If Casey Stengel entirely will operate q32 - where will the extra Orions come from to handle the extra trips?
Could be from QV and MCH once they start getting the Orion VII's in some there Orion V's can go to CS.
From what I experience, the bulk of the Q32 buses are already supplied by Casey Stengal.
Good riddance.
-- Nassau St Exp./Q11 Woodhaven wrote:
"Could be from QV and MCH once they start getting the Orion VII's in some there Orion V's can go to CS."
Since the matter of the Q32 being run entirely out of Casey Stengel is one of speculation, where the buses will come from is also a matter of speculation.
David
[If Casey Stengel entirely will operate q32....]
AFAIK, Casey doesn't have enough space to absorb the Hudson half of the Q32.
Most likely MJQ or MV would take over the Q32
why in the world would the Q32 go to manhattanville??????
I always wonder why is the Q32 split casey stengel has enough buses for the Q32?
Manhattanville is too far out to operate the Q32 by itself & count 126, Amsterdam & Mother Clara Hale out. As for the Q32, IF it really becomes one depot run by CS only:
a)Where will the other buses come from?
b)Will there be extra room at CS to handle it?
Nothing is solidified yet so don't jump to conclusions, remember in the MTA anything could happen.
The only way for CS depot to handle the entire Q32 is to move one or more CS routes to JA or QV.
Moving routes around is easy outside of Queens, because of "system picks" - drivers get to pick work across depots. The Queens Division ATU contract requires that EACH depot be treated as a separate and distinct operating authority, at all times and at all costs.
Yes, but routes changing depots in Queens is not easy at all since there are only 3 & they are all nowhere near each other. All the Queens depots are near capacity so this would be a mystery of making the Q32 all 1 depot. On weekends right now, it would probably work but its the weekday schedule that prevents it.
Why not have the Q32 completely at hudson pier or now at quill there is lots of room there.
[Why not have the Q32 completely at hudson pier or now at quill there is lots of room there?]
It was entirely at Hudson (and 54th Street before that) until the split. However, as BLX has noted, it's more efficient to have a split because the peak riding is TO Manhattan in the morning and FROM Manhattan in the evening. The all-Hudson schedules required a 10-minute headway from 5:00AM to 6:00AM in the WRONG direction just to get empty buses to Jackson Heights; the current schedule still starts service from Penn Station at 4:46AM (for the early railroad crowd), but also lets buses pull out directly to Jackson Heights (where they're truly needed).
How about moving the Q27 to QV? Since its close to that route.
First of all the MTA IS taking over all the queens privates. Thats old news already. Casey Stengel is WAY SHORT of buses already. I know someone that works there as a driver. They are in DESPERATE NEED of more buses. Let MCH give back all those 1 and 200s series buses that CS started with in the first place. once MCH gets there Orions 7s then CS will have enough to MAYBE handle ALL of the Q 32. Squash the idea of CS having the ALL of the Q32. Not happening. Not anytime soon. Theres NO space to keep all the orions unless they can get space elsewhere. Any ideas?
Maybe the Stengel run that go into the Bronx can be absorbed by a depot over there - The Q44 I think? That could open up some space and buses, Not sure how many buses would free up, How frequent is the Q44 (?) service, Q32 is a busy route and would need a lot of buses.
By the way - Anyone know the original reason reason for the split in the first place?
There's NO WAY THE Q32 WILL BE ALL ONION based! If anything, Pier's buses will go to MJQ. Perhaps MJQ will give up some of their routes to 100 St whenever it decides to open.
Other than that the Q32 will ALWAYS BE SPLIT.
I should consider that the Q27 should be a split between CS and QV.
What about the Q44? Should it be a split between CS and Coliseum? Or PERHAPS GH?
Maybe if that happened then the CS shortage will not be as much as it is now.
#5198 Q32
Doesnt Casey Stengel still have acess to the parking lot next door when theres no BASEBALL ?
[Doesn't Casey Stengel still have acess to the parking lot next door when theres no BASEBALL?]
That's irrelevant - the depot's fleet requirements wouldn't magically vanish when baseball is in season.
Forget about room for all the buses. The purpose of the OA/TA Q32 split was to cut down on the deadhead costs. For the a.m., Q32 is peak towards Manhattan. Pulling out of CS instead of buses going dark (OA term) from Manhattan to Jackson Hts. saves money. On the p.m. side, peak service is going to Queens, therefore Q32's pull out of Hudson instead of deadheading (TA term) from CS to Penn Station. More cost savings. On the issue of Queens depots each being a separate authority, that's true for seniority among the b/o's and dispatchers. They have depot seniority and are locked into that depot. However, mechanics and foreman have an annual system pick within the 3 Queens ATU represented depots. So on the maintenance side, it doesn't matter what equipment/models are used at each depot, they can jump yearly. Also, let's not forget that the Q44 was split between Jam & CS in the 90's and when the Jamaica Ave. 'EL' was being demolished, Jamaica & ENY depot shared the shuttle bus. Jam dispatchers worked the Queens end (TSO) and ENY dispatchers worked the Brklyn end (SSSA). BLX loves you. Also, from the personal experience of BLX, he never liked the RTS. It wasn't b/o friendly, especially that small window that the b/o needs to bend down and speak through. BLX enjoyed a big window for the b/o. Lets air in, speak to others in normalcy. BLX is out.
I have seen may Hudson buses deadheading down Northern Bld back to the city empty, I have also seen Stengel Orions deadheading on Madison Avenue back to Queens. It seems also that lately there are more Stengel buses on the Q32, Hudson seems to have cut back, In both rush hours (Back and Fourth) 9 out of 10 trips I take are with Stengel and I ride Q32 15 to 20 times a week.
Stengel is also using a lot of the Orion Suburbans on this route, which is awful during the rush hour as they take a while to load up because of the tight squeeze past those coach seats.
Sunday December 1, 2002
The Observer http://www.observer.co.uk
Stagecoach will take a £500 million hit to shrink its American bus
operations in a dramatic reversal of fortune for Brian Souter, the
transport company's controversial founder and chief executive. The
City is awash with speculation that Souter will take the company
private in 2003.
The US move, which will lead to thousands of job losses, and could
spark labour unrest, comes after a review of Coach USA, which has
been hit by stiff competition and dwindling profitability since it
was bought by Stagecoach for £1.2 billion in 2000.
Analysts say that the latest damage will be revealed when the group
publishes interim figures on Wednesday; profits will be wiped out by
the size of the Coach write-off, and the dividend will be slashed.
Souter built Stagecoach from scratch into Britain's largest bus and
train operator - but the company over stretched itself in the 1990s
after more than 70 acquisitions. It still runs more than 7,000 buses
on this side of the Atlantic as well as controlling South West
Trains; it also has a 49 per cent stake in Virgin Trains and owns a
bus company in Hong Kong.
Stagecoach was valued at nearly £4bn in 1999, but it has been forced
to scrap its imperial ambitions and concentrate more tightly on the
UK. Like other transport companies it has been affected by the global
economic slowdown. Last Friday, its stock market value had fallen to
just £200m.
Souter, whose family controls 24 per cent, has fallen out with
several of his senior executives including chief executive Mike
Kinski. Two years ago, the company was rocked by news that Barry
Hinkley, sent to the US to try and sort out Coach, had been arrested
for soliciting a male prostitute in Houston, Texas.
Hinkley resigned at a time when Souter was campaigning against the
repeal of legislation banning gay literature from Scottish schools.
His stance infuriated Scotland's liberal establishment.
Stagecoach wrote off half the value of its US business in 2001. This
week, it will confirm that Coach's charter, sightseeing and tour
operations will be closed or sold. But Souter will insist that the
commuter and long distance travel components of the US business are
worth keeping.
City investors are expected to welcome the news that Coach is being
scaled back and that Souter is to focus his energies on expanding
business in the UK. But they will also seek reassurances that the
company will not breach its banking covenants.
During the summer, Stagecoach said that there had been accounting
irregularities at Coach USA, which was audited by the same Houston
office of Andersen that was involved in the Enron scandal.
------------------------------------------------
http://abcnews.go.com/wire/Business/reuters20021130_297.html
Stagecoach to Cut Back U.S. Operations - Nov 30-02
— LONDON (Reuters) - The British bus and train operator Stagecoach
Group Plc is set to announce the sell-off of most of its American bus
operation in the coming week with a write-down of up to 500 million
pounds ($780 million), industry sources said on Saturday.
Brian Souter, the group's co-founder and acting chief executive, is
expected to wield the axe at Coach USA, the American bus operation it
bought in 1999 for 1.2 billion pounds ($1.86 billion), when he
reveals half-year results on Wednesday.
Souter is seen writing off goodwill of 500 million pounds from the
acquisition. Most of Coach USA's operations on the west coast of
America are earmarked for sale or closure. Analysts say Stagecoach is
unlikely to realize much more than 200 million pounds ($312 million)
from the disposals.
Souter, who founded the group in 1980, took over as chief executive
last July, and recent speculation has focused on whether he might
lead a management buyout and take the company private. The group has
consistently said it has not received any approaches for the company.
The group's share price had fallen to close at 18 pence on Friday,
valuing the group at 238 million pounds, from a price of over 260p in
1999.
A Stagecoach spokesman declined to comment.
http://www.forbes.com/work/newswire/2002/11/30/rtr810009.html (same
story different link)
The second article mentioned that most of Coach USA's West Coast operations will be put up for sale or closed. Anyone want to guess as how long it will take till they put the rest of their operations on the block? Will any other companies (i.e. Academy, Peter Pan come to mind right now) take over the Coach USA ops that operate line runs, such as Bonanza of Providence RI. If Peter Pan ended up acquiring Bonanza, that would give them Providence/Boston and Providence/NYC runs to compliment their already extensive Southern New England/NYC/Philly/DC routes. I hate to see any drivers, mechanics, other staff lose their jobs should Coach USA shutter any of it's operations if they can't sell or unload, but it looks like in my opinion they got too big too fast..
Mark
The second article mentioned that most of Coach USA's West Coast operations will be put up for sale or closed. Anyone want to guess as how long it will take till they put the rest of their operations on the block? Will any other companies (i.e. Academy, Peter Pan come to mind right now) take over the Coach USA ops that operate line runs, such as Bonanza of Providence RI. If Peter Pan ended up acquiring Bonanza, that would give them Providence/Boston and Providence/NYC runs to compliment their already extensive Southern New England/NYC/Philly/DC routes. I hate to see any drivers, mechanics, other staff lose their jobs should Coach USA shutter any of it's operations if they can't sell or unload, but it looks like in my opinion they got too big too fast..
Mark
Check out this story from today's Philadelphia Inquirer
Police stop bus after Taliban remark
The Greyhound driver, annoyed by passengers as he tried to avoid traffic, was charged.
By Wayne Parry
Associated Press
MARLBORO, N.J. - A frazzled bus driver responded to criticism of his roundabout route Saturday night by saying "I'm taking you to the Taliban," prompting a massive police response, authorities said.
The bus driver, Robert Mickens, 37, of Brooklyn, was charged with creating a false public alarm, Marlboro Police Capt. Brian Hall said. Mickens was expected to be released Saturday night on a summons.
Passenger Sally Weisbrot, 30, of Manhattan, said the New York-bound bus hit heavy traffic after leaving Philadelphia around 3:00 p.m., and the driver took several alternate routes to find less congested roads.
"People were angry and making fun of the driver, yelling 'Do you know what you're doing up there? Do you know where you're going?' He clearly was annoyed," she said.
Weisbrot said the driver then shot back: " 'I'm taking you to the Taliban.' "
She said the driver was only joking because he was upset, but some people panicked and called 911 on their cell phones. Within minutes, 18 police cars surrounded the bus and pulled it over, she said.
Passengers were told to get off the bus with their hands in the air and police officers had their guns pointed at the bus, said Dara Salcman, a passenger from Manhattan.
The 30 passengers were taken to to meet another bus, which departed at 8:30 p.m.
Jamille Bradfield, a spokeswoman for Dallas-based Greyhound, said the company was cooperating with the authorities.
People. Are. FUCKING STUPID!!!!!! And I don't mean the driver. I wish these people were taken to Nimco and shredded into human razor blades.
>>> I wish these people were taken to Nimco and shredded into human razor blades. <<<
I'm dialing my cell phone with the other hand as I type this. :-^)
Tom
do not use curse words on this website or david will remove you from it.
Where's that coming from?
And just exactly WHERE is a cussword in Old Tom's post?
He meant my post. I called those people "f'ing" stupid. I never knew of this new "no cursing" rule until Hudson reported it. It must have originated from posters at SubTalk as things get out of hand in there on a regular basis.
Why did you curse in the first place? Obviously, total immaturity. People such as yourself don't belong here, in my opinion - and surely in the opinion of the website host. Any mature, educated person can speak without cursing.
He made a mistake there is no need to hang him for it. It wasn't directed towards anyone in bustalk. Let it go.
Troy
Do you not understand?!!?!
Actually, most of the rules originated from serious wars here, which usually sparked up the same time Dave had a free second to look at what was going on. What usually goes down on Subtalk is something seriously out-of-whack with Saalam, who most of us ignore already.
BTW, wasn't this guy a poster here?
-Hank
He'll remove you if he feels like it. We're supposed to 'self-police' but that never seems to work out.
-Hank
It's that time of the year again...
All I can say is that passengers will take you there! I mean I've done something but I wouldn't go THAT far, not in today's world.
Regards,
Trevor Logan
The driver will probably lose his job and get a suspended sentence.
He is just lucky that none of the passengers was carrying a sidearm or other weapon.
I think this driver was streching a bit winding up in Marlboro on a trip from Philadelphia to New York. I agree with looking for altenates but getting that far east of the Turnpike/Rte1/Rte130 corridor would get a few passengers wondering where's he going. Greyhound drivers I trust know what there doing but any time saved just getting to a route that far east is no time saver to the original route. Marlboro gets all the shore traffic to contend with.
