jun 28 17:53:20 1997
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Posted by ~airplane on June 20, 1997 at 20:44:03:
In Reply to: [6]Montreal Subway posted by Nathan on June 20, 1997 at
17:33:33:
Speaking of rubber tired vehicles, has anyone heard any details on
this new plan to run a high speed train to the Hamptons using rubber
wheels?
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POSTER>Jim
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Montreal Subway
DATE>Jun 28 17:53:21 1997
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Posted by Jim on June 20, 1997 at 21:05:50:
In Reply to: [5]Re: Montreal Subway posted by ~airplane on June 20,
1997 at 20:44:03:
If you are talking about the Hamptons on Long Island, those rubber
tired high speed vehicles are called jitneys.
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POSTER>Steve
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: New R-142's and 143's
DATE>Jun 28 17:53:22 1997
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Posted by Steve on June 20, 1997 at 21:12:46:
In Reply to: [5]Re: New R-142's and 143's posted by Bingo on June 20,
1997 at 16:36:49:
Actually, two north american railcar builders didn't even bid on the
R-142s and R-143s. The Railcar division spinoff of Morrison Knudsen in
Hornell, NY and ABB Traction of Elmira, NY showed no real interest. M
& K built the new CTA cars as well as the New Haven M-6s and ABB
Traction built the Norristown cars (pics elsewhere on this site).
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POSTER>Steve
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Questions on Refurbished R-40 Modifications
DATE>Jun 28 17:53:24 1997
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Posted by Steve on June 20, 1997 at 21:23:41:
In Reply to: [5]Re: Questions on Refurbished R-40 Modifications posted
by Charles Fiori on June 20, 1997 at 14:00:25:
You have the right idea but backwards. The female side is called 'The
Center Casting' and is mounted to the truck bolster. The male portion
is on the carbody. By the way, the center casting is filled with oil.
The truck noise which was mentioned earlier is likely from the side
bearings (sometimes referred to as the friction pads). These are an
asbestos composite pads mounted to the upper portion of the truck side
frame. On the car body there is a steel plate which is designed to
slide across this pad.
When upright, there is approximately 1/4" between the carbody and
truck surfaces of the friction pads. But on curves or with uneven
loading, one side of the carbody can sit down on the friction pad,
which will still permit the truck to turn smoothly. The noise comes
when the friction pad is either badly worn or binding.
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POSTER>Steve
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: What are interlocking signals?
DATE>Jun 28 17:53:25 1997
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Posted by Steve on June 20, 1997 at 21:30:36:
In Reply to: [5]Re: What are interlocking signals? posted by Bingo on
June 17, 1997 at 19:14:16:
I know very little about the Toronto System.. How is it possible to
run a trip on that system and keep going? On the NYCT system, if you
hit a trip, brakepipe air is vented to atmosphere and the emergency
brakes apply -
PERIOD.
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POSTER>Steve
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Los Angeles (*gasp*) Red line Subway
DATE>Jun 28 17:53:26 1997
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Posted by Steve on June 20, 1997 at 21:36:50:
In Reply to: [5]Los Angeles (*gasp*) Red line Subway posted by Nathan
on June 20, 1997 at 17:31:44:
Perhaps you have it backwards. When conceived, the LA Subway was
predicted to carry less than 1% of LAs population. Is it the fault of
the system or the reluctance of the inhabitants to give up their cars.
Keep in mind that LAs growth was due primarily to the growth &
expansion of the electric railways which preceeded it. However, the
electric railways soon went bankrupt as the auto's popularity surged
in the late 20s.
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POSTER>Steve
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Transit in Movies - Again
DATE>Jun 28 17:53:28 1997
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Posted by Steve on June 20, 1997 at 21:44:13:
In Reply to: [5]Re: Transit in Movies - Again posted by John on June
20, 1997 at 17:54:14:
The scene you are referring to was filmed at the Church Avenue Station
on the F line. The longitudinal seats are the seats perpendicular to
the car side. On the cars with such seating, those seats are abreast
of the windows. However, they are only two hinies wide. I was not
present at the filming, nor have I seen the movie so I can't visualize
the scene but I can tell you that the chime sound had to be dubbed
because the cars had a standard chime when they left Jamaica yard
prior to the filming.
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POSTER>Nathan
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Los Angeles (*gasp*) Red line Subway
DATE>Jun 28 17:53:29 1997
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Posted by Nathan on June 20, 1997 at 21:47:07:
In Reply to: [5]Re: Los Angeles (*gasp*) Red line Subway posted by
Steve on June 20, 1997 at 21:36:50:
Yes, i know the all-too-familiar story of the great interurban giants,
Pacific Electric ("big red"), the radials found on the east coast, and
my personal pet, the bc electric rlwy. And yes, it is the fault of the
system.
Not the technology, but the way it was planned. LA has a very low
population density (especially when compared to Manhattan) and is
decentralized. Many Los Angelinos work in the sprawling suburbs, to
which rail travel is not suited.
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NEXT>2206
PREVIOUS>2159
POSTER>Andrew Huie
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: New Cars for PATH ?
DATE>Jun 28 17:53:30 1997
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Posted by Andrew Huie on June 20, 1997 at 22:11:36:
In Reply to: [6]New Cars for PATH ? posted by subway-buff on June 19,
1997 at 17:16:41:
Are you sure the PA-4's have 3 sets of doors? I thought I've seen
every car they had so far, and I haven't seen any 3-door-sets-per-side
cars since the MP-50's (and the "sets" in that case were 1 door each).
If they have 3 sets of doors on each side, how is it arranged?
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NEXT>2202
PREVIOUS>2195
POSTER>John
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Los Angeles (*gasp*) Red line Subway
DATE>Jun 28 17:53:32 1997
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Posted by John on June 20, 1997 at 22:45:16:
In Reply to: [5]Re: Los Angeles (*gasp*) Red line Subway posted by
Nathan on June 20, 1997 at 21:47:07:
Los Angelinos? That sounds more like a Greek name rather than the term
for a citizen of Los Angeles. Isn't the correct term 'Los Angelin'?
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PREVIOUS>2194
POSTER>John
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Transit in Movies - Again
DATE>Jun 28 17:53:33 1997
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Posted by John on June 20, 1997 at 22:47:40:
In Reply to: [5]Re: Transit in Movies - Again posted by Steve on June
20, 1997 at 21:44:13:
Ooops! I must have used the wrong term for the seats. What I meant was
the set of three seats against the wall of the train (facing inward).
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NEXT>2216
PREVIOUS>2190
POSTER>Zack
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: New R-142's and 143's
DATE>Jun 28 17:53:34 1997
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Posted by Zack on June 20, 1997 at 23:05:58:
In Reply to: [6]Re: New R-142's and 143's posted by Nick on June 20,
1997 at 15:42:10:
yeah it aloso takes time to tool up, instruct the workrs how to build
the cars and start assembling the parts and all those 1001 things that
need to be done with.(not bad for somphting the government does. :))
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NEXT>2334
PREVIOUS>2158
POSTER>Zack
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: What happened to J/Z skip stop and express between Marcy and Myrtle?
DATE>Jun 28 17:53:36 1997
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Posted by Zack on June 20, 1997 at 23:22:56:
In Reply to: [6]Re: What happened to J/Z skip stop and express between
Marcy and Myrtle? posted by John on June 20, 1997 at 15:22:53:
if it is torn doen then its probally unecomincal to operate either due
to age or detoriationg physical age. if thy do they will probally make
it a bus line. (if this keeps up newyork wont have any subway left
then 100 years later they will wonder what happend to the subway and
re build it.)
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NEXT>2226
PREVIOUS>2191
POSTER>Zack
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Questions on Refurbished R-40 Modifications
DATE>Jun 28 17:53:37 1997
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Posted by Zack on June 20, 1997 at 23:26:34:
In Reply to: [6]Re: Questions on Refurbished R-40 Modifications posted
by John on June 20, 1997 at 15:14:40:
NO!! NO!! not more of thoes ugly R-40 (R-30's would be great though)
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NEXT>2208
PREVIOUS>2197
POSTER>Nathan
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Los Angeles (*gasp*) Red line Subway
DATE>Jun 28 17:53:39 1997
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Posted by Nathan on June 21, 1997 at 00:50:51:
In Reply to: [5]Re: Los Angeles (*gasp*) Red line Subway posted by
John on June 20, 1997 at 22:45:16:
Nope!! Los Angelinos is it...
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NEXT>
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>Nathan
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: New R-142's and 143's (and Bingo's T-1's)
DATE>Jun 28 17:53:40 1997
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Posted by Nathan on June 21, 1997 at 01:02:32:
In Reply to: [5]Re: New R-142's and 143's posted by Bingo on June 20,
1997 at 16:36:49:
Isn't Bombardier manufacturing half the order, with Kawasaki doing the
other half? Does Siemens show any interest in Heavy Rail, or does it
wish to stick with Light Rail? Hmmm, hansome sum for the T-1's, eh?
Well, at least you don't have to pay 2 million dollars for one 4 door
car!! Good god! Bombardier must have gotten rich off the BC Taxpayer,
you try (in the 1980's) to pay for an ART (advanced rapid transit)
vehicle!! Of course it is paying off, now Kuala Lumpur is throwing out
the $$$ on ART vehicles, and so Bombardier get's a hefty sum, but so
does the EVIL BC gov, bc transit is helping implement the system. Why?
Because the 2 other operators (detroit and it's EVIL people mover and
the Scarberia RT) that were brave enough to put money into an unproven
technology didn't do Jack shit to improve the technology, I was on the
Scarberia RT last summer and it was
basically "whiiiiiiiiiiiiIIIIIIIIINNE-whiiiiiIIIIIIIIINE,
whiiiiiIIIIIINE
Screech! Screech! Kathunk-Kathunk-kathunk *ssss, Midland's Next ssss*
WHIIIIiiiiiiiinnnne". Good god, must have gone deaf. I swear the
Linear
Induction Motors were dragging on the reaction rail... Oh well, I may
seem to be dwelling on pathetic gold plated small town transit systems
but I'm doing a thesis on it over the summer... *sigh*
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NEXT>2211
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>Nathan
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Breda Cars
DATE>Jun 28 17:53:43 1997
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Posted by Nathan on June 21, 1997 at 01:06:46:
Ok, I'm letting my feelings fly.
BREDA CARS SUCK!!!!!! Good God! Have you seen the new SF Muni cars?
The doors are sooooo small, their sinister looking, and even worse are
the LA
MetroRail Cars!
ICK!! I HATE BREDA!!! BOMBARDIER ALL THE WAY!!! ()
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NEXT>2401
PREVIOUS>2154
POSTER>Joshua Caesar
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Javits Center Service Idea
DATE>Jun 28 17:53:44 1997
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Posted by Joshua Caesar on June 21, 1997 at 02:02:35:
In Reply to: [6]Re: Javits Center Service Idea posted by Andrew Huie
on June 16, 1997 at 20:58:24:
Andrew Huie wrote "If the service to JFK is created on the LIRR ROW,
why not have an LIRR route going direct from JFK to Javits, with a
stopover at Penn Station?"
A service like that is a great idea, but would primarily serve
out-of-towners, try convincing the MTA and the city to spend money on
that. LIRR service, shuttle or through, is a great idea for the Javits
Center, one that would be even better when complemented by the
extension of the 7 train to bring the subway to the convention center.
The one seat ride for city residents should be the ultimate goal of a
project like this.
JC
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NEXT>2207
PREVIOUS>2196
POSTER>David Pirmann
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: New Cars for PATH ?
DATE>Jun 28 17:53:45 1997
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Posted by David Pirmann on June 21, 1997 at 12:26:23:
In Reply to: [6]Re: New Cars for PATH ? posted by Andrew Huie on June
20, 1997 at 22:11:36:
Yup, they do. They're offset from each other, rather than directly
across like in the PA1,2,3 classes(two doors per side). There's
pictures on the site.
[7]example of PA-1,2,3 class cars, #740
[8]example of PA-4 class car
--Dave
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NEXT>
PREVIOUS>2206
POSTER>David Pirmann
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: New Cars for PATH ?
DATE>Jun 28 17:53:47 1997
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Posted by David Pirmann on June 21, 1997 at 12:29:56:
In Reply to: [6]Re: New Cars for PATH ? posted by Nathan on June 20,
1997 at 02:08:33:
Well no one knows yet since no RFP has been placed. (Request for
Proposal)
I've heard that the ordering process might begin this year but I've
seen nothing definite. An RFP has to be done, then bids placed, THEN
we'll know who's going to build them.
--Dave
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NEXT>2214
PREVIOUS>2202
POSTER>Bingo
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Los Angeles (*gasp*) Red line Subway
DATE>Jun 28 17:53:48 1997
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Posted by Bingo on June 21, 1997 at 13:20:22:
In Reply to: [5]Los Angeles (*gasp*) Red line Subway posted by Nathan
on June 20, 1997 at 17:31:44:
Sort of like that episode of the Simpsons when Springfield is conned
into getting a monorail system, isn't it?
The Sheppard line, in my opinion, is a waste of money. What we need
right now is a connection with the airport!
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NEXT>2220
PREVIOUS>2186
POSTER>Bingo
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: MLW's still in service??? Re: Transit in Movies - Again
DATE>Jun 28 17:53:50 1997
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Posted by Bingo on June 21, 1997 at 13:24:33:
In Reply to: [5]MLW's still in service??? Re: Transit in Movies -
Again posted by Nathan on June 20, 1997 at 20:18:52:
1)8
2)Yes
3)Yes, contrary to the Gloucesters (3)
p.s please leave your e-mail address so that we may send you a picture
of RT-38 and 39! I don't have a web page service and I certainly would
like to send you pictures of the silver G's.
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NEXT>2225
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: TTC Ugly Stations, Vancouver, everything else, life story, was Re:
DATE>Jun 28 17:53:51 1997
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In Reply to: [5]TTC Ugly Stations, Vancouver, everything else, life
story, was Re: Toronto H-6's posted by Nathan on June 20, 1997 at
20:15:12:
Better planning than in Japan, where big department stores (i.e. Sogo)
OWN the stations and make it so that you MUST walk through some part
of the store before you can break surface.
I was thinking, maybe a whole bunch of people should get together and
picket outside the Bombardier headquarters with signs like "NO MORE
DISGUSTING ORANGE CARS" and "WHEN DOES THE INSANITY STOP??" and even
"I CAN'T HAVE SEX IN THOSE HORRID CARS ANYMORE" (I don't have sex on
the TTC! But I know people who do!)
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NEXT>2224
PREVIOUS>2204
POSTER>Bryan Layne
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Breda Cars
DATE>Jun 28 17:53:52 1997
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Posted by Bryan Layne on June 21, 1997 at 13:40:20:
In Reply to: [6]Breda Cars posted by Nathan on June 21, 1997 at
01:06:46:
I agree!!! I'd rather see the old red n orange Boeings running in SF
any day.The Breda cars are not only inadequate,theyre ugly,those
slanted sides and stainless steel sides are just not San Fran.I do on
the other side like the Red Line cars for LA.There not really special
in anyway,and are quite contemperary,much like LA.But I dont disagree
with LA for getting all stainless steel cars,LA has a graffiti problem
and I'm sure there are a lot of writers that would like to see the Red
line as a new,old New York thing,a big moving target.
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NEXT>
PREVIOUS>2184
POSTER>Bingo
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Coffee Bars and Bullet nosed Lada's (Was, um... I forget)
DATE>Jun 28 17:53:54 1997
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Posted by Bingo on June 21, 1997 at 13:41:27:
In Reply to: [5]Re: Coffee Bars and Bullet nosed Lada's (Was, um... I
forget) posted by Nathan on June 20, 1997 at 20:01:15:
Well, there are coffee bars on all AmTrak runs, like the one I took
between Toronto and Chicago. Why could'nt they splurge a bit? Maybe
get my favorite Second Cup (Die Starbucks! die die die!) to run a few
franchises on the longer runs.
Of course, on AmTrak, you're just waiting for some crazy psycho from
the American White Trash Militia to put a penny on the track and watch
the chaos ensue.
Stupid turbotrain couldn't even run in snow!
We had cushy seats on the early 60's trains, but the standard are
those anti-vandal seats that they're putting on all the H-5's now. I
still love those bench seats, they're so good on your ass! And you
sleep like a baby on them!
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NEXT>
PREVIOUS>2187
POSTER>Bingo
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: TTC Small Witt RT-10/anti silver car message
DATE>Jun 28 17:53:56 1997
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Posted by Bingo on June 21, 1997 at 13:52:50:
In Reply to: [5]Re: TTC Small Witt RT-10/anti silver car message
posted by Nathan on June 20, 1997 at 20:35:28:
Yes, the G cars were very advanced for their time. They were among the
first cars to be shipped with plastic bench seats, and not the wicker
ones that dominated the older New York cars. The interior was lit by
round lights that went totally down the entire length of the car, one
next to another, and were accompanied on the ceiling by those swing
away handles. The exterior of the trains bore the TTC's old logo (just
the letter TTC written on top of each other) and the operator's cab
was on the left side, not the right. When I was a kid, a motorman let
me drive the train and honk the horn a few times. I guess I had a
pretty good childhood (definitely not!)
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NEXT>
PREVIOUS>2208
POSTER>Bryan Layne
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Los Angeles (*gasp*) Red line Subway
DATE>Jun 28 17:53:57 1997
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Posted by Bryan Layne on June 21, 1997 at 13:56:16:
In Reply to: [6]Re: Los Angeles (*gasp*) Red line Subway posted by
Steve on June 20, 1997 at 21:36:50:
Ya,and not only that ,you have to remember that LA is laid out much
diferently than NYC or Chicago.LA is like a big suburb,with little
dense apartment housing like in NYC or Chicago,therefore commuting
patterns will be different.Ex:A person living 30 blocks from downtown
in LA,is going to take the bus for a one way trip straight to
Downtown.NOT take a bus 10 blocks to the closest Red Line
station,transfer,and then go Downtown.Sense in
NYC,Boston,Chicago....housing,shopping,everything is much closer
together,less dependant on the automobile,this is not LA.LA was built
around the automobile,having no intention of a subway.And remember
NYC,Chicago,Boston were built before the age of the automobile,this is
why public transit is much more succesfull in these cities for two
reasons 1)cars are a pain in dense areas with high traffic 2)public
transportation is easier to get around with.This is why LA is having
ridership troubles with its subway,this is only expected and I believe
will take some time before there are any major ridership growths.
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NEXT>2223
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>Bingo
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: So why's B.C so rich?(Was: you know, I really don't care anymore.)
DATE>Jun 28 17:53:59 1997
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Posted by Bingo on June 21, 1997 at 13:58:49:
In Reply to: [5]Re: New R-142's and 143's (and Bingo's T-1's) posted
by Nathan on June 21, 1997 at 01:02:32:
So why is B.C. so rich? I read this story about a fleet of new buses
that were bought for the city of Victoria, except that they ordered
them too wide for the mountainside road! What do they do? Send them
back? Hell no! They REDO THE MOUNTAINFACE so the buses will fit!
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NEXT>2234
PREVIOUS>2199
POSTER>Bingo
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: New R-142's and 143's
DATE>Jun 28 17:54:01 1997
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Posted by Bingo on June 21, 1997 at 14:19:35:
In Reply to: [5]Re: New R-142's and 143's posted by David Pirmann on
June 20, 1997 at 16:00:13:
Will the new 42's and 43's run on AC or DC motors?
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NEXT>2218
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>Timothy
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Subway/Elevated scenes in movies
DATE>Jun 28 17:54:03 1997
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Posted by Timothy on June 21, 1997 at 14:25:06:
Is anyone familiar with the movie "Streets Of Fire", which came out
sometime during the early or mid 1980's? I've seen this movie many
times,
and I've noticed that it includes lots of subway/elevated footage
(mostly
elevated). I'm assuming that the El scenes were filmed in Chicago,
because
they showed the old "PCC" style trains that used to run on Chicago's
Els.
Can anyone tell me what part of Chicago where this movie was most
likely
filmed? Also, Can anyone tell me what other movies include a lot of
subway/
elevated scenes, whether it be New York City, Chicago, Philadelphia,
or
Boston (the only cities I know of with Els)?
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NEXT>2222
PREVIOUS>2217
POSTER>Dave
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Subway/Elevated scenes in movies
DATE>Jun 28 17:54:05 1997
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Posted by Dave on June 21, 1997 at 14:47:56:
In Reply to: [6]Subway/Elevated scenes in movies posted by Timothy on
June 21, 1997 at 14:25:06:
There was a looong thread a few months ago on movies containing
scenese of subways/els. You might want to check the historic files for
the thread.
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NEXT>
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>Nathan
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Shepperd/Eglinton subway, was Re: Los Angeles (*gasp*) Red line Subway
DATE>Jun 28 17:54:06 1997
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Posted by Nathan on June 21, 1997 at 15:42:41:
In Reply to: [5]Re: Los Angeles (*gasp*) Red line Subway posted by
Bingo on June 21, 1997 at 13:20:22:
Yeah, I think they should have continued construction of the Eglinton
West,
except extend it to the airport. In any case, Missisauga has been
waiting ages for rapid transit and they badly need it, not enough is
being done out there.
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NEXT>2283
PREVIOUS>2209
POSTER>Nathan
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: MLW's still in service??? Re: Transit in Movies - Again
DATE>Jun 28 17:54:08 1997
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Posted by Nathan on June 21, 1997 at 15:45:54:
In Reply to: [6]Re: MLW's still in service??? Re: Transit in Movies -
Again posted by Bingo on June 21, 1997 at 13:24:33:
Yeah, follow the hypertext link to my email address! Last nite I went
to
a ttc site which said that all 36 M-series cars are still on property
and
serviceable; is this correct?
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NEXT>
PREVIOUS>2144
POSTER>Gerry O'Regan
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Green Line in Boston
DATE>Jun 28 17:54:09 1997
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Posted by Gerry O'Regan on June 21, 1997 at 15:46:17:
In Reply to: [6]Re: Green Line in Boston posted by Dave on June 20,
1997 at 09:33:06:
Reservoir today looks nothing like it did back then. Coming west from
Beaconsfield there was a crossover followed by a right hand turnout
which provided access to the lower yard and carhouse. The line then
expanded to six tracks, with the northmost track being the westbound
main, which continued to Reservoir Station in approximately a straight
line. A left hand turnout, just beyond the lead to the lower yard,
provided access to the two other westbound tracks, which continued for
a few hundred feet, and then rejoined the westbound main. After this
was another right hand turnout leading to a ramp up to the level of
Chestnut Hill Av., where the track looped over the main line tracks.
The station for short turn cars was located here. The loop led into a
descending ramp leading directly into the eastbound main. The easbound
main from Riverside curved to the right after leaving Reservoir
Station and joined the track from the loop in a left hand trailing
switch. A left hand facing switch from the main track led into the
other two eastbound tracks. which rejoined the eastbound main as it
negotiated an 'S' curve to the left just before Beaconsfield Station.
This whole mess was known as Reservoir Upper Yard, and a few trains
would be stationed there to enter service in either direction when
needed either for rush hour or at the beginning or end of the day.
A pair of tracks connected the loop at the top of the ramp to the
Beacon St. and Chestnut Hill Av. tracks. This was arranged so that
outbound Riverside cars could connect to Beacon St. inbound or either
direction on Commonwealth Av. Likewise any car from Commonwealth Av or
outbound Beacon St. cars could connect to Riverside inbound. This left
moves from Riverside to Reservoir or vice-versa being routed into
Kenmore and back out Beacon St.
Even without a map one can see that the layout was not conducive to
convenient movement of equipment between Riverside and the carhouse.
To cap things off, moves entering Reservoir Lower yard via the switch
at the east end of the yard had to make a back-up move to reach the
carhouse or most storage tracks. Cars using the lead off the loop
could also reach the carhouse by backing up, but that required pulling
up to a 150 foot train into Chestnut Hill Av. and then backing into
the yard while motorists fumed. In either case trolley poles had to be
backed through special work during this process, making the moves as
slow as could be imagined.
Today with double-ended cars, pantographs and a new carhouse,
operations at Reservoir are far less painful.
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NEXT>2230
PREVIOUS>2218
POSTER>Mark Greenwald
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Subway/Elevated scenes in movies
DATE>Jun 28 17:54:11 1997
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Posted by Mark Greenwald on June 21, 1997 at 15:48:57:
In Reply to: [6]Subway/Elevated scenes in movies posted by Timothy on
June 21, 1997 at 14:25:06:
The film "Streets of Fire" was filmed in a "back lot". The entire
place was nothing more than a "set", to the point that the rain was
fake and the wet streets were made that way on purpose.
Other than that, I love the movie, I own it & the soundtrack. Many
years ago I was a manager of a video store & when this came out there
was also a video soundtrack for the movie that showed the making of
it.
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NEXT>2286
PREVIOUS>2215
POSTER>Nathan
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: So why's B.C so rich?(Was: you know, I really don't care anymore.)
DATE>Jun 28 17:54:13 1997
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Posted by Nathan on June 21, 1997 at 15:53:12:
In Reply to: [5]Re: So why's B.C so rich?(Was: you know, I really
don't care anymore.) posted by Bingo on June 21, 1997 at 13:58:49:
Why is it so rich? because Mike Harris isn't in charge! No, kidding.
No,
the mountainside was not redone for the buses, it was the new island
highway (which has only gone, well, too far overbudget to remember),
which
includes a reserved median for future light rail, after the next ten
years.
Second of all, the government likes to waste money on advertising;
bombard the public with advertisements. That's why bc transit
ridership was up 10% last year, it is a more competitive organization
than the ttc. Finally,
because, unlike portland, speed and efficiency of the service take a
high priority. Last, no one lives in BC so therefore capital
expenditures are not that large (did I mention the 3 light rail lines
that vancouver is supposed to be getting?)
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NEXT>2229
PREVIOUS>2211
POSTER>Mark Greenwald
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Breda Cars
DATE>Jun 28 17:54:14 1997
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Posted by Mark Greenwald on June 21, 1997 at 15:56:53:
In Reply to: [6]Breda Cars posted by Nathan on June 21, 1997 at
01:06:46:
Breda Cars are also the main manufacturer of the cars on the
Washington Metro. The original cars came from Rohr but from the
opening of the original segment of the Yellow Line in 1981, all of the
cars have come from Breda with the breaking systems coming from
Pittsburgh. It was always interesting to see a subway car on a flatbed
going through the Appalachian Mtns. on I-68 & I-70 on its way to DC.
The cars than that don't look that different from the outside, but you
see that the seating & the door closing chime is a little different
than Rohr. It was also the Breda cars that introduced the "flip-dot"
destination signs to DC, Rohr always used a scroll w/ a barcode that
the computer would use to know when to stop the scroll at the proper
destination. IT FAILED MISERABLY!! Although they were nice to look at
with the destination showing up w/ the line color in the background.
Since then, all the Rohr cars have been retrofitted w/ flip dots.
Today, to the best of my knowledge, the Rohr cars are mostly used on
the Red Line & the Bredas are used on the Orange, Blue, Yellow & Green
Lines.
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NEXT>2287
PREVIOUS>2210
POSTER>
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: TTC Ugly Stations, Vancouver, everything else, life story, was Re:
DATE>Jun 28 17:54:16 1997
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In Reply to: [6]Re: TTC Ugly Stations, Vancouver, everything else,
life story, was Re: Toronto H-6's posted by Bingo on June 21, 1997 at
13:32:48:
The inside of the T-1's are not orange, are they? That was just the
eighties. Oh, the old tom cruise movie "Risky Buisness" shows Tom
Cruise
and some chick having sex on the el train. It's pretty gross.
Sex on the TTC? (Looks at the subway route map he managed to salvadge
from a to-be-scrapped G-car: "I better wash that, just in case!")
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NEXT>2251
PREVIOUS>2201
POSTER>Gerry O'Regan
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Questions on Refurbished R-40 Modifications
DATE>Jun 28 17:54:18 1997
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Posted by Gerry O'Regan on June 21, 1997 at 15:58:55:
In Reply to: [6]Re: Questions on Refurbished R-40 Modifications posted
by Gary Jacobi on June 20, 1997 at 11:39:59:
Somewhere I heard that the credit for the design of the R-40 end went
to Lowey and Snaith (sp?) The redesign which became the R-40M/42 (and
everything since including LIRR & MN MUs) was credited to
Sundberg-Ferrar.
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NEXT>
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>Nathan
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Coffee Bars and Bullet nosed Lada's/STARBUCKS FOREVER!!!!
DATE>Jun 28 17:54:19 1997
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Posted by Nathan on June 21, 1997 at 16:02:31:
In Reply to: [5]Re: Coffee Bars and Bullet nosed Lada's (Was, um... I
forget) posted by Bingo on June 21, 1997 at 13:41:27:
Ok, it might be my West Coast bias, but Starbucks rules! I can not
even find a second cup location in the vancouver area, yet in the new
vancouver
airport terminal (which gouges you a 10$ airport improvement fee)
there is
about 10 Starbucks Outlets! on one intersection there is a starbucks
on each corner!! Damn it though, WCE's coffee stalls aren't operated
by starbucks. Darn!! Oh well. If anything, what they need is coffee
stalls at park-n-rides...
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NEXT>2333
PREVIOUS>2157
POSTER>Mark Greenwald
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: RE: New Routes & Stuff
DATE>Jun 28 17:54:21 1997
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Posted by Mark Greenwald on June 21, 1997 at 16:17:09:
In Reply to: [6]Re: RE: New Routes & Stuff posted by John on June 20,
1997 at 15:19:52:
On the map dated "May 1996"---It shows the J/Z using the express
tracks from Myrtle to Marcy & the J/M using the local tracks
(depending on the time of day)
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NEXT>2236
PREVIOUS>2224
POSTER>Zack
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Breda Cars
DATE>Jun 28 17:54:23 1997
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Posted by Zack on June 21, 1997 at 18:00:34:
In Reply to: [6]Breda Cars posted by Nathan on June 21, 1997 at
01:06:46:
i have seeen pictues of the beretas they look good and ugly at onc but
boston is getting somphting similar. metro got some bereta duel
electric/diesel buses and ther lemons but i agree the boeings look
better and the boston type 7's gook even better
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NEXT>2231
PREVIOUS>2222
POSTER>Timothy
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Subway/Elevated scenes in movies
DATE>Jun 28 17:54:24 1997
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Posted by Timothy on June 21, 1997 at 19:10:14:
In Reply to: [6]Re: Subway/Elevated scenes in movies posted by Mark
Greenwald on June 21, 1997 at 15:48:57:
You say that "Streets of Fire" was a "set" filmed in a "back lot".
Does
that mean that none of the elevated structure, or trains seen in the
movie
are real? Was every second of the movie a "set", or were there a few
scenes
that were shot on an actual city street? Many of the scenes throughout
the
movie seemed so realistic, especially when a train passes on the
elevated
structure. Also, there were even a few scenes on board a train, and it
also
showed a front window view of the train approaching a subway station.
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NEXT>2232
PREVIOUS>2230
POSTER>Timothy
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Subway/Elevated scenes in movies
DATE>Jun 28 17:54:25 1997
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Posted by Timothy on June 21, 1997 at 19:14:33:
In Reply to: [6]Re: Subway/Elevated scenes in movies posted by Dave on
June 21, 1997 at 14:47:56:
Is there anyway you can tell me the titles of some of those movies,
and
give me a brief description of what they are about?
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NEXT>2235
PREVIOUS>2231
POSTER>Timothy
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Subway/Elevated scenes in movies
DATE>Jun 28 17:54:27 1997
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Posted by Timothy on June 21, 1997 at 19:27:32:
In Reply to: [6]Re: Subway/Elevated scenes in movies posted by Mark
Greenwald on June 21, 1997 at 15:48:57:
Do you know of other movies that are comparable to "Streets of Fire",
that
include subway/elevated scenes, as well as a "hard rock" soundtrack?
Just
like you, I love "Streets of Fire", and I also own the video and
soundtrack!! I'm looking for other movies with the same type of
action,
scenes, and music as "Streets of Fire". I have a feeling that there
must
be others out there. If you know of any, please let me know the
titles.
Thanks.
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NEXT>2241
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>lOU
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Interesting Subway Signal
DATE>Jun 28 17:54:28 1997
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Posted by lOU on June 21, 1997 at 20:16:53:
This Signal is looking southbound on the Northbound express track at
Kings Highway. Does anyone know what signal indication would be given
for a train to cross to the Southbound local track??
G=Green Y=Yellow R=Red ?=sometype of light (Call Light??)
G
Y
R
A4
628 ?
?
G
Y
R
X
522
?
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NEXT>2243
PREVIOUS>2216
POSTER>Lou
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: New R-142's and 143's
DATE>Jun 28 17:54:30 1997
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Posted by Lou on June 21, 1997 at 20:25:49:
In Reply to: [5]Re: New R-142's and 143's posted by Zack on June 20,
1997 at 23:05:58:
Acceptance Testing of the First Cars. Maybe run them down ye old N
line in brooklyn or are they gonna run them on the LIRR like the 44's
(nah they won't clear some of the 3rd rail gaps at the interlockings,
IRT is a short car ).
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NEXT>2237
PREVIOUS>2232
POSTER>Nathan
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Subway/Elevated scenes in movies
DATE>Jun 28 17:54:31 1997
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Posted by Nathan on June 21, 1997 at 20:35:29:
In Reply to: [5]Re: Subway/Elevated scenes in movies posted by Timothy
on June 21, 1997 at 19:14:33:
The movie, "It can happen to you" has a few el scenes in it. It is a
kind of "feel happy" movie, but it has some good el shots.
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NEXT>2239
PREVIOUS>2229
POSTER>Nathan
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Breda Cars
DATE>Jun 28 17:54:33 1997
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Posted by Nathan on June 21, 1997 at 20:41:36:
In Reply to: [5]Re: Breda Cars posted by Mark Greenwald on June 21,
1997 at 15:56:53:
Yeah, I still think the Bredas suck though!! I mean, geez. The
Washington
Metro is hideous to look at. Sure, the cars have carpeting, but the
outsides are UUU-GLY!! I mean, Breda has a talent for making ugly
cars.
I mean, AdTranz cars can look ok (sometimes), Siemens LRV's can look
nice,
Boeing LRV's, despite shitty engineering, can look ok, but Breda?
YEEEECH!!
Bombardier cars usually look good (I love the outside of the R-110-B,
but the LED destination markers should have been changed to something
that can be read from a distance. I mean, make some sharp looking cars
(with the exception of the R-62-not ugly, but not pretty either) etc.
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NEXT>2238
PREVIOUS>2235
POSTER>Mark Greenwald
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Subway/Elevated scenes in movies
DATE>Jun 28 17:54:34 1997
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Posted by Mark Greenwald on June 21, 1997 at 20:44:02:
In Reply to: [6]Re: Subway/Elevated scenes in movies posted by Timothy
on June 21, 1997 at 19:10:14:
Obviously, the scenes on a train & those showing a train are
real---where? I don't know---Maybe someone out there knows--BUT--those
scenes on the street below where you see the 'el support beams---BACK
LOT---As far as other movies that would fall under the same
genre--I'll get back to you on that one.
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NEXT>2242
PREVIOUS>2237
POSTER>Mark Greenwald
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Subway/Elevated scenes in movies
DATE>Jun 28 17:54:36 1997
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Posted by Mark Greenwald on June 21, 1997 at 20:45:15:
In Reply to: [6]Re: Subway/Elevated scenes in movies posted by Nathan
on June 21, 1997 at 20:35:29:
I've always been partial to "The Warriors"
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NEXT>2249
PREVIOUS>2236
POSTER>Mark Greenwald
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Breda Cars
DATE>Jun 28 17:54:38 1997
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Posted by Mark Greenwald on June 21, 1997 at 20:49:41:
In Reply to: [6]Re: Breda Cars posted by Nathan on June 21, 1997 at
20:41:36:
Yeah right, DC's cars are a bit drab---Although you want to know who
has ugly, boring, and just down right lacking in any imagination are
the Baltimore Metro cars. They're not made by Breda though---they're
made by Transit-america (Budd).---Very plain
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NEXT>2248
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>Nathan
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Chicago Els
DATE>Jun 28 17:54:40 1997
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Posted by Nathan on June 21, 1997 at 20:51:50:
What was the type of car used on the els (that I haven't seen since
the eighties) that was green and white, with bi-fold doors? They were
pretty old, and sometimes they would operate in only 1 car consists.
Does anyone know the type/name, how many are left in service or when
they were retired?
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NEXT>2328
PREVIOUS>2233
POSTER>Steve
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Interesting Subway Signal
DATE>Jun 28 17:54:41 1997
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Posted by Steve on June 21, 1997 at 21:58:22:
In Reply to: [5]Interesting Subway Signal posted by lOU on June 21,
1997 at 20:16:53:
What you are describing is a standard 'home signal'.
The top set of lights indicates the condition of the tracks ahead.
A4 628 indicates the north-bound express track on the 8th Avenue line,
signal #628.
The question marks would likely indicate either a grade or diverging
route timer.
The next set of lights would indicate the route which is set - either
normal or diverging.
X 522 would indicate that the signal is actually a home signal
controlled by lever #522 (although I can't recall ever seeing a number
that high)
The bottom question mark would be a 'call on' signal which is
displayed when the train operator is to pass a stop signal (Red/Red) .
Where was this signal???
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NEXT>
PREVIOUS>2238
POSTER>Steve
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Subway/Elevated scenes in movies
DATE>Jun 28 17:54:43 1997
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Posted by Steve on June 21, 1997 at 22:04:22:
In Reply to: [5]Re: Subway/Elevated scenes in movies posted by Timothy
on June 21, 1997 at 19:14:33:
I caught the end of the original movie "THe Naked City". There are
some very interesting shots of trains passing over the Williamsburg
Bridge.
Nighthawks has shots of one of the Bronx Els, I think it's the #4 line
and also shots in the 63rd Street tunnel while it was still under
construction.
Theres also one scene withthe R-9 museum train.
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NEXT>2245
PREVIOUS>2234
POSTER>Steve
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: New R-142's and 143's
DATE>Jun 28 17:54:45 1997
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Posted by Steve on June 21, 1997 at 22:14:59:
In Reply to: [5]Re: New R-142's and 143's posted by Lou on June 21,
1997 at 20:25:49:
Acceptance testing can be done anywhere. The R110s were run over the
mainlines in simulated service (making station stops but not opening
doors). The running on the LIRR is not really necessary. That was done
just that one time because of some federal gov't tests. And don't get
hung up on 3rd rail gaps. You can easily gap one half of the train and
keep on moving (as lond as your batteries are okay)
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NEXT>
PREVIOUS>2189
POSTER>Steve
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Montreal Subway
DATE>Jun 28 17:54:47 1997
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Posted by Steve on June 21, 1997 at 22:21:48:
In Reply to: [6]Re: Montreal Subway posted by Bingo on June 21, 1997
at 14:17:10:
I was more impressed with the train which ran at the "Man & His World"
Exhibition. I was on it several times in the early 80s. Is it still
running and better yet, does anyone have any scanned pictures?
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NEXT>2247
PREVIOUS>2243
POSTER>Steve
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: New R-142's and 143's
DATE>Jun 28 17:54:48 1997
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Posted by Steve on June 21, 1997 at 22:23:14:
In Reply to: [5]Re: New R-142's and 143's posted by Bingo on June 21,
1997 at 14:19:35:
They will have AC motors.
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NEXT>
PREVIOUS>2111
POSTER>Steve
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Javits Center Service Idea (second try!)
DATE>Jun 28 17:54:50 1997
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Posted by Steve on June 21, 1997 at 22:29:35:
In Reply to: [5]Re: Javits Center Service Idea (second try!) posted by
Peter Rosa on June 19, 1997 at 16:18:41:
I think that the most we can hope for will be shuttle bus service.
Take a look at the Colliseum. It's not that old and all but abandoned.
By the time any rail connection to the Javitts Center were built, the
Center would be obsolete. Perhaps the next time, a rail link will be
part of the plans for any new exhibition center. Perhaps as part of
the 'WestWay' projects or Battery Park City. Do you think any of
(them) will ever learn?
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NEXT>2284
PREVIOUS>2245
POSTER>David Pirmann
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: New R-142's and 143's
DATE>Jun 28 17:54:52 1997
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Posted by David Pirmann on June 21, 1997 at 23:04:01:
In Reply to: [6]Re: New R-142's and 143's posted by Lou on June 21,
1997 at 20:25:49:
They tested the 51' PATH PA-1 cars on the LIRR in early 1965. The May
1965 of the ERA Headlights magazine has an article about this. I have
some slides of this testing that I'll be putting on the web site in
the near future. One of them is of the really tiny PATH car coupled to
the back of a huge (relatively) PRR GG1. The GG1 towed the PATH car
from the Northeast Corridor area in Harrison/Kearny thru Pennsylvania
Station out to Sunnyside Yard, where it then ran on its own power out
the LIRR mainline. I've got pictures of it running at Woodside and
other places...
So there wouldn't be a problem testing an IRT style train on the LIRR.
--Dave
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NEXT>2250
PREVIOUS>2240
POSTER>Bryan Layne
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Chicago Els
DATE>Jun 28 17:54:54 1997
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Posted by Bryan Layne on June 21, 1997 at 23:12:07:
In Reply to: [6]Chicago Els posted by Nathan on June 21, 1997 at
20:51:50:
Those were the 6000 series and 1-50 series cars.The 6000 series cars
were built by St.Louis Car Co. and were of married pair consists.The
1-50 were scratch built cars,built using components of recently
retired PCC cars(many call them the only true PCC rapid transit car.I
posted a message a while back about a fantrip with these cars on April
17th)and were single units,which enabled them to run in one car
trains,this is what your talking about.The 6000 and 1-50 series cars
no longer run(retired when the last of the 3200 series cars arived)and
last ran in Spring/Early Summer 1996.
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NEXT>2262
PREVIOUS>2239
POSTER>Bryan Layne
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Breda Cars
DATE>Jun 28 17:54:56 1997
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Posted by Bryan Layne on June 21, 1997 at 23:19:08:
In Reply to: [5]Re: Breda Cars posted by Zack on June 21, 1997 at
18:00:34:
ya you r talking about Seattle Metro's dual power buses.Those are the
hittiest busses seen.If i was in charge of the design of Breda
vehicles I would at least make an effort to make them suitable
aestetically to us transit fans!!!!!
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NEXT>2259
PREVIOUS>2248
POSTER>John
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Chicago Els
DATE>Jun 28 17:54:57 1997
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Posted by John on June 21, 1997 at 23:37:16:
In Reply to: [5]Re: Chicago Els posted by Bryan Layne on June 21, 1997
at 23:12:07:
Were they still around in July? Because I was in Chicago for the
Independence Day weekend, 1996, and I had flown in to O'Hare Airport
and I took the train (I think it was the Blue Line) to the Loop and
the train I was on passed some trains that resemble the ones mentioned
above.
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PREVIOUS>2226
POSTER>John
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Questions on Refurbished R-40 Modifications
DATE>Jun 28 17:54:59 1997
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Posted by John on June 21, 1997 at 23:51:18:
In Reply to: [5]Re: Questions on Refurbished R-40 Modifications posted
by Zack on June 20, 1997 at 23:26:34:
Well, hopefully, the trains are smart enough to use condems.
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NEXT>2256
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>Dan Lawrence
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Breda Cars/Baltimore Metro Cars
DATE>Jun 28 17:55:01 1997
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Posted by Dan Lawrence on June 22, 1997 at 00:02:07:
In Reply to: [5]Re: Breda Cars posted by Mark Greenwald on June 21,
1997 at 20:49:41:
They may be plain, and simple. Ugly- NO!!!! Dependable YES!! They will
see their 50th birthday in 2030 - and they'll still be running!!!
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NEXT>2255
PREVIOUS>2164
POSTER>Dan Lawrence
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: TTC Small Witt RT-10
DATE>Jun 28 17:55:03 1997
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Posted by Dan Lawrence on June 22, 1997 at 00:12:14:
In Reply to: [5]Re: TTC Small Witt RT-10 posted by Dan Lawrence on
June 20, 1997 at 12:56:31:
Correct me if I am wrong, but wasn't RT-10 rebuilt from a Large Witt??
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NEXT>2271
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>Nathan
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Breda Cars/Seattle Dual powered buses
DATE>Jun 28 17:55:04 1997
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Posted by Nathan on June 22, 1997 at 01:21:05:
In Reply to: [6]Re: Breda Cars posted by Bryan Layne on June 21, 1997
at 23:19:08:
Breda makes the Seattle Dual-Powered buses? No wonder, they are pretty
ugly too. The thing is, dual powered takes away alot of the advantages
the trolley bus has, in trade for being able to de-wire. This may
sound
wonderful (the idea of flexable trolleys) but an internal combustion
engine
adds greatly to the weight of the vehical. Trolleys are more suitable
to climbing hills than diesels, have faster acceleration, are quieter,
and
offer a smoother ride, as well as being almost pollution free (this is
seen where I live, 93% of the electricity here is provided by hydro
electric dams). Yet an I.C. engine weighs down the vehical, reducing
efficiency etc.
Here (in Vancouver) the trolleys are completely electric, but BC
Transit
is considering whether or not to go dual mode. Dual mode would be bad
because of all the hills/mountains in this area, and having each
trolley
come with an I.C. engine adds to the cost, especially when the local
tax-payer is required to foot the bill for 250 some odd replacement
trolleys...
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NEXT>2269
PREVIOUS>2253
POSTER>Nathan
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: TTC Small Witt RT-10
DATE>Jun 28 17:55:06 1997
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Posted by Nathan on June 22, 1997 at 01:23:10:
In Reply to: [5]Re: TTC Small Witt RT-10 posted by Dan Lawrence on
June 22, 1997 at 00:12:14:
Weren't all the TTC Witts considered "Small" Witts?
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NEXT>
PREVIOUS>2252
POSTER>Mark Greenwald
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Breda Cars/Baltimore Metro Cars
DATE>Jun 28 17:55:08 1997
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Posted by Mark Greenwald on June 22, 1997 at 01:27:17:
In Reply to: [6]Re: Breda Cars/Baltimore Metro Cars posted by Dan
Lawrence on June 22, 1997 at 00:02:07:
Yeah--they'll see their 50th birthday, it helps having only one line
that about 10 miles long
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NEXT>2258
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>Ben-Zion Y. Cassouto
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>LIRR
DATE>Jun 28 17:55:09 1997
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Posted by Ben-Zion Y. Cassouto on June 22, 1997 at 03:40:31:
1. A plea: Does anyone have or know where I can find LIRR track
maps???!!!
2. Any reviews/comments/info on content on 2 LIRR books recommended to
me:
a. Long Island Railroad Memories
b. Electric Heritage of the LIRR
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NEXT>2260
PREVIOUS>2257
POSTER>Dave
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: LIRR
DATE>Jun 28 17:55:11 1997
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Posted by Dave on June 22, 1997 at 05:57:55:
In Reply to: [6]LIRR posted by Ben-Zion Y. Cassouto on June 22, 1997
at 03:40:31:
You can pick up a track map at any station that has a system
timetable. Both of the books yoy mentioned are excellent, BTW. Also
consider checking out:
1) The Pennsy Era on Long Island
2) Change at Jamaica
3) Steel Rails to the Sunrise
4) Long Island Railroad
5) Diesels of the Sunrise Trail (great pics!)
6) The Long Island Railroad in Early Photographs
7) Victorian Railroad Station of Long Island
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NEXT>2261
PREVIOUS>2250
POSTER>Dave
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Chicago Els
DATE>Jun 28 17:55:13 1997
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Posted by Dave on June 22, 1997 at 06:07:11:
In Reply to: [6]Re: Chicago Els posted by John on June 21, 1997 at
23:37:16:
The Illinios Railway Museum in Union, Ill. (about an hour west of
Chicago) ha sthe largest extant collection of former Chicago
streetcars and elevated (loop) cars (inlcuding a former Skokie Swift)
in the country. Most are either restored and running or in the process
of restoration. The IRM is one of the great railroad museums in the
country and well worth a visit from any railfan. For you LIRR buffs,
the museum very recently added one for the former Alco FA powerpack
untis to their collection, although when restored with prime mover it
will be repainted in it's former L&N paint scheme. If you saw the
movie "A League of Their Own" with Gina Davis, the early scenes where
the girls board a streamliner to head off to the big city for tryouts,
was filmed at the museum. The only restored and operational E-6 with
complete trainset (including diner but less sleepers)- a former CB&Q
trainset - runs on the weekends, along with steam and electric
(trolleys, streetcars) cars.
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NEXT>6345
PREVIOUS>2258
POSTER>Charles
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: LIRR
DATE>Jun 28 17:55:15 1997
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Posted by Charles on June 22, 1997 at 08:43:38:
In Reply to: [6]LIRR posted by Ben-Zion Y. Cassouto on June 22, 1997
at 03:40:31:
I just wanted to add one more book.
Change at Ozone Park is also a very good book with alot of pictures.
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NEXT>2277
PREVIOUS>2259
POSTER>Bryan Layne
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Chicago Els
DATE>Jun 28 17:55:17 1997
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Posted by Bryan Layne on June 22, 1997 at 10:08:36:
In Reply to: [6]Re: Chicago Els posted by John on June 21, 1997 at
23:37:16:
Ya,you probably saw them,I think there were still a few trains running
in Summer '96 due to a number of things(shortages,breakdowns,testing
still of 3200 series).
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NEXT>2270
PREVIOUS>2249
POSTER>Steve
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Breda Cars
DATE>Jun 28 17:55:19 1997
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Posted by Steve on June 22, 1997 at 11:09:17:
In Reply to: [5]Re: Breda Cars posted by Mark Greenwald on June 21,
1997 at 20:49:41:
Buffalo, Portland, StLouis and Pittsburgh, except for the paint, you
couldn't tell which you were looking at. Perhaps boring and lacking in
imagination but for a cash-strapped municipality, buying transit
vehicles 'off the shelf' can save much $$$. It may not please the rail
fans but the majority of taxpayers are not buffs.
Just a personal note: The Baltimore cars may indeed last 50 years.
Many of the NYCT cars ran 40 or more years and the R-9s could still be
running today. The point should be, WHY? Rail fans not withstanding,
new equipment draws new riders. When any rail system starts showing
it's age, riders (the daily commuter) opt for alternatives. I'd love
an opportunity to ride the MP54s or even the MP41s but the majority of
the commuters find that even the M-1s and M-3s are starting to show
their age, and they are the ones paying the tab (well 48% of it).
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NEXT>2275
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>Jim
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>R-44s Off the A Line
DATE>Jun 28 17:55:21 1997
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Posted by Jim on June 22, 1997 at 11:16:43:
NYCT is planning to move the R-44s to the C line and use mostly R-32s
and R-38s on the A line. They want to cut the dwell time on the A line
and also use the R-44's for OPTO on the C line.
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NEXT>2285
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>Brian W
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: MLW's still in service???
DATE>Jun 28 17:55:22 1997
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Posted by Brian W on June 22, 1997 at 15:41:57:
In Reply to: [6]Re: MLW's still in service??? Re: Transit in Movies -
Again posted by Nathan on June 21, 1997 at 15:45:54:
Well, I was on the BD-line on an M-train (which was 6 or 8 cars), and
I passed at least 2 more going in the opposite direction, which also
contained 6 or 8 cars, so there are at least 18 cars servicable...
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NEXT>
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>Mark Greenwald
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Baltimore cars
DATE>Jun 28 17:55:23 1997
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Posted by Mark Greenwald on June 22, 1997 at 15:54:28:
In Reply to: [6]Re: Breda Cars posted by Steve on June 22, 1997 at
11:09:17:
What makes the purchase interesting that Baltimore did, was that, from
the original 208-car order---Baltimore purchased 172 of them.
Metro-Dade (Miami) bought the others. The two cities worked together
to create a large order in order to keep the costs down----I think
other cities ought to look into this kind of teamwork.
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NEXT>
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>Mark Greenwald
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: The PRT of WVU
DATE>Jun 28 17:55:25 1997
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Posted by Mark Greenwald on June 22, 1997 at 15:57:28:
Did you notice---Dave added the track map for the West Virginia Univ.
Personal Rapid Transit (PRT) on his transit systems worldwide section.
It appears to be rather detailed. It's something different..........
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NEXT>2289
PREVIOUS>2192
POSTER>Bingo
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: What are interlocking signals?
DATE>Jun 28 17:55:26 1997
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Posted by Bingo on June 22, 1997 at 16:16:44:
In Reply to: [5]Re: What are interlocking signals? posted by Steve on
June 20, 1997 at 21:30:36:
Trains are NOT supposed to go through trip arms in ANY circumstance.
The design of the trip arm was faulty, and allowed the train to pass
by. It's as simple as that.
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NEXT>2278
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>subway-buff
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Proposed New Sta on IRT 2/3 at 103 St
DATE>Jun 28 17:55:28 1997
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Posted by subway-buff on June 22, 1997 at 19:08:00:
I was lookign at track maps on this site and wondered why there can't
be a station on the IRT to connect with 103 on the IND. If my memory
serves me right, the tunnel is wide and there is a large gap between
the tracks so an insland platform on the IRT level could be built
along with needed passageways to the IND 103 Street Station.
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NEXT>
PREVIOUS>2255
POSTER>Dan Lawrence
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: TTC Small Witt RT-10
DATE>Jun 28 17:55:30 1997
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Posted by Dan Lawrence on June 22, 1997 at 19:26:57:
In Reply to: [5]Re: TTC Small Witt RT-10 posted by Nathan on June 22,
1997 at 01:23:10:
No, there were two general series of witts - Large Witts (which were
equipped to pull trailers) and Small Witts (which were not) The Large
Witts were last used on Bay, while the Small Witts lasted into the
1960's. Examples of both types are at Halton County and THERE is a
difference.
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NEXT>2301
PREVIOUS>2262
POSTER>Nathan
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Breda Cars
DATE>Jun 28 17:55:31 1997
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Posted by Nathan on June 23, 1997 at 01:02:25:
In Reply to: [5]Re: Breda Cars posted by Steve on June 22, 1997 at
11:09:17:
What the hell are you talking about? Portland's LRV's are made by
Bombardier and Siemens, St Louis' are made by Kawasaki,
NOT BREDA!
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NEXT>2290
PREVIOUS>2254
POSTER>Zack
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Breda Cars/Seattle Dual powered buses
DATE>Jun 28 17:55:33 1997
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Posted by Zack on June 23, 1997 at 02:44:22:
In Reply to: [6]Re: Breda Cars/Seattle Dual powered buses posted by
Nathan on June 22, 1997 at 01:21:05:
trollys can climb hills but not in snow they WILL not climb hliis in
snow probally becouse of their weight. the buses opreate in the tunnel
and in electric mode accelrate pretty fast underground.thay are aloso
artiluated but thay are lemons and i'm not shure if they can operate
above ground on the trolly system or vice versa. P.S metro's trollys
ae aging and i wonder if they will replace them with new flyers
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NEXT>
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>Julio Perez
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Other R-1 Qualities (was Re: R-44's and 46's)
DATE>Jun 28 17:55:35 1997
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Posted by Julio Perez on June 23, 1997 at 07:26:02:
In Reply to: [6]Re: R-44's and 46's posted by John on June 19, 1997 at
20:07:04:
How about the Westinghouse fans on the R-1s? Anyone have a surplus of
them to sell?
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NEXT>2274
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>Julio Perez
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>R-14x Question
DATE>Jun 28 17:55:37 1997
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Posted by Julio Perez on June 23, 1997 at 07:33:18:
Will the new R-14xs allow traveling over switches _without_
temporarily shutting off the main lights of the cars?
The switch outside of Times Square on the 7 (Queens-bound, of course)
was presumably on a curve, and it seemed it took forever for the cars
to light up again once it was out of the switch area.
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NEXT>2279
PREVIOUS>2273
POSTER>John
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: R-14x Question
DATE>Jun 28 17:55:39 1997
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Posted by John on June 23, 1997 at 08:41:04:
In Reply to: [5]R-14x Question posted by Julio Perez on June 23, 1997
at 07:33:18:
That's not the only place on the #7 line where the lights shut off.
After exiting the tunnel (after Hunterspoint Ave, I think), the lights
turn off and remain off indefinately. Also in the tunnel on the
approach to Main Street, the lights are flickering on and off. This,
however, is the only line on which this still happens, I beleive. Ride
any other train - the lights will never shut off (although they may
slightly dim). I think this is because of a device that keeps reserve
current flowing to the train. I'm not too electrically inclined, but I
think this is vaguely correct.
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NEXT>2323
PREVIOUS>2263
POSTER>John
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: R-44s Off the A Line
DATE>Jun 28 17:55:40 1997
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Posted by John on June 23, 1997 at 08:42:04:
In Reply to: [5]R-44s Off the A Line posted by Jim on June 22, 1997 at
11:16:43:
When will this take place?
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NEXT>2280
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>Peter Rosa
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Rail Control Center
DATE>Jun 28 17:55:42 1997
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Posted by Peter Rosa on June 23, 1997 at 08:43:31:
This week's edition of Crain's New York Business includes a fold-out
map of Manhattan, with major buildings and landmarks highlighted. On
the SE corner of Ninth Avenue and 54th Street, there's a big area
shown as the "Transit Authority Rail Control Center." This is still
under construction, as there's excavation going on at the site. What
exactly is this center? I haven't seen any mention of it before.
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NEXT>2281
PREVIOUS>2261
POSTER>Gerry O'Regan
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Chicago Els
DATE>Jun 28 17:55:44 1997
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Posted by Gerry O'Regan on June 23, 1997 at 10:47:41:
In Reply to: [6]Re: Chicago Els posted by Dave on June 22, 1997 at
06:07:11:
For those who don't wish to travel as far from the NYC area,
Connecticut Trolley Museum has 4 of the 4000 series el cars from
Chicage, while Seashore, in Maine, has a pair of 6000s.
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NEXT>2300
PREVIOUS>2268
POSTER>Gerry O'Regan
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Proposed New Sta on IRT 2/3 at 103 St
DATE>Jun 28 17:55:45 1997
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Posted by Gerry O'Regan on June 23, 1997 at 10:54:52:
In Reply to: [6]Proposed New Sta on IRT 2/3 at 103 St posted by
subway-buff on June 22, 1997 at 19:08:00:
The 2 line is already one of the longest trips time wise on NYCT.
Would the additional running time and the cost to build such a station
be worth the convenience of a transfer there?
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NEXT>
PREVIOUS>2274
POSTER>Gerry O'Regan
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: R-14x Question
DATE>Jun 28 17:55:46 1997
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Posted by Gerry O'Regan on June 23, 1997 at 11:01:20:
In Reply to: [6]Re: R-14x Question posted by John on June 23, 1997 at
08:41:04:
The reason for this is the type of lighting equipment used. The
equipment on the 7 train, and presumably similar equipment on other
lines, use DC discharge tubes for their flourescent lighting. These
flash on and off just like the old incandescent lighting.
Newer cars use standard AC flourescents, powered from an inverter
which is in turn powered by the battery voltage on the cars. These
stay on, but might dim slightly, going through gaps.
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NEXT>2291
PREVIOUS>2276
POSTER>Bryan Layne
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Rail Control Center
DATE>Jun 28 17:55:48 1997
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Posted by Bryan Layne on June 23, 1997 at 12:22:29:
In Reply to: [5]Rail Control Center posted by Peter Rosa on June 23,
1997 at 08:43:31:
And won't this eliminate jobs? Will there be no need for interlocking
towers,etc,etc....?
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NEXT>
PREVIOUS>2277
POSTER>Bryan LAYNE
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Chicago Els
DATE>Jun 28 17:55:49 1997
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Posted by Bryan LAYNE on June 23, 1997 at 12:26:52:
In Reply to: [5]Re: Chicago Els posted by Gerry O'Regan on June 23,
1997 at 10:47:41:
On the subject,I never could understand why the CTA never has had a
transit museum,CTA has a extisive history and definetly should have
one.
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NEXT>2308
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>BRYAN LAYNE
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Whitehall Ferry Terminal
DATE>Jun 28 17:55:51 1997
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Posted by BRYAN LAYNE on June 23, 1997 at 12:31:05:
Are there any direct Subway-W.Ferry Terminal pedestrian tunnels.I'm
pretty sure I've heard there are.Are there any closed off or abandoned
connections(due to the Terminal fire,neglect..)?
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NEXT>2366
PREVIOUS>2220
POSTER>FREE WEBPAGE SERVICES (Sorry, No E-mail was left)
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: MLW's still in service??? Re: Transit in Movies - Again
DATE>Jun 28 17:55:52 1997
EMAILNOTICES>no
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Posted by FREE WEBPAGE SERVICES (Sorry, No E-mail was left) on June
In Reply to: [6]Re: MLW's still in service??? Re: Transit in Movies -
Again posted by Bingo on June 21, 1997 at 13:24:33:
I'm really really sorry but there are 2 free webpage services I am
aware of:
* Geocities [7]www.geocities.com
* Angelfire [8]www.angelfire.com
Geocities DOES NOT give me benefits for referrals.
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NEXT>2302
PREVIOUS>2247
POSTER>Bingo
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: New R-142's and 143's
DATE>Jun 28 17:55:54 1997
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Posted by Bingo on June 23, 1997 at 14:48:14:
In Reply to: [5]Re: New R-142's and 143's posted by Steve on June 21,
1997 at 22:23:14:
I read that around 1992 Bombardier released an experimental set of
cars called the R-110A that were supposed to accrue customer response
in how they wanted the next generation (the 142's 43's) to look and
perform. Where did these cars go? Are they still in service? What do
they look like?
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NEXT>2294
PREVIOUS>2264
POSTER>Bingo
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: MLW's still in service???
DATE>Jun 28 17:55:55 1997
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Posted by Bingo on June 23, 1997 at 14:53:46:
In Reply to: [5]Re: MLW's still in service??? posted by Brian W on
June 22, 1997 at 15:41:57:
I went to Square One today in Mississauga, so I had to get to
Islington station. I got on an MLW, and in the ugly part of town
(Humberside) I noticed another trainset passing. Therefore, the total
amount of MLW cars I have seen in service is 16. 36 may be the magic
number, but I seriously doubt that they would keep all of them
running. Where do I send my letter for the repainted T-1's, Nathan?
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NEXT>2293
PREVIOUS>2223
POSTER>Bingo
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: So why's B.C so rich?(Was: you know, I really don't care anymore.)
DATE>Jun 28 17:55:57 1997
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Posted by Bingo on June 23, 1997 at 15:04:47:
In Reply to: [5]Re: So why's B.C so rich?(Was: you know, I really
don't care anymore.) posted by Nathan on June 21, 1997 at 15:53:12:
The TTC just runs really retarded ads, that's all. They can barely
fill up the billboards in each station, and the company that runs the
transit advertising on behalf of the TTC, TransAD, is filling up these
empty spots with ads for TransAD. If you ask me, advertisers
advertising advertisements is a really redundant and stupid idea. I do
like the Calvin Klein ads for the bras and underwear, though. That
girl is hot!
BTW, what is portland? Are you referring to portland, OR? I thought
so.
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NEXT>2335
PREVIOUS>2225
POSTER>
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: TTC Ugly Stations, Vancouver, everything else, life story, was Re:
DATE>Jun 28 17:55:59 1997
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In Reply to: [5]Re: TTC Ugly Stations, Vancouver, everything else,
life story, was Re: Toronto H-6's posted by Nathan on June 21, 1997 at
15:58:15:
That is right, the interior of T-1's are a *Montrealais frenche
accent* revolutionary fuschia and grey palette. But all of the post
60's rolling stock preceding the T-1's involved the hated orange. The
interior of DC-9's used to be orange too. They used a lot of orange in
the 70's! And cheezy woodgrain!
I was thinking, maybe they could abandon the current Union station,
and make a new station closer to the waterfront once they get the Air
Canada centre in place. Maybe they could have like, a central
connection centre for TTC, the Harbourfront LRT, GO, VIA, and AMTRAK,
and reroute the freight lines which have absolutely no place on the
passenger track. The whole reason why VIA's Lr cars (In my book, it's
NOT LRC! THEY ARE NOT "COMFORTABLE") were complete failures was
because they couldn't travel at their maximum running speed of 125mph.
The cars don't even use that leaning feature anymore. It takes 5 hours
to get to Montreal vs Air Canada's 1hr 21 minutes. I'm going off
topic. Sorry.
The station would be really big, like the one in France, and would fit
all the different lines into one big property, integrated into the
currently standing Union. It would feature state-of-the-art
architecture and art, and would be sort of open-air, or at least look
like it, with lots of windows. Lots of glass, lots of marble, and
above all, lots of passengers to move around.
I'm still waiting for WestJet to crash. When will one of their 737's
have a "horrible tragedy" occur with their thrust reversers. Going off
topic again. sorry../[
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NEXT>
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Come to the Light/ Was:Coffee Bars and Bullet nosed Lada's/STARBUCKS
DATE>Jun 28 17:56:00 1997
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In Reply to: [5]Re: Coffee Bars and Bullet nosed Lada's/STARBUCKS
FOREVER!!!! posted by Nathan on June 21, 1997 at 16:02:31:
Starbucks is evil! Do not let the devil tempt you! (just kidding)
While practicing Wicca (kidding again) I stumbled into a Starbucks
with my ex-girlfriend and found that they seem to stress on this
separate area where you can enjoy your coffee away from the sounds of
the espresso grinder and the cash register. Still, the coffee is not
as good as Second Cup's, there isn't enough variety, and they don't
serve Moccachinos. In Toronto, the Second Cup outlets outnumber
Starbucks 7 to 1, so I guess I might be prejudiced as well.
I found out the Turbotrain was built by United Aircraft, was a really
tall luxury train, had single-bogie articulation, and were finally
pulled from service in 1982 because they were Lemony Ladas.