Ever been nagged by a back seat driver?
If you have, was it fun?
Would it have made you a better driver, made the trip any safer or faster?
How about being nagged by 20 or 30 backseat drivers - all at the same time? Would that be helpful?
Sure the driver was out of line for making that threat. But nobody here has repeated what any of the passengers had to say. I bet they came up with worse than the driver.
So - if the driver is liable for his behavior on the bus, why aren't the passengers?
>>> if the driver is liable for his behavior on the bus, why aren't the passengers? <<<
You already know the answer. The driver is paid to be there, the passengers are paying to be there. Who is easier for the bus company to replace?
Tom
I rode greyhound (the 9pm departure) from Port Authority down to Philadelphia last night. Three buses were still not enough to accomodate the whole crowd.....has anyone else traveled so far today...how has your trip fared?
Ok guys, what do you think is the worst bus model & the best model of NYCT buses since the advent of motorbuses. I would have picked the Grumman Flxibles b/c of constant breakdowns but since they were shipped out & didn't have a long tenure in NYC, I would say the Orions[the CNG's at JG however are in great shape] is the most inconsistent model of NYCT. I know they move people but they look like 'rectangular prisms', they break down a lot, they have problems in warm weather & the 1993's got repowered. Thats my opinion.
The best model I say are the GM New looks. Very durable, attractive, roomy on the inside, the back window and when they Blitzed them, looked even better and some of them lasted nearly THIRTY years now that's true quality.
Don't count the Grummans out. A batch of 100 lasted 18 years on the mean streets of Houston. They were pretty fast when they wanted to be and the last 35 were used on two of the busiets lines in Houston the 2-Bellaire and 65-Bissonnet and on some express routes up until their retirement.
When were they retired at Houston?
In late 1997. They were 18 years old.
The ones that went to NJTransit lasted to 2000. A few continued running around on the private carriers leased by NJTransit until 2001. That's about 21 to 22 years.
Wow! I didn't realize that; what private carriers were those? Go Grummans! Our 1979 model at the museum was restored at that time. Good to know some were still in regular service around then!
-F.
Two off the top of my head were Montgomery & Westside; and South Orange Avenue (not the 31 bus in Newark, but the Jersey City routes only).
Wait a minute....18? In 1997? I have heard from sources that their Grummans were 1979s; however, NYC's were 1980 models. So were they all originally Houstons circa 1979, or were some of them 1980s from NYC?
-F.
They wereall from Houston. 1979 + 20 = 1999 - 2 = 1997. Therefore they were 18 years old.
That's what I thought. I'll check omot.org to see if they are older or newer than ours (Valley Metro order, 9/79).
-F.
THANK you. Another believer!
-F.
I agree on the Fishbowl. However, I frown on trashing the Grummans. Sure, they had their problems as they were then a new design, but they lasted at NJT until they were 20 years old and stil had plenty of life left in them. And a restored example is still at NJT today.
-.
Two comments:
1. Without a doubt, the "new look" or the "fishbowl" was the best. The only improvement needed was the A/C unit and configuration, but the Blitz took care of that too!
2. The Grumanns were kept by the Queens privates until the mid 90's!! And without any refurbishes. Oh some of them were bad and were retired just at 12 yerars (life expectancy for a bus within the "Privates". But Jamaica Bus had them in service until the mid 90's,when QSC got their CNG's and transferred 18 TMC's (1993 models) to Jamaica Bus. And QSC had a number of them until 1994-1995.
Jamaica still had some of their Grumman's well into 2000. They mostly ran on the Q113 Ltd.
Were these part of the NYCTA/MABSTOA order? Just curious. And how long did Steinway keep theirs?
-F.
No, this was a separate order entirely - placed by NYCDOT. I'm not sure exactly when Steinway (now Queens Surface) got rid of their Grummans. I believe the bulk of them were replaced around 1994 by the 1994 TMC RTS. The few that was left was replaced shortly after the acquisition of the Orion Vs Suburbans in 1998 or after the acquisition of the Orion Vs Transit around 2000.
Hey, aren't there some that are still running for Jetway, Jetaway, or some odd thing?
The Orion CNGs (Queens Private Lines) do not provide much in terms of passenger comfort, they are loud, they are top heavy and tend to rock and bounce, they stop short and if you dont get a seat it can be an adventure. I also know that they tend to break down often, there is some kinf of safety control that sets off an alarm and they just stop dead (I have experienced this several times), Its ok if it happens on the street but not in the middle of the midtown tunnel or the 59th Street bridge.
(I
We have the same problems with them at LI Bus. The alarm usually goes off before/after the engine stalls.
CNG's are louder than diesel buses from my experience, and give a less comfortable ride, due to swaying from the tanks on top.
And you think QSC's are rough? Try the LI Bus 300s! Now those are rough!
Diesel buses are more reliable than CNG buses and I always prefer riding a diesel bus. But to please the tree huggers.....
The Orion CNGs (Queens Private Lines) do not provide much in terms of passenger comfort, they are loud, they are top heavy and tend to rock and bounce, they stop short and if you dont get a seat it can be an adventure. I also know that they tend to break down often, there is some kinf of safety control that sets off an alarm and they just stop dead (I have experienced this several times), Its ok if it happens on the street but not in the middle of the midtown tunnel or the 59th Street bridge.
(I have seen both)
The worst bus model I have ever seen is this abortion someone made from a Corgi GM fishbowl model and tried to make it into a Flxible.
They glued plastic onto the metal with the wrong kind of glue, and all the plastic is either falling off or warping.
They made the marker light out of what looks like broken matchsticks.
They made the drivers window out of a piece of plastic with electrical tape over it and NO details.
They made the air conditioner about twice as high and three times as long as it should be, with NO fan details.
They glued stuff on over silver paint, and of course, the moment it was handled it all fell off.
No names to be mentioned.....but they should give up modelling, and ESPECIALLY trying to SELL garbage like this thing.
i still wis road champs were making model buses..ah well. if anyone is interested, they are selling a orion V bus bank in new york colors on ebay. go to city bus and it is there.
#8755-M3-NOVABUS(yes i took the bus, too cold to walk)
On the morning of Thanksgiving I drove home to NYC and as usual I got off the NJ Turnpike at exit 14. As I approached the toll plaza I saw a bunch of buses in a parkinbg lot. Many of them were the RTS that Continental Airlines uses, but there were also several Red & White MAN articulated buses there as well. Anyone know what service these artics are providing???
Wayne
Those are probably the "new" order of former King County Metro (Seattle Washington) 1982 MAN SG-310 articulated buses that have been bought by Rutgers University. There are a bunch of pictures of these buses @ www.transitalk.org. They have been retrofitted with a/c and they also look very nice! Some are already in Rutgers University service with new New Flyer D60LFs.
[Those are probably the "new" order of former King County Metro (Seattle Washington) 1982 MAN SG-310 articulated buses that have been bought by Rutgers University... Some are already in Rutgers University service with new New Flyer D60LFs.]
The Seattle MAN artics arrived at the beginning of the 2001-2002 school year at Rutgers, pending the delivery of the new New Flyer artics (whose delivery was delayed until the beginning of the 2002-2003 school year). I believe all the Rutgers buses are owned by Academy and not Rutgers (except the NJDOT owns some of the 1000 series RTS buses, as these were also in service with HML prior to Sept. 2001). I have heard that Academy likes the MANs so much that it has kept some in Rutgers service even after the New Flyers arrived. Perhaps the MAN's Wayne saw have been taken out of Rutgers service. In any event, it sounds like the lot he saw is an Academy lot.
Does anyone know the ex KCMetro fleet #s of the Rutgers buses?
Holy crap they're following me!
I was born in Seattle in 1983, one year after they came on the scene there. The MAN artics were the first busses that I could recognize, and would shout something like, "look mommy, a MAN bus!" as one drove by. At first she thought I was talking about the bus driver, but I think I showed her the nameplate, right at the perfect height to be viewed from my carseat, while walking in downtown Seattle one day. I really only grouped the Metro busses into 3 groups, Bus Tunnel busses (bredas), the little ones (the non-artic MANs, and American General trolley busses), and the MAN Artics. I even had it to the point where I could tell the trolley and diesel busses from each other.
After a quick move to LA, my family once again packed up and headed for Chicago in the summer of '94. I think it was in 98 that the CTA got the MANs (MEN?)from King County metro.
Since the summer of 1998 I have lived in New Jersey, and now I learn that my MAN artics from my childhood in Seattle have followed me clear across the country! I guess I owe them a visit, after they've come so far to visit. Almost makes me wish I had picked rutgers as my college. Oh well, I got some friends up there, maybe they'll let me borrow a student ID...
Which depots will get these buses?
I know QV will be one of them.
Hopefully the Onion 7's will get rejected.
I'd rather get something from New Flyer rather than Grumman's 2nd Generation of these UGLY ONIONS!
#800 B61
Don't bet on that happening.The Orion 7's will be here wether you like it or not
WHOOPEE! More Onions! I need to get some hot dogs from Nathans to go with those Onions-LOL!
Onions = More junk for our streets.
#2854 X63
Now you're seriously starting to piss me off!Give me 3 damn reason's why you hate the Orion's so much.Just be happy that they get you from PointA-PointB just like any other bus and let that be the end of it!
If you don't like the Orions,pack your bag's and move somewhere else where you'll NEVER see an Orion ever for the rest of your life!
Damn,I'm transit buff,I love the buses and subway's alot,but I'm not THAT MUCH of a buff to say I hate a certain bus model or train type. Yeeeeeshhhh!! I'm happy the buses get me to where I'm going,I don't care if it's the ugliest thing I've ever seen,if it get's me to where I'm going,well I'd say that's a one fine day!
1. Don't like the way they look. They're shoeboxes with wheels.
Dull-looking to me.
2. Don't like the way they ride-especially the repowers-sound horrible.
3. Remind me of the Grumman Days-cheaply made and have so many problems.
I'll ride them if I have to and I agree as long as they get you from A to B then I'm a happy camper.
That's why I like JBL and NYBS-No Orions.
They're all over the place. Triboro has Orion Suburbans on all of their local lines. And look at their condition. UGLY!
Question is where are their RTS?
And trust me if I had the money, I'd definitely move out of the City.
#5198 Q32
You're in serious need of a reality check.The Orion's look better and run better than an RTS anyday.They look very nice all around IMO.Hope you havn't been to SI.SI is Orion Country.Nothing but Orions all over SI with very few exception's on the S79 and rarely on the S61.Look,my point is just be happy that they get you from one place to another.To hell with everything else about them,the fact that they get you to place's is the most important thing of all.
Here's something that will make you very happy. I rode 6365 on the M1 tonight and was very impressed with it. It is a mixture of an LI Bus with a C40LF. Every stop was spoken: East 56 Street, East 58 Street etc etc. Even when you rang the bell, that was spoken: STOP REQUESTED! 2 things I did not like:
1. High step up near the rear.
2. Those funky-looking windows.
I can honestly say the Onion brought a tear to my eye but in a good way. I hope to see more of these soon. ;)
PS Yes I have been to SI and yes I've rode their Orions as well.
Orions (Onions) are getting better as the years go on.
#6365 M1
#6335 S61
The MTA should not be spending money on frivilous bells and whistles like talking buses.
I am a big gadget nuut but, the taliking buses will become very irritaing very soon.
I rather see the mta spend money on automatic bus monitoring. A sweet little system can be pu together using 811.b wi-fi equiptment which will both give the mta better info on bus timing and reduce costs. Plus the system can be expandable when the moeny becomes available for such things as how long is the next bus from you current bus stop.
Irritating? uhhh hello,they're there to help passenger's.If anything,those automated announcement's are for a very good cause more than being irritating,add the fact that I find them anything BUT irritating.
The only time I remember hearing "Stop Requested" being said on a bus was when I went to Daytona Beach on vacation 2 years ago and the 35ft RTS buses had automated announcement's and it also said that when the tape to request a stop was pressed.Those are the type of buses I absoultely LOVE!! I wish they were on those New Flyer buses out of JG.
It would've been SO COOL!I had the chance to see the main intersection's announced plus the date and time shown on those same type of buses that are out of JG in Miami last year. But damn,the only thing I didn't like about them was the air conditioner's.Those buses would be FREEZING!
Yeah, the New Flyers in JG could sure use it, lately in the past 2 weeks I've been on quite a few buses that had malfunctioned "STOP REQUESTED" signs. One bus had the SR sign on even when the front doors opened, a few didn't light up when pressed and a few had NEITHER! I had to go through the front door so the driver doesn't skip my stop.
The Orions run better than an RTS? Running their way into retirement at an early age, yes.
I honestly don't know why so many of you think the RTS is a horrible bus. Ergonomics and torpedo shape aside, it has proven time and time again that it can outperform ANY bus out there with just basic maintenance.
I agree with you, the RTS is one of the most dependable buses to EVER run on NYC streets [I say the GM New looks is the best], I don't know how a Orion outperforms a RTS, it just DOESN'T! The problem is the MTA is junking the earlier RTS's too early IMO, and I still believe that scrapping earlier RTS's; the 1984 GM's particularly was a bad mistake.
Love them or REALLY dislike them, barring any problems, they're coming whether you like it or not so deal with it. New Flyer is supposed to be building another batch of Artics but it is unknown when they are going to come.
It doesn't bother me whether they come or not. Ridgewood, Maspeth, Glendale, and Middle Village will remain RTS exclusive, except for the Orions you see on Queens private routes.
I hope they push those 4600's and 4700's out of Brooklyn as soon as possible. I hope I can see this happen before I go into bootcamp. :(
Sorry Ridgewood but other than JG, don't count on any other Brooklyn depot to get any other bus model other than the RTS. Right now, the 4600's/4700's are the rock of FP so they can't scrap them until more new buses start coming in.