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NEXT>3116
PREVIOUS>2267
POSTER>Bingo
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: What are interlocking signals?
DATE>Jun 28 17:56:02 1997
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Posted by Bingo on June 23, 1997 at 16:27:00:
In Reply to: [5]Re: What are interlocking signals? posted by Nathan on
June 20, 1997 at 19:55:48:
You know what? I still don't understand how he could have possibly
survived! It's almost like the accident was planned...
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NEXT>2297
PREVIOUS>2271
POSTER>Bingo
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Breda Cars/Seattle Dual powered buses
DATE>Jun 28 17:56:04 1997
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Posted by Bingo on June 23, 1997 at 16:33:46:
In Reply to: [5]Re: Breda Cars/Seattle Dual powered buses posted by
Nathan on June 22, 1997 at 01:21:05:
Shit! Vancouver has still has trolley cars? Toronto canceled them all
and doomed them to the scrapyard! Now the routes that were formerly
electrified are diesel, and you can already notice the dirtier windows
and air.
What does dual-powered mean? Like having two engines on each end like
the Chunnel maintenance buses?
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NEXT>2292
PREVIOUS>2280
POSTER>Charles Fiori
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Rail Control Center
DATE>Jun 28 17:56:05 1997
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Posted by Charles Fiori on June 23, 1997 at 16:59:15:
In Reply to: [5]Re: Rail Control Center posted by Bryan Layne on June
23, 1997 at 12:22:29:
Isn't that the site of the old 54th Street MaBSTOA garage? Where did
the routes and the buses go? What of the Command Center on the 4th
Floor at 370 Jay Street?
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NEXT>2298
PREVIOUS>2291
POSTER>Charles Fiori
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Rail Control Center
DATE>Jun 28 17:56:06 1997
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Posted by Charles Fiori on June 23, 1997 at 16:59:39:
In Reply to: [5]Re: Rail Control Center posted by Bryan Layne on June
23, 1997 at 12:22:29:
Isn't that the site of the old 54th Street MaBSTOA garage? Where did
the routes and the buses go? What of the Command Center on the 4th
Floor at 370 Jay Street?
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NEXT>2295
PREVIOUS>2286
POSTER>Nathan
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: So why's B.C so rich?(Was: you know, I really don't care anymore.)
DATE>Jun 28 17:56:08 1997
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Posted by Nathan on June 23, 1997 at 18:10:50:
In Reply to: [5]Re: So why's B.C so rich?(Was: you know, I really
don't care anymore.) posted by Bingo on June 23, 1997 at 15:04:47:
Yeah, Portland OR. Ok, is the TTC having problems filling up
advertising space? Man, at least you don't have to deal with excessive
transit advertising!! God, why watch tv! You walk into any SkyTrain
station, then get on the train, then the bus, you will be absolutely
bombarded with Nike Ads, Airmiles ads, Starbucks ads, Lipsorex ads,
condom (!) ads, (and some of them are pretty obsene too) you get the
picture. Basically, rapid transit vehicles have turned into roving
billboards! On the OUTSIDE of articulated buses you can see up to 4
mini billboards!
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NEXT>2296
PREVIOUS>2285
POSTER>Nathan
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: MLW's still in service???
DATE>Jun 28 17:56:10 1997
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Posted by Nathan on June 23, 1997 at 18:15:03:
In Reply to: [6]Re: MLW's still in service??? posted by Bingo on June
23, 1997 at 14:53:46:
Ok, to sort this out, this summer I'm going to ride the BD end to end,
during the day, and during the night, keep track of the number of
MLW's I see, and add them up. MLW's (On the bloor line) are
charecterized by their
roof vents, right? you know, the ugly slotted roof vents that traverse
each side of the roof? Hmm, I'll try to find the TTC's mailing
address.
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NEXT>2307
PREVIOUS>2293
POSTER>Bingo
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: So why's B.C so rich?(Was: you know, I really don't care anymore.)
DATE>Jun 28 17:56:11 1997
EMAILNOTICES>no
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Posted by Bingo on June 23, 1997 at 18:18:12:
In Reply to: [5]Re: So why's B.C so rich?(Was: you know, I really
don't care anymore.) posted by Nathan on June 23, 1997 at 18:10:50:
You know what? The old red G-cars had advertisements on the side of
them too! Once they had this whole train where there was this really
big Oh Henry! bar on the side!
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NEXT>2320
PREVIOUS>2294
POSTER>Bingo
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: MLW's still in service???
DATE>Jun 28 17:56:12 1997
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Posted by Bingo on June 23, 1997 at 18:26:24:
In Reply to: [5]Re: MLW's still in service??? posted by Nathan on June
23, 1997 at 18:15:03:
They have BLACK roofs with a very french bright YELLOW interior and
LIGHT BLUE plastic bench seats. The windows are round and don't open
(still, it's not air conditioned) and they don't have the chime system
on them. The guards are still having their fun with them whistles.
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NEXT>2304
PREVIOUS>2290
POSTER>Zack
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Breda Cars/Seattle Dual powered buses
DATE>Jun 28 17:56:14 1997
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Posted by Zack on June 23, 1997 at 18:50:43:
In Reply to: [6]Re: Breda Cars/Seattle Dual powered buses posted by
Bingo on June 23, 1997 at 16:33:46:
no its a bus powerd by a diesel engine while not in the tunned and
powerd by electric motors while in the tunnel.
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NEXT>
PREVIOUS>2292
POSTER>Steve
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Rail Control Center
DATE>Jun 28 17:56:15 1997
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Posted by Steve on June 23, 1997 at 20:56:29:
In Reply to: [5]Rail Control Center posted by Peter Rosa on June 23,
1997 at 08:43:31:
The new Control Center will replace the 3rd floor at 370 Jay Street
(The Command Center depicted in "The Taking of Pelham 123". It will be
phased in over the next several years. Unlike the present Command
Center, this one WILL indicate train locations for the entire system.
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NEXT>
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>Steve
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>CarBody Lights
DATE>Jun 28 17:56:17 1997
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Posted by Steve on June 23, 1997 at 21:04:26:
In Reply to: [5]R-14x Question posted by Julio Perez on June 23, 1997
at 07:33:18:
The flurescent lights on the Corona cars go off when the car goes over
a 3rd rail gap because they are powered by 600 Volts DC. On virtually
all other equipment, the fluorescents are powered by the battery
voltage through Inverter Ballasts which provide the AC to light the
tubes. Since the battery voltage is not dependent on 600 Volt 3rd rail
power, the lights stay on. However, to reduce battery drain during
prolonged loss of 3rd rail power, the cars are designed so only about
1/3 of the lights will remain lit beyond a few minutes.
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NEXT>
PREVIOUS>2278
POSTER>Steve
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Proposed New Sta on IRT 2/3 at 103 St
DATE>Jun 28 17:56:18 1997
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Posted by Steve on June 23, 1997 at 21:09:03:
In Reply to: [5]Proposed New Sta on IRT 2/3 at 103 St posted by
subway-buff on June 22, 1997 at 19:08:00:
There are many places on the NYCT system where lines are close enough
to make a free transfer point. The question is will the useage justify
the cost and will there be a real benifit? Take for example the
discussion here several weeks ago abour a transfer between the #7 and
the IND at Queens/Queensboro Plaza.
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NEXT>2306
PREVIOUS>2270
POSTER>Steve
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Breda Cars
DATE>Jun 28 17:56:19 1997
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Posted by Steve on June 23, 1997 at 21:21:13:
In Reply to: [5]Re: Breda Cars posted by Nathan on June 23, 1997 at
01:02:25:
Perhaps your lack of command of the language limits your
comprehension.
My point was not who built the cars.The builder is irrelevant. My
pointt was that regardless of who built the cars, they all looked
similar and that this was directly related to cost. Look back at your
history. Every PCC unit, regardless of who built it and when it was
built, looked just like every other PCC unit. This was not an
accident. It was a concious decission. All of the LRV units being
produced, regardless of Mfgr. look more similar than different because
this is a universally accepted design and a purchaser is more likely
to buy it "Off the shelf" because it can be produced more
economically. Something a cash strapped municipality must consider.
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NEXT>
PREVIOUS>2284
POSTER>Steve
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: New R-142's and 143's
DATE>Jun 28 17:56:21 1997
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Posted by Steve on June 23, 1997 at 21:27:28:
In Reply to: [6]Re: New R-142's and 143's posted by Bingo on June 23,
1997 at 14:48:14:
The R-110A and R-110B are still in service? I have a pix of them
together
(which is not for publication) if you send me your E-Mail address.
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NEXT>2310
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>David L.
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Second Avenue Subway
DATE>Jun 28 17:56:22 1997
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Posted by David L. on June 24, 1997 at 01:07:30:
I really haven't been paying attention lately, but does the TA plan on
doing anything with the Second Avenue subway? Has there even been any
talks about any plans for the Second Avenue subway? Or are they just
going to let the Second Avenue subway sit there and rot?
Oh and this is unrealated to the second avenue subway, but when does
the Transit Museum plan on opening up the City Hall station(please
don't tell me around 1997-1998).
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NEXT>2305
PREVIOUS>2297
POSTER>Nathan
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Breda Cars/Seattle Dual powered buses
DATE>Jun 28 17:56:24 1997
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Posted by Nathan on June 24, 1997 at 01:10:16:
In Reply to: [5]Re: Breda Cars/Seattle Dual powered buses posted by
Zack on June 23, 1997 at 02:44:22:
Ack! No, trolleys usually do NOT operate in a tunnel, here there is
306 route km of trolley wire, all above ground. And no, trolleys ARE
lighter than diesels. The only place I know of that operates trolley
buses in a tunnel is seattle.
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NEXT>2311
PREVIOUS>2304
POSTER>Nathan
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Breda Cars/Seattle Dual powered buses
DATE>Jun 28 17:56:25 1997
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Posted by Nathan on June 24, 1997 at 01:13:11:
In Reply to: [5]Re: Breda Cars/Seattle Dual powered buses posted by
Bingo on June 23, 1997 at 16:33:46:
Dual powered means an electric trolley bus that has a diesel engine as
well so the trolley can "de-wire" and operate as a diesel bus. This
also adds
a large weight penalty making the bus less efficient.
2)Yes, vancouver still has trolley buses and BC Transit has (somewhat)
committed to maintaining the trolley fleet. They are looking at some
250
replacement vehicles when the current fleet is retired in 2004
(co-incident
with the planned opening of the Lougheed lrt).
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NEXT>
PREVIOUS>2301
POSTER>Nathan
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Breda Cars
DATE>Jun 28 17:56:27 1997
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Posted by Nathan on June 24, 1997 at 01:26:42:
In Reply to: [5]Re: Breda Cars posted by Steve on June 23, 1997 at
21:21:13:
No! I live near Portland (somewhat), Portland's LRT's look NOTHING
like
those in use in St Louis. Portland's old lrv's have curb level
entrances,
with steps to the high floors. St Louis uses high floor LRV's with
high level platform boarding. Portland's new LRV's are low floor and
look nothing like St Louis' cars. Perhaps you lack good knowledge of
LRV/Streetcar history. The PCC (President's Conference Commitee car,
if you are as ignorant as I like to think) was a last ditch effort to
save the streetcar. The Electric Railway President's Conference
Commitee (who the cars were named after), comprising of the presidents
of various streetcar operators, met to develop a revolutionary new car
that would effectively compete with the automobile. The commitee had
designed a fast,
streamlined car and the design was taken by the various streetcar
operators, and sent out to different manufacturors, where the cars
were built and, in some cases, customized for a specific operator.
The point being is that the PCC was ONE design! One design, the car
was NOT
designed by any manufacturor, but through the collaborated efforts of
many streetcar operators. The design was THEN sent out to whatever
company would build the cars for the least money. If the PCC was
designed by, say Budd, that trademark design would only be found on
Budd cars, and other companies would have built different looking
cars.
Does any other city operate R-62's?
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NEXT>2316
PREVIOUS>2295
POSTER>Nathan
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: So why's B.C so rich?(Was: you know, I really don't care anymore.)
DATE>Jun 28 17:56:29 1997
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Posted by Nathan on June 24, 1997 at 01:28:40:
In Reply to: [5]Re: So why's B.C so rich?(Was: you know, I really
don't care anymore.) posted by Bingo on June 23, 1997 at 18:18:12:
I remember the Oh Henry train too!
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NEXT>2312
PREVIOUS>2282
POSTER>Dan
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Whitehall Ferry Terminal
DATE>Jun 28 17:56:30 1997
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Posted by Dan on June 24, 1997 at 08:58:59:
In Reply to: [5]Whitehall Ferry Terminal posted by BRYAN LAYNE on June
23, 1997 at 12:31:05:
No connections exist. The 'new' Whitehall terminal might have direct
covered above-ground connections to the 1/9 at South Ferry, and the
N/R at Whitehall Street. Underground connections would be nice but
very expensive to construct.
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NEXT>
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>Ed Sachs
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Chicago Els (CTA Museum)
DATE>Jun 28 17:56:31 1997
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Posted by Ed Sachs on June 24, 1997 at 11:52:33:
In Reply to: [6]Re: Chicago Els posted by Bryan LAYNE on June 23, 1997
at 12:26:52:
The CTA did, at one time, own a collection of historic streetcars
(including
horsecars and cable cars), but some years ago donated these to the
Illinois
Railway Museum.
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NEXT>2314
PREVIOUS>2303
POSTER>Ted Nielsen
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Second Avenue Subway
DATE>Jun 28 17:56:33 1997
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Posted by Ted Nielsen on June 24, 1997 at 13:09:32:
In Reply to: [6]Second Avenue Subway posted by David L. on June 24,
1997 at 01:07:30:
As far as I know , the TA has no plans for the 2nd. Ave. subway. Its a
shame since the IRT line is so congested and the 2nd. Ave. subway
would provide relief. I have an idea for the route of the subway :
start it
in South Brooklyn ( at the present time , people have to walk or take
the bus to a subway station ) , continue to Atlantic Ave. , to the
piers ( there
are plans to develop a recreational / commercial area like South
Street
Seaport ) and then under the East River to Manhattan ( under the
Bklyn Bridge ) , up 2nd. Ave. until 90th St. , under the East River
again
into Astoria and ending at La Guardia Airport ( its another fantasy ,
I know )
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NEXT>2318
PREVIOUS>2305
POSTER>Gary Jacobi
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Breda Cars/Seattle Dual powered buses
DATE>Jun 28 17:56:34 1997
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Posted by Gary Jacobi on June 24, 1997 at 14:15:10:
In Reply to: [5]Re: Breda Cars/Seattle Dual powered buses posted by
Nathan on June 22, 1997 at 01:21:05:
My daughter recently moved to Seattle, and uses transit almost
excluseively. She tells me the Bus-Trolley is a political fix wherein
the tunnel downtown was built first, but then nobody could agree on
what kind of rail vehicles to use. Nevertheless, she is very high on
the system, but you must take into account that she grew up in Phoenix
and Sacramento, and never experienced THE NYC Subways!
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NEXT>2315
PREVIOUS>2308
POSTER>John
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Whitehall Ferry Terminal
DATE>Jun 28 17:56:36 1997
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Posted by John on June 24, 1997 at 14:23:43:
In Reply to: [5]Re: Whitehall Ferry Terminal posted by Dan on June 24,
1997 at 08:58:59:
Where is the passageway to the inner platform at the South Ferry 1/9
station? I know that the inner platform is closed, but there has to be
a passageway to it somewhere. I can't even find a trace of a
passageway.
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NEXT>2321
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>Charles
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>New York City Bus (RTS)
DATE>Jun 28 17:56:38 1997
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Posted by Charles on June 24, 1997 at 14:29:51:
Does Anyone know if there was a Transit Authority RTS built with ad
wings. If there was does anyone have pictures of it? I know that there
were a few Grummans with them.
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NEXT>2327
PREVIOUS>2310
POSTER>David Pirmann
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Second Avenue Subway
DATE>Jun 28 17:56:40 1997
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Posted by David Pirmann on June 24, 1997 at 14:36:10:
In Reply to: [6]Second Avenue Subway posted by David L. on June 24,
1997 at 01:07:30:
The TA still considers Second Avenue an active project. There was a
press conference two weeks ago at City Hall which commemorated the
closing of the 2nd Avenue El 55 years ago and reiterated the need for
the subway. Whether it will be built in our lifetimes is uncertain.
Last I heard, the TA had recommissioned environmental impact,
enginerring, and alternatives studies for the 2nd Avenue corridor.
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NEXT>
PREVIOUS>2312
POSTER>David Pirmann
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Whitehall Ferry Terminal
DATE>Jun 28 17:56:41 1997
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Posted by David Pirmann on June 24, 1997 at 14:39:12:
In Reply to: [6]Re: Whitehall Ferry Terminal posted by John on June
24, 1997 at 14:23:43:
The stairway is just to the left of the token booth (I'm not sure if
there's more than one booth at South Ferry, so that might not be very
clear.) Anyway, it's behind a door so you can't see it unless the door
is open. You basically go down, twist around, walk thru a corridor,
and then you come out on the platform area. There's crew quarters down
there-- lockers and sinks and maintenance stuff in one area, and the
north/western half is still wide open (see pix at [7]Here.
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NEXT>
PREVIOUS>2307
POSTER>Bingo
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: So why's B.C so rich?(Was: you know, I really don't care anymore.)
DATE>Jun 28 17:56:42 1997
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Posted by Bingo on June 24, 1997 at 15:27:52:
In Reply to: [5]Re: So why's B.C so rich?(Was: you know, I really
don't care anymore.) posted by Nathan on June 24, 1997 at 01:28:40:
Cool!
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NEXT>
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>Nathan
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Vancouver-Seattle "Mt Baker International" Slamtrak Talgos
DATE>Jun 28 17:56:44 1997
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Posted by Nathan on June 24, 1997 at 16:04:40:
ok, I know this is not really urban transit, but oh well.
Anyway, I heard from a friend in Seattle that more track-upgrades
to this rail corridor are being planned. I am not sure if this is
true, all
I know is that Slamtrak, Washington DOT, the bc gov, and Renfe Talgo
(car manufacturor) were engaged in a co-operative effort to bring high
speed rail travel to this corridor, through an incremental approach
(first step was the tilting Talgo Pendular rail cars). Anyway, Does
anyone know any details on this? I think that corridor should be a
prime consideration for a high speed line; it is already running at
95% of capacity.
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NEXT>2319
PREVIOUS>2311
POSTER>Nathan
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Breda Cars/Seattle Dual powered buses
DATE>Jun 28 17:56:45 1997
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Posted by Nathan on June 24, 1997 at 16:10:37:
In Reply to: [5]Re: Breda Cars/Seattle Dual powered buses posted by
Gary Jacobi on June 24, 1997 at 14:15:10:
Yeah, Seattle's system is ok, downtown, that is. Of course then again
Seattle doesn't have any rail transit (heritage streetcar and monorail
not included).
The best way to make the best use of a rail transit line is through
hub and spoke operation: buses feed people to various parts of the
rail line, and
the rail line (if well planned) should take them to where they want to
go, faster than the automobile. But Seattle is just a bunch of empty
spokes....
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NEXT>2349
PREVIOUS>2318
POSTER>Bingo
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Breda Cars/Seattle Dual powered buses
DATE>Jun 28 17:56:46 1997
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Posted by Bingo on June 24, 1997 at 16:27:05:
In Reply to: [5]Re: Breda Cars/Seattle Dual powered buses posted by
Zack on June 23, 1997 at 02:44:22:
Sorry, but trolley cars are much, much, lighter than anything that
requires fossil fuels. Consider this analysis: the fastest trains in
the world are powered solely by electricity while the strongest ones
are powered by diesel.
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NEXT>
PREVIOUS>2296
POSTER>Bingo
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: MLW's still in service???
DATE>Jun 28 17:56:47 1997
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Posted by Bingo on June 24, 1997 at 16:36:41:
In Reply to: [5]Re: MLW's still in service??? posted by Bingo on June
23, 1997 at 18:26:24:
The count is 36 MLW cars on property, all of which are in revenue
service, which are rotated in 18 car blocks. I called TTC today,
that's what they told me. I still think they are ugly (not as bad as
the H-5's, mind you) but they are older than the H-1's, are extremely
well built, and barely show their age.
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NEXT>2348
PREVIOUS>2313
POSTER>Wayne Johnson
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: New York City Bus (RTS)
DATE>Jun 28 17:56:49 1997
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Posted by Wayne Johnson on June 24, 1997 at 17:34:40:
In Reply to: [6]New York City Bus (RTS) posted by Charles on June 24,
1997 at 14:29:51:
Charles,
As far as I know NYCTA never did operate any RTS's with ad wings.
Before the Grumman 870's were withdrawn from service one of them
(#631) had ad wings. This bus was assigned to the 132nd Street Depot
and it was later transferred to the 54th Street Depot. One Flxible bus
(built approx. 1975/76) also had ad wings. This bus was #7753. It
orignally operated out of the 54th Street Depot in Manhattan, but was
later transferred to the West Farms Depot in the Bronx.
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NEXT>2325
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>Shig
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Express C train?
DATE>Jun 28 17:56:50 1997
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Posted by Shig on June 24, 1997 at 18:02:29:
When I took uptown C train from 14 Street last week, it ran as
an express train and skipped local stations.
In the system map, C seems to be always local. Does such non-listed
express service often run in NYC subway?
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NEXT>2421
PREVIOUS>2275
POSTER>Lou
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: R-44s Off the A Line
DATE>Jun 28 17:56:51 1997
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Posted by Lou on June 24, 1997 at 18:33:53:
In Reply to: [5]Re: R-44s Off the A Line posted by John on June 23,
1997 at 08:42:04:
Last Saturday I was riding the 8th Ave and the A had 32's/38's and
same with the **FOUR** Car (see me running to catch it, was expecting
6) C.
I am not often on the west side but the whole time riding Saturday on
the A/C I did not see a 44.
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NEXT>2330
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>John of Calgary
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Extra route on L line
DATE>Jun 28 17:56:53 1997
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Posted by John of Calgary on June 24, 1997 at 18:57:49:
The people at the MTA should really consider this!
Here is my message:
The MTA should start plaaning a route that would release some of the
load off the L train. Maybe try and refurbish the link between Livonia
Av (L line) and Junius St. (3/4 line). Or build a link between the L
line and the J/M/Z line at Broadway Junction.
If they can carry out these improvements, here are some of the
suggested numbers or letters for these trains.
-For the L and 3/4 line: The colour should be grey and the letter
should be :H,I or the number 8.
-For the L and J/M/Z line: The colour: grey.(DUH!) letter or number:
K,P or the number 10.
Those who think this is a good idea, respond today!!!!
For those who think that this is a stupid, dumb, etc. idea. Do
respond, but don't put stupid things on it!
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NEXT>2326
PREVIOUS>2322
POSTER>John of Calgary
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Express C train?
DATE>Jun 28 17:56:54 1997
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Posted by John of Calgary on June 24, 1997 at 19:00:45:
In Reply to: [5]Express C train? posted by Shig on June 24, 1997 at
18:02:29:
Maybe the MTA was doing track recostruction or maybe the stations
needed renovation. Did you see any red signs at your station? EOr you
can call the MTA customer service to spill the beans on the story.
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NEXT>2345
PREVIOUS>2325
POSTER>John of Calgary
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Express C train?
DATE>Jun 28 17:56:56 1997
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Posted by John of Calgary on June 24, 1997 at 19:02:39:
In Reply to: [5]Express C train? posted by Shig on June 24, 1997 at
18:02:29:
Try calling MTA customer service. Or maybe even try looking for signs
at your subway station.
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NEXT>2352
PREVIOUS>2314
POSTER>John of Calgary
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Second Avenue Subway
DATE>Jun 28 17:56:58 1997
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Posted by John of Calgary on June 24, 1997 at 19:10:27:
In Reply to: [5]Re: Second Avenue Subway posted by Ted Nielsen on June
24, 1997 at 13:09:32:
Sorry to tell you, but they ARE opening the abandoned City Hall
Station in 1998. Sorry!
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NEXT>2329
PREVIOUS>2241
POSTER>John of Calgary
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Interesting Subway Signal
DATE>Jun 28 17:56:59 1997
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Posted by John of Calgary on June 24, 1997 at 19:15:27:
In Reply to: [5]Re: Interesting Subway Signal posted by Steve on June
21, 1997 at 21:58:22:
Yeah! Where is the signal? Which line? D/Q? F? or the N? Like, tell
him, man!
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NEXT>
PREVIOUS>2328
POSTER>John of Calgary
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Interesting Subway Signal
DATE>Jun 28 17:57:01 1997
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Posted by John of Calgary on June 24, 1997 at 19:15:46:
In Reply to: [5]Re: Interesting Subway Signal posted by Steve on June
21, 1997 at 21:58:22:
Yeah! Where is the signal? Which line? D/Q? F? or the N? Like, tell
him, man!
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NEXT>2331
PREVIOUS>2324
POSTER>Andrew Huie
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Extra route on L line
DATE>Jun 28 17:57:02 1997
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Posted by Andrew Huie on June 24, 1997 at 19:16:06:
In Reply to: [6]Extra route on L line posted by John of Calgary on
June 24, 1997 at 18:57:49:
Actually, this was done before. The last time a train went from
Canarsie to Bway (Brooklyn) was the 'JJ' in the 60's. But if they do
it now, where should it go? Should it follow the old 'K' route up
Sixth Avenue or go down Nassau Street like the 'J'? Also, should it
skip-stop like the 'J' along Bway or go completely local and let the
'J' go express? The latter would be nice for the 'J', but then who
would want to take the new line?
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NEXT>2339
PREVIOUS>2330
POSTER>John of Calgary
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Extra route on L line
DATE>Jun 28 17:57:03 1997
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Posted by John of Calgary on June 24, 1997 at 19:30:19:
In Reply to: [5]Re: Extra route on L line posted by Andrew Huie on
June 24, 1997 at 19:16:06:
Well, the one that connects the L and the 3/4 should A. go to 241
Street Wakefield or Dyre Av. or 148 Street Lenox Terminal or the 242
Street Van Cortlandt Park.
And as for the L and J/M/Z line, it could use that abandoned streetcar
station when trains descend from the Willamsburg Bridge. That is
accessable to trains if trains go straight down instead of turning
into Essex St. (It is visible. if there is no Brooklyn then Queens
bound trains, go to the very front and stare out the door's window.)
or Maybe use the disused dead end at Canal St by breaking down the
wall and build tracks so trains from Bowery can enter it. or run it
all the way to Chambers Street or Broad Street or maybe to Coney
Island by the way of the M. And (THIS IS OFF TOPIC!!!!!!) extend the M
Shuttle from Myrtle Street to Essex St. (It can terminate at that
abandoned streetcar terminal I mentioned earlier.)
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NEXT>2337
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>Timothy
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Cities with Elevateds
DATE>Jun 28 17:57:05 1997
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Posted by Timothy on June 24, 1997 at 19:44:05:
Can anyone tell me what other cities in the U.S., besides New York,
Chicago, and Philadelphia, that still have (old) elevated lines,
whether
in use, or abandoned with el structures and stations still standing?
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NEXT>2342
PREVIOUS>2228
POSTER>John of Calgary
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: RE: New Routes & Stuff
DATE>Jun 28 17:57:06 1997
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Posted by John of Calgary on June 24, 1997 at 20:14:32:
In Reply to: [5]RE: New Routes & Stuff posted by subway-buff on June
19, 1997 at 03:26:44:
Are you trying to make me laugh?
Here, consider THIS!
-Run G from 179 Street Jamaica to Stillwell Ave. Coney Island. as a
Local and have F run on the Brighton Line. (D/Q line) and move the Q
onto the Culver Line (F line) as an Express.
-Make 4 terminate at Bowling Green and 5 go to Utica and 6 Should go
to Flatbush at all times except Midnight hours when 2 goes to Utica
and 6 goes to New Lots while 3 have its nightly siesta and 5 become a
shuttle from Dyre Avenue to 125 Street. 1 and 9 then will assume the
duty of serving Flatbush. (try to rotate them.) 4 will become a
shuttle from Woodlawn to 125 Street to connect with 6.
-Run C from 205 Street Norwood to Far Rockaway, sending A to Rockaway
Park AT ALL TIMES! (No, the Rockaway S will remain.)
-Run D to 205 Street Norwood to Coney lsland RUSH HOURS ONLY! Other
times, the D goes to 21 Street Queensbridge. Q will go to 179 Street
Jamaica AT ALL TIMES!
-Run the M to Jamaica Center and put the Z to Metropolitian Av. and
have the M go from Jamaica Center to Coney Island and Z from
Metropolitian Av to Broad Street half of the time and the rest of the
time it goes to Chambers Street.
-Have the 7 Express be renamed to the 8.
-Run the N from Jamaica Center to 95 Street Bay Ridge and R from
Ditmars to Coney Island except late nights and weekends when they
switch routes.
-Have the 4 and 5 use Bleeker Street on their way to the Bronx.
-Run the E to Lefferts Blvd rush hours and middays. Other times,
continue running it to the WTC.
-Run the 2 from 241 Street Wakefield to South Ferry except late nights
when it serves Utica and 3 from 148 Street Lenox Terminal to Utica
except late nights when it has its nightly siesta while 1 and 9 run
from 242 Street to South Ferry except Late nights when one goes to
Flatbush and the other staying at South Ferry. The next night, it
switches between the 1 and 9.
ALL OF THESE SHOULD BE IN EFFECT AT ALL TIMES EXCEPT WEEKENDS.
WEEKEND SUGGESTIONS:
-Keep G at Smith/9 Streets
-Have F do 179 Street Jamaica while Q goes to Queesbridge.
-Have the 5 go to New Lots and 6 to Flatbush. The 1 will go to New
Lots and 9 will go to Flatbush. Half of the 4's will go from Woodlawn
to Brooklyn Bridge and the other half to Bowling Green. 2 and 3 will
go from their Northern terminals (Which is 148 Street and 241 Street
Wakefield) to South Ferry.
Doesn't this sound better?
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NEXT>2343
PREVIOUS>2200
POSTER>John of Calgary
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: What happened to J/Z skip stop and express between Marcy and Myrtle?
DATE>Jun 28 17:57:08 1997
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Posted by John of Calgary on June 24, 1997 at 20:32:15:
In Reply to: [5]Re: What happened to J/Z skip stop and express between
Marcy and Myrtle? posted by Garfield on June 19, 1997 at 17:22:29:
Well, when I was in New York last summer, I took the J or Z to
Manhattan. (Mainly to Chinatown.) And on every Z train I took, it
stopped at the stops it's supposed to skip! What on the face of the
Planet Earth is happening?
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NEXT>2416
PREVIOUS>2287
POSTER>
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: TTC Ugly Stations, Vancouver, everything else, life story, was Re:
DATE>Jun 28 17:57:09 1997
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In Reply to: [5]Re: TTC Ugly Stations, Vancouver, everything else,
life story, was Re: Toronto H-6's posted by Bingo on June 23, 1997 at
15:28:22:
Well, for one thing, we'll someday see a WestJet crash. don't worry.
About that little Union Station plan of yours, its pretty good, but
what about the subway? will you build a passageway that would connect
it and the station. And in the place of the existing station, they
could build a freight yard.
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NEXT>2341
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>California Mike
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Express C train
DATE>Jun 28 17:57:10 1997
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Posted by California Mike on June 24, 1997 at 22:51:00:
In Reply to: [5]Re: Express C train? posted by John of Calgary on June
24, 1997 at 19:00:45:
The way it was when I lived in New York was that double letters
identified locals, and single letters identified expresses.
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NEXT>2338
PREVIOUS>2332
POSTER>John
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Cities with Elevateds
DATE>Jun 28 17:57:12 1997
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Posted by John on June 24, 1997 at 23:53:06:
In Reply to: [5]Cities with Elevateds posted by Timothy on June 24,
1997 at 19:44:05:
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NEXT>2354
PREVIOUS>2337
POSTER>John
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Cities with Elevateds
DATE>Jun 28 17:57:13 1997
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Posted by John on June 24, 1997 at 23:53:56:
In Reply to: [5]Cities with Elevateds posted by Timothy on June 24,
1997 at 19:44:05:
Boston also has an elevated.
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NEXT>2340
PREVIOUS>2331
POSTER>John
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Extra route on L line
DATE>Jun 28 17:57:15 1997
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Posted by John on June 24, 1997 at 23:58:30:
In Reply to: [5]Re: Extra route on L line posted by John of Calgary on
June 24, 1997 at 19:30:19:
The connection between the L and the 3/4 cannot be used for revenue
service because the demensions of the BMT/IND and IRT cars are
different. However, like mentioned above, the connection at Broadway
was used at one time. I beleive that there used to be a line from
Canarsie to Jamaica.
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NEXT>2356
PREVIOUS>2339
POSTER>Steve
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Extra route on L line
DATE>Jul 9 19:51:54 1997
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Posted by Steve on June 25, 1997 at 00:01:46:
In Reply to: [5]Extra route on L line posted by John of Calgary on
June 24, 1997 at 18:57:49:
Not a dumb idea but unworkable. The L line uses B division equipment
wheras the 3/4 lines use IRT equipment. It would work fine until the
first L train got onto the IRT trackage and tore up the first platform
it gets to.
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NEXT>
PREVIOUS>2336
POSTER>John
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Express C train
DATE>Jul 9 19:51:56 1997
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Posted by John on June 25, 1997 at 00:02:19:
In Reply to: [5]Re: Express C train posted by California Mike on June
24, 1997 at 22:51:00:
The double-letter system has been discontinued and all lines are now
single-lettered, regardless of whether they are express or local. As
for the C running express, this could have been due to track work, or
a gap in A service that would force the C to substitute. Things like
this occasionally happen. To me, it happened twice on the B when it
ran local from 36th Street to DeKalb, and also on the F between
Roosevelt Avenue and 71st-Continental.
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NEXT>2383
PREVIOUS>2333
POSTER>John
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: RE: New Routes & Stuff
DATE>Jul 9 19:51:57 1997
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Posted by John on June 25, 1997 at 00:13:30:
In Reply to: [5]Re: RE: New Routes & Stuff posted by John of Calgary
on June 24, 1997 at 20:14:32:
If the 4 and 5 are going to remain express, they cannot stop at
Bleeker Street (or they will have to make local stops between Brooklyn
Bridge and 14th Street). Or, they can run express on the local tracks.
Other than that, you are creating confusing situations between
rotating and alternating routes and terminals and times and . . .
ARHGHH!! What are you trying to do - drive everybody crazy??!!
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NEXT>
PREVIOUS>2334
POSTER>John
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: What happened to J/Z skip stop and express between Marcy and Myrtle?
DATE>Jul 9 19:51:58 1997
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Posted by John on June 25, 1997 at 00:17:24:
In Reply to: [5]Re: What happened to J/Z skip stop and express between
Marcy and Myrtle? posted by John of Calgary on June 24, 1997 at
20:32:15:
You are not the only "victim" here. Apparently, it seems as if the
Transit Authority is not living up to its word. You should call the
MTA at (718) 330-1234 to find out what's going on.
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NEXT>2361
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>John
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Why not the LIRR??
DATE>Jul 9 19:52:00 1997
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Posted by John on June 25, 1997 at 00:24:11:
If NJ Transit has thru-ticketing and scheduled connections to SEPTA
trains at Trenton, why can't they have the same thing with the Long
Island Railroad at Penn Station? Yesterday, I was on my way back from
Long Beach and I was going to visit a reletive in Newark. I got off
the LIRR at Penn Station and I had to go upstairs, walk to the NJ
Transit area, purchase a ticket, and go back downstairs to board a
train. Going to Philadelphia, I bought both tickets in Penn Station,
took NJ Transit to Trenton, crossed the platform and got on the SEPTA
train. Why can't NJ Transit at least have thru-ticketing with the
LIRR?
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NEXT>2346
PREVIOUS>2326
POSTER>Steve
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Express C train?
DATE>Jul 9 19:52:01 1997
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Posted by Steve on June 25, 1997 at 00:27:05:
In Reply to: [5]Express C train? posted by Shig on June 24, 1997 at
18:02:29:
No need to call customer service. The uptown C runs express from Canal
Street to 59th Street (weekdays) due to construction at Canal Street.
I have no idea, however, how long this will be going on. Southbound
service is not effected.
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NEXT>
PREVIOUS>2345
POSTER>David L.
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Express C train?
DATE>Jul 9 19:52:02 1997
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Posted by David L. on June 25, 1997 at 01:19:15:
In Reply to: [5]Express C train? posted by Shig on June 24, 1997 at
18:02:29:
What's actually happening is that the TA is trying to replace a
crossover track north of Canal St. Usually C trains coming from the
Fulton Street line share the same tracks with the A train up to Canal
Street. When the C train leaves Canal St, it uses that crossover to
switch on the 8 Ave local tracks. But now that the TA are replacing
the crossover, Northbound C trains are running on the 8 Ave express
track.
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NEXT>2355
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>Zack
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>2nd avenue elevated
DATE>Jul 9 19:52:03 1997
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Posted by Zack on June 25, 1997 at 01:23:59:
How come the TA doesen build a new 2nd avenue elevated. but this time
out of steel reniforced concrete like Vancouver B.C.'s sky train/New
US Super Feeways. i think it would be a good idea little manitance
becouse it would be concrete not steel and with thoes new R142,143
coming in to service the car sulppy would be good.
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NEXT>2358
PREVIOUS>2321
POSTER>Zack
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: New York City Bus (RTS)
DATE>Jul 9 19:52:05 1997
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Posted by Zack on June 25, 1997 at 01:28:26:
In Reply to: [6]Re: New York City Bus (RTS) posted by Wayne Johnson on
June 24, 1997 at 17:34:40:
What are adwings?
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NEXT>2350
PREVIOUS>2319
POSTER>Zack
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Breda Cars/Seattle Dual powered buses
DATE>Jul 9 19:52:06 1997
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Posted by Zack on June 25, 1997 at 01:32:44:
In Reply to: [6]Re: Breda Cars/Seattle Dual powered buses posted by
Nathan on June 24, 1997 at 16:10:37:
there trying at least to have a spoke
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NEXT>2353
PREVIOUS>2349
POSTER>Zack
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Breda Cars/Seattle Dual powered buses
DATE>Jul 9 19:52:07 1997
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Posted by Zack on June 25, 1997 at 01:33:36:
In Reply to: [6]Re: Breda Cars/Seattle Dual powered buses posted by
Nathan on June 24, 1997 at 16:10:37:
there trying at least to have a spoke in seattle (i think)with the 6
year plan (and mabey the rta soon)
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NEXT>2390
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>David L.
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Salaries
DATE>Jul 9 19:52:08 1997
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Posted by David L. on June 25, 1997 at 01:37:13:
This may be a stupid question, but I'm curious. How much money does a
train engineer, a conductor, and a token booth clerk make annually?
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NEXT>2384
PREVIOUS>2327
POSTER>David L.
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Second Avenue Subway
DATE>Jul 9 19:52:10 1997
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Posted by David L. on June 25, 1997 at 01:45:05:
In Reply to: [5]Re: Second Avenue Subway posted by John of Calgary on
June 24, 1997 at 19:10:27:
Thank you John!
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NEXT>
PREVIOUS>2350
POSTER>Nathan
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Breda Cars/Seattle Dual powered buses
DATE>Jul 9 19:52:11 1997
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Posted by Nathan on June 25, 1997 at 02:36:19:
In Reply to: [6]Re: Breda Cars/Seattle Dual powered buses posted by
Zack on June 25, 1997 at 01:33:36:
Yes, the current RTA plan includes major transit upgrades, including
light rail, commuter rail, and (in my opinion) retarded HOV lanes.
Seattle is kinda the odd ball in the pacific northwest: Portland has
made major expenditures on light rail, which no one uses, Seattle has
an extensive fleet of trolleys, which are somewhat used, and then
there is Vancouver (hometown bias) in which trolley buses usually turn
away people because they are so fucking full, as well as politically
motivated advanced rapid transit lines (which are well used) and
commuter rail. Of course, nothing adds up to NYC, what a concept; you
can take the subway ANYWHERE you want to go, hmmm, I'm saving my
pennies and hopefully I'll be able to get out to NYC sometime, course
by the time I get out there the Second Ave Subway would have been
built and fully operational...
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NEXT>2367
PREVIOUS>2338
POSTER>Nathan
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Cities with Elevateds
DATE>Jul 9 19:52:12 1997
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Posted by Nathan on June 25, 1997 at 02:38:45:
In Reply to: [5]Cities with Elevateds posted by Timothy on June 24,
1997 at 19:44:05:
outside the US, I know that Vancouver uses els, toronto's SRT uses
elevated guideways, and Kuala Lumpur's new ART (Advanced Rapid
Transit) uses elevated structures, it will open in '98.
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NEXT>2374
PREVIOUS>2347
POSTER>Nathan
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: 2nd avenue elevated
DATE>Jul 9 19:52:13 1997
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Posted by Nathan on June 25, 1997 at 02:46:32:
In Reply to: [5]2nd avenue elevated posted by Zack on June 25, 1997 at
01:23:59:
You say to build L sections like the ones used on the SkyTrain. Well,
from personal experience, these structures do not rattle and amplify
noise,
which is nice on nearby residents. It would be an easy project, as the
beams are prefabricated off site and transported to the construction
area by flatbed truck ()Like i said before, the main thing about
concrete guideways is that they don't shake like hell when a LIM
powered train moving 110Km/h is running over them, besides, I like els
because if you are driving with a pro-auto (die bastard!)/anti transit
person, you can race the el, and here it always wins (not counting the
times I've hidden the car keys from an auto crazed friend!)
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NEXT>2359
PREVIOUS>2340
POSTER>z
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Extra route on L line
DATE>Jul 9 19:52:15 1997
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Posted by z on June 25, 1997 at 06:02:01:
In Reply to: [6]Extra route on L line posted by John of Calgary on
June 24, 1997 at 18:57:49:
I think money would be best spent elsewhere on the system. As long as
we don't get to a system like they have with Barcelona three different
subway companies and a rail company serve the city. Even worse,
connections at stations between lines are miles apart.
Anyway, I've heard of a plan to develope the trackage that exists next
to the L. As you head from Wilson Avenue towards East New York, you
can see the trackage. My only question is where it leads, and is it
really neccessary?
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NEXT>2368
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>You mean the trucks are loose?? (Was Re: Questions on Refurbished R-40
DATE>Jul 9 19:52:16 1997
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In Reply to: [6]Re: Questions on Refurbished R-40 Modifications posted
by Steve on June 20, 1997 at 21:23:41:
I hope there is some sort of security pin holding the trucks to the
car body, or vice versa. Please tell me that's the case with the R-40s
and other current rolling stock on the TA...
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NEXT>2362
PREVIOUS>2348
POSTER>Charles Fiori
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: New York City Bus (RTS)
DATE>Jul 9 19:52:17 1997
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Posted by Charles Fiori on June 25, 1997 at 07:51:03:
In Reply to: [5]Re: New York City Bus (RTS) posted by Zack on June 25,
1997 at 01:28:26:
Adwings were advertising boards attached along the rooflines. They
were maybe 3 feet high and in three pieces, 2 of equal size on the
ends and a smaller one in the middle, covering the entire length of
the bus, on both sides. When these things first debuted in the 60s,
the smaller section in the middle housed a destination sign (outer
boroughs) or route sign (Manhattan). I was a big fan of those signs
and would be EXTREMELY PLEASED to track down some of them.
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NEXT>2380
PREVIOUS>2356
POSTER>Dan
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Extra route on L line
DATE>Jul 9 19:52:18 1997
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Posted by Dan on June 25, 1997 at 08:30:48:
In Reply to: [6]Re: Extra route on L line posted by z on June 25, 1997
at 06:02:01:
The tracks adjacent to the 'L' line are the LIRR's Bay Ridge freight
line. They run from 2 Avenue & 65 Street in Bay Ridge east across
Brooklyn, then north into Queens. There was LIRR passenger service
possibly into the 1920's. I don't think there are any remnants of the
stations visible.
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NEXT>2375
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>Todd Glickman
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>NYC Subway Service Changes
DATE>Jul 9 19:52:20 1997
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Posted by Todd Glickman on June 25, 1997 at 09:10:05:
Many have asked questions on this board about NYC Subway service
changes. The TA folks (sorry for the old nomenclature, I think
it still sounds good) have a web site which is updated weekly
on Fridays -- it spells out service changes and diversions for
the upcoming week. Even though I only travel to NYC a few times
a month from my [now] home in Boston, it (1) helps me plan my
trips and (2) alerts me to interesting "rides".
http://www.mta.nyc.ny.us/nyct/Subway/subsrvno.htm
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NEXT>2496
PREVIOUS>2344
POSTER>Josh Caesar
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Why not the LIRR??
DATE>Jul 9 19:52:21 1997
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Posted by Josh Caesar on June 25, 1997 at 09:23:29:
In Reply to: [6]Why not the LIRR?? posted by John on June 25, 1997 at
00:24:11:
I think they used to a long time ago. I think the connection with the
LIRR at Penn Station is a bit more complex than the SEPTA connection
at Trenton, Penn Station has many lines, Trenton really only has one
coming in from each railroad. Scheduled connections at Penn Station
would be pretty hard, especially since NJ Transit already has a
schedule to keep to connect to Septa, to make scheduled connections to
the LIRR, SEPTA schedules would probably have to be changed as well.
Itl looks like a logistical mess.
JC
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NEXT>2369
PREVIOUS>2358
POSTER>Wayne Johnson
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: New York City Bus (RTS)
DATE>Jul 9 19:52:22 1997
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Posted by Wayne Johnson on June 25, 1997 at 09:28:38:
In Reply to: [5]Re: New York City Bus (RTS) posted by Zack on June 25,
1997 at 01:28:26:
That middle sign was actually a route sign (as opposed to destination
sign) on all MABSTOA buses.
6701-6900 (Non-Air Conditioned)
8301-877? (Air Conditioned)
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NEXT>2364
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>lou
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>theGold Card
DATE>Jul 9 19:52:23 1997
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Posted by lou on June 25, 1997 at 10:04:28:
how much does everybody think the Gold card is going to ,increase
ridership???? I think its gonna boom!!! Anybody else???
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NEXT>2365
PREVIOUS>2363
POSTER>lou
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SUBJECT>theGold Card
DATE>Jul 9 19:52:24 1997
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Posted by lou on June 25, 1997 at 10:04:32:
how much does everybody think the Gold card is going to ,increase
ridership???? I think its gonna boom!!! Anybody else???
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NEXT>2370
PREVIOUS>2364
POSTER>Josh Caesar
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: theGold Card
DATE>Jul 9 19:52:26 1997
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Posted by Josh Caesar on June 25, 1997 at 10:50:52:
In Reply to: [6]theGold Card posted by lou on June 25, 1997 at
10:04:32:
Oh yeah. The service increases due to demand produced by the free
transfers will be incredible. Queens Surface Corporation has already
hired 65 new bus drivers alone. I don't know the numbers for NYCT, but
they must be up there as well.
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NEXT>
PREVIOUS>2283
POSTER>Josh Caesar
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: MLW's still in service??? Re: Transit in Movies - Again
DATE>Jul 9 19:52:27 1997
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Posted by Josh Caesar on June 25, 1997 at 11:11:11:
In Reply to: [6]Re: MLW's still in service??? Re: Transit in Movies -
Again posted by FREE WEBPAGE SERVICES (Sorry, No E-mail was left) on
June 23, 1997 at 13:11:23:
Geocities www.geocities.com
Angelfire www.angelfire.com
Geocities DOES NOT give me benefits for referrals.>
A third service is Tripod, located at http://www.tripod.com.
JC
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NEXT>2381
PREVIOUS>2354
POSTER>Gart Jacobi
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Cities with Elevateds
DATE>Jul 9 19:52:28 1997
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Posted by Gart Jacobi on June 25, 1997 at 11:14:19:
In Reply to: [5]Re: Cities with Elevateds posted by Nathan on June 25,
1997 at 02:38:45:
If your definition of els is broad enough,most systems qualify. If you
limit your definition to systems with stations on elevated sections,
which I think is reasomable, you still have quite a few. BART and
WAMTA definitely, and I believe MARTA as well.Everyone prides in
calling their new systems subways, but with the cost of underground
construction today, a completely underground system is no longer
fiscally sane.
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NEXT>3124
PREVIOUS>2357
POSTER>
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: You mean the trucks are loose?? (Was Re: Questions on Refurbished R-40
DATE>Jul 9 19:52:29 1997
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In Reply to: [5]You mean the trucks are loose?? (Was Re: Questions on
Refurbished R-40 Modifications) posted by Julio Perez on June 25, 1997
at 07:47:02:
This is standard railroad practice; think about it, trucks can't come
off unless the carbody has overturned, at which time having attached
trucks would only lead to increased damage. The big plus is the
ability to spot new trucks and replace cars on them which then can be
quickly towed to the shop. I have seen damaged subway cars moved on
plain freight trucks in such situations.
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NEXT>2371
PREVIOUS>2362
POSTER>Charles Fiori
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: New York City Bus (RTS)
DATE>Jul 9 19:52:31 1997
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Posted by Charles Fiori on June 25, 1997 at 12:09:45:
In Reply to: [5]Re: New York City Bus (RTS) posted by Wayne Johnson on
June 25, 1997 at 09:28:38:
If I remember correctly, Coliseum Depot was MaBSTOA. I have one of the
signs from the adwings and they had destinations and route numbers as
opposed to route numbers and names. Once the signs became too annoying
to change, etc., the route/destination signs were replaced by Happy
Faces :).
I really, really would love to find some more of those signs. Wild
goose chases I do not need, but if you know where some might reside...
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NEXT>2385
PREVIOUS>2365
POSTER>Wayne Johnson
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: theGold Card
DATE>Jul 9 19:52:32 1997
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Posted by Wayne Johnson on June 25, 1997 at 13:36:11:
In Reply to: [5]theGold Card posted by lou on June 25, 1997 at
10:04:28:
I have one dispite that fact that I now reside in Maryland and I have
a car. It's great to have when I come into NYC and need to ride the
subway or bus.
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NEXT>2406
PREVIOUS>2369
POSTER>Wayne Johnson
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: New York City Bus (RTS)
DATE>Jul 9 19:52:33 1997
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Posted by Wayne Johnson on June 25, 1997 at 13:49:24:
In Reply to: [5]Re: New York City Bus (RTS) posted by Charles Fiori on
June 25, 1997 at 12:09:45:
Yes, Coliseum Depot, was a MABSTOA depot (It was recently demolished),
but I was unaware of it's side adwing signs with destinations on it.
Thanks for the info. I do remember that these signs pretty much had
the same info as the side sign (near the exit door) on buses without
adwings. I remember that some Coliseum routes had many branches and
they would have a sign for the branch that a particular bus was
serving such as "12 Fordham Road - City Island" "12A Fordham Road
Pelham Parkway" "12B Fordham Road Orchard Beach" and I believe their
was one for the Pelham golf course also. If I remember correctly
Kingsbridge and West Farms Depots (The other two Bronx depots) had
side adwings signs with route information. Thanks again and much luck
in finding those signs
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NEXT>2373
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>john zmijewski
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Express m trains
DATE>Jul 9 19:52:34 1997
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Posted by john zmijewski on June 25, 1997 at 14:58:01:
In Reply to: [5]Re: Express C train? posted by John of Calgary on June
24, 1997 at 19:02:39:
is too fast and it is diry and late
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NEXT>
PREVIOUS>2372
POSTER>john zmijewski
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Express m trains
DATE>Jul 9 19:52:36 1997
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Posted by john zmijewski on June 25, 1997 at 14:58:10:
In Reply to: [5]Re: Express C train? posted by John of Calgary on June
24, 1997 at 19:02:39:
is too fast and it is diry and late
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NEXT>2376
PREVIOUS>2355
POSTER>john zmijewski
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: 2nd avenue elevated
DATE>Jul 9 19:52:37 1997
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Posted by john zmijewski on June 25, 1997 at 14:59:47:
In Reply to: [5]2nd avenue elevated posted by Zack on June 25, 1997 at
01:23:59:
it suck it is slow it blows
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NEXT>2377
PREVIOUS>2360
POSTER>Peter Rosa
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: NYC Subway Service Changes
DATE>Jul 9 19:52:38 1997
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Posted by Peter Rosa on June 25, 1997 at 16:11:29:
In Reply to: [6]NYC Subway Service Changes posted by Todd Glickman on
June 25, 1997 at 09:10:05:
[re MTA Web site listing service changes]
I agree with you that the site does serve a useful purpose. What's
really needed, however, is a better way of communicating unscheduled
delays, re-routings etc. to riders. Station PA announcements are
frequently (usually?) inaudible, and the booth clerks may not have
much information themselves. I know there's *supposedly* a program in
progress to upgrade the PA systems - I'll believe it when I see, er,
hear it :-)
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NEXT>2409
PREVIOUS>2374
POSTER>M.J.S.
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: 2nd avenue elevated
DATE>Jul 9 19:52:39 1997
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Posted by M.J.S. on June 25, 1997 at 17:17:24:
In Reply to: [6]2nd avenue elevated posted by Zack on June 25, 1997 at
01:23:59:
Please, PLEASE get a spell checker.
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NEXT>2378
PREVIOUS>2375
POSTER>M.J.S.
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: NYC Subway Service Changes
DATE>Jul 9 19:52:41 1997
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Posted by M.J.S. on June 25, 1997 at 17:22:27:
In Reply to: [6]Re: NYC Subway Service Changes posted by Peter Rosa on
June 25, 1997 at 16:11:29:
The PA at Prospect Park D/Q and at Atlantic Ave. D/Q are great. I see
new PAs going in a t Chambers/WTC A/C/E.
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NEXT>2379
PREVIOUS>2377
POSTER>M.J.S.
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: NYC Subway Service Changes
DATE>Jul 9 19:52:42 1997
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Posted by M.J.S. on June 25, 1997 at 17:22:31:
In Reply to: [6]Re: NYC Subway Service Changes posted by Peter Rosa on
June 25, 1997 at 16:11:29:
The PA at Prospect Park D/Q and at Atlantic Ave. D/Q are great. I see
new PAs going in at Chambers/WTC A/C/E.
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NEXT>2395
PREVIOUS>2378
POSTER>M.J.S.
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: NYC Subway Service Changes
DATE>Jul 9 19:52:43 1997
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Posted by M.J.S. on June 25, 1997 at 17:22:38:
In Reply to: [6]Re: NYC Subway Service Changes posted by Peter Rosa on
June 25, 1997 at 16:11:29:
The PA at Prospect Park D/Q and at Atlantic Ave. D/Q are great. I see
new PAs going in at Chambers/WTC A/C/E.
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NEXT>2382
PREVIOUS>2359
POSTER>subway-buff
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Extra route on L line
DATE>Jul 9 19:52:44 1997
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Posted by subway-buff on June 25, 1997 at 17:30:35:
In Reply to: [6]Re: Extra route on L line posted by John on June 24,
1997 at 23:58:30:
The track connections still exist.On 6/14/97, The L train ran from the
Jamaica bound Track of the J line to Rockaway parkway on the L Line
due to track work.
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NEXT>2394
PREVIOUS>2367
POSTER>Ron
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Cities with Elevateds
DATE>Jul 9 19:52:45 1997
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Posted by Ron on June 25, 1997 at 17:45:16:
In Reply to: [6]Cities with Elevateds posted by Timothy on June 24,
1997 at 19:44:05:
Boston fine system of very interesting elevated lines indeed. They are
generally as old as the ones in New York and include full train-type
vehicles (Washington Street) as well as streetcar lines with shapr
turns (North Starion) and hybrids (the dual power system to
Wonderland, elevated at the Airport). Since you asked.
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NEXT>2396
PREVIOUS>2380
POSTER>John of Calgary
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Extra route on L line
DATE>Jul 9 19:52:47 1997
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Posted by John of Calgary on June 25, 1997 at 18:25:40:
In Reply to: [5]Re: Extra route on L line posted by subway-buff on
June 25, 1997 at 17:30:35:
What do you mean by the L running on the Jamaica bound J track to
Rockaway Parkway?
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NEXT>2386
PREVIOUS>2342
POSTER>John of Calgary
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: RE: New Routes & Stuff
DATE>Jul 9 19:52:48 1997
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Posted by John of Calgary on June 25, 1997 at 18:32:28:
In Reply to: [5]Re: RE: New Routes & Stuff posted by John on June 25,
1997 at 00:13:30:
If the MTA could build something called a crossover that would connect
the Northbound express track with the Northbound local track north of
Spring Street, then the 4 and 5 can connect to BleekeR, STUPID!
Or even better: abandon Bleeker and forget about it!
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NEXT>2455
PREVIOUS>2352
POSTER>John of Calgary
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Second Avenue Subway
DATE>Jul 9 19:52:49 1997
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Posted by John of Calgary on June 25, 1997 at 19:15:01:
In Reply to: [5]Re: Second Avenue Subway posted by Ted Nielsen on June
24, 1997 at 13:09:32:
It's good. But it should have a little improvements here and there.
Here's some pointers:
1. Start in Coney Island.
2. Travel up the Brighton Line
3. Turn onto the Franklin Shuttle Route.
4. Build connection between the Franklin S and the A and C.
5. Follow A and C route until High Street
6. Build tunnel across East River or go onto the Brooklyn
Bridge.(Build lower deck!)
7. Go up 2nd Avenue. Connecting with these route along the way:
- Grand Street(B,D,Q) and East Broadway(F) with a passageway.
- 1 Avenue(L) with an another passageway.
- 42 Street Grand Central(S,4,5,6,7) with an another passageway.
- Lexington/3 Avenues(E,F,6) and 59 Street(4,5,6) and Lexington
Avenue(B,Q) with 3 passageways
8. Make 2 branches. One to the Bronx and the other to LaGuardia
Airport
And you should get the rest of the picture. Do you?
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NEXT>2391
PREVIOUS>2370
POSTER>John of Calgary
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: theGold Card
DATE>Jul 9 19:52:51 1997
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Posted by John of Calgary on June 25, 1997 at 19:20:18:
In Reply to: [5]theGold Card posted by lou on June 25, 1997 at
10:04:28:
Well, what the darn is the deal with these MetroCard Gold? What does
it do? Huh? What's the dif from the blue Metrocard?
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NEXT>2387
PREVIOUS>2383
POSTER>John of Calgary
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: RE: New Routes & Stuff
DATE>Jul 9 19:52:52 1997
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Posted by John of Calgary on June 25, 1997 at 19:33:44:
In Reply to: [5]Re: RE: New Routes & Stuff posted by John on June 25,
1997 at 00:13:30:
Hey, pal, watch it! Although I live like 3,000 kilometers from New
York, I know your subway system pretty well. (Due to the fact I
visited your city last summer.
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NEXT>2388
PREVIOUS>2386
POSTER>John of Calgary
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: RE: New Routes & Stuff
DATE>Jul 9 19:52:53 1997
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Posted by John of Calgary on June 25, 1997 at 19:55:07:
In Reply to: [5]Re: RE: New Routes & Stuff posted by John of Calgary
on June 25, 1997 at 18:32:28:
Do you want a more general explanation?
Here it is!
- D and Q go between Coney Island and 179 Street Jamaica at all times.
- F will go between 205 Street Norwood and Coney Island in the place
of the D.
- C go from Bedford Park Boulevard to Far Rockaway and run the A
between 207 Street Inwood and Rockaway Park at all times except
weekends when the C goes to the WTC.
- J and M trade places in Queens. (J in Metropolitian and M to Jamaica
Center)
- G go from Jamaica Center to Coney Island except weekends when it
goes from Queens Plaza to Smith/9th Streets.
- 1 and 9 trade places with 2 and 3. (1 from 242 Street, Bronx to New
Lots Avenue and 9 from 242 Street, Bronx to Flatbush and 2 from 241
Street, Bronx to South Ferry and 3 from 148 Street, Manhattan to South
Ferry. At nights and weekends, 1 switches with 2 and 3 switches with
9)
- Abandon Bleeker Street and turn it into a storage area or a museum.
- the Rockaway S will start at Euclid Avenue and end at Rockaway Park
at all times except weekends when it replaces the C.
- Run the 4 between Pelham Bay Park and Bowling Green/Brooklyn Bridge.
- Run the 6 between Dyre Avenue and Flatbush AT ALL TIMES.
- Run the 5 between Woodlawn and Utica Avenue AT ALL TIMES.
That's all. I hope you understand now.
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NEXT>2402
PREVIOUS>2387
POSTER>John of Calgary
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: RE: New Routes & Stuff
DATE>Jul 9 19:52:54 1997
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Posted by John of Calgary on June 25, 1997 at 19:58:32:
In Reply to: [5]Re: RE: New Routes & Stuff posted by John of Calgary
on June 25, 1997 at 19:55:07:
Oh yeah. build the Northbound Lexington Avenue Local past
Broadway/LaFayette Avenue.
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NEXT>2392
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>System Operator
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Electrical Power Dept. Power Substations.
DATE>Jul 9 19:52:55 1997
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Posted by System Operator on June 25, 1997 at 21:00:32:
Any body have any stories to tell about Operations and Maintenance of
Power Substations. I have 33 years on the job with the NYC Transit, I
started working at Parkville S/S Brooklyn,in 1964. I seen the Rotaries
at thier finest hour to thier replacement with Solid State Rectifiers.
From local control at the substation level to remote operation from
the Power Control Center at midtown NYC. All comments are welcome.
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NEXT>
PREVIOUS>2351
POSTER>Jim
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Salaries
DATE>Jul 9 19:52:57 1997
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Posted by Jim on June 25, 1997 at 21:01:45:
In Reply to: [5]Salaries posted by David L. on June 25, 1997 at
01:37:13:
On the NYCT system, hourly wages range from $16.10 1/2 per hour to
approximately $22.00 per hour fpr the hourly titles. Cleaners are at
the lower end while Electronic Equipment Maintainers and Road Car
Inspectors are at the high end. Of course, new hires come in at about
70% of those rates and get periodic increases. Also there are payments
for night differential and holiday pay.
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NEXT>
PREVIOUS>2385
POSTER>Andrew Huie
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: theGold Card
DATE>Jul 9 19:52:58 1997
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Posted by Andrew Huie on June 25, 1997 at 21:02:09:
In Reply to: [6]Re: theGold Card posted by John of Calgary on June 25,
1997 at 19:20:18:
AFAIK, I think the new card incorporates one or two features that were
probably added on after the blue cards were issued-for instance, up to
4 free transfers per card. Remember when the transit police threw a
fit because someone used their (blue) card to let someone else through
a turnstile? I think someone then realized that a person might use
their own card to let multiple people have free transfers - say, a
family for instance. The blue cards, as designed probably couldn't
handle it, so they issued the gold cards to distinguish the new
"version".
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NEXT>
PREVIOUS>2389
POSTER>Steve
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Electrical Power Dept. Power Substations.
DATE>Jul 9 19:52:59 1997
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Posted by Steve on June 25, 1997 at 21:03:48:
In Reply to: [5]Electrical Power Dept. Power Substations. posted by
System Operator on June 25, 1997 at 21:00:32:
33 years on the job ??? MORE POWER TO YOU......
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NEXT>2400
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: suggested connection between Grand and E Bway (was: Second Avenue
DATE>Jul 9 19:53:00 1997
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In Reply to: [6]Re: Second Avenue Subway posted by John of Calgary on
June 25, 1997 at 19:15:01:
Um, the distance between Grand Street and East Broadway is really
pretty far. I sincerely doubt it would be practical. Hell,
Delancey/Essex or even Bowery is closer to Grand Street.
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NEXT>2403
PREVIOUS>2381
POSTER>Andrew Byler
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Cities with Elevateds
DATE>Jul 9 19:53:02 1997
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Posted by Andrew Byler on June 25, 1997 at 21:45:53:
In Reply to: [6]Cities with Elevateds posted by Timothy on June 24,
1997 at 19:44:05:
Since very few cities actually ever had elevated railways, very few
still exist. The grand total for the United States was New York,
Philadelphia, Boston, Chicago, and Sioux City (or maybe it was Sioux
Falls - I always get them mixed up). Only the former four stil have
vestigaes of their systems.
These are the only cities "real" elevated lines in the tradition of
steel structures running directly over the streets. Modern
construction in any number of cities doesn't count as an el line by
any true meaning of the word.
New York has long ago lost a number of its els, most prominently the
following:
In Manhattan
2nd Ave.
3rd Ave. (both to a mythical 2nd Ave. subway)
6th Ave. (to the 6th Ave. subway)
9th Ave. (to the 8th Ave. subway)
In the Bronx
3rd Ave.
9th Ave. connection to Jerome Ave.
In Brooklyn
Myrtle Ave. (part)
Lexington Ave.
Fulton Ave. (to Fulton Ave. subway)
Jamaica (part - to new subway)
3rd/5th Ave. (to 4th Ave. subway)
Culver Line (part)
Philadelphia lost:
Market St. 23rd St. to 45th St. (to new subway)
Front St. portal to Girard Ave. (to highway median)
The Camden Ferries Branch
Two block section of Philadelphia and Western (Norristown High Speed
Line)
Boston lost its entire elevated Orange line (Washington Ave.)
Chicago lost:
Congress St. (to a highway median)
Stock Yards Branch (to abandonment)
The Paulina St. Branch to the northwest (new subway)
Sioux Falls is entirely abandoned.
Long sections of traditional el remain only in New York, Chicago, and
Philadelphia.
Overseas, the only el I've ever seen was in Berlin on the first U-bahn
lines. Does anyone know if London or Paris have any real els (or any
other cities for that matter)?
Andy
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NEXT>2426
PREVIOUS>2379
POSTER>David L.