BTW, good luck in bootcamp.
I know that. Thats why I said the word "exclusive". But when the Orion7 goes to Gleason. QV, and MCH, I'll be waiting for the fleet changes. Fresh Pond is short on buses, only 243. Nothing will be touched until the fleet changes occur, that is, whenever the hell the Orion7 gets to NYC.
i can definately see the #8500's at JG sent over to UP once the orion V arrive, and hopefully some of the 8400's over to FP, but one can only hope.
i can definately see the #8500's at JG sent over to UP once the orion VII arrive, and hopefully some of the 8400's over to FP, but one can only hope.
Has anyone been in the transit gift shop at Grand Central and seen there are no rts bus bank there. I was there on Saturday and there were about 5 of then left and with Christmas days away. Does that mean bye to these rts bus banks. I hope.
Can't speak for the store but if you want RTS buses check out Royal Coach's website - www.royalcoachbuses.com.
Also there is the F&J Models website.....Don't know the address but a search engine will find it.......
Disclaimer - I am in no way connected with either site.
Sinmce the year is almost over are the orion 7 the only new buses coming to New york before 2003?
Where are the new flyer that was coming to Jackie Gleason or is GJ stuck with them boring a** rts buses.
Where are my artic buses at. Those are my favorite buses even if they are very slow. Are they begin built and will any new one be on New york city ground before 2003?
I hope 2003 more depot remove some of these rts buses.
Brooklyn is the city with the most of these rts buses. Haven't you guy notice that?
Out of all the rts bus I like the 5000 series before they get a paint job.
I don't get mta repainting the outside and the inside look nasty. Very interesting.
I understand that the TA plans to extend the B-13 route to serve Gateway Mall via the city streets Seaview Ave,Erskine Street and Vandalia Avenue.
How about extending the B-20 route as follows:
1-Current service between Fresh Pond Road and the GMF will be retained as is and remain in Fresh Pond Depot
2-The Broadway-East New York Station trips which are currently operated by East New York weekdays and Fresh Pond weekends will be rerouted from Wortman Ave/Ashford Street to Gateway Mall via Wortman Ave,Fountain Avenue,Seaview Ave,Erskine Street and return. This service will be designated a different route say B-22 and be operated from East New York Depot.
Pros and cons of this change as follows
1-Current B-20 service between Broadway/E New York Station and Wortman Ave/Ashford Street will be retained by both the B-20/B-22 routes.
2-Service to the industrial area along Wortman Ave between Ashford Street and Fountain Avenue will be restored. This was served by the B-83 prior to the B-83 being rerouted to Starrett City
3-The new B-22 will provide B-6 and B-83 passengers a transfer to Gateway Mall.
4-No additonal buses will be needed for this service change.
5-The cost factor should not change or if any thing a slight increase may result. However this change will be offset by new ridership that will ride the system.
6-There will be a reduction on B-20 service between Wortman Ave/Ashford Street and the GMF but passengers will be able to use the new B-22 and transfer to the B-13 to complete their trip.
Any commnets
Thank You
This might be a 'silly' question but where is Gateway located again?? Thanx for the info.
It takes up a hugh plot of land bordered by Flatlands Ave. to the North, Belt Pkwy. to the south, Fountain Ave. to the East and I forgot the name of the street to the west, but it is about a block or 2 east of Van Siclen Ave. (using Flatlands Ave only).
Also, there was a brand new exit constructed from the Belt Parkway; Exit 15-Erskine Ave/Gateway Mall
Thanks I forgot the exact location. The street on the west is Erskine St I believe.
I am back
This is the information you wanted
Northern Border: Vandilla Av
Southern and Western Border: Gateway Dr **(only in Gateway boundries) the original street name is Seaview Ave. That portion only exist east of Eskine St
Eastern border: of course Eskine St
Thanks for the location. Wow, I didn't think Gateway was THAT big. As for buses serving the area, more than 1 bus line is needed, maybe extending the B82 or the B20, lots of possibilities.
I feel that they should extend something from Starett City, maybe the B83.
That looks like a better option than the B82, which is already too long. The B14 and B20 could be extended as well.
I think the B82 is perfect. This gives riders from SW Bklyn to get to the mall(being that it is an east-west bus route). Also I think the B14 should be extended to the mall as well.
"Showing Disdain to the House of Pain."
I have it from very high sources from the DOB. The B-6 nor the B-82 are being extended to Gateway Mall
The reason both lines are too long already
Thank You
If you reroute the B82 to the mall from Flatlands/Pannsylvania, it is probably the same distance as to Starrett City. During mall hours most B82 can go to the mall and late nights all B82s go to Starrett City. Let see what happens. The first step is to get that B13 to the mall. (Which BTW, you have another way of getting in from Flatlands Ave side.)
"Showing Disdain to the House of Pain."
7 More Days to Go.
The B-82 is not going to Gatway Mall
1-Its too long
2-Most B-82 passengers on the east end of the line want to go to Starrett City. What happens to them?
Thank You
Im surprised no one has started an dollar van service yet as a shuttle yet .Possible illegal gravy with all the workers and shoppers taking that very long walk ( in the roadway mind u ) from and to the Flatlands entrance . Its a dangerous walk because vehicles speed along that strip , its not very well lit and i saw all these kids walking in the roadway with their back to the traffic playing and joking not knowing the danger there in .
Was at Boulder Creek with some friends Friday night & did a little shopping at Target before.
One of the group said "they" don't want to extend the bus service because "those" people could get here. I responded, but "those" people work here.
Anyhow, I think it's just common since to provide bus service to the mall.
Barry:
Reread my post. I said most B82s can go to the mall during mall hours. Lets say every third B82 can go to the mall. Paasengers that are on a Gateway bound B82 and wants to go to Starrett City can still change to the B83 at Van Siclen-Flatlands Aves. Late night when the mall is closed, then all B82s can go to Starrett City.
Although I wouldnt mind the B83 going to the mall as well. I think it would be too roundabout if it goes via the Belt Pkwy. I like your B22 idea as well.
The people in Starrett City will scream bloody murder.
It is not going to happen. Period
The core ridership of the B-82 is Starrett City residents. Why would you want to reroute the buses.
And what happens if you use your transfer to the B-82 from the L Line you have to transfer again.
The B-82 is a top ten ridership route in Brooklyn. While in my opinion it was one of the greatest mistakes by the TA in creating this line an even greater mistake is to reroute it to Gateway Mall.
Thank You
To SubBus, sorry but Barry is right the B82 would become extra longer than it already is and I agree with him. Just creating the route was a mistake imagine making it even LONGER. The B83 would be a better option but I don't know if 83 riders would want that either.
This is TA were talking about. Anything can happen. You cant stop the shining..........
It will appear in the Summer Pick
Details to follow
I am in the process of updating my OLD pages
==
Probably over the next few months---updated to November 2002
--as soon as i can access a computer on a regular basis!!!
I did offer that other fellow---Bus Guy or something,,he has NOT answered my letters,,I offfered to update his material for him
Steve
FDNY
I was wondering what happened to your web page, smokiecat?
Michael
Washington, DC
X1 X6 X7 X9 Route changes for the holidays thru Jan. 5, 2003.
Staten Island bound only via 7th ave. 42nd st. 5 av. and regular.
M20 Battery Park City
Implementation date Jan. 2003, to affect the northern section.
North bound via North on West St. West on Murray St. North on North end Ave. and East on Chambers to normal route.
South bound via West on Chambers St. South on North end Ave. East on Vesey St. and South on West St. to normal route.
Manhattan weekend closure of Manhattan bridge and the Q BMT service.
Implementation of weekend service revision on April 27th, 2003, to Nov. 1, 2003.
On weekends only which includes 12:01am Saturday to 5:00am Monday, the Q BMT will operate via the Montaque St. tunnel and lower Manhattan, making all regular stops along the Brighton Line in Brooklyn and the Broadway Line in Manhattan, will make all local stops between Dekalb Ave. and Canal St. station, same as R BMT and W BMT. Then will run express between Canal St. and 57th St./7th Ave.
Grand St. shuttle between W. 4th St. and Grand St.
Implementation May, 2003.
Will run one train every 15 minutes instead of two trains every 12 minutes.
Revision of weekend schedules for the IRT 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, and 6, including minor service increases and decreases thoughout the weekend.
Durning early mornings, evenings and late nites, there will be no decrease in schedule services.
Barry, why don't you just extend the current B20 route and let it run with the B13 the rest of the way from the GMF to Gateway [the 13 could use some help too since it has poor headways].
Your thought of a split is not a bad idea but simply extending the 20 is probably more simpler. I think I get what you are saying you're saying that the 20 should just have 2 terminals [Fresh Pond Rd to GMF no more short trips to/from B'way Junction] and the current 20 trips from B'way Junction to the GMF should be incorporated into this new route the B22 as you call it.
If I'm not mistaken, this is how it would look:
B20-Fresh Pond Rd to GMF
B22-B'way Junction[this eliminates the short trips on the 20] to Gateway Mall
Since were on the Gateway subject, why not extend the B82 via Seaview Av to Gateway since 1 bus going there would look very silly BUT the B82 would probably have to be split [by bringing the B50 back] and a new LTD service would have to be created, a plan similar to the Q20/Q44 by having all 82's as LTD's. Would make LTD stops from CI Av to Flatlands/Williams Av or Pennsylvania/Vandalia Av then all stops to Gateway. B50's run from CI Av to Starrett City; like before it was combined, all times except nights and late nights all B82's terminate at Starrett City.
Comments. Criticism. Compliments. Holla back.
1. Barry doesn't work for MTA or NYCT and thus is not able to extend any NYCT bus routes -- he's got some good ideas, but he's not an official of any kind.
2. Gateway Mall management isn't very amenable to public transportation being on their property -- typical of mall managements. Whatever happens, will happen only with their cooperation.
David
David,
1. I already know that Barry doesn't work for the MTA but he does bring up some good ideas.
2. The owners of Gateway are making absolutely no sense in not allowing public transportation to go there. They should realize that this is NOT the suburbs where am majority of residents own at least 1 car.
Of course they're making no sense,they're stupid just like every other mall owner out there.People who don't drive and don't have any relative's that can take them there gotta get there somehow,and that's by the bus.Hmmm....maybe if we file a multi million dollar lawsuit just for not allowing public transportation into the mall, they might finally cut the crap and allow buses in there.
As I said previously, this isn't the damn suburbs where a majuority of the people have cars. This place looks like it will close at 8pm, this is NYC, its these out of state asses who most likely don't know shit about big cities and how malls run out here. They could very well make buses go there, extend buses like they did for Kings Plaza in the early 70's; and a few bus extensions it will happen eventually. Why is the guy making such a beef about it, is he afraid it will become "too urban" or something, there's lots of space out there, I don't see a valid excuse for this moronic stuff like blocking buses. Lest see how long it takes before the owners srart crying for shoppers.
I don't know about that. While I definately agree with your feelings about the out of state asses, I've been at Gateway once so far and believe me it is DISGUSTINGLY jam packed.
Whether it will continue to be this way, I don't know, but I know personally, if I couldn't get there by public transportation and I don't have a car, I would not patronize the mall.
The place is packed to the rafthers all the time.
Any shoping center with a Bj's and a home depot will always be packed. Many shopper flooding Gateway plaza previouly drove to suburban malls to reach these stores.
People on this board forget that there is a large population in southeastern queens and brooklyn who have cars and previouly had to drive great distance to access these stores
Buses will eventually be extened to the shopping center but if they are not the shopping center will thrive without them.
It took me 15 to get a parking spot when i went out in the begining of november on a tuesday afternoon
Please stop playing the "class" card. It is not an issue to a shopping center. If you spend $$$ you are welcome
I'm NOT playing the "class" card, the point is they could attract even more people if they extend bus routes. If people who don't have cars want to go ther but they have no one to drop them there, there should be efficient public transportation. You're not seeing the whole picture, you could say that b/c you have a car, now lets say you didn't have a car, you had no one to drop you off there & the only choice is public transportation [right now the B13], ok then so don't accuse me of playing the class card.
will become "too urban"
I aplogize for attaching you too this statement
"its these out of state asses who most likely don't know shit about big cities and how malls run out here"
Gateway plaza was developed by the related compaines which is the developer of AOL Time Warner Center up at columbus circle plus dozens of other projects across NYC.
"You're not seeing the whole picture, you could say that b/c you have a car, now lets say you didn't have a car, you had no one to drop you off there & the only choice is public transportation [right now the B13], ok then so don't accuse me of playing the class card."
Growing up in brooklyn my mother did not drive. we took the bus everywhere lugging large packages at time.
In addition I went to college out at stonybrook on long island and did not have a car. I took the bus over to smith haven mall on sufolk transit. They have the worst busues.
I am one of the few on this board who does see the whole picture. I have seen both sides of the fense. There are far too many people on this board who bash anyone who worked hard to get a car. If you would just read this board you would think anyone who drives is a rich jerk.
>>"I am one of the few on this board who does see the whole picture. I have seen both sides of the fense. There are far too many people on this board who bash anyone who worked hard to get a car. If you would just read this board you would think anyone who drives is a rich jerk."<<
All I'm saying is that it is not fair to people who don't have a car and must rely on only 1 bus for such a huge mall. Don't worry, I'm not bashing you b/c you have a car but the mall owners could attract even more shoppers, especially people who live around the area. I apologize if you got offended by saying you didn't see the whole picture..
[The owners of Gateway are making absolutely no sense in not allowing public transportation to go there. They should realize that this is NOT the suburbs where am majority of residents own at least 1 car.]
1. Brooklyn may not be the suburbs, but the owners put Gateway next to a highway in order to attract suburbanites.
2. Mall owners are generally hostile to public transportation. Think about it: have you ever tried to carry lumber or a television on the bus? (Yes, low-wage employees need to get there, too, but mall owners like to ignore their needs.)
3. There have been enough threads on BusTalk about transit access to malls. One more won't change things.
David,
I believe i mentioned that i am not an TA or MTA worker and never claimed that i worked for the agencies now.( I did many many years ago as a temporary emplyoee however)
I appreciate your good words and i thank you for them. I also appreciate you bringing my ideas to your bosses and i hope it does not get you into trouble.
Please keep up your outstanding work
Thank You
So you're saying the B20 should go from Ridgewood to Gateway(and vice-versa). That would be good for the people riding between Bway and Gateway, but pointless for the Bushwick/Ridgewood residents, because they don't really need another bus for Gateway. The B20 should stay the same. Let the B22 run between Bway Junct. and Gateway, like if it were the ENY branch of the B20 except it goes to Gateway.
I said the B20 should just be extended to Gateway via the B13 the rest of the route & leave it as is and not split the route. However, I followed up Barry's suggestion that the 20 be split by basically eliminating the short trips on the B20 & creating the B22 from B'way to Gateway. The B20 would run from the GMF/General Mail Facility to Ridgewood, & NO more short trips to B'way, since this would cause surplus buses.
I have from very high sources in the Department of Buses the following information
1- The B-13 will be the first route to be extended to Gateway Mall
2- That the following routes WILL NOT BE EXTENDED into Gateway
These are the B-6 and the B-82. The reason is that both routes are too long already.
3- The TA is looking at extending the B-20 and the B-83 with the B-83 being extended from Starrett City to Gateway via the Belt Parkway.
another possibility is the B-14. I hope that David shows his bosses may proposed B-20/B-22 routes.
4-I know that the DOT will not be extending any DOT Command or Green Line buses because of lack of funding.
Thank You
>>"1- The B-13 will be the first route to be extended to Gateway Mall"<<
That's obvious.
>>"2- That the following routes WILL NOT BE EXTENDED into Gateway
These are the B-6 and the B-82. The reason is that both routes are too long already."<<
Especially the B6 and the B82 MIGHT have been able to go if it had a LTD stop service.
>>"3- The TA is looking at extending the B-20 and the B-83 with the B-83 being extended from Starrett City to Gateway via the Belt Parkway.
another possibility is the B-14. I hope that David shows his bosses may proposed B-20/B-22 routes."<<
You have to have more than 1 bus to serve such a large mall so obviously so it makes sense to extend these routes. It would be intersting if they actually consider your proposal.
>>"4-I know that the DOT will not be extending any DOT Command or Green Line buses because of lack of funding."<<
Plus they don't have a adequate fleet for that possibility and what Command bus are you going to extend? Unless people are willing to pay $3 for a express bus or if they create a new local bus line, other than that the DOT has no chance in doing so.
Any word on when exactly this might happen? I'd like to be able to go visit that mall someday
Hope this works!
"<"imgsrc="http://homepage.mac.com/joepcc699/.Pictures/MSBA387Pixels600.jpg">"
You need a space between the img and the src and omit the quotes around the HTML tag. Nice pic though!
Flowers will bring joyous tears to a woman's eye. Well in this case so do Onions.
Great pic Joe! I like the scenery around the Onion.
#387 N20
Nice pic! That scene just looks perfect with the flowers & lawn, and the bus looks attractive and the pic is crystal clear :-).
Thank you! That's the way I like to take them - years of experience, practice makes better. It's at the north end of Routes 48/49 at the Jericho Quad.
Whatever camera you had, it showed a very good pic. The experience must of paid off.
Thank you. Your comment was most appreciated. 45 years of experience. The camera was a Minolta Maxxum 7, normal lens. Most important thing in taking any photo is composition; framing a subject is my "thing."
That is a great picture. I've never seen an Orion with those type of front doors. They are reminicent of the Flxible Metro front doors. I had some pictures taken of me when I was on my last shift driving for Shuttle UM back in 1994. One of my favorites, which I cannot find is with me at the left front corner of my 30' Flx Metro, so you can see the front and the whole side, plus it was nearing sunset, so the sun was beaming off the front destination sign, but you can still see that it said "College Park Metro Station".
Yes - Those doors (4-leaf) are something LI Bus speced on their all of their newest buses which happen to be CNG Orion 05.501 I'm often curious as to why LI Bus chose this type of door. I imagine at least most of the B/O's were usewd to it from their days of operating the Grumman 870 and Flxible Metro.
Wayne
Thanks, Wayne! I didn't realize that the front doors could be spec'd differently.
Sure thing! When NYCTA got their Orion 5.501 buses with w/c lifts in the rear door (a move I think is typical NYCTA - plain ridiculous) - I knew just about anything was possible.
Wayne
Oh yes. Ever seen the CTA 1995 Flx Metros? Custom spec all the way!
-F.
Is that over by the LIE near exit 40-41? I recognize that building before. Nice pic though! You should really submit these pics to a bus website. I'm sure they will take it...it's too good to pass up.
Way to go Joe! Nice photo; the scenery was a nice touch. I'd love to see a similar pic of one of WMATA's Flx Metros.
-F.
Hi,
The picture didn't show up in the post, but certainly kudos to you for taking a clear, nicely set up picture of the Orion.
I'm sure that's a picture we'll see in print; it's that well laid out!
Thanks,
Mark Valera
Mark -
Read the post from WMATAGMOAGH in this thread. Joe's photo is there and it's a beauty.
Wayne
Thank you; I sincerely appreciate your comment. This was the first time I tried to post directly and didn't do it correctly. However, another BusTalker corrected it for me, for which I thank him, and you can then view it thru him. Hopefully, next time I 'll do the correct encoding.
Hey, Bustalkers!
What do your thoughts on express buses going to Long Island?
NO NO and NO. You have LIB if you want bus service to LI. And you have lousy Onions for that.
I'd rather ride the M7 on LIRR than those Onions-ugh!
#7012 LIRR
It would be kind of difficult since you have only one limited access highway (the LIE) that allows commercial traffic. Furthermore, Long Island's highways, biways and main roads are disgustingly traffic clogged during the rush hours.
Now that I think of it, doesn't Hampton Jitney offer commuter service from Long Island to different parts of the city? If this service does exist and anyone has experienced it, please comment on what you think of the service.
Thank you.
[...doesn't Hampton Jitney offer commuter service from Long Island to different parts of the city?]
Both Hampton Jitney and Hampton Express market their services to affluent Manhattanites who (1) have second homes in the Hamptons and (2) look down their noses at the LIRR because it resembles the subway.
That's sort of what I thought as I've always seen Hampton Jitney buses on the Upper East Side. Perhaps - The Hampton Jitney is "acceptable" for these folks because they know it's unlikely that they'll find any non-affluent folks on this bus.
Wayne
those buses were on ch 11 news with larry hoff this summer. they are unlike any other buses with immaculate interiors and possibly even a bar. definitely for the very affluent.
Is the br.55x still limited and merry chrismas to everyone.
You're 24 days too early buddy. Happy Holidays!
And it's BX55 LIMITED!
Yes it's still LIMITED!
#5507 bx55
They haven't called it the BX55X (or BX55 Express) in many years. It has changed over the years ... Buses now operate both north and south along Third Ave, 161st Street-River Ave service eliminated, no longer operates 24/7 and is now very much like any other bus route in that there's now free bus-subway transfers for all routes and you can transfer to the BX55 from other bus routes (and vice-versa).
Wayne
The county executive and council are having their inauguration at my school today (Richard Montgomery HS) The school was under heavy police guard, with traffic being diverted, etc. At about 12 PM, I spotted 2 chartered Ride-on busses pulling into my school's driveway. One of them was 5809 and the other was 58xx. Both of them displaying "INAUGURATION". I've heard that they're taking the band of the inauguration to lunch at mcdonalds sponsored by Doug Duncan. However, I saw 58xx departing empty, being that the inauguration is ending at 1:30, i suppose that it might come back with even more chartered busses. (I'm typing from my software Apps class, 1:10)
Maybe one of them was 5814, since it wasn't on the 37 as it normally is this morning. Instead, 5801 (Orion VI/CNG) was there (although on the other run, the one time it wound up on my run, I didn't have my camera).
might be, I was informed that the busses weren't for the band but for the councilmen.
Is Ride-On still running Flxibles? All I ever hear about anymore is Orions.
-F.
Ride-On has 4 Flxible Metro-Ds which were originally up in Baltimore. Considering there are only 4 Flxibles in the whole fleet, the odds are against any of us seeing them alot. The Metro-Bs on the 92, 36, and some other routes were WMATA Flxibles in Ride-On livery, so I don't ocunt those. They have since returned to WMATA routes.
I thought there were a whole lot of Flxes at Ride-On, including the 5100-series Metro B 30-footers? Obviously returned to WMATA, I guess.
What vintage are the transplanted Baltimores?
-F.
The ex MTA's are 1993's.
That's what I thought; I recall them having 93s. I think the WMATA units were 89s...were they redone in the new WMATA livery when returned from Ride-On? And were any overhauled?
-F.
They probably were overhauled. You're right, the WMATA 30' Flx's are from the late 80's. There are several in the old livery stored at the Arlington Division by my apt. They were used on the SmartMover shuttles that operated in Tysons Corner, routes 14T and 14W. Even though they are used on other routes now that those two were discontinued, they still advertise the SmartMover.
The Flx Metros for Ride On look really cool in their colors. They seem to look longer than WMATA's. I think its due to the lack of advertising. For whatever reason when I see a bus with an ad on the side, it looks shorter than one without an ad.
This is very true, especially on "baby wrap" buses; those make our 35-foot Gilligs look almost like 30-footers! Optical illusion for sure.
I loved the Ride-On colors on the baby Metros, especially in night photos; the side graphics looked almost purple.
Say, did Ride-On ever serve parts of VA? It would be really neat to have one of those 30' Flxes in those colors at our museum, if space and operating cost allowed. The only catch is that we only collect transit vehicles operated in Virginia; that is the only reason we have a WMATA AM General in our historic fleet.
-F.
Yeah, it was cool seeing the WMATA Flxs in Ride On colors. For awhile, they were stored at the Montgomery garage and I'd make a special trip by there when I could just to see them in the lot.
Ride Ons only go into a little part of DC around Friendship Heights. I'm sure they've been in VA on charters. I actually recall seeing a bunch of them by the Pentagon after 9/11, but they don't serve any stops in VA. They could potentially do a trip to the Tysons area if WMATA and Ride On were to coordinate some type of service to mimick the Purple Line and make it an addition to the current Smart Mover, but I doubt that would happen. I'm not sure if there are regulations the local gov't. buses have to follow, like interstate travel, except for emergencies.
Too bad you couldn't get anymore of the old WMATA classics before they disappeared. Maybe you can get an 8700 or 8800 Flx Metro when they start to retire and sell those!
Oddly enough, most were overhauled before going into the Ride On livery. When they came back, they were just repainted in the new livery, with some minor fixes and taillight replacemtents.
The Ride-On Metro Bs were never in Ride-On hands, they just operated on Ride-On routes but were driven by WMATA drivers from Montgomery Division.
My family and I went to Tuckahoe for Thanksgiving. We went across the Throgs Neck Bridge (ugly and the Whitestone wasn't even better). Anyways, he's what I saw:
An Orion 05.501 on the Q13 or Q16 as I was crossing over Fort Totten Av on the Cross Island Pkwy (Clearview Expwy wasn't much better either)
#1621 - BxM7
#8051 - Bx30 (not repowered)
#9246 - Bx30
#302 - QBx1
#5391 - Bx12
NO WESTCHESTER BUSES! They were not running. Found that out on their website the next day.
Pass by the Gun Hill Bus Depot and saw the Orions up front like they were special or something. Also notice the bunch of Articulateds in the front and I saw NO RTS-06 buses in the lot. Must be in the back on inside the garage. I also saw the New York Bus Service Depot for possibly the last time. I'll post a story about the NYBS and me later this week.
That's all.
Enjoy!
I could never understand why Westchester suspends their bus service on Thanksgiving Day and Christmas Day. At least operate the heavier routes. It may very well be for budgetary reasons, and I have a partial answer for that.
On President's Day (Holiday), Westchester operates a regular weekday schedule, and most of their buses are running near-empty. Why not operate a Saturday Schedule. With the savings, maybe they could operate a limited service on Thanksgiving & Xmas.
Anyone hear anything new on the New York Bus situation? It's hars to imagine them packing it in. There will be no other Company like them...clean equipment, passenger service, dependability, employees that care, and a tight ship...all for a price (per hour) considerably less than the MTA or NYCT can provide.
According to a state government official, Mayor Bloomberg is crossing his fingers that the MTA will pick it up. He agreed with me that this is not the way to go, since the MTA is not in good financial shape right now and is reorganizing. There may be some other things going on, but I won't pop the lid on that until it's confirmed.
Theres a rumor at my garage going around saying that Academy may take it over.
Im kinda curious what is everyone's favorite bus model(im talking about what is out there you can buy, whether in ho,o or any other scale). These are my favorite:
1-HO Scale Flixible(Made by Road Champs).
2-HO scale RTS buses(shame they only made 2 varieties).
3-Corgi GMC NYC Bus(the blue model).
4-HO Scale GMC New look.
5-HO Scale GMC old look(made by a company called APM).
my question is this: how come nobody decided to make a orion V in ho scale? In china, they made the RTS model, but didnt make a Grumman bus, also as road champs did. they made Flixible Metro and Eagle 05, but not RTS buses. wonder why?
I like the Classic GM RTS-2 (Both Flat And Angled Back) Hot Wheels "Rapid Transit" c1982 In LA RTD Logos And Colors
Yeah...I love those. Quite better looking than the more common yellow School Bus version! I used to customize those into 40-footers and put Alcoas on them back when I was 12 or 13.
-F.