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: NYC Subway Service Changes
DATE>Jul 9 19:53:04 1997
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Posted by David L. on June 25, 1997 at 22:56:23:
In Reply to: [5]Re: NYC Subway Service Changes posted by Peter Rosa on
June 25, 1997 at 16:11:29:
The PA system on the Queens Blvd line from Elmhurst Ave to 179 St are
pretty good. They are all very new. In addition to hearing what they
are saying, there is also a LCD display which displays what exactly is
being said over the PA system. Right now they are still working on the
PA system from Roosevelt Ave to Queens Plaza- the speakers and LCD
displays are up but they aren't connected to the system yet.
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NEXT>2399
PREVIOUS>2382
POSTER>David L.
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Extra route on L line
DATE>Jul 9 19:53:05 1997
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Posted by David L. on June 25, 1997 at 23:26:42:
In Reply to: [5]Re: Extra route on L line posted by John of Calgary on
June 25, 1997 at 18:25:40:
There's a track connection between the J and L lines at the Broadway
Junction. In other words- a L train running on the J line ran north to
Broadway-E. New York, then switched onto the Canarsie line heading to
Rockaway Parkway
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NEXT>2405
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>Brian
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>TTC and STCUM (Montreal and Toronto subway systems)
DATE>Jul 9 19:53:06 1997
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Posted by Brian on June 26, 1997 at 00:42:54:
I have been away for a week, in Montreal and Toronto. I love both the
cities, both are much nicer than any US city. The people in both
cities are very nice.
About the transit systems, I have to say that the STCUM system is not
very efficient. Are they still running the origional cars? The only
thing I like about them is that some of them have a news ticker, which
helps pass the time. Also, why do they use rubber tires? It is the
only major system in the world that is completely underground. This
makes it very difficult to build anything new in the system. I also
hear they are falling apart, with problems such as leaks. The subways
also usually left me quite far from where I wanted to go, and the
buses, with few exceptions run rarely. The people only pay 45% of the
system's funds, which is what it should be. More should be available
at those fares with that funding (Although the $12 3 day pass was a
great bargain).
Desp
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NEXT>2469
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>Brian
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: TTC and STCUM (This is the Toronto one)
DATE>Jul 9 19:53:07 1997
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Posted by Brian on June 26, 1997 at 00:49:00:
In Reply to: [6]TTC and STCUM (Montreal and Toronto subway systems)
posted by Brian on June 26, 1997 at 00:42:54:
Sorry, I hit the post button by accident.
The Toronto system is much more efficient. Despite only two lines, it
took me where I wanted to go, and the service is very frequent. Also,
it is much quieter than the rubber tires in Montreal. The trolleys and
buses are also very efficient, and run often. Amazingly, this is done
with almost no state funding, as the riders pay 80%.
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NEXT>2404
PREVIOUS>2396
POSTER>John of Calgary
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Extra route on L line
DATE>Jul 9 19:53:09 1997
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Posted by John of Calgary on June 26, 1997 at 01:08:29:
In Reply to: [5]Re: Extra route on L line posted by David L. on June
25, 1997 at 23:26:42:
I still don't get it. Do you mean that the L train terminates at B'Way
Jct., then uses the J line to make a U turn?
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NEXT>2414
PREVIOUS>2393
POSTER>
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: suggested connection between Grand and E Bway (was: Second Avenue
DATE>Jul 9 19:53:10 1997
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In Reply to: [5]Re: suggested connection between Grand and E Bway
(was: Second Avenue Subway) posted by Andrew Huie on June 25, 1997 at
21:38:52:
Why not try building a tunnel that can accomodate s shuttle train that
could connect them. Ah, hell, never mind.
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NEXT>
PREVIOUS>2205
POSTER>John of Calgary
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Javits Center Service Idea
DATE>Jul 9 19:53:11 1997
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Posted by John of Calgary on June 26, 1997 at 01:16:26:
In Reply to: [5]Re: Javits Center Service Idea posted by Mark S
Feinman on June 20, 1997 at 13:21:38:
So you mean extending the L to Javits Center is better than extending
the 7, right?
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NEXT>2418
PREVIOUS>2388
POSTER>John of Calgary
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: RE: New Routes & Stuff
DATE>Jul 9 19:53:12 1997
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Posted by John of Calgary on June 26, 1997 at 01:20:49:
In Reply to: [5]Re: RE: New Routes & Stuff posted by John of Calgary
on June 25, 1997 at 19:58:32:
One more comment. In Brooklyn, have the Broadway/7 Av.'s run as an
Express and the Lexington Av.'s run as a local.
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NEXT>2423
PREVIOUS>2394
POSTER>John of Calgary
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Cities with Elevateds
DATE>Jul 9 19:53:13 1997
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Posted by John of Calgary on June 26, 1997 at 01:28:57:
In Reply to: [5]Re: Cities with Elevateds posted by John on June 24,
1997 at 23:53:56:
Like, duh. We KNOW that! And someone says its abandoned too.
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NEXT>2412
PREVIOUS>2399
POSTER>irv
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Extra route on L line
DATE>Jul 9 19:53:15 1997
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Posted by irv on June 26, 1997 at 03:44:42:
In Reply to: [6]Re: Extra route on L line posted by Dan on June 25,
1997 at 08:30:48:
Are these the same tracks that run under the 7 line at about 65th or
74th street?
Is the route of any use to the MTA and could it be tied into an
existing line to provide passenger serivce?
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NEXT>2413
PREVIOUS>2397
POSTER>Sam
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: TTC and STCUM (Montreal and Toronto subway systems)
DATE>Jul 9 19:53:16 1997
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Posted by Sam on June 26, 1997 at 03:53:32:
In Reply to: [6]TTC and STCUM (Montreal and Toronto subway systems)
posted by Brian on June 26, 1997 at 00:42:54:
The nicest cars I've been on are in Barcelona. The State-owned Railway
de Catalunya has easy-back, upholstered seats for trips that take no
more than 20-30 minutes to complete. Another railway, RENFE has
easy-backs too. The 5 lined-subway is mostly air conditioned and
automated so far as announcing stops. Signs are clear. However, even
at connecting stations, lines are miles apart. Whereas in New York the
Lex and Flushing lines are on top of each other, lineás 1 and 3 (red
and green) are at least two long blocks apart underground at such key
stations as Plaça de Espanya and Plaça de Catalunya. It makes a trip
longer. Also, to transfer between rail companies you have to buy
another ticket or buy a daily ticket for 550 ptas.
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NEXT>2442
PREVIOUS>2371
POSTER>Charles Fiori
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: New York City Bus (RTS)
DATE>Jul 9 19:53:17 1997
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Posted by Charles Fiori on June 26, 1997 at 08:17:05:
In Reply to: [5]Re: New York City Bus (RTS) posted by Wayne Johnson on
June 25, 1997 at 13:49:24:
Somewhere I have a list of what is on that sign. Barring that I could
re-write the listing, but that's a longer-term project. Feel free to
remind me if you do not hear anything. I also have a sign, which I
bought at the old Broadway Limited antiques shop on w. 33d, which is
in red cloth. Front sign from one of the first fishbowls, and the only
ones to have actual split front signs. Great readings like Orchard
Beach, City Island, and FREEDOMLAND!!! Probably one of the few with
which I'd never part.
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NEXT>2408
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>Nick
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>R110 a&b-Still in operation on same line?
DATE>Jul 9 19:53:18 1997
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Posted by Nick on June 26, 1997 at 10:26:53:
Just one more question about these cars! Is the r110a still running as
the #2, and is the R110b still the A train? If not, which line(s) are
they running on, if their still running at all. Also, do they operate
on a regular basis? THANK YOU-NICK
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NEXT>2411
PREVIOUS>2407
POSTER>Nick
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>R110 a&b-Still in operation on same line?
DATE>Jul 9 19:53:20 1997
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Posted by Nick on June 26, 1997 at 10:27:13:
Just one more question about these cars! Is the r110a still running as
the #2, and is the R110b still the A train? If not, which line(s) are
they running on, if their still running at all. Also, do they operate
on a regular basis? THANK YOU-NICK
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NEXT>2424
PREVIOUS>2376
POSTER>Brian
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: 2nd avenue elevated
DATE>Jul 9 19:53:21 1997
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Posted by Brian on June 26, 1997 at 12:49:30:
In Reply to: [6]Re: 2nd avenue elevated posted by Nathan on June 25,
1997 at 02:46:32:
It sounds like a great idea. I would be able to look at trains,
instead of traffic jams, when looking out of my apartment. If this can
be done relatively inexpensively, go for it. However, where would this
run? Otherwise, at least build a light rail line on Second av., either
as an el or on the street separated from cars. (My post at the top
will tell you my two light rail plans)
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NEXT>2477
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>Brian
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>2nd Av. Light Rail idea
DATE>Jul 9 19:53:22 1997
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Posted by Brian on June 26, 1997 at 13:10:48:
I have an idea for a Light Rail line to be run on 2nd Av., instead of
the 2nd Av. subway, which will never happen.
Note: Transfers to other lines are in parentheses.
Via elevated tracks
Yankee Stadium to 23rd st. and 12th Av. (Chelsea Piers)
It would run down 161st St to 3rd Av from River Av. (C,D,4). Then run
it down 3rd Av., stopping at 161st, 149th,(2 5) and 138th (6). Then it
would cross the river on the 3rd Av. bridge, and go over to Second Av.
It would stop at 125th, 116th, 106th, 96th, 86th, 79th, 72nd, 59th,
50th, and 42nd on Second Av. Build a branch over to first Av. to go
past the UN, stopping in front of it before meeting the 2nd Av. branch
at 41st and 2nd. After this, it would go down 41st, stopping at
Lexington (4,5,6,7,S), 6th (B,D,F,Q,7), 8th (1,2,3,9,7,S,N,R,A,C,E),
and 10th. Then it would go down 11th, stopping at the Javits Center at
38th, 34th, and 23rd. This would allow a high speed second Av. line,
at a lower cost than the subway. Also, light rail is generally quiet,
and concrete els make it very quiet to begin with. Also, this would
replace the 42nd St. trolley idea.
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NEXT>2428
PREVIOUS>2408
POSTER>John
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: R110 a&b-Still in operation on same line?
DATE>Jul 9 19:53:24 1997
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Posted by John on June 26, 1997 at 14:05:17:
In Reply to: [5]R110 a&b-Still in operation on same line? posted by
Nick on June 26, 1997 at 10:27:13:
I have never seen these cars in service, but I assume that they are
still in service. I think they are used only during the rush hours and
on the #2 and A, but I'm not sure about any other lines.
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NEXT>2419
PREVIOUS>2404
POSTER>John
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Extra route on L line
DATE>Jul 9 19:53:25 1997
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Posted by John on June 26, 1997 at 14:14:30:
In Reply to: [5]Re: Extra route on L line posted by John of Calgary on
June 26, 1997 at 01:08:29:
No, man. Here. Picture this: You have two intersecting lines. The left
side of the horizontal line is Manhattan and the right side is
Jamaica. On the vertical line, the bottom is Canarsie. The
intersection is Broadway Junction. The L train is on the horizontal
line, going left to right. At the intersection, it turns and heads to
the bottom of the vertical line. Look at a subway map and try to use
this analogy and you'll understand.
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NEXT>2417
PREVIOUS>2405
POSTER>Dan Casey
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: TTC and STCUM (Montreal and Toronto subway systems)
DATE>Jul 9 19:53:26 1997
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Posted by Dan Casey on June 26, 1997 at 14:15:38:
In Reply to: [6]TTC and STCUM (Montreal and Toronto subway systems)
posted by Brian on June 26, 1997 at 00:42:54:
Running below ground means that you don't have to handle winter
weather, which is no small benefit in Montreal. Try waiting on an
unheated el platform in Chicago and you'll see what I mean. Even with
cutbacks and whatnot, the Metro is far from falling apart; it's quite
well maintained by American standards. As for leaks, they'll happen
anytime an underground structure reaches a certain age.
It's not designed as a New York-style system that will get you
absolutely everywhere, but more along the lines of the DC Metro; a
more regional system that ties together large chunks of the city and
serves major destinations. Not a good system for short hops, but fast
and smooth for long distances. Bus connections are excellent and
frequent, in my experience. It's not the most baroque transit system
in the world, and its aesthetics leave something to be desired, but it
provides better service than you'll find most places.
-Dan Casey
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NEXT>
PREVIOUS>2400
POSTER>
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: suggested connection between Grand and E Bway (was: Second Avenue
DATE>Jul 9 19:53:27 1997
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In Reply to: [5]Re: suggested connection between Grand and E Bway
(was: Second Avenue Subway) posted by John of Calgary on June 26, 1997
at 01:12:45:
If the line were to connect at Franklin Avenue to the A line, why not
have a branch from there running nonstop to Kennedy Airport?
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NEXT>2474
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>Timothy
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>9th Ave. Elevated
DATE>Jul 9 19:53:29 1997
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Posted by Timothy on June 26, 1997 at 14:24:16:
Does anyone know if there are any books available on the 9th Ave.
Elevated?
I do own books on the 2nd and 3rd Ave. Els, but haven't seen any on
the
6th or 9th Ave. Els. Also, Where can I get photos of 9th Ave. El
stations?
I heard that the stations were very ornate, similar to the ones on the
3rd
Ave. El.
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NEXT>
PREVIOUS>2335
POSTER>
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: TTC Ugly Stations, Vancouver, everything else, life story, was Re:
DATE>Jul 9 19:53:30 1997
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In Reply to: [5]Re: TTC Ugly Stations, Vancouver, everything else,
life story, was Re: Toronto H-6's posted by John of Calgary on June
24, 1997 at 20:47:49:
It could be connected via the Skywalk system running over the current
Union station, which would make it easy for commuters to connect with
the downtown core office buildings, like BCE place, attractions, like
SkyDome, or hotels, like the Royal York. Or, there could be a large
mezzanine overlooking the station that would connect the people with
the surface. Right now, that is the main problem. You have to zig and
zag in order to get to where you want to go. Nothing is direct or
certain. Because many of the buildings were built at different times,
there are now conflicts in entrances and underground walkways. There
has to be a structured, organized pathway made to get people around.
The existing station is too small and ostracized from the main Union
Station to be of any use as anything except storage for the TTC.
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NEXT>2425
PREVIOUS>2413
POSTER>Bingo
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: TTC and STCUM (Montreal and Toronto subway systems)
DATE>Jul 9 19:53:31 1997
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Posted by Bingo on June 26, 1997 at 15:38:47:
In Reply to: [5]TTC and STCUM (Montreal and Toronto subway systems)
posted by Brian on June 26, 1997 at 00:42:54:
Urbain-Montreal also has some of the nicest station architecture I
have seen since I went to Paris. You may recall Angrignon, Verdun and
Jean-Talon stations, which are my favorites.
The system has not bought new stock since 1973 ( the line opened in
1966 ) They were supposed to in 1983, but that fell through. For what
reason, I haven't a clue, but I can tell you this. They need new stock
badly, really really badly (although I wouldn't say that the system is
falling apart. Far from it, from what I've seen of certain unnameable
MTA stations)
Toronto and Montreal also have the cheapest CD's in North America. I
hope you took advantage of this during your visit.
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NEXT>2453
PREVIOUS>2402
POSTER>Gerry O'Regan
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: RE: New Routes & Stuff
DATE>Jul 9 19:53:32 1997
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Posted by Gerry O'Regan on June 26, 1997 at 16:20:32:
In Reply to: [6]Re: RE: New Routes & Stuff posted by John of Calgary
on June 26, 1997 at 01:20:49:
First lets think for a minute about the design of the system. The way
it was set up when the Dual Contracts extensions were constructed in
the teens was that Lexington trains become Brooklyn Expresses and 7th
Av. trains become Brooklyn Locals. Although there are crossovers at
various locations the most important at Atlantic it would be very
awkward to cross every train from express to local or vice-versa at
that location. Sooner or later a signal would be run and the press
would have a field day with another wreck! Thus the Lex express has to
run at least one of its services express to Utica with the option of
an extended run to New Lots. Likewise, both 7th Av. expresses have to
run local in Brooklyn since only the local tracks can access the
Flatbush branch easily, and some service as local to Utica is needed.
When the 5 is extended into Brooklyn it must use a crossover to reach
Flatbush and must be dovetailed with two other services. This is why
it usually terminates in Manhattan.
As far as route numbers are concerned, they designate the northern
terminal and have little to do with the routing in Manhattan. Ie: 1/9
= 242-Broadway., 2 = 241-White Plains Rd., 3 = Lenox Terminal, 4 =
Woodlawn, 5 = Dyre Av., 6 = 177 or Pelham. 1 & 3 have to run West Side
and 4 and 6 have to run East Side. 2 and 5 can swap but both the 2 and
4 as Brooklyn Expresses would never work since the shorter 3 and 5
runs would not generate enough business in the Bronx to justify the
necessary headways on the Brooklyn end. Thus things are pretty much
cast in concrete with the exception of which train goes on which
Brooklyn Branch. (The 2&3 swapped south terminals a few years ago.
Now on the IND side, again the designations are related to where the
train is going. ACE is Eighth Av, BDF is Sixth Av, G is BQ Crosstown.
AB means Washington Heights, CD means Concourse, EF means Queens
Everything Else is BMT - but now the southern destination counts. J is
Jamaica Av., L is Carnasie, M is Myrtle, N is Sea Beach, Q is
Brighton, R is Fourth Av. Local, T is West End.
With that in hand, it doesn't matter whether a BMT route takes Sixth
Av. or Broadway in Manhattan unless it's going to Astoria. Thus a
routing from CI via Sea Beach to the Queens Line local tracks is an N
but if it comes from 95th St. its an R. Thus your suggestion re:
Astoria just undoes a terminal swap of a few years ago and leaves the
R without a convenient yard (which is why the swap was done).
"-Run G from 179 Street Jamaica to Stillwell Ave. Coney Island. as a
Local and have F run on the Brighton Line. (D/Q line) and move the Q
onto the Culver Line (F line) as an Express."
-Run D to 205 Street Norwood to Coney lsland RUSH HOURS ONLY! Other
times, the D goes to 21 Street Queensbridge. Q will go to 179 Street
Jamaica AT ALL TIMES!
Putting the F on the Brighton Line and the Q on Culver will create its
own set of problems. Since you seem to indicate that both the N and
the G will run local to 179th St., that leaves the F as an express.
Since it is now running from Brighton it becomes a 6th Av. Express
which may require use of the crossovers between 42 and 47-50 to
straighten things out. Not Good at Rush Hour. Now what was the Q has a
problem, since south of Church it can only be a one way express and
north of Bergen it has to run local. And since it is no longer a
Brighton train it isn't the Q anymore either. In fact there is no
present BMT designation for the Culver line, so maybe we will
ressurect the letter H and use that, since it is really an all IND
routing.
Planning services for a system as complex as NYCT required familiarity
with the track map, ridership patterns and general geography. Try
small changes and you will get more positive responses.
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NEXT>2420
PREVIOUS>2412
POSTER>Garfield
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Extra route on L line
DATE>Jul 9 19:53:34 1997
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Posted by Garfield on June 26, 1997 at 16:32:20:
In Reply to: [6]Re: Extra route on L line posted by z on June 25, 1997
at 06:02:01:
That just maybe a bad idea and a waste of money. I've rode the L train
a few times before and thought that it does not transport a heavy load
of riders. I honestly think that the MTA should provide express
service from Marcy Ave to Eastern Pkwy on the J/Z line. This would
defintely ease congestion on both the Queens Blvd line (E,F,G,R) and
the Fulton line (A,C). This was the main reason why the MTA brought
"skip-stop" service for the J when it use to ride alone.
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NEXT>2422
PREVIOUS>2419
POSTER>Garfield
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Extra route on L line
DATE>Jul 9 19:53:35 1997
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Posted by Garfield on June 26, 1997 at 16:38:13:
In Reply to: [6]Re: Extra route on L line posted by z on June 25, 1997
at 06:02:01:
That just maybe a bad idea and a waste of money. I've rode the L train
a few times before and thought that it does not transport a heavy load
of riders. I honestly think that the MTA should provide express
service from Marcy Ave to Eastern Pkwy on the J/Z line. This would
defintely ease congestion on both the Queens Blvd line (E,F,G,R) and
the Fulton line (A,C). This was the main reason why the MTA brought
"skip-stop" service for the J when it use to ride alone.
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NEXT>2433
PREVIOUS>2323
POSTER>Garfield
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: R-44s Off the A Line
DATE>Jul 9 19:53:36 1997
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Posted by Garfield on June 26, 1997 at 16:44:49:
In Reply to: [5]Re: R-44s Off the A Line posted by Lou on June 24,
1997 at 18:33:53:
I prefer the newer "silverbirds" I'm not really sure of the model
numbers. But I think that there much faster and have better air
conditioning.
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NEXT>2429
PREVIOUS>2420
POSTER>Gerry O'Regan
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Extra route on L line
DATE>Jul 9 19:53:38 1997
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Posted by Gerry O'Regan on June 26, 1997 at 16:50:39:
In Reply to: [6]Re: Extra route on L line posted by John on June 26,
1997 at 14:14:30:
In other words, instead of having come from its normal terminal at
14th St. and 8th Av. a diversion caused an L train to run out the J/Z
line structure and then divert onto its normal route.
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NEXT>2434
PREVIOUS>2403
POSTER>Gerry O'Regan
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Cities with Elevateds
DATE>Jul 9 19:53:39 1997
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Posted by Gerry O'Regan on June 26, 1997 at 17:06:01:
In Reply to: [6]Cities with Elevateds posted by Timothy on June 24,
1997 at 19:44:05:
Boston's Orange Line north of downtown was abandoned in 1975.
Boston's Orange Line south of downtown was abandoned in 1987.
The interconnection along Atlantic Av. was abandoned in 1938 and
removed in 1942, though a small section was retained for car storage
until 1955.
A former connection to the Tremont St. Subway south of downtown was
abandoned in 1908 and removed ca. 1935.
The Red Line has a short el east of Charles/MGH station.
The Blue Line has a short el at Beachmont Station.(rebuilt in 1994)
(Nothing at Airport)
The Green Line (light rail) is elevated from just outside Haymarket to
just outside Lechmere. Section between Haymarket and Northstation is
brand new open deck el with highway ramp above on double deck
structure. Connects to old structure over Causeway St. Remainder is
concrete deck steel structure except for ornamental concrete viaduct
over Charles River. Section from east of Science Park to Haymarket to
be replaced with subway in a few years. The remainder will survive.
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NEXT>2479
PREVIOUS>2409
POSTER>Gerry O'Regan
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: 2nd avenue elevated
DATE>Jul 9 19:53:40 1997
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Posted by Gerry O'Regan on June 26, 1997 at 17:12:01:
In Reply to: [6]Re: 2nd avenue elevated posted by Brian on June 26,
1997 at 12:49:30:
I have never heard a concrete deck structure that was quieter than an
open deck structure!
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NEXT>
PREVIOUS>2417
POSTER>Brian
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: TTC and STCUM (Montreal and Toronto subway systems)
DATE>Jul 9 19:53:41 1997
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Posted by Brian on June 26, 1997 at 17:17:49:
In Reply to: [6]Re: TTC and STCUM (Montreal and Toronto subway
systems) posted by Dan Casey on June 26, 1997 at 14:15:38:
Yes, I do understand the advantage of avoiding the snow, but would you
rather have an el or no train?
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NEXT>
PREVIOUS>2395
POSTER>Gerry O'Regan
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: NYC Subway Service Changes
DATE>Jul 9 19:53:43 1997
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Posted by Gerry O'Regan on June 26, 1997 at 17:18:18:
In Reply to: [6]Re: NYC Subway Service Changes posted by M.J.S. on
June 25, 1997 at 17:22:38:
Every time I hear a PA announcer who mumbles I suggest that he/she get
a job in NYC doing station announcements. Waadaaoorseessee = Watch the
doors, please.
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NEXT>
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>Andrew Byler
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Cities with Elevateds (correction for Miami)
DATE>Jul 9 19:53:44 1997
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Posted by Andrew Byler on June 26, 1997 at 19:30:31:
In Reply to: [6]Re: Cities with Elevateds posted by Andrew Byler on
June 25, 1997 at 21:45:53:
Actually, i decided my comments need ammending. Of allt he new systems
built, one should qualify as a bonafide el - the Miami line. Although
it is of more mofern concrete construction, it still runs over the
streets, unlike the short elevated sections in places like Washington,
which are not comparable to a traditional el.
Andy
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NEXT>2478
PREVIOUS>2411
POSTER>charles
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: R110 a&b-Still in operation on same line?
DATE>Jul 9 19:53:45 1997
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Posted by charles on June 26, 1997 at 19:32:05:
In Reply to: [6]R110 a&b-Still in operation on same line? posted by
Nick on June 26, 1997 at 10:27:13:
Both of the trains are in service. They operate during non-rush hours
also but to my knowledge not on weekends WHEN THEY ARE CAPABLE OF
SERVICE. I suggest you ask tower operator, they would know.
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NEXT>2430
PREVIOUS>2422
POSTER>John of Calgary
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Extra route on L line
DATE>Jul 9 19:53:46 1997
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Posted by John of Calgary on June 26, 1997 at 20:01:44:
In Reply to: [5]Re: Extra route on L line posted by Gerry O'Regan on
June 26, 1997 at 16:50:39:
Then WHERE did it come from?
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NEXT>2432
PREVIOUS>2429
POSTER>John of Calgary
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Extra route on L line
DATE>Jul 9 19:53:47 1997
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Posted by John of Calgary on June 26, 1997 at 20:07:28:
In Reply to: [5]Re: Extra route on L line posted by Garfield on June
26, 1997 at 16:38:13:
Uh, haven't you heard? they cancelled the J/Z skip stop between Marcy
and Myrtle.
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NEXT>2485
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re:TTC's Yonge-University-Spadina Subway, formerly know as:TTC Ugly
DATE>Jul 9 19:53:49 1997
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In Reply to: [5]Re: TTC Ugly Stations, Vancouver, everything else,
life story, was Re: Toronto H-6's posted by Bingo on June 26, 1997 at
15:28:46:
Then how will the Yonge-University-Spadina subway line run if you
abandon Union Station like the lower level of Bay Station on the
Bloor-Danforth Subway line?
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NEXT>2440
PREVIOUS>2430
POSTER>Steve
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Extra route on L line
DATE>Jul 9 19:53:50 1997
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Posted by Steve on June 26, 1997 at 20:19:41:
In Reply to: [5]Re: Extra route on L line posted by irv on June 26,
1997 at 03:44:42:
The tracks you are referring to are the Conrail tracks that go north,
over the Hells Gate Bridge into the Bronx. I believe that they do
interconnect with the Bay Ridge Branch somewhere near Fresh pond Road.
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NEXT>2458
PREVIOUS>2421
POSTER>Steve
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: R-44s Off the A Line
DATE>Jul 9 19:53:51 1997
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Posted by Steve on June 26, 1997 at 20:22:08:
In Reply to: [5]Re: R-44s Off the A Line posted by Garfield on June
26, 1997 at 16:44:49:
The NYCT has no eguipment referred to as Silver Birds. THe R-32s, 38s
and 44s are all stainless steel so you'll have to be a bit more
specific.
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NEXT>2464
PREVIOUS>2423
POSTER>Concerned Patron
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Cities with Elevateds
DATE>Jul 9 19:53:52 1997
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Posted by Concerned Patron on June 26, 1997 at 20:27:10:
In Reply to: [5]Re: Cities with Elevateds posted by John of Calgary on
June 26, 1997 at 01:28:57:
Like,shutup,huh!
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NEXT>
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>John of Calgary
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Coney Island Yard
DATE>Jul 9 19:53:53 1997
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Posted by John of Calgary on June 26, 1997 at 20:42:07:
How does the SIRT trains get from the St. George Ferry Terminal
Station to the Coney Island Shop?
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NEXT>
PREVIOUS>2150
POSTER>Sylvain
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: San Jose LRT
DATE>Jul 9 19:53:55 1997
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Posted by Sylvain on June 26, 1997 at 21:11:57:
In Reply to: [6]Re: San Jose LRT posted by Nathan on June 20, 1997 at
12:44:41:
The Los Angles LRVs were made by Nippon Sharyo (the ones on the Ble
Line).
The vehicules from Kawasaki are found in Philadelphia.
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NEXT>2439
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>John of Calgary
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>South Ferry
DATE>Jul 9 19:53:56 1997
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Posted by John of Calgary on June 26, 1997 at 21:23:56:
Can anyone answer this question:
Is South Ferry a loop? Like, when the 1 or the 9 arrives at South
Ferry, it drops off and picks up at the same platform, right? And then
the trains start their journey back to the Bronx?
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NEXT>2449
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>California Mike
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Old New York Subway Routings
DATE>Jul 9 19:53:57 1997
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Posted by California Mike on June 26, 1997 at 21:25:32:
I am fascinated by routings used in NYC Subway before my time, the
early
50's. For instance, there used to be a HH from Court St. in Brooklyn
to
Hoyt-Schermerhorn St. Can any one tell me how I can get this kind of
information?
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NEXT>2456
PREVIOUS>2437
POSTER>David L.
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: South Ferry
DATE>Jul 9 19:53:58 1997
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Posted by David L. on June 26, 1997 at 23:16:37:
In Reply to: [5]South Ferry posted by John of Calgary on June 26, 1997
at 21:23:56:
Yes, South Ferry is a loop. It drops and loads passengers on the same
platform. But that platform is not for a full length car. So only the
first half of the train unloads. People in the last half of the train
have to walk through the cars in order to get to the front, and get
off.
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NEXT>2452
PREVIOUS>2432
POSTER>David L.
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Extra route on L line
DATE>Jul 9 19:53:59 1997
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Posted by David L. on June 26, 1997 at 23:41:47:
In Reply to: [5]Re: Extra route on L line posted by John of Calgary on
June 26, 1997 at 20:07:28:
I still don't understand. Why did the cancel it?!?!? WHY? WHY? WHY?
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NEXT>2445
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>David L.
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Staten Island connection
DATE>Jul 9 19:54:01 1997
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Posted by David L. on June 27, 1997 at 00:03:29:
Why didn't the TA Ever build a subway connection between Brooklyn and
S.I., or Manhattan and S.I.?
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NEXT>2443
PREVIOUS>2406
POSTER>STEVE LOWENTHAL
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: New York City Bus (RTS)
DATE>Jul 9 19:54:02 1997
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Posted by STEVE LOWENTHAL on June 27, 1997 at 01:00:12:
In Reply to: [6]Re: New York City Bus (RTS) posted by Charles Fiori on
June 26, 1997 at 08:17:05:
ANYONE HAVE A COMPLETE LIST OF THE DESTINATION SIGNS.USED DURING THE
FREEDOMLAND ERA ,,IN THE BRONX AND MANHATTAN AND BROOKLYN
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NEXT>2444
PREVIOUS>2442
POSTER>STEVE LOWENTHAL
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: New York City Bus (RTS)
DATE>Jul 9 19:54:03 1997
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Posted by STEVE LOWENTHAL on June 27, 1997 at 01:00:33:
In Reply to: [6]Re: New York City Bus (RTS) posted by Charles Fiori on
June 26, 1997 at 08:17:05:
ANYONE HAVE A COMPLETE LIST OF THE DESTINATION SIGNS.USED DURING THE
FREEDOMLAND ERA ,,IN THE BRONX AND MANHATTAN AND BROOKLYN
,,LOOKING FOR THE EXACT READINGS
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NEXT>
PREVIOUS>2443
POSTER>Charles Fiori
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: New York City Bus (RTS)
DATE>Jul 9 19:54:04 1997
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Posted by Charles Fiori on June 27, 1997 at 06:45:37:
In Reply to: [5]Re: New York City Bus (RTS) posted by STEVE LOWENTHAL
on June 27, 1997 at 01:00:33:
I once wrote down the listings on the red/white sign that I have. At
some point I'll do it again. Remind me.
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NEXT>2446
PREVIOUS>2441
POSTER>RAC93
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Staten Island connection
DATE>Jul 9 19:54:06 1997
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Posted by RAC93 on June 27, 1997 at 06:54:31:
In Reply to: [5]Staten Island connection posted by David L. on June
27, 1997 at 00:03:29:
Money, not enough of it... I'm sure.
I think they were going to use the "R" line around the 95th st.
terminal station in Brooklyn to connect under or on
the veranzano bridge. ( I probably misspelled veranzanno - sorry I
live in
L.A. and last time I went to NYC was in '91). another possibility is
the
opening after 59th st. when the "N" train heads splits from the "R".
I think that they use barges or trucks to move the train cars to the
major
yards for repairs. I think that the 207th yard in manhatten has a dock
for
the train barges. I heard a rumor that on the south brooklyn railway,
there is also a dock for train barges. I think that the S.B. railway
still connects
with the "B" line after 36th st, going towards 9th ave.
If anyone knows more about this, I would like to know too...
PEACE! ! !
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NEXT>2450
PREVIOUS>2445
POSTER>Charles Fiori
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Staten Island connection
DATE>Jul 9 19:54:07 1997
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Posted by Charles Fiori on June 27, 1997 at 08:23:56:
In Reply to: [5]Re: Staten Island connection posted by RAC93 on June
27, 1997 at 06:54:31:
Some weeks back, someone had the same question. Off the south end of
the southbound plat at 59&4, you can see a ramp which would have led
to the underwater connection to Staten Island. As for heavy
maintenance on the SIRTOA R-44s, I thought that was done at St. George
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NEXT>
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>steve lowenthal
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>BRONX.MANHATTAN BUS ROUTE SHORT-TURNS
DATE>Jul 9 19:54:08 1997
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Posted by steve lowenthal on June 27, 1997 at 09:22:30:
Does anyone have any info on short turns for the Bx and Manhattan ,I
know of a few ie--M15 south of houston ,on allen st to return
northbound..Looking for details also please,thank you
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NEXT>
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>steve lowenthal
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>1960 to 1965 destination curtain readings
DATE>Jul 9 19:54:09 1997
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Posted by steve lowenthal on June 27, 1997 at 09:25:22:
does anyone have a list of curtain readings==front signs and side
signs ,readings only for the mabstoa and nycta bus routes circa 1960
to 1965,thank you
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NEXT>2465
PREVIOUS>2438
POSTER>David Pirmann
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Old New York Subway Routings
DATE>Jul 9 19:54:11 1997
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Posted by David Pirmann on June 27, 1997 at 10:21:38:
In Reply to: [6]Old New York Subway Routings posted by California Mike
on June 26, 1997 at 21:25:32:
See: [7]http://www.nycsubway.org/news/nyc/routes.html
and [8]http://www.nycsubway.org/news/nyc/1955exp.html
for some details...
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NEXT>2451
PREVIOUS>2446
POSTER>Lou
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Staten Island connection
DATE>Jul 9 19:54:13 1997
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Posted by Lou on June 27, 1997 at 10:45:39:
In Reply to: [5]Staten Island connection posted by David L. on June
27, 1997 at 00:03:29:
This was actually part of the old Dual Contracts plan of the
1910's.For various reasons,politics,money,etc it never got done...But
this is why the B&O electrified theline in the 20's and ordered cars
that could've (and actually did!) run on the BMT.
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NEXT>2461
PREVIOUS>2450
POSTER>Lou
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Staten Island connection
DATE>Jul 9 19:54:14 1997
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Posted by Lou on June 27, 1997 at 12:02:32:
In Reply to: [5]Staten Island connection posted by David L. on June
27, 1997 at 00:03:29:
This was one of the original plans of the Dual Contracts of the
1910's. It never got done because of the usual reeasons;i.e.
money,politics, etc. Brian Cudahy (in "Under the Sidewalks...") Blames
Mayor John Hylan, wether this is true or not I don't know!!
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NEXT>2457
PREVIOUS>2440
POSTER>Gerry O'Regan
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Extra route on L line
DATE>Jul 9 19:54:15 1997
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Posted by Gerry O'Regan on June 27, 1997 at 12:20:53:
In Reply to: [6]Re: Extra route on L line posted by John of Calgary on
June 26, 1997 at 20:01:44:
Possibilities include Delancy St., Chambers St. or Broad St. on the
Center St. Line, or possibly Sixth Av. to provide a connection with
its normal route at 14th St. Beyond that it could have originated as a
regular service train on the B, D orQ(from either direction), F(from
Queens), N(from Brooklyn), A, C or E (from any North Terminal via the
connection at W. 4th St. or R from either direction. Not to mention
simply diverting a train from the J, M or Z. The possibilities are
endless (though few are likely)!
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NEXT>
PREVIOUS>2418
POSTER>M.J.S.
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: RE: New Routes & Stuff
DATE>Jul 9 19:54:16 1997
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Posted by M.J.S. on June 27, 1997 at 13:00:08:
In Reply to: [6]Re: RE: New Routes & Stuff posted by John of Calgary
on June 25, 1997 at 19:55:07:
All this is so stupid I'm not going to read any more of your
suggestions. You will never get a job planning routes for the MTA.
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NEXT>2487
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>David Pirmann - Web Site Host
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>DELETED POSTS - READ ME NOW
DATE>Jul 9 19:54:18 1997
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Posted by David Pirmann - Web Site Host on June 27, 1997 at
Hello,
I just deleted a bunch of posts about canadian politics that were
getting pretty out of hand. I got some complaints, actually, from
non-Canadians about them. So please, guys up north and everyone else,
please keep the political stuff that doesn't relate to transit away
from here. We don't need to be advocating violence or anything else
illegal, okay folks?
--Dave
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NEXT>4918
PREVIOUS>2384
POSTER>M.J.S.
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Second Avenue Subway
DATE>Jul 9 19:54:19 1997
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Posted by M.J.S. on June 27, 1997 at 13:08:54:
In Reply to: [6]Re: Second Avenue Subway posted by John of Calgary on
June 25, 1997 at 19:15:01:
Before you start msking up crazy ideas for subway routings that will
never work, why don't you just check out Framklin Avenue Station? The
Shuttle is high on an embankment and the subway is completely below
the street, and the Franklin Shuttle Station points directly onto the
Franklin Subway Station. It would be cheaper and easier to abandon the
shuttle and build a duplicate under some street other Than Franklin,
like Bedford.
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NEXT>2459
PREVIOUS>2439
POSTER>Michael Berson
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: South Ferry
DATE>Jul 9 19:54:20 1997
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Posted by Michael Berson on June 27, 1997 at 13:56:05:
In Reply to: [6]Re: South Ferry posted by David L. on June 26, 1997 at
23:16:37:
Do they switch to another Motorman at South Ferry or does the same
train operator take the train back to the Bronx??
Mike
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NEXT>
PREVIOUS>2452
POSTER>M.J.S.
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Extra route on L line
DATE>Jul 9 19:54:21 1997
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Posted by M.J.S. on June 27, 1997 at 15:20:16:
In Reply to: [6]Re: Extra route on L line posted by John of Calgary on
June 26, 1997 at 20:07:28:
Fools, there was never any skip-stop between Marcy and Myrtle, it was
always uni-directional express.
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NEXT>
PREVIOUS>2433
POSTER>M.J.S.
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: R-44s Off the A Line
DATE>Jul 9 19:54:22 1997
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Posted by M.J.S. on June 27, 1997 at 15:22:46:
In Reply to: [6]Re: R-44s Off the A Line posted by Steve on June 26,
1997 at 20:22:08:
It doesn't matter, the RedBirds are the worst cars on the fleet, any
stainless steel car is better.
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NEXT>2460
PREVIOUS>2456
POSTER>Peter Rosa
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: South Ferry
DATE>Jul 9 19:54:24 1997
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Posted by Peter Rosa on June 27, 1997 at 16:00:41:
In Reply to: [6]Re: South Ferry posted by David L. on June 26, 1997 at
23:16:37:
The 1 train uses the "outer" loop at South Ferry. There is also an
"inner loop," visible as arched openings in the wall, which was
originally designed as a turnaround for East Side IRT trains. Until
about 20 years ago, the outer loop was in revenue service for a
shuttle train to Bowling Green. Today it's used only for turning the 5
train.
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NEXT>2483
PREVIOUS>2459
POSTER>Philip Ng
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: South Ferry
DATE>Jul 9 19:54:25 1997
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Posted by Philip Ng on June 27, 1997 at 16:54:48:
In Reply to: [6]Re: South Ferry posted by Michael Berson on June 27,
1997 at 13:56:05:
I believe that the INNER loop was used as the renevue platform for the
shuttle that ran to Bowling Green. The OUTER loop platform was used to
turn
the Seventh avenue (1,9) and the Lexington Avenue (5) trains.
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NEXT>2462
PREVIOUS>2451
POSTER>Bill
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Staten Island connection
DATE>Jul 9 19:54:26 1997
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Posted by Bill on June 27, 1997 at 17:12:56:
In Reply to: [5]Staten Island connection posted by David L. on June
27, 1997 at 00:03:29:
They did start to dig a shaft for the tunnel to S.I. There is a
concret slab at 68 street and Shore Road right next the Belt Parkway.
I think it is filled in, but there is a shaft.
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NEXT>2525
PREVIOUS>2461
POSTER>Bob Andersen
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Staten Island connection
DATE>Jul 9 19:54:27 1997
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Posted by Bob Andersen on June 27, 1997 at 18:26:01:
In Reply to: [5]Staten Island connection posted by David L. on June
27, 1997 at 00:03:29:
The major reason why such a connection was not made in conjunction
with the building of the Verrazzano Bridge in the early-mid '60's can
be summed up in two words: Robert Moses
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NEXT>2467
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>Zack
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Return Of the redbirds???
DATE>Jul 9 19:54:28 1997
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Posted by Zack on June 27, 1997 at 19:54:06:
after seeing a picture of the new R-110b it resembles the REDBIRD.
mabye we can have the NYCTA paint the cars like the redbird
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NEXT>2472
PREVIOUS>2434
POSTER>Andrew Huie
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Cities with Elevateds
DATE>Jul 9 19:54:30 1997
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Posted by Andrew Huie on June 27, 1997 at 19:55:14:
In Reply to: [6]Re: Cities with Elevateds posted by Andrew Byler on
June 25, 1997 at 21:45:53:
What was the Sioux Falls system like? Was it a more like a trolley, or
did it have MU cars like NY?
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NEXT>
PREVIOUS>2449
POSTER>Zack
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Old New York Subway Routings
DATE>Jul 9 19:54:31 1997
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Posted by Zack on June 27, 1997 at 20:00:31:
In Reply to: [6]Old New York Subway Routings posted by California Mike
on June 26, 1997 at 21:25:32:
you might want to try to contact the NYCTA, they will probally have
information that you can retreve about the subways of the past
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POSTER>Andrew Byler
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Cities with Elevateds (Sioux City and Vienna)
DATE>Jul 9 19:54:32 1997
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Posted by Andrew Byler on June 27, 1997 at 20:08:56:
In Reply to: [6]Re: Cities with Elevateds posted by Andrew Huie on
June 27, 1997 at 19:55:14:
The Sioux City, IA (not Falls, sorry!) system was a real live elevated
with multiple unit cars, not trolleys running above the streets. It
was built and ran during the 1890's and maybe also the early 1900's.
The only reason I know about it is a picture I remembered from the
Trains issue from April 1986 on Iowa. It is on pg. 24, lower left hand
corner. The magazine refers to a further article in the May 1986 Model
Railroader which goes into more detail, so I'll have to refer you
there for more information.
The picture itself is a normal steel elevated with a tiny stem engine
hauling two cars - if we didn't know better, it could be a scene from
New York in the 1890's.
As an aside, I remembered another foreign elevated (I am not sure how
I forgot it). Vienna has its famous Gurtel line running in the middle
of the road of the same name, a good 20 feet off the ground, and
dating back from the good old days of real elevated construction. It
carries the U-6 line now.
Andy
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NEXT>2476
PREVIOUS>2463
POSTER>Steve
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Return Of the redbirds???
DATE>Jul 9 19:54:33 1997
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Posted by Steve on June 27, 1997 at 20:10:08:
In Reply to: [5]Return Of the redbirds??? posted by Zack on June 27,
1997 at 19:54:06:
I think that you are referring to the R-110A that looks like a
redbird.
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NEXT>2473
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>Bob
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>How many possibilities are there?
DATE>Jul 9 19:54:34 1997
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Posted by Bob on June 27, 1997 at 20:14:27:
In Reply to: [5]Re: RE: New Routes & Stuff posted by Gerry O'Regan on
June 26, 1997 at 16:20:32:
I wonder how many different possibilities there are (without
back-tracking or looping)?
For the A Division it's not too complicated: From the North you can
start at 242-Bway or Woodlawn-Jerome or 241-White Plains or Dyre or
Pelham or 148-Lenox (6 possibilities) and take either East or West
side (2) to either South Ferry or New Lots or Nostrand-Flatbush Ave.
(3) plus the Fushing Line and the 42nd St Shuttle. for a maximun of (6
* 2 * 3) + 1 + 1 or 38. Of course there are several routes that are
not possible, For example, 242-Bway cannot access the East Side. Lenox
cannot access the West Side.
For the B division, things get much more complicated.
For example, a train starting at Rockaway Parkway on the Canarsie line
can either
1. go to 8th Ave and 14St. St
2. Switch at Eastern Parkway to the Broadway Line, then go over the
Williamsburg Bridge and either
a. Take Nassau St. back to Brooklyn then take any one of 4 routes from
there
i) Brighton
ii)Sea Beach
iii)West End
iv) 4th Ave & 95th St.
b. Switch to the 6th Ave.-Houston St. line (old KK route) to West 4th
St to either 6th or 8th Ave. to
i)Washington Heights
ii)Concourse
iii)179th St.
iv)Jamaica Center
That's 13 possibilities right there just for Rockaway Parkway (and I'm
sure I must have missed a few!). There must be hundreds in total -
even more, once the connection is made to the 63rd. St tunnel.
Any volunteers out there to figure them all out?
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NEXT>2486
PREVIOUS>2398
POSTER>Nathan
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: TTC and STCUM (This is the Toronto one)
DATE>Jul 9 19:54:36 1997
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Posted by Nathan on June 27, 1997 at 20:28:45:
In Reply to: [5]Re: TTC and STCUM (This is the Toronto one) posted by
Brian on June 26, 1997 at 00:49:00:
3 lines (Scarberia RT, does that count?). Yes, the Toronto system is
very effective and efficient. Very little funding comes from the
government, which is good as the TTC was able to adapt to Mike Harris'
anti transit budgets, and come out (somewhat) on top. I do think that
the biggest mistake was cancelling (I would rather say/hope,
postponing) work on the Eglinton subway, the airport needs a subway
connection desperately. It is a model system indeed.
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NEXT>2471
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>Steve
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>IRT Extension
DATE>Jul 9 19:54:37 1997
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Posted by Steve on June 27, 1997 at 20:29:01:
I have a proposal for an extension of subway service in Brooklyn. The
#2 train terminates at Flatbush Ave. I believe that the line should be
extended in a South-East direction, along Flatbush Avenue to Kings
Plaza. I think that this would provide the TA an excellent opportunity
to build a subway extension which would instantly attract riders, not
duplicate an existing service and help bolster the local economy. In
addition, if one wanted to get a bit exotic, the new line could be
extended via elevated ROW to the west end of Rockaway [Jacob Riis
Park] This would also afford the TA an opportunity to build a state of
the art yard & maintenance facility on the land occupied by the now
deserted Floyd Bennett Field.
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NEXT>2490
PREVIOUS>2470
POSTER>Steve
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>IRT Extension
DATE>Jul 9 19:54:38 1997
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Posted by Steve on June 27, 1997 at 20:30:03:
I have a proposal for an extension of subway service in Brooklyn. The
#2 train terminates at Flatbush Ave. I believe that the line should be
extended in a South-East direction, along Flatbush Avenue to Kings
Plaza. I think that this would provide the TA an excellent opportunity
to build a subway extension which would instantly attract riders, not
duplicate an existing service and help bolster the local economy. In
addition, if one wanted to get a bit exotic, the new line could be
extended via elevated ROW to the west end of Rockaway [Jacob Riis
Park] This would also afford the TA an opportunity to build a state of
the art yard & maintenance facility on the land occupied by the now
deserted Floyd Bennett Field.
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NEXT>2510
PREVIOUS>2464
POSTER>Nathan
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Cities with Elevateds
DATE>Jul 9 19:54:40 1997
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Posted by Nathan on June 27, 1997 at 20:33:02:
In Reply to: [5]Re: Cities with Elevateds posted by Gart Jacobi on
June 25, 1997 at 11:14:19:
I was talking about lines that are almost completely elevated; of the
systems I mentioned the vast majority of line IS elevated, with maybe
a few
short at grade and underground sections.
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NEXT>2607
PREVIOUS>2468
POSTER>Steve
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: How many possibilities are there?
DATE>Jul 9 19:54:41 1997
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Posted by Steve on June 27, 1997 at 21:42:51:
In Reply to: [5]How many possibilities are there? posted by Bob on
June 27, 1997 at 20:14:27:
I think you've covered them all except 21st St.-Queensbridge.
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NEXT>2488
PREVIOUS>2415
POSTER>Steve
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: 9th Ave. Elevated
DATE>Jul 9 19:54:42 1997
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Posted by Steve on June 27, 1997 at 21:47:30:
In Reply to: [5]9th Ave. Elevated posted by Timothy on June 26, 1997
at 14:24:16:
"The Tracks of New York" #3 has some about the 6th & 9th Ave Els.
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NEXT>2509
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>Nathan
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Calgary Transit
DATE>Jul 9 19:54:43 1997
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Posted by Nathan on June 28, 1997 at 01:10:37:
I heard that a Siemens Regio-Sprinter was/is being tested in Calgary,
to
a)test the vehicle, and
b)to see if ridership warrants to expand the C-Train light rail
system.
Does anyone know anything about this? I heard from a Light Rail
organization that the Calgary system was the most successful LRT
system in North America (115 000passengers/day).
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NEXT>2482
PREVIOUS>2467
POSTER>Nathan
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Return Of the redbirds???
DATE>Jul 9 19:54:44 1997
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Posted by Nathan on June 28, 1997 at 01:16:46:
In Reply to: [5]Re: Return Of the redbirds??? posted by Steve on June
27, 1997 at 20:10:08:
Yeah, the R-110B does not look anything like a red bird...
Still, I think the colour RED suits any subway, Red cars just seem to
look good, kind of imposing, in the dark tunnel/station light.
Then there is the ugly silver cars who destroyed the red birds, and
basically reflect light everywhere and make the subway look like,
well,
you get the picture,
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NEXT>2492
PREVIOUS>2410
POSTER>Nathan
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: 2nd Av. Light Rail idea
DATE>Jul 9 19:54:46 1997
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Posted by Nathan on June 28, 1997 at 01:23:40:
In Reply to: [5]2nd Av. Light Rail idea posted by Brian on June 26,
1997 at 13:10:48:
But would the Light Rail have the capacity to serve this area? Would
the LRT run on a reserved right of way or be street running? Why not
elevate the LRT?
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NEXT>2484
PREVIOUS>2428
POSTER>Nathan
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: R110 a&b-Still in operation on same line?
DATE>Jul 9 19:54:47 1997
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Posted by Nathan on June 28, 1997 at 01:26:26:
In Reply to: [5]Re: R110 a&b-Still in operation on same line? posted
by charles on June 26, 1997 at 19:32:05:
You say they operate during non-peak times, are you saying that they
operate during off periods and peak periods, or are you saying they do
not operate during peak periods at all.
WHY??
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NEXT>2480
PREVIOUS>2424
POSTER>Nathan
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: 2nd avenue elevated
DATE>Jul 9 19:54:48 1997
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Posted by Nathan on June 28, 1997 at 01:29:36:
In Reply to: [5]Re: 2nd avenue elevated posted by Gerry O'Regan on
June 26, 1997 at 17:12:01:
What do you mean, concrete deck over open deck. We're talking about
open deck concrete! Agghhhh. WIth concrete you don't have the rattling
associated with steel el structures.
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NEXT>2516
PREVIOUS>2479
POSTER>Nathan
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: 2nd avenue elevated
DATE>Jul 9 19:54:50 1997
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Posted by Nathan on June 28, 1997 at 01:30:15:
In Reply to: [5]Re: 2nd avenue elevated posted by john zmijewski on
June 25, 1997 at 14:59:47:
What sux, what is slow, what blows????
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PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>Nathan
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Los Angeles (*hyperventilates*) Red Line Subway
DATE>Jul 9 19:54:51 1997
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Posted by Nathan on June 28, 1997 at 01:33:44:
Is there any hope?? Please, let there be hope! Does any one know the
status
of the LA Metro-Rail project? Is there a corresponding ridership
increase
when new sections of the line open?
Please, let there be light!
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NEXT>2495
PREVIOUS>2476
POSTER>?
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Return Of the redbirds???
DATE>Jul 9 19:54:52 1997
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Posted by ? on June 28, 1997 at 02:06:53:
In Reply to: [5]Return Of the redbirds??? posted by Zack on June 27,
1997 at 19:54:06:
what's a mabye? J/K
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NEXT>2528
PREVIOUS>2460
POSTER>RAC93
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: South Ferry
DATE>Jul 9 19:54:53 1997
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Posted by RAC93 on June 28, 1997 at 02:19:23:
In Reply to: [5]Re: South Ferry posted by Philip Ng on June 27, 1997
at 16:54:48:
I think that phillip is right. If you check the track maps at Mr.
Pirmann's
site you will see that the smaller inner loop ran the shuttle to
bowling
green. There is a game called BAHN 3.40 which is more like a simulator
that is available in the transfer station. There are a few track
layouts which
depict the various trackworks. They may not be 100% but they are nice
to look at.
RAC93
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NEXT>
PREVIOUS>2478
POSTER>Charles
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: R110 a&b-Still in operation on same line?
DATE>Jul 9 19:54:54 1997
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Posted by Charles on June 28, 1997 at 09:28:28:
In Reply to: [6]Re: R110 a&b-Still in operation on same line? posted
by Nathan on June 28, 1997 at 01:26:26:
The R110A and B both operate during rush and non rush hours. I do not
think that they are in late-night operation. What I meant by WHEN THEY
ARE IN SERVICE is that the R110A is taken out of service very
frequently. The R110B is taken out but not as often. There is no
official reason for this.
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NEXT>
PREVIOUS>2431
POSTER>
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re:TTC's Yonge-University-Spadina Subway, formerly know as:TTC Ugly
DATE>Jul 9 19:54:56 1997
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In Reply to: [5]Re:TTC's Yonge-University-Spadina Subway, formerly
know as:TTC Ugly Stations, Vancouver, everything else, life story, was
Re: Toronto H-6's posted by John of Calgary on June 26, 1997 at
20:18:19:
Extend the line so it actually stops inside the big Union Station,
then make a separate area for the TTC (because they run on different
rack guages) and the rest of the bunch. Make the station look
immaculately brilliant, lots of glass, walkthrough areas, maybe even
platform kiosks. To get to the other tracks, all you'll have to do is
go onto a mezzanine, buy a ticket for Go, Amtrak, or VIA, and you
descend again. Or, if you have a ticket already, you can bypass this
and go straight to the track your train is boarding at. (via
undderground passageway, maybe integrated with the current facilities,
but expanded for future ridership growth.
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NEXT>
PREVIOUS>2469
POSTER>Bingo
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: TTC and STCUM (This is the Toronto one)
DATE>Jul 9 19:54:57 1997
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Posted by Bingo on June 28, 1997 at 13:30:41:
In Reply to: [5]Re: TTC and STCUM (This is the Toronto one) posted by
Nathan on June 27, 1997 at 20:28:45:
1) Not really (Scarborough RT)
2) You know, we're still footing the bill for the B-D line!
3) The Eglinton line has been shelved, and WILL be completed in the
future. (It may be 2 years, 4, maybe even 10) It's a shame, because
the line is still badly needed. There hasn't been any major
development in West Toronto for 2 decades now. The provincial gov't
still doesn't have enough $$$, even if Mike Harris were to be
mysteriously lynched outside Queens Park...
4) I wanted the Queen subway, but that was an idea shot dead about 50
years ago. They have these old underground caves which were to be the
starting point for an underground streetcar line, but that fell
through as well.
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NEXT>
PREVIOUS>2454
POSTER>Gary Jacobi
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: DELETED POSTS - READ ME NOW
DATE>Jul 9 19:54:58 1997
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Posted by Gary Jacobi on June 28, 1997 at 16:35:56:
In Reply to: [5]DELETED POSTS - READ ME NOW posted by David Pirmann -
Web Site Host on June 27, 1997 at 13:03:05:
No wonder I didn't understand them, they were talking about Canadian
Politics. I'm with you, except for an occasional questioning of MTA's
decision making ability. I will never mention names; they know who
they are!
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NEXT>
PREVIOUS>2474
POSTER>Gary Jacobi
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: 9th Ave. Elevated
DATE>Jul 9 19:54:59 1997
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Posted by Gary Jacobi on June 28, 1997 at 16:50:35:
In Reply to: [5]9th Ave. Elevated posted by Timothy on June 26, 1997
at 14:24:16:
Many of the photos I have seen of the Ninth Avenue El are of the
original cable drawn line, and I'm not sure how much of that structure
was able to be incorporated into the Steam powered conversion.
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NEXT>2493
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>Ted Nielsen
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>STCUM Depots
DATE>Jul 9 19:55:01 1997
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Posted by Ted Nielsen on June 28, 1997 at 17:51:00:
I would like to know if the train depots in Montreal are underground
and their locations. ( I'm creating a Bahn layout ) This applies only
to the Metro and not the commuter lines.
thanks.
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NEXT>2491
PREVIOUS>2471
POSTER>Gerry O'Regan
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: IRT Extension
DATE>Jul 9 19:55:03 1997
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Posted by Gerry O'Regan on June 28, 1997 at 18:17:00:
In Reply to: [6]IRT Extension posted by Steve on June 27, 1997 at
20:30:03:
Sounds like a great idea, penetrating a section of Brooklyn with no
previous subway service AND balancing the two branches of the IRT in
Brooklyn with similar length routes. Unfortunately, if NYC can't
afford to build the desperately needed 2nd Av. line in Manhattan, such
an extension would be difficult to get off (or in) the ground.
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NEXT>2498
PREVIOUS>2490
POSTER>Bob Andersen
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: IRT Extension
DATE>Jul 9 19:55:04 1997
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Posted by Bob Andersen on June 28, 1997 at 18:20:39:
In Reply to: [5]IRT Extension posted by Steve on June 27, 1997 at
20:30:03:
I think something similar to this was on the drawing board many years
ago - , and it's definitely a good idea. I guess the problem now
(besides money) would be the disruption to traffic on Flatbush Ave.
for who knows how many years.
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NEXT>2515
PREVIOUS>2477
POSTER>Brian
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: 2nd Av. Light Rail idea
DATE>Jul 9 19:55:05 1997
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Posted by Brian on June 28, 1997 at 18:40:24:
In Reply to: [6]Re: 2nd Av. Light Rail idea posted by Nathan on June
28, 1997 at 01:23:40:
Preferably, run it as an el. Otherwise, run it on the street, closing
off two lanes for two tracks, and giving trolleys the right of way
with traffic lights. Also, build the northbound branch on 1st Av.
because then it will be going in the same direction as the traffic,
making it easier to adjust the lights to give the trolleys the right
of way. The track closest to the sidewalk would be for a local
trolley, which would replace the bus, stopping every three or four
blocks. The other track would stop at major streets and other
attractions. It would be a two track line on 41st, and from 41st to
23rd, the northbound track will travel on 10th Av., while the
southbound track would travel on 11th. In The Bronx, run it as a two
track line.
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NEXT>2494
PREVIOUS>2489
POSTER>Brian
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: STCUM Depots
DATE>Jul 9 19:55:06 1997
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Posted by Brian on June 28, 1997 at 18:42:03:
In Reply to: [6]STCUM Depots posted by Ted Nielsen on June 28, 1997 at
17:51:00:
I don't know where, but they have to be underground because of the
rubber tires, which are damaged by snow. They should have built the
system with steel tires.
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NEXT>2499
PREVIOUS>2493
POSTER>Nathan
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: STCUM Depots
DATE>Jul 9 19:55:08 1997
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Posted by Nathan on June 28, 1997 at 18:48:31:
In Reply to: [5]Re: STCUM Depots posted by Brian on June 28, 1997 at
18:42:03:
Why are the rubber tires damaged by snow? The STCUM trains also have
steel wheels which run on steel rails, in case there is a tire
blow-out. WHyare the rubber tires damaged by snow?
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NEXT>2501
PREVIOUS>2482
POSTER>Steve
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Return Of the redbirds???
DATE>Jul 9 19:55:09 1997
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Posted by Steve on June 28, 1997 at 18:51:18:
In Reply to: [5]Re: Return Of the redbirds??? posted by Nathan on June
28, 1997 at 01:16:46:
Stainless is not pretty - granted. Red is an okay color. Personally, I
think that the Corona 1963-64 Worlds Fair cars were the best looking
car ever, on this system but face it, It's not all about looks.
Stainless is low maintenance whereas painted cars are not. In NY where
the miscreant ratio is about 1 in 12, painted dars will be destroyed
in short order. If you think I'm wrong or kidding, look at some of the
stainless cars like the R-62s and the R-68s. The hooligans have begun
to carve in the outer skin and they use bats on the interiors. Face
it, red may work in some cities but in NY it's like a red flag and a
bull.
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NEXT>2497
PREVIOUS>2361
POSTER>subway-buff
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Why not the LIRR??
DATE>Jul 9 19:55:10 1997
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Posted by subway-buff on June 28, 1997 at 21:48:40:
In Reply to: [6]Why not the LIRR?? posted by John on June 25, 1997 at
00:24:11:
Your idea of cross honoring NJT tand LIRR tickets sin the same manner
as NJT and SEPTA sounds good. As a regular NJT rider there is one
"catch" to the SEPTA tickets- The joint ticket is only for Center City
Philadelphia. If you are going from New York Penn Station to
Norristown you must change SEPTA trains in Center City Philadelphia
(CCP(. Also, if you are getting off before CCP you can not buy a
ticket from NJT but must buy a nother ticket at Trenton.
Good idea though! Perhaps it can work from Penn to Jamaica! (But then
won't NYCT get upset!)
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NEXT>2503
PREVIOUS>2496
POSTER>subway-buff
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Why not the LIRR??
DATE>Jul 9 19:55:11 1997
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Posted by subway-buff on June 28, 1997 at 22:00:22:
In Reply to: [6]Why not the LIRR?? posted by John on June 25, 1997 at
00:24:11:
This is a follow-up to my own response. I just sent an e-mail to NJT
suggesting they cross ticket for LIRR to the LIRR Jamaica Station.
If NJT responds-yes or no- I will post their reply.
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NEXT>2500
PREVIOUS>2491
POSTER>Subway-buff
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: IRT Extension
DATE>Jul 9 19:55:13 1997
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Posted by Subway-buff on June 28, 1997 at 22:20:33:
In Reply to: [6]IRT Extension posted by Steve on June 27, 1997 at
20:30:03:
In the 1970's NYCT had other dreams: a Utica ave subway, extend the
Canarsie line all the way to the ocean, extend the Flatbush line to
the ocean, and the super express in queens/63 st. The financial cruch
that stopped 2nd ave also cancelled Utica Ave idea as well as the
others. Only the 63 st tunnel, tearing down of the Jamaica EL past 121
st and the short Parsons/Archer subway survived..
I think the only way NYC will get more lines is *if* we get the
olympic games (and I wouldn't hold my breath for that!). *if* we do
get the games then I look for 2nd ave to be built and possibly a
Javits link, and maybe LaGuardia to N train and a JFK train link. As
far as Utica IRT and Extended Faltbush/Nostrand IRT- I think mag-lev
subways will happen sooner thasn that !--they will *never* happen !!!
(Mag-lev if you want to know are traisn with no tracks- they ride a
cushion of air.) like the French TGV Trains or the Japanese Bullet
Trains.
(The Impossible dream-NY Srtyle!)
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NEXT>2519
PREVIOUS>2494
POSTER>John
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: STCUM Depots
DATE>Jul 9 19:55:14 1997
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Posted by John on June 29, 1997 at 00:55:23:
In Reply to: [5]Re: STCUM Depots posted by Nathan on June 28, 1997 at
18:48:31:
How can they be damaged by snow? Every winter, we drive in the snow,
don't we?
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NEXT>2520
PREVIOUS>2498
POSTER>John
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: IRT Extension
DATE>Jul 9 19:55:15 1997
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Posted by John on June 29, 1997 at 01:00:43:
In Reply to: [5]Re: IRT Extension posted by Subway-buff on June 28,
1997 at 22:20:33:
The TGV and Bullet Train (Shinkansan) are NOT mag-levs! They are, in
fact, regular trains. The only difference is that the tracks are
modified and built in a way that there are no curves in them and they
cannot be used by conventional trains (it would throw the tracks out
of alignment).
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NEXT>2524
PREVIOUS>2495
POSTER>M.J.S.
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Return Of the redbirds???
DATE>Jul 9 19:55:16 1997
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Posted by M.J.S. on June 29, 1997 at 03:12:55:
In Reply to: [6]Return Of the redbirds??? posted by Zack on June 27,
1997 at 19:54:06:
Again with this nonsense, there was already a thread about ruining the
R110 by making it look like a redbird.
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NEXT>2521
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Don't turn Floyd-Bennet Field into a freaky train yard, take your ideas
DATE>Jul 9 19:55:18 1997
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In Reply to: [6]IRT Extension posted by Steve on June 27, 1997 at
20:29:01:
The Floyd-Bennett Field IS NOT DESERTED!!!! It would be a shame to
destroy it, it is part of the Gateway National Recreation area
(National Parks Service). The field is a nice wide open space with
nice wide open roads (which were once runways!) there is a visitor
center at the Flatbush Avenue side. Periodically various fairs and
festivals are held here, the facility is still used by the Coast
Guard, and when they move out next year the Department of Defense
would still have some use for the field. It's a great place to launch
model rockets and planes and to drive around with no regulations. I
once saw people fishing with a net at the Jamaica Bay. PLEASE PLEASE
Don't turn the Floyd-Bennet Field into a freaky train yard, please
visit this place sometime before you actually make a judgment about
it's condition.