I'm not sure what I ate the other night, but for whatever reason I had a dream that I got a Hot Wheels RTS bus in NJT colors at a hobby store. I woke up thinking, "WHAT????!!!"
I have an Orion V bank in NYCT colors that I love, also have several of the Road Champs Flx Metros.
I think my all time favorite is a resin model Flx Metro that I purchased from Royal Coach several years ago. It looks like a Flx Metro E.
Yes...I have that one! Once again, a very pliable model. I converted mine to a 35' Grumman 870; I angled the rear to the right 85 degree angle, smoothed the front panel and side windows, and lowered the front suspension to correct ride height. I then painted it to match our restored 1979 Grumman from Valley Metro (Roanoke, VA).
I hope to launch pics of this baby soon.
-F.
Very cool. Its been great that there were finally transit vehicles to collect. I was a very frustrated kid growing up not being able to find anything buy school buses and Greyhound type buses. It was a wonderful thing when the Hot Wheels RTS came out. I have one or two in storage someplace along with the hundreds of other Matchbox and Hot Wheels cars I had.
Very cool. I always wanted a Grumman Flxible model when I was younger; after many failed attempts at making one (including a drawn cardboard body on a fire engine) I finally discovered the Road Champs model in 1996. If only it came out when I was little!
A neat side note: in the early 1980s, a man here in town named Bev Fitzpatrick made an HO scale resin model of 35 and 40-foot Grumman 870s. I first saw one of these in our TA's livery when I was 5 years old and immediately fell in love with the model. He made about 50 of these and still has a few around. You should see them...very impressive stuff.
-F.
id love to see the guy's work-email me a picture??
I don't have any pics but will hopefully take some soon.
-F.
I've had strange bus model dreams myself. In 1981, when I was 4 years old, I dreamt I was in day care, assembling a plastic model of a Trailways MCI bus, only it was molded in light blue and white, much like a toy MCI that I carried with me all the time (I think it was an MC-9?). Anyhow, someone was yelling at me for something or other while I was trying to glue this thing together, and then I woke up.
Weird, huh? :)
-F.
Hey...you know those neat 1:18 scale diecast versions of all the regular line cars they've done (i.e. the '69 Charger, VW Bus, Honda Civic coupe, Twin Mill, etc.)? If only they would do the same with the slopeback RTS...that would be WILD!
-F.
Yeah, I'm sure it could easily be done. I think the main thing is there is more of a demand for the cars than a bus, though. : (
Sadly, yes. Once again, form follows function. Sounds like the problem we have with the real vehicles, eh? :)
On that subject, did you read the Washington Post article about people in the DC area who won't date someone more than 30 minutes away or if they have to get on the Beltway? They claimed 2 to 3 hours in traffic just isn't worth it. Obviously, they forgot all about WMATA, the ample bus system thereof, and the fact that the Red Line is the best way to go in some areas. I shake my head at them.
-F.
Yeah, typical of a car dominated world. I learned so much as a kid by taking the bus more than riding in a car. For one thing, I learned how to prioritize my time since I couldn't be as flexible with public transportation as I would driving.
I saw that article and had a big laugh, too. The DC area is really hard for dating. The women are ridiculous here. Luckily, I found someone that wasn't like a lot of the females that live here. I'm not saying the guys are any better, but I feel for anyone that is single and looking!
Thanks for the warning; so much for my thoughts of moving to DC. The women in this part of Virginia are crazy enough, believe me! (Or at least the ones I attract; go figure...I'm a bus geek...LOL.)
And I agree; those who ride transit are generally more structured than car drivers. A major self-complaint I had for a long time was that I did not prioritize my time or go by a set schedule; that all changed when I became dependent on the bus. And think of all the creative ways you can utilize your time while waiting; in fact, I'm doing so by writing to you while I await the 12:50 to Downtown!
And I learned a lot by riding buses when I was a child as well; my most vivid memory is how I learned to count. When I was 3 or 4, my Dad was a ridership census taker for our local TA. One day, he gave me a pad and pencil, and I helped him count the number of people that got on and off the bus. Also, I picked up a lot by memorizing all the fleet numbers of our Flxible New Looks and Grumman 870s.
Every time I sit in the front side-facers of our restored Grumman at the museum, I can't help but remember the above. What an experience.
-Fred
I agree, it was actually a good thing that my parents didn't have a car until I was a teenager. I learned how to get around on some of the small side streets better by remembering that a particular bus ran down there. One time, I really got lost in Alexandria, but then I saw a metrobus stops and I kept following them until I came to a road that I recognized and got myself out that way. To this day, you can ask where a particular store is and I'll tell you along with what bus route goes by there. Good for driving people crazy!!!
I had an issue with staying on time when I drove. I kept running early, but then I had it drilled into me that the goal was to pick up people, not make it to the end of the line faster. I also learned that I shouldn't model my driving behavior after the Metrobuses that came through the campus as they were pretty horrible. There were many clashes between drivers of Shuttle UM and WMATA. We had to follow the speed limit to the t, they on the other hand flew down Campus Drive like there was no tomorrow, so they'd get angry when they got stuck behind one of us driving 20 mph when they were used to going faster.
There was one driver on the F6 that I used to pass everyday that was really nice and he and I would always flash our lights at each other and wave as we got to know each other after awhile.
I definitely think taking public transit is a great learning experience. It is what propelled me into the career I'm in. I can only be thankful for that.
What an experience. You certainly took the right track for sure. I later drove for a TA as well...what fun it was!
-F.
I was car crazy too, at age 16 , but I started loving buses long before that. I almost went crazy when PTC Routes K & L were detoured
due to the rebuilding of Stenton av, two blocks north of Rodney St.
My house was 5 houses away from Rodney, where the buses ran for the detour. Man, what a year that was. They used CM-Macks and regular Macks back them. The CM's had that hydraulic trannny, you shifted gears w/o a clutch. They would give out a "too-choo" when the B/O
shifted gears.
Chuck Greene
That's very cool. I used to sit on the bus as a kid wishing I lived at one of the houses that had a bus stop planted in their front yard. I always thought it was funny how you would see a clump of grass around the pole where they couldn't quite get to it.
Only once in a great while would a bus come up the street near my house as it led to the Elementary School where an occasional Metrobus was used as a Charter bus. Once an OTR coach did come down my street which was barely wide enough for a car. That was really neat to see!
I did find a part of the window in my old house that if I contorted my neck enough, I could see Riggs Road, which was the major road near our house and I could just see a Metrobus come up the hill. We were about 3 or 4 long blocks away and were parallel to that road, but there was a curve where you could just see the traffic come around.
As yes, we sure are bus-nuts, aren't we?
Chuck Greene
OH yes. We are bus geeks for sure....LOL!!! :)
-F.
It was, and to a point still is fun to live on Sheriff Road. When the F14 ran on Sheriff Road, you saw a lot of buses traveling up and down the road. A lot of times new buses that I would see were seen outside my window. I remember seeing 9300s, 9400s, 2000s and 8700s first either outside my window and or as I was going to school. I saw the 9200s after seeing one on the news. It was 9282 and the next day, I caught it. Unfortunately, the F14 is gone, but when the Redskins play, I do see buses rolling up and down Sheriff Road (when I am not at work, which has been alot more at work, and less at home).
I am sending some bus route suggestions to WMATA (one is to have a rush hour route run up Sheriff Road) and hopefully if they agree and have the funding, buses rolling up Sheriff Road on a somewhat regular basis again.
I always wanted a bus stop in front of my house too! Fortunately, one day I would go on to live the dream...when I got my first apartment at age 20.
I could always tell the time by the buses going by; if it was a Series 50, it was 4:00. If it was a 6V92, it was 4:30. :)
-F.
How neat those old Macks must have been. The only time I have ever seen one was at a museum, including the one I am now curator of. I have always been car crazy, but I cannot recall if buses came first...I would have to say yes, because I have been into them since I was 2 years old. All I know is I played with a lot of Matchbox cars and rode a lot of buses.
-F.
I've gotta say the Flxible Metro by Road Champs. They have so many livery possibilities...plus you can Grummanize them quite easily, and I love making them into 30 and 35-foot versions! And if the taillights are gone when you find them second-hand, oh well...time to smooth the back end over and put on some LEDs! I also like retrofitting them with Alcoas, especially in Baltimore MTA colors.
That is the best model I have ever played with EVER!!!
-F.
The RTS-II Slopeback made by Air Jet Industries that comes in the lucite case with wooden base. I have it the the blue demo colors and it looks sharp. It is slightly larger in all dimensions than a Corgi 102 DL3.
With the $$ crunch will we continue to see new buses/subway cars added to the system? Will the new orders arriving soon be it for a long while? The other question to look at is if MTA picks up the private lines how do they deal with that? Many buses in those fleets are overdue for retirement.
Remember the MTA cash surplus a few years ago, Much of it was blown on all the new equipment.
(Remember the MTA cash surplus a few years ago, Much of it was blown on all the new equipment.)
The MTA went broke due to:
o The big pension enhancement during the stock market boom.
o Not raising fares for seven years even as wages rose.
o Huge debts loaded onto its books by the State of New York.
In other words, by politicians riding a boom to increase their popularity, and sacrificing a future which has now arrived.
Don't forget to mention there wasn't really a surplus, just a projection that receipts would exceed costs. Always bad for a governmental organization, because the next budget comes along and the people in charge say "Oh, they used $40M less than we allocated last year. Let's cut this year's allocation by $50M."
-Hank
The MTA's money problem are also due to slow adoption of technology that would reduce its outragouse labor expenses.
Cutting back on token booths
Improving the way it dispatches and tracks buses
Reducing the number of crew men on trains
Upgrading infrastructure to reduce maintence expense
Upgrading back office administration
I disagree that the MTA has blown money on new equipment. The R-143/r-143 program will save the MTA in the long run. These cars will utilize less electricity and cost less tomaintian over time. The old rail cars needed replacement. I don't think anyone here will argue with that
i dont think theres any outragious maintenance involved here.
The old rail cars such as the redbirds and the R-40 (my favorite - great heat today) are not getting any younger.
Some recent cosmetic renovations allthough nice are not needed. One such excess is tiled platform floors. At first I thought it was a great idea but increasingly i think it was a bad idea. they are tough to keep clean and very prone to cracking. Take a look at 34th street station and about 15% of the tiles have already been replaced. The same can be said for the wall street station on the 2/5. Half the tiles on the norther most portion ber either loose, broken or already repalced at least once. The larger tiles seem dont seem to agree with the train vibrations.
paris had an elegant solution of simply painting a dark color.
Let's not forget the Union in all this. While protesting a fare hike and coming up with solutions that will cost as much to implement as the near-term savings would be once implemented, they're asking for a 24% pay hike.
-Hank
>>"Remember the MTA cash surplus a few years ago, Much of it was blown on all the new equipment."<<
Not quite, Paturkey & the state also took a portion for themselves b/c they were jealous the city had so much extra money, yes they did spend too much, especially on subway cars & execs took hefty bonuses as well so the MTA did it to themselves, they're reeling from some stupidity and now its most likely we will get hit with a fare hike set for next year.
[Remember the MTA cash surplus a few years ago....]
No, I don't remember a surplus. I DO remember a SMALLER-THAN-EXPECTED DEFICIT, which the Straphangers Campaign twisted around to sound like a surplus.
(Think about it: You EXPECT to lose $10, but ACTUALLY lose only $6. Is the $4 difference a surplus? Of course not. However, Straphangers would have you spend the $4 anyway to meet your budgeted $10 loss.)
What will the Orion 7 have that will make it different than the previous model? Is there a link to a photo somewhere?
Click Here To See the Orion 07.501 CNG Style
Click Here To See the Orion 07.501 Hybrid Style
Hope This Helps!
Regards,
Trevor Logan
Thank's so much - Nice looking bus - Cant wait to ride one!
I've always wanted to tell you this, but your interior pictures of the CNG and HEV are the same ones. Are you saying that the interiors will be identical, therefore you used the same pics for both pages?
EXACTLY!
You've hit it on the nose.
There was ZERO change in the interiors on both models!
Regards,
Trevor Logan
I have a question...7560 has four pairs of forward-facing seats in the rear in front of the last 4 seats...but 6365 had two 3-seat aisle-facing seats where the four front-facing seats would be...I wonder which interior will the Orion VII HEVs have?
Carlton
Cleanairbus
The first two Neoplan AN-460 Transliner Articulateds arrived @ Bladensberg last night!!!!!!
Regards,
Trevor Logan
Thanks, Trevor! Any word on when they enter service?
Cool! I just happen to have Tuesday & Wednesday off from work and I'll definitely take a spin over to Bladensburg with the digicam.
Wayne
Trevor, PLEASE tell me this doesn't mean doom for the 8700s or any other Flxibles...new buses in Flx towns scare me these days!!!
-F.
No This means doom for the remaining 21 MAN SG-310 Artics!
Trevor
Oh, thank goodness! No offense to MAN fans, but I thought the oldest buses there were the 8700-series Flx Metros, being that the New Looks and RTS fleets are long gone. I didn't realize the MANs were still in action; how old are those things?
-F.
The ones that are left are from 1983. Prior to that, there were some MAN's from 1979. Those were 55 feet. The 1983's are 60 feet.
I see; weren't the 1979s affiliated with AM General somehow? And how come there was a 55-foot model...wouldn't a 60 have made more sense?
-F.
I believe they were related to AM General. The back trailer was definitely smaller than the 1983's. I don't know why they were shorter. I found this info on the WMATA Website. They have the specs of all their buses on there.
Really? How neat. There just aren't enough TA websites with bus info on them.
I think in the early days of articulated buses those manufacturers though it would be good to offer them in more than one size. At the time when GM toyed wit the idea of an articulated RTS they also were planning to offer them in two lengths. However the lengths of the GM RTS artics would've been 56 and 61 foot long.