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NEXT>2507
PREVIOUS>2497
POSTER>Dave
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Why not the LIRR??
DATE>Jul 9 19:55:19 1997
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Posted by Dave on June 29, 1997 at 07:26:26:
In Reply to: [6]Re: Why not the LIRR?? posted by Josh Caesar on June
25, 1997 at 09:23:29:
I think you're missing the point of the original post. It is talking
about cross-railroad ticketing, not necessarily coordinated operation
like SEPTA-NJT. Get off the train at Penn. Sta. then get on a NJT
train. If you have to wait for the next train, so what? at least you
don't have to stand on line to get a NJT ticket. The same idea should
be extended to Metro North and ConnDOT trains, too.
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NEXT>2505
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>Ben-Zion Y. Cassouto
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Airport Connection
DATE>Jul 9 19:55:20 1997
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Posted by Ben-Zion Y. Cassouto on June 29, 1997 at 07:59:05:
Anyone know if there is final approval/work started on the Jamaica
LIRR to JFK link?
(I'll never accept the waste of the abandoned but intact LIRR Rockaway
Branch just sitting there available, runnung from the Main Line to
Ozone Park, available - but unexploited!)
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NEXT>2508
PREVIOUS>2504
POSTER>Steve
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Airport Connection
DATE>Jul 9 19:55:22 1997
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Posted by Steve on June 29, 1997 at 10:45:08:
In Reply to: [5]Airport Connection posted by Ben-Zion Y. Cassouto on
June 29, 1997 at 07:59:05:
It's likely all election year babble. With feasibility studies,
environmental impact studies, engineering studies & public hearings,
all of which have not yet taken place, the odds of NOT seeing a JFK
rail link before 2020 is all but assured.
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NEXT>2513
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>Steve
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Floyd Bennet Field
DATE>Jul 9 19:55:23 1997
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Posted by Steve on June 29, 1997 at 11:02:27:
In Reply to: [5]Don't turn Floyd-Bennet Field into a freaky train
yard, take your ideas elsewhere (was Re: IRT Extension posted by
M.J.S. on June 29, 1997 at 03:26:54:
First of all, the same arguments were made when Jamaica Yard was built
in the 30s and the environmentalists (The Friends of Willow Lake) have
fought the badly needed yard expansion for a decade or more. Second, a
yard would take up less than 25% of the available area. Third, when
was the last time you were to Floyd Bennet field? It's used by model
airplane flyers, a few fairs and the GSA auctions cars there. I think
that 75% of the current space would suffice for that limited use.
Finally, if a rail link were built, the public would have greater
access to the Gateway National Seashore which is, for the most part
only accessible to those with cars or strong legs.
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NEXT>
PREVIOUS>2503
POSTER>Steve
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Why not the LIRR??
DATE>Jul 9 19:55:25 1997
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Posted by Steve on June 29, 1997 at 11:11:14:
In Reply to: [5]Why not the LIRR?? posted by John on June 25, 1997 at
00:24:11:
Such a plan is feasible but is it necessary. Both railroads agree to
sell combined tickets and at the end of the month they balance the
books. In this age of computers, it's not all that difficult to do.
The airlines have been doing it since foreve. I think you might get
some opposition from the union representing the ticket agents though.
On the other hand, unless trains from both railroads are permitted to
traverse the other's ROW, we'd still have to change trains at Penn
Station. Another track, another train and another conductor. Your idea
only makes sense if the trip became seamless.
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NEXT>
PREVIOUS>2505
POSTER>JFK-LRS
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Airport Connection
DATE>Jul 9 19:55:26 1997
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Posted by JFK-LRS on June 29, 1997 at 14:16:12:
In Reply to: [5]Airport Connection posted by Ben-Zion Y. Cassouto on
June 29, 1997 at 07:59:05:
Final approval on the JFK-LRS has not yet been given by The Port
Authority of NY & NJ to any of the five consortiums bidding the
project. The award notice will most probably be given towards the end
of summer in August or September.
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NEXT>
PREVIOUS>2475
POSTER>John of Calgary
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Calgary Transit
DATE>Jul 9 19:55:27 1997
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Posted by John of Calgary on June 29, 1997 at 16:55:29:
In Reply to: [5]Calgary Transit posted by Nathan on June 28, 1997 at
01:10:37:
Yes, they did test the RegioSprinter here last summer when it ran from
Anderson Station to the southernmost reaches of the city or 162 Av.
SW, to be precise.) And then they shipped it off to California for
more tests. I also think that the LA transit system has bought a few
cars for service on the Green Line. (Or was it the Blue Line? Oh
shoot, I forgot.)
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NEXT>2517
PREVIOUS>2472
POSTER>Brian
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Cities with Elevateds
DATE>Jul 9 19:55:29 1997
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Posted by Brian on June 29, 1997 at 19:28:46:
In Reply to: [6]Re: Cities with Elevateds posted by Nathan on June 27,
1997 at 20:33:02:
A perfect system that is all of the above is the Douglas (Cermak
Branch) Branch of the Blue Line here in Chicago. It is in subway
downtown, Elevated for almost it's entire route out of downtown and
the last two stations are at ground level with grate crossings
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NEXT>2514
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>Brian of Chicago
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Comfortable BART Trains!!
DATE>Jul 9 19:55:30 1997
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Posted by Brian of Chicago on June 29, 1997 at 19:32:28:
I just visited SF and rode a BART Train, it was great. The trains are
carpeted and have padded big seats. All the stations are clean and
beautiful. Will Chicago or New York ever get the idea from bart and
modernize. Here in Chicago it would be nice. Our El's are old and have
hard plastic seats
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NEXT>2536
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>Nathan
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>New EPA regulations
DATE>Jul 9 19:55:31 1997
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Posted by Nathan on June 29, 1997 at 19:37:55:
I was watching CNN this morning and they were talking about how the
new EPA
regulations would (aside from ensuring that plants and factories get
anti-pollution equipment) require that more federal and state funds be
spent on mass transit. Maybe the 2nd Av subway/el/light rail/horse and
buggy/you get the picture might be built after all....
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NEXT>
PREVIOUS>2506
POSTER>M.J.S.
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Floyd Bennet Field
DATE>Jul 9 19:55:32 1997
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Posted by M.J.S. on June 29, 1997 at 19:42:10:
In Reply to: [6]Floyd Bennet Field posted by Steve on June 29, 1997 at
11:02:27:
The purpose of my post was to mention that the field was not deserted.
Yes, there is lots of useless space there that can become a yard, but
the whole thing just shouldn't be paved over.
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NEXT>2518
PREVIOUS>2511
POSTER>M.J.S.
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Comfortable BART Trains!!
DATE>Jul 9 19:55:34 1997
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Posted by M.J.S. on June 29, 1997 at 19:47:32:
In Reply to: [6]Comfortable BART Trains!! posted by Brian of Chicago
on June 29, 1997 at 19:32:28:
The problem is that New York is a completely different system than
BART, the padded seats wouldn't survive a day in New York (KILL ALL
VANDALS!!!) Same with the carpeting. NY had vinyl seats a long time
ago and this had to be removed because of heavy vandalism. A few R44
trains were made with carpet, that failed, they had to get Linolium.
carpets and cushioned seats wouldn't last a day in New York, just look
at the windows and you'll see what I mean.
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NEXT>2523
PREVIOUS>2492
POSTER>Steve
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: 2nd Av. Light Rail idea
DATE>Jul 9 19:55:35 1997
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Posted by Steve on June 29, 1997 at 21:22:16:
In Reply to: [5]2nd Av. Light Rail idea posted by Brian on June 26,
1997 at 13:10:48:
Great idea ! Just one thing though. If the city was able to build such
a project, don't you think the money would be better spent completing
the 2nd avenue subway?
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NEXT>
PREVIOUS>2480
POSTER>Steve
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: 2nd avenue elevated
DATE>Jul 9 19:55:36 1997
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Posted by Steve on June 29, 1997 at 21:24:50:
In Reply to: [5]2nd avenue elevated posted by Zack on June 25, 1997 at
01:23:59:
Once again - if the city/state has the money to build such a project,
then it should be used to complete the 2nd Ave. Subway.
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NEXT>
PREVIOUS>2510
POSTER>Nathan
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Cities with Elevateds
DATE>Jul 9 19:55:37 1997
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Posted by Nathan on June 29, 1997 at 22:04:01:
In Reply to: [5]Re: Cities with Elevateds posted by Brian on June 29,
1997 at 19:28:46:
Yes, I think I know of the line you're talking about (I still haven't
recovered from the CTA's rampant colour coding...) but yeah, a grade
crossing too? Groovy, that can't happen in Vancouver or Kuala Lumpur
because no one has figured out a way of embedding LIM Reaction rails
in the pavement without them being crushed...
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NEXT>2527
PREVIOUS>2514
POSTER>Nathan must = ignorant canadian
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Comfortable BART Trains!!
DATE>Jul 9 19:55:39 1997
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Posted by Nathan must = ignorant canadian on June 29, 1997 at
In Reply to: [5]Comfortable BART Trains!! posted by Brian of Chicago
on June 29, 1997 at 19:32:28:
Hmmm, the pretty picture you paint of the BART is not the one I am
familliar with: Yes, the trains have padded seats...
BUT:
When the train ACTUALLY functions, that is usually after some
technical delay, people finally board the trains and are crammed on
like cattle, so who needs the seats? (the carpet is NOT very nice on
your @$$)
The stations may be "clean", but this is when being compared to NYC
and Chicago. In SF they have methods of discouraging people from
urinating off the ends of platforms, but the stations are still filled
with trash, smell, etc.
In final, there are other systems which New York and Chicago should
look to
as role models, (ie:European cities, though London needs a janatorial
army to clean up the litter) other than SF.
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NEXT>2522
PREVIOUS>2499
POSTER>Nathan=canadian=knows what snow is
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: STCUM Depots
DATE>Jul 9 19:55:40 1997
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Posted by Nathan=canadian=knows what snow is on June 29, 1997 at
In Reply to: [5]Re: STCUM Depots posted by John on June 29, 1997 at
00:55:23:
That was what I was asking! The person who put the message up, before
mine said that the rubber tires where damaged by snow. Where I live
(right now) we don't usually get snow at all in winter, but in
Montreal they get sooo much snow that if rubber tired vehicles were
damaged by it, STCUM wouldn't have chosen them!
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NEXT>2534
PREVIOUS>2500
POSTER>gary jacobi
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: IRT Extension
DATE>Jul 9 19:55:41 1997
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Posted by gary jacobi on June 29, 1997 at 22:16:00:
In Reply to: [5]Re: IRT Extension posted by Bob Andersen on June 28,
1997 at 18:20:39:
It was planned to follow on the heels of the dual contracts (1916).
One of the NY Subway Histories quotes a real estate agent assuring
buyers in the area that they would soon have subway service. They now
have grown grandchildren, but still no subway.
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NEXT>2529
PREVIOUS>2502
POSTER>
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Don't turn Floyd-Bennet Field into a freaky train yard, take your ideas
DATE>Jul 9 19:55:42 1997
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In Reply to: [5]Don't turn Floyd-Bennet Field into a freaky train
yard, take your ideas elsewhere (was Re: IRT Extension posted by
M.J.S. on June 29, 1997 at 03:26:54:
I agree with you on preserving FBF, although not on trainyards being
"freaky". Did you know that before Laguardia was built, that Floyd
Bennet was the cities commercial airport?
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NEXT>2535
PREVIOUS>2519
POSTER>Brian
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: STCUM Depots
DATE>Jul 9 19:55:44 1997
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Posted by Brian on June 29, 1997 at 23:35:02:
In Reply to: [6]Re: STCUM Depots posted by Nathan=canadian=knows what
snow is on June 29, 1997 at 22:12:34:
The system is entirely underground. This is because the rubber tires
use more than just the tracks, also the surrounding area, which means
that it is much more difficult to clean than steel tracks, and the
wheels can often get stuck in it.
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NEXT>2539
PREVIOUS>2515
POSTER>Brian
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: 2nd Av. Light Rail idea
DATE>Jul 9 19:55:45 1997
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Posted by Brian on June 29, 1997 at 23:37:02:
In Reply to: [6]Re: 2nd Av. Light Rail idea posted by Steve on June
29, 1997 at 21:22:16:
The only reason for this idea is that it would be easier, and cheaper.
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NEXT>2531
PREVIOUS>2501
POSTER>John
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Return Of the redbirds???
DATE>Jul 9 19:55:46 1997
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Posted by John on June 30, 1997 at 05:46:45:
In Reply to: [5]Re: Return Of the redbirds??? posted by M.J.S. on June
29, 1997 at 03:12:55:
How you gonna paint a stainless steel car, anyway?
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NEXT>2561
PREVIOUS>2462
POSTER>Julio Perez
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Staten Island connection
DATE>Jul 9 19:55:47 1997
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Posted by Julio Perez on June 30, 1997 at 07:25:46:
In Reply to: [6]Re: Staten Island connection posted by Charles Fiori
on June 27, 1997 at 08:23:56:
Does the MTA currently consider a connection between the Staten Island
Railway and the rest of the subway system as an _active_ project?
If it's considered as active, there should be more hope in it becoming
reality...
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NEXT>2558
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>Mark S Feinman
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>3 Cheers for Chicago's Loop (was Re: Comfortable BART Trains!!)
DATE>Jul 9 19:55:49 1997
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Posted by Mark S Feinman on June 30, 1997 at 12:23:45:
In Reply to: [6]Comfortable BART Trains!! posted by Brian of Chicago
on June 29, 1997 at 19:32:28:
Hmmmm ... the Morrison-Knudsen 3200s looked like they had some kind of
padding on them to me, albeit hard padding ... but I wasn't
uncomfortable
on them by any means!
Having just got back from spending a week in Chicago (and the Loop!) I
didn't think CTA was that bad. Yes some stations look like they'll
fall
apart tomorrow and others are recently modernized, but NY shares some
of
those traits as well and it takes $$$$ to moderminze things. And with
the
CTA service cutback hearings taking place today (the only rail line to
be
24 hours is the Blue between O'Hare and 54/Cermak and the Red line
Howard
- Dan Dyan, and there are lots of bus schedule changes), I don't think
CTA
is in a great position to make many improvements fast. Personally I
hope
the cuts don't go through but it's probably a foregone conclusion by
now.
Took lots of pictures (boy is the action at Tower 18 fun to watch!)
and 7
& 1/2 hours of videotape. There's really nothing like the Chicago Loop
with the L running through the canyons of tall buildings - I can only
imagine what the 2nd, 3rd, 6th and 9th ave ELs in NY must have been
like
looking at Chicago's L. I'll get the pix to Dave as soon as I get them
developed and more info on the videos will be forthcoming.
--Mark
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NEXT>2530
PREVIOUS>2518
POSTER>Mark S Feinman
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Comfortable BART Trains!!
DATE>Jul 9 19:55:50 1997
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Posted by Mark S Feinman on June 30, 1997 at 12:32:24:
In Reply to: [6]Re: Comfortable BART Trains!! posted by M.J.S. on June
29, 1997 at 19:47:32:
... The last point reminded me of something I saw in CHicago that I
don't
think would last a day in NY either ... the doors on both sides of the
cars have emergency releases right above them that anyone could pull
"under penalty of law". While this is great for emergency evacuations,
I
could just imagine how many kids sitting in the last car would pull
the
release lever "just for kicks".
--Mark
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NEXT>2533
PREVIOUS>2483
POSTER>Mark S Feinman
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: South Ferry
DATE>Jul 9 19:55:51 1997
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Posted by Mark S Feinman on June 30, 1997 at 12:56:51:
In Reply to: [6]Re: South Ferry posted by Michael Berson on June 27,
1997 at 13:56:05:
IIRC, crew changes occur on the Northbound platform at Chambers
Street.
--Mark
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NEXT>2548
PREVIOUS>2521
POSTER>
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Don't turn Floyd-Bennet Field into a freaky train yard, take your ideas
DATE>Jul 9 19:55:53 1997
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In Reply to: [6]Re: Don't turn Floyd-Bennet Field into a freaky train
yard, take your ideas elsewhere (was Re: IRT Extension posted by Gary
Jacobi on June 29, 1997 at 22:23:56:
Yes I do, but was it closed in 1941 (when LGA opened) or later?
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NEXT>2551
PREVIOUS>2527
POSTER>Nathan (likes to pull door release)
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Comfortable BART Trains!!
DATE>Jul 9 19:55:54 1997
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Posted by Nathan (likes to pull door release) on June 30, 1997 at
In Reply to: [5]Re: Comfortable BART Trains!! posted by Mark S Feinman
on June 30, 1997 at 12:32:24:
Most transit systems in the world I have been on have these door
release handles, under "In case of emergency break glass" covers. I
have never seen
kids pull these things, and if I was an operator and a kid on my train
opened the doors, I would speed the train up to the point where the
suspension becomes unstable and the train rocks uncontrollably, which
should toss the delinquent off the guideway...
hehehe
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NEXT>
PREVIOUS>2524
POSTER>M.J.S.
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Return Of the redbirds???
DATE>Jul 9 19:55:55 1997
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Posted by M.J.S. on June 30, 1997 at 14:21:54:
In Reply to: [6]Re: Return Of the redbirds??? posted by John on June
30, 1997 at 05:46:45:
How do you think cars and busses are painted?
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NEXT>2538
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>Nathan
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Return Of the redbirds??? (Painting instructions)
DATE>Jul 9 19:55:57 1997
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Posted by Nathan on June 30, 1997 at 14:25:07:
In Reply to: [5]Re: Return Of the redbirds??? posted by M.J.S. on June
30, 1997 at 14:21:54:
Well, you open a can labled "ACME All Purpose Exterior Transit
Paint-available in latex and enamel", stick in this funky little tool
called a "brush" (or, if you are extremely modern, an air hose), dip
the "brush" into the can of coloured liquid, cover the "brush" with
this coloured liquid (called "paint") and rub the brush over the
desired area,
until this area is now the colour of the "paint".
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NEXT>2562
PREVIOUS>2528
POSTER>M.J.S.
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: South Ferry
DATE>Jul 9 19:55:58 1997
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Posted by M.J.S. on June 30, 1997 at 14:25:53:
In Reply to: [6]Re: South Ferry posted by Mark S Feinman on June 30,
1997 at 12:56:51:
I've never seen the crew change at Chambers Street, and they don't
stay in the station long enough to facilitate it, unlike South Ferry.
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NEXT>2568
PREVIOUS>2520
POSTER>Jerry
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: IRT Extension
DATE>Jul 9 19:55:59 1997
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Posted by Jerry on June 30, 1997 at 17:15:42:
In Reply to: [5]IRT Extension posted by Steve on June 27, 1997 at
20:29:01:
In a 1950's bond issue, the city promised to extend the Nostrand Ave.
line(now the #2) all the way to Sheepshead Bay. It never happenned and
will probably never happen (the money, as usual was frittered away
without the big capital projects ever being done). In any case, as
extension along Nostrand Avenue, rather than out along Flatbush Ave.
would make much more sense, because of the higher population density
on both sides of Nostrand.
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NEXT>2653
PREVIOUS>2522
POSTER>Gerry O'Regan
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: STCUM Depots
DATE>Jul 9 19:56:00 1997
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Posted by Gerry O'Regan on June 30, 1997 at 17:27:32:
In Reply to: [6]Re: STCUM Depots posted by Brian on June 29, 1997 at
23:35:02:
Thread derailed!
Someone please answer the original question!
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NEXT>
PREVIOUS>2512
POSTER>Zack
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: New EPA regulations
DATE>Jul 9 19:56:02 1997
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Posted by Zack on June 30, 1997 at 18:23:01:
In Reply to: [6]New EPA regulations posted by Nathan on June 29, 1997
at 19:37:55:
Finally (where would the stable and horses come from?) :-)
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NEXT>2547
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>Brian of Chicago
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Trains like BART WOuld last in Chicago
DATE>Jul 9 19:56:03 1997
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Posted by Brian of Chicago on June 30, 1997 at 20:50:48:
In Reply to: [6]Comfortable BART Trains!! posted by Brian of Chicago
on June 29, 1997 at 19:32:28:
NYC is all crazy Bastards. At least most of the people i've seen. Here
in Chicago I do believe that padded seats and carpeted trains would
last on the trains routes during the day. When I ride (which is alot)
I've seen all sane people, unlike NYC.
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NEXT>2564
PREVIOUS>2532
POSTER>John
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Return Of the redbirds??? (Painting instructions)
DATE>Jul 9 19:56:04 1997
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Posted by John on June 30, 1997 at 22:00:34:
In Reply to: [5]Re: Return Of the redbirds??? (Painting instructions)
posted by Nathan on June 30, 1997 at 14:25:07:
Ha, ha, ha! - you killin' me! Listen, man. I know how to paint. I was
asking how STAINLESS STEEL (steel that is difficult to stain) can be
painted on without the paint bleeding off.
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NEXT>2545
PREVIOUS>2523
POSTER>Andrew Byler
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: 2nd Av. Light Rail idea
DATE>Jul 9 19:56:06 1997
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Posted by Andrew Byler on June 30, 1997 at 22:24:34:
In Reply to: [6]Re: 2nd Av. Light Rail idea posted by Brian on June
29, 1997 at 23:37:02:
Easier and Cheaper????? In New York?
A trolley on either of these streets (1st and 2nd) would run into the
same problems that buses do now with the supposed "dedicated" bus
lanes. Trucks parked on their right of way, construction somewhere
along the street blocking the right of way, cars parked on the right
of way etc. There is no possible way that a good chunk of the street
could actually be taken away and made so that vehicles couldn't get on
it, because that would be a fire and emergency hazard.
The easiest and cheapest way to improve traffic in New York would be
to enforce existing laws. This would take some new Tow trucks and a
new set of police to enforce traffic rules. Suggested victims would be
double parkers, all delivery trucks illegally parked (which is most of
the time it seems), people parked in bus lanes or lanes which are
supposedly "No stopping" during rush hour or all day (which is an all
too common occurance which renders the curb lane essentially useless
during rush hour), and of course a rampant vicious persectuion of taxi
drivers who clearly have no idea of American traffic laws and think
they are still in New Delhi (I've been there and seen how you guys
drive - its terrible - much worse than New York), oh and one other
thing, big tickets for people making turns from the middle of the
street (you idiots who turn left from the 3rd lane from the curb knwo
who you are).
After this very thorough and vicious persecution of road menaces,
undoubtedtly New York's streets would flow smoother - and more
importantly, many bad drivers would have been driven into the subways,
as would many taxi riders displaced after the necessary culling of the
ignorant morons driving the yellow machines who think that the dashed
lines marking lanes mean "drive over this line" and who have trouble
figuring out how to negotiate streets which are nearly all numbered.
Then .... after all of this, the greater number of subway riders would
justify the expansions we all want and know are needed (2nd Ave.,
outer Brooklyn and Queens, lower east Bronx, 125th St. crosstown,
Chelsea loop, etc., etc.), and the lesser number of drivers would give
us the street space we need for construction.
So that's my two cents.
Andy
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NEXT>2541
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>Zack
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Does Graffitti stick to stanless steel???
DATE>Jul 9 19:56:07 1997
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Posted by Zack on July 01, 1997 at 05:23:10:
does spray paint adhere to stanless steel and is that why the NYCTA is
switching over to stanless steelon its subways?
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NEXT>2544
PREVIOUS>2540
POSTER>John
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Does Graffitti stick to stanless steel???
DATE>Jul 9 19:56:08 1997
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Posted by John on July 01, 1997 at 06:34:50:
In Reply to: [5]Does Graffitti stick to stanless steel??? posted by
Zack on July 01, 1997 at 05:23:10:
According to the way it was 10-15-20 years ago, graffitti does adhere
to stainless steel, but not as easy as it does to the LAHT cars. The
reason why the Transit Authority is going stainless steel is because
graffitti is very easy to remove from it.
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NEXT>2549
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>Julio Perez
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Funding MTA Projects
DATE>Jul 9 19:56:10 1997
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Posted by Julio Perez on July 01, 1997 at 07:40:18:
Can't the MTA issue some sort of municipal bonds to fund projects on
their wish list?
That way, connections to the Javits Center, LGA, JFK, and SIR could
become a bona fide reality and less of a transit planner's dream.
Or, is it that Wall Street considers New York City such a liability
that it is reluctant to encourage investors to consider muni bonds?
It is my understanding that muni bonds have been used by other
municipalities around the country to fund construction of limited
access roadways (a.k.a. expressways, parkways, turnpikes, freeways,
however you wish to call 'em). While LARs and rail systems are
_definitely_ different, they are both transit-related projects for
which funding should be obtained through similar means.
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NEXT>2546
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>Nick
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>R142 and 143 Pics
DATE>Jul 9 19:56:11 1997
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Posted by Nick on July 01, 1997 at 10:32:13:
Does anyone have any pictures/designs of these cars? If so, could you
tell me where I can get them, or possibly e-mail them to me if it's
not in violation of any copyright laws? THANK YOU!
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NEXT>2550
PREVIOUS>2541
POSTER>Nick
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Does Graffitti stick to stanless steel???
DATE>Jul 9 19:56:12 1997
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Posted by Nick on July 01, 1997 at 10:37:06:
In Reply to: [6]Re: Does Graffitti stick to stanless steel??? posted
by John on July 01, 1997 at 06:34:50:
The transit authority has a super job on getting graffiti off cars for
several years now. All we need now is window protectors to protect
from scratches, and we'll be all set ('till another problem arises!).
I know the R110 series already have these, and I assume the R142s and
3s will too. But what about The 67's and 68s? They still have a long
time beforew retirement. Does the MTA plan to install protectors on
these cars too?
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NEXT>2552
PREVIOUS>2539
POSTER>Brian
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: 2nd Av. Light Rail idea
DATE>Jul 9 19:56:13 1997
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Posted by Brian on July 01, 1997 at 11:03:43:
In Reply to: [6]Re: 2nd Av. Light Rail idea posted by Andrew Byler on
June 30, 1997 at 22:24:34:
Build the tracks in a way that the cars can't get on. For one, put up
a gate between the street lanes and trolley lanes. Also, build the
tracks on top of the street, not into the street like many trolleys,
so cars cannot go in these lanes anyway. At intersections, the gate
will be stopped, and the tracks built into the street, so cars can
turn.
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NEXT>2559
PREVIOUS>2543
POSTER>David Pirmann
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: R142 and 143 Pics
DATE>Jul 9 19:56:15 1997
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Posted by David Pirmann on July 01, 1997 at 11:40:49:
In Reply to: [6]R142 and 143 Pics posted by Nick on July 01, 1997 at
10:32:13:
There are no pictures of the R142 or R143 because there aren't any
yet! Funding hasn't even been approved so it's unlikely construction
has even begun on the R142. No contracts have been approved for R143
(assuming that will even be the right #).
The closest thing to a "design" that I've seen is that for the R110
cars in New York City Subway Cars, by Greller.
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NEXT>2567
PREVIOUS>2537
POSTER>Gary Jacobi
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Trains like BART WOuld last in Chicago
DATE>Jul 9 19:56:16 1997
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Posted by Gary Jacobi on July 01, 1997 at 11:52:40:
In Reply to: [5]Trains like BART WOuld last in Chicago posted by Brian
of Chicago on June 30, 1997 at 20:50:48:
I respect your effort to think positively about Chicago El riders, but
I'm afraid I can testify that they are not ALL sane. When the O'Hare
extension first opened, I had a long layover between flights, so I
took a ride to the loop area. I really enjoyed the front facing window
seat across from the motorman, until a twenty-something guy got on and
informed me that I was in HIS seat. He flunked my personal sanity
test!
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NEXT>2553
PREVIOUS>2529
POSTER>
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Don't turn Floyd-Bennet Field into a freaky train yard, take your ideas
DATE>Jul 9 19:56:17 1997
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In Reply to: [5]Re: Don't turn Floyd-Bennet Field into a freaky train
yard, take your ideas elsewhere (was Re: IRT Extension posted by
M.J.S. on June 30, 1997 at 14:20:55:
Floyd Bennet was an 'active' Coast Guard and/or Navy airfield at least
into the sixties.
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NEXT>2555
PREVIOUS>2542
POSTER>Gary Jacobi
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Funding MTA Projects
DATE>Jul 9 19:56:19 1997
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Posted by Gary Jacobi on July 01, 1997 at 12:05:42:
In Reply to: [5]Funding MTA Projects posted by Julio Perez on July 01,
1997 at 07:40:18:
I'm afraid that putting money in MTA's hands has a long and decidedly
sorry history. It seems to generate little except newspaper headlines.
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NEXT>2554
PREVIOUS>2544
POSTER>Gary Jacobi
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Does Graffitti stick to stanless steel???
DATE>Jul 9 19:56:20 1997
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Posted by Gary Jacobi on July 01, 1997 at 12:13:55:
In Reply to: [5]Re: Does Graffitti stick to stanless steel??? posted
by John on July 01, 1997 at 06:34:50:
The property of Stainless Steel that makes Grafitti easy to remove is
that it requires no paint to prevent rust. It was not the steel that
was infiltrated by the Grafitti, but rather the base paint. If a
strong enough solvent was used to remove the "art",the underlying coat
of paint was harmed as well. This may explain why even painted stripes
are no longer placed on newer cars.
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NEXT>
PREVIOUS>2530
POSTER>Mark S Feinman
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Comfortable BART Trains!!
DATE>Jul 9 19:56:21 1997
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Posted by Mark S Feinman on July 01, 1997 at 12:17:13:
In Reply to: [6]Re: Comfortable BART Trains!! posted by Nathan (likes
to pull door release) on June 30, 1997 at 14:21:49:
.... yes, the emergency door handles are usually under glass which has
to
be broken. In Chicago, there was no glass to break! Just reach up and
pull the door release.
--Mark
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NEXT>2565
PREVIOUS>2545
POSTER>Gary Jacobi
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: 2nd Av. Light Rail idea
DATE>Jul 9 19:56:22 1997
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Posted by Gary Jacobi on July 01, 1997 at 12:29:19:
In Reply to: [5]Re: 2nd Av. Light Rail idea posted by Brian on July
01, 1997 at 11:03:43:
Light Rail is a half-assed fix for half-assed cities. I know from
living in one and visiting four or five others. The only good thing I
can say about these cities decisions is thank God they didn't make the
egotistic mistake of going . New York has a fantastic system which it
could never afford to build today. The level of service provided by
light rail is much closer to bus lines than to subways, and New
Yorkers would NOT be impressed.
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NEXT>2560
PREVIOUS>2548
POSTER>
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Don't turn Floyd-Bennet Field into a freaky train yard, take your ideas
DATE>Jul 9 19:56:24 1997
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In Reply to: [6]Re: Don't turn Floyd-Bennet Field into a freaky train
yard, take your ideas elsewhere (was Re: IRT Extension posted by Gary
Jacobi on July 01, 1997 at 11:58:23:
It still is a regional Coast Guard headquarters, however the
Department of Defense plans to move the facility to Atlantic City next
year.
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NEXT>2557
PREVIOUS>2550
POSTER>M.J.S.
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Does Graffitti stick to stanless steel???
DATE>Jul 9 19:56:25 1997
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Posted by M.J.S. on July 01, 1997 at 13:54:16:
In Reply to: [6]Re: Does Graffitti stick to stanless steel??? posted
by Nick on July 01, 1997 at 10:37:06:
An R-67 is an order for a bunch of trucks, don't you really mean R-62?
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NEXT>2570
PREVIOUS>2549
POSTER>M.J.S.
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Funding MTA Projects
DATE>Jul 9 19:56:26 1997
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Posted by M.J.S. on July 01, 1997 at 13:58:21:
In Reply to: [6]Re: Funding MTA Projects posted by Gary Jacobi on July
01, 1997 at 12:05:42:
This month in 1981 the MTA was given permission to sell bonds to fund
projects. Where did you think they got money to get out of the 'Dark
Ages' of the 70s?
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NEXT>
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>Bryan Layne
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Does Graffiti stick to stanless steel???
DATE>Jul 9 19:56:27 1997
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Posted by Bryan Layne on July 01, 1997 at 15:52:53:
In Reply to: [5]Does Graffitti stick to stanless steel??? posted by
Zack on July 01, 1997 at 05:23:10:
Yes it does.But the quality of the apperance and how easy it is to
buff almost always drives graffiti artists away.It tends to run and
does not cover as well as it does on the carbon steel cars.
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NEXT>2566
PREVIOUS>2554
POSTER>?
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Does Graffitti stick to stanless steel???
DATE>Jul 9 19:56:28 1997
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Posted by ? on July 01, 1997 at 15:54:55:
In Reply to: [5]Re: Does Graffitti stick to stanless steel??? posted
by Nick on July 01, 1997 at 10:37:06:
R-67?
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NEXT>
PREVIOUS>2526
POSTER>Bryan Layne
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: 3 Cheers for Chicago's Loop (was Re: Comfortable BART Trains!!)
DATE>Jul 9 19:56:30 1997
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Posted by Bryan Layne on July 01, 1997 at 15:58:00:
In Reply to: [6]3 Cheers for Chicago's Loop (was Re: Comfortable BART
Trains!!) posted by Mark S Feinman on June 30, 1997 at 12:23:45:
I second that motion!!
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NEXT>2578
PREVIOUS>2546
POSTER>Bryan Layne
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: R142 and 143 Pics
DATE>Jul 9 19:56:31 1997
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Posted by Bryan Layne on July 01, 1997 at 16:03:31:
In Reply to: [6]Re: R142 and 143 Pics posted by David Pirmann on July
01, 1997 at 11:40:49:
I found one!!Its a computer aided prototype though....[7]Go Here
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NEXT>2563
PREVIOUS>2553
POSTER>
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Don't turn Floyd-Bennet Field into a freaky train yard, take your ideas
DATE>Jul 9 19:56:33 1997
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In Reply to: [6]Re: Don't turn Floyd-Bennet Field into a freaky train
yard, take your ideas elsewhere (was Re: IRT Extension posted by Gary
Jacobi on June 29, 1997 at 22:23:56:
Please also remember that both the NEW YORK CITY POLICE DEPARTMENT Air
Units (the only City Agency with aircraft) and the US Coast Guard base
helicopters out of Floyd B. Field EVERYDAY!!!
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NEXT>2636
PREVIOUS>2525
POSTER>Lou
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Staten Island connection
DATE>Jul 9 19:56:34 1997
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Posted by Lou on July 01, 1997 at 16:13:48:
In Reply to: [6]Re: Staten Island connection posted by Charles Fiori
on June 27, 1997 at 08:23:56:
The MTA Staten Island Railway (SIRT-OA used to be) has a wye at St.
Gerogre but their car maintenance is done at a shop at Clifton (3rd
stop East of St. George). There is a MOW shop at Tomkinsville (1st
stop east of St. George). They also have a small police force/office
at that building too.
The R44's were rebuilt at Coney Island Shops when a contractor failed
a load test on one of the first rebuilts and then defaulted on the
contract (I think). As far as I know all maintenace is done at
Clifton.
When the cars went to and from Coney Island they were moved by truck
over the road.
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NEXT>
PREVIOUS>2533
POSTER>Lou
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: South Ferry
DATE>Jul 9 19:56:35 1997
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Posted by Lou on July 01, 1997 at 16:17:04:
In Reply to: [6]Re: South Ferry posted by Philip Ng on June 27, 1997
at 16:54:48:
TODAY the inner loop is used to turn #5 trains. It used to be for the
shuttle to Bowling Green. #1/9 run on the outer loop.
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NEXT>2569
PREVIOUS>2560
POSTER>
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Don't turn Floyd-Bennet Field into a freaky train yard, take your ideas
DATE>Jul 9 19:56:36 1997
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In Reply to: [5]Re: Don't turn Floyd-Bennet Field into a freaky train
yard, take your ideas elsewhere (was Re: IRT Extension posted by Gary
Jacobi on June 29, 1997 at 22:23:56:
Really? FBF was the cities main comercial airport until LGA opened?
What about Idlewild (now JFK)??
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NEXT>2634
PREVIOUS>2538
POSTER>Nathan
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Return Of the redbirds??? (Painting instructions)
DATE>Jul 9 19:56:38 1997
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Posted by Nathan on July 01, 1997 at 18:30:55:
In Reply to: [5]Re: Return Of the redbirds??? (Painting instructions)
posted by John on June 30, 1997 at 22:00:34:
I know what stainless steel is! Hmm, I guess I could try painting my
sink... Are you sure the subway cars are made of stainless steel and
not
just plain aluminum? Stainless steel is rather heavy...
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NEXT>2574
PREVIOUS>2552
POSTER>Nathan
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: 2nd Av. Light Rail idea
DATE>Jul 9 19:56:39 1997
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Posted by Nathan on July 01, 1997 at 18:42:03:
In Reply to: [5]Re: 2nd Av. Light Rail idea posted by Gary Jacobi on
July 01, 1997 at 12:29:19:
What city do you live in that has Light Rail? Ok, here is MY 2 cents:
Perhaps light rail technology can be used, but not street running.
Elevate the line, but not with traditional el structures. Use the new
"T"
sype supports: a single pier that supports 2 tracks. The single pier
would require the width of approximately 1 lane of traffic. (if the
line is run down the center of the road). The other thing that could
be done would
not require any roadspace (albeit being more expensive) would be to
have the elevated guideway running down the center of the street, and
have support columns on the sidewalk. 2 vertical support piers on
opposite sides of the road would support a horizontal beam (all beams
and piers are made of concrete) which would thus support the
guideway/track. A drawback of this design is the large shadows it
would produce, but all concrete piers and beams would be prefabricated
off-site and erected during the wee hours of the morning.
Otherwise, traditional heavy rail subway would be the only
alternative.
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NEXT>2592
PREVIOUS>2557
POSTER>Steve
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Does Graffitti stick to stanless steel???
DATE>Jul 9 19:56:40 1997
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Posted by Steve on July 01, 1997 at 18:50:05:
In Reply to: [5]Does Graffitti stick to stanless steel??? posted by
Zack on July 01, 1997 at 05:23:10:
Spray paint will adhere to stainless steel. The extent of the adhesion
is dependent on the type of finish the stainless steel has. As the
steel becomes more and more grained, the paint has a greater chance of
adhering, making it harder to remove. The R-110B has an extremely
grainy finish. Since it was built as a prototype, Bombardier did not
use a high quality stainless steel for the car body. This train would
be more difficult to clean that an R-32, even with the fluted sides.
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NEXT>2676
PREVIOUS>2547
POSTER>Nathan
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Trains like BART WOuld last in Chicago
DATE>Jul 9 19:56:42 1997
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Posted by Nathan on July 01, 1997 at 18:51:03:
In Reply to: [5]Re: Trains like BART WOuld last in Chicago posted by
Gary Jacobi on July 01, 1997 at 11:52:40:
well, aren't we getting a tad testy. Now, the BART cars would probably
last in Chicago simply because vandalism just isn't as prevalent as it
is/was on
NYC. No, all the people on the NYC subway aren't crazy, you've just
watched Seinfeld too much (ie naked man on subway). The carpet would
be a bummer to clean though, seeing as it would require vacuuming, not
a few swipes with a mop.
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NEXT>
PREVIOUS>2534
POSTER>Steve
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: IRT Extension
DATE>Jul 9 19:56:43 1997
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Posted by Steve on July 01, 1997 at 18:53:26:
In Reply to: [5]Re: IRT Extension posted by Jerry on June 30, 1997 at
17:15:42:
Yes, but Nostrand Avenue runs parallel and in close prooximity to the
other 4 major Brooklyn Lines. Besides, this would give subway access
to the residents of Mill Basin, who have no service now.
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NEXT>2605
PREVIOUS>2563
POSTER>
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Don't turn Floyd-Bennet Field into a freaky train yard, take your ideas
DATE>Jul 9 19:56:44 1997
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In Reply to: [5]Re: Don't turn Floyd-Bennet Field into a freaky train
yard, take your ideas elsewhere (was Re: IRT Extension posted by
Nathan on July 01, 1997 at 18:28:08:
Idlewild, I believe came after WWII
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NEXT>2684
PREVIOUS>2555
POSTER>Steve
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Funding MTA Projects
DATE>Jul 9 19:56:46 1997
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Posted by Steve on July 01, 1997 at 21:11:53:
In Reply to: [5]Funding MTA Projects posted by Julio Perez on July 01,
1997 at 07:40:18:
MTA bonds are currently thought of as a fairly good investment. The
bonds usually get a pretty good rating from Moodys or S&P. The raising
of capital for rail projects is not difficult through bond sales.
However, since this would account for about 10% of any project, it's
the other 90% that becomes problematic. Most of the money for transit
capital projects comes from the federal and state governments. NY's
current executive branch (the governor) is from upstate so mass
transit is not a high priority. The same can be said for the largly
republican (rural) congress. Since the NY airports are owned and
operated by the Port Authority of NY-NJ, any rail link would become
their project anyway.
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NEXT>2572
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>James
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>POP QUIZ
DATE>Jul 9 19:56:47 1997
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Posted by James on July 01, 1997 at 21:16:52:
Which subway line makes connections with the greatest number of
different lines and which lines does it not connect with?
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NEXT>2580
PREVIOUS>2571
POSTER>Andrew Byler
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: POP QUIZ
DATE>Jul 9 19:56:48 1997
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Posted by Andrew Byler on July 01, 1997 at 21:34:58:
In Reply to: [6]POP QUIZ posted by James on July 01, 1997 at 21:16:52:
An easy question ... The A train. From the A train one can connect to
every other line on the system with one transfer at one station.
From north to south ...
1,9,B,C - 168th St.
D - 145th St.
2,3,7,S(IRT),E,N,R - Times Square
L - 14th St.
F,Q - West 4th St.
4,5,6,J,M,Z - Broadway-Nassau St.
G - Hoyt-Schermerhorn Sts.
S (BMT) - Franklin Ave. (but only evenings, late nights, weekends)
S (IND) - Braod Channel
Any line missed? Not according to my map!
It should be notes that the C train makes the same connections except
for the S (IND), thus taking second place.
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PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>Andrew Byler
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: POP QUIZ (missed one!)
DATE>Jul 9 19:56:49 1997
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Posted by Andrew Byler on July 01, 1997 at 21:36:55:
In Reply to: [6]POP QUIZ posted by James on July 01, 1997 at 21:16:52:
Ooops! I got distracted while writing and forgot to mention that these
lines (A,C) do not connect with the 6!
Otheriwse, they make every connection.
Andy
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NEXT>2637
PREVIOUS>2565
POSTER>Brian
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: 2nd Av. Light Rail idea
DATE>Jul 9 19:56:50 1997
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Posted by Brian on July 01, 1997 at 22:21:42:
In Reply to: [6]Re: 2nd Av. Light Rail idea posted by Nathan on July
01, 1997 at 18:42:03:
Ideally, it would be run as an el. However, it would probably be
cheaper to build the tracks on the street, with a gate blocking the
traffic from entering the tracks. The tracks could just be put down,
although they would need to be built into the street at intersections.
Also, it would run with the traffic, with the downtown on 2nd, and
uptown on 1st. Also, this would be done between 23rd and 42nd on 10th
and 11th.
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NEXT>2579
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>Zack
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Can irt cars run on bmt/ind lines
DATE>Jul 9 19:56:52 1997
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Posted by Zack on July 01, 1997 at 22:51:41:
can irt cars run on bmt/ind lines??
and can the serve on thoes lines with plankes inbetween the cars and
platform??
*please excuse my spelling*
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NEXT>2577
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>Shig
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Child Fare in NYC Subway
DATE>Jul 9 19:56:53 1997
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Posted by Shig on July 01, 1997 at 23:10:26:
I looked at MTA site and could not find any infomation about
reduced fare for children in NYC subway.
Does a small child also have to pay $1.50 ? How about a baby ?
Are there other subway systems without reduced fare for
children ?
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NEXT>2601
PREVIOUS>2576
POSTER>Lou
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Child Fare in NYC Subway
DATE>Jul 9 19:56:54 1997
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Posted by Lou on July 01, 1997 at 23:38:11:
In Reply to: [5]Child Fare in NYC Subway posted by Shig on July 01,
1997 at 23:10:26:
Children under a certian height ride free. I don't know the height but
my 4yr old nephew still rides free with me.
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NEXT>2590
PREVIOUS>2559
POSTER>Lou
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: R142 and 143 Pics
DATE>Jul 9 19:56:56 1997
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Posted by Lou on July 01, 1997 at 23:41:01:
In Reply to: [5]Re: R142 and 143 Pics posted by Bryan Layne on July
01, 1997 at 16:03:31:
The requested URL /cityrail/r142nyct.gif/ was not found on this
server.
Check your link, this is what I got.
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NEXT>2589
PREVIOUS>2575
POSTER>Steve
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Can irt cars run on bmt/ind lines
DATE>Jul 9 19:56:57 1997
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Posted by Steve on July 01, 1997 at 23:46:25:
In Reply to: [5]Can irt cars run on bmt/ind lines posted by Zack on
July 01, 1997 at 22:51:41:
Mechanically, yes. The cars all run on the same gauge track and the
3rd rails are virtually the same height. Safetywise, though, IRT cars
cannot run n BMT tracks because the IRT Trip Cocks are on the opposite
side of the car from BMT/IND cars and therefore would not have
adequate signal protection...
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NEXT>2611
PREVIOUS>2572
POSTER>Steve
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: POP QUIZ
DATE>Jul 9 19:56:58 1997
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Posted by Steve on July 01, 1997 at 23:53:47:
In Reply to: [5]Re: POP QUIZ posted by Andrew Byler on July 01, 1997
at 21:34:58:
Correct but you missed a few connections. The A line connects with the
J/Z and L at B'Way - East NY.
It also connects with the 1/9 at time Sq and 59th St and the Fat Jay
St.
There are probably others.
The A also never connects with the #6.
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NEXT>2582
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>Al
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>how can i get from Laguardia to long Island???
DATE>Jul 9 19:56:59 1997
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Posted by Al on July 02, 1997 at 00:34:47:
i have looked at maps and i can't see where the subway connects to
laguardia. as you can tell i have never been to ny. i need to know the
easiest way to get from laguardia to syosset ny. also what's up with
this long island rail road>> could i get to syosset from LGAirport
using the longisland rail road
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NEXT>2583
PREVIOUS>2581
POSTER>Al
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>how can i get from Laguardia to long Island???
DATE>Jul 9 19:57:01 1997
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Posted by Al on July 02, 1997 at 00:35:16:
i have looked at maps and i can't see where the subway connects to
laguardia. as you can tell i have never been to ny. i need to know the
easiest way to get from laguardia to syosset ny. also what's up with
this long island rail road>> could i get to syosset from LGAirport
using the longisland rail road
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NEXT>2586
PREVIOUS>2582
POSTER>sam
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: how can i get from Laguardia to long Island???
DATE>Jul 9 19:57:02 1997
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Posted by sam on July 02, 1997 at 02:21:20:
In Reply to: [6]how can i get from Laguardia to long Island??? posted
by Al on July 02, 1997 at 00:34:47:
Its a pain in the ass so to speak.
The best thing to do is hop in a cab and go to Jamaica Center. From
there you can catch a train to Soyosset. Any Carey (Airport) bus will
only take you as far as Grand Central Terminal or the Port Authority
Bus Terminal. You're still going to be left with the problem of
getting to Penn Station.
Another solution is to take the regular city bus to the 74th Street
station (I forget which number it is, but you can find out at the
airport). From there, take the E train to Jamaica. Up above is the
Long Island Rail Road hub and you can find a train to Soyosset there.
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NEXT>2617
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>zeeve
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>2nd Ave Subway
DATE>Jul 9 19:57:03 1997
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Posted by zeeve on July 02, 1997 at 02:24:48:
Does anyone know if the Second Ave subway was to be IND, BMT or IRT?
And what lines would it connect with? Would it be part of the huge
connection at Canal Street?
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NEXT>2600
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>Joris Fiers
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>I want to buy turnstiles
DATE>Jul 9 19:57:04 1997
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Posted by Joris Fiers on July 02, 1997 at 06:26:08:
I am looking to buy turnstiles. Does anybody know where I can get them
at a decent price?
Thank you for any help you might offer.
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NEXT>2587
PREVIOUS>2583
POSTER>Dave
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: how can i get from Laguardia to long Island???
DATE>Jul 9 19:57:05 1997
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Posted by Dave on July 02, 1997 at 06:51:09:
In Reply to: [6]Re: how can i get from Laguardia to long Island???
posted by sam on July 02, 1997 at 02:21:20:
You cannot go directly between LaGuardia and Syosset on the LIRR. The
cheapest (albeit not the easiest) way is when you get off the plane,
exit the airport building and get on the Q33 bus. Take it to the last
stop, the 74st-Broadway subway station. Walk upstairs to the #7 train
(elevated) and take it to the 61st St.-Woodside stop. Walk downstairs
and you'll be at the Woodside LIRR station. From there you can take a
train to Syosset
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NEXT>2588
PREVIOUS>2586
POSTER>stan
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: how can i get from Laguardia to long Island???
DATE>Jul 9 19:57:07 1997
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Posted by stan on July 02, 1997 at 07:45:21:
In Reply to: [6]Re: how can i get from Laguardia to long Island???
posted by Dave on July 02, 1997 at 06:51:09:
There is another way, Carey bus runs Bus Service between LGA and the
Jamiaica Station of the LIRR, also between JFK and the Station,
the last time I took it it was $5 p/p
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NEXT>2621
PREVIOUS>2587
POSTER>stan
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: how can i get from Laguardia to long Island???
DATE>Jul 9 19:57:08 1997
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Posted by stan on July 02, 1997 at 07:45:38:
In Reply to: [6]Re: how can i get from Laguardia to long Island???
posted by Dave on July 02, 1997 at 06:51:09:
There is another way, Carey bus runs Bus Service between LGA and the
Jamiaica Station of the LIRR, also between JFK and the Station,
the last time I took it it was $5 p/p
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NEXT>
PREVIOUS>2579
POSTER>Peter Rosa
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Can irt cars run on bmt/ind lines
DATE>Jul 9 19:57:09 1997
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Posted by Peter Rosa on July 02, 1997 at 09:15:42:
In Reply to: [6]Can irt cars run on bmt/ind lines posted by Zack on
July 01, 1997 at 22:51:41:
IRT cars physically can run on BMT/IND lines and sometimes do when
traveling to Coney Island or other yards for maintenance service.
Except on the 7 line, however, the IRT cars have the t
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NEXT>2591
PREVIOUS>2578
POSTER>BryAN
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: R142 and 143 Pics
DATE>Jul 9 19:57:10 1997
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Posted by BryAN on July 02, 1997 at 10:03:23:
In Reply to: [5]Re: R142 and 143 Pics posted by Lou on July 01, 1997
at 23:41:01:
YA I GOT THE SAME THING ..I THOUGHT IT WAS AOL THOUGH CAUSE AOL IS
STUPID.
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NEXT>
PREVIOUS>2590
POSTER>Nick
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: R142 and 143 Pics
DATE>Jul 9 19:57:11 1997
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Posted by Nick on July 02, 1997 at 10:21:19:
In Reply to: [5]Re: R142 and 143 Pics posted by BryAN on July 02, 1997
at 10:03:23:
Bryan..Thanks for trying, but the NAI server said the same thing. If
you get it to work please e-mail me....THANKS
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NEXT>
PREVIOUS>2566
POSTER>Nick
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Does Graffitti stick to stanless steel???
DATE>Jul 9 19:57:12 1997
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Posted by Nick on July 02, 1997 at 10:24:06:
In Reply to: [6]Re: Does Graffitti stick to stanless steel??? posted
by M.J.S. on July 01, 1997 at 13:54:16:
Yes...sorry about that. I've looked through all the NYC subway cars
pages, which are terrific. However, I haven't "memorized" everything
yet, so please try to understand my petty mistakes...THANK YOU
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NEXT>2599
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>jcooper
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>R Train
DATE>Jul 9 19:57:14 1997
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Posted by jcooper on July 02, 1997 at 11:37:56:
Will the R train be extend from 95th street terminal to St georges st
terminal in Staten Island to connect with the SI rapid Transit in the
future? The money the MTA is making they can afford to build a tunnel
through the narrows.I hope so because I tired of paying two fares to
staten Is using the R train and S5 to see my cousins.
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NEXT>2598
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>jcooper
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>The R-62 on 7 Line?
DATE>Jul 9 19:57:15 1997
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Posted by jcooper on July 02, 1997 at 12:31:59:
Can the R-62 cars run on the 7 Line? And will it operate on the 7 line
in the near future? I'm tired of seeing the same red cars over and
over again. I like to hear the tones when the doors close.
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NEXT>2597
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>jcooper
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Any new cars becides as the R68's
DATE>Jul 9 19:57:16 1997
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Posted by jcooper on July 02, 1997 at 12:35:14:
Are there new cars out there? If they are, what line does it run on?
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NEXT>2665
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>Peter Rosa
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Can irt cars run on bmt/ind lines (Second try!)
DATE>Jul 9 19:57:17 1997
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Posted by Peter Rosa on July 02, 1997 at 13:26:34:
In Reply to: [6]Re: Can irt cars run on bmt/ind lines posted by Peter
Rosa on July 02, 1997 at 09:15:42:
Okay, hopefully it'll come out right *this* time :-) At any rate,
while IRT cars can fit on the BMT/IND lines, their trip cocks (used to
apply the brakes if a train passes a red signal) are on the "wrong"
side. An IRT train operating on BMT/IND tracks, for example one on the
way to the Coney Island yard for heavy maintenance, therefore has to
have a BMT/IND car coupled on the front to ensure proper trip cock
operation. I believe that the 7 train is an exception to this rule as
the cars used on the 7 have their trip cocks on the BMT/IND side.
Note also that an IRT train can't use BMT/IND tracks for passenger
service as the platform-door gap would be dangerously wide.
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NEXT>2630
PREVIOUS>2595
POSTER>John
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Any new cars becides as the R68's
DATE>Jul 9 19:57:18 1997
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Posted by John on July 02, 1997 at 13:27:24:
In Reply to: [5]Any new cars becides as the R68's posted by jcooper on
July 02, 1997 at 12:35:14:
The R-110A and 110B are the newest trains is service, but there are
only two of them (one each), and the run irregularly. As far as I
know, they are used on the A and the #2 line.
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NEXT>2673
PREVIOUS>2594
POSTER>John
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: The R-62 on 7 Line?
DATE>Jul 9 19:57:19 1997
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Posted by John on July 02, 1997 at 13:29:48:
In Reply to: [5]The R-62 on 7 Line? posted by jcooper on July 02, 1997
at 12:31:59:
A few R-62s ran on the #7 in the early 1980s, but they were taken off
afterwards. I think the R-142 will run on the 7 line once their
delivery commences.
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NEXT>2606
PREVIOUS>2593
POSTER>John
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: R Train
DATE>Jul 9 19:57:21 1997
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Posted by John on July 02, 1997 at 13:33:41:
In Reply to: [5]R Train posted by jcooper on July 02, 1997 at
11:37:56:
Don't count on a tunnel ever being built to Staten Island. We all know
who to blame for the condemnent of building a subway link to Staten
Island (i.e. - Gvnr. Robert Moses). As for the two fares, that will be
no longer if you buy a MetroCard Gold. With that card, you can make
free transfers between subway/bus, bus/subway within two hours of
using the card.
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NEXT>2604
PREVIOUS>2585
POSTER>John
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: I want to buy turnstiles
DATE>Jul 9 19:57:22 1997
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Posted by John on July 02, 1997 at 13:35:18:
In Reply to: [5]I want to buy turnstiles posted by Joris Fiers on July
02, 1997 at 06:26:08:
You know, I think it'd be pretty cool to own a turnstile. I could
practice turnstile-jumping :-)
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NEXT>2622
PREVIOUS>2577
POSTER>John
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Child Fare in NYC Subway
DATE>Jul 9 19:57:23 1997
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Posted by John on July 02, 1997 at 13:39:54:
In Reply to: [5]Re: Child Fare in NYC Subway posted by Lou on July 01,
1997 at 23:38:11:
Any child under 44 inches rides free by ducking under the turnstile
(or, if he/she is skilled, he/she can jump the turnstile).
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NEXT>2603
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>Mitch
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>"SWIPE HERE AGAIN!" or else!
DATE>Jul 9 19:57:24 1997
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Posted by Mitch on July 02, 1997 at 13:53:51:
Let's say you swipe your metrocard at a subway turnstile and it says
"SWIPE HERE AGAIN!". You try a couple more times, but keep getting the
same message. You think something's wrong with the card reader so you
go to a different turnstile and swipe the card. It works at the second
turnstile OK and you go through.
According to what I heard, this scenario may result in two fares being
deducted. If you look at the metrocard brochure, it says, "And if the
display says, "SWIPE AGAIN HERE!", swipe the card at the same
turnstile until the display says "GO". Do not move to another
turnstile. "
This is what I believe is happening: when you swipe the metrocard, it
has to (1) read the information on the card, (2) accept the card and
compute the new value, (3) write the new value to the card, and (4)
read back what it just wrote to make sure it verifies. Let's say that
it gets as far as step (3), but has a problem with step (4) because
you varied the swipe speed. The card has been debited by one fare, but
the transaction isn't finished -- you haven't gone through. When you
move prematurely to another turnstile, the new turnstile has no
knowledge that your transaction wasn't completed, and it debits the
card again.
I see a lot of people do this with metrocards -- they try at one
turnstile a couple of times and then give up and go to another. They
don't realize it, but I think they're being charged twice. Yet another
reason why I won't use the metrocard until forced.
Anyone have an opinion on this? Thanks.
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NEXT>2724
PREVIOUS>2602
POSTER>Peter Rosa
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: "SWIPE HERE AGAIN!" or else!
DATE>Jul 9 19:57:26 1997
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Posted by Peter Rosa on July 02, 1997 at 14:28:57:
In Reply to: [6]"SWIPE HERE AGAIN!" or else! posted by Mitch on July
02, 1997 at 13:53:51:
Twice within the last few weeks I got "SWIPE HERE AGAIN" messages but
ended up having to use other turnstiles when repeated re-swipings were
unsuccessful. Each time, the re-swiping at the second turnstile only
deducted a single fare. That's not to say that there isn't a risk of a
double deduction - I wouldn't use a second turnstile unless necessary
- but it's clearly not a certainty.
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NEXT>
PREVIOUS>2600
POSTER>Peter Rosa
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: I want to buy turnstiles
DATE>Jul 9 19:57:27 1997
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Posted by Peter Rosa on July 02, 1997 at 14:33:06:
In Reply to: [6]I want to buy turnstiles posted by Joris Fiers on July
02, 1997 at 06:26:08:
There's a clothing store called (I think) "Transit," on lower Broadway
south of Astor Place. The entryway has what looks like an authentic
turnstile. Store personnel might be able to tell you where they
acquired it.
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NEXT>2610
PREVIOUS>2569
POSTER>
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Don't turn Floyd-Bennet Field into a freaky train yard, take your ideas
DATE>Jul 9 19:57:28 1997
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In Reply to: [5]Re: Don't turn Floyd-Bennet Field into a freaky train
yard, take your ideas elsewhere (was Re: IRT Extension posted by Lou
on July 01, 1997 at 16:05:15:
So, I take it Coast Guard has NOT left Floyd Bennet; this is good
news.
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NEXT>2613
PREVIOUS>2599
POSTER>Michael Berson
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: R Train
DATE>Jul 9 19:57:29 1997
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Posted by Michael Berson on July 02, 1997 at 21:08:51:
In Reply to: [6]Re: R Train posted by John on July 02, 1997 at
13:33:41:
Would it be possible to have trains and cars share the lower level of
the Verrazanno Bridge? I believe there are 6 lanes of traffic on each
level (3 lanes each way). Couldn't some of that space on the lower
level be turned into a ROW for the R train?
Mike
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NEXT>2615
PREVIOUS>2473
POSTER>Michael Berson
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: How many possibilities are there?
DATE>Jul 9 19:57:30 1997
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Posted by Michael Berson on July 02, 1997 at 21:36:17:
In Reply to: [6]How many possibilities are there? posted by Bob on
June 27, 1997 at 20:14:27:
How about this one...
From Jamaica Center to Jamaica Center
You could follow the normal J route from Jamaica Center to Marcy
Avenue. Then cross the Williamsburg Bridge and take the cutoff to 6th
Avenue (old KK route). Uptown along 6th Avenue to 53rd Street. 53rd
Street Eastbound to Queens Plaza. From there, follow the route of the
E to Jamaica Center.
Mike
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NEXT>2609
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>M.J.S.
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: R142 and 143 Pics (WORKING LINK TO SAME PIC)
DATE>Jul 9 19:57:32 1997
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Posted by M.J.S. on July 02, 1997 at 22:05:58:
In Reply to: [6]Re: R142 and 143 Pics posted by Nick on July 02, 1997
at 10:21:19:
Check this link:
[7]www.geocities.com/SouthBeach/Lights/2742/r142nyct.gif (it's stored
on my website)
Now thank me for working hard and getting the pic for you all, that
happens to be the same pic that the original poster linked to.
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NEXT>2660
PREVIOUS>2608
POSTER>M.J.S.
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: R142 and 143 Pics (WORKING LINK TO SAME PIC)
DATE>Jul 9 19:57:33 1997
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Posted by M.J.S. on July 02, 1997 at 22:09:07:
In Reply to: [6]Re: R142 and 143 Pics posted by Nick on July 02, 1997
at 10:21:19:
Check this link:
[7]www.geocities.com/SouthBeach/Lights/2742/r142nyct.gif (it's stored
on my website)
Now thank me for working hard and getting the pic for you all, that
happens to be the same pic that the original poster linked to.
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NEXT>2647
PREVIOUS>2605
POSTER>
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Don't turn Floyd-Bennet Field into a freaky train yard, take your ideas
DATE>Jul 9 19:57:34 1997
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In Reply to: [6]Re: Don't turn Floyd-Bennet Field into a freaky train
yard, take your ideas elsewhere (was Re: IRT Extension posted by Steve
on July 01, 1997 at 18:55:33:
That's right New York International Airport was opened in 1948, as
soon as it opened the airport was nicknamed Idlewild and it's
abbreviation became IDL. The reason for the name was that Idlewild was
the name of the plot of land that the airport was built on (Look at
1888 USGS map available in historical maps section on this site!). In
1963, the month after the Kennedy Assasination the airport was renamed
and so was it's abbreviation, the name Idlewild soon after faded into
history.
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NEXT>2612
PREVIOUS>2580
POSTER>M.J.S.
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: POP QUIZ
DATE>Jul 9 19:57:35 1997
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Posted by M.J.S. on July 02, 1997 at 22:39:17:
In Reply to: [6]POP QUIZ posted by James on July 01, 1997 at 21:16:52:
(A) 8 Avenue Express
Does not connect to (6) or Lexington Avenue Local
2nd Place:
(R) Broadway Local
Does not connect to (S) Franklin Avenue Shuttle or (S) Rockaway Park
Shuttle
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NEXT>
PREVIOUS>2611
POSTER>Andrew Byler
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: POP QUIZ
DATE>Jul 9 19:57:36 1997
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Posted by Andrew Byler on July 02, 1997 at 22:40:43:
In Reply to: [6]Re: POP QUIZ posted by Steve on July 01, 1997 at
23:53:47:
Actually, I didn't miss them - I simply listed connections from north
to south. There is no point mentioning connections to the same line
multiple times, when the object is to list all the lines it connects
to.
Andy
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NEXT>2616
PREVIOUS>2606
POSTER>Zack
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: R Train
DATE>Jul 9 19:57:38 1997
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Posted by Zack on July 02, 1997 at 22:42:37:
In Reply to: [6]Re: R Train posted by Michael Berson on July 02, 1997
at 21:08:51:
insterating propisition but where would the traks come from in its way
across an incline??? on what route would it be on ??? would it be irt
or bmt/ind (i remeberd them :)) where would the displaced traffic go
to?? thers a lot more then just layin track.
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NEXT>2730
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>Zack
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>what will happen to the r-110's
DATE>Jul 9 19:57:39 1997
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Posted by Zack on July 02, 1997 at 22:46:49:
when the r 14x's arrive what will happen to the r-110's will they be
modidfed like R-14x's,will they be scrapped what wil happen to them???
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NEXT>2629
PREVIOUS>2607
POSTER>Andrew Byler
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: How many possibilities are there?
DATE>Jul 9 19:57:40 1997
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Posted by Andrew Byler on July 02, 1997 at 22:49:09:
In Reply to: [6]Re: How many possibilities are there? posted by
Michael Berson on July 02, 1997 at 21:36:17:
You could do the same thing on a few other routes.
Either the Dyre Ave. or White Plains Road lines from the Bronx could
run down Broadway-7th to South Ferry and then up Park-Lex to the
origin, and vice versa.
The N and D/Q or B and F could run as loops through Coney Island.
Fianlly, I think 6th and 8th Ave. could be used as loops via 53rd St.,
though I'd have to check the track maps to be certain.
Andy
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NEXT>2619
PREVIOUS>2613
POSTER>M.J.S.
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: R Train
DATE>Jul 9 19:57:42 1997
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Posted by M.J.S. on July 02, 1997 at 22:49:14:
In Reply to: [6]Re: R Train posted by Zack on July 02, 1997 at
22:42:37:
Please tell me one IRT line that comes anywhere near the Verrazano
Bridge and I will mail you a check for $100.00.