Wayne
I see; so that makes the 35-footers actually 36 feet and the 40 foots were 41 feet? Mostly bumper, I guess. An aRTic buS would be cool!
-f.
No - I think it only applied to the RTS artics had they gone into production. I suspect the extra foot was in the section where the front/rear sections were joined together. Perhaps GM wanted the extra foot. Now when GMDD built those 53 artics (TA60102N), they were indeed 60-feet long. I think GMDD used a 35 foot shell for the front and a 40 foot shell for the rear.
Wayne
Yeah...those New Look-style artics were really neat. If only they used the Fishbowl front end!
I think GMDD used that front end to get the wide entrance which we all know later became the front end for the Classics. I never did see those artics in person, but I sure wish I had. GMDD buses always seemed to have this nice slow bounce-rock to them and it would've been interesting to see the GMDD artics in action.
Wayne
The first generation of MAN artics were built in partnership with AM General, mainly as MAN's way of entering the US market due to the Buy America regulations. This site has a full production list and some info on the MAN/AMGs.
And also, there is a little MAN in every New Flyer LF. Their axle designs are used on those.
-F.
You might not want to hear when the Neoplans arrive for Baltimore.
Missed seeing them by one day. Went by Bladensburg Sunday night after I left work and didn't see any.
Long weekend translates into a long post which takes a long time to write so here goes. As usual, all car numbers refer to the first car unless noted otherwise. There are bus parts in here, you just need to find them, sorry.
Thursday 11/28
The word of the day for Thursday was DESERTED (this word of the day didn't make it into the subject line but the others did)
Take the Red Line (Breda 4019) to Union Station, which I found to be deserted. Hardly anyone was there and most of the people near gate F were waiting for people on arriving trains (people come from gate G). I picked up some reading material (holiday schedule, VRE brochure, etc) and at decided to go see if the train display was up and running. It wasn’t but while I was checking that, my train was called, so when I got back, I went to get on board. It was Acela Express 2254 (Trainset 20 2026-2029). They had a quiet car, so I sat there. Just like the station, the train was essentially deserted. Got to New York on time and went upstairs to find that the area around the departure board was not deserted. Went to the subway to discover that my MetroCard was expiring at the end of December and only had 1 dollar. Unfortunately, the subway station was not totally deserted and I had to wait to get the agent to transfer my one dollar and add another 15 to a new card. I find I always get the slowest agents when I don’t really want them, not to mention they don’t understand enough English to make these transactions go fast enough. Seems to me they need to be stricter when they make hiring decisions. Bought a fun pass and went through the turnstile with my suitcase. I didn’t feel like asking the agent to open the gate for me since she took forever and a day to transfer my money. Got on the E (R32 3640) and took that to Lex (that construction zone at the west end is a disaster, just wait until Sunday) and transferred to the 6 (R142A 7505). Had a wonderful Thanksgiving dinner at an Italian restaurant on the Upper East Side (no turkey) and went to bed. I did see D60HF 5509 on the M79.
Friday 11/29: National Railfan Day
The word of the day for Friday was SKIP
Somehow got up at 6:15 and dozed until 7:15, listening to Transit and Weather together every 10 minutes on the 8s. Unfortunately, a certain meteorologist didn’t predict the nicest whether, but then again, I guess he would be out of a job if he reported that it was going to be 80 degrees and sunny. Personally, a hearing the high for the day is 35 degrees is not the high point of my day. That said, left at about 8 to walk to 86th Street, where a train of R33s on the 4 passed as I waited for a 5 train to the Bronx. That came, and I got on (R142 7030). The new interior LED displays don’t work, they need to do them how they did it originally (with the 125 ST NEXT, not the THE NEXT STOP IS… thing). At 3rd Avenue, we got a skip to 180th although we were going to have stops at Intervale and Freeman. The conductor covered the automated announcements in the stations but didn’t change the computer, so it did announce “THIS IS JACKSON AVENUE” and so on. I wanted pictures at Simpson, so I got off at Intervale and took the next train (R142 6736 on the 2) to Simpson, where I got pictures of the 142s and the Redbirds coming around the curve at the north end of the station. Eventually got back on a 2 (R142 6686) and took it to Tremont, where I got a picture of the last 5 express coming around the curve. As soon as it left, I look and see a train of R33s signed for Dyre coming in on the northbound track, so I run through the crossover, only to just miss them. A train to 180th comes in (R33 9116) and I take that one stop, where I am discharged, to see the train I missed out of service on the middle track. I guess I shouldn’t have felt bad about missing that train. Yet another 5 came in after that (R142 6766) which I took up to Dyre. I changed ends (now in 6836). We left about 3 minutes late because there was some confusion over which crew was supposed to take the train (this was the 0933 out of Dyre). Took that train to Gun Hill, where I took pictures of trains going by (missed getting a shot of Redbirds, I would have had them if I had gotten off at Baychester) and got back on R142 7000 to 180th. Hoped to get this 5 up to 238th that goes thru 180th at 0959 according to the schedule on the MTA site although it didn’t show. Got on a 2 (R142 6411) which I was going to take to Gun Hill but at Pelham, I saw a garbage train. Turned out to be R127s EP001 and EP002, so I photographed those, and waited in the wonderful weather for the next train. It eventually showed and I got on (R142 6601). At Gun Hill, we got a skip to 241st, so I decided to stay. This conductor turned off the automated announcements after 219th. At Wakefield, the train turned back almost immediately. I was in 6604 and took that to 238th, where I waited 10 minutes for the Bx16. While there, I got some pictures of the Bee Line buses in the area. I got TMC RTS 8894, which I took to the last stop at 205th Street. We had a student driver, so it was slow going at times, although a nice trip. There was some snow on the ground in Woodlawn Cemetery and Van Courtlandt Park. At 205th, I went back into the subway and got on the D (R68 2712).
Took the D to Fordham where I walked over to the Jerome El. A train was in the station, so I got on (R62 1340, 5th car) although at Bedford Park the train was held and I made it to the first car (1336). The trip to Woodlawn took some time since they wound up with an extra train and had to pull it out (R142As 7676-7685) and then there was congestion. Once I got to Woodlawn, I got the ability to say I’ve been to every stop in the Bronx (one borough down, 4 to go). Got pictures, then got back on 1336 and took it to Bedford Park Boulevard, where I got out and walked over to Train Dude Land. Got pictures from the bridge over the yard and of a Neoplan Artic for Bee Line. Missed a train when I got back to the platform so I had a few cookies while waiting for the next one, during which time a train of R142As went by. On the trip on the 4 to 149th Street (R62 1416), I saw one train of Redbirds, although it may have been the same set I had seen at 86th Street earlier (4 hours difference almost between sightings, someone can figure out if they were the same if they want). I decided to make a quick trip down to South Ferry to see Courtlandt and then go have lunch. Got on the 2 (R142 6565) with a very slow T/O (although I am convinced the R142 played a part in this). A 1 train left 42nd Street as we came in. It made the stop at 34th and was leaving as we arrived. We passed it before 14th where we saw another 1 pull out as we came in. The 2 left Chambers about 90 seconds before the leading 1 arrived. I got on (R62A 2196) and took it to South Ferry. There were people in the back half of the train, who had bewildered faces on as the train left with them still on it. While we waited for the next train, a lady asked if “this was the uptown platform”, explaining how she wanted to go to Chambers and wasn’t sure where to go. I told her it was and explained how there was a loop. Got on the next 1 (R62A 2285) which I took to Rector. We got stuck behind the first 1 which had to wait for the starting lights and missed a connection with a 3 as a result. Got the express (R142 6371) to Penn Station where I had a very quick lunch at Sbarro’s.
After lunch, it was off to the Flushing Line. To get there, I took the 3 to Times Square (R62A 1905) and then got on a local 7 to Queensboro Plaza (R36 WF 9629). At Queensboro, I looked around for some other railfans who I told that I would be out there and got pictures of an R40 slant on the N and R40Ms on the N (including the lone R42 on the N). After deciding the other railfans weren’t there, I got on an express to Willets Point (R36 WF 9644). This was one of my best rides on the Flushing Express ever. It was fast and had the Redbird feel we won’t have for much longer. On this ride, I saw someone taking pictures at 52nd Street (now about 2 PM), was it someone on this board? I took pictures at Corona Yard, then got on a train to Flushing (R62A 1701). At Flushing, I got on a train of Redbirds which I took to 103rd, but I was switching cars most of the time. At 103rd, I got a picture of two R62As neck and neck heading to Flushing with the train I had just gotten off in the background (a year ago it was three Redbirds in a picture :’(). A I ended up getting a picture of a Redbird speeding by on the express next to an R62A, then got on R36 WF 9571 to 90th, where I got even more pictures. After 90th, it was 2153 to 74th, 2114 to 52nd, 2090 to 46th, and finally, 9609 to 33rd. Of course, I got pictures at each location. At 33rd, it was freezing (at least that unnamed meteorologist gave an accurate forecast, even though it wasn’t a very nice one). After I was almost finished there and about to go back, I saw Flushing bound trains signed as expresses going by on the local. The automatic in the middle of the station on the middle track also changed to red. What was going on? Three trains went by without stopping as well for Manhattan bound, including one empty, two with passengers, making some people on the platform rather mad. Eventually, I got on a train to Queensboro Plaza (R36 WF 9579). As we arrived at Queensboro, a train of R40 slants arrived on the other platform on the N, so I took those to Lexington (4352). It was quite a ride and better than the last one through the 60th Street tube in a slant, when I must have gotten a slow T/O, because Friday’s run was much faster. At Lex, I got on the 6 to go back to where I was staying (R142A 7241). On the walk back to where I was staying, I saw a D60HF on the M102 (can’t recall the number).
Saturday 11/30
Word of the Day for Saturday was BUSY
Didn’t ride anywhere in the morning but after lunch, I had a little adventure. Went to get Bill Newkirk’s calendar (Bill, I assume you got my e-mail) at the Transit Museum store, so I took the 6 to Grand Central (R142A 7456). Although the museum didn’t have the calendar, I got an umbrella, the 4 and 6 beanie bears (which are very cute), several maps, and the number plate from car 7661 (an R22 I believe). Called 411 which didn’t have Penn Books in their directory from a pay phone. Not wishing to chance having the store closed on Sunday when I went to catch my train back home, I shuttled over to Times Square (R62A 1986) and then took the 1 to Penn Station (R62A 2230, 5th car). Found the bookstore (so much for 411’s reliability) and found out they didn’t have the calendar either. So it was off to the Met on the M4 (RTS 8983). I missed one M4 because the stop is in the middle of the block and you don’t really have any way of knowing that, but that is another matter. I just wish the terminal stops were where the bus map says they are. I also found out there was no stop on 81st Street and Madison (I like the limited but the M4 isn’t on weekends). Later, I went to see Les Miserables so I took the 6 (R142A 7492, 2nd car) to Grand Central and shuttled over to Times Square (R62A 1986, anyone realize I like this car and some of you already know I am not a Mets fan so that isn’t the connection). Excellent show although I’ve seen better. On the walk to the subway, I saw D60HF 1070 on the M79 with LED signs. After the show, I got 6063 on the M104 although I took a cab over to the East Side (other members of the party didn’t want to wait for the crosstown).
Sunday 12/1
The word of the day for Sunday was PACKED
Does the word of the day surprise anyone considering it is one of the busiest travel days of the year? Went to Penn Station on the 6 (R142A 7267, 9th car). At 51st, I changed for the E, which I heard come in with just a few more feet to go on the escalator. I picked up my suitcase (which is on wheels) and the shopping bag with 7668’s number plate and ran down the escalator. By the time I got there, the doors had opened, but I ran around the wooden supports, people yielded to me seeing I had every intention to get on the train, and I made it on to the train (R32 3568) and situated myself at the railfan window for the trip to 34th Street. There were a few rough starts out of the stations but we did 30 around the curve entering 50th Street, the way the subway should be run! At Penn Station, things were crowded. I got the new HBLR and NJT schedules and went to the Acela waiting room. I got there at about 11:10 for a noon train. At about 11:35, red caps started taking people to the platform. I asked the waiting room attendant what track it was on, he told me (12), went down one level, and found a staircase, so I was there before the train was. Took the train (Acela Express 2251, Trainset #6 2030-2031) which was sold out to Washington, where we arrived on time. My arriving on the platform when I did didn’t get me the window seat I wanted and I did have to share (as did everyone), but it was still nice. No quiet car this time. This is this third time I got that trainset and there are now footprints (white) all over the vestibules and the bathroom doors still don’t lock! Got to Washington, saw the model train at Union Station (same Norwegian display as its been the past few years), and took the Metro (Breda 3227 with the same operator I had on Thursday) home.
I've always wondered why NYCTA wastes their time testing buses at other depots. They should just send every new bus that they plan on buying over to 126th Street Depot and let us run it 24/7 (the only down time naturally would be for refueling, fluid checks, interior cleaning and exterior washing) on the M15. If it can survive 30 days of that without breaking down then NYCTA should buy it. Back in 1993 when the 8400's first arrived they were subjected to 24/7 service on the M15. They passed the test. With it's status of being the busiest urban transit bus line in North America, the M15 is the ultimate torture test for a transit bus. The RTS(UGH!)handles it without a problem. I'm waiting to see if the New Flyer artics (if they ever arrive) can handle it. I know they handle the Bx12 okay but the Bx12 is not the M15.
It's pretty close...have you ever SEEN Fordham Road at 4 in the afternoon? Fordham Road could support a cross-Bronx subway line.
I'm at fordham road at 4 in the afternoon. All I have to say is: Thank god for the bus lane and the tow trucks that patrol it. ( Big Grin)
Not everyone agrees. (But I do. This city badly needs more bus lanes and better enforcement of the existing bus lanes.)