BTW, Please tell me what the difference is between the BMT and IND in
planning routes?
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NEXT>2628
PREVIOUS>2584
POSTER>M.J.S.
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: 2nd Ave Subway
DATE>Jul 9 19:57:43 1997
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Posted by M.J.S. on July 02, 1997 at 22:51:47:
In Reply to: [6]2nd Ave Subway posted by zeeve on July 02, 1997 at
02:24:48:
1. Please tell me what the MODERN difference of the BMT and IND is
2. There was to be no Canal Street station on the 2 Ave. Subway
3. IRT cars are narrower and shorter and cannot be moved to a major
repair shop without special provisions, so do you think anybody would
be stupid enough to build a new trunkline as IRT?
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NEXT>2623
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>M.J.S.
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>MORE R142 PICS
DATE>Jul 9 19:57:44 1997
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Posted by M.J.S. on July 02, 1997 at 23:14:20:
Check out 2 R142 pics now!!!
* [6]www.geocities.com/SouthBeach/Lights/2742/r142nyct.gifAlso
posted on another message.
* [7]http://www.geocities.com/SouthBeach/Lights/2742/nyctr142.jpg
Zoom of Pic 1
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NEXT>2620
PREVIOUS>2616
POSTER>Steve
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: R Train
DATE>Jul 9 19:57:45 1997
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Posted by Steve on July 02, 1997 at 23:22:57:
In Reply to: [5]Re: R Train posted by John on July 02, 1997 at
13:33:41:
Robert Moses was never a governor of NY or any other state.
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NEXT>2624
PREVIOUS>2619
POSTER>Steve
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: R Train
DATE>Jul 9 19:57:46 1997
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Posted by Steve on July 02, 1997 at 23:31:03:
In Reply to: [5]R Train posted by jcooper on July 02, 1997 at
11:37:56:
The lower deck of the Verrezanno bridge was built with the promise
that it would be used partially for a subway connection to Staten
Island (presumably an extension of the line from 4th Ave. & 95th St).
After the deck was added, Robert Moses, the master builder of NY, who
hated mass transit, had the subway link killed. Under the present
state government, I would not assume that the revival of the
Verrazanno Bridge subway link would be given serious consideration.
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NEXT>
PREVIOUS>2588
POSTER>Steve
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: how can i get from Laguardia to long Island???
DATE>Jul 9 19:57:48 1997
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Posted by Steve on July 02, 1997 at 23:35:18:
In Reply to: [6]how can i get from Laguardia to long Island??? posted
by Al on July 02, 1997 at 00:35:16:
Carey bus lines runs a bus at 30 minute intervals or less. It stops at
most of the LGA terminals and for $5.00, will take you to the LIRR
Jamaica Station.
You can get a train to Syossett there.
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NEXT>2626
PREVIOUS>2601
POSTER>~airplane
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Child Fare in NYC Subway
DATE>Jul 9 19:57:49 1997
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Posted by ~airplane on July 03, 1997 at 00:21:31:
In Reply to: [6]Re: Child Fare in NYC Subway posted by John on July
02, 1997 at 13:39:54:
I heard on the news last week that the mayor has a new plan to allow
children to ride the subway for $1.00 on weekends. When and if this
will happen is anyone's guess (if anyone has a guess, I'd like to hear
it).
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NEXT>2644
PREVIOUS>2618
POSTER>daibi
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: MORE R142 PICS
DATE>Jul 9 19:57:50 1997
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Posted by daibi on July 03, 1997 at 03:07:02:
In Reply to: [5]MORE R142 PICS posted by M.J.S. on July 02, 1997 at
23:14:20:
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NEXT>2625
PREVIOUS>2620
POSTER>Zack
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: R Train
DATE>Jul 9 19:57:51 1997
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Posted by Zack on July 03, 1997 at 04:43:42:
In Reply to: [6]Re: R Train posted by M.J.S. on July 02, 1997 at
22:49:14:
the #2,5 comr the closest that i can see
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NEXT>2627
PREVIOUS>2624
POSTER>Ben-Zion Y. Cassouto
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: R Train
DATE>Jul 9 19:57:53 1997
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Posted by Ben-Zion Y. Cassouto on July 03, 1997 at 05:41:10:
In Reply to: [6]Re: R Train posted by Zack on July 03, 1997 at
04:43:42:
Robert Moses succeeded in getting a lower level built BECAUSE of the
hint
that it would be available for a train link!
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NEXT>2670
PREVIOUS>2622
POSTER>Ben-Zion Y. Cassouto
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Child Fare in NYC Subway
DATE>Jul 9 19:57:54 1997
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Posted by Ben-Zion Y. Cassouto on July 03, 1997 at 05:44:39:
In Reply to: [6]Re: Child Fare in NYC Subway posted by John on July
02, 1997 at 13:39:54:
Boy I'm getting old it seems...
I was sure that someone would quote the old subway placards on this
subject:
"Small enough to ride for free - small enough to ride your knee"
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NEXT>2633
PREVIOUS>2625
POSTER>John
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: R Train
DATE>Jul 9 19:57:55 1997
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Posted by John on July 03, 1997 at 06:13:09:
In Reply to: [5]Re: R Train posted by Zack on July 03, 1997 at
04:43:42:
And it's STILL nowhere near the Verrezano Bridge.
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NEXT>2693
PREVIOUS>2617
POSTER>John
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: 2nd Ave Subway
DATE>Jul 9 19:57:56 1997
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Posted by John on July 03, 1997 at 06:15:29:
In Reply to: [5]Re: 2nd Ave Subway posted by M.J.S. on July 02, 1997
at 22:51:47:
There is no modern difference between the BMT and IND; the two
divisions are fully integrated.
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NEXT>2702
PREVIOUS>2615
POSTER>John
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: How many possibilities are there?
DATE>Jul 9 19:57:57 1997
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Posted by John on July 03, 1997 at 06:23:08:
In Reply to: [5]Re: How many possibilities are there? posted by Andrew
Byler on July 02, 1997 at 22:49:09:
Loop trains, huh? Not a bad idea. Is it possible to recreate the
Nassau Street Loop?
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NEXT>2632
PREVIOUS>2597
POSTER>Dave
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Any new cars becides as the R68's
DATE>Jul 9 19:57:58 1997
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Posted by Dave on July 03, 1997 at 06:50:59:
In Reply to: [6]Re: Any new cars becides as the R68's posted by John
on July 02, 1997 at 13:27:24:
Why the big jump in car numbers from R-68 to R-110? It seems the later
in time, the bigger the jump in the numbers. For example, the early
R's "moved" slowly - R-10, R-11, R-12, etc. Then later, R-32, R-36,
R-40, R-42. Then the jump from R-46 to R-62, followed by a large jump
from R-68 to R-110. Anyone have an explanation?
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NEXT>
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>Julio Perez
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Second Picture Not Found! (Was Re: MORE R142 PICS)
DATE>Jul 9 19:58:00 1997
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Posted by Julio Perez on July 03, 1997 at 07:44:20:
In Reply to: [6]MORE R142 PICS posted by M.J.S. on July 02, 1997 at
23:14:20:
GeoCities says the file
http://www.geocities.com/SouthBeach/Lights/2742/nyctr142.jpg is not
found. Are you sure that's the correct link???
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NEXT>2674
PREVIOUS>2630
POSTER>David Pirmann
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Any new cars becides as the R68's
DATE>Jul 9 19:58:01 1997
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Posted by David Pirmann on July 03, 1997 at 07:47:28:
In Reply to: [6]Re: Any new cars becides as the R68's posted by Dave
on July 03, 1997 at 06:50:59:
R-contract numbers are assigned to everything-- not just passenger
cars. There hasn't been a passenger car order since the R62 and R68 in
the 80s. So lots of numbers have been assigned to other things. For a
list, see
[7]http://www.quuxuum.org/~joekor/rroster.htm
-Dave
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NEXT>2635
PREVIOUS>2627
POSTER>David Pirmann
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: R Train
DATE>Jul 9 19:58:02 1997
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Posted by David Pirmann on July 03, 1997 at 07:50:37:
In Reply to: [6]Re: R Train posted by Steve on July 02, 1997 at
23:22:57:
> Robert Moses was never a governor of NY
Well, not officially.
--Dave
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NEXT>2642
PREVIOUS>2564
POSTER>Julio Perez
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Return Of the redbirds??? (Painting instructions)
DATE>Jul 9 19:58:03 1997
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Posted by Julio Perez on July 03, 1997 at 08:05:55:
In Reply to: [6]Re: Return Of the redbirds??? (Painting instructions)
posted by Nathan on July 01, 1997 at 18:30:55:
You don't paint stainless steel cars; you use colored adhesive rolls
to give them different colors.
At least that's what they did to Dade County's Metrorail (Miami),
using rolls of black, white, green, and light blue. Black was used
across the top half of the sides, and the other three colors went
across the same number of indentations along the fluting.
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NEXT>2641
PREVIOUS>2633
POSTER>Dan
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: R Train
DATE>Jul 9 19:58:04 1997
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Posted by Dan on July 03, 1997 at 09:37:32:
In Reply to: [6]R Train posted by jcooper on July 02, 1997 at
11:37:56:
The last thing we need on SI is a direct connection to the subway! It
would
cost a fortune to build, and another smaller fortune to extend the
platforms on the SIR to 10-car length (currently 4 or 5 car length),
install 'subway' signals, install turnstiles (currently pay-on-board).
Money would be better spent on buying more comfortable and reliable
express buses, a lot cheaper than any rail-based solution.
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NEXT>2648
PREVIOUS>2561
POSTER>Raymond
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Staten Island connection
DATE>Jul 9 19:58:06 1997
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Posted by Raymond on July 03, 1997 at 10:14:21:
In Reply to: [5]Re: Staten Island connection posted by Lou on July 01,
1997 at 16:13:48:
You are right about the maintainance facility. But the SIR cars are
airlifted via helicopter from St. George to Coney Island. The army
supplies the helicopters. It is an amazaing sight to see, but it
works!
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NEXT>2650
PREVIOUS>2574
POSTER>Andrew Byler
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: 2nd Av. Light Rail idea
DATE>Jul 9 19:58:07 1997
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Posted by Andrew Byler on July 03, 1997 at 12:42:36:
In Reply to: [6]Re: 2nd Av. Light Rail idea posted by Brian on July
01, 1997 at 22:21:42:
Some of you just don't seem to get it.
If you reserve a right of way on the curb of 2nd and 1st Aves., you
very negatively impact the ability of hundreds of businesses to
receive deliveries. You also create a fire hazard, because ballast
construction track is inacessible to fire trucks. Having the live
wires near the buildings also does no good for the fire fighters.
If you don't make open construction ballasted track, you run the 100%
probable risk of having the line blocked by taxis, cars, trucks, etc.
who think it is their god given right to swerve across all lanes of
traffic to turn and double park. This defeats the whole notion of a
reserved right of way.
If you run the track down the middle of the street, any semblance of
fluidity to the traffic which now exists will be lost, because now
traffic will be unable to cross from one side of the street to the
other. This will cause all sorts of hassles in temrs of turning,
moving around stopped cars, etc.
Further, resignalling the lights to be triggered by trolleys destroys
one of the few good things about New York traffic - the synchronized
lights ont he North-South streets, which allow for a much higher
traffic capacity than would attain under a scheme with a Light Rail
line running down the street.
An elevated line is also incredibly stupid. Property values are high
along 2nd and 3rd Aves., because els were ripped down. These were not
fashionable places to live along until that occurred. Putting an el
back in defeats the entire purpose of having ripped it down in the
first place. It will throw the street into darkness much worse than it
is now from the highrises. Further, the support pillars are an
obstacle to traffic and *will* cause numerous wrecks. The whole reason
els are ripped down and placed in subways is to counter all of these
problems.
Finally, millions of the taxpayers dollars have been spent creating
large unused chunks of the 2nd Ave. Subway. From north to south, money
has been spent buying the Westchester line right of way (currently
unused) from 180th St. to 132nd St. in the South Bronx; building
unused tunnels from 121st St. to 110th St., 106th St. to 98th St., a
flying juntion at 63rd St., building the 63rd St. tunnel all the way
to 7th Ave. to allow connections with the express tracks there, 9th
St. to 2nd St., over the 2nd Ave. F Station, building the Chrysite St.
Connection in a fashion compatible with the proposed subway, and under
the Manhattan Bridge Plaza in Manhattan. Also, money has been spent
preparing final engineering plans for the entire subway, and planning
the conversion of the Dyre Ave. line. And lastly, the newer subway
cars have been purposely built more expensively at higher standards to
be able to operate at 70 or 75 mph speeds on the 2nd Ave line and the
63rd St.-Queensbridge-Archer Ave. lines.
To now throw all this investment away for a slow technology which will
increase the surface chaos is ludicrous even by New York standards.
What is discouraging is that seemingly intelligent politicians (or is
that an oxymoron) and community "activists" take stupid proposals like
this seriously enough to fund studies of them, when the best solution
is not merely already known, but already designed and partially built.
Andy
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NEXT>2672
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>Andrew Byler
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Is there hope for New York Subways?
DATE>Jul 9 19:58:08 1997
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Posted by Andrew Byler on July 03, 1997 at 13:08:59:
I was just thinking about this, and it is something everyone should
consider when they talk grandiose plans about subway extensions.
Under the TA and MTA since unification in 1940, the Subway has
accomplished just about zilch in terms of new constrcution, despite
billions being allocated to it.
1941 - Dyre Ave. (rebuild)
1948 - E. New York to Euclid (replacement for el)
1950 - 169th to 179th on the E/F
1954 - Church to Ditmas on the F
1956 - Rockaways (rebuild)
1967 - Chrsytie St. Connection
1968 - 6th Ave. express tracks and extension to 57th St.
1968 - 145th to 148th on the 3
1989 - 63rd St. Tunnel
1989 - Archer Ave. (replacement for el)
The same period saw the abandonment of the 3rd Ave. and Myrtle Ave
els, the 9th Ave. shuttle from Jerome Ave. to the Polo Grounds (which
could have been easily turned into an extension of the 3 with very
little investment), and the Culver Shuttle.
Comparing this to the previous period from 1904 to 1940 makes it look
exceedingly unfavorable. It looks even worse when you recall what was
never accomplished but promised (2nd Ave., Queens Express Bypass, LI
Exp. line, Rosedale extension, Utica Ave line, Nostrand Ave.
extension, extending the L, Midtown crosstown line, replacing the 3rd
Ave el in the Bronx, connecting to Staten Island - then of course
there is the whole IND 2nd System, some of which included previously
mentioned lines, some of which did not).
A pretty pathetic record.
Andy
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PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>Ted Nielsen
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>STCUM Metro depots
DATE>Jul 9 19:58:09 1997
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Posted by Ted Nielsen on July 03, 1997 at 14:01:49:
Does anyone know where the Montreal Metro depots are located ?
( near what stations , how many are there , are they all underground ?
)
I tried to get this question answered already but with no luck.
thanks.
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NEXT>
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>M.J.S.
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>WORKS NOW!!!(was Re: Second Picture Not Found! (Was Re: MORE R142 PICS))
DATE>Jul 9 19:58:11 1997
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Posted by M.J.S. on July 03, 1997 at 14:12:30:
In Reply to: [6]Second Picture Not Found! (Was Re: MORE R142 PICS)
posted by Julio Perez on July 03, 1997 at 07:44:20:
Try it now, I forgot to upload it the first time.
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NEXT>2643
PREVIOUS>2635
POSTER>John
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: R Train
DATE>Jul 9 19:58:12 1997
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Posted by John on July 03, 1997 at 14:12:53:
In Reply to: [5]Re: R Train posted by David Pirmann on July 03, 1997
at 07:50:37:
Than why is the State Park on Fire Island named after him? And why is
there a Robert Moses Bridge near Buffalo/Niagara Falls?
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NEXT>
PREVIOUS>2634
POSTER>John
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Return Of the redbirds??? (Painting instructions)
DATE>Jul 9 19:58:13 1997
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Posted by John on July 03, 1997 at 14:15:27:
In Reply to: [5]Re: Return Of the redbirds??? (Painting instructions)
posted by Julio Perez on July 03, 1997 at 08:05:55:
I had a suspician that that kind of thing was used. Because otherwise,
how did the R-44s and R-46s manage to maintain that deep blue band
that ran along its side and the light blue that ran up the ends of the
cars.
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NEXT>2656
PREVIOUS>2641
POSTER>M.J.S.
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: R Train
DATE>Jul 9 19:58:14 1997
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Posted by M.J.S. on July 03, 1997 at 14:19:41:
In Reply to: [6]Re: R Train posted by John on July 03, 1997 at
14:12:53:
One need not be governor to have landmarks named after one's self.
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NEXT>
PREVIOUS>2623
POSTER>Lou
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: MORE R142 PICS
DATE>Jul 9 19:58:16 1997
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Posted by Lou on July 03, 1997 at 15:46:04:
In Reply to: [5]MORE R142 PICS posted by M.J.S. on July 02, 1997 at
23:14:20:
Sorry It don't work here is their nice message:
Unfortunately, we couldn't find the file that you're looking for at
http://www.geocities.com/SouthBeach/Lights/2742/nyctr142.jpg .
Are you sure you typed it correctly?
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NEXT>
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>Lou
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: R Train JULY 4th NO 3 FARES from STATEN ISLAND
DATE>Jul 9 19:58:17 1997
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Posted by Lou on July 03, 1997 at 15:56:05:
In Reply to: [5]R Train posted by jcooper on July 02, 1997 at
11:37:56:
Please remember that on the 4th SIRT to the Ferry to the Subway will
be ONE FARE ($1.50). As well as S59/S79 to the R and the express buses
to the subway.
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NEXT>
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>Lou
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: R Train Robert Moses
DATE>Jul 9 19:58:18 1997
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Posted by Lou on July 03, 1997 at 15:59:03:
In Reply to: [5]Re: R Train posted by John on July 03, 1997 at
14:12:53:
Robert Moses desgined all a lot of the roadways in and out and around
New York City/State. He hated Mass Transit but love the Parkway.
(Why do you NOT Drive on a Driveway and Park on a Parkway??)
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NEXT>
PREVIOUS>2610
POSTER>
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Don't turn Floyd-Bennet Field into a freaky train yard, take your ideas
DATE>Jul 9 19:58:20 1997
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In Reply to: [5]Re: Don't turn Floyd-Bennet Field into a freaky train
yard, take your ideas elsewhere (was Re: IRT Extension posted by Gary
Jacobi on July 02, 1997 at 19:48:30:
With the closing of Goveners Island and down sizing of the Operation
of the Coast Guard unit here they do plan to move the Air Ops to NJ. I
don't know if it has happened as in the same time they left Gov.
Island.
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NEXT>2669
PREVIOUS>2636
POSTER>Lou
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Staten Island connection
DATE>Jul 9 19:58:21 1997
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Posted by Lou on July 03, 1997 at 16:05:55:
In Reply to: [5]Re: Staten Island connection posted by Raymond on July
03, 1997 at 10:14:21:
Helicopeter???
I saw in the Staten Island Advance (back then) them loading the cars
on flat cars. Maybe those are the ones that went/came back from the
contractor?
Helicopter, hehe love it.
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NEXT>2657
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>Garfield
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Graffitti Is Here To Stay ???
DATE>Jul 9 19:58:22 1997
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Posted by Garfield on July 03, 1997 at 17:12:20:
I assume that everyone has noticed the difference between the subway
cars of the 80's and what we have today. Forget about the air
conditioning and musical chimes for the doors. The overall appearance
of the cars both inside and out concerning graffitti. Back then you
would have to worry if the seat you were about to sit on was dry after
vandals did their artwork. There is a dramatic change. The T.A's whole
fleet of subway cars literally had a big sign to vandals that said
"Come and spray paint on my interior/exterior finish". Again, nowadays
it's rare that you find a subway car in the system with graffitti to
that nature. But now this "new" thing of scrathing the glass is upon
us. There would be times where I would try to look out of a window
outside and see a complete blur. My next question is how the T.A going
to fight this problem. At first, the cars had this type of flexiglass
as windows. Then the T.A decided to put regular glass but was to no
help. So far they've won the battle on spray painting; but now it's
"scratchitti".
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NEXT>2651
PREVIOUS>2637
POSTER>Nathan
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: 2nd Av. Light Rail idea
DATE>Jul 9 19:58:23 1997
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Posted by Nathan on July 03, 1997 at 17:20:00:
In Reply to: [5]Re: 2nd Av. Light Rail idea posted by Andrew Byler on
July 03, 1997 at 12:42:36:
The pillars would not be sticking out of the road, meaning drivers
would
have to swerve whenever there was a pillar, but one lane of traffic
would
have to become a median, raised (about a foot) above the roadway and
have the piers on that. But no, I have never heard of drivers in miami
hitting pillars...
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NEXT>2652
PREVIOUS>2650
POSTER>Bingo
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: 2nd Av. Light Rail idea
DATE>Jul 9 19:58:25 1997
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Posted by Bingo on July 03, 1997 at 17:20:37:
In Reply to: [5]Re: 2nd Av. Light Rail idea posted by Nathan on July
01, 1997 at 18:42:03:
A drawback to that idea is that it would not meet the code for
earthquakes and floods.
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NEXT>2682
PREVIOUS>2651
POSTER>Nathan
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: 2nd Av. Light Rail idea
DATE>Jul 9 19:58:26 1997
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Posted by Nathan on July 03, 1997 at 17:20:44:
In Reply to: [5]Re: 2nd Av. Light Rail idea posted by Andrew Byler on
July 03, 1997 at 12:42:36:
The pillars would not be sticking out of the road, meaning drivers
would
have to swerve whenever there was a pillar, but one lane of traffic
would
have to become a median, raised (about a foot) above the roadway and
have the piers on that. But no, I have never heard of drivers in miami
hitting pillars...
But no, it would be best to use subway technology.
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NEXT>2654
PREVIOUS>2535
POSTER>Bingo
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: STCUM Depots
DATE>Jul 9 19:58:27 1997
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Posted by Bingo on July 03, 1997 at 17:41:46:
In Reply to: [5]Re: STCUM Depots posted by Brian on June 29, 1997 at
23:35:02:
The tires run on separate running boards next to the rails. The guide
wheels (the tires on the side of the bogie that keep the train stable
within the rail trench) run on insulated boards that are on each wall
of the trench. For those who don't know, Metro opened in 1966, runs
two series of rolling stock, MR-63 and MR-73, and has 5 lines, 1,2,4,5
and 6.
Why is there no 3? That's an interesting story. Has something to do
with Expo 67.
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NEXT>2661
PREVIOUS>2653
POSTER>John
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: STCUM Depots
DATE>Jul 9 19:58:28 1997
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Posted by John on July 03, 1997 at 18:17:05:
In Reply to: [5]Re: STCUM Depots posted by Bingo on July 03, 1997 at
17:41:46:
The Metro has two types of trains? When I was in Montreal, I only
noticed one type. What's the difference between the two?
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NEXT>2769
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>Brian W
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Toronto Subway Expansion
DATE>Jul 9 19:58:30 1997
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Posted by Brian W on July 03, 1997 at 18:41:40:
In Reply to: [6]Re: TTC and STCUM (This is the Toronto one) posted by
Bingo on June 28, 1997 at 13:30:41:
Well, after a week and a bit, I'm finally back!!! My modem was bombed
by lightning during a wicked thunderstorm, and has now been replaced.
Anyway, I have a lot to say.
The current TTC subway expansion strategy indicates that once the
Sheppard line is complete, the next step will be to build an Eglinton
West Subway (YES!!), extend the Spadina line from Downsview to York
University (GOOD THINKING), and extend the Scarborough RT up to
Sheppard Ave. (WAIT A SEC...). Now why in the HELL would they want to
waste money extending the Scarborough RT up to Sheppard when what the
system really needs is a station at Yonge/Steeles? I live in that area
and, trust me, the traffic is choking Yonge St. Whenever I go
downtown, the Steeles West bus becomes an integral part of my trip.
Since there's no Steeles station, the bus has to go down Yonge to
Finch station. It is joined by all the other buses that go into the
station, like Steeles East, Yonge, Drewry, Cummer, not to mention
Finch West, Finch East, and all the buses from other systems, like
Vaughan Transit, Markham Transit, and GO Transit. With all this bus
activity using the stretch of Yonge Street from Steeles to Finch,
traffic is HELL. If they made a simple Steeles subway station, this
problem would be resolved.
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NEXT>
PREVIOUS>2643
POSTER>Gary Jacobi
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: R Train
DATE>Jul 9 19:58:31 1997
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Posted by Gary Jacobi on July 03, 1997 at 21:48:19:
In Reply to: [5]Re: R Train posted by John on July 03, 1997 at
14:12:53:
Moses held jusat about every powerful post, including the Niagra power
net work, and LI park comission. If you never read another book, you
must read The Power Broker by Robert Caro. It is a huge book, but it
had to be to retell everything Moses did.
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NEXT>2728
PREVIOUS>2649
POSTER>Steve
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Graffitti Is Here To Stay ???
DATE>Jul 9 19:58:32 1997
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Posted by Steve on July 03, 1997 at 21:48:29:
In Reply to: [5]Graffitti Is Here To Stay ??? posted by Garfield on
July 03, 1997 at 17:12:20:
There are several measures now being tested. There are newer types of
glass and replaceable protectice sheets over the glass. If all else
faills, enthusiastic enforcement of the laws is always an option.
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NEXT>2717
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>Michael Adler
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>NYC Subway in 2020
DATE>Jul 9 19:58:34 1997
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Posted by Michael Adler on July 03, 1997 at 21:52:19:
Wondering what NYC Subway will be like in the year of 2020? do you
think older els will still be there (like J/Z line in Bklyn & Qns,
etc...) and how much do you think the fare will be?
Michael Adler
Lakewood, ColorFUL Colorado
Former Jackson Hgts resident
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NEXT>
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>Todd
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>AC Propulsion on the C line
DATE>Jul 9 19:58:35 1997
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Posted by Todd on July 03, 1997 at 22:03:27:
The TA has begun testing AC propulsion on the C Line. 8 R-38 cars,
numbered 4040 - 4047 are now in service on the C line. They will run
during AM to PM hours Mon.-Fri. during a 1 year test. They will be
identified by a 'RED DIAMOND' under the car number.
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NEXT>2675
PREVIOUS>2609
POSTER>Dan Lawrence
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: R142 and 143 Pics (WORKING LINK TO SAME PIC)
DATE>Jul 9 19:58:36 1997
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Posted by Dan Lawrence on July 03, 1997 at 22:13:40:
In Reply to: [5]Re: R142 and 143 Pics (WORKING LINK TO SAME PIC)
posted by M.J.S. on July 02, 1997 at 22:09:07:
Guess what?? The link to Geocities still doesn't work. (Geocities
gives the message "can't find the file you want")
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NEXT>2662
PREVIOUS>2654
POSTER>Sylvain
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: STCUM Depots
DATE>Jul 9 19:58:37 1997
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Posted by Sylvain on July 03, 1997 at 22:56:46:
In Reply to: [6]Re: STCUM Depots posted by Bingo on July 03, 1997 at
17:41:46:
There is no #6 line in Montral. The number is/was for a line along Pie
IX Bd to Rivière-des-Prairies. I don`t know if it will ever be
built...
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NEXT>2767
PREVIOUS>2661
POSTER>Sylvain
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: STCUM Depots
DATE>Jul 9 19:58:38 1997
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Posted by Sylvain on July 03, 1997 at 22:57:28:
In Reply to: [6]Re: STCUM Depots posted by Bingo on July 03, 1997 at
17:41:46:
There is no #6 line in Montreal. The number 3 is/was for a line along
Pie IX Bd to Rivière-des-Prairies. I don`t know if it will ever be
built...
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NEXT>2664
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>David Pirmann
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>A TRAIN DERAILMENT - 7/3/1997
DATE>Jul 9 19:58:40 1997
EMAILNOTICES>no
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Posted by David Pirmann on July 03, 1997 at 23:01:45:
I just heard this-- a southbound A train has derailed near 135th St.
Station. Apparently the rear few cars somehow derailed, probably on
one of the four switches between 145th St. and 135th St. The report
says that at least one car was completely totalled and sheared off a
number of support columns between the tracks.
The EMS report says that about 6 people were injured, no one killed.
The power is off on the 8th Avenue line between 168th Street and at
least 125th Street. All other trains in the area are being evacuated.
Therefore there is no service on the A, B, C, D lines. From looking at
the track maps I would say service is suspended above 59th or 72nd
street at minimum.
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NEXT>2666
PREVIOUS>2663
POSTER>Zack
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: A TRAIN DERAILMENT - 7/3/1997
DATE>Jul 9 19:58:41 1997
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Posted by Zack on July 03, 1997 at 23:30:07:
In Reply to: [6]A TRAIN DERAILMENT - 7/3/1997 posted by David Pirmann
on July 03, 1997 at 23:01:45:
what type of cars were they,was it in the subway or above ground, and
are there any pictures????
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NEXT>2668
PREVIOUS>2596
POSTER>John Lant
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Can irt cars run on bmt/ind lines (Second try!)
DATE>Jul 9 19:58:42 1997
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Posted by John Lant on July 04, 1997 at 00:10:10:
In Reply to: [6]Re: Can irt cars run on bmt/ind lines (Second try!)
posted by Peter Rosa on July 02, 1997 at 13:26:34:
YOU ARE CORRECT. While IRT Subway cars can fit on the BMT rails,the
cars are much shorter and narrower than the IND & BMT cars, and IRT
trip cocks and cab are located on opposite sides. This arrangement
makes the operation on the normal main lines almost impossiable do to
the signal interlocking structures along the way. By the way BMT & IND
can be run on the same line with out any problems. The IRT car's have
to be shorter and narrower because the IRT subway was the first of the
Railroads to be built in NYC and they followed the early designs
borrowed from Europe.
By the way are you the Train Master for the IRT?
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NEXT>2667
PREVIOUS>2664
POSTER>David Pirmann
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: A TRAIN DERAILMENT - 7/3/1997
DATE>Jul 9 19:58:43 1997
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Posted by David Pirmann on July 04, 1997 at 00:12:19:
In Reply to: [6]Re: A TRAIN DERAILMENT - 7/3/1997 posted by Zack on
July 03, 1997 at 23:30:07:
Don't know what kind of cars. Either R44 or R38 presumably.
The 8th Avenue line is in subway at that point (and in fact, all the
way to it's northern terminals).
No pictures -- no newscrews are allowed downstairs yet.
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NEXT>2678
PREVIOUS>2666
POSTER>Steve
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: A TRAIN DERAILMENT - 7/3/1997
DATE>Jul 9 19:58:45 1997
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Posted by Steve on July 04, 1997 at 00:36:28:
In Reply to: [5]Re: A TRAIN DERAILMENT - 7/3/1997 posted by David
Pirmann on July 04, 1997 at 00:12:19:
21:41 A derailed at 135th Street. R-44s were involved. The last 2 were
very heavily damaged. Looks like the last car picked a switch @ 135th
Street on A3 track.
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NEXT>2671
PREVIOUS>2665
POSTER>Steve
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Can irt cars run on bmt/ind lines (Second try!)
DATE>Jul 9 19:58:46 1997
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Posted by Steve on July 04, 1997 at 00:41:32:
In Reply to: [5]Re: Can irt cars run on bmt/ind lines (Second try!)
posted by John Lant on July 04, 1997 at 00:10:10:
Peter might be correct but you certainly are not. The cabs on IRT
equipment are definitely NOT on the opposite side as compared to the
BMT/IND equipment. For the record, on IND/BMT equipment, the tripcock
is located on the corners of the car which is opposite the T/O cab. On
IRT equipment (Except the #7 line cars) the trip cock is located on
the same side as the cab. #7 line cars are equipped the same way as
the BMT/IND cars in so far as the trip cock is concerned.
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NEXT>2679
PREVIOUS>2648
POSTER>Jim
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SUBJECT>Re: Staten Island connection
DATE>Jul 9 19:58:47 1997
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Posted by Jim on July 04, 1997 at 00:43:43:
In Reply to: [5]Re: Staten Island connection posted by Raymond on July
03, 1997 at 10:14:21:
Next we'll be hearing stories about retractable tracks on the
Verrezanno Narrows bridge.
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NEXT>2695
PREVIOUS>2626
POSTER>M.J.S.
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Child Fare in NYC Subway
DATE>Jul 9 19:58:49 1997
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Posted by M.J.S. on July 04, 1997 at 00:59:04:
In Reply to: [6]Re: Child Fare in NYC Subway posted by ~airplane on
July 03, 1997 at 00:21:31:
But they already ride free this is BAD!!!!
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NEXT>2692
PREVIOUS>2668
POSTER>Shane
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Can irt cars run on bmt/ind lines (Second try!)
DATE>Jul 9 19:58:50 1997
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Posted by Shane on July 04, 1997 at 01:54:44:
In Reply to: [6]Re: Can irt cars run on bmt/ind lines (Second try!)
posted by Steve on July 04, 1997 at 00:41:32:
Is it true that the cars originally did not have proper spacing
between rails, and that when unification occured, the tracks were
matched and the wheels on BMT/IND/IRT were adjusted appropriately?
I seem to remember that European track widths are different than the
USA. Or was that European track widths are different than non-Allied
tracks for wartime intersystem blockage reasons.
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NEXT>2699
PREVIOUS>2638
POSTER>Zee've
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Is there hope for New York Subways?
DATE>Jul 9 19:58:52 1997
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Posted by Zee've on July 04, 1997 at 03:48:12:
In Reply to: [6]Is there hope for New York Subways? posted by Andrew
Byler on July 03, 1997 at 13:08:59:
I whole-heartedly agree. However, what is it going to take to get
politicians to own up to the fact that our system is now inadequate
for the living patterns in New York? There are so many holes in the
system no service to LaGuardia or Kennedy (direct), Mill Basin in
Brooklyn, Staten Island, Bayside in Queens and Central Queens. What
kills me is that there is funding and in some cases trackage available
(the old Rockaway bypass on the A line) that could be utilized. Hey
someone: wake up!!!
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NEXT>
PREVIOUS>2598
POSTER>Charles
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: The R-62 on 7 Line?
DATE>Jul 9 19:58:53 1997
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Posted by Charles on July 04, 1997 at 09:12:38:
In Reply to: [6]Re: The R-62 on 7 Line? posted by John on July 02,
1997 at 13:29:48:
I agree with the fact that the flushing line needs new cars. The older
cars though they are workhorses they are showing their age. However
the R142's will first go to the 2/5 lines to replace the R26,28,29's
The R36's on the flushing line will be the last of the "redbirds" to
go. I heard a rumor that when the R62A's ran out on the flushing line
that they lost a few guard lights in the Stienway tunnel.
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NEXT>2737
PREVIOUS>2632
POSTER>Dave
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Any new cars becides as the R68's
DATE>Jul 9 19:58:54 1997
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Posted by Dave on July 04, 1997 at 10:19:09:
In Reply to: [6]Re: Any new cars becides as the R68's posted by David
Pirmann on July 03, 1997 at 07:47:28:
Very interesting, David. Thanks!
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NEXT>
PREVIOUS>2660
POSTER>subway-buff
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: R142 and 143 Pics (WORKING LINK TO SAME PIC)
DATE>Jul 9 19:58:55 1997
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Posted by subway-buff on July 04, 1997 at 10:29:45:
In Reply to: [6]Re: R142 and 143 Pics (WORKING LINK TO SAME PIC)
posted by M.J.S. on July 02, 1997 at 22:05:58:
I checked * all* the links and one work. I still get the same error
message.
I am convinced that these pics are the 90s version of the second ave
subway- here but not here !
Like Roosevelt Ave IND- disused platform witrh tile and no track ....
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NEXT>2685
PREVIOUS>2567
POSTER>subway-buff
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Trains like BART WOuld last in Chicago
DATE>Jul 9 19:58:57 1997
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Posted by subway-buff on July 04, 1997 at 10:33:15:
In Reply to: [6]Re: Trains like BART WOuld last in Chicago posted by
Nathan on July 01, 1997 at 18:51:03:
Carpet would not work in * any* train. If you will ride Atlanta's
MARTA trains, they have carpet and especially on their 1xx numbered
cars the carpet is black, dirty, matted, ... etc. not the intended
beige-ish
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NEXT>
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>M.J.S.
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>R142 Picture
DATE>Jul 9 19:58:58 1997
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Posted by M.J.S. on July 04, 1997 at 12:07:07:
In Reply to: [6]Re: R142 and 143 Pics (WORKING LINK TO SAME PIC)
posted by subway-buff on July 04, 1997 at 10:29:45:
The reason picture B is not appearing is that I've been having
problems uploading to GeoCities.
BTW, neither link works now
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NEXT>2688
PREVIOUS>2667
POSTER>Gerry O'Regan
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: A TRAIN DERAILMENT - 7/3/1997
DATE>Jul 9 19:58:59 1997
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Posted by Gerry O'Regan on July 04, 1997 at 13:20:10:
In Reply to: [6]Re: A TRAIN DERAILMENT - 7/3/1997 posted by Steve on
July 04, 1997 at 00:36:28:
This type of wreck seems to be among the more frequent and
destructive. I know that with ATO in Boston speed limits are reduced
while passing over some switches, with a resultant slowing of run
times. Hopefully this won't happen in NYC as a result of these wrecks.
Two possible causes come to mind, broken rails or a broken axle on a
car. Either of these are virtually impossible to prevent aince they
often happen spontaneously. Thank God for no fatalities this time.
One question though:
Would a 'black rail' in an appropriate location have prevented these
cars from wandering so far from the 4'8.5", maybe reducing damage?
Gerry
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NEXT>2689
PREVIOUS>2669
POSTER>John
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Staten Island connection
DATE>Jul 9 19:59:00 1997
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Posted by John on July 04, 1997 at 14:08:52:
In Reply to: [5]Re: Staten Island connection posted by Jim on July 04,
1997 at 00:43:43:
And how some other "lunitic" will say that they were on the R train
and it crossed the Verrezano Bridge.
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NEXT>2683
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>Zack
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>private intrenst
DATE>Jul 9 19:59:01 1997
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Posted by Zack on July 04, 1997 at 19:07:22:
why doesent NYCTA bring big bisness into the picture. they could trade
advertisements on cars and in sattions for money to help build the
subway and when building ro re-building the subway they could make it
atomated and a standard with then it currently is. and give tax breaks
as incentives
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NEXT>2687
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>Nathan
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: A TRAIN DERAILMENT - 7/3/1997(pictures(
DATE>Jul 9 19:59:03 1997
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Posted by Nathan on July 04, 1997 at 19:30:09:
In Reply to: [5]Re: A TRAIN DERAILMENT - 7/3/1997 posted by Zack on
July 03, 1997 at 23:30:07:
That would be a good photo tour on this site, NYC Train-Wrecks...
:)
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NEXT>2686
PREVIOUS>2652
POSTER>Nathan
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: 2nd Av. Light Rail idea
DATE>Jul 9 19:59:04 1997
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Posted by Nathan on July 04, 1997 at 19:43:20:
In Reply to: [5]Re: 2nd Av. Light Rail idea posted by Bingo on July
03, 1997 at 17:20:37:
No, actually it would. This type of beam is pretty much earth quake
safe
(hopefully I won't have to retract that if we get a big earthquake in
the Pacific North West...) but yes, they conform to some of the most
stringent
earth quake safe guidelines...
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NEXT>2690
PREVIOUS>2680
POSTER>Nathan
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: private intrenst
DATE>Jul 9 19:59:05 1997
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Posted by Nathan on July 04, 1997 at 19:45:16:
In Reply to: [5]private intrenst posted by Zack on July 04, 1997 at
19:07:22:
Automation would be expensive...
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NEXT>
PREVIOUS>2570
POSTER>Mark Greenwald
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Funding MTA Projects
DATE>Jul 9 19:59:06 1997
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Posted by Mark Greenwald on July 04, 1997 at 23:14:11:
In Reply to: [6]Funding MTA Projects posted by Julio Perez on July 01,
1997 at 07:40:18:
One thing that definately seems to be gaining momentum when it comes
to financing transportation projects is to privatize them---In other
words---get a corporate sponser. The Dulles Greenway which is a dual
lane, limited access toll highway was funded primarily from private
funds. The interesting thing is that it was designed to allow for some
kind of median transit in the future, not necessarily related to the
parent company. If your curious, it is a sort of extension of the
Dulles Toll Road from Dulles Int'l Airport outside of DC to the
Leesburg, Virginia area.
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PREVIOUS>2676
POSTER>Mark Greenwald
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Trains like BART WOuld last in Chicago
DATE>Jul 9 19:59:07 1997
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Posted by Mark Greenwald on July 04, 1997 at 23:17:15:
In Reply to: [6]Re: Trains like BART WOuld last in Chicago posted by
subway-buff on July 04, 1997 at 10:33:15:
the same is true of the Baltimore & Washington Metros---the carpeting
looks good when it's new-----But as George Bush would say,"wouldn't be
prudent."
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PREVIOUS>2682
POSTER>Mark Greenwald
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: 2nd Av. Light Rail idea
DATE>Jul 9 19:59:09 1997
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Posted by Mark Greenwald on July 04, 1997 at 23:35:26:
In Reply to: [6]Re: 2nd Av. Light Rail idea posted by Nathan on July
01, 1997 at 18:42:03:
And here is my 2 cents worth also-----Being a native of the Baltimore
Washington area---I have seen the benefits of both heavy rail (DC &
Balto.) and Light Rail (Central Rail Line running north-south through
downtown Baltimore)
In Baltimore, the only reason the light rail line even exists is
because of cost---In 1971, an entire heavy rail system was designed
for the Balto. metro area but was later shelved due to cost and the
liabilty of being forced to donate to the DC Metro from Maryland's
share of the funds. If you were to notice, the southern portion of the
LRT runs the exact route of what would have been the South Line of the
Metro and the northern portion runs parrallel to what would have been
the North Line.
Baltimore needed mass transportation in these corridors and light rail
seemed like a quick & cheap way to provide it, BUT, the only problem
that I've noticed is that it takes a long time to get downtown, you
can't move at the speed that heavy-rail can--it gets frustrating,
plus, once downtown, you are running down the middle of Howard St,
sharing it with auto & bus traffic & subjected to traffic signals like
ordinary traffic--very time consuming. In the end, I like light rail,
it's better than nothing but heavy-rail is by far better, if given the
opertunity---Oh, and by the way, the Baltimore Metro line running from
Owings Mills to Johns Hopkins is the only surviving portion of the
5-line system designed in '71.
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NEXT>2711
PREVIOUS>2681
POSTER>Mark Greenwald
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: A TRAIN DERAILMENT - 7/3/1997(pictures(
DATE>Jul 9 19:59:10 1997
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Posted by Mark Greenwald on July 04, 1997 at 23:40:13:
In Reply to: [6]Re: A TRAIN DERAILMENT - 7/3/1997(pictures( posted by
Nathan on July 04, 1997 at 19:30:09:
The book "Uptown/Downtown" has a section specifically dedicated to
subway wrecks
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NEXT>2719
PREVIOUS>2678
POSTER>Mark Greenwald
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: A TRAIN DERAILMENT - 7/3/1997
DATE>Jul 9 19:59:11 1997
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Posted by Mark Greenwald on July 04, 1997 at 23:47:17:
In Reply to: [6]Re: A TRAIN DERAILMENT - 7/3/1997 posted by Gerry
O'Regan on July 04, 1997 at 13:20:10:
this was the same type of wreck the killed a couple of people on the
DC Metro's Orange/Blue Lines between Federal Triangle &
Smithsonian--the car literally bent in two from the concrete wall
seperating the two tracks. The thing that made this crash so memorable
was that it happened on a cold, snowy January afternoon when federal
workers were let off work early due to the bad
weather--which---consequently was the cause of an Air Florida jet
crashing into the 14th St. bridge (Near the Pentagon) about 30 minutes
earlier----Rescue squads from bothe DC & Virginia were so strained
that squads from Maryland had to be called in to fill the void
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NEXT>2747
PREVIOUS>2679
POSTER>Mark Greenwald
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Staten Island connection
DATE>Jul 9 19:59:12 1997
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Posted by Mark Greenwald on July 04, 1997 at 23:50:41:
In Reply to: [6]Re: Staten Island connection posted by John on July
04, 1997 at 14:08:52:
You guys are cold---yet--very amusing---I'm sure John will have
something to say---I think somebody ought to put a thing together from
the very beginning of the ride over the q-boro bridge to the
present--it would make a great "made for tv" movie---ROFLMAO
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NEXT>2696
PREVIOUS>2683
POSTER>Steve
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: private intrenst
DATE>Jul 9 19:59:14 1997
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Posted by Steve on July 05, 1997 at 00:25:17:
In Reply to: [5]private intrenst posted by Zack on July 04, 1997 at
19:07:22:
It has and is being done. Part of the fiscal recovery plan of the MTA
involved corporations purchasing rolling stock and leasing the cars to
the TA. Some of the R-68 fleet is actually leased. The companies get
some income and a large tax write-off for their investment.
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NEXT>2712
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>Steve
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: A TRAIN DERAILMENT - Update
DATE>Jul 9 19:59:15 1997
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Posted by Steve on July 05, 1997 at 00:33:54:
In Reply to: [5]A TRAIN DERAILMENT - 7/3/1997 posted by David Pirmann
on July 03, 1997 at 23:01:45:
After almost 22 hours of around-the-clock work, service was restored
on the A,C, and D lines through 135th St. Car #5282 had to be cut up
as it was damaged beyond any hope of repair. The train was proceeding
south on A3 track when the trailing truck of car 5282, for an
undetermined reason 'picked' a switch' and went down A5 track (a
spur). The car hit a wall between the two tracks and split in half.
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NEXT>2749
PREVIOUS>2671
POSTER>Steve
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Can irt cars run on bmt/ind lines (Second try!)
DATE>Jul 9 19:59:16 1997
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Posted by Steve on July 05, 1997 at 00:39:21:
In Reply to: [5]Re: Can irt cars run on bmt/ind lines (Second try!)
posted by Shane on July 04, 1997 at 01:54:44:
No, everything I have heard indicates that the IRT and BMT were always
'standard gauge' operations. The Els, because of the tight curves
through the NY canyons, used shorter, narrower cars than did the
subways. It the 20s and 30s, the BMT & IRT shared the trackage on the
line which is now the #7 line. This ended when the BMT went to wider
cars. This explains the odd arrangement at Queensboro Plaza.
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NEXT>2694
PREVIOUS>2628
POSTER>Zack
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: 2nd Ave Subway
DATE>Jul 9 19:59:17 1997
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Posted by Zack on July 05, 1997 at 02:34:35:
In Reply to: [6]Re: 2nd Ave Subway posted by John on July 03, 1997 at
06:15:29:
no one has wider cars the other doesent
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PREVIOUS>2693
POSTER>Gary Jacobi
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: 2nd Ave Subway
DATE>Jul 9 19:59:19 1997
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Posted by Gary Jacobi on July 05, 1997 at 10:56:33:
In Reply to: [5]2nd Ave Subway posted by zeeve on July 02, 1997 at
02:24:48:
By the time building the 2nd ave was "imminent" (Ha ha), the subways
all were under NYCTA control. They had not yet eliminated the BMT/IND
distinction, but the connections at Christie St. would indicate that
it could have operated either.as
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PREVIOUS>2670
POSTER>Gary Jacobi
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Child Fare in NYC Subway
DATE>Jul 9 19:59:20 1997
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Posted by Gary Jacobi on July 05, 1997 at 11:07:49:
In Reply to: [5]Child Fare in NYC Subway posted by Shig on July 01,
1997 at 23:10:26:
You bring back an old memory with this question. I was a very tall
child even at five years of age, and the little grey haired lady who
tended the Crescent st station would always challenge my Mote phrase "
How old is the boy?" Under six was the correct answer then; if it is
44" now, I would be dead meat.
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PREVIOUS>2690
POSTER>John
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: private intrenst
DATE>Jul 9 19:59:21 1997
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Posted by John on July 05, 1997 at 14:59:58:
In Reply to: [5]Re: private intrenst posted by Nathan on July 04, 1997
at 19:45:16:
It was done with the Times Square shuttle (I forgot the exact years -
sometime in the 1960s, I think), but the train was destroyed in a fire
and automation was never attempted after that.
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NEXT>2698
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>John
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>R-32
DATE>Jul 9 19:59:22 1997
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Posted by John on July 05, 1997 at 15:13:13:
Will the Transit Authority start retiring the R-32s and R-38s once the
new equipment arrives? I don't think they should, because, even after
being in service for over 30 years, they are still running nicely and
they don't look that old.
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PREVIOUS>2697
POSTER>Steve
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: R-32
DATE>Jul 9 19:59:24 1997
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Posted by Steve on July 05, 1997 at 17:52:37:
In Reply to: [5]R-32 posted by John on July 05, 1997 at 15:13:13:
It is more likely that the R-40 slants will be the first to go.
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NEXT>2781
PREVIOUS>2672
POSTER>Steve
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Is there hope for New York Subways?
DATE>Jul 9 19:59:25 1997
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Posted by Steve on July 05, 1997 at 18:41:52:
In Reply to: [5]Is there hope for New York Subways? posted by Andrew
Byler on July 03, 1997 at 13:08:59:
While the subways deteriorated during the last forty years, the
politicians had no difficulty building over 600 miles of limited
access highways. Today, there is no political will to do anything
relating to public service. Our subways will be improved and expanded
when some future generation understands the need for infrastructure
investment and the public demands it. I hope it happens in my
lifetime.
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PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>Subway-buff
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Joint NJT/LIRR Ticketing- Update
DATE>Jul 9 19:59:26 1997
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Posted by Subway-buff on July 05, 1997 at 19:36:49:
This message is an update to my message last week on this subject. I
got an e-mail from NJT (New Jersey Transit) advising me that they are
"studying additional joint ticketing."
I sugegsted to them that they joint ticket LIRR to Jamaica.
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NEXT>2703
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>Chicago EL Man
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>CTA FARE Card system/comparison to metro card
DATE>Jul 9 19:59:27 1997
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Posted by Chicago EL Man on July 05, 1997 at 23:15:23:
Is the NYC Metro card like the CTA's new fare card? This new card can
be used in any turnstile or in any bus fare box. They are sold at all
CTA stations and can be used by up to seven people. You must know how
much you want on it and it will deduct a transfer charge if used again
in less then two hours. Third ride in two hours is free. We also have
a transfer card which is the same, except it is good for two transfers
in two hours. One more question, are you guys able to use transfers on
the route you started on? They aproved that in April here. And for
every 13.50 another free 1.50 is added.( The cost of one fare for
free).
Also, doesn't the turnstile tell you how much is left on the card
after you use it? It does here!
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PREVIOUS>2629
POSTER>Steve
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: How many possibilities are there?
DATE>Jul 9 19:59:29 1997
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Posted by Steve on July 05, 1997 at 23:18:01:
In Reply to: [5]Re: How many possibilities are there? posted by Andrew
Byler on July 02, 1997 at 22:49:09:
6th and 8th Ave lines can not be looped via 53rd St.
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NEXT>2756
PREVIOUS>2701
POSTER>John
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: CTA FARE Card system/comparison to metro card
DATE>Jul 9 19:59:30 1997
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Posted by John on July 06, 1997 at 00:32:25:
In Reply to: [5]CTA FARE Card system/comparison to metro card posted
by Chicago EL Man on July 05, 1997 at 23:15:23:
It sounds like the CTA card and the MetroCard are very much the same.
There are only some minor differences. The Metrocard can be used by
only four people at a time. Also, there is no transfer charge (the
Metrocard allows you free transfers between subway and bus/vice versa,
and bus to bus. The transfers are free only if you use the card within
two hours). You cannot get a free transfer to the line you started on
and you cannot get a free transfer from subway to subway (if you exit
the system and re-enter it. Otherwise, free transfers between subway
lines can be made at appropriate connecting stations). And yes, the
turnstile and bus fare box displays the remaining amount on the card.
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PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>JC
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>The Inefficient MTA
DATE>Jul 9 19:59:31 1997
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Posted by JC on July 06, 1997 at 12:53:14:
Want to know why people dispise the MTA and revile the unions? Here's
an example. Going home from a party on the fourth, I had a long trip
from the upper west side to Greenpoint. At that time, the A train was
still out of service due to the derailment. I hopped on the 2, which
was right there at 96th Street, then walked over to the E and
42nd/Times Square. Noting that the G was on a weekend schedule (Court
Square is the terminus for northbound trains), I walked to the end of
the platform at 42nd Street, caught the E, then walked another long
corridor at Court Square. So far, so good. Travel time was an
incredible 20 minutes to Court Square. Then, the first G train came
into Court Square, but it wasn't terminating. it was heading for 179th
Street in Queens. Great! I could have changed travel plans if I knew
that was happening. Well, then we waited another 30 minutes and a G
showed up again, bound for 179th Street. And then, 20 minutes later,
the same. There was no southbound service for some reason, and no one
knew anything about it. Finally, a southbound G showed up, an hour and
10 minutes after we got to the G platform. No apologies, no
explainiation, no nothing. Not only that, the conductor and the
motorperson had the most flippant attitudes. My suggestion is this:
Screw the MTA. You ant to shove the gold card, etc. down our throats?
Fine. I'll be tokens. Improve service and we'll talk. As for the
unions, these assholes operate with impunity because they can't be
disciplined. So, let's do away with the unions and get some really
responsible, good workers in there. Or at least, make discipline part
of the regiment. The train is late? Fine the motorman and conductor,
effective immediately. If it was the dispatcher's fault, a suspension
without pay will do the trick. Let's get these assholes to realize
that we, the straphangers are the most important commodity. Let's get
responsible people to run this thing. Then, we'll all be happy,
because we'll have a transit system that works, instead of this mess.
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NEXT>2706
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>Steve
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>You Think ???
DATE>Jul 9 19:59:33 1997
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Posted by Steve on July 06, 1997 at 15:23:06:
In Reply to: [5]The Inefficient MTA posted by JC on July 06, 1997 at
12:53:14:
You had a truly unfortunate experience. However, how do you know that
the cause of your delay was due to negligence? I don't know that this
is the case. At the time you were trying to get home from your party
(or whatever) most of the Subways Operating Management from the Senior
Vice President on down were on duty. Many had been on duty more than
20 hours without a break in a smokey 100+ degree tunnel, trying to
restore service on the 8th Avenue corridor.
I do not know for sure but I suspect that the delay you encountered
was due to the emergency work equipment being moved along the Queens
Corridor to the site of the derailment. Perhaps the train dispatchers
had their hands full, diverting service around this 'slow moving' work
equipment. Perhaps the train crews were not able to tell you what was
going on or why because all of the radio channels were overloaded with
communications between Control Center and dispatchers directing work
trains, police, fire and so many others.
Yeah, I suppose that we could discipline that one crew who couldn't
answer your question just as they couldn't answer that same question
when it was asked of them 1,000 times earlier. I also suppose we could
discipline the Train Dispatchers at Queens Plaza, Continental Ave. &
179th St. who might have, while dealing with the ongoing service
disruptions (due to the emergency), neglected to keep you informed.
[BTW, the train dispatchers are also in a union, The Subway & Surface
Supervisors Assoc. and are subject to discipline.]
The cleanup and restoration of service in Harlem, on the 8th Ave line,
was a monumental accomplishment. It was cleared in an amazing 22
hours. To get it done, required a tremendous effort, not only by the
400+ employees and managers of the TA who were on-site, from the
Police and Fire and EMS, but also from the rest of the system where
dispatchers and tower operators and train crews went above and beyond
to provide more service on the unaffected segments of the system. As
for your intollerable inconvenience, I profoundly appologize.
I could go on, but many of us who were at 135th Street for for the
entire 22 hours on July 3 & 4 are having our 4th of July celebrations
with our families, today. I'm on my way to mine.
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NEXT>2707
PREVIOUS>2705
POSTER>sid
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: You Think ???
DATE>Jul 9 19:59:34 1997
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Posted by sid on July 06, 1997 at 20:58:56:
In Reply to: [6]You Think ??? posted by Steve on July 06, 1997 at
15:23:06:
Look. I think the guy was making a valid point. Waiting for a train
for over an hour is bullcrap, especially considering we are the ones
that pay for the overbloated MTA. You were down in the tunnel for 22
hours? Great. I thank you. Its also part of your job. As they say to
Cecil Fielder, if you don't like DHing, take your fat caboose outta
here and we'll pay someone else the $7 mil he gets. It boil;s down to
whether the MTA and the unions care about the passengers throuoghout
the system. The answer is no. Let's get people in here who do. An hour
without any word, alternative modes of transit, etc. is inexcusible.
In the private sector, it wouldn't be tolerated.
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NEXT>2713
PREVIOUS>2706
POSTER>Zack
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: You Think ???
DATE>Jul 9 19:59:36 1997
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Posted by Zack on July 06, 1997 at 22:12:07:
In Reply to: [6]Re: You Think ??? posted by sid on July 06, 1997 at
20:58:56:
you should concider yourself lucky at least you got home. at least you
had that subway to get home on, they couldve just shut thoes affected
lines down until the wreck was cleard up.
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NEXT>
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>John
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>FERRY TURNSTILES
DATE>Jul 9 19:59:37 1997
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Posted by John on July 06, 1997 at 23:25:55:
Now that the Staten Island Ferry is free, will the Transit Authority
eventually remove the turnstiles from the Staten Island terminal? I
was on the ferry yesterday, and the turnstiles were still there, only
they were unlocked.
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NEXT>2714
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>Joe M
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>PCC Streetcars for Kenosha Wisconsin
DATE>Jul 9 19:59:39 1997
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Posted by Joe M on July 06, 1997 at 23:47:52:
City of Kenosha Wiscosnin has purchased 5 ex Toronto 4600 Cars and is
planning how they can be best used in the Harborpark lakefront
redevelopment area.
When the plan is complete they will likely be run by the Kenosha
Transit Commission but outside funding is needed (Donations) and
volunteers may help with restoration, and staffing
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NEXT>
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>"Morris J. Shlyaf"
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: New Routes & Stuff
DATE> ::
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References: <5q188g$53q$1@kahlua.quuxuum.org>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.01 [en] (Win95; U)
To: John of Calgary
X-Priority: 3 (Normal)
John of Calgary wrote:
> Posted by John of Calgary on June 25, 1997 at 18:32:28:
>
> In Reply to: [5]Re: RE: New Routes & Stuff posted by John on June
> 25,
> 1997 at 00:13:30:
>
> If the MTA could build something called a crossover that would
> connect
> the Northbound express track with the Northbound local track north
> of
> Spring Street, then the 4 and 5 can connect to BleekeR, STUPID!
>
> Or even better: abandon Bleeker and forget about it!
> ____________________________________________________
>
> --
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STUPID! The delays caused by merging and diverging trains would override
any advantages.
NEXT>
PREVIOUS>2687
POSTER>Nathan
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: A TRAIN DERAILMENT - 7/3/1997(pictures(
DATE>Aug 8 11:46:06 1997
EMAILNOTICES>no
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Posted by Nathan on July 07, 1997 at 00:49:11:
In Reply to: [6]Re: A TRAIN DERAILMENT - 7/3/1997(pictures( posted by
Mark Greenwald on July 04, 1997 at 23:40:13:
Who writes and publishes it?
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NEXT>2716
PREVIOUS>2691
POSTER>Nathan
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: A TRAIN DERAILMENT - Update
DATE>Aug 8 11:46:08 1997
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Posted by Nathan on July 07, 1997 at 00:50:48:
In Reply to: [5]Re: A TRAIN DERAILMENT - Update posted by Steve on
July 05, 1997 at 00:33:54:
That car was empty, was it not? (I got a pretty groovy picture from
the newspaper of it...)
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NEXT>2715
PREVIOUS>2707
POSTER>sid
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: You Think ???
DATE>Aug 8 11:46:09 1997
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Posted by sid on July 07, 1997 at 00:54:42:
In Reply to: [6]Re: You Think ??? posted by Zack on July 06, 1997 at
22:12:07:
thAt's not the issue. The issue is that the west side lines were
running well the IRT that is. so was the E. It was the lack of care of
the MTA wizards who, with a little understanding, could have sent word
that the G was late so commuters could have taken alternate routes
home. Buses like the B61 serve the G area around McCarren Park from
Queens Plaza.
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NEXT>2721
PREVIOUS>2709
POSTER>Nathan
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: PCC Streetcars for Kenosha Wisconsin
DATE>Aug 8 11:46:11 1997
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Posted by Nathan on July 07, 1997 at 01:05:41:
In Reply to: [5]PCC Streetcars for Kenosha Wisconsin posted by Joe M
on July 06, 1997 at 23:47:52:
Ah yes, the Toronto PCC's are in very good condition seeing as they
have all been rebuilt in the past 10 years. How is the city of Kenosha
(I'm sorry, I don't know where it is) going to deal with the
off-standard
track guage used by these cars? Are they just going to lay the rails
wider
apart or reconfigure the bogeys?
That is one of the dillemnas being encountered here (Vancouver BC)
because
the city has bought an existing rail right of way for streetcar use,
(to, ultimetly connect a new light rail line to the city's ART, around
false creek. Toronto PCC's are being considered but there is the track
guage problems, which would bring compatibility problems with the
restored BC Electric interurbans...
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NEXT>2718
PREVIOUS>2713
POSTER>Steve
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: You Think ???
DATE>Aug 8 11:46:12 1997
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Posted by Steve on July 07, 1997 at 03:42:42:
In Reply to: [5]Re: You Think ??? posted by sid on July 06, 1997 at
20:58:56:
Thanks for your input but let me make 3 small corrections.
First: I checked the computer - tonight. There were no train delays of
an hour or more on the G line - northbound or southbound that day.
There were no significant delays at all on that line.
Second: The point wasn't that I was there for 22 hours. The point was
that we were dealing with something far more significant and
immediately important than one person's alleged commutation
confussion.
Third: I do not make $7,000,000. 00 per year so don't compare me to a
professional athlete. Besides would he play for the Yankees - even one
game for free? Well, I doubt that you are aware of this but virtually
every manager who was there was not being paid for that time.
The fact that you had Lionel trains as a kid does not mean that you
are remotely qualified to run a rail system.There are many things that
happen that are not to our credit but given the circumstances with
which we were dealing, I think we did a great job.
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NEXT>
PREVIOUS>2712
POSTER>Steve
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: A TRAIN DERAILMENT - Update
DATE>Aug 8 11:46:13 1997
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Posted by Steve on July 07, 1997 at 03:45:04:
In Reply to: [5]Re: A TRAIN DERAILMENT - Update posted by Nathan on
July 07, 1997 at 00:50:48:
Fortunately for all concerned, the car was empty
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NEXT>2726
PREVIOUS>2658
POSTER>Peter Rosa
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: NYC Subway in 2020
DATE>Aug 8 11:46:14 1997
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Posted by Peter Rosa on July 07, 1997 at 09:07:00:
In Reply to: [6]NYC Subway in 2020 posted by Michael Adler on July 03,
1997 at 21:52:19:
My prediction is that the Second Avenue Subway will begin service that
year, and that the ... uh, wait a minute, you asked about 2020, not
3020!
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NEXT>2720
PREVIOUS>2715
POSTER>Wayne Johnson
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: You Think ???
DATE>Aug 8 11:46:16 1997
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Posted by Wayne Johnson on July 07, 1997 at 09:57:30:
In Reply to: [5]Re: You Think ??? posted by Steve on July 07, 1997 at
03:42:42:
I agree with you on this topic. It's a matter of dealing with the
highest priority at the time. Of course you shouldn't ignore other
services (I'm not implying that the TA did), but again, as you said
many TA employees (inclding Management) was dealing with a disaster.
As can relate very easily as I am a LAN administrator and my point
here is that when the LAN goes down it affects many more people than
say a jammed printer in an isolated section of the office - and if
this is the case well I will have most of my people on the LAN problem
first It's one of those cases where a lesser priority thing such as
the mysterious southbound G train may have slipped through the cracks.
This can happen in any profession and yes, if I was delayed for an
hour waiting for one train, I would be unhappy , but I would be even
unhappier if the TA had dragged it's feet in clearing up the 8 Ave
problems. I know a office and a transit system are completely
different, but my point here is that in ANY job one must prioritize.
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NEXT>2723
PREVIOUS>2688
POSTER>Lou
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: A TRAIN DERAILMENT - 7/3/1997
DATE>Aug 8 11:46:17 1997
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Posted by Lou on July 07, 1997 at 10:25:43:
In Reply to: [5]A TRAIN DERAILMENT - 7/3/1997 posted by David Pirmann
on July 03, 1997 at 23:01:45:
Although there is no official cause yet, dosen't this sound like the
1927 Times Square wreck (i.e. a switch malfunctioning in the middle of
the train??? At least this happened in the middle of a holiday
weekend,and noone got hurt seriously.Any comments???
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NEXT>2722
PREVIOUS>2718
POSTER>Nathan
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: You Think ???
DATE>Aug 8 11:46:18 1997
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Posted by Nathan on July 07, 1997 at 12:51:47:
In Reply to: [5]Re: You Think ??? posted by sid on July 06, 1997 at
20:58:56:
What does Major League Baseball have to do with this? Stick to riding
the trains, not controlling them.
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NEXT>2816
PREVIOUS>2714
POSTER>Dan Lawrence
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: PCC Streetcars for Kenosha Wisconsin
DATE>Aug 8 11:46:19 1997
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Posted by Dan Lawrence on July 07, 1997 at 12:54:11:
In Reply to: [5]Re: PCC Streetcars for Kenosha Wisconsin posted by
Nathan on July 07, 1997 at 01:05:41:
Track guage is not a problem - any rail shop can reguage a Toronto
guage B-2 truck to standard guage. The axles are only 2 3/8" longer
than standard
and there are no collars on the axle transoms. The wheels can be
pressed in
1 3/16" on each side (with the end protruding through the outer cheek
plate) or cut down to the proper length. There should be no problems
with reguaging. When SEPTA (Philadelphia) bought Toronto PCC's in the
1970's the TTC shops simply pulled the wheels OUT on the axles to make
the guage 5' 2 1/4". The cars ran that way (with an obvious "hole" in
the cheek plates) for almost 3 years until SEPTA rebuilt the trucks
properly. PCC's are pretty tough and forgiving.