I agree that the city should enforce bus lanes restrictions. I've ridden buses along Fordham Road since I was a child and I have to say that many motorists are just out of control with illegal parking and/or driving in the bus lanes. I understand the merchants' position too, but I don't think they should stop enforcement just for that reason. Something needs to be worked out. I admit - that I've done my share of illegal parking and when I still lived in NYC I often chose to shop in the suburbs or someplace like Bay Plaza so I wouldn't have to worry about parking. I think many of these motorists need to stop being lazy and just find a parking spot and walk to the store(s) they're shopping in.
Wayne
All I've got to say is: HA HA! It's too damn bad that you're losing business. The Bus LAne wouldn't be there if you didn't park in the stops ( among other things)!!!!
I would love to see Philadelphia do that with Chestnut Street. Supposedly theres a bus lane along the right lane between 7am and 7pm, the only occupants are supposed to be the 42 and 21 busses, and bicylists. However, the bus lane is just as car-choked as the "regular" lanes. I must say that people don't park in the bus lane, but double parking on the left is common, which forces traffic, whether they want to or not, to drive with the busses. I have never seen a police officer hand out a ticket to a bus lane violator, and signs saying 'No right turn' to keep the cars out from in front of the bus stops have the same legal implications as a US mail box does.
To be fair, Septa really was stupid in their application of the bus lane. They did it on a narrow, one way street with parking on the left, cars in the middle, and busses on the right. The Bus lane is supposed to be a bus lane for 12 hours, but in midday the 21 and 42's headway drops to such a level that you could go 20 minutes or more without seeing a bus, only to have 4 pass by at once (to me, bus bunching is rampant on these two, the 42 always seems to arrive at 33rd and Chestnut [where the two lines meet] at the same exact time as the 21). It's clear that Septa intended the 9 to use the Bus lanes, a not so close look at most shelters will reveal a covered up 9 with a wheelchair next to it, and also, the 9 does not appear on any bus shelters I have seen on market st, it's current home. It would be nice to see the Chestnut St Busway take a few busses off market st, which would ease crowding there, and allow the bus lanes to be more occupied during the day, perhaps the 44, or the 124 and 125 could use it. But that would require a possibly convoluted plan, they'd need to get from the expressway to chesnut st, and that isn't as easy as it sounds. One way would be to go straight at 31th and Market, where the busses now turn left to head into the city, but this sends them right down into the loading docks for the post office across market st from 30th St station, and a stuck truck or other minor disaster could have several busses stuck for quite a while. The only way I could see to get the expressway busses where they now come off would be to go left at 31st and market, then make a stop at 30th and market, where most of them stop now, and then a right down a small separated road from 30th st, to chestnut, and from there to the bus lanes.
Of course, all this could be avoided if SEPTA were to purchase a portion of Drexel's parking lot across 31st st from 30th st station. I'm not even sure what it is, I don't see too many cars there. They could wall it off (more than it is now), make a staircase or elevator down to the fare control area of 30th St station on the MFL and Sub Surface lines, and allow free transfer between like 5 bus lines, a major subway line, AND all of our trolley lines (cept the 15, but even then, maybe they'll route them through , rather than use a the diversion Route). Busses could even terminate there, dropping passengers to catch trolleys or subways across town, and making the local riders (those getting off before 19th or so, say Peco tower employee commuters) switch to a 31, or another, continuing bus. Perhaps a new, local circulator bus is in order, one running the DE40LFs (or in my wild pipe dream, trackless trolley in Center City; mmmm, Dual Mode Bredas, ala Seattle's metro, on the 9, American Generals on the Circulator!) to serve the city riders, possibly running in Market st to Penns Landing, back up market, both ways using the successful bus lanes (course though, when you got Septa and NJT busses coming once a minute, who's gonna mess with them? well, delivery drivers, but those guys don't count), round city hall, then down JFK to 20th, and back south to market, which is now once again dual direction, out to 32nd, Market, and JFK (theres two 32nd Streets, this is the first, right past the PPA), up JFK to 30th st, and back in to pick up a bunch of commuters who don't wanna ride the subway. During the afternoon rush, there should be a method for turning the busses into the 30th st TC without going out to 32nd, it isn't far, but people would feel that they are getting dragged out of their way, perhaps a gate off of market just west of 31st could help. As I see it, the TC would consist of a big fenced area, with muliple bus parking spots, perhaps with curbs, so that is less distance to jump down or climb up to the bus. At the northern, JFK side, there'd be two gates to let the busses in and out, busses off the expressway would turn right off of 31th st, onto JFK west, then turn left off of JFK into the terminal. Exiting busses would turn right out of the terminal, then right again, back onto 31st st, then left onto market st, and from there, terminated busses could turn left at 30th st to go back north to their origin, or continuing busses could continue straight into the city as always.
The 17,38,33,48, and a few other routes that I am forgetting would also provide similar service tot eh citculator, but would head for their end-points at some point, rather than just going round and round. And undoubtedly there would be a few busses on the 9, 44, 121, 124, and 125 that would go direct into downtown after a quick stop to allow passenger who want the free transfer to the subway to get off.
Well, there's my great plan to improve philadelphia's downtown transit, any thoughts?
Thanks
I'm not familiar enough with Philadelphia to comment on your idea, but I can present one of my own for NYC.
The typical bus lane in NYC is the right lane of an avenue, "divided" from the rest of the avenue by a painted white line. It's only in effect for a few hours each day (either the morning or the evening rush, typically), and private vehicles are allowed to use the lane to turn right. Enforcement is pretty much nil. These bus lanes aren't very effective.
There is one notable exception: Madison Avenue between 34th Street and 59th Street. On Madison, the two right lanes are set aside for buses, and the restriction is in effect between 2 and 7pm. Right turns aren't permitted at all (except for medallion cabs for a few blocks in the 40's), and there is some degree of enforcement. These bus lanes do help somewhat.
I don't know if this is still being seriously considered, but a few years ago I read about a new bus lane proposal: the rightmost curb lane would be a truck loading lane, and the next lane to its left would be the bus lane. At bus stops, the loading lane is replaced with an extended sidewalk.
One reason the common bus lane doesn't work, and the reason I think the newer proposal wouldn't work much better, is that vehicles other than buses are granted limited permission to use the bus lane -- to make right turns and to move into the loading lane. In neither case are there clear guidelines of when the limited permission draws to an end. How far may a private vehicle get into the bus lane to turn right? (Half a block? Two blocks? A mile?) What if the driver repeatedly "changes his mind" and decides to go straight? If the loading lane is full, may a truck stop in the bus lane for just a few minutes? Etc. Limited permission will invariably be abused unless absolute parameters are stated and enforced.
The Madison Avenue system is better. My idea is to take it one step further.
Designate the two rightmost lanes as full-time bus lanes. Install an actual physical curb divider between the bus lanes and the main roadway. If appropriate, mark the rightmost lane of the main roadway (against the divider) as a loading or parking lane. Ban right turns; if right turns are especially important at any particular intersection, add a phase to the traffic signal program to stop bus (and crosswalk) traffic but allow main roadway traffic to turn right. Post prominent signs at each potential entry point to the bus roadway and on each intersecting street.
Enforcement would be largely automatic. It could be done either of two ways. First is with traffic gates -- equip each bus with a transponder that signals the gates to open for each approaching bus. Second is with E-ZPass and license plate cameras -- don't physically stop any vehicle from entering, but automatically charge each unauthorized vehicle a fine on the order of $100-200 per offense.
During the day, aside from emergencies, there would be no exceptions. The DOT could grant limited permits to construction vehicles and perhaps some delivery vehicles to use the bus lanes between midnight and 5am.
Comments?
What happens if the gate breaks down and not open? It could happen
second option sounds like a good one. And Bloomberg loves to collect $$.
Enforcement would be largely automatic. It could be done either of two ways. First is with traffic gates -- equip each bus with a transponder that signals the gates to open for each approaching bus. Second is with E-ZPass and license plate cameras -- don't physically stop any vehicle from entering, but automatically charge each unauthorized vehicle a fine on the order of $100-200 per offense.
The most successful bus lanes I have seen are in the few cities that use counterflow bus lanes. For example, instead of running the M27/50 as currently done, take the northerly curb lane of 50th Street (which now moves easterly) and make it into a 24/7 bus lane on which the buses would move westbound. A double line would separate the westbound bus lane from the eastbound other traffic and enforcement would have to be 100% out of necessity. (The southerly curb lane of 49th Street would be an exclusive eastbound bus lane.) This has worked in Chicago and Montreal and, perhaps, a few other cities, and is similar to the LIE and Lincoln Tunnel exclusive bus lanes.
Hmmm, an interesting idea, and I could see how it would be largely self-enforcing.
But, especially in a case like this, there really need to be dual bus lanes. (What happens if a bus breaks down or, despite all odds, a truck parks in the bus lane?) Side streets are too narrow to dedicate two lanes to buses (unless you're going for a bus-only street, which might not be a bad idea). And contraflow lanes wouldn't work well on avenues, since the traffic signals would be progressively timed for the wrong direction.
I don't think that signal timing is a major rissue, as buses do make stops and current timing doesn't help them tthat much anyway.
Arti
True for locals, though they do benefit somewhat since they pass through 2-3 lights between stops.
But limiteds can make good use of the progression if there isn't too much congestion in the way.
"Second is with E-ZPass and license plate cameras -- don't physically stop any vehicle from entering, but automatically charge each unauthorized vehicle a fine on the order of $100-200 per offense."
I have been preposing this idea for years. The cameras would not only help to keep bus lanes clear but also bus stops and other no standing areas set up to help bus movement.
How far may a private vehicle get into the bus lane to turn right? (Half a block? Two blocks? A mile?)
This is a major issue. The law must be cut and dry. Advances in digital camera and video searching technology will allow for a computer program to measure exactly how long a car was in the bus lane and automatically separate out offenders from the hours of worthless video fotage
"Install an actual physical curb divider between the bus lanes and the main roadway"
This will not work in NYC unless bus scheduling can be improved greatly. Observe the southbound bus flow on Broadway (broadway is one way downtown for those who are not from nyc). Currently there are nearly a dozen express bus lines that operate during rush hour. The bus stops are set up so that differnt bus lines stop at different locations. A physical curb divider would impead one bus from followign another. In addion the physical gaes would slow down traffic
That's why my proposal calls for two lanes, not one. Buses can use the left lane to pass stopped buses in the right lane.
Is there a plant to replace Hudson Depot in the future?..I am surprised to hear that it's still around after all these years.
It will be there until it Edgewaters.
-Hank
The reopening of 100 St is supposed to contribute to the demise of HP, but then again, what if the MTA pulls a surprise and actually keep it, I bet you guys didn't really think about that.
This morning's commute from SI was a complete mess with the Gowanus being shut down with the overturned truck which dumped its load.
Following detours were in effect:
X3,4,8,13,15,18,20 were detoured to the ferry so passengers could use the SI ferry to downtown - Fare was $1.50 on an MCI.
All others were sent via NJ Turnpike. All of the midtown ones were sent via Lincoln Tunnel and the Worth Street ones were sent via the HOLLAND TUNNEL believe it or not. This is coming from the driver of my bus.
Midtown buses with downtown parts started in midtown and worked their way downtown. Roll offs went back to SI via NJ until they had the Gowanus cleared for roll offs. Also any SI bound express went via NJ to SI until the Gowanus was opened again for Brooklyn Bound traffic.
You also had a 2 alarm fire on Broadway near White Street. I'm sure that didnt help either.
I heard what happin this AM. It close down at about 6:15 AM. There's some SI Express Buses might have been close there around that time.
Also the X27/X37 and X28/X38 had to be detoured as well. Most likely went on 3 Ave or 4 Ave
As you all may know... Trevor was good enough to let us know that 2 Neoplan AN460 buses had arrived at Bladensburg division. This afternoon I went to Bladensburg and there they were... #'s 5302 & 5308. Anyone who has been to Bladensburg probably knows it's nearly impossible to see much through the fence - and for me... trespassing is definitely not an option. Anyways - I found a 2-3 inch wide gap in which I was able to get a photo of the front of the buses. Not a good shot at all, but if anyone wants to see it just e-mail me and I'll be happy to send the pic.
Wayne
I guess they'll be seeing service on the X2 soon!
Seems like they are in the process of delivery, more to come this week or next week most likely. I wonder if they will just deliver them to the garages that will run them.
Trevor or anyone else familar with the dashboard of a Neoplan Cityliner? I have a few questions.
Thank You
What year Cityliner?
I drove a 1986 version for a couple years. But I've seen newer ones and the dash seems to be a lot different.
A 1994 model
THe dash has a big speedometer and 6 gauges located on the left.
Also the master switch for the engine and the door are located below that at a 90 degree towards the driver.
There is a large gauge located under the warning light cluster. Just want to know what that is for.
Hmmmm.....does NOT sound familar to me.
The one I drove had an ignition key (a rather strange one, more like a nail with a notch in it!) and push-buttons for the doors (yes, DOORS...it was a two-door version) on a panel that was about 45 degrees up and to the right of the main panel. The door/ignition key panel also had the temperature controls for the climate control.
The parking brake knob was actually on the "wall" behind the driver, about six inches below passenger floor level.
The rest of it sounds the same though -- but thatlarge guage? Any idea what numbers are on it? That might give a hint.
It was below the taletail cluster. Located to the right of the speedometer (which was oddly marked. Zero was pointing straight down, 80 was the 3'oclock position.)
The gauge had two needles. It had a number (20 I think it was) on the top. It wasn't the techometer because it has 2 needles. It wasn't the air pressure because the needles were showing the 9'oclock position.
No low air warning or anything, so that can't be it. No idea really....
Yeah, the air guage on the one I drove was that way (O psi at 6 o'clock, etc.)
A tachometer wouldn't have two needles....there's only ONE RPM reading coming out of an engine.