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NEXT>2774
PREVIOUS>2720
POSTER>Steve
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: You Think ???
DATE>Aug 8 11:46:21 1997
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Posted by Steve on July 07, 1997 at 13:27:39:
In Reply to: [5]Re: You Think ??? posted by Nathan on July 07, 1997 at
12:51:47:
You are correct about baseball, but riding trains isn't the same as
controlling them. That goes for model trains or the real thing.
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NEXT>2731
PREVIOUS>2719
POSTER>Steve
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: A TRAIN DERAILMENT - 7/3/1997
DATE>Aug 8 11:46:22 1997
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Posted by Steve on July 07, 1997 at 13:31:09:
In Reply to: [5]Re: A TRAIN DERAILMENT - 7/3/1997 posted by Lou on
July 07, 1997 at 10:25:43:
As you said, there has been no 'OFFICAIL' determination yet so no
comment other than to say there will likely be no suprises here. We'll
just have to wait until the NTSB does its' investigation.
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NEXT>
PREVIOUS>2603
POSTER>Steve
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: "SWIPE HERE AGAIN!" or else!
DATE>Aug 8 11:46:23 1997
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Posted by Steve on July 07, 1997 at 13:39:40:
In Reply to: [5]"SWIPE HERE AGAIN!" or else! posted by Mitch on July
02, 1997 at 13:53:51:
What you suggest is not beyond the realm of the possible. If it were
to happen to me, before swiping in a second turnstile, I would go to
the token booth where there is a customer accessible card reader and I
would make sure that no money had been deducted from the card. I would
then report any discrepancies to the token clerk.
Just as an aside - I have been using the metrocard readers for over a
year now and have not had a single problem.
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NEXT>2727
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>Aaron
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>New NYC subway cars
DATE>Aug 8 11:46:24 1997
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Posted by Aaron on July 07, 1997 at 13:51:15:
Will all new cars have the motorman cabs completely across the car so
you
can never see out the front window again?
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NEXT>2732
PREVIOUS>2717
POSTER>Mark S Feinman
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: NYC Subway in 2020
DATE>Aug 8 11:46:26 1997
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Posted by Mark S Feinman on July 07, 1997 at 14:55:09:
In Reply to: [6]NYC Subway in 2020 posted by Michael Adler on July 03,
1997 at 21:52:19:
The NYC Subway in the year 2020 ...well, let's see ....
Fare: Zoned fares. Each borough is roughly one zone.
Stay withon one zone and the fare is $2.00. Each zone
requires an additional 30 cents. The Rockaways is also
considered a zone, but only an additional 15 cents
south of Broad Channel. Free bus/subway and bus/bus
and subway/subway transfers continue with the
MetroSmart Card. No swiping. Hold card upto "reader"
and walk through gate. No token booths, either.
Not much will have changed in the system itself.
Here's what would be different as compared to now:
- 21st - Queensbridge connection with Queens Blvd
Subway. The Q line runs from Brighton Beach, express
via Brighton, over south side of Manhattan Bridge, now
open for only 3 years, via Broadway Express to 57th St,
then via 63rd St, then local in Queens to 179th St. No
change to current E and F routes. R train all times to
179th St via local. New Y train from 2nd Ave Manhattan
via 6th Ave express and 63rd St tunnel, to 179th St
running express from 21st - Queensbridge to 179th St.
- The NORTH side of the Manhattan Bridge is closed for
the same reason the south side was closed.
Construction is expected to run until the year 2037.
Estimated price tag is in the tens of billions of
dollars. Election year issue is whether to build a new
bridge and knock down the Manhattan Bridge. Reroutings
as follows:
B, current route from Coney Island, skips Dekalb, uses
South side of Manhattan Bridge, then local to 57th St -
7th Ave, then local to Ditmars Blvd, Astoria.
Additional C service on 8th Ave to make up the deficit
of the lack of B train when the B train used to run.
D, current route from Coney Island to Dekalb Ave, then
via new connection to Rutgers St tunnel (F) built north
of York Street in anticipation of the bridge crisis,
local from Dekalb Ave through this tunnel to W 4 St,
then current route to 205th St. Mayor Walter Jones
wins another term overwhelmingly by a public very
satisfied by the completion of this tunneling project,
which was done in 4 years and under budget.
F - current routing.
N - original routing from early 80s but still
terminating at Ditmars Blvd.
Second Avenue subway contruction resumed in 2017 (it
took THAT long!) but was stopped in early 2020 for the
same reason it stopped in the early '70s. Lack of
$$$$$. Section from 63rd St - Lexington Ave to 96th St
- 2nd Ave was built. Stations completed between 63rd
and 96th. Plan to start shuttle service from 63rd &
Lexington to 96th & 2nd connecting with Q and Y trains
in June 2020. The hope is to connect the sections of
route between 99th and 120th (the connection between
107th and 110th st was made in 2018) to 96th St in 2
years. All construction used shield tunneling so 2nd
ave traffic would not be disrupted.
Let's see - the Els ....
- Brighton in good shape after muti-million dollar
revamp in 2011 - 2014.
- West End in OK shape.
- Jamaica El - slow speed order from Alabama Av -
Crescent St. R32s still providing service, though new
lightweight R-319s (300 of them) are expected in
service next year to replace the R32s which went
through another major overhaul in the late 00's and
early teens. MTA New York City Transportation (a
reorganized NYC Transit, NYC Bus, etc) not yet
committed to fate of this part of EL, in the worst
shape of the subway system, almost as bad as the
Franklin Ave shuttle in the late 1990s. Rest of EL in
OK shape.
- All IRT ELs in the Bronx are holding up surprisingly
well. IRT ELs in Brooklyn are found structurally
deficient but safe.
- Franklin Ave shuttle overhaul completed in 1999.
Track and sturctures in good shape. Ridership on line
increases because of a building revival in the served
area. MTA discussing possibility of part time direct
service to Coney Island from Franklin Ave during summer
months (shades of the 1950s!) due to Coney Island's
revival as a summer destination spot as a result of the
opening of the Gates & Allen Amusement Area and the
Guiliani Exposition Pavilion in 2016.
- Elevated from Myrtle Av/Broadway to Metropolitan Ave
in reasonable shape; however, M service cut back to
Wyckoff Ave during non rush-hours for EL rehab.
Cab signalling instituted on Lexington Ave lines 4,5 &
6 providing additional capacity to a trunk line in dire
need of relief. Suspension of 2nd Ave subway again is
not handled well by the public because of the severe
overcrowding on the Lex.
Even after all this, the NYC subway is a 24 hour
operation.
--Mark (who had to curtail his imagination at this
point)
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NEXT>2733
PREVIOUS>2725
POSTER>David Pirmann
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: New NYC subway cars
DATE>Aug 8 11:46:27 1997
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Posted by David Pirmann on July 07, 1997 at 15:18:13:
In Reply to: [6]New NYC subway cars posted by Aaron on July 07, 1997
at 13:51:15:
Yup. Get your cab-view rides now while they last.
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NEXT>2729
PREVIOUS>2657
POSTER>ABSTRACT MINDES
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Graffitti Is Here To Stay ???
DATE>Aug 8 11:46:28 1997
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Posted by ABSTRACT MINDES on July 07, 1997 at 15:49:11:
In Reply to: [5]Graffitti Is Here To Stay ??? posted by Garfield on
July 03, 1997 at 17:12:20:
WHATS UP ITS ALL ABOUT WEST COAST
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PREVIOUS>2728
POSTER>ABSTRACT MINDES
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Graffitti Is Here To Stay ???
DATE>Aug 8 11:46:29 1997
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Posted by ABSTRACT MINDES on July 07, 1997 at 15:50:28:
In Reply to: [5]Graffitti Is Here To Stay ??? posted by Garfield on
July 03, 1997 at 17:12:20:
WHATS UP ITS ALL ABOUT WEST COAST
CALIFORNIA AEM CREW
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PREVIOUS>2614
POSTER>Charles
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: what will happen to the r-110's
DATE>Aug 8 11:46:31 1997
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Posted by Charles on July 07, 1997 at 16:56:11:
In Reply to: [6]what will happen to the r-110's posted by Zack on July
02, 1997 at 22:46:49:
I don't work for NYCT but my best guess is that the R110B could stay
in service on the A or if the TA wanted to repeat history they could
put them on the Franklin Shuttle, Just as the R11/34's were. The
R110A's could go to the Dyre Avenue Shuttle or they could save it as a
museum train.
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NEXT>2734
PREVIOUS>2723
POSTER>Garfield
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: A TRAIN DERAILMENT - 7/3/1997
DATE>Aug 8 11:46:32 1997
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Posted by Garfield on July 07, 1997 at 17:00:20:
In Reply to: [6]Re: A TRAIN DERAILMENT - 7/3/1997 posted by Lou on
July 07, 1997 at 10:25:43:
Sometimes I wonder how on earth do these trains keep on the tracks. I
ride the Queens Blvd line (F)express which does at least 40 to maybe
45 miles at some point and still after all the rocking from side to
side and up and down, still keeps it's wheels and flangs on the rails.
Besides the F, I've rode the Lexington(4,5) and 7th Ave line(2,3) and
think those trains do even more speed than the Queens Blvd line.
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NEXT>2736
PREVIOUS>2726
POSTER>Garfield
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: NYC Subway in 2020
DATE>Aug 8 11:46:33 1997
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Posted by Garfield on July 07, 1997 at 17:12:48:
In Reply to: [5]Re: NYC Subway in 2020 posted by Peter Rosa on July
07, 1997 at 09:07:00:
I don't think the J/Z line will cut my the MTA. If anyone who has been
riding the line for the past week or so, must of noticed that they are
servicing the station. But a few times on my way home, I've noticed
that it looks like they are possibly extending the stations. I saw
thick steel beams measuring the same height and width of the station's
platform. Is it possible that the trains are being extended from 8
cars to 10 cars ????
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NEXT>2743
PREVIOUS>2727
POSTER>Steve
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: New NYC subway cars
DATE>Aug 8 11:46:34 1997
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Posted by Steve on July 07, 1997 at 17:25:07:
In Reply to: [5]Re: New NYC subway cars posted by David Pirmann on
July 07, 1997 at 15:18:13:
Or you can always become a motorman - oops, I mean train operator.
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PREVIOUS>2731
POSTER>Steve
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: A TRAIN DERAILMENT - 7/3/1997
DATE>Aug 8 11:46:36 1997
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Posted by Steve on July 07, 1997 at 17:28:03:
In Reply to: [5]Re: A TRAIN DERAILMENT - 7/3/1997 posted by Garfield
on July 07, 1997 at 17:00:20:
Yup, before going to "full field shunting" most of the cars would do
50 - 55 MPH. and even more on the flats out to the Rockaways.
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NEXT>2738
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>Steve
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Pop Quiz for this week
DATE>Aug 8 11:46:37 1997
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Posted by Steve on July 07, 1997 at 17:37:14:
Allowing only ONE transfer, what is the longest ONE-WAY ride you can
take on the NYC Subway System. Name the 2 lines, the start and end
points, the transfer point and the approximate distance you will have
traveled.
The correct answer is based on information in:
"New York City Transit's Facts & Figures" Printed in 1994
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NEXT>2742
PREVIOUS>2732
POSTER>subway-buff
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: NYC Subway in 2020
DATE>Aug 8 11:46:38 1997
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Posted by subway-buff on July 07, 1997 at 18:40:23:
In Reply to: [6]Re: NYC Subway in 2020 posted by Garfield on July 07,
1997 at 17:12:48:
Sorry to disappoint you but the steel beams are for lighting upgrades.
They are finally removing the non-working incandescent (regular screw
in bulbs with reverse threads from the stop after Marcy to and
including E. Pkwy.(which will also habve the L platforms upgraded.)
I just rode that section today. They are doing the same for the 2/5
IRT in the Bronx which may be done by 2300! (They said 12/96, then
3/97 and now no date!). The steel beams are for wiring for the new
lights.i
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NEXT>2745
PREVIOUS>2674
POSTER>subway-buff
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Any new cars becides as the R68's
DATE>Aug 8 11:46:40 1997
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Posted by subway-buff on July 07, 1997 at 18:45:09:
In Reply to: [6]Any new cars becides as the R68's posted by jcooper on
July 02, 1997 at 12:35:14:
Yes, the TA bought ten work cars, the r-127 built by Kawasaki in 1992.
They resemble the IRT R62. They are numbered EP01-EP10.
SOURCE: New York City SUbway Cars-Greller,The book has a picture but I
do nort have a scanner or digital camera.
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NEXT>2739
PREVIOUS>2735
POSTER>P.A.R.
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Pop Quiz for this week
DATE>Aug 8 11:46:41 1997
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Posted by P.A.R. on July 07, 1997 at 18:59:48:
In Reply to: [5]Pop Quiz for this week posted by Steve on July 07,
1997 at 17:37:14:
The longest ONE-WAY ride on the New York City Transit System, allowing
for only ONE transfer, would take you over 38 miles in distance. Your
starting point would be on the IRT Number 2 Line at 241 Street in the
Bronx, transfering at 42 Street-Times Square for the IND Far Rockaway
bound A Train, and getting off at its last stop: Far Rockaway-Mott
Avenue.
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NEXT>2740
PREVIOUS>2738
POSTER>Koi
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Pop Quiz for this week
DATE>Aug 8 11:46:42 1997
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Posted by Koi on July 07, 1997 at 19:40:33:
In Reply to: [6]Pop Quiz for this week posted by Steve on July 07,
1997 at 17:37:14:
Longest one way trip on the subway:
The 2 lines: A, 2
Start point: Mott Ave, Far Rockaway
End point: 241st St. in The Bronx
Transfer point: B'way Nassau St. on the A to the 2
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NEXT>2741
PREVIOUS>2739
POSTER>Steve
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Pop Quiz for this week
DATE>Aug 8 11:46:44 1997
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Posted by Steve on July 07, 1997 at 20:24:16:
In Reply to: [5]Re: Pop Quiz for this week posted by Koi on July 07,
1997 at 19:40:33:
Got it all except for the length of the trip...
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NEXT>2750
PREVIOUS>2740
POSTER>Steve
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Pop Quiz for this week
DATE>Aug 8 11:46:45 1997
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Posted by Steve on July 07, 1997 at 20:25:27:
In Reply to: [5]Re: Pop Quiz for this week posted by P.A.R. on July
07, 1997 at 18:59:48:
Got it all! Very good !!
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NEXT>2748
PREVIOUS>2736
POSTER>Steve
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: NYC Subway in 2020
DATE>Aug 8 11:46:46 1997
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Posted by Steve on July 07, 1997 at 20:29:40:
In Reply to: [5]Re: NYC Subway in 2020 posted by Mark S Feinman on
July 07, 1997 at 14:55:09:
Very interesting. It all sounds plausible too. You shuld apply for a
job in Operations Planning...
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NEXT>2744
PREVIOUS>2733
POSTER>Dan Lawrence
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: New NYC subway cars
DATE>Aug 8 11:46:48 1997
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Posted by Dan Lawrence on July 07, 1997 at 20:47:02:
In Reply to: [5]Re: New NYC subway cars posted by Steve on July 07,
1997 at 17:25:07:
Or, maybe the TA could do the full width cabs Baltimore style - a
forward
facing transverse seat with a window in front. (since Baltimore's
operating
position is on the left, the seat is on the right. The TA could just
reverse the layout. Presto! A railfan seat WITHOUT blocking any end
doors!
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NEXT>2751
PREVIOUS>2743
POSTER>Steve
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: New NYC subway cars
DATE>Aug 8 11:46:49 1997
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Posted by Steve on July 07, 1997 at 23:17:27:
In Reply to: [5]Re: New NYC subway cars posted by Dan Lawrence on July
07, 1997 at 20:47:02:
Sorry, but I'm afraid that transverse cabs will be the rule for the
near future, at least. Transverse cabs are needed for OPTO which will
be making greater inroads over the next year or two. In fact,
currently, it is being looked into whether some cars with corner cabs
can be converted to transverse cabs.
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NEXT>2766
PREVIOUS>2737
POSTER>Steve
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Any new cars becides as the R68's
DATE>Aug 8 11:46:50 1997
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Posted by Steve on July 07, 1997 at 23:21:44:
In Reply to: [5]Re: Any new cars becides as the R68's posted by
subway-buff on July 07, 1997 at 18:45:09:
Correct. They also bought the R-134s which are like the 127s. Also,
the vacuum train has been delivered.
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NEXT>2760
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>Chris Roman
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Have idea?
DATE>Aug 8 11:46:51 1997
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Posted by Chris Roman on July 08, 1997 at 01:17:32:
Where can I send ideas to the MTA about service improvemnets
and will they listen to me. I have some ideas that will make me
president of the MTA. If anyone wants to hear, email me.
THanks
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NEXT>2814
PREVIOUS>2689
POSTER>Raymond
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Staten Island connection
DATE>Aug 8 11:46:53 1997
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Posted by Raymond on July 08, 1997 at 10:12:55:
In Reply to: [5]Re: Staten Island connection posted by Lou on July 03,
1997 at 16:05:55:
I am glad that someone still has a sense of humor on this web-site.
There
are too many wierdly serious people here! Get lives you people, and
learn how to spell! (Must be a lot of publik skool graduates with
computers.)
And by the way, the SIR does float the cars for major rehabs, etc.
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NEXT>2765
PREVIOUS>2742
POSTER>Mark S Feinman
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: NYC Subway in 2020
DATE>Aug 8 11:46:54 1997
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Posted by Mark S Feinman on July 08, 1997 at 10:18:01:
In Reply to: [6]Re: NYC Subway in 2020 posted by Steve on July 07,
1997 at 20:29:40:
Cool! And to think I thought I was just a frustrated writer .....
(where do I sign up? :-))
--Mark
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NEXT>
PREVIOUS>2692
POSTER>Gerry O'Regan
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Can irt cars run on bmt/ind lines (Second try!)
DATE>Aug 8 11:46:55 1997
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Posted by Gerry O'Regan on July 08, 1997 at 10:54:29:
In Reply to: [6]Re: Can irt cars run on bmt/ind lines (Second try!)
posted by Steve on July 05, 1997 at 00:39:21:
Going back to the Astoria/Flushing joint operation; this worked for
one reason - The IRT subway cars and both system's el cars were
essentially the same size. Since both IRT lines were through routed
(Steinway Tunnel and 2nd Av.) I would expect that the trips at that
time matched the IRT standard, and were changed after the BMT
connection at Queensboro Plaza became the only connection to the rest
of the system. (There was a period when the 7 line connected only to
the BMT, there was no connection from the BMT to the IND or from IND
to IRT as there is today. (1940s))
When they were retired from the subway, the original IRT composite
cars ran on the els for many years, a definite advantage to having a
uniform car size. The BMT put 10' equipment on their els with the
Multis and rebuilds such as the C types, often creating situations
where 9' and 10' cars had to mix, but with a few minor exceptions,
never operated subway equipment of any type on an older el.
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NEXT>2752
PREVIOUS>2741
POSTER>Gerry O'Regan
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Pop Quiz for this week
DATE>Aug 8 11:46:56 1997
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Posted by Gerry O'Regan on July 08, 1997 at 11:01:12:
In Reply to: [6]Re: Pop Quiz for this week posted by Steve on July 07,
1997 at 20:25:27:
The Times Square connection makes the trip even longer due to the one
long block walk from 7th Av. to 8th Av in the transfer tunnel. The
transfer in Lower Manhattan involves less walking.
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NEXT>2764
PREVIOUS>2744
POSTER>Mark S Feinman
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: New NYC subway cars
DATE>Aug 8 11:46:57 1997
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Posted by Mark S Feinman on July 08, 1997 at 13:06:05:
In Reply to: [6]Re: New NYC subway cars posted by Steve on July 07,
1997 at 23:17:27:
Hmmm ... I guess the R62As would be fairly easy to convert because of
the window that can be lowered on the left side of each car, but what
about the R-32, 38, 40 or 42 series? Is the MTA considering cutting a
window into the left side of (sone of) these cars? And I guesss they'd
have to consider what to do with the side door panel; that is,
permanently close it or reduce its size to make room for the train
operator at that position.
--Mark
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NEXT>2761
PREVIOUS>2750
POSTER>Gary Jacobi
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Pop Quiz for this week
DATE>Aug 8 11:46:59 1997
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Posted by Gary Jacobi on July 08, 1997 at 13:29:45:
In Reply to: [5]Pop Quiz for this week posted by Steve on July 07,
1997 at 17:37:14:
Hate to be a spoil sport, but your rules do not forbid reversing
general direction on the second line. Therefore I submit A train from
Mott Ave to 168th st upper Manhattan, and IRT 7th ave back to New Lots
Ave in Brooklyn.There could be a longer run on a BMT Coney Island run,
but the uptown link would have to be below 59th St. so I didn't check
it.
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NEXT>2754
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>John
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Too Old to Still Be Running!!!
DATE>Aug 8 11:47:00 1997
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Posted by John on July 08, 1997 at 13:30:11:
When is the Long Island Rail Road going to replace those ancient
deisel trains? The trains don't even have head-end power; they need
two units per train, a locomotive, and a power unit. The cars and
locomotives look like they're straight from Ancient Greece, with rust
spots all over them, they bang around and make funny noises when you
ride in them. I can't understand how the LIRR can purchase and operate
modern electric trains, while at the same time, keep operating the old
deisels. I understand the things about loyalty and nostalga (see how
much I like the Redbirds?), but I mean, come on! These trains are too
old to still be in service and they need to be replaced! Why doesn't
Metro North or NJ Transit lease some of their trains to the LIRR until
they purchase new equipment?
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NEXT>2755
PREVIOUS>2753
POSTER>David Pirmann
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Too Old to Still Be Running!!!
DATE>Aug 8 11:47:02 1997
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Posted by David Pirmann on July 08, 1997 at 13:37:08:
In Reply to: [6]Too Old to Still Be Running!!! posted by John on July
08, 1997 at 13:30:11:
They already have ordered new equipment. They've already got some of
the double-decker cars running. Not sure what they ordered for
locomotive replacements, though.
-Dave
p.s. there was a show on PBS recently about train travel in India.
There was a bit about a line that used steam locomotives, of which the
newest locomotive had been running since 1902... Maybe the LIRR can
sell their old stuff to them :-)
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NEXT>2759
PREVIOUS>2754
POSTER>aaron
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Too Old to Still Be Running!!!
DATE>Aug 8 11:47:03 1997
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Posted by aaron on July 08, 1997 at 13:41:44:
In Reply to: [6]Too Old to Still Be Running!!! posted by John on July
08, 1997 at 13:30:11:
There are few sets of double-decker Diesel Electric trainsets now
running
in the rush hour only. I believe they are powered by FL9s. They are
not
very reliable and are out of service about 30% of the time. Because
the
LIRR takes power from the top of the third rail as opposed to the
bottom
on Metro-North, the locomotives are not compatible.
P.S. How do you spell diesel?
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NEXT>3047
PREVIOUS>2703
POSTER>aaron
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: CTA FARE Card system/comparison to metro card
DATE>Aug 8 11:47:04 1997
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Posted by aaron on July 08, 1997 at 13:53:24:
In Reply to: [6]CTA FARE Card system/comparison to metro card posted
by Chicago EL Man on July 05, 1997 at 23:15:23:
Challenge. I was in Chicago last week and attempted to purchase a card
at
Howard Street. I was sent to the currency exchange next door. The next
day I boarded the Red Line at Belmont with my wife. The system
deducted
two fares, but when I returned less than two hours later at Chicago
Avenue,
the system took off 30 cents (correct) for the first swipe and $1.50
for
the second swipe(incorrect). I was told it was good for up to four
passengers. When I got back to Belmont, there was no place to buy or
complain about the problem. The New York card works better, though you
can't reverse ride or get a volume discount yet. Once the bugs have
been
worked out, the Chicago system should be as good as New York.
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NEXT>2758
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>Brian
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Metra, will they ever switch to electric trains?
DATE>Aug 8 11:47:06 1997
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Posted by Brian on July 08, 1997 at 13:53:42:
I was wondering why Metra the Chicago Commuter Rail System still
operates Diesel trains when NYC and other places swithched to Electric
such a long time ago. It is not that these trains are old, they just
cause lots of pollution. The engines are new and are quiet.
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NEXT>2770
PREVIOUS>2757
POSTER>aaron
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Metra, will they ever switch to electric trains?
DATE>Aug 8 11:47:07 1997
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Posted by aaron on July 08, 1997 at 13:58:23:
In Reply to: [6]Metra, will they ever switch to electric trains?
posted by Brian on July 08, 1997 at 13:53:42:
It costs a fortune to electrify, look at what is being spent on
upgrading
the Northeast Corridor from New Haven to Boston.
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NEXT>2771
PREVIOUS>2755
POSTER>Todd Glickman
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Too Old to Still Be Running!!!
DATE>Aug 8 11:47:08 1997
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Posted by Todd Glickman on July 08, 1997 at 18:02:37:
In Reply to: [6]Re: Too Old to Still Be Running!!! posted by David
Pirmann on July 08, 1997 at 13:37:08:
According to "The Bulletin" of the NY Division of the Electric
Railroaders' Association (June, 1977), the first two new dual-mode
locomotives, Model DE-30 being built in Barre, Vt, should be on the
property in August. The pilot cars of the new bi-level coaches
(Mitsui) will arrive in July. The first train composed of the new
rolling stock and locomotive is expected to be running next January.
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NEXT>3057
PREVIOUS>2746
POSTER>Steve
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Have idea?
DATE>Aug 8 11:47:10 1997
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Posted by Steve on July 08, 1997 at 19:13:38:
In Reply to: [5]Have idea? posted by Chris Roman on July 08, 1997 at
01:17:32:
Don't wait for an audience. If you have something to say, just say it.
If you want to contact the MTA directly, I suggest that you might find
them in the Manhattan phone book.
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NEXT>2762
PREVIOUS>2752
POSTER>Steve
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Pop Quiz for this week
DATE>Aug 8 11:47:11 1997
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Posted by Steve on July 08, 1997 at 19:16:48:
In Reply to: [5]Re: Pop Quiz for this week posted by Gary Jacobi on
July 08, 1997 at 13:29:45:
You know, I thought about that last night. What if you start at Mott
Ave, Far Rockaway and change at 145th Street for a southbound D? Well
anyway, since there was no prize at stake, you win too.
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NEXT>2763
PREVIOUS>2761
POSTER>P.A.R.
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Pop Quiz for this week
DATE>Aug 8 11:47:12 1997
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Posted by P.A.R. on July 08, 1997 at 19:16:52:
In Reply to: [5]Re: Pop Quiz for this week posted by Gary Jacobi on
July 08, 1997 at 13:29:45:
True, but if you were to take this route, you would have to transfer
from an Uptown A-Train at 168th Street, to either a Downtown 1 or 9
local, and then transfer again to a Brooklyn-bound 3-Train. If I just
counted correctly, that's TWO transfers. The quiz allowed for only ONE
transfer. There is no train at 168th Street that you can transfer to
that goes to New Lots Avenue in Brooklyn.
P.S. If you wanted to try this route today, you wouldn't be able to
because the IRT 168th Street Station is closed for Elevator repairs
until September 8. Oh well, nice try!!!
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NEXT>2830
PREVIOUS>2762
POSTER>Steve
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Pop Quiz for this week
DATE>Aug 8 11:47:14 1997
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Posted by Steve on July 08, 1997 at 19:19:18:
In Reply to: [5]Re: Pop Quiz for this week posted by Gerry O'Regan on
July 08, 1997 at 11:01:12:
Ehhhhhhhhh. Sorry, we're talking rail miles only. Otherwise we'd have
to count which passage you walk through and if you went out of your
way to get to the restroom.
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NEXT>2773
PREVIOUS>2751
POSTER>Steve
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: New NYC subway cars
DATE>Aug 8 11:47:15 1997
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Posted by Steve on July 08, 1997 at 19:24:20:
In Reply to: [5]Re: New NYC subway cars posted by Mark S Feinman on
July 08, 1997 at 13:06:05:
It's only in the feasibility investigation stage. The only car being
considered is the R-42 because it would be easy to cut through the
fiberglass bonnet to install the off-side window. The cab would be
sufficiently narrow that the door panel arrangement would not be
changed..
BTW, the 62As have convertitle cabs. To make them transverse cabs,
just one seat has to be removed and 1 side panel is swung out. Or
something like that.
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NEXT>2782
PREVIOUS>2748
POSTER>Steve
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: NYC Subway in 2020
DATE>Aug 8 11:47:17 1997
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Posted by Steve on July 08, 1997 at 19:26:57:
In Reply to: [5]Re: NYC Subway in 2020 posted by Mark S Feinman on
July 08, 1997 at 10:18:01:
370 Jay Street in the Information Center on the first floor. Most open
jobs (except for the Civil Service Titles) are posted there.
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NEXT>2964
PREVIOUS>2745
POSTER>Steve
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Any new cars becides as the R68's
DATE>Aug 8 11:47:18 1997
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Posted by Steve on July 08, 1997 at 19:31:22:
In Reply to: [5]Re: Any new cars becides as the R68's posted by Dave
on July 03, 1997 at 06:50:59:
Between the 12s and 32s you forgot the 15s, 16,s, 17s, 22s, 27s & 30s.
Between the 42s and 46s you forgot the 44s. Otherwise, Dave has
covered the reason for the gaps.
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NEXT>2768
PREVIOUS>2662
POSTER>Bingo
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: STCUM Depots
DATE>Aug 8 11:47:19 1997
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Posted by Bingo on July 08, 1997 at 20:17:00:
In Reply to: [5]Re: STCUM Depots posted by John on July 03, 1997 at
18:17:05:
There is none. They both look exactly the same, with the same
dimensions, and the same paint job. They just were made in different
periods of time. (1963,1973)
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NEXT>
PREVIOUS>2767
POSTER>Bingo
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: STCUM Depots
DATE>Aug 8 11:47:21 1997
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Posted by Bingo on July 08, 1997 at 20:19:03:
In Reply to: [5]Re: STCUM Depots posted by Sylvain on July 03, 1997 at
22:56:46:
Line 6 was never built?! I always thought it existed. Are there plans
in the future for it's construction/completion/planning?
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NEXT>
PREVIOUS>2655
POSTER>Bingo
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Toronto Subway Expansion
DATE>Aug 8 11:47:22 1997
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Posted by Bingo on July 08, 1997 at 20:31:04:
In Reply to: [5]Toronto Subway Expansion posted by Brian W on July 03,
1997 at 18:41:40:
Vaughan, GO, Mississauga, Brampton, and Markham Transit go to a
separate boarding area on Bishop Ave. I agree that the traffic on
Bishop gets very congested with the taxis, TTC buses and the other
transit systems fighting with the regular traffic, but here are my
three reasons why TTC can't put a station up at Steeles.
1) No money. Were paying for the Sheppard line and the Bloor-Danforth
line at the moment
2) There is no land free up at Yonge and Steeles. With a mall taking
up one whole corner, and with the Thornhill lands being untouchable
(amalgamated cities bullshit) we only have one corner to work with,
which is way too narrow for a subway station and too close to a
residential area.
3) Why? With the Metro area fighting for amalgamated transit,
everything will become more of a hell than usual anyway. Relax and
enjoy it.
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NEXT>2772
PREVIOUS>2758
POSTER>Andrew Huie
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Metra, will they ever switch to electric trains?
DATE>Aug 8 11:47:23 1997
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Posted by Andrew Huie on July 08, 1997 at 21:06:45:
In Reply to: [6]Re: Metra, will they ever switch to electric trains?
posted by aaron on July 08, 1997 at 13:58:23:
Wow, they're electrifying the stretch between New Haven and Boston?
Quite an undertaking for Slamtrak! 8-) When do they expect it to be
done?
To Brian:
As for electrified commuter railroads in the NY area, there aren't as
many as you might think. The Long Island Railroad still has large
sections of non-electrified trackage mainly because it is either
unwanted or unneeded.
The Hudson line, which runs part way along the Empire corridor, is
only electrified up to Croton-Harmon, less than half it's total
length. Even the New Haven line, which runs along the Northeast
corridor has 2 fairly long, non-electrified branches. Finally, out of
the 4 (5?) lines out of Hoboken, only one is electrified - the rest
are diesel.
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NEXT>2775
PREVIOUS>2759
POSTER>Andrew Huie
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Too Old to Still Be Running!!!
DATE>Aug 8 11:47:24 1997
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Posted by Andrew Huie on July 08, 1997 at 21:57:40:
In Reply to: [6]Re: Too Old to Still Be Running!!! posted by aaron on
July 08, 1997 at 13:41:44:
How difficult can it be to convert them to overriding shoes?
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NEXT>2776
PREVIOUS>2770
POSTER>John
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Metra, will they ever switch to electric trains?
DATE>Aug 8 11:47:26 1997
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Posted by John on July 08, 1997 at 22:08:47:
In Reply to: [5]Re: Metra, will they ever switch to electric trains?
posted by Andrew Huie on July 08, 1997 at 21:06:45:
Actually, 3 of the lines out of Hoboken are electrified - the
Montclair Branch, Morristown Branch, and Gladstone Branch, although
diesel trains are sometimes used on these lines (don't ask me why!).
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NEXT>2779
PREVIOUS>2764
POSTER>John
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: New NYC subway cars
DATE>Aug 8 11:47:27 1997
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Posted by John on July 08, 1997 at 22:20:57:
In Reply to: [5]Re: New NYC subway cars posted by Steve on July 08,
1997 at 19:24:20:
So the cabs on the R-42s would be even narrower? Jeez, they are
already narrow enough as it is! So while the Transit Authority will be
cutting back on costs, the motormen and conductors will be cutting
back on the Ring Dings and Twinkies :-)
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NEXT>
PREVIOUS>2722
POSTER>Nathan
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: You Think ???
DATE>Aug 8 11:47:28 1997
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Posted by Nathan on July 08, 1997 at 23:06:39:
In Reply to: [5]Re: You Think ??? posted by Steve on July 07, 1997 at
13:27:39:
That was what I was trying to say...I was telling him not to even talk
about controlling trains, he must know nothing about standard
operations...
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NEXT>2777
PREVIOUS>2771
POSTER>Nathan
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Too Old to Still Be Running!!!
DATE>Aug 8 11:47:30 1997
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Posted by Nathan on July 08, 1997 at 23:13:40:
In Reply to: [5]Re: Too Old to Still Be Running!!! posted by David
Pirmann on July 08, 1997 at 13:37:08:
Will the new equipment be dieselor electric??
Nathan
PS:I saw that show too...
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NEXT>2783
PREVIOUS>2772
POSTER>Nathan
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Metra, will they ever switch to electric trains?
DATE>Aug 8 11:47:31 1997
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Posted by Nathan on July 08, 1997 at 23:23:33:
In Reply to: [5]Metra, will they ever switch to electric trains?
posted by Brian on July 08, 1997 at 13:53:42:
Economics:Electrification requires a large capital investment and thus
a long planning/environmental impact review time.
Aside from cost, the pollution concern is somewhat negligable because
a passenger riding a train with one diesel locomotive pulling 500
people would still pollute considerably less than 1 person in a single
occupant vehicle. (yes, there is still those nasty emissions, NOX
etc...)
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NEXT>2778
PREVIOUS>2775
POSTER>Steve
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Too Old to Still Be Running!!!
DATE>Aug 8 11:47:32 1997
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Posted by Steve on July 09, 1997 at 00:28:36:
In Reply to: [5]Re: Too Old to Still Be Running!!! posted by Nathan on
July 08, 1997 at 23:13:40:
Some will be dual mode but the majority will be diesel...
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NEXT>2792
PREVIOUS>2777
POSTER>Steve
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Too Old to Still Be Running!!!
DATE>Aug 8 11:47:34 1997
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Posted by Steve on July 09, 1997 at 00:30:42:
In Reply to: [5]Re: Too Old to Still Be Running!!! posted by Andrew
Huie on July 08, 1997 at 21:57:40:
It's not difficult at all. It only involves changing the shoe beams -
the device that colds the contact shoe and fulcrum to the truck.
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NEXT>
PREVIOUS>2773
POSTER>Steve
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: New NYC subway cars
DATE>Aug 8 11:47:35 1997
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Posted by Steve on July 09, 1997 at 00:34:22:
In Reply to: [5]Re: New NYC subway cars posted by John on July 08,
1997 at 22:20:57:
I didn't say that the cabs would be narrower. They would be as wide
(front to back) as they are now, but they'd span the width of the car.
Remember, this is just being looked at as of now.
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NEXT>2788
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>Keranu
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: NYC Subway in 2020 (J/Z)
DATE>Aug 8 11:47:36 1997
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Posted by Keranu on July 09, 1997 at 08:57:38:
In Reply to: [6]Re: NYC Subway in 2020 posted by Garfield on July 07,
1997 at 17:12:48:
Where did you hear that they're going to cut the J/Z! That's a huge
line,
don't many people use it? Is it true they cut the express between
Marcy
and Myrtle? Cutting that line would leave a vast gap in N. Brooklyn
and
commuters would have to contend with the bus or those lucky enough to
drive to subway stations may be crammed onto the overcrowded Queens
Blvd
line. Does the MTA actually adopt a transit-shrinking programme? The
subway has done nothing but shrink and cut service since about 1960
(except
for a few extremely modest but fairly useless extensions). Does NYC
treat
its subways as a way backwards and the car as the way forward. In
London,
where a total of 120 years worth of productivity is lost each morning
through employees sitting in traffic jams, the Underground (Subway) is
seen as a solution and no expense is spared (and believe me, they're
seriously short of money too). Or does NYC want to turn into a Los
Angeles, practically zilch in the way of rail-based public
transportation
with highways criss-crossing the city and pollution belching big cars
everywhere?
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NEXT>
PREVIOUS>2699
POSTER>Keranu
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Is there hope for New York Subways?
DATE>Aug 8 11:47:38 1997
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Posted by Keranu on July 09, 1997 at 09:24:06:
In Reply to: [6]Is there hope for New York Subways? posted by Andrew
Byler on July 03, 1997 at 13:08:59:
I totally agree with you, the NYC Subway "extensions" are unbelievably
pathetic. The worrying thing is that the subway just keeps to be going
downhill, I'm not just talking about closing lines or the
deterioration of the system but little things such as the gradual
removal of express services and the gradual reduction of the no. of
routes using some lines. Also there are things like the whole
Manhattan Bridge fiasco which I believe will never be resolved.
Endlessly increasing fares. WHO IS IN CHARGE!!! GET WITH IT!!! The
subway system is like an alien world, compare it to a modern one like
Paris's. User friendly, complexity sorted out by EASY color coding and
signs that are actually placed where you will see them. There is also
none of this crap of lines passing over each other but not having a
station so you can change lines (how the hell do you sort out that
mess in Downtown Brooklyn).
There WERE (and maybe still will be for a while) two things that
separated NYC Subway from others around the world.
1) Size - Take a look at the map, it is mind-boggling to outsiders but
look at expansion plans (ones that will actually happen, that is) of
other systems and in terms of route length, another system will surely
surpass NYC soon.
2) Express trains - this is a brilliant concept but is sadly dying
out, am I the only one who believes that by about 2010, the only
express lines will be in the main north-south routes in Manhattan (oh,
wait a minute, what about N,R, already abandoned) and possibly a short
section of Queens Blvd.
Be prepared to say goodbye to skip-stop, if the subway keeps going on
this way, it'll be a loooooooong ride to Washington Heights on the #1,
rush hours included. The one-way express idea won't hold for much
longer, the J/Z has finally bitten the dust, the 4 went ages ago, the
Culver line.
Franklin shuttle will close soon, I reckon. I frankly wouldn't be
surprised if they tore down the J/M/Z, who's going to ride twenty-odd
stops to Jamaica if they can zoom on the E instead?
I know this is very pessimisstic but unless the MTA realises that
people are being pushed towards the car and that this is very bad, the
subway is also going to bite the dust.
Lecture over (Sighs of relief resound)
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NEXT>2786
PREVIOUS>2765
POSTER>Keranu
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: NYC Subway in 2020
DATE>Aug 8 11:47:39 1997
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Posted by Keranu on July 09, 1997 at 10:11:51:
In Reply to: [6]NYC Subway in 2020 posted by Michael Adler on July 03,
1997 at 21:52:19:
NYC Subway in 2020
==================
Following the infamous flame-thrower incident at Crescent St station
where Falkes Hoseby (cultivated from Martian dust found on pathfinder)
blew up an empty J train at 2am "for the fun of it", the MTA
designates the J/Z line a disaster area and uses this as its excuse
for closing it down. Exposed memo shows that this had actually been
planned 23 years ago in 1997. Linguistic evolution means that Express
is now spelt with only one 's' "Expres".
The transit museum is burned down by a protester against the planned
skyscraper development miles away in Long Island City (don't ask me
why, maybe she got lost) and is reopened as Court Street Subway
station. Commuters wait for 39 hours on the opening day (and the
following day) before realising that no trains were ever actually
scheduled to serve the station though the station would be open 24
hours a day for vandalism purposes and as simulator for what it used
to be like to wait for the Franklin shuttle back in the 'teens
(2013-2019).
The new MTA director claims that voices told him to cook the remaining
funds and serve it at the company dinner with beetroot garnish.
In March that year, a woman collapses and dies after looking at a
subway map, subsequently subway maps are classed as a "lethal weapon"
and all of them burned to avoid any further situations.
In April, vertical loops are added at various points along the old J/Z
tracks and the worlds first A to B roller coaster is opened whereby
residents of Jamaica Center area are able to take a roller coaster all
the way to the Brooklyn side of the Williamsburg Bridge. The roller
coaster is named "The J train".
In June, the greatest subway disaster ever occurs when a subway train
spontaneously bursts in a tunnel under the East River. The train was
carrying six times its capacity at the time after budget cuts forced
the MTA to run two-car trains on the Queens Boulevard line at the hour
on the hour.
Another disaster later that month as a greenfly lands on one of the
tracks on Manhattan Bridge causing it to collapse. About a thousand
cars and a B train plunge into the sea.
Another budget cut means the MTA closes the Lexington Av line, the 4
now terminates at 125 St and the 5 now runs on Broadway with the
1,2&3. The Pelham line is also closed. Staff strike at pay cuts. A
settlement is reached when all staff are expelled (excluding drivers)
and squirrels are employed.
A soar in the number complaints about inadequate signing in stations
forces the MTA to take down the old signs and put up new ones. The
squirrels were not able to put up new signs, however, leaving stations
signless. Commuters realise that squirrels cannot speak English or
Spanish and token sales plummet.
In August, it was decided that budget conditions meant that squirrels
were too expensive and one member of human staff was re-employed who
visited all the stations periodically selling tokens.
Later that month it is decided that this system is unworkable and an
immobile token stall is set up in Times Square.
September, one car trains now operate once every 60 minutes on all
lines except the G which is abandoned. Commuters squeezed into trains
or prevented from entering stations.
October, further budget cuts mean that all train service is withdrawn
and drivers sacked. 60 exercise instructors jog passengers down subway
tunnels to their destinations. Advertisements for super-human to do
the A train express route appear around the city.
Later, one instructor collapses from exhaustion, shuttle services and
locals now only permitted. MTA's budget investigated, it turns out
that it currently only $4 million a year of which $3.999 million is
subtracted before any spending on the subway/jog-tunnel system. MTA's
newer director is putting on weight, now 30 stone (420 pounds, I
think).
December, the subway is closed and pumped full of water, worlds
greatest water adventure park opened. Speedboats allowed in most
tunnels.
Christmas Day, multiple pile up of speed boats near Times Square,
boating in passageways banned, tunnels only now. 18 year old talks of
her 10 mile water slide trip in the old Lexington Av tunnel.
December 31, 2020, first underwater shop opens in what used to be
Christopher St station on the #1 line.
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NEXT>
PREVIOUS>2776
POSTER>Ed Sachs
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Metra, will they ever switch to electric trains?
DATE>Aug 8 11:47:41 1997
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Posted by Ed Sachs on July 09, 1997 at 11:58:53:
In Reply to: [6]Metra, will they ever switch to electric trains?
posted by Brian on July 08, 1997 at 13:53:42:
Actually, Metra does have an electrified line -- the former Illinois
Central commuter line, which now goes by the name "Metra Electric".
This line was electrified in 1926 to reduce smoke pollution along the
lakefront (it runs along the lake from the Hyde Park area of Chicago
to the Loop). Also, the South Shore line, a former interurban line
which uses the Metra Electric trackage into Chicago, is electrified.
The Illinois Central line is also unique in that there are separate
tracks for the commuter and freight servies. At their height, there
were 10 tracks between Hyde Park and Roosevelt Rd (about a mile south
of the downtown commuter terminal at Randolph St., and the site of
Central Station, the mainline passenger terminal). Six tracks were
used for the commuter trains (IC and SS), two for mainline passenger,
and two for freight.
The other lines lines are unlikely to electrify because of the
economics. Electrification was a big enough benefit over steam
operation to justify the cost. However, with the advent of
diesel/electric locomotives and push-pull operation, the financial
incentive just isn't there any more.
As for pollution, coal fired electric generating plants are a big
source of it, also.
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NEXT>2785
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>Ed Sachs
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Can irt cars run on bmt/ind lines (Historical Note)
DATE>Aug 8 11:47:42 1997
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Posted by Ed Sachs on July 09, 1997 at 12:12:29:
In Reply to: [6]Re: Can irt cars run on bmt/ind lines (Second try!)
posted by Gerry O'Regan on July 08, 1997 at 10:54:29:
During the late 1950s, a few IRT low-Vs were used on the BMT Franklin
Shuttle. They were outfitted with platform extensions under the doors
so there wouldn't be a platform gap, and (I presume) trip cocks on the
correct side for BMT operation.
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NEXT>
PREVIOUS>2784
POSTER>David Pirmann
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Can irt cars run on bmt/ind lines (Historical Note)
DATE>Aug 8 11:47:43 1997
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Posted by David Pirmann on July 09, 1997 at 12:38:06:
In Reply to: [6]Re: Can irt cars run on bmt/ind lines (Historical
Note) posted by Ed Sachs on July 09, 1997 at 12:12:29:
> IRT low-Vs were used on the BMT Franklin Shuttle
Yup! They also ran on the Culver Shuttle, and we have pictures! see
[7]Culver Shuttle. I also have one of the train on the Franklin
Shuttle, which I'll put up soon.
--Dave
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NEXT>2787
PREVIOUS>2782
POSTER>John
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: NYC Subway in 2020
DATE>Aug 8 11:47:45 1997
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Posted by John on July 09, 1997 at 13:30:38:
In Reply to: [5]Re: NYC Subway in 2020 posted by Keranu on July 09,
1997 at 10:11:51:
In 2020, the Transit Authority will cut service down to the bare
minimum. The #5 train will be cut down to a mere shuttle between Dyre
Avenue and E.180th St. The #6 will also be cut back to a shuttle
between Pelham Bay Park and 125th St. and Pelham Express service will
be discontinued. The #4 will be the only remaining line to operate on
Lexington Avenue and it will be a split between local and express
(local will be marked "4L", express will be marked "4X"). The route of
the #4 will stay the same, but will operate to New Lots at all times.
The #3 will be eliminated and the 148 and 145th St. stations will be
abandoned. The #2 will stay the same, likewise the #1. The #9 will be
eliminated.
The Times Square shuttle will be eliminated; passengers will have to
use the #7 for crosstown transfers.
The #7 Flushing Express will be eliminated.
The C train will be eliminated. The A will be a split between local
and express (local will be AL, express will be AX). The Lefferts
Boulivard branch will be abandoned, as well as the Rockaway Park
branch. Rockaway Shuttle service will be discontinued. E service will
remain the same.
The B will remain the same, but will not go to Queensbridge. It will
only go up to 168th.
The Queens Blvd. connection will have been abandoned during
construction, and the Second Avenue Subway still would not have been
touched. The South Side of the Manhattan Bridge will still be closed,
but the Q will be switched back to Broadway.
The D will stay the same, but express service in the Bronx will be
discontinued. The Q will operate express on Broadway, from
Queensbridge to DeKalb Avenue (it will not go onto the Brighton Line).
The Franklin Shuttle will be abandoned. The F will remain the same,
but will operate local in Queens.
The N will remain the same, but express service in Brooklyn will be
discontinued. The R will be cut back to Queens Plaza.
The G will also be cut back to Queens Plaza. The E will stay the same.
The J train will remain the same. The Z will be eliminated, and the M
will remain a shuttle between Myrtle and Metropolitan. The Transit
Authority is considering abandoning the Myrtle Avenue El altogether
and thus, eliminating the M.
The L will remain the same.
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NEXT>2789
PREVIOUS>2786
POSTER>John
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: NYC Subway in 2020
DATE>Aug 8 11:47:46 1997
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Posted by John on July 09, 1997 at 13:51:22:
In Reply to: [5]Re: NYC Subway in 2020 posted by John on July 09, 1997
at 13:30:38:
As for the equipment, the R142 will have taken the exact place where
the mainline Redbirds operated (all of the #2, some #4, all #5, some
#6). The mainline Redbirds will have been retired, but the #7 will
remain an exclusive-Redbird line. The R-134 will have replaced the
R-40s and R-42s, but all the other cars will remain in service.
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NEXT>
PREVIOUS>2780
POSTER>John
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: NYC Subway in 2020 (J/Z)
DATE>Aug 8 11:47:48 1997
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Posted by John on July 09, 1997 at 13:54:44:
In Reply to: [5]Re: NYC Subway in 2020 (J/Z) posted by Keranu on July
09, 1997 at 08:57:38:
Unfortunately, it looks as if New York is headed in that direction.
Did you read my post above for "NYC Subway in 2020"?
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NEXT>2790
PREVIOUS>2787
POSTER>Huaxianija Xoataualja
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: NYC Subway in 2020
DATE>Aug 8 11:47:49 1997
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Posted by Huaxianija Xoataualja on July 09, 1997 at 16:00:58:
In Reply to: [5]Re: NYC Subway in 2020 posted by Keranu on July 09,
1997 at 10:11:51:
Subway 2020 very different. Each commuter encased in personal
transport module (PTM). PTM go very fast, deducting from commuter
personal debit account (CPDA)each 1/10 of mile. PTM eject commuter
onto platform, now called commuter receiving area (CRA). No trains,
just many PTM zipping along tracks, PTM have stereo, video, no crime,
no bums, no smell of other passenger, no urine puddles. Commuter now
happy!!
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NEXT>2791
PREVIOUS>2789
POSTER>Charles
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: NYC Subway in 2020
DATE>Aug 8 11:47:50 1997
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Posted by Charles on July 09, 1997 at 21:53:26:
In Reply to: [6]Re: NYC Subway in 2020 posted by Keranu on July 09,
1997 at 10:11:51:
I regret to inform those of you who have already responded to NYC
Subway in 2020 that you are pesimistic who need to see an obvous
reality. The MTA Board and all of the "people" whom run this system
are subject to change. E. Virgil Conway, Lawerence Reuter etc.. Will
change when government changes. I don't think that ANYTHING including
the Franklin Shuttle is going to be torn down. Ridership is up, crime
is down.
I do not deny that I am seeing problems now. Defered matinence is
becoming more and more prevelant. NYCT also needs to take a look at
the way that they are treating their own employees. The system is far
from perfect, but it is better than it was in the late 70's and early
80's. THE SYSTEM WILL NEVER DIE. It can crumble but New Yorkers will
make sure that the subway, the main artery for NYC Survives the reign
of incompetent politicans. The car will be superior to the subway
until the city invests in the technology to update this system to the
standards of other systems such as washington Metro....
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NEXT>2793
PREVIOUS>2790
POSTER>Charles
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: NYC Subway in 2020
DATE>Aug 8 11:47:52 1997
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Posted by Charles on July 09, 1997 at 22:04:03:
In Reply to: [6]Re: NYC Subway in 2020 posted by Keranu on July 09,
1997 at 10:11:51:
I regret to inform those of you who have already responded to NYC
Subway in 2020 that you are over dramitic and have a pesimistic
attitude who need to see an obvous reality. The MTA Board and all of
the "people" whom run this system are subject to change. E. Virgil
Conway, Lawerence Reuter etc these people are all temporary.. Will
change when government changes. I don't think that ANYTHING including
the Franklin Shuttle is going to be torn down. Ridership is up, crime
is down. While expansion of the system is unrealistic, the sixty-third
st. tunnel will get finished. Second Avenue, Sadly this will never
happen. Station Rehabs improve the system, and I believe that we have
come a long way. The R110 tech trains are a precursor to a new
generation of equipment. Quieter more efficent than some of the lemons
today such as the R40's. I am a fan of history, but in some cases
history must make way for efficence, reliability, and a lack of
capital
I do not deny that I am seeing problems now. Defered matinence is
becoming more and more prevelant. NYCT also needs to take a look at
the way that they are treating their own employees. The system is far
from perfect, but it is better than it was in the late 70's and early
80's. THE SYSTEM WILL NEVER DIE. It can crumble but New Yorkers will
make sure that the subway, the main artery for NYC Survives the reign
of incompetent politicans. The car will be superior to the subway
until the city invests in the technology to update this system to the
standards of other systems such as washington Metro The J/Z lines are
going nowhere, Though the line needs major structural work.
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NEXT>2806
PREVIOUS>2778
POSTER>Andrew Huie
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Too Old to Still Be Running!!!
DATE>Aug 8 11:47:53 1997
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Posted by Andrew Huie on July 09, 1997 at 22:05:48:
In Reply to: [6]Re: Too Old to Still Be Running!!! posted by Steve on
July 09, 1997 at 00:28:36:
I find it a little odd that the LIRR doesn't seem to put much emphasis
on dual-mode locomotives, considering how much of the system is
electrified. Hell, with a dual mode locomotive they should be able to
run a train all the way to eastern long island. Was there any reason
why this wasn't pursued further?
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NEXT>2962
PREVIOUS>2791
POSTER>Charles
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: NYC Subway in 2020
DATE>Aug 8 11:47:55 1997
EMAILNOTICES>no
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Posted by Charles on July 09, 1997 at 22:05:52:
In Reply to: [6]Re: NYC Subway in 2020 posted by Keranu on July 09,
1997 at 10:11:51:
I regret to inform those of you who have already responded to NYC
Subway in 2020 that you are over dramitic and have a pesimistic
attitude who need to see an obvous reality. The MTA Board and all of
the "heads" whom run this system are subject to change. E. Virgil
Conway, Lawerence Reuter etc these people are all temporary.. They
will change when government changes. I don't think that ANYTHING
including the Franklin Shuttle is going to be torn down. Ridership is
up, crime is down. While expansion of the system is unrealistic, the
sixty-third st. tunnel will get finished. Second Avenue, Sadly this
will never happen. Station Rehabs improve the system, and I believe
that we have come a long way. The R110 tech trains are a precursor to
a new generation of equipment. Quieter more efficent than some of the
lemons today such as the R40's. I am a fan of history, but in some
cases history must make way for efficence, reliability, and a lack of
capital
I do not deny that I am seeing problems now. Defered matinence is
becoming more and more prevelant. NYCT also needs to take a look at
the way that they are treating their own employees. The system is far
from perfect, but it is better than it was in the late 70's and early
80's. THE SYSTEM WILL NEVER DIE. It can crumble but New Yorkers will
make sure that the subway, the main artery for NYC Survives the reign
of incompetent politicans. The car will be superior to the subway
until the city invests in the technology to update this system to the
standards of other systems such as washington Metro The J/Z lines are
going nowhere, Though the line needs major structural work.
____________________________________________________
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NEXT>2876
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>Charles
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: NYC Subway in 2020 (read me)
DATE>Aug 8 11:47:56 1997
EMAILNOTICES>no
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Posted by Charles on July 09, 1997 at 22:06:34:
In Reply to: [6]Re: NYC Subway in 2020 posted by Keranu on July 09,
1997 at 10:11:51:
I regret to inform those of you who have already responded to NYC
Subway in 2020 that you are over dramitic and have a pesimistic
attitude who need to see an obvous reality. The MTA Board and all of
the "heads" whom run this system are subject to change. E. Virgil
Conway, Lawerence Reuter etc these people are all temporary.. They
will change when government changes. I don't think that ANYTHING
including the Franklin Shuttle is going to be torn down. Ridership is
up, crime is down. While expansion of the system is unrealistic, the
sixty-third st. tunnel will get finished. Second Avenue, Sadly this
will never happen. Station Rehabs improve the system, and I believe
that we have come a long way. The R110 tech trains are a precursor to
a new generation of equipment. Quieter more efficent than some of the
lemons today such as the R40's. I am a fan of history, but in some
cases history must make way for efficence, reliability, and a lack of
capital
I do not deny that I am seeing problems now. Defered matinence is
becoming more and more prevelant. NYCT also needs to take a look at
the way that they are treating their own employees. The system is far
from perfect, but it is better than it was in the late 70's and early
80's. THE SYSTEM WILL NEVER DIE. It can crumble but New Yorkers will
make sure that the subway, the main artery for NYC Survives the reign
of incompetent politicans. The car will be superior to the subway
until the city invests in the technology to update this system to the
standards of other systems such as washington Metro The J/Z lines are
going nowhere, Though the line needs major structural work.
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NEXT>2797
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>Gary Jacobi
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>No signs of life
DATE>Aug 8 11:47:58 1997
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Posted by Gary Jacobi on July 09, 1997 at 23:34:21:
Are you down? No messages since 7/81
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NEXT>2803
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>David Pirmann - Web Site Host
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>New Stuff
DATE>Aug 8 11:47:59 1997
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Posted by David Pirmann - Web Site Host on July 09, 1997 at
Greetings,
Just wanted to let you all know of new stuff on the site.
The [6]Historical Perspectives section
has been redone with lots of new pictures added. The page on
the [7]Culver Shuttle has been
moved to the "Lines" section with some new pictures added.
Lots of pictures are being rearranged, rescanned, removed (if
they are of poorer quality). If you find broken links please
let me know.
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NEXT>2799
PREVIOUS>2795
POSTER>David Pirmann
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: No signs of life
DATE>Aug 8 11:48:00 1997
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Posted by David Pirmann on July 09, 1997 at 23:42:05:
In Reply to: [6]No signs of life posted by Gary Jacobi on July 09,
1997 at 23:34:21:
Check the View by Date. There were lots of posts today. (18). Not as
many as past weeks, but that's maybe due to people being on vacation.
I had some complaints about the site being slow, but as best I can
tell that's an internet problem and not a server problem on my end.
I've been watching the logs and we're getting a lot of hits every
minute.
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NEXT>2815
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>steve lowenthal
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Metra track maps
DATE>Aug 8 11:48:02 1997
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Posted by steve lowenthal on July 09, 1997 at 23:43:20:
In Reply to: [6]Re: Metra, will they ever switch to electric trains?
posted by Ed Sachs on July 09, 1997 at 11:58:53:
does anyone HAVE track maps of the metra ----detailed
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NEXT>2804
PREVIOUS>2797
POSTER>Gary Jacobi
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: No signs of life
DATE>Aug 8 11:48:03 1997
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Posted by Gary Jacobi on July 09, 1997 at 23:52:21:
In Reply to: [5]Re: No signs of life posted by David Pirmann on July
09, 1997 at 23:42:05:
View by date is working, but the home screen is acting very wierd(ly).
I had the same problem earlier this afternoon from another PC.
SOMETIMES I RELOAD, AND THERE ARE FEWER MESSAGES THAN BEFORE !
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NEXT>2979
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>Nathan
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: NYC Subway in 2020 (PRT, not PTM)
DATE>Aug 8 11:48:04 1997
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Posted by Nathan on July 10, 1997 at 00:39:03:
In Reply to: [5]Re: NYC Subway in 2020 posted by Huaxianija Xoataualja
on July 09, 1997 at 16:00:58:
Oh dear, another PRT activist. Look, the problems with personal rapid
transit (PRT) is that they use automobile sized vehicles which are
JUST electrified computerized automobiles, which means instead of
subway lines
we will have freeways with computerized automobiles on them. For some
cities it will not solve the urban sprawl problem, and in NYC there is
no room for the massive guideways required.
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NEXT>2802
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>Zack
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>3 ave EL
DATE>Aug 8 11:48:06 1997
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Posted by Zack on July 10, 1997 at 03:33:13:
When was the 3 rd ave el demolished by looking at the site i woluld
say it was sometime in the late 70's or 80's and why dident they keep
it if it would releve pressure on the lexington ave subway??
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NEXT>2809
PREVIOUS>2801
POSTER>David Pirmann
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: 3 ave EL
DATE>Aug 8 11:48:07 1997
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Posted by David Pirmann on July 10, 1997 at 08:00:00:
In Reply to: [6]3 ave EL posted by Zack on July 10, 1997 at 03:33:13:
Manhattan Section - open ~1878 to 5/12/1955
Bronx Section - open ~1888 to 4/28/1973
The 3rd Avenue el was the last to go in Manhattan. Ninth closed on
6/11/1940, Sixth closed on 12/4/1938, Second on 6/13/1940. It was
planned that by the time the El was demolished, or shortly thereafter,
the Second Avenue subway would have been completed.
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NEXT>2805
PREVIOUS>2796
POSTER>Charles Fiori
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: New Stuff
DATE>Aug 8 11:48:08 1997
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Posted by Charles Fiori on July 10, 1997 at 08:02:27:
In Reply to: [5]New Stuff posted by David Pirmann - Web Site Host on
July 09, 1997 at 23:35:39:
Great idea, Dave. However, I thought I was watching "Groundhog Day" as
each of the IND sections I pulled up all had First Generation Cars.
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NEXT>2857
PREVIOUS>2799
POSTER>David Pirmann
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: No signs of life
DATE>Aug 8 11:48:10 1997
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Posted by David Pirmann on July 10, 1997 at 08:03:05:
In Reply to: [6]Re: No signs of life posted by Gary Jacobi on July 09,
1997 at 23:52:21:
I ran expire yesterday afternoon so of course there would have been
less messages between early in the day and later. I've never seen the
behavior you describe-- the index page is static and unless messages
are physically removed it should always show the right list. The View
By Date is a CGI script and compiles the list each time someone calls
it up, based on the data in the View By Thread list (it doesn't
actually search the articles on disk).
If you see the pages showing less messages than before, please try and
save them (save as source in netscape).
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NEXT>2838
PREVIOUS>2803
POSTER>David Pirmann
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: New Stuff
DATE>Aug 8 11:48:11 1997
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Posted by David Pirmann on July 10, 1997 at 08:08:35:
In Reply to: [6]Re: New Stuff posted by Charles Fiori on July 10, 1997
at 08:02:27:
oops, it seems I was less than diligent updating the index-- i just
fixed it. Reload it and be on your merry way. (The picture links
worked but the text links were broken)
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NEXT>2808
PREVIOUS>2792
POSTER>Dave
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Too Old to Still Be Running!!!
DATE>Aug 8 11:48:12 1997
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Posted by Dave on July 10, 1997 at 09:17:41:
In Reply to: [6]Re: Too Old to Still Be Running!!! posted by Andrew
Huie on July 09, 1997 at 22:05:48:
Will dual-mode diesels (e.g., FL-9 or the new engines being built) fit
in the tunnel to Penn Station?
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NEXT>2811
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>David Pirmann
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>City Hall Station Renovation News
DATE>Aug 8 11:48:14 1997
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Posted by David Pirmann on July 10, 1997 at 10:06:02:
Recent rumor about the City Hall Station renovation project is that it
is "on hold" due to some recent shakeups/reorganizing at the Transit
Museum.
Even so, the Museum web site just put up a section about the City Hall
project, at:
[6]
http://www.mta.nyc.ny.us/nyct/Museum/cityhall.htm
--Dave
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NEXT>2820
PREVIOUS>2806
POSTER>Peter Rosa
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Too Old to Still Be Running!!!
DATE>Aug 8 11:48:15 1997
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Posted by Peter Rosa on July 10, 1997 at 10:55:17:
In Reply to: [6]Re: Too Old to Still Be Running!!! posted by Dave on
July 10, 1997 at 09:17:41:
[re dual-mode locomotives fitting in the Penn Station tunnels]
There shouldn't be any problem. Afternoons at 4:54 a train with the
new bi-level cars (pulled by a FL-9 dual-mode locomotive) runs out of
Penn to Pt. Jefferson.
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NEXT>2810
PREVIOUS>2802
POSTER>Peter Rosa
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: 3 ave EL
DATE>Aug 8 11:48:17 1997
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Posted by Peter Rosa on July 10, 1997 at 10:58:42:
In Reply to: [6]Re: 3 ave EL posted by David Pirmann on July 10, 1997
at 08:00:00:
The 3rd Avenue EL was demolished soon after it was closed in 1955.
From what I've read, the demolition work didn't take long; supposedly
it's still possible to see the places where the structure stood, if
you look from a high window over the avenue.
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NEXT>2812
PREVIOUS>2809
POSTER>John
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: 3 ave EL
DATE>Aug 8 11:48:18 1997
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Posted by John on July 10, 1997 at 13:11:59:
In Reply to: [5]Re: 3 ave EL posted by David Pirmann on July 10, 1997
at 08:00:00:
And man, were they wrong!
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NEXT>2813
PREVIOUS>2807
POSTER>aaron
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: City Hall Station Renovation News
DATE>Aug 8 11:48:19 1997
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Posted by aaron on July 10, 1997 at 14:22:30:
In Reply to: [6]City Hall Station Renovation News posted by David
Pirmann on July 10, 1997 at 10:06:02:
On the subject of the Ciry Hall station, I thought you could ride
around
the loop to see the station. When I tried a few months ago, two
motormen
would not let me stay on the train. A few days later, another operator
did finally let me stay on...
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NEXT>2841
PREVIOUS>2810
POSTER>aaron
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: 3 ave EL
DATE>Aug 8 11:48:21 1997
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Posted by aaron on July 10, 1997 at 14:42:01:
In Reply to: [6]Re: 3 ave EL posted by Peter Rosa on July 10, 1997 at
10:58:42:
That is only in Manhattan, not the Bronx
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NEXT>
PREVIOUS>2811
POSTER>David Pirmann
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: City Hall Station Renovation News
DATE>Aug 8 11:48:22 1997
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Posted by David Pirmann on July 10, 1997 at 15:11:39:
In Reply to: [6]Re: City Hall Station Renovation News posted by aaron
on July 10, 1997 at 14:22:30:
Well, just because you're "allowed" to do something doesn't mean
everyone will let you :-)
The same thing happened to me when I was down there once. I was
showing someone the station. The first motorman got all suspicious and
said no, but the second one was really polite, and even turned out the
car lights for us. :-)
So it just pays to ask a second time...
--Dave
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NEXT>2855
PREVIOUS>2747
POSTER>tom pinto
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Staten Island connection
DATE>Aug 8 11:48:23 1997
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Posted by tom pinto on July 10, 1997 at 16:02:17:
In Reply to: [5]Re: Staten Island connection posted by Raymond on July
08, 1997 at 10:12:55:
there is an old section of roadbed for a proposed cross island
passenger line behind the staten island mall, including a stone bridge
abutment, just at the edge of the parkland graded over a century ago.
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NEXT>2817
PREVIOUS>2798
POSTER>aaron
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Metra track maps
DATE>Aug 8 11:48:25 1997
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Posted by aaron on July 10, 1997 at 16:20:51:
In Reply to: [6]Re: Metra track maps posted by steve lowenthal on July
09, 1997 at 23:43:20:
Yes, yes yes!!! Look at www.transitchicago.com, it is all there
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NEXT>2823
PREVIOUS>2721
POSTER>Bingo
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: PCC Streetcars for Kenosha Wisconsin
DATE>Aug 8 11:48:27 1997
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Posted by Bingo on July 10, 1997 at 16:22:44:
In Reply to: [5]Re: PCC Streetcars for Kenosha Wisconsin posted by
Nathan on July 07, 1997 at 01:05:41:
What Toronto PCC's? I haven't seen a PCC since they were used on the
Harbourfront LRT line. I know we sold couple dozen of them to Egypt.
Anyway, Toronto needs new streetcars.
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NEXT>3033
PREVIOUS>2815
POSTER>David Pirmann
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Metra track maps
DATE>Aug 8 11:48:28 1997
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Posted by David Pirmann on July 10, 1997 at 16:28:29:
In Reply to: [6]Re: Metra track maps posted by aaron on July 10, 1997
at 16:20:51:
Don't see any track maps there. It's unlikely you'd find track maps on
the official web site of the transit provider. They're fairly arcane
and not of general interest.
(There *IS* a route map there. Don't be confused between routes and
tracks. A single route line of the NYC subway might have 2, 3, or 4
tracks, etc.)
-Dave
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NEXT>2952
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>subway-buff
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Track Maps
DATE>Aug 8 11:48:29 1997
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Posted by subway-buff on July 10, 1997 at 17:29:38:
Does anyone have track maps for: MARTA, NJ Transit and SEPTA to Phila.
(R7).
If so please post or give a link to find the maps. thanks.
ps to David Pirman, site host- Excellent site. Your site has taught me
more about the system than any book. I especially enjoy your picture
collection.
Thanks :-)
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NEXT>2822
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>aaron
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>#3 Train
DATE>Aug 8 11:48:31 1997
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Posted by aaron on July 10, 1997 at 22:09:23:
Does anyone know why #3 trains are only a maximum of 9 cars?
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NEXT>2821
PREVIOUS>2808
POSTER>Steve
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Too Old to Still Be Running!!!
DATE>Aug 8 11:48:32 1997
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Posted by Steve on July 10, 1997 at 22:13:44:
In Reply to: [5]Re: Too Old to Still Be Running!!! posted by Peter
Rosa on July 10, 1997 at 10:55:17:
I don't want to nit-pick but it's the 4:49 PM out of Penn Station
(track 19) or 5:11 PM from Jamaica. By the way, in the morning it
passes through Hicksville between 6:40 - 6:45 Am and at about 7:05 @
Jamaica.
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NEXT>
PREVIOUS>2820
POSTER>Steve
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Too Old to Still Be Running!!!
DATE>Aug 8 11:48:33 1997
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Posted by Steve on July 10, 1997 at 22:15:15:
In Reply to: [5]Re: Too Old to Still Be Running!!! posted by Dave on
July 10, 1997 at 09:17:41:
The FL-9 s have no trouble fitting through the Amtrak tunnels into
Penn Station.
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NEXT>
PREVIOUS>2819
POSTER>Charles
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: #3 Train
DATE>Aug 8 11:48:34 1997
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Posted by Charles on July 10, 1997 at 22:54:32:
In Reply to: [6]#3 Train posted by aaron on July 10, 1997 at 22:09:23:
The # 3 only operates with 9 car R62A's because Lenox terminal cannot
accomadate 10 cars and it is not nesscary to cut the trains down to 8.
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NEXT>2825
PREVIOUS>2816
POSTER>James
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: PCC Streetcars for Kenosha Wisconsin
DATE>Aug 8 11:48:36 1997
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Posted by James on July 10, 1997 at 23:22:22:
In Reply to: [5]Re: PCC Streetcars for Kenosha Wisconsin posted by Dan
Lawrence on July 07, 1997 at 12:54:11:
I can't believe that any AAR certified shop will change the 'back to
back'
dimension of wheel sets the way you describe it. Where did you get
your information?
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NEXT>2826
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>Zack
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Cab arrangement
DATE>Aug 8 11:48:37 1997
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Posted by Zack on July 11, 1997 at 00:29:49:
whats the diffrence between tranverse and corner cabs and the "cross
car cabs the ta is looking in to. what is on the other side of the cab
now on the r-30 series?
P.S there should be a section on this website devoted to cabs and cab
view pictures
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NEXT>2840
PREVIOUS>2823
POSTER>Nathan
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: PCC Streetcars for Kenosha Wisconsin
DATE>Aug 8 11:48:38 1997
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Posted by Nathan on July 11, 1997 at 01:55:48:
In Reply to: [5]Re: PCC Streetcars for Kenosha Wisconsin posted by
Bingo on July 10, 1997 at 16:22:44:
The TTC PCC's were removed from regular service in 1995, but they are
still on TTC property. Yes, Toronto needs new streetcars, but the
CLRV's look pretty nice...
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NEXT>2828
PREVIOUS>2824
POSTER>subway-buff
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Cab arrangement
DATE>Aug 8 11:48:39 1997
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Posted by subway-buff on July 11, 1997 at 04:32:42:
In Reply to: [6]Cab arrangement posted by Zack on July 11, 1997 at
00:29:49:
The new cars will have a cab that goes all the way across rather than
the little "closet" they use now. Transverse, full-width, etc are
diffgerent names for the same thing.
On the R3x series question- the other side has conductor controls that
the conductor uses to open./close doors.
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PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>David Pirmann
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>MTA Capital Plan Approved
DATE>Aug 8 11:48:41 1997
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Posted by David Pirmann on July 11, 1997 at 08:16:31:
Last night the MTA Capital Plan was approved which authorizes $7.3
billion in expenditures for the next three years, including $1.4
billion for the R-142's. So it looks like construction of those new
cars will start soon. Also part of the plan was $35 million to convert
the 8th Avenue Post Office into a new Penn Station for Amtrak trains,
and restore many of the 1995 service cuts (the overnight runs of the
42nd St. Shuttle was one of these, decreased numbers of trains and bus
service). It didn't restore money for funding cleaning crews.
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NEXT>2864
PREVIOUS>2826
POSTER>David Pirmann
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Cab arrangement
DATE>Aug 8 11:48:42 1997
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Posted by David Pirmann on July 11, 1997 at 08:18:51:
In Reply to: [6]Cab arrangement posted by Zack on July 11, 1997 at
00:29:49:
> P.S there should be a section on this website devoted to cabs and
cab view pictures
Sounds great.. do you have access to cabs to take these pictures? I
sure don't.
--Dave
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NEXT>2834
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>aaron
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Subway spotting
DATE>Aug 8 11:48:43 1997
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Posted by aaron on July 11, 1997 at 08:39:45:
What is your favorite spot for subway spotting in New York Ciry. Mine
is the view of the Coney Island shops from the "F" train as it goes
over the Belt Parkway.
The best spot in the country however is on the crossover bridge at the
Howard Street Terminal in Chicago. Here three lines converge and this
bridge affords one a look at the station as well as the yards and shop
at
Howard Street. Since trains are interchangable on all lines in
Chicago,
except Skokie Swift(Yellow Line), this vantage point provides a view
of
almost all types of rolling stock operating on the system.
Additionally,
trains bound for the main shops in Skokie pass through here.
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PREVIOUS>2763
POSTER>Philip E. Dominguez
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Pop Quiz for this week
DATE>Aug 8 11:48:45 1997
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Posted by Philip E. Dominguez on July 11, 1997 at 09:39:46:
In Reply to: [5]Re: Pop Quiz for this week posted by Gary Jacobi on
July 08, 1997 at 13:29:45:
Take the A Train from Far Rockaway to Lower Manhattan. Then Transfer
to
#2 train. Take #2 northbound to 241 st.
-Phil
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POSTER>Philip E. Dominguez
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: A TRAIN DERAILMENT& Train Modification
DATE>Aug 8 11:48:46 1997
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Posted by Philip E. Dominguez on July 11, 1997 at 09:51:10:
In Reply to: [5]Re: A TRAIN DERAILMENT - 7/3/1997 posted by Garfield
on July 07, 1997 at 17:00:20:
Scince the Crash on the williamsburg Br. All Subway Trains Have been
modified to pick-up speed at a lower rate. The modified trains(models)
that tend to have the greates performence picking up speed are the
R-38
and the R-40(slant) models. The R-46 models have a very slow pick-up
and are "Dead" after about 30 mph. At around 30 mph the train will
rock
as if in the coast position.
-Phil
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NEXT>2833
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>Philip E. Dominguez
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Are New Subway Cars Needed & my thoughts on the METRO CARD
DATE>Aug 8 11:48:48 1997
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Posted by Philip E. Dominguez on July 11, 1997 at 10:11:21:
I think that the MTA does not need new subway cars. The new subway
cars
have to many "gadgets" that really are not needed for driving a subway
train. I also think that the subway cars cost way to much(1.8 million
PER CAR!!). They are inferior to older models. Others may disagree
with
this but are they as solid as older models(R-32's,R-38's, R-40's,ect)?
The R-110b seems to have some sort of problem EVERY time it is out on
the
road. Also the cars that we have now can last another 20 years if
taken care of well. I also think that the MTA should not be getting
rid
of conducters on its trains(opto service). ]
my thoughts on the metro-card
I think that the metro card is a wast of MTA funding. Even with the
transfer included i prefer a token. I think the metro card is a scam
to
make us pay more(or less) when traveling. I think the MTA(in 5-15
years)
start calculating subway trips by distince(such as The D.C. metro).
Post what you think about what i have written.
-Phil
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NEXT>2839
PREVIOUS>2832
POSTER>Jerry
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Are New Subway Cars Needed & my thoughts on the METRO CARD
DATE>Aug 8 11:48:49 1997
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Posted by Jerry on July 11, 1997 at 11:16:11:
In Reply to: [5]Are New Subway Cars Needed & my thoughts on the METRO
CARD posted by Philip E. Dominguez on July 11, 1997 at 10:11:21:
In my opinion, metrocards are a major advance, even without the free
transfer policy, which as someone who grew up in a two fare zone, is a
major advance in and of itself. For the rest of us, the ability to
avoid token lines and to carry a pocket full of tokens is a step up.
You are right that the card makes fare zones logistically possible;
much of the world, e.g. London, Washington, San Fran, thinks this is
the logical pricing system. I, for one, think it will remain
politically impossible in New York.
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NEXT>2835
PREVIOUS>2829
POSTER>Michael Berson
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Subway spotting
DATE>Aug 8 11:48:51 1997
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Posted by Michael Berson on July 11, 1997 at 11:22:40:
In Reply to: [6]Subway spotting posted by aaron on July 11, 1997 at
08:39:45:
I personally like the overpass at Coney Island-Stillwell looking North
towards the Coney Island yards. This is especially good during yard
"put-ins". You also get good views of the B and N trains entering and
leaving Stillwell.
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NEXT>2837
PREVIOUS>2834
POSTER>Michael Berson
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Subway spotting
DATE>Aug 8 11:48:52 1997
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Posted by Michael Berson on July 11, 1997 at 11:22:50:
In Reply to: [6]Subway spotting posted by aaron on July 11, 1997 at
08:39:45:
I personally like the overpass at Coney Island-Stillwell looking North
towards the Coney Island yards. This is especially good during yard
"put-ins". You also get good views of the B and N trains entering and
leaving Stillwell.
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NEXT>2843
PREVIOUS>2827
POSTER>Michael Berson
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: MTA Capital Plan Approved
DATE>Aug 8 11:48:53 1997
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Posted by Michael Berson on July 11, 1997 at 11:26:42:
In Reply to: [6]MTA Capital Plan Approved posted by David Pirmann on
July 11, 1997 at 08:16:31:
Besides the reinstatement of late-night shuttle service, what other
services will be reinstated. The only other one I remember is they
closed Dean Street on the Frnaklin Avenue shuttle. I can't imagaine
they'd re-open it.
Mike Berson
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NEXT>2846
PREVIOUS>2835
POSTER>Gary Jacobi
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Subway spotting
DATE>Aug 8 11:48:54 1997
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Posted by Gary Jacobi on July 11, 1997 at 12:38:37:
In Reply to: [5]Subway spotting posted by aaron on July 11, 1997 at
08:39:45:
Sounds like a great spot, can you give directions to this
out-of-towner in case I have a long layover at O'Hare?
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NEXT>2850
PREVIOUS>2805
POSTER>Gary Jacobi
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: New Stuff
DATE>Aug 8 11:48:55 1997
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Posted by Gary Jacobi on July 11, 1997 at 12:52:44:
In Reply to: [5]New Stuff posted by David Pirmann - Web Site Host on
July 09, 1997 at 23:35:39:
Not to nit-pick, but to help out (you did put a ? after 1964). On the
likely date of the Sands St. photo in "Abandoned Elevateds", the deck
@ Sands St. came down in 1944. Your photo also shows the trolley wire
structure, which MAY have come down earlier; I am checking my sources.
A beautiful picture in any event. I will try to boost it's contrast
with some software I can access at my office on monday.
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NEXT>2847
PREVIOUS>2833
POSTER>Gary Jacobi
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Are New Subway Cars Needed & my thoughts on the METRO CARD
DATE>Aug 8 11:48:57 1997
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Posted by Gary Jacobi on July 11, 1997 at 13:00:05:
In Reply to: [5]Are New Subway Cars Needed & my thoughts on the METRO
CARD posted by Philip E. Dominguez on July 11, 1997 at 10:11:21:
Don't worry too much about the card being converted to ride length
metering. The existing systems are easily defeated into charging
minimum fare for ANY length of trip by using two cards. That's all I
will say in deference to Dave's wishes not to describe illegal
activity, which this may be. I've tried it once each on two modern
systems, and it worked.
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NEXT>2842
PREVIOUS>2825
POSTER>Gerry O'Regan
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: PCC Streetcars for Kenosha Wisconsin
DATE>Aug 8 11:48:58 1997
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Posted by Gerry O'Regan on July 11, 1997 at 13:03:09:
In Reply to: [6]Re: PCC Streetcars for Kenosha Wisconsin posted by
James on July 10, 1997 at 23:22:22:
Who said any transit shop was AAR Certified? Some may be but for the
most part, these operations work under their own set of regulations.
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PREVIOUS>2812
POSTER>Gerry O'Regan
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: 3 ave EL
DATE>Aug 8 11:48:59 1997
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Posted by Gerry O'Regan on July 11, 1997 at 13:13:36:
In Reply to: [6]Re: 3 ave EL posted by David Pirmann on July 10, 1997
at 08:00:00:
The 1940 date for the 2nd Av. el applies north of 59th St. The south
end and the connection accross the Queensboro Bridge lasted about two
more years..
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NEXT>2898
PREVIOUS>2840
POSTER>Dan Lawrence
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: PCC Streetcars for Kenosha Wisconsin
DATE>Aug 8 11:49:01 1997
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Posted by Dan Lawrence on July 11, 1997 at 13:15:22:
In Reply to: [5]Re: PCC Streetcars for Kenosha Wisconsin posted by
James on July 10, 1997 at 23:22:22:
My information comes from SEPTA, MBTA and SFMUNI. All three properties
have
shopped PCC B-2 trucks from various guages. PCC Trucks are unlike any
other
streetcar trucks in that everything is built to the same standards.
Want to
reguage a truck from Toronto guage to standard guage? Just disassemble
the truck, pull the backing plates from the axles, pull the axles,
reset or replace the "wide guage" axles, repress the backing plates on
the axles and finish assembling the truck. Not complicated at all. In
the case of Kenosa,
the CTA shops should be able to reguage the trucks quickly. Only the
axles are changed, nothing else.
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NEXT>2890
PREVIOUS>2836
POSTER>Gerry O'Regan
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: MTA Capital Plan Approved
DATE>Aug 8 11:49:02 1997
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Posted by Gerry O'Regan on July 11, 1997 at 13:23:42:
In Reply to: [6]Re: MTA Capital Plan Approved posted by Michael Berson
on July 11, 1997 at 11:26:42:
Obviously the usual political games are being played here. A Capital
Plan means infrastructure, not operations, so restoring service cuts
adds up to the old TA trick of using capital money for operations. I
guess that means no progress on a Second Av. Subway or a real solution
to the problems in Queens.
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NEXT>2845
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>Chris
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Problems on the Subway
DATE>Aug 8 11:49:04 1997
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Posted by Chris on July 11, 1997 at 14:27:58:
In my opinion, there are still tons of problems on the New York
Subways. For example, just a few weeks ago, my friend was mugged. I
would like to know, from the various people's opinions, what would be
the biggest problem on the NY subway today, and a feasible mean to
solving it.
ThanX!
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NEXT>2848
PREVIOUS>2844
POSTER>Peter Rosa
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Problems on the Subway
DATE>Aug 8 11:49:05 1997
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Posted by Peter Rosa on July 11, 1997 at 14:55:29:
In Reply to: [6]Problems on the Subway posted by Chris on July 11,
1997 at 14:27:58:
The biggest problem? Service reliability, without a doubt. There may
be some debate about the reasons, but service on most lines has become
notably less reliable in the past year or two. Waits for trains seem
to get longer and longer. Solve the reliability issue, and other
problems will seem less severe.
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NEXT>2912
PREVIOUS>2837
POSTER>David Pirmann
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Subway spotting
DATE>Aug 8 11:49:06 1997
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Posted by David Pirmann on July 11, 1997 at 14:58:43:
In Reply to: [6]Subway spotting posted by aaron on July 11, 1997 at
08:39:45:
One of my favorite places is Broadway-East New York during morning
rush hour. Lots of trains on the J and L, and some yard moves as well.
That complex is truly immense in size, and is but a wan memory of what
it once was, though.
Smith/9th is always nice. The pedestrian overpass at Corona Yard is
good after morning rush or before evening rush for yard moves.
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NEXT>2853
PREVIOUS>2839
POSTER>David Pirmann
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Are New Subway Cars Needed & my thoughts on the METRO CARD
DATE>Aug 8 11:49:08 1997
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Posted by David Pirmann on July 11, 1997 at 15:02:17:
In Reply to: [6]Are New Subway Cars Needed & my thoughts on the METRO
CARD posted by Philip E. Dominguez on July 11, 1997 at 10:11:21:
Zone fares won't happen too soon-- keep in mind that any zone fare
system requires swiping the card on exit. New York's stations simply
weren't designed to allow for crowds exiting the platforms. Some
stations are dangerous even without the added delay of people swiping
their cards at exit.
As for the new cars, they might be over-gadgeted, but take a look at
the R26 and R29 cars sometime... when you see how rusted the frames
are, you'll wonder how the "cabin" part of the car hasn't slid right
off...
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NEXT>2849
PREVIOUS>2845
POSTER>David Pirmann
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Problems on the Subway
DATE>Aug 8 11:49:09 1997
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Posted by David Pirmann on July 11, 1997 at 15:13:26:
In Reply to: [6]Problems on the Subway posted by Chris on July 11,
1997 at 14:27:58:
Crime is a New York Problem, not a Subway Problem, IMHO. There's no
seperate Transit Police force anymore... which might be a problem.
Complain to the mayor :)
--Dave
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NEXT>2860
PREVIOUS>2848
POSTER>george
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Problems on the Subway
DATE>Aug 8 11:49:10 1997
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Posted by george on July 11, 1997 at 15:20:29:
In Reply to: [5]Problems on the Subway posted by Chris on July 11,
1997 at 14:27:58:
Basically Chris, the way to avoid being mugged is to carry a gun. God
made men, colt made them equal. Better to be judged by twelve men than
carried by six. My personal preference is a S & W model 59. The subway
isn't that dangerous though, and I have been on every station at every
hour of the day or night. The problems are that of a bureacracy, and
can only be solved by contracting out to private sector forces. On the
Staten Island Rapid Transit, for example, although the train has one
destination twelve electronic destination signs costing ten thousand
dollars each were installed at Saint George. The perfect solution to
which no known problem existed. Likewise the adequate signaling system
on SIRT is being "upgraded" for another million and a half. One train
meets one boat. One track out. One track in. Simple? Two million was
spent for fencing along the right of way, preventing emergency crews
from reaching passengers in the event of a wreck, and doing nothing to
protect kids, who go under them. The 42nd street shuttle, which I use
to work at night, shuts down at midnight. The TA has a highly paid
bureacracy for public relations that couldn't find it's behind with
both hands. Light rail has been ignored, and a perfectly good carbarn
on 52nd street ideal for the 42nd street cross town trolley was torn
down this year to sell the site to political patronage real estate
interests. The cleaning crews on the subway are overpaid and
underworked. The wages paid to employees verge on insanity. TA
employees are good people and I am for the working man, but somebody
has to pay for everything. There is no free ride. The boxing of the
emergency pull cords on the IRT, a moronic idea and will cost a life.
I know because I once saved a woman being dragged by pulling such a
cord and I would never have been able to do it in time if the cord had
been boxed. At the risk of being a luddite, I have to say the
Metrocard was not needed and again, the perfect solution to which no
known problem existed. Take a ride to Neward and ride the excellent
trolley line out of the AMTRAK station using fifty year old PCC's to
see what can be done on a budget.
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PREVIOUS>2838
POSTER>David Pirmann
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: New Stuff
DATE>Aug 8 11:49:12 1997
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Posted by David Pirmann on July 11, 1997 at 15:29:06:
In Reply to: [6]Re: New Stuff posted by Gary Jacobi on July 11, 1997
at 12:52:44:
Thanks.. I had meant to look into that. As I was writing the captions
I was just going by the dates stamped or written on the slides.
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NEXT>2856
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>Ken Rubin
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>La Guardia and subway
DATE>Aug 8 11:49:13 1997
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Posted by Ken Rubin on July 11, 1997 at 16:01:17:
I'm trying to recall something I'd heard second-hand about the
involvement of the sainted Fiorello with the subway...Something to the
effect that the mayor was in cahoots with Firestone and other
auto-related businesses. He therefore tried to sour merchants on the
subway, reminding them that the noise and smell of the elevated would
discourage people from coming in to their stores. The merchants bought
it and voted against the subway, whereupon elevated *roads* were built
instead! Can anybody clarify this anecdote? I asked at the NYC Subway
Museum, but the guide didn't seem to knwo what I was talking about.
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NEXT>3041
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>Brian W
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>TTC Websites
DATE>Aug 8 11:49:14 1997
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Posted by Brian W on July 11, 1997 at 16:38:18:
Does anyone know any REALLY GOOD TTC Websites?
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NEXT>2854
PREVIOUS>2847
POSTER>sal
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Are New Subway Cars Needed & my thoughts on the METRO CARD
DATE>Aug 8 11:49:15 1997
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Posted by sal on July 11, 1997 at 16:46:17:
In Reply to: [5]Are New Subway Cars Needed & my thoughts on the METRO
CARD posted by Philip E. Dominguez on July 11, 1997 at 10:11:21:
The problem is federal funding and depreciation. That's why new
equipment is ordered. The TA is not a system run by normal business
arbiters. Decisions are not evaluated against a rational standard.
Common sense would dictate a watt-hour meter be installed to see how
much current is utilized by the various operators. Nobody knows.
Nobody really has a handle on costs. The system is out of control with
no accountability. Try to telephone the TA sometime and get connected
with a human being. The system is part social welfare system, part
jobs program for the handicapped, part model railroad, and part
political red herring overseen by a group ,of politicians useless as a
screen door on a submarine. Disbanding the wonderful Transit Police
organization was plan stupid, but Guliani did it. More carreer
opportunity but less transit safety. Multi-drug resistant Tuberculosis
is going to be the big problem of the late nineties because of the
homeless. Four hundred and ninety people infected at Bath Shipyards
because of one infected person. There is no cure. The ACLU refused to
allow these derelicts to be removed. Plan STUPID. And the ventilation
is inadequate and remains inadequate. At night entire lines are shut
for maintenance. This would never have happened twenty years ago. The
use of the RR to go to Staten Island via 95th street is now unfeasable
because of poor service at odd hours but nobody cares. That's the
amazing thing. This Internet site is therapeutic but its like doing
something you do in the bathroom into the wind. There is no
accountability. Read my lips. Guliani has probably never ridden on a
subway except once when he was evading the draft during the Vietnam
war. The subway seating plan on the new cars is absurd, as well as the
well-intentioned provisions for the handicapped. The wall to wall cabs
prevent moving between cars, which is the only way flee a mugger. The
people who design these cars live in Long Island and commute by
limousine and helicopter. How many people must die falling between
cars before the South Ferry Station is extended? The brain damaged TA
orders new cars for the line you have to walk between while moving
because only the first half opens at south ferry. The life of a
toddler doesn't mean much to Jared Lebow and the rest of the
just-missed, wannabees and never-wases who run the public relations
shop at the TA.
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NEXT>2858
PREVIOUS>2853
POSTER>sal
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Are New Subway Cars Needed & my thoughts on the METRO CARD
DATE>Aug 8 11:49:17 1997
EMAILNOTICES>no
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Posted by sal on July 11, 1997 at 16:46:21:
In Reply to: [5]Are New Subway Cars Needed & my thoughts on the METRO
CARD posted by Philip E. Dominguez on July 11, 1997 at 10:11:21:
The problem is federal funding and depreciation. That's why new
equipment is ordered. The TA is not a system run by normal business
arbiters. Decisions are not evaluated against a rational standard.
Common sense would dictate a watt-hour meter be installed to see how
much current is utilized by the various operators. Nobody knows.
Nobody really has a handle on costs. The system is out of control with
no accountability. Try to telephone the TA sometime and get connected
with a human being. The system is part social welfare system, part
jobs program for the handicapped, part model railroad, and part
political red herring overseen by a group ,of politicians useless as a
screen door on a submarine. Disbanding the wonderful Transit Police
organization was plan stupid, but Guliani did it. More carreer
opportunity but less transit safety. Multi-drug resistant Tuberculosis
is going to be the big problem of the late nineties because of the
homeless. Four hundred and ninety people infected at Bath Shipyards
because of one infected person. There is no cure. The ACLU refused to
allow these derelicts to be removed. Plan STUPID. And the ventilation
is inadequate and remains inadequate. At night entire lines are shut
for maintenance. This would never have happened twenty years ago. The
use of the RR to go to Staten Island via 95th street is now unfeasable
because of poor service at odd hours but nobody cares. That's the
amazing thing. This Internet site is therapeutic but its like doing
something you do in the bathroom into the wind. There is no
accountability. Read my lips. Guliani has probably never ridden on a
subway except once when he was evading the draft during the Vietnam
war. The subway seating plan on the new cars is absurd, as well as the
well-intentioned provisions for the handicapped. The wall to wall cabs
prevent moving between cars, which is the only way flee a mugger. The
people who design these cars live in Long Island and commute by
limousine and helicopter. How many people must die falling between
cars before the South Ferry Station is extended? The brain damaged TA
orders new cars for the line you have to walk between while moving
because only the first half opens at south ferry. The life of a
toddler doesn't mean much to Jared Lebow and the rest of the
just-missed, wannabees and never-wases who run the public relations
shop at the TA.
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NEXT>2859
PREVIOUS>2814
POSTER>larry
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Staten Island connection
DATE>Aug 8 11:49:18 1997
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Posted by larry on July 11, 1997 at 17:12:40:
In Reply to: [5]Re: Staten Island connection posted by tom pinto on
July 10, 1997 at 16:02:17:
The old right of way near near the mall I last visited over twenty
years ago and consisted of two hand hewn stone abutments over a dry
creekbed and about 150 feet of obviously graded single track roadbed
actually quite a way from the.ame mall, mostly towards the edge of the
public parkland just before the creek running into richmondtown. This
would have been a few hundred yards from the end of the old airport
runway. Does anybody remember the airport? The construction must be a
century old, but it sure was is rail roadbed. It may be gone now.
Interestingly some of the old trolley rails were still under the
street in Stapleton as recently as ten years ago. At least a ten foot
section under the pavement near the old R & H brewary site. In the
early 1960's four trolleys were stored in the Saint George Yard of the
SIRT. A PCC (I believe 1000), an old Peter Witt from Brooklyn and a
Queensboro Bridge car. All were operable. Wonder what heppened to
them.Another old PCC was stored in Richmondtown near the old trolley
garage at the landfill, but was horribly vandalized.
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NEXT>2869
PREVIOUS>2851
POSTER>Gary Jacobi
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: La Guardia and subway
DATE>Aug 8 11:49:19 1997
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Posted by Gary Jacobi on July 11, 1997 at 18:51:27:
In Reply to: [5]La Guardia and subway posted by Ken Rubin on July 11,
1997 at 16:01:17:
Never heard Fiorello attached to the infamous "National Lines" fable
before. The truth is, GM, Firestone, et al bought up trolley lines
because their owners were dumping them, and the corporations forsaw
that SOMETHING had to take their place, so why not get in on the
ground floor and make a killing! This is the crime they were judged
guilty; nobody has ever proved they conspired to destroy transit.
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POSTER>Gary Jacobi
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: No signs of life
DATE>Aug 8 11:49:21 1997
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Posted by Gary Jacobi on July 11, 1997 at 19:05:47:
In Reply to: [5]Re: No signs of life posted by David Pirmann on July
10, 1997 at 08:03:05:
I think I was online at the same moment you were cleaning up the site,
because I have had no repeats of the phenomenon. My Mac is so fast
that I sometimes miss seeing the message that it is using cached info
because it couldn't re-establish contact with the site.
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NEXT>2862
PREVIOUS>2854
POSTER>John
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Are New Subway Cars Needed & my thoughts on the METRO CARD
DATE>Aug 8 11:49:22 1997
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Posted by John on July 11, 1997 at 19:33:01:
In Reply to: [5]Re: Are New Subway Cars Needed & my thoughts on the
METRO CARD posted by David Pirmann on July 11, 1997 at 15:02:17:
Aren't the trains inspected, though, just like automobiles? If the
rusting is a safety hazard, why are the trains kept un service? I have
never heard of a case where the carbody has slid off the trucks, but
according to your description, it looks like it's bound to happen.
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NEXT>2879
PREVIOUS>2855
POSTER>John
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Staten Island connection
DATE>Aug 8 11:49:23 1997
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Posted by John on July 11, 1997 at 19:41:10:
In Reply to: [5]Re: Staten Island connection posted by larry on July
11, 1997 at 17:12:40:
Do you think trolley or light rail would be ideal in Staten Island?
Something like that could enhance the bus system, be quicker and more
direct than many bus lines, and serve more areas than the SIRT.
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NEXT>2861
PREVIOUS>2849
POSTER>Steve
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Problems on the Subway
DATE>Aug 8 11:49:24 1997
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Posted by Steve on July 11, 1997 at 21:42:59:
In Reply to: [6]Re: Problems on the Subway posted by David Pirmann on
July 11, 1997 at 15:13:26:
Well said Dave but crime is not just a NY problem. It's a problem of
our national society. However, Chris should realize that the odds of
getting mugged on the subway system are less than half of what they
are in NY proper. AND NY City is safer than more than 100 other major
US Cities including Indianapolis Ind. A mugging on the subways is by
no means a common occurrence. This, of course, is of no consolation to
the victims of street crime.
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NEXT>2884
PREVIOUS>2860
POSTER>Steve
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Problems on the Subway
DATE>Aug 8 11:49:26 1997
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Posted by Steve on July 11, 1997 at 21:51:00:
In Reply to: [6]Re: Problems on the Subway posted by Peter Rosa on
July 11, 1997 at 14:55:29:
Service reliability is the problem? Where do you get your information?
It may come as a surprise to you but service reliability is at an
all-time high.
One nationally recognized measure of performance is MDBF is among the
highest in the nation, 68,238 miles between breakdowns. This is 10
times the MDBF of 15 years ago. On time performance during AM & PM
peak hours is over 94%. Overall, on time performance is 79% but this
includes delays due to track maintenance and construction. So what
aspects of reliability are you speaking of?
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NEXT>2863
PREVIOUS>2858
POSTER>Steve
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Are New Subway Cars Needed & my thoughts on the METRO CARD
DATE>Aug 8 11:49:27 1997
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Posted by Steve on July 11, 1997 at 21:55:07:
In Reply to: [5]Re: Are New Subway Cars Needed & my thoughts on the
METRO CARD posted by John on July 11, 1997 at 19:33:01:
Yes, NYCT cars are inspected every 10,000 miles or 66 days, which ever
comes first. I think that Dave is exaggerating the corrosion problem
slightly but the redbirds do have a serious corrosion problem.
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NEXT>2882
PREVIOUS>2862
POSTER>Steve
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Are New Subway Cars Needed & my thoughts on the METRO CARD
DATE>Aug 8 11:49:28 1997
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Posted by Steve on July 11, 1997 at 22:06:20:
In Reply to: [5]Are New Subway Cars Needed & my thoughts on the METRO
CARD posted by Philip E. Dominguez on July 11, 1997 at 10:11:21:
I think you might be slightly mis-informed.
First of all, the cars are needed, despite what you might think. The
cars which are beib=ng replaced have reached and in some cases exceded
their 35 year life expectancy.
Second, maintenance on the older cars becomes overly burdensome and
costly. The manufacturers of some of the major components charge
exhorbetantly for maintaining obsolete parts, especially when other
properties have upgraded.
Third, the cost of the new cars will not be $1.8 million as you have
stated. they will be about half of that amount. It might interest you
to know that the last major overhaul, the R-46 fleet, cost $490,000
per car and that was 7 years ago. What do you think it would cost to
overhaul the redbirds?
Finally, the R-32s are among the most reliable cars in the fleet but I
assure you that they will not last another 20 years. It would not be
cost effective to keep running them beyond another 7-9 years and
another overhaul would not make sense.
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POSTER>Steve
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Cab arrangement
DATE>Aug 8 11:49:30 1997
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Posted by Steve on July 11, 1997 at 22:13:06:
In Reply to: [5]Cab arrangement posted by Zack on July 11, 1997 at
00:29:49:
Cross car cab must be a laymans term for a transverse cab. Transverse
cabs are usually equal in size (front to back) as the corner cabs but
extend from one side of the car to the other.
There are no more R-30s so I'm not sure what you are referring to.
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NEXT>2866
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>Zack
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Fresh Pond Yard
DATE>Aug 8 11:49:31 1997
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Posted by Zack on July 11, 1997 at 23:15:04:
is Fresh Pond Yard still used and what line(s) was/is it on???
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PREVIOUS>2865
POSTER>Steve
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Fresh Pond Yard
DATE>Aug 8 11:49:32 1997
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Posted by Steve on July 11, 1997 at 23:47:36:
In Reply to: [6]Fresh Pond Yard posted by Zack on July 11, 1997 at
23:15:04:
Fresh pond yard is used for storage & cleaning of trains on the M
line.
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NEXT>2881
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>Zack
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Shuttle Service
DATE>Aug 8 11:49:34 1997
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Posted by Zack on July 12, 1997 at 00:29:43:
Whats so special about the culver shuttle. and why arnt the other
shuttles coverd more like the culver shuttle????
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NEXT>2917
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>Zack
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>modified lo V's
DATE>Aug 8 11:49:35 1997
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Posted by Zack on July 12, 1997 at 00:32:33:
how many of the lo v's were modidfied for the BMT/IND. And witch lines
did they serve on and what happend to them???
(i have been on a posting binge latey) :)
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NEXT>2870
PREVIOUS>2856
POSTER>Zack
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: La Guardia and subway
DATE>Aug 8 11:49:37 1997
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Posted by Zack on July 12, 1997 at 00:38:33:
In Reply to: [6]Re: La Guardia and subway posted by Gary Jacobi on
July 11, 1997 at 18:51:27:
but it did reduse and disuse the service that was already in place and
that haunts still today,
P.S there is a show on pbs calle point of view and ther is a show
titled Road To Ruin i would suggst yoiu watch it if you ever get the
chance to
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NEXT>2891
PREVIOUS>2869
POSTER>Steve
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: La Guardia and subway
DATE>Aug 8 11:49:38 1997
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Posted by Steve on July 12, 1997 at 01:22:11:
In Reply to: [5]La Guardia and subway posted by Ken Rubin on July 11,
1997 at 16:01:17:
I am not sure but I think you have your history coastally confused. If
memory serves me correctly, It was government officials on the west
coast who conspired with auto & tire makers to force the Pacific
Electric and other LA Electric lines into bankruptcy.
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NEXT>2872
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>Mark
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>R44 wreck
DATE>Aug 8 11:49:39 1997
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Posted by Mark on July 12, 1997 at 01:57:30:
The R44 A train wreck was the control unit car of a four car
configuration, which means half a train is lost. Does any one knows if
the TA have any plan to salvage and rebuilt this car or is it a total
lost?
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NEXT>2875
PREVIOUS>2871
POSTER>Zack
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: R44 wreck
DATE>Aug 8 11:49:41 1997
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Posted by Zack on July 12, 1997 at 02:09:14:
In Reply to: [6]R44 wreck posted by Mark on July 12, 1997 at 01:57:30:
probally they will be split up and used as extra cars
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NEXT>2874
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>RAC93
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>- - - - - Tribute to Mr. Pirmann - - - - -
DATE>Aug 8 11:49:42 1997
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Posted by RAC93 on July 12, 1997 at 04:55:13:
I just wanted to say thank you to Mr. Pirmann for having an awesome
Website. I can always find something interesting that I never knew
about the NYC Subways!
I am 21 Years old and I lived in NYC until late 1989 so I recall the
subways pretty well. (I now live in L.A.)
I do not think that Mr. Pirmann gets enough credit for all his hard
work. I don't know of any other website that is even close to this one
for details and awesome historical stuff. Great pictures!
I bet Mr. Pirmann could be rich if this was a pay site...
Thank You again!
RAC93
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NEXT>2878
PREVIOUS>2873
POSTER>Zack
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: - - - - - Tribute to Mr. Pirmann - - - - -
DATE>Aug 8 11:49:44 1997
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Posted by Zack on July 12, 1997 at 05:31:28:
In Reply to: [6]- - - - - Tribute to Mr. Pirmann - - - - - posted by
RAC93 on July 12, 1997 at 04:55:13:
Thank you Mr.Pirmann for haveing such an infromative web site an the
ne york city subway
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NEXT>2925
PREVIOUS>2872
POSTER>Steve
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: R44 wreck
DATE>Aug 8 11:49:45 1997
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Posted by Steve on July 12, 1997 at 08:09:40:
In Reply to: [5]R44 wreck posted by Mark on July 12, 1997 at 01:57:30:
Car #5282 was damaged beyond repair. In order to remove it, it was cut
up and placed into flatcars. I'm sure that the fate of the other 3
cars has not yet been determined.
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NEXT>2900
PREVIOUS>2794
POSTER>Steve
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: NYC Subway in 2020 (read me)
DATE>Aug 8 11:49:46 1997
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Posted by Steve on July 12, 1997 at 08:18:13:
In Reply to: [6]Re: NYC Subway in 2020 (read me) posted by Charles on
July 09, 1997 at 22:06:34:
What deferred maintenance are you referring to?
How does NYCT treat its employees that you find problematic?
Where do you get your information & insight.
I have more than a passing interest in these issues.
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NEXT>2926
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>Andrew Byler
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Westchester Right of Way in Westchester County
DATE>Aug 8 11:49:48 1997
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Posted by Andrew Byler on July 12, 1997 at 12:19:01:
I know that the MTA own all od the old new York, Westchester, and
Boston right of way in the Bronx from 132nd St. to the city line north
of Dyre Ave., and has high hopes of using it someday to connect the to
the 2nd Ave. Subway.
What is the status of its right of way in Westchester County up to
White Plains, however? I've heard that through Mount Vernon, much of
it was filled in, and in Scarsdale, it is now the Heathcote Bypass.
What about New Rochelle and White Plains?
I guess the basic question is could the line be rebuilt easily,
without having to go through too many "takings" of private property?
The reason for asking is that the Regional Plan Association seems bent
on hooking the 2nd Ave. Subway up to several commuter lines, including
the Atlantic Branhc of the LIRR and the Port Washington Branch of the
same. I was wondering how prohibitive it would be to rebuild the
Westchester and connect it to this system, seeing as it splits neatly
the New Haven and Harlem branches of Metro North. It would make good
sense if it could be done reasonably, as the 2nd Ave line is to be New
York's first high speed subway (70 mph track speeds), and thus would
mesh nicely with a similar high speed line in the suburbs. Call it a
Hutchinson River Parkway relief route to build support. If you need
some sort of parallel to comapre this with, in terms of practicality
(lets ignore Bart and Metro like systems), think of PATCO in my
hometown of Philly, which is a similar suburbs to city link.
While we're on the subject, could similar work be done with the now
abandoned Putnam division on the opposite side of the county?
Admittedly, it was not designed very well, unlike the Westchester, but
I suppose the right of way has some potential.
One other note - I know it would be expensive, and money is not
available right now, but whre there is a will there is a way.
Naysaying will not bring about a rail transit version of Robert Moses
to help New York (interesting aside - I don't suppose Moses would have
gotten into so much trouble had he been building subways instead of
highways; with subways, he would never have run into his Tremont
problems, and might still be considered a hero).
Andy
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PREVIOUS>2874
POSTER>P.A.R.
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: - - - - - Tribute to Mr. Pirmann - - - - -
DATE>Aug 8 11:49:49 1997
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Posted by P.A.R. on July 12, 1997 at 12:50:39:
In Reply to: [5]- - - - - Tribute to Mr. Pirmann - - - - - posted by
RAC93 on July 12, 1997 at 04:55:13:
I'll double that!!! THANKS Mr. Pirmann!!!
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PREVIOUS>2859
POSTER>larry
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Staten Island connection
DATE>Aug 8 11:49:50 1997
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Posted by larry on July 12, 1997 at 15:29:26:
In Reply to: [5]Re: Staten Island connection posted by John on July
11, 1997 at 19:41:10:
The deal on light rail is complicated for Staten Island. Many
residents desire isolation. The SIRT right of way would have been the
ideal feeder, but during rehabilitation no thought was given to
passing sidings of interchange. Light rail is cheaper to construct,
which is the big plus, and environmentally sensitive. There is not
necessarily need for double track. A light rail extension to
Richmondtown (single track) via the SIRT using restored cars with a
hotel at the juncture would have made economic sense, but poor zoning
and total incompetence on the part of the Richmondtown historical
society prevented this from becoming another Williamsburg Va. If you
get a chance to go to Philadelphia ride the Norristown line, run with
one man operation very analagous to the SIRT, and slightly lighter
equipment. There is no reason single unit light rail cars could be run
together with the heavy rail units on the SIRT. Another obvious
tourist line would be from the Ferry to Snug harbor, except for the
fact a construction company has dumped a few thousand tons of sand on
the right of way. Instead of screwing around with trolleys in Red Hook
where only tourists with Uzi's and grenades dare venture a trolley
museum at the terminal running to and from Snug Harbor, with a hotel
would be the cats meow. Trolley cars are not an end in themselves.
Milan now has a large number of 1920 era Peter Witt cars coming up for
scrapping and they would made ideal vehicles for a historical line.
They would cost less than the Gomaco replicas. Of course the South
Beach line should be restored, with the road under the expressway
being used as the underpass, with light rail running the entire
length. I remember when the roadbed was visible all the way to Midland
beach. For a City the size of staten Island the number of people are
there, but there is no critical mass. The planners put the cart before
the horse, looking at where people live, then planning transit.
Historically the population shift and housing pattern developed after
the rail line was installed. Air quality is a significant public
benefit, and light rail certainly reduces polution. One problem is the
TA goldplates everything and a line like the San Diego trolley seems
out of the question.
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NEXT>2885
PREVIOUS>2878
POSTER>David Pirmann
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: - - - - - Tribute to Mr. Pirmann - - - - -
DATE>Aug 8 11:49:52 1997
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Posted by David Pirmann on July 12, 1997 at 16:13:37:
In Reply to: [6]- - - - - Tribute to Mr. Pirmann - - - - - posted by
RAC93 on July 12, 1997 at 04:55:13:
What is this Mr. business? :) You make me sound old!
But seriously, thanks!
--Dave
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NEXT>
PREVIOUS>2867
POSTER>David Pirmann
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Shuttle Service
DATE>Aug 8 11:49:53 1997
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Posted by David Pirmann on July 12, 1997 at 16:15:34:
In Reply to: [6]Shuttle Service posted by Zack on July 12, 1997 at
00:29:43:
Well, the Culver Shuttle has it's on page on this site primarily
because it doesn't exist any more! We had enough photos and there's
enough interest in demolished/abandoned stuff that I thought it fit
well as it's own page.
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NEXT>2883
PREVIOUS>2863
POSTER>David Pirmann
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Are New Subway Cars Needed & my thoughts on the METRO CARD
DATE>Aug 8 11:49:54 1997
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Posted by David Pirmann on July 12, 1997 at 16:22:25:
In Reply to: [6]Re: Are New Subway Cars Needed & my thoughts on the
METRO CARD posted by John on July 11, 1997 at 19:33:01:
Well, I guess I was exaggerating a bit, and I'm no expert on car
inspections. But yes they are inspected and I doubt it's likely there
will be any carbodies sliding off trucks, but some of the R26-36 cars
have a serious rust/corrosion problem that make an overhaul pretty
much out of the question...
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NEXT>2905
PREVIOUS>2882
POSTER>Jim Tesoriero
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Are New Subway Cars Needed & my thoughts on the METRO CARD
DATE>Aug 8 11:49:55 1997
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Posted by Jim Tesoriero on July 12, 1997 at 18:06:18:
In Reply to: [6]Are New Subway Cars Needed & my thoughts on the METRO
CARD posted by Philip E. Dominguez on July 11, 1997 at 10:11:21:
New subway cars are needed. The maximum service life is around 40
years. The next to go are the R26 through R33 Redbirds which are now
35+ years old.
It's about time for the Metrocard.
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NEXT>2886
PREVIOUS>2861
POSTER>Gerry O'Regan
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Problems on the Subway
DATE>Aug 8 11:49:57 1997
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Posted by Gerry O'Regan on July 12, 1997 at 18:17:01:
In Reply to: [6]Re: Problems on the Subway posted by Steve on July 11,
1997 at 21:51:00:
I get the feeling that if the train you wanted doesn't arrive at the
station you are at within one minute of the time you get there, the
service is unreliable. This is, of course, an impossible standard to
meet. However, service reliability is also far more complicated than
simple car reliability. Then there are things beyond the control of
the shops, such as the signal system, various emergency repair
projects or those people who delay trains by standing in the door
while three flights up, their friend fumbles in her purse for the
token she knew she had. Things of this nature are beyond the
capability of the TA to control, but have their effect on reliability.
Spot crowds, for example a Yankees game getting out, can also impact
service by increasing station dwell times, not only at 161-River, but
at subsequent stops as people fight their way out of the crowded cars.
Perfect service is impossible, but the important measurement to the
shop is missed trips, while to the customer it is how long he waits.
(Long headways during off peak hours are often perceived as delays or
unreliable service.) Even the door blocker knows that the train in the
station will get him to his destination before than the next one down
the tunnel, and HE hasn't been delayed by holding up the train!
The bottom line, improve service - possible, eliminate delays -
impossible.
Gerry
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NEXT>2892
PREVIOUS>2880
POSTER>subway-buffsubway-buff@msn.com
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: - - - - - Tribute to Mr. Pirmann - - - - -
DATE>Aug 8 11:49:58 1997
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Posted by subway-buffsubway-buff@msn.com on July 12, 1997 at 22:56:00:
In Reply to: [5]- - - - - Tribute to Mr. Pirmann - - - - - posted by
RAC93 on July 12, 1997 at 04:55:13:
I also ewxtend by compliments for a superb site. I run a fledgling
computer business and one day hope to be a thrivig business. A BBS
like This one from Mr. Pirmann gives me excellent ideas (not to
compete, of course) but for my own page if I ever do one when I learn
HTML.
Thnaks, Mr. Pirmann, or David if you prefer.
I grew up riding the subways and all my years and all the tours I have
been on have not taught me as much as this BBS.
Thank you, thank you,. ....
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NEXT>2904
PREVIOUS>2884
POSTER>subway-buff
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Problems on the Subway
DATE>Aug 8 11:49:59 1997
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Posted by subway-buff on July 12, 1997 at 23:00:48:
In Reply to: [6]Problems on the Subway posted by Chris on July 11,
1997 at 14:27:58:
Sure there are suprises (delays, breakdowns, door holding, etc.) but
how long do you keep your carr before trasding or repairing. Many of
the lines are 50 years or even up to almost 100 years old!
This is New York. The inconvenince now will lead to a better system
(even if no new lines) when the rebuild is completed.
Long live the subways.
ps- have you ever been in Manhattan during a subway strike !
Gridlock during presidetial visits is nothing compared to no subways!
If you ignore the subway it *will* go away and NYC will be worse it.
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NEXT>2888
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>Wei
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Health problems on the Subway
DATE>Aug 8 11:50:02 1997
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Posted by Wei on July 13, 1997 at 09:39:39:
From the various studies done by scientists, the NYC subway system,
while not the most crowded, has the poorest health measures of all the
subway systems in the world. As a subway rider personally, I really
don't think the air quality is that good, and I see a lot trash on the
platform all the time. What are some measures that can be done about
this?
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NEXT>2889
PREVIOUS>2887
POSTER>Steve
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Health problems on the Subway
DATE>Aug 8 11:50:04 1997
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Posted by Steve on July 13, 1997 at 11:17:25:
In Reply to: [5]Health problems on the Subway posted by Wei on July
13, 1997 at 09:39:39:
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NEXT>
PREVIOUS>2888
POSTER>Steve
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Health problems on the Subway
DATE>Aug 8 11:50:08 1997
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Posted by Steve on July 13, 1997 at 11:24:53:
In Reply to: [5]Health problems on the Subway posted by Wei on July
13, 1997 at 09:39:39:
Well, there's the new Vacuum Train to keep the roadbed clean.
But until you get people not to urinate or defecate on the trains and
stations, until you get people to dispose of their refuse properly,
until you get people to respect their environment, then you'll have
the conditions that you have. It's a societal problem - just like the
homeless problem. These are not unique to the subways. It's just that
you are in a closed environment on the subway and have to look at it.
You can't turn your head.
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NEXT>2936
PREVIOUS>2843
POSTER>Steve
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: MTA Capital Plan Approved
DATE>Aug 8 11:50:10 1997
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Posted by Steve on July 13, 1997 at 11:31:56:
In Reply to: [5]Re: MTA Capital Plan Approved posted by Gerry O'Regan
on July 11, 1997 at 13:23:42:
You are right about politics but not quite correct about who was
playing the game. Since over 80% of your ride came from the farebox
last year, the government(s) cut their operating subsidies. The MTA
had actually been using operating funds to keep capital proograms
moving while waiting for capital funding. (The money does actually
come seperately). The capital money, as you correctly state, is for
capital projects and can not be used otherwise but this will free up
operating monies which may be put to good use.
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NEXT>
PREVIOUS>2870
POSTER>Gary Jacobi
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: La Guardia and subway
DATE>Aug 8 11:50:12 1997
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Posted by Gary Jacobi on July 13, 1997 at 12:19:58:
In Reply to: [5]Re: La Guardia and subway posted by Zack on July 12,
1997 at 00:38:33:
Yes, I agree, but the tendency to overstate the story has always
disturbed me. I have heard and read on several occasions that these
corporations were convicted of a crime which is suggested to be the
destruction of a healthy Trolley system nationwide. They were in fact
convicted of profiting in restraint of trade. Did they do us a great
disservice? Absolutely, but many, many decisions made by businesses in
search of profit turn out to be harmful. Mr. Gates comes to mind.
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NEXT>2916
PREVIOUS>2885
POSTER>Gary Jacobi
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: - - - - - Tribute to Mr. Pirmann - - - - -
DATE>Aug 8 11:50:14 1997
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Posted by Gary Jacobi on July 13, 1997 at 12:23:17:
In Reply to: [5]- - - - - Tribute to Mr. Pirmann - - - - - posted by
RAC93 on July 12, 1997 at 04:55:13:
I think Dave is already rich for having come up with the idea of this
site, and managing it in such a professional and ethical manner.
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NEXT>2894
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>Timothy
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Crime on subway/el systems
DATE>Aug 8 11:50:16 1997
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Posted by Timothy on July 13, 1997 at 15:20:26:
About 10 years ago, after taking pictures from a West Philadelphia El
station platform, I got mugged while waiting for the train. The funny
thing about it is that my attackers didn't take my camera, all they
got
was my wallet with only $10.00. Luckily, I didn't get hurt. Even
though
this incident occured during early evening, as it was getting dark,
I've
been very cautious when it comes to taking pictures on the subway or
El
since the attack. I've also started carrying MACE whenever I go into
the
city. Of the 4 cities with Els (New York, Chicago, Philadelphia, and
Boston), can anyone tell me where and when it is safe to take pictures
of,
and from elevated structures and stations, without taking the risk of
getting mugged or held up? Also, can anyone tell me what areas to
avoid
completely in the cities mentioned? As I've noticed that most
elevateds
run through bad neighborhoods.
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NEXT>2897
PREVIOUS>2893
POSTER>David Pirmann
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Crime on subway/el systems
DATE>Aug 8 11:50:17 1997
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Posted by David Pirmann on July 13, 1997 at 16:21:18:
In Reply to: [6]Crime on subway/el systems posted by Timothy on July
13, 1997 at 15:20:26:
Maybe you just got unlucky. Plus, crime as a whole was a lot higher 10
years ago, especially in New York, than it is now.
I haven't felt or been threatened in the past few years taking
pictures or riding the subway anywhere. There are places I wouldn't
leave the system or flash my camera around, though.
Some guidelines, though: the obvious one, don't look too flashy,
scared, or unsure of where you are. Ride and photograph during rush
hour and NOT in the mid afternoon when schools get out. Crowds of kids
are worse than crowds of adults at any time of the day. Travel with a
friend- two sets of eyes are better than one especially if you're
preoccupied with taking pictures.
--Dave
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NEXT>2896
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>John
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Flushing on Pelham?
DATE>Aug 8 11:50:19 1997
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Posted by John on July 13, 1997 at 16:25:37:
Yesterday, I was waiting for a downtown #6 train at 23rd st. After
waiting a few minutes, a #6 train using redbirds came into the
station, and as the train passed me by (I was standing toward the end
of the platform), I saw that the first two cars were Flushing R-36s.
Why were those cars on the #6 train? I thought they weren't able to be
used on mainline IRT lines because of the location of the trip cocks.
Was I in danger while on that train? Come to think of it, how did the
R-62s run on the Flushing Line in the 1980s? Was I in danger back
then, too?
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NEXT>2913
PREVIOUS>2895
POSTER>Steve
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Flushing on Pelham?
DATE>Aug 8 11:50:21 1997
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Posted by Steve on July 13, 1997 at 20:54:31:
In Reply to: [5]Flushing on Pelham? posted by John on July 13, 1997 at
16:25:37:
You definitely were not in danger. It's a simple matter to either move
the trip cock to the other side of the truck or simply switch the
truck.
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NEXT>2906
PREVIOUS>2894
POSTER>Steve
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Crime on subway/el systems
DATE>Aug 8 11:50:22 1997
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Posted by Steve on July 13, 1997 at 21:02:07:
In Reply to: [6]Crime on subway/el systems posted by Timothy on July
13, 1997 at 15:20:26:
First of all, use pepper spray. It's far more effective than mace,
especially if it's rated at 2,000,000 SHU. Of course with either
pepper spray or mace, make sure your attacker is down wind from you or
else you'll be helping him (or her) instead of yourself. Second,
except for the area in the South Bronx, none of the El lines on the
NYCT run through especially bad neighbor- hoods. Neighborhoods are not
inately bad. It's their bad citizens who make it bad and they are
quite mobile. They can and do turn up in good neighborhoods because as
Willy Sutton once said, "That's where the money is.".
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NEXT>2923
PREVIOUS>2842
POSTER>Joe M
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: PCC Streetcars for Kenosha Wisconsin
DATE>Aug 8 11:50:24 1997
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Posted by Joe M on July 14, 1997 at 00:09:03:
In Reply to: [5]Re: PCC Streetcars for Kenosha Wisconsin posted by Dan
Lawrence on July 11, 1997 at 13:15:22:
Thanks for the info. We think the B-2 trucks can be regauged. The
easist way is to retruck them with standard trucks. There are some
standard gauge trucks out there yet.
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NEXT>2903
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>subway-buff
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>New Derailment
DATE>Aug 8 11:50:25 1997
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Posted by subway-buff on July 14, 1997 at 04:18:22:
In the wee hours of Monday 7/14/1997, 3 cars of a southbound #2
derailed neared President Street in Brooklyn. As of 4:15am no IRT
train is running South of Atlantic Ave. Bus service is being provided.
Opinion: this probably is the Rutgers Street turnoff since the #4 is
also out due to the derailment.
There are 3 injuries among 150 passengers.
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NEXT>2921
PREVIOUS>2876
POSTER>Keranu
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: NYC Subway in 2020 (read me)
DATE>Aug 8 11:50:27 1997
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Posted by Keranu on July 14, 1997 at 04:26:37:
In Reply to: [6]Re: NYC Subway in 2020 (read me) posted by Charles on
July 09, 1997 at 22:06:34:
OK, fine, I was just fooling around anyway, don't take it too
seriously. The subway in NYC is by far the best in the world (I think)
and I HOPE it never dies. This seems unrealistic. What's the
Washington Metro like?
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NEXT>2909
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>Thicko Low-tech Keranu
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Archives???
DATE>Aug 8 11:50:28 1997
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Posted by Thicko Low-tech Keranu on July 14, 1997 at 04:32:52:
Sorry 'bout this, I'm very thick when it comes to high-tech stuff. How
do you get the archives, I clicked on that newsgroup thing but all the
dates seem to be the same and I can't find stuff that I typed way back
in May, has it been erased? I could cope with the old system of web
addresses containing info, are they still there (even though links are
removed). I think I need to read more books about the net and get with
it.
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NEXT>
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>Keranu
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: - - - - - Tribute to David Pirmann - - - - -
DATE>Aug 8 11:50:30 1997
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Posted by Keranu on July 14, 1997 at 04:37:19:
In Reply to: [6]- - - - - Tribute to Mr. Pirmann - - - - - posted by
RAC93 on July 12, 1997 at 04:55:13:
There, you don't sound so old now! I have to say this is the most
visited place I come to, every time I come on the internet I type up
that address (cos my bookmarks get curiously erased) and see what cool
stuff has been typed since I last saw it. Hats off to you, great
website, cool idea and very informative for those (like me) yearning
to ride the subway again. A tribute was definitely in order - how come
we waited so long??
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NEXT>2907
PREVIOUS>2899
POSTER>Keranu
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: New Derailment
DATE>Aug 8 11:50:31 1997
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Posted by Keranu on July 14, 1997 at 04:39:10:
In Reply to: [6]New Derailment posted by subway-buff on July 14, 1997
at 04:18:22:
Can you imagine BEING in a derailment, how scary would that be?!
Yikes!
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NEXT>2927
PREVIOUS>2886
POSTER>Keranu
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Problems on the Subway
DATE>Aug 8 11:50:33 1997
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Posted by Keranu on July 14, 1997 at 04:45:16:
In Reply to: [6]Re: Problems on the Subway posted by Steve on July 11,
1997 at 21:42:59:
I agree, I used the subway everywhere when I visited NYC and loved it,
my paranoid fears were very unjustified, there was an article in the
newspaper that some New Yorkers are annoyed that NYC is so much safer
than it used to be because they have nothing to brag about. NYC isn't
the crime-scene anymore. Is this sadism a reality? Actually, here in
Glasgow, we brag about being the most crime-ridden city in the UK
(that's not official).
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NEXT>2910
PREVIOUS>2883
POSTER>Keranu
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Are New Subway Cars Needed & my thoughts on the METRO CARD
DATE>Aug 8 11:50:34 1997
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Posted by Keranu on July 14, 1997 at 05:01:52:
In Reply to: [6]Re: Are New Subway Cars Needed & my thoughts on the
METRO CARD posted by Jerry on July 11, 1997 at 11:16:11:
I would just like to say -off the subject- that tube fares in London
are extortionate, an adult single between two stations in the SAME
ZONE (this is about 3 or 4 stations due to the concentric ring zones)
is 90 pence!!!! This is over the flat $1.50 you pay in NYC. If you
travel from somewhere like Loughton to somewhere like Wimbledon
(crossing ten zones boundaries) it can be as much as 4 pounds (over
$6). BUT, I think that NYC should have a one-day travel pass thing
like London where you buy one ticket (or card) and you can travel on
any train anywhere (this includes surface systems like the ex-Network
SouthEast in London) in the city for about $5 perhaps (about 4 pounds
in London). This caused a boom in which passenger numbers literally
doubled in the 80s when it was introduced. Imagine the extra revenue
this could produce in NYCs case!
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NEXT>2908
PREVIOUS>2897
POSTER>Keranu
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Crime on subway/el systems
DATE>Aug 8 11:50:36 1997
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Posted by Keranu on July 14, 1997 at 05:06:47:
In Reply to: [6]Crime on subway/el systems posted by Timothy on July
13, 1997 at 15:20:26:
A friend of mine said that he watched a guy at 110 St on the #1,9 line
taking photos right at the edge of the platform and he had to hold
himself back from pushing the guy onto the tracks. He isn't
particularly evil so I suggest you definitely keep away from the edge
of the platform. I'm personally too paranoid to even make eye-contact
with people on the subway and would definitely never dream of taking
photos. You are very bold, I know there are many others out there.
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NEXT>2911
PREVIOUS>2903
POSTER>John
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: New Derailment
DATE>Aug 8 11:50:38 1997
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Posted by John on July 14, 1997 at 05:48:04:
In Reply to: [5]Re: New Derailment posted by Keranu on July 14, 1997
at 04:39:10:
From what I just heard on Eyewitness News, the last (10th) car of the
train jumped the track and slammed into a column and then a wall.
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NEXT>2915
PREVIOUS>2906
POSTER>John
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Crime on subway/el systems
DATE>Aug 8 11:50:39 1997
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Posted by John on July 14, 1997 at 06:05:30:
In Reply to: [5]Re: Crime on subway/el systems posted by David Pirmann
on July 13, 1997 at 16:21:18:
There are kids, and there are kids. Most of them are harmless, but
there are a few that are just rotton. Especially some of the high
school students. They invade the train like a bunch of wild animals,
they are loud, rude, inconsiderate, have the filthiest mouths I ever
heard, they hog the seats, blare rap music from enormous boom-boxes,
swing from the bars and/or straps, and generally, have worse conduct
than the animals in the Bronx Zoo.
However . . .
If you happen to be a high-school student who uses mass transit, I am
describing only a handful of these people. Be advised that I do not
stereotype all high school students like this. I have also seen many
(and much more, by the way) smart, intellegent, and well-behaved high
school students on the train also, and the majority of students are
very intellegent, but just act silly (just like I did when I was in
high school). So if you are a high school student, I apologize if I
insulted anybody, but I am just describing what I sometimes see.
Remember . . . I was in high school too, and I have to admit, there
are some things I did during those 4 years that I'm not to fond of,
either.
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NEXT>3024
PREVIOUS>2901
POSTER>David Pirmann
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Archives???
DATE>Aug 8 11:50:41 1997
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Posted by David Pirmann on July 14, 1997 at 07:59:39:
In Reply to: [6]Archives??? posted by Thicko Low-tech Keranu on July
14, 1997 at 04:32:52:
Unfortunately, all the dates are the same-- the date when I posted it
to the archive. Set your news browser to show all old articles, and
possibly to show more than 100 at a time, and you should be able to
find your old posts.
The news interface might be confusing but it has the advantage of
maintaining the threads with a minimum of effort on my part..
--Dave
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NEXT>2929
PREVIOUS>2905
POSTER>David Pirmann
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Are New Subway Cars Needed & my thoughts on the METRO CARD
DATE>Aug 8 11:50:43 1997
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Posted by David Pirmann on July 14, 1997 at 08:11:28:
In Reply to: [6]Re: Are New Subway Cars Needed & my thoughts on the
METRO CARD posted by Keranu on July 14, 1997 at 05:01:52:
Actually 90 pence is $1.52 as of today's exchange rate. As you know,
London has the benefit of multi-zone day and week passes that can be
quite a bargain especially for a tourist from another country. Maybe
you didn't realize that if you buy the card before you go to London at
one of the Brit Rail tourist offices, it's much cheaper than to buy
your farecard when you get there. $40 can get you a full six-zone
7-day pass (which is good on the Underground, busses, Docklands LR,
and ex-British Rail lines within the six zones of Greater London). For
a single tourist, you really can't beat that. If you're travelling as
a group cabbing it might be more affordable.
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NEXT>2914
PREVIOUS>2907
POSTER>Julio Perez
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: New Derailment
DATE>Aug 8 11:50:44 1997
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Posted by Julio Perez on July 14, 1997 at 08:17:56:
In Reply to: [6]New Derailment posted by subway-buff on July 14, 1997
at 04:18:22:
As of 8:15 am 07/14/97, there were no pics available on the derailment
on the Web, although there was a blurb about it on WABC Channel 7's
Web site, [7]http://www.abcnews.com/local/wabc/news/index.html.
Nothing was available on the New York Times nor WNBC's sites, either.
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NEXT>2978
PREVIOUS>2846
POSTER>aaron
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Subway spotting
DATE>Aug 8 11:50:47 1997
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Posted by aaron on July 14, 1997 at 08:42:36:
In Reply to: [6]Re: Subway spotting posted by Gary Jacobi on July 11,
1997 at 12:38:37:
Take the Blue Line from O'hare to Washington. Walk through underground
passageway to Red Line (free transfer). Take Red Line to northern
terminus
(Howard Street). Allow about one hour. If you are at Howard Street
station in rush hour, you can take a Purple Line Express back to
Clark/Lake
and change to the Blue Line back to O'hare at that station.
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NEXT>2958
PREVIOUS>2896
POSTER>aaron
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Flushing on Pelham?
DATE>Aug 8 11:50:49 1997
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Posted by aaron on July 14, 1997 at 08:51:12:
In Reply to: [6]Re: Flushing on Pelham? posted by Steve on July 13,
1997 at 20:54:31:
Help!!! What is a trip cock?
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NEXT>2922
PREVIOUS>2911
POSTER>Peter Rosa
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: New Derailment
DATE>Aug 8 11:50:50 1997
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Posted by Peter Rosa on July 14, 1997 at 08:54:15:
In Reply to: [6]Re: New Derailment posted by John on July 14, 1997 at
05:48:04:
That sounds a lot like the A train derailment a couple of weeks ago.
It will be interesting to see if the causes turn out to be the same.
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NEXT>2928
PREVIOUS>2908
POSTER>Peter Rosa
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Crime on subway/el systems
DATE>Aug 8 11:50:52 1997
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Posted by Peter Rosa on July 14, 1997 at 09:01:33:
In Reply to: [6]Crime on subway/el systems posted by Timothy on July
13, 1997 at 15:20:26:
Some elevated sections of the New York subway that are reasonably safe
for photography would be the 7 train in Queens, the N in Astoria, and
the 1 train in the Bronx. In any event, crime on the NY subway
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NEXT>2918
PREVIOUS>2892
POSTER>Lou
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: - - - - - Tribute to Mr. Pirmann - - - - -
DATE>Aug 8 11:50:53 1997
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Posted by Lou on July 14, 1997 at 10:27:44:
In Reply to: [5]- - - - - Tribute to Mr. Pirmann - - - - - posted by
RAC93 on July 12, 1997 at 04:55:13:
that goes double (or isit Triplex??) for me too!!!
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NEXT>2919
PREVIOUS>2868
POSTER>Lou
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: modified lo V's
DATE>Aug 8 11:50:54 1997
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Posted by Lou on July 14, 1997 at 10:30:25:
In Reply to: [5]modified lo V's posted by Zack on July 12, 1997 at
00:32:33:
I think maybe there was one small train-set. They served exclusively
on the Culver Shuttle (i.e. 9th St Brooklyn to Ditmas).
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NEXT>2920
PREVIOUS>2916
POSTER>Mark Greenwald
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: - - - - - Tribute to Mr. Pirmann - - - - -
DATE>Aug 8 11:50:56 1997
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Posted by Mark Greenwald on July 14, 1997 at 11:11:05:
In Reply to: [6]- - - - - Tribute to Mr. Pirmann - - - - - posted by
RAC93 on July 12, 1997 at 04:55:13:
Dave does have a great site--No arguement there, BUT, I think the
"thanks" shouls also be extended to the contributors (like Mr. Adler).
I must admit, on my bookmarks, this site is the first one listed. I
also want to extend my thanks to David for being so "approachable".
He's very easy to contact and also very accomidating with ideas. IT IS
BY FAR THE BEST OVERALL SITE COMMITTED TO SUBWAYS THAT'S OUT
THERE!!!!! DON'T CHANGE A THING!!!
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NEXT>
PREVIOUS>2917
POSTER>David Pirmann
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: modified lo V's
DATE>Aug 8 11:50:58 1997
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Posted by David Pirmann on July 14, 1997 at 11:12:54:
In Reply to: [6]Re: modified lo V's posted by Lou on July 14, 1997 at
10:30:25:
I've only seen pictures of four cars. But they also ran on the
Franklin.
[7][LINK].
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NEXT>2930
PREVIOUS>2918
POSTER>David Pirmann
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: - - - - - Tribute to Mr. Pirmann - - - - -
DATE>Aug 8 11:50:59 1997
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Posted by David Pirmann on July 14, 1997 at 11:17:38:
In Reply to: [6]Re: - - - - - Tribute to Mr. Pirmann - - - - - posted
by Mark Greenwald on July 14, 1997 at 11:11:05:
Mark is right, the contributors deserve recognition too. If you
haven't already read it, a list of them is at [7]Credits.
Don't change a thing? Well I like to hope improvements are welcome :)
And, as Mark said, ideas are welcome! If you don't want to post in
public about them, use the [8]Feedback Form.
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NEXT>3045
PREVIOUS>2900
POSTER>charles
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: NYC Subway in 2020 (read me)
DATE>Aug 8 11:51:01 1997
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Posted by charles on July 14, 1997 at 11:19:02:
In Reply to: [5]Re: NYC Subway in 2020 (read me) posted by Keranu on
July 14, 1997 at 04:26:37:
I was out there about 8 years ago. It seemed to me to be a
"futuristic" System. The stations were air Conditioned. THe trains
were quiet, the stations were clean. The seats were cushoned with no
standing passengers. The ride was similar to path. I found their fare
collection inferior to NY's. This is due to a lack of personal in
stations. The zoned fare system forces you to pay your fare when
leaving the system.
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NEXT>2924
PREVIOUS>2914
POSTER>David Pirmann
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: New Derailment
DATE>Aug 8 11:51:02 1997
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Posted by David Pirmann on July 14, 1997 at 11:57:09:
In Reply to: [6]New Derailment posted by subway-buff on July 14, 1997
at 04:18:22:
Does this mean they get to cut up another R62? The one from Union
Square is still sitting in Concourse Yard... in two halves. Anyone
know where the wreckage from the A train wreck went? Could go get a
picture :-)
--Dave
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NEXT>2957
PREVIOUS>2898
POSTER>Dan Lawrence
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: PCC Streetcars for Kenosha Wisconsin
DATE>Aug 8 11:51:04 1997
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Posted by Dan Lawrence on July 14, 1997 at 12:27:18:
In Reply to: [5]Re: PCC Streetcars for Kenosha Wisconsin posted by Joe
M on July 14, 1997 at 00:09:03:
That's one way to do it. The National Capital Trolley Museum converted
a Toronto PCC to standard guage by swapping the trucks with a pair
from a Shaker Heights car, after changing the brake acuators to the
ones removed from the Toronto trucks so that the car would react the
same. (Both sets of
trucks have the same motors.) In Dallas, the 2 cars that the McKinney
Avenue Transit Authority acquired will have their trucks reguaged by
the DART Light Rail shops.
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NEXT>2956
PREVIOUS>2922
POSTER>Wayne Johnson
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: New Derailment
DATE>Aug 8 11:51:06 1997
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Posted by Wayne Johnson on July 14, 1997 at 12:38:39:
In Reply to: [5]Re: New Derailment posted by David Pirmann on July 14,
1997 at 11:57:09:
It wouldn't be an R-62 this time. The #2 uses R-33's (Redbirds)
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NEXT>2959
PREVIOUS>2875
POSTER>Wayne Johnson
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: R44 wreck
DATE>Aug 8 11:51:07 1997
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Posted by Wayne Johnson on July 14, 1997 at 13:11:24:
In Reply to: [5]Re: R44 wreck posted by Steve on July 12, 1997 at
08:09:40:
Does this means that the other cars (I guess they are 5281, 5283 &
5284) may have to just sit unused. I guess it would be good if there
was another A-unit available now
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NEXT>
PREVIOUS>2877
POSTER>Peter Rosa
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Westchester Right of Way in Westchester County
DATE>Aug 8 11:51:09 1997
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Posted by Peter Rosa on July 14, 1997 at 13:19:01:
In Reply to: [6]Westchester Right of Way in Westchester County posted
by Andrew Byler on July 12, 1997 at 12:19:01:
Some months ago I checked out the old Westchester right-of-way in
Scarsdale and White Plains. As far as I could tell, the section to the
north of Heathcoat Bypass is a sort of linear park. I didn't have time
to check out the top part of the ROW in White Plains, however, which I
believe ends at the Westchester shopping mall.
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NEXT>2960
PREVIOUS>2904
POSTER>Wayne Johnson
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Problems on the Subway
DATE>Aug 8 11:51:11 1997
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Posted by Wayne Johnson on July 14, 1997 at 13:23:57:
In Reply to: [5]Problems on the Subway posted by Chris on July 11,
1997 at 14:27:58:
Yes, there are many problems with the subway. I really try to keep an
optimistic view when it comes to the subway (And life in general). I
feel that the subway system (as well as the buses) have come a long
way in recent years. Sometimes it seems like yesterday when the fleet
was covered in graffiti, trains broke down more often, numerous track
fires derailments etc. My point is that there are still problems, but
I'm quite thankful for the improvements. We get a lot for a buck and
fifty cents.
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NEXT>3018
PREVIOUS>2915
POSTER>Mark S Feinman
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Crime on subway/el systems
DATE>Aug 8 11:51:12 1997
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Posted by Mark S Feinman on July 14, 1997 at 13:49:31:
In Reply to: [6]Crime on subway/el systems posted by Timothy on July
13, 1997 at 15:20:26:
I've also been taking photos (and videos) of the NYC Subway for
several years now. Fortunately, I never had a problem. Some areas I've
gone to are E 180 St (2/5), East Tremont Ave (2/5), Brighton Beach,
Ocean Pkwy, W 8 St, Stillwell Ave (B,D,N,Q), Broadway Junction/East NY
(J,M,Z) and various other places. Just don't be flashy when you're
taking your photos and keep an eye over your shoulder and you'll be
OK. Sometimes you may get a silly look from NYC Transit employees but
when you tell them what you're doing they usually warm up to you. And
don't do anything stupid like go where you aren't supposed to go.
That's just looking for trouble.
I'm not an expert on Chicago but as a NY'er having recently returned
from there, just about anywhere on the Loop during the day is fine.
There are multi-level garages that have what I call "railfan floors"
where you can get perfect views of trains circling the Loop without
having to board the trains. There's one conveniently located right at
Tower 18! (The only one that comes close on the NY system is a
multi-level garage just outside Queensboro Plaza). I'm sure these
garages were NOT built with railfans in mind but since there are so
many of them, I'm gonna guess the architect was a railfan! Other
places in Chicago I'd highly recommend for photos - Howard Street and
yard from the bridge connecting the Evanston and Dan-Ryan bound
platforms, Loyola (strategically placed garage!), and Belmont from the
overhead pedestrian bridge.
I even took some video at night on the Loop and wasn't bothered by
anyone.
--Mark
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NEXT>2993
PREVIOUS>2910
POSTER>Philip E.D.
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Are New Subway Cars Needed & my thoughts on the METRO CARD
DATE>Aug 8 11:51:13 1997
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Posted by Philip E.D. on July 14, 1997 at 13:53:22:
In Reply to: [5]Re: Are New Subway Cars Needed & my thoughts on the
METRO CARD posted by Steve on July 11, 1997 at 22:06:20:
Dear Steve,
I think you might be slightly mis-informed about these new cars.
These new cars will be costing 1.8 million $ each. Also some of the
red-birds have to be replaced but not with the models the MTA is
buying.
The MTA has to go back to the drawing board with these models.
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NEXT>2983
PREVIOUS>2920
POSTER>Mark S Feinman
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: - - - - - Tribute to Mr. Pirmann - - - - -
DATE>Aug 8 11:51:15 1997
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Posted by Mark S Feinman on July 14, 1997 at 13:53:44:
In Reply to: [6]- - - - - Tribute to Mr. Pirmann - - - - - posted by
RAC93 on July 12, 1997 at 04:55:13:
Agreed. Both Dave and the NYC Subway Resources web site are
world-class.
--Mark
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NEXT>
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>William A. Padron
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Pittsburgh PATransit's Home Page
DATE>Aug 8 11:51:17 1997
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Posted by William A. Padron on July 14, 1997 at 14:28:31:
The Port Authority of Allegheny County, the agency that operates the
mass transit system in the Pittsburgh metropolitan area, now has a web
site on the Internet.
The address is:
http://trfn.clpgh.org/orgs/patransit/
Sincerely,
William A. Padron
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NEXT>2934
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>William A. Padron
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Pittsburgh PATransit's PCC car fleet - current status
DATE>Aug 8 11:51:18 1997
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Posted by William A. Padron on July 14, 1997 at 14:46:03:
According to an article in the Pennsylvania Trolley Museum's "Trolley
Fare" magazine published in the January-February 1997 issue (and later
confirmed in a recent e-mail inquiry response to me), the current
Pittsburgh PCC fleet that are now only assigned to the 47D Drake
shuttle line is at three units (#4007 to #4009) with a fourth one
(#4004) being repaired for return to revenue service shortly. The
PATransit Web Home Page, however, current state that they have six
PCC's in their fleet. In any event, the 47D Drake line really only
needs a maximum requirement of two cars in service. All of the
remaining PCC units, including several unrebuilt 1700-series cars, are
in dead storage (or as what the E-mail response from PTM stated as
being in "various states of disuse"). I guess that the days are indeed
numbered for the PCC's in Pittsburgh!
Sincerely,
William A. Padron
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NEXT>2935
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>Charles Fiori
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Buses
DATE>Aug 8 11:51:19 1997
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Posted by Charles Fiori on July 14, 1997 at 15:08:29:
This is just an attempt to maintain some surface-transit related
dialogue on this site. Likes, dislikes, stories, memorabilia,
questions, answers. I'd love to keep it to NYC and environs (from a
selfish point of view) but welcome the promotion of anything buses.
Good web sites, photos on the web, let's hear about it!!! (memo to
David Pirrman--Hope you don't mind. If so, reply here. Regards and
thanks for your efforts.)
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NEXT>2982
PREVIOUS>2932
POSTER>William A. Padron
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Pittsburgh PATransit's PCC car fleet - current status
DATE>Aug 8 11:51:20 1997
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Posted by William A. Padron on July 14, 1997 at 15:13:32:
In Reply to: [6]Pittsburgh PATransit's PCC car fleet - current status
posted by William A. Padron on July 14, 1997 at 14:46:03:
It should be noted that, according to the recent e-mail inquiry
response by the Pennsylvania Trolley Museum towards myself, PATransit
might even list some of these Pittsburgh PCC's in dead storage as
being "active" but only on paper. The reason for that premise is
because many of them had yet to fulfill their 10-year rehabilitation
expectancy service line, and must be considered as being "alive" by
government rules. In the end, some cars (such as #4010 to #4012) have
been officially retired, and there is a very
strong possibility that they will soon go to the scrap line along with
the long-derelict 1700-series units (but definitely not the four PCC's
current in use on the 47D Drake line).
Sincerely,
William A. Padron
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NEXT>2942
PREVIOUS>2933
POSTER>John M.
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Buses
DATE>Aug 8 11:51:22 1997
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Posted by John M. on July 14, 1997 at 16:32:28:
In Reply to: [5]Buses posted by Charles Fiori on July 14, 1997 at
15:08:29:
Here are my like and dislikes about buses.
Dislike: I bike frequently, and when I approach a bus (particuarly the
ones with the exhaust pipe on the bottom) I literally have to pull
over and gasp for air. I was glad when I saw the exhaust at the top of
the new buses last year.
Is it feasible to switch the fleet to Natural gas. I spoke to someone
at the TA; they said that because of the volatility of natural gas,
the depots would have to be completely overhauled and it wuld be very
expensive.
Like: I like riding the bus at night when you're one of only three
people on the bus, the traffic is light, and there are hardly any
people waiting along the line.
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NEXT>
PREVIOUS>2890
POSTER>sandy
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: MTA Capital Plan Approved
DATE>Aug 8 11:51:23 1997
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Posted by sandy on July 14, 1997 at 16:35:06:
In Reply to: [5]MTA Capital Plan Approved posted by David Pirmann on
July 11, 1997 at 08:16:31:
The waste of money by the TA on the SIRT boggles the mind. At Old Town
a landscaped area of flowers, trees and wonderful honeysuckles that
would have cost a hundred thousand dollars was chainsawed down. The
moron who designed the new stations on the SIRT must have been a drug
addict in rehab. At Old Town a previously wheelchair accessable
platform with shelter was converted to one with stairs exposed to the
elements. Progress! On the elevated sections (between Old Town and
Dongan Hills) there are no internal safety rails preventing the cars
from tumbling off the embankment in the event of a derailment. I agree
with another poster that obtaining new cars for the number 1 line in
Manhatten requiring passengers to move between moving cars is a
criminal action. The South Ferry platform is too short.
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NEXT>2940
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>John M.
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>How come more chicks don't post messages?
DATE>Aug 8 11:51:25 1997
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Posted by John M. on July 14, 1997 at 16:47:33:
I've been visiting this site for about one month now, and I think the
information and dialogue are first-rate. I've always wondered why 99%
of the participants on this bulletin board seem to be endowed with a Y
chromosone. I took a recent tour with the New York Transit Museum, and
I think there were about two women in a group of more than 30 people.
Is this because the MTA and the world of transit planning is male
dominated and sexist?
By the way, my tour with the Transit Museum included a ride along the
Franklin Avenue Shuttle in Brooklyn. When you get out at Franklin
Avenue, there is this wooden boardwalk that is supported by the
remains of an el tht ran along Fulton Street. Our guide said this is
the oldest part of the entire NYC transit system that is still "in
use." It is scheduled to be torn down as the entire Franklin Avenue
shuttle is being renovated next year (including the now closed Dean
Streeet stop, I think). Just thought I would pass this along.
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NEXT>2939
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>Tushar Desai
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Info for getting to Port Authority Terminal from JFK
DATE>Aug 8 11:51:26 1997
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Posted by Tushar Desai on July 14, 1997 at 17:07:21:
Hi
Could anyone let me know how to get to Port Authority Terminal from
JFK ??
Moreover, from where could I get the tokens used in buying tickets.
Appreciate your help..
Tushar
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NEXT>2941
PREVIOUS>2938
POSTER>Tushar Desai
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Info for getting to Port Authority Terminal from JFK
DATE>Aug 8 11:51:28 1997
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Posted by Tushar Desai on July 14, 1997 at 17:07:51:
Hi
Could anyone let me know how to get to Port Authority Terminal from
JFK ??
Moreover, from where could I get the tokens used in buying tickets.
Appreciate your help..
Tushar
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NEXT>2948
PREVIOUS>2937
POSTER>subway-buff
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: How come more chicks don't post messages?
DATE>Aug 8 11:51:29 1997
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Posted by subway-buff on July 14, 1997 at 17:11:55:
In Reply to: [6]How come more chicks don't post messages? posted by
John M. on July 14, 1997 at 16:47:33:
Perhaps more women would post if they were treated as equals. Some
women like trains as much as some guys. Also- many women would prefer
not to be called "chick" or similar words. It is this attitude and
"fear?" of perverts that keeps alot of women of this BBS and the net.
Please e-mail a reply and we'll discuss further. I too went ont he
trip and found it fascinating. I ride NJT six days a week and have
answerd questions their crews don't know. All right- I am a *woman*
not a "chick".
Please treat us with courtesy. :-)
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NEXT>2944
PREVIOUS>2939
POSTER>John
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Info for getting to Port Authority Terminal from JFK
DATE>Aug 8 11:51:30 1997
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Posted by John on July 14, 1997 at 17:13:33:
In Reply to: [5]Info for getting to Port Authority Terminal from JFK
posted by Tushar Desai on July 14, 1997 at 17:07:21:
From Kennedy Airport, you can take the Carey Bus directly to the Port
Authority. I don't know the exact fare (call 1-800-AIR-RIDE for exact
information). By subway, there is a free shuttle bus to the Howard
Beach station where you can take the A train directly to the Port
Authority.
The tokens are used to enter the system; you do not use them to buy
tickets. At any subway station, you have to go to a token booth to
purchase your tokens. They are $1.50 each, and you deposit the token
into the slot in the turnstile. The turnstile will then beep and an
electronic display will flash "GO". Be advised that the token booth
attendants will not produce change for bills over US$20.00.
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NEXT>2943
PREVIOUS>2935
POSTER>Charles Fiori
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Buses
DATE>Aug 8 11:51:32 1997
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Posted by Charles Fiori on July 14, 1997 at 17:14:09:
In Reply to: [5]Re: Buses posted by John M. on July 14, 1997 at
16:32:28:
Thanks--keep it up. Plenty of room for new parishioners, congregants,
whatever! We seem to have generated a lot of material about Redbirds,
Stainless Steel, etc., that I'd like to exchange ideas about
Fishbowls, Old Looks, New Looks, adwings, Flxibles, yadda-yadda-yadda.
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NEXT>2947
PREVIOUS>2942
POSTER>Charles Fiori
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Buses
DATE>Aug 8 11:51:33 1997
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Posted by Charles Fiori on July 14, 1997 at 17:14:28:
In Reply to: [5]Re: Buses posted by John M. on July 14, 1997 at
16:32:28:
Thanks--keep it up. Plenty of room for new parishioners, congregants,
whatever! We seem to have generated a lot of material about Redbirds,
Stainless Steel, etc., that I'd like to exchange ideas about
Fishbowls, Old Looks, New Looks, adwings, Flxibles, yadda-yadda-yadda.
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NEXT>3126
PREVIOUS>2941
POSTER>subway-buff
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Info for getting to Port Authority Terminal from JFK
DATE>Aug 8 11:51:34 1997
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Posted by subway-buff on July 14, 1997 at 17:26:00:
In Reply to: [6]Info for getting to Port Authority Terminal from JFK
posted by Tushar Desai on July 14, 1997 at 17:07:51:
1- take the free Port Authority Shuttlke bus to Howard Beach /JFK
Airport Station. take a Manhattan Bound A train (this train has a
White letter A in a blue circle).
2- Get off this train at 42 Street Port Authority Bus Terminal.
3- Go through the turnstiles after going up the stairs when you see
the directional sign for the Port AUthority Bus Terminal (PABT)
4- You will be on the lower level of the PABT.
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NEXT>2951
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>Garfield
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>NYC Bus Fleets
DATE>Aug 8 11:51:36 1997
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Posted by Garfield on July 14, 1997 at 17:30:54:
During the past year or so, I've noticed that on the private bus
company "Queens Surface Corp", some of there EXPRESS buses have
stunning advertisements painted on the buses' exterior. On a few
occassions, I've stopped and looked at these buses go by near where I
work examining the paintings. Will the MTA ever go along with this
concept in order to boost revenue therfore lessening the chance of a
fare increase?
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NEXT>2950
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>Garfield
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>NY1 News "Straphangars Report"
DATE>Aug 8 11:51:37 1997
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Posted by Garfield on July 14, 1997 at 17:33:56:
I've noticed for the past month or so that the "Straphangars Report"
does not appear on the regular times as it did. Does anyone know of
the show and knows if the program was either cut or has a new time
slot. PLEASE POST !!!
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NEXT>2989
PREVIOUS>2943
POSTER>John
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Buses
DATE>Aug 8 11:51:38 1997
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Posted by John on July 14, 1997 at 17:36:53:
In Reply to: [5]Re: Buses posted by John M. on July 14, 1997 at
16:32:28:
Yeah, the bus at night. There's nothing like riding a Manhattan bus at
11:00 at night. Nobody to get on your nerves, nobody ringing the bell
every two blocks, the bus doesn't pull over every two blocks to pick
up any passengers.
Then again, there's nothing like the subway at night. It's like a
"fantasyland", expecially stations like Times Square or Atlantic
Avenue that have a maze of underground passageways. Nobody . . . Not a
soul hangs around the station at 2AM. The flurescent lighting provides
a cold shine on everything, but the indescent lights of the past cast
eerie amber glows on the walls and what-not. Strange as it may sound,
this is the place and time where I would LOVE to spend time with N.M.
(the woman I'm in love with!) Just wishful thinking, I guess.
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NEXT>2949
PREVIOUS>2940
POSTER>Gary Jacobi
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: How come more chicks don't post messages?
DATE>Aug 8 11:51:39 1997
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Posted by Gary Jacobi on July 14, 1997 at 17:45:56:
In Reply to: [5]Re: How come more chicks don't post messages? posted
by subway-buff on July 14, 1997 at 17:11:55:
We have a real social problem in our society in that all contacts
between strangers of the opposite sex are presumed/suspected to be
"Hits". A prime example; in 1984,while taking my first tour of the
relatively new DC subway, I changed trains, and to my surprise, found
the front window position occupied by a young woman! I would have
enjoyed swapping knowledge of the system with her,as I was a visitor
and the odds were that she was a regular rider. But, glib as I might
consider myself to be, I could not think of a way to strike up a
conversation without saeeming to be threatening! What should I have
done?
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NEXT>2971
PREVIOUS>2948
POSTER>Gary Jacobi
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: How come more chicks don't post messages?
DATE>Aug 8 11:51:41 1997
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Posted by Gary Jacobi on July 14, 1997 at 17:47:39:
In Reply to: [5]Re: How come more chicks don't post messages? posted
by subway-buff on July 14, 1997 at 17:11:55:
We have a real social problem in our society in that all contacts
between strangers of the opposite sex are presumed/suspected to be
"Hits". A prime example; in 1984,while taking my first tour of the
relatively new DC subway, I changed trains, and to my surprise, found
the front window position occupied by a young woman! I would have
enjoyed swapping knowledge of the system with her,as I was a visitor
and the odds were that she was a regular rider. But, glib as I might
consider myself to be, I could not think of a way to strike up a
conversation without saeeming to be threatening! What should I have
done? (I would NOT consider calling any woman a chick, unless perhaps
she was wearing an Easter costume)
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NEXT>2970
PREVIOUS>2946
POSTER>John
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: NY1 News "Straphangars Report"
DATE>Aug 8 11:51:42 1997
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Posted by John on July 14, 1997 at 17:48:25:
In Reply to: [5]NY1 News "Straphangars Report" posted by Garfield on
July 14, 1997 at 17:33:56:
Yeah, because the term "Straphanger" will be obsolete once the
redbirds go. We will now have to be called "Barhangers" :-)
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NEXT>2953
PREVIOUS>2945
POSTER>John
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: NYC Bus Fleets
DATE>Aug 8 11:51:43 1997
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Posted by John on July 14, 1997 at 17:50:20:
In Reply to: [5]NYC Bus Fleets posted by Garfield on July 14, 1997 at
17:30:54:
I have seen an MTA bus painted in a MetroCard Gold advertisement, but
that's it.
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NEXT>
PREVIOUS>2818
POSTER>Andrew Byler
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Track Maps
DATE>Aug 8 11:51:44 1997
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Posted by Andrew Byler on July 14, 1997 at 17:51:57:
In Reply to: [6]Track Maps posted by subway-buff on July 10, 1997 at
17:29:38:
I don't know of any availability of these things on the web ...
However, I do have c. 1982 Track Charts for SEPTA Commuter Rail and
some NJT which I'd be happy to send out to anyone who wants them for a
modest fee to cover copying and postage - please contact me at my
email address (byler@ce.udel.edu) - the lot will run you about $5 to
$10 I imagine. Trains Magazine published the track charts in their
article on the Northeast Corridor in 1984 (February issue I believe).
SEPTA charts are also available in the book "Delaware Valley Rails"
from 1979.
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NEXT>2955
PREVIOUS>2951
POSTER>Gary Jacobi
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: NYC Bus Fleets
DATE>Aug 8 11:51:46 1997
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Posted by Gary Jacobi on July 14, 1997 at 18:05:11:
In Reply to: [5]NYC Bus Fleets posted by Garfield on July 14, 1997 at
17:30:54:
Be careful what you wish for! Here in Sacramento, CA, they went so far
as to paint several busses "head to toe" including windows ! You could
see out in daylight, but outsiders could not see in. I think
management was made to realize that this had negative safety impacts,
and after the first few thet were not repeated. They still cover both
busses and light rail vehicles with massive graphics below the
beltline. Most of them are "striking", I suppose; STRIKINGLY UGLY
USUALLY.
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NEXT>2966
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>David Pirmann
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>New Frames-based pages
DATE>Aug 8 11:51:47 1997
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Posted by David Pirmann on July 14, 1997 at 21:05:05:
I've replaced the main page and the subject pages with a new
Frames-based interface. Let me know if you find any bugs or anything
not working properly. (Or if you don't like it...)
--dave
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NEXT>2961
PREVIOUS>2953
POSTER>Bobw
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: NYC Bus Fleets
DATE>Aug 8 11:51:49 1997
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Posted by Bobw on July 14, 1997 at 21:20:33:
In Reply to: [6]NYC Bus Fleets posted by Garfield on July 14, 1997 at
17:30:54:
Here in Philadelphia SEPTA experimented with a few "shrink-wrapped"
all-over ads. Looking out from the inside was OK, but you can't see
inside from the street thru the windows. It appears that the
experiment was a flop and no new ads have been seen, except for a
couple of Blue Cross and local efforts. The new Ikarus buses have a
SEPTA "S" over the last side window on each side, but none have been
shrink-wrapped.
Another interesting one is Neoplan 3439 - it was once covered in a
partial ad for SEPTA's Day Pass, with city scenes covering the
windows. It has recently been repainted but the decals remain on the
windows!
You may have seen NJT Flxible 1403, the "Aqualink" bus, which is
shrink-wrapped for the NJ Aquarium and runs on the Aqualink (Route
461) between Camden Transporation Center (WJ Rand) on Broadway and the
Aquarium on weekends. It has been featured at the Hoboken Festival the
last few years. On this bus, the windows are virtually useless, as the
decals make it seem as if you are looking thru a heavy screen to see
outside from in, and it is nearly impossible to see inside from out.
My opinion - keep the ads simple and the buses as buses and not
rolling billboards. SEPTA had a policy for no exterior ads for years,
and this ended in '92-'93. The buses don't look any cleaner, as had
been promised, and who knows if the revenue is covering what the
boosters said it would.
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NEXT>3020
PREVIOUS>2924
POSTER>Steve
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: New Derailment
DATE>Aug 8 11:51:50 1997
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Posted by Steve on July 14, 1997 at 22:48:08:
In Reply to: [5]Re: New Derailment posted by David Pirmann on July 14,
1997 at 11:57:09:
The wreck from 135th Street was cut up into enough pieces that it
filled about 8 flatcars. There's not much to photograph. You can have
all the pix you want of the R-62 from 14th Street. BTW - it was not a
62 but a redbird (R-36) which derailed this morning and it was one
car, not 3. The car & it's mate are on 17 track in Livonia Yard as of
now.
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NEXT>3035
PREVIOUS>2923
POSTER>Joe M
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: PCC Streetcars for Kenosha Wisconsin
DATE>Aug 8 11:51:51 1997
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Posted by Joe M on July 14, 1997 at 22:52:45:
In Reply to: [5]Re: PCC Streetcars for Kenosha Wisconsin posted by Dan
Lawrence on July 14, 1997 at 12:27:18:
I have talked to the people at McKinney Ave and we are swapping info
about regauging. If you find more info let me know
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NEXT>2994
PREVIOUS>2913
POSTER>Steve
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Flushing on Pelham?
DATE>Aug 8 11:51:52 1997
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Posted by Steve on July 14, 1997 at 22:55:49:
In Reply to: [6]Re: Flushing on Pelham? posted by aaron on July 14,
1997 at 08:51:12:
A trip cock: It's basically a dump valve mounted on the truck. The
trip cock has an arm which extends downward from the valve body. When
it passes over a red signal (with it's stop arm up, the trip cock
contacts the stop arm and the valve opens. When the valve opens, the
brake pipe air is vented to atmosphere and the train goes into
emergency, and stops.
I hate to say this because I'll get dozens of requests but if you need
a diagram, let me know?
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NEXT>
PREVIOUS>2925
POSTER>Steve
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: R44 wreck
DATE>Aug 8 11:51:54 1997
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Posted by Steve on July 14, 1997 at 22:57:36:
In Reply to: [5]Re: R44 wreck posted by Wayne Johnson on July 14, 1997
at 13:11:24:
No decision has been made yet
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NEXT>2986
PREVIOUS>2927
POSTER>Steve
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Problems on the Subway
DATE>Aug 8 11:51:55 1997
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Posted by Steve on July 14, 1997 at 23:01:30:
In Reply to: [5]Re: Problems on the Subway posted by Keranu on July
14, 1997 at 04:45:16:
Since I always found the UK a very civilized society, I'm sure that
Glasgow has far less crime than some of the 100 or so US cities with
crime rates greater than NYC. Did that make sense???
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NEXT>2984
PREVIOUS>2955
POSTER>~airplane
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: NYC Bus Fleets
DATE>Aug 8 11:51:57 1997
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Posted by ~airplane on July 14, 1997 at 23:04:44:
In Reply to: [6]NYC Bus Fleets posted by Garfield on July 14, 1997 at
17:30:54:
Have you ever stood on a sidewalk and watched a telephone roll by?
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NEXT>3059
PREVIOUS>2793
POSTER>Joe Camel
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: NYC Subway in 2020
DATE>Aug 8 11:51:58 1997
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Posted by Joe Camel on July 15, 1997 at 00:04:11:
In Reply to: [6]Re: NYC Subway in 2020 posted by Peter Rosa on July
07, 1997 at 09:07:00:
3020! We have a very over-optimistic person on our hands.
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NEXT>2972
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>Timothy
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Subway in Wilmington, Delaware?
DATE>Aug 8 11:51:59 1997
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Posted by Timothy on July 15, 1997 at 00:27:13:
Can anyone tell me if Wilmington, Delaware will ever get a subway
system,
or at least an LRV line? I don't know if Wilmington is considered a
major
city, but it appears to be about the size of Newark, N.J., and is
served
by Amtrak, and Philadelphia's SEPTA commuter rail system. I just can't
understand why Wilmington doesn't have any form of subway/elevated or
trolley system, as it appears to be a large enough city for one.
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NEXT>2968
PREVIOUS>2766
POSTER>Joe Camel
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Any new cars becides as the R68's
DATE>Aug 8 11:52:01 1997
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Posted by Joe Camel on July 15, 1997 at 00:27:29:
In Reply to: [6]Re: Any new cars becides as the R68's posted by Steve
on July 07, 1997 at 23:21:44:
are the R-134 cars going to replace the ozone depleting R-11 and R-12
cars?
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NEXT>3000
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>Timothy
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Levi's jeans commercial shot on el
DATE>Aug 8 11:52:02 1997
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Posted by Timothy on July 15, 1997 at 01:16:19:
Back in the early/mid 1980's, I remember seeing a Levi's 501 jeans TV
commercial, in which showed a small group of people walking down, and
dancing to the commercial's rap-like jingle on what appeared to be
stairs
to an elevated station. The stairways in the commercial looked very
ornate.
They seemed to have resembled the old Polo Grounds Shuttle stairways
that
still exist at 155th St. and 8th Ave.. If anyone here recalls seeing
this
commercial, please let me know if the stairs were in fact the ones at
155th St. and 8th Ave.. The only other possible location could be the
stairs on Metro-North's 125th St. Station, which are also ornate.
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NEXT>2967
PREVIOUS>2954
POSTER>Ben-Zion Y. Cassouto
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: New Frames-based pages
DATE>Aug 8 11:52:03 1997
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Posted by Ben-Zion Y. Cassouto on July 15, 1997 at 01:59:41:
In Reply to: [6]New Frames-based pages posted by David Pirmann on July
14, 1997 at 21:05:05:
I wasn't able to see the logo at the top of the big page.
In any case, I personally despiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiise frames...
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NEXT>2969
PREVIOUS>2966
POSTER>Zack
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: New Frames-based pages
DATE>Aug 8 11:52:05 1997
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Posted by Zack on July 15, 1997 at 03:17:02:
In Reply to: [6]Re: New Frames-based pages posted by Ben-Zion Y.
Cassouto on July 15, 1997 at 01:59:41:
go back to the old format dave i liked it better yo could see more of
the page and it looked better
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NEXT>
PREVIOUS>2964
POSTER>John
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Any new cars becides as the R68's
DATE>Aug 8 11:52:06 1997
EMAILNOTICES>no
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Posted by John on July 15, 1997 at 06:13:20:
In Reply to: [5]Re: Any new cars becides as the R68's posted by Joe
Camel on July 15, 1997 at 00:27:29:
Say whaaaaaaaa? Man, those cars are long gone! (How are they ozone
depleting? They're electric! Just like all the other subway cars!)
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NEXT>2976
PREVIOUS>2967
POSTER>David Pirmann
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: New Frames-based pages
DATE>Aug 8 11:52:07 1997
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Posted by David Pirmann on July 15, 1997 at 08:13:01:
In Reply to: [6]Re: New Frames-based pages posted by Zack on July 15,
1997 at 03:17:02:
Okay, that's two votes no. But what do you mean you could see more of
the page? Isn't that a function of the size of your browser window? In
my window (630x768 browser size) I can see *more* of the page than
before, without scrolling.
I don't really like frames that much either, which is why only the
index pages got them. The rest of the site isn't framed and won't be.
-Dave
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NEXT>2980
PREVIOUS>2950
POSTER>Wayne Johnson
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: NY1 News "Straphangars Report"
DATE>Aug 8 11:52:09 1997
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Posted by Wayne Johnson on July 15, 1997 at 09:54:21:
In Reply to: [5]NY1 News "Straphangars Report" posted by Garfield on
July 14, 1997 at 17:33:56:
The Straphangers Report has been canceled until further notice,
because Paul Fleuranges, the transit reporter had resigned. I'm not
sure but I think he accepted a position at CBS.
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NEXT>2973
PREVIOUS>2949
POSTER>John M.
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: How come more chicks don't post messages?
DATE>Aug 8 11:52:10 1997
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Posted by John M. on July 15, 1997 at 10:11:36:
In Reply to: [5]Re: How come more chicks don't post messages? posted
by subway-buff on July 14, 1997 at 17:11:55:
Sorry, I didn't mean to offend with the message title. It was meant in
a humorous vein (i.e. me, the nerdy transit aficionado awkwardly
expressing a desire that more women share my enthusiasm for trains and
mass transit). I told my fiancee I posted this, and she thought it was
hysterical, even though she's not a subway buff.
Anyway, I did want to open a discussion on why transit planning seems
so male dominated. Seeing all the male names posting messages reminded
me that when I attended NYU's Wagner School a few years back, the
public administration program was pretty evenly distributed among the
sexes, while the urban planning program was heavily male. Why is this?
I've worked in 2 jobs dealing with the legal profession recently, and
among younger lawyers, women seemed pretty fairly represented
(although I don't think its 50-50 yet). Is there something about
transit planning and administration, or simply fascination with
transit, that keeps women away? How can we correct this problem?
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NEXT>2975
PREVIOUS>2963
POSTER>Mark Greenwald
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Subway in Wilmington, Delaware?
DATE>Aug 8 11:52:11 1997
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Posted by Mark Greenwald on July 15, 1997 at 10:23:27:
In Reply to: [6]Subway in Wilmington, Delaware? posted by Timothy on
July 15, 1997 at 00:27:13:
It seems to me that Wilmington would be just the right size for Light
Rail--Why don't you contact the city itself and ask if one was ever
considered and if not---why. Then, if you can, let the rest of us
know.
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NEXT>2974
PREVIOUS>2971
POSTER>Mark Greenwald
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: How come more chicks don't post messages?
DATE>Aug 8 11:52:13 1997
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Posted by Mark Greenwald on July 15, 1997 at 10:32:58:
In Reply to: [6]Re: How come more chicks don't post messages? posted
by John M. on July 15, 1997 at 10:11:36:
You know, it's amazing about the people that post messages--you're
right it is mostly male--maybe it's due to upbringing. When I went to
Frostburg State College (now University) in the western Maryland
mountains, it was amazing how many people I knew growing up attended
the Urban Planning courses like myself. What makes this significant is
that I'm from a "planned city" that sits between Baltimore &
Washington called "Columbia"
We all grew up in a planned racially, socially, and religiously
tolerant city that I guess the dreams of James Rouse and the other
urban visionaries grew within all of us, male & female. That is here,
though, New York can be a much tougher environment, especially the
subway, henceforth, a more masculine environment. I could be DEAD
WRONG!!--probably am, but it was just a thought.
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NEXT>2981
PREVIOUS>2973
POSTER>Peter Rosa
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: How come more chicks don't post messages?
DATE>Aug 8 11:52:14 1997
EMAILNOTICES>no
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Posted by Peter Rosa on July 15, 1997 at 11:13:36:
In Reply to: [6]How come more chicks don't post messages? posted by
John M. on July 14, 1997 at 16:47:33:
Interest in transit issues seems to be primarily a male phenomenon.
All but a few of the regular participants in the Usenet newsgroups
nyc.transit and misc.transport.urban-transit are men. Even beyond
transit, let's not forget that the Internet in general is still
somewhat male-oriented, though less so than in the past.
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NEXT>2991
PREVIOUS>2972
POSTER>Gerry O'Regan
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Subway in Wilmington, Delaware?
DATE>Aug 8 11:52:15 1997
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Posted by Gerry O'Regan on July 15, 1997 at 12:18:18:
In Reply to: [6]Re: Subway in Wilmington, Delaware? posted by Mark
Greenwald on July 15, 1997 at 10:23:27:
Wilmington at one time had a fair sized trolleybus system, which was
abandoned at an early date. Many of the coaches later went to
Johnstown, PA. Seashore has two ex-Wilmington coaches, one via
Johnstown. AFAIK another is on the way.
I don't know what the future will offer, but there is a precedent.
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NEXT>2977
PREVIOUS>2969
POSTER>Mark S Feinman
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: New Frames-based pages
DATE>Aug 8 11:52:17 1997
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Posted by Mark S Feinman on July 15, 1997 at 12:22:38:
In Reply to: [6]New Frames-based pages posted by David Pirmann on July
14, 1997 at 21:05:05:
I didn't have trouble with loading the new pages, nor do I have a
preference between frames or no frames, but will you have a home page
for those with frame-challenged browsers?
(You may already have it - perhaps I just didn't see it)
--Mark
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NEXT>
PREVIOUS>2976
POSTER>Gary Jacobi
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: New Frames-based pages
DATE>Aug 8 11:52:18 1997
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Posted by Gary Jacobi on July 15, 1997 at 12:45:41:
In Reply to: [5]New Frames-based pages posted by David Pirmann on July
14, 1997 at 21:05:05:
Excuse my computer ignorance, but I am over Fifty after all! What does
Frame Based imply/mean. Looks better to me, but what do I know?
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NEXT>
PREVIOUS>2912
POSTER>Mark S Feinman
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Subway spotting
DATE>Aug 8 11:52:19 1997
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Posted by Mark S Feinman on July 15, 1997 at 13:07:44:
In Reply to: [6]Subway spotting posted by aaron on July 11, 1997 at
08:39:45:
You mean Tower 18 in Chicago doesn't even get an honourable mention?
There's a garage on the corner of Lake & Wells that provides fantastic
views of the action. During Rush Hour, you have Green Line service
coming from Lake & Harlem approaching from the east/west, Brown
(Ravenswood) & Purple (Evanston Express) coming from the north
(Evanston runs clockwise and Ravenswood counterclockwise) and Orange
(Midway) coming from the south running clockwise. There's a train like
every MINUTE it seems during the morning rush.
As for the NY subway, my favourites are, in no particular order here:
- Coney Island / Stillwell Ave (B/D/F/N)
- The area between West 8th St and Stillwell Ave, from the
Aquarium/Boardwalk overpass over Surf Ave; the el is double-decked
here, D at the top and F at the bottom.
- 9th Ave - 39th St (Brooklyn) pedestrian overpass (B, M).
Technically, this is no longer legal because of a sign recently put up
that the overpass is for authorized use only. It provides employee
entrance with the 36th St yard.
- E 180 St (Bronx) pedestrian overpass (2/5). You can get views of the
2/5 approaching from 174th St, you have the E 180 St yard (now under
reconstruction) and the defunct NYW&B. If it were legal to get up onto
the Bronx River Pkwy (I don't think it is), that would provide an even
better view of the same area.
- East Tremont Av (2/5) facing Bronx Park. Great views of 2/5s
rounding a sharp 90 degree curve hading towards E 180 St. Stand at the
center of the Bronx-bound platform and take your pick of trains
rounding curves in either direction. (In videos I've taken I have
nearly an hour of just these 2 stations alone).
- Corona Yards (#7) from a pedestrian bridge connecting Flushing
Meadow Park with the #7 at Shea Stadium).
- Broadway / East NY. The complex elevated junction, now just a memory
of what it once was, always amazes me. Clear views of Atlantic Ave and
even the #3 train leaving Junius Street.
- 168th St & Broadway (1/9). Perch on one of two pedestrian
overpasses. High arched ceiling. I just think its pretty cool.
- Elder Av (6). Stand at northern portion of Pelham Bay Park platform
and get a clear view of the elevated for three stops. Great place just
after the morning rush when all the extra rush-hour #6s are heading
back to Westchester Yard for their midday siesta.
- Myrtle Ave (J,M,Z) facing east. M trains coming from Metropolitan
Ave and you have a clear view of J/Z trains coming from East New York.
--Mark
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NEXT>
PREVIOUS>2800
POSTER>Mark S Feinman
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: NYC Subway in 2020 (PRT, not PTM)
DATE>Aug 8 11:52:20 1997
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Posted by Mark S Feinman on July 15, 1997 at 13:27:14:
In Reply to: [6]Re: NYC Subway in 2020 (PRT, not PTM) posted by Nathan
on July 10, 1997 at 00:39:03:
> in NYC there is no room for the massive guideways required.
You mean electrifying the LIE, BQE, Cross-Bronx Expressways, etc,
doesn't appeal to you?? :-)
--Mark
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NEXT>
PREVIOUS>2970
POSTER>William A. Padron
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: NY1 News "Straphangars Report"
DATE>Aug 8 11:52:22 1997
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Posted by William A. Padron on July 15, 1997 at 13:52:02:
In Reply to: [6]Re: NY1 News "Straphangars Report" posted by Wayne
Johnson on July 15, 1997 at 09:54:21:
Paul Fleuranges, original host of NY1 News' "The Straphangers'
Report", is currently a general assignment reporter for WCBS-TV
Channel 2 News here in New York City. There is no word at this time
for a return of the show and a replacement host at this time from NY1
News.
Sincerely,
William A. Padron
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NEXT>2996
PREVIOUS>2974
POSTER>John M.
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: How come more chicks don't post messages?
DATE>Aug 8 11:52:23 1997
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Posted by John M. on July 15, 1997 at 14:08:13:
In Reply to: [5]Re: How come more chicks don't post messages? posted
by Mark Greenwald on July 15, 1997 at 10:32:58:
Maybe part of the answer lies in childhood - I didn't know too many
girls with model trains for toys.
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NEXT>
PREVIOUS>2934
POSTER>William A. Padron
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Pittsburgh PATransit's PCC car fleet - current status
DATE>Aug 8 11:52:24 1997
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Posted by William A. Padron on July 15, 1997 at 14:15:51:
In Reply to: [6]Re: Pittsburgh PATransit's PCC car fleet - current
status posted by William A. Padron on July 14, 1997 at 15:13:32:
To get a better clarification on this matter...in 1993, there were
sixteen PCC cars still available for revenue service: #1713, #1737,
#1745, #1765 and #4001 to #4012. While the PATransit Home Web Page now
claims to have six PCC units in their fleet (as of March 16, 1997),
the January-February 1997 edition of the Pennsylvania Trolley Museum's
"Trolley Fare" magazine states that the revenue fleet was up to three
(#4007-#4009) with a fourth one (#4004) being repaired for return to
service.
I had originally inquired to both PATransit and PTM as what was the
current and correct status of the PCC car fleet (i.e. the actual
number of cars available and their roster number), and whatever became
of the last four remaining 1700-series cars mentioned above. There was
no response from PATransit on this matter, but I did receive an E-mail
reponse from PTM. Their response, shown here verbatim, was as follows:
"The most recent info on this was that 4007-4009 were active and 4004
was under repair. The rest of the cars, including the four 1700s
(1713, 1737, 1745, 1765) were in various states of disuse. While PAT
might list them as active, they may only be so on paper. Some of the
cars have not yet run out their alloted 10 year rehab life and thus
PAT must continue to consider them as 'alive' by government rules.
The Drake line requires at most two cars, so there obviously is no
longer a need for 16 cars. Some (4010-4012) have benn officially
retired and may to go scrap soon along with the long-stored basket
case 1700s (other than the 4 rebuilt ones)."
By the way, two 1700-series Pittsburgh PCC units have been preserved
as in their original vintage-1949 paint scheme. Car 1711 is at the
Pennsylvania Trolley Museum in Washington, Pennsylvania, while car
1724 is on display at the Senator John Heinz Pittsburgh Regional
History Center museum which is located in that city's Strip District.
Sincerely,
William A. Padron
New York, NY
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NEXT>
PREVIOUS>2930
POSTER>Peter Rosa
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: - - - - - Tribute to Mr. Pirmann - - - - -
DATE>Aug 8 11:52:26 1997
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Posted by Peter Rosa on July 15, 1997 at 14:30:32:
In Reply to: [6]- - - - - Tribute to Mr. Pirmann - - - - - posted by
RAC93 on July 12, 1997 at 04:55:13:
Yep, it's a terrific site ... definitely one of my favorites!
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NEXT>2988
PREVIOUS>2961
POSTER>John M.
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: NYC Bus Fleets
DATE>Aug 8 11:52:27 1997
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Posted by John M. on July 15, 1997 at 15:15:08:
In Reply to: [5]NYC Bus Fleets posted by Garfield on July 14, 1997 at
17:30:54:
You're message raises an important point re: subway and bus
advertising. How much revenue is the MTA losing by devoting almost
entire subway cars and buses to MetroCard advertising. At least when I
see ads for Dr. Zizmor, I know that that MTA is reveiving badly needed
revenue (even if some people are literally paying with their skin).
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NEXT>2987
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>Chris
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Aesthetics
DATE>Aug 8 11:52:28 1997
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Posted by Chris on July 15, 1997 at 16:38:16:
According to my research, a majority of New York's working population
still does not take the subway, even though it is quicker and more
time-saving. Maybe if we improve the looks of the subway with artwork
(ex. Moscow), the subway can get more customers.
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NEXT>3016
PREVIOUS>2960
POSTER>Joesph
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Problems on the Subway
DATE>Aug 8 11:52:29 1997
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Posted by Joesph on July 15, 1997 at 17:47:10:
In Reply to: [5]Problems on the Subway posted by Chris on July 11,
1997 at 14:27:58:
In summer heat the stations have totally unacceptable ventilation. The
use of trains themselves to push air would solve part of the problem
and could be accomplished easily be boxing in some girders on some
lines, and adding small extensions at one end to make the train closer
fitting and the subway train would act as a piston. This would also
slow the train and reduce brake wear. Center for disease control
recommendations are that circulation is the number one way to reduce
hazard from multi-drug resistant tuberculosis. This is the NUMBER ONE
problem facing the transit system and is not being addressed by the
morons on the Transit Board. Take bets on this prophesy. The METROCARD
was a waste of tax money. Give the chimps another bananna.
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NEXT>
PREVIOUS>2985
POSTER>John
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Aesthetics
DATE>Aug 8 11:52:31 1997
EMAILNOTICES>no
IP_ADDRESS> REMOTE_HOST: ; REMOTE_ADDR:
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Posted by John on July 15, 1997 at 19:58:12:
In Reply to: [5]Aesthetics posted by Chris on July 15, 1997 at
16:38:16:
The TA is working on improving the look of the stations by installing
tiled floors and stainless steel railings. Also, the entire purpose of
the R-110 cars was to get customer feedback on what they
liked/disliked in subway cars.
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NEXT>3127
PREVIOUS>2984
POSTER>John
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SUBJECT>Re: NYC Bus Fleets
DATE>Aug 8 11:52:32 1997
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Posted by John on July 15, 1997 at 20:00:28:
In Reply to: [5]Re: NYC Bus Fleets posted by John M. on July 15, 1997
at 15:15:08:
I have never seen an entire subway car painted in MetroCard
advertisement.
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PREVIOUS>2947
POSTER>John
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SUBJECT>Re: Buses
DATE>Aug 8 11:52:33 1997
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Posted by John on July 15, 1997 at 20:06:37:
In Reply to: [5]Re: Buses posted by Charles Fiori on July 14, 1997 at
17:14:28:
When did NJ Transit retire their last Fishbowl? I remember seeing one
as late as 1994, on my way to Willowbrook Mall from Newark. My bus
(#11) was going through Bloomfield Center and I saw a Fishbowl in
front of their City Hall (I think it was Broad St., or Montgomery St.
I have reletives in this area, so I know the local streets fairly
well).
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NEXT>3008
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>Ted Nielsen
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SUBJECT>Regional Express plan ( Rx )
DATE>Aug 8 11:52:35 1997
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Posted by Ted Nielsen on July 15, 1997 at 20:21:34:
What do you think about Gov. Pataki's plan called the Regional
Express plan ? Here are some highlights of the plan :
1.) Extend the West Side rail line underground from Penn station
to the Wall St. area , giving downtown access to LIRR , NJ Transit ,
Amtrak and Metro-North Hudson line trains.
2.) Build a new tunnel from Grand Central Terminal to the Wall St.
area for Metro-North trains.
3.) Extend the LIRR from the Flatbush Ave. Terminal ( Brooklyn )
underground , following Atlantic Ave. , under the East River to
the Wall St. area connecting with the proposed tunnels mentioned
above , enabling LIRR riders to go straight to Downtown Manhattan and
points north. ( some trains could travel directly from Long Island to
Westchester with stops in Downtown Bklyn , Wall St. and
Penn station )
4.) An alternative option to the Penn station / Grand Central tunnels
would be a subway shuttle line bet. the two stations and downtown.
The study to look at those options has begun and will cost 10-15
million.
There is also a ongoing study on the 2nd. Ave. subway line. It would
cost about 5 Billion to build it. I have an idea for the route of the
2nd. Ave. subway.
There would be 2 subway lines using the 2nd. Ave. line , one would
connect with the Staten Island subway ( via a NY harbor tunnel ) , the
other line would begin in Brooklyn ( Red Hook ? ) and continue to
Downtown Bklyn ( Brooklyn Heights ) , under the East River into
Manhattan , up to 2nd. Ave ( merging with the line from SI ). The 2
lines
would continue up 2nd. Ave ( 4 tracks , express / local ). One line
would
terminate on Upper East Side and the other would use the 63rd. St.
tunnel under the East River into Queens , terminating at La Guardia
Airport.
Some upgrades would be needed for the SI subway line.
What do you think about it ?
Well , thats my dream plan for the 2nd. Ave. line.
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PREVIOUS>2975
POSTER>Bobw
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SUBJECT>Re: Subway in Wilmington, Delaware?
DATE>Aug 8 11:52:36 1997
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Posted by Bobw on July 15, 1997 at 21:08:25:
In Reply to: [6]Re: Subway in Wilmington, Delaware? posted by Gerry
O'Regan on July 15, 1997 at 12:18:18:
Wilmington is only 25 miles south of Philadelphia (my home base) and I
don't think I've ever heard of any plans for light rail there. There
was a sizable trackless network there, as mentioned in another
follow-up, and before that a comprehensive trolley system, but transit
there today is 100% bus and not very big in terms of fleet size or
ridership. There are no significant high-volume corridors of
attraction, as Wilmington is in the center of its metropolitan area
(about 200K population at best). The only major link in my opinion
would be toward Newark (DE) along I-95 - the U of Delaware is in
Newark and there are large employers and shopping centers in this
corridor. Unfortunately DART's bus routes in this area are
hard-pressed to compete with the highway.
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NEXT>2998
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>David Pirmann
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SUBJECT>More on Frames. Lynx too.
DATE>Aug 8 11:52:38 1997
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Posted by David Pirmann on July 15, 1997 at 22:31:21:
In Reply to: [6]New Frames-based pages posted by David Pirmann on July
14, 1997 at 21:05:05:
Well I came up with a workable combination which I like better (I too
don't care much for frames. They are usually not done very well.) Take
a look at the layout of the top level pages now. They are what I call
frames-by-tables. Not exactly what tables are supposed to be for, but
whatever. :) They're done via server-side includes (as are all the
other pages here in terms of standard header and footers) so
maintenance is easy. By the way, I don't know if anyone other than me
really cares, but all of the top level pages are Lynx-friendly. I
think all of the pages qualify as "mostly" Lynx-friendly.)
(One other note. For the GUI challenged, Lynx 2.7 handles frames, in
albeit a unique manner.)
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NEXT>3022
PREVIOUS>2929
POSTER>Steve
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: Are New Subway Cars Needed & my thoughts on the METRO CARD
DATE>Aug 8 11:52:39 1997
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Posted by Steve on July 15, 1997 at 22:38:05:
In Reply to: [5]Re: Are New Subway Cars Needed & my thoughts on the
METRO CARD posted by Philip E.D. on July 14, 1997 at 13:53:22:
I don't think I'm mis-informed at all. Perhaps you'd like to share the
source of your information.
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NEXT>3010
PREVIOUS>2958
POSTER>John
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SUBJECT>Re: Flushing on Pelham?
DATE>Aug 8 11:52:40 1997
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Posted by John on July 15, 1997 at 23:34:20:
In Reply to: [5]Re: Flushing on Pelham? posted by Steve on July 14,
1997 at 22:55:49:
Is there any chance the device will be renamed? Because, after all,
"Trip cock" does have an air of vulgarness :-)
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NEXT>3273
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>Andrew Byler
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: 2nd Ave. Subway Plans (was Regional Express plan ( Rx ))
DATE>Aug 8 11:52:42 1997
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Posted by Andrew Byler on July 15, 1997 at 23:46:31:
In Reply to: [6]Regional Express plan ( Rx ) posted by Ted Nielsen on
July 15, 1997 at 20:21:34:
I like your basic idea. Let me relate my own concerning the 2nd Ave.
Subway and other lines, with regard to how sections of it have been
built and planned.
A few things need to be kept in mind with the 2nd Ave. Subway, because
it is designed to be fundementally different than other New York
Subways. First off, it is a two track line in the sections laready
built, not a four track line, which is more typical. Second, it is
designed for high speeds (70 mph - a speed achieved in Subway only by
Philly's Broad St. Express trains) and wide station spacing. Third,
connections are already built into the 63rd St. tunnel to allow BMT
Broadway express trains to continue north up 2nd Ave., and to allow
other trains from Queens to turn south down 2nd Ave. The proposed
stations are: Triborough Plaza, 109th St., 96th St., 86th St., 72nd
St., 57th St., 42nd St., 28th St., 14th St., Houston, Grand St., Park
Row, Cedar St., Whitehall.
My idea from from Whitehall is that the line would swing south and
east across the East River to the Court St. Station (Current Transit
Museum), and via a rebuilt interlocking which would allow it and the
A/C trains to access either the express or local tracks at
Hoyt-Schermerhorn, join with that line.
One branch would follow this line as an express, and in a continuation
of the Pitkin Ave. tunnel under Pitkin and 107th Ave. beyond Euclid
Ave station, eventually hit the old LIRR right of way, which it take
to past Howard Beach, where it would swing in to JFK.
The other line would branch off at Flatbush Ave. to join the BMT 4th
Ave. tunnel. It would follow this on the express tracks to south of
59th St. where the dummy leads currently end pointing at Staten
Island. it would follow these leads, and end up in St. George. From
St. George, it could operate as two lines - one to Tottenville via the
SIRT, the other along the north shore to New Jersey and a possible
connection with the NEC and then the Raritan Valley line at Cranford.
At the 63rd St. Tunnel, I'd agree that a line should go to LaGuardia.
Specifically, I think the previously mentioned JFK line should. It
could branch use the Queens-Local connection to the E-F express tracks
under Northern Blvd. to Broadway, where the would branch off before
the express tracks rejoin the locals, and follow either the BQE right
of way (which would be cheaper) or Northern Blvd. to 94th St. to get
to LaGuardia. In any case, by pairing the airport lines together,
special cars with some luggage rack space could be used.
At the north end of the 2nd Ave line, the trains from Staten Island
would continue north and east under the Harlem river to the old
Westchester right of way. With a stop in Hunts Point and one at 180th
St., they would then take over the Dyre Ave. line, and continue up the
old Westchester right of way through Mount Vernon, New Rochelle, and
Scarsdale to White Plains. Stops along the way would be made at E.
6th, Columbus Ave., Lincoln Ave., New Rochelle Rd., North Ave.,
Stratton Ave., heathcote Rd., Ridgeway Ave., etc. up to White Plains.
This would thus give a high speed commuter type line on either end.
Finally, the Broadway trains brought over on to the 2nd Ave. could be
swung across under 125th St., stopping at Park Ave., Lenox Ave., and
8th Ave., to connect to the extra two tracks between 125th St. and
145th St., which they would follow up the local tracks to 168th St.,
from there, after a stop at the Port Authority terminal, they would
continue across the GW Bridge to Fort Lee, and follow Main St./Fort
Lee Rd. out to the I-95/I-80 junction, where a large Park and Ride lot
could be built.
One final note - since the 5 will now find its Bronx end chopped off,
a new subway could finally be built under 3rd Ave. in the Bronx for
either it to follow up to 238th St.
Well, that's my pipe dream if New York metro area had no money
problems.
Andy
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NEXT>2999
PREVIOUS>2981
POSTER>Andrew Byler
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: How come more chicks don't post messages?
DATE>Aug 8 11:52:43 1997
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Posted by Andrew Byler on July 15, 1997 at 23:52:05:
In Reply to: [6]Re: How come more chicks don't post messages? posted
by John M. on July 15, 1997 at 10:11:36:
Why do you look at this as necessarily being a problem?
From my perspective, the fewer people entering my field of Civil
Engineering, which includes transit operatiosn and planning, the
better. It means I am more in demand, have a better chocie of work,
and get paid more.
From the point of view of enthusiasts, sure, it'd be nice to have more
interested people, including women. But then again, if everyone
followed transit and railroads as much as folks like us do, maybe it
wouldn't seem so interesting anymore and would lose some of its charm.
Sometimes its best to keep a secret!
Andy
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NEXT>3004
PREVIOUS>0
POSTER>aaron
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>missed connections
DATE>Aug 8 11:52:44 1997
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Posted by aaron on July 16, 1997 at 09:22:01:
I have noticed over the past year that conductors at major transfer
points
never hold doors open to wait for passengers changing from local to
express
trains. This is happening at Chambers Street 2/3 - 1/9, Nevins Street
2/3 - 4/5 and Jay Street A/C - F. As soon as platforms are clear, they
close up the doors, even if a train is just arriving on local/express
platform. Has a new policy been implemented to discourage them from
allowing passengers to make these connections?
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NEXT>
PREVIOUS>2992
POSTER>Ben-Zion Y. Cassouto
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: More on Frames. Lynx too.
DATE>Aug 8 11:52:46 1997
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Posted by Ben-Zion Y. Cassouto on July 16, 1997 at 09:44:29:
In Reply to: [6]More on Frames. Lynx too. posted by David Pirmann on
July 15, 1997 at 22:31:21:
No good Dave -- I am getting an error "executing directive" ???
BTW, when frames are used it is possible to call up the sub-page from
the main box by entering it directly as a URL.
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NEXT>3005
PREVIOUS>2996
POSTER>John M.
EMAIL>
SUBJECT>Re: How come more chicks don't post messages?
DATE>Aug 8 11:52:47 1997
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Posted by John M. on July 16, 1997 at 10:41:53:
In Reply to: [5]Re: How come more chicks don't post messages? posted
by Andrew Byler on July 15, 1997 at 23:52:05:
If more people followed transit and railroads as much as "folks like
us," or even had a general interest in ensuring an efficient transit
system and expanding it where feasible, then the demand for your
profession overall would be increased. Obviously, diversity in the
workplace is not the only answer, but I do think its healthy that the
administration of a mass transit system used by millions of people
reflects its ridership. And I think its quite important that more
women become interested in transit administration and planning,
especially as more women become elected officials and policymakers.
At the very least, having more women interested in this field might
make your work environment more aesthetically pleasing.
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