Could it be transmission temperature? The one I drove had a manual retarder, and you had to watch the tranny temp when using it...get the tranny too hot and it set off a nasty beeper. Seeing as how we're talking a German bus, the temperature would most likely be in Celsius, not Fahrenheit.
>>> It wasn't the techometer because it has 2 needles. <<<
Any chance it was a tach with a telltale to record an over speed?
Tom
Hello everyone, I just called downtown personnel to check on the status of exam 0077 for MaBSTOA. They are up to #1122 on the list. They're getting close. I see myself in there sometime next year. Good luck to any other bus talkers who have happened to had taken this exam back in December 2001.
Dave
Our first storm, potentially. Lets see if it just turns into rain like it normally does!! The weather people sound pretty confident though that this could dump 4-8 inches of 'fluffy' snow. Fluffy? Hmm, if only our cars were made like bumper cars could that be fun spinning around in the fluffy snow.
Everyone be careful out there. I'm definitely going to keep my car at home if its really bad in the morning and just take the bus to work. I think I'm a decent driver, but there are too many out there that take too many chances for me to want to deal with it.
It's snowing in Roanoke; not sticking, but it sure is flying! Hopefully the bus should stay on schedule as usual. Gotta go; the library is closing due to inclement weather. Poop. Oh well. Time to build snow buses on the lawn! :)
-F.
Yes - we have been dodging snow for a long time now. I haven't decided how I'm going to work tomorrow. Growing up in NYC I'm very comfortable driving in snow, but I take issue with the folks who either drive too slow or too fast for the conditions. If I do drive it won't be my new car.
Wayne
I don't blame you. Everyone makes such fun of us, but i guess its for good reason. I just got my car in July, so I'm definitely keeping it safe and sound at home. I can only imagine what the scene is like at the grocery stores!
Yes - I never understood that thing with the grocery stores. I've lived here for 6 years now and I just don't understand why the folks will buy out the entire store when snow is mentioned in the weather forecast. OK - Of course I'm exaggerating, but I found it amusing those times I walked into the store only to find last minute Thanksgiving sized crowds and the milk, bread and most juice shelves empty or nearly empty. Whatever you decide to do... be careful
Wayne
Thanks, you too! One of my coworkers had to go to the store just a little while ago to pick up something for dinner, nothing major, but the Giant by the office was packed. We're having a good laugh over the morons who pack the stores like they wont be able to go out for weeks. I think the weather is sponsored by the grocery store chains. They figure if they can get the weather people to create a panic, they'll triple their business and make all sorts of profits! Why is it that bread and milk sell out faster? If I'm going to be socked in, I want some fun food! That and a couple beers would do me just fine. LOL
You're right. Giant, Safeway, Super Fresh (and others) must have something going with the folks giving us the forecasts:-). I'd also want fun food too while I'm indoors watching videos. Maybe these people increase milk and bread intake when snow falls:-).
Wayne
I often wonder about how people go to the store, like they are going to be stuck in the house for a month. It is just a little snow storm. As long as I got good food and some good movies (note to self get Austin Powers 3), and I am good to go. OH CRAP I have to shovel this stuff.
Well, I only work 3 miles away, but the yucky Ford buses don't come
close enough so off I go in my 2002 Windstar Mini-Van with front wheel drive and traction control.
Good luck to everyone, no "fender benders" please...
Chuck Greene
You should be just fine with that van. I have a Nissan Altima that has traction control, but I'm a little nervous to take it out there. The best would be to wake up and see it coming down so hard that Im not even motivated to get dressed and go out in it. But, I can be nutty sometimes, and I'll probably go out and catch the bus just for the heck of it.
I already had (1) accident with the 2002 that wasn't even my fault. Some idiot down at my gym backed into it and caused $832 worth of damage, of which I paid $500. (It was a hit and run job).
So I'm not too thrilled about going out,either. They are saying at 6 a.m. it shouldn't be bad at all, and when I leave work at 4 p.m., the roads will be plowed. Still wish the bus went close by, I'd take it.
Chuck Greene
Actually if I drove in tomorrow my new car would be safer. It's an '02 Honda Accord EX-V6, with ABS and traction control. My older car is a '92 Honda Accord that does not have ABS or TCS. I've decided that I'll get up a bit earlier and ride Metrorail.
Wayne
oh you love those honda's don't you!
I sure do - I have nothing but praise for them. My '92 just reached 200,000 miles last weekend and it's awesome. I still drive it to NYC regularly.
Wayne
Those Honda Accords are awesome, my dad has a 2002 Accord Special Edition. But I'd LOVE to have a EX-V6
Well... I can tell you that the EX-V6 is a blast. I've had mine for almost a year and since then I haven't been on many buses:-). I have a friend who drives a BMW 528i and he's a bit upset that my $25,000 family car is a bit faster than his "Superior" sports sedan that costs so much more. He was even more pissed off when I pointed out that my Accord has nearly everything his car has.
Wayne
Well its gonna be fun again in "what's a shovel" Sea Cliff. The village has made an announcement in their flyer that people who dont clear their sidewalks will recieve a fine. Come Friday, you dont have your walk shoveled I will report your address to Village Hall.
Hopefully the N21 and N27 will be able to run, some of these North shore roads can get a bit slippery.
As for the panic, hey, it snows in winter.
Also what ticks me off is people who don't clear off their cars completly. I know that cleaning off the top of the car is tough but they have brushes that extend. I can't stand it when a car has snow blowing off their roofs, blinding me and distorting my view. I make it a point to clear off the whole car, even if it means using my arm.
Crop dusters is what I call them. I have a Jeep which is a higher vehicle and more space than a car to clear snow off yet I find the time to clear away as much snow off as possible.
Just imagine what it must be like to clear the snow off a Hummer. Yeah, alot of people own them now round here in Snob Hills.
Well they probably wont even bother cleaning snow off anything but the front and rear windows, hehehehe :-0
Yeah that is especially a problem with SUV's. I guess most of the little women that drive them cant reach the roof, even with an extended brush (well if they cant reach the roof they shouldnt be driving those monsters in the first place).
Also you can make a bet SUV drivers will be driving like their vehicle is invincible tomorrow.
Also they figure, "why bother shoveling if I can run over other cars". Greedvale will sure be an interesting sight later. :-0
W.E.S. - I totally agree with you. That has been a pet peeve of mine for a long time. I understand that it can be be tough on some vehicles like the top of a Van, Mini-Van or an SUV. However, it's clear that people often will clear a part of the windshield and just start driving. I really think the police should really ticket drivers who do not clear the snow off their cars. Once time ... I'm pretty certain I saved myself from disaster... It was a few days after the storm... so any remaining snow had frozen and I was driving on the Cross-Bronx Expway when a van in front of me hit a bump and a large piece of ice can flying right at me. I had just enough time to swerve out of the path of the flying ice. Luckily no other vehicles were in the right lanes.
Wayne
On my Windstar, I open one sliding door and clear the roof as much as possible. Then I close that door and do the other side the same way. This gets almost all the snow off the roof. Mini-van drivers, take this advice!
Chuck Greene
Chuck,
That's a good idea and even if you don't get it all... at least you managed to get what you could. I think there's no excuse for a person driving a car. I saw a guy this morning in a car and get this... He did have on his lights and if he did it may not have mattered because both the head and tail lights were totally covered by snow. He had cleared the snow from all of his windows, but that's just not quite enough.
Wayne
Me to the first snow fall is pretty cool here in philly 4-6 inches is expect maybe even 7inchs.I never seen a bus with a ddc 50 engine stick in the snow before i will get my first change to see one.
:)
Wait until to see those tires spin! Then the bus starts to fishtail!
Especially the buses in Roxborough and Manayunk...
Chuck Greene
How do Orions fare in comparison to RTS's in the snow?
RTS fend better in snow. I seen many Orion 5 get stuck in snow.
RTS get stuck too of course but not as much.
Strange though, Orion 5s seems to be a heavier bus.
the flyers(low floor model dont seem to do too well in the snow. My sister took the b68 today and didnt see any running. I, on the other hand was working by 42nd near Lexington. Did happen to see #4845 on the M42 get stuck behind a NYC Transit car and a plow-took up most of 42nd street. traffic wasnt moving much. The M101,M102 and M103on lexingotn were moving, but a bit slowly.
#6358-M1-Orion VI
never saw a artic neoplan in the snow before any one know what happen does the bus attemp to spin out. I know one time i rode on a septa new flyer in the snow i guess it has traction contral beofre the brake come on.
I consider myself a good driver in the snow, I have driven in some of D.C.'s worst weather and came out unscathed. I just hate it when some people drive too carefully or drive like they think the road is dry and it is sunny outside.
Good to hear from you WES!! I bet things are getting crazy now with the holidays coming up.
Yeah, I consider myself a good driver too. Its amazing the chances people will take. My biggest pet peeve in bad weather is no headlights. That's the easiest thing to do out of everything. If I can't see them, it makes it that much challenging out there. A lot of people in 4 wheel drive vehicles tend to take too many chances too. I was joking to someone that I should get an ATV and ride that in tomorrow.
Yea, retail is a bitch, especially now with the holiday season, people getting in the "Not Too Cheery Holiday Spirit", finding a parking spot, and people who hold up the line when they should have been prepared before they got to the front. I put my headlights on when I drive in rain or snow, so others can see me. If you have to drive take care. I know most likely the mall will be open(with no shoppers in there), so most likely I will see morons first hand. Would like to drive to a Metro subway lot park for a couple of minutes and take some bus picks. If for some odd reason, I am off tomorrow, I will look out my window and laugh at the drivers trying to drive up Sheriff Road's big hill. I remember one person took about four or five tries to get up it. Fun to be had by me.LOL!!
Here's is another one. Picture a Champion trying to get up a hill, especially up Sheriff Road on the 22. That should be really good for a laugh.
THE CHAMPION IS GOING UP THE HILL. OH OH, THE CHAMPION IS GOING BACKWARDS DOWN THE HILL. IT MAKES A SECOND ATTEMPT, IT FAILS, IT IS COMING BACK DOWN. OH OH! LOL, ITS TRYING AGAIN, AND IT IS FAILING AGAIN. After about ten times, it just gives up and breaks down.
Yeah, I remember when I was working for Sears about 10 years ago, they had us come in to the store at 6:30 AM the day after Thanksgiving because it was opening at 7. Of course we didn't really have any customers for a couple of hours. My g/f is in the midst of working crazy hours now with their extended store hours as well. I think the week before Christmas, they're open until 11. Good luck and stay sane! If I have to go to any malls, I'm taking public transportation.
In 1996 when we had the back to back blizzards, the whole development where my parents lived was so socked in, but we needed to get out to the grocery store in between storms to stock up a bit and I was one of the few cars to get out of there. To keep the momentum of my car going, I went up the wrong side of the street and held my breath hoping nobody would come towards me, but I would have been stuck like the half dozen other cars were if I went the way they did. I had a nice laugh then, too!
Our hours this week are normal, next week mall hours are 9AM to 10 PM and the following week 8AM to 11PM. Not happy times. Thank god I got two weeks of vacation left, I will need them. Happy shopping and try to be nice (more like patient) to all service employees, even if they are a little rude. They may have had a bad day.
You too, take it easy out there! I think being in the service field at one time really has helped me learn to be patient when I shop. I see how customers carry on and its so embarrassing. I did some shopping last weekend, but I'll do some more in the coming weeks.
The funny thing is that the N27 will still have it's last run at 6:44pm back to Glen Cove (Weekday), 6:32pm (Saturday), and 6:40pm Sunday. Well at least it runs on Sundays now. So if I want to stay late at the mall, I'll need a friend to drive me back. None of the other LI Buses are running extra late night runs either for the late malls hours. Just another example of how you need a car to survive in Nassau county.
Or at least a lot of friends who are willing to drive you around.
Montgomery County already closed schools for tomorrow before the first flake fell...
I just heard that! Enjoy your day off! I still don't know if I'm going in or not tomorrow, it just depends on what it looks like in the AM. It sounds like its going to be an all day event. Luckily, the 1C travels mainly on main roads, so that might not be too bad of a choice. They might bypass Seven Corners Shopping Center though since there is a huge hill to get to the bus stop.
From the Severe Weather Emergency Plan (they had it on their website one year before a storm):
1B,C,D,
E,F
Potential Problem Areas: Patrick Henry Drive, Williston Drive, Peyton Randolph Drive
Alternatives: Operate via Seven Corners Shopping Center, Leesburg Pike, Wilson Boulevard
1,D,E
Potential Problem Areas: McKinley Road, 10th Road, Livingston Street (Dominion Hills)
Alternatives: Operate via Wilson Boulevard between McKinley Road & Livingston Street
If you want a copy of the entire thing (pre Branch Avenue although I can tell you the changes for that segment) complete with headways, train lengths, single track sections, spraying and scraping operations, and bus detours, e-mail me. I have it as an HTML file (as it appeared on their site) and I'll be glad to send it to you. It is about 32 pages IIRC so I don't think printing it is a really viable option.
Thanks for the info! That's all I need to see. I'll take my chances and hope the buses are running. I hear the worst of the storm is to be between 8AM and 1PM, so I'll try to get a 7:30 bus or so and get ahead of it.
Now forecasting 6 to 8 inches in Greater NY, more out on the east end.
I'm in mid-Suffolk, and it's really come down at this point. There's already a few inches on the ground. They already announced that they will be closing the schools early. It's a big mass of white, getting windy, and it's getting heavier.
Remember the month and one-half a certain group of local 100 Brothers & Sisters got to go for a walk ?
Today those members are deciding whether or not to stay in Local 100.
They are voting until 6 PM tonight.
Roger T. was at this depot earlier this week to remind the troop how much he feels their pain. This groups main union man (from cTc) was recently removed from all responsibility in Local 100. George's mistake was to ask why when Roger said jump.
I can say all of this because I'm N-O-T in Local 100.
Any word on the outcome?
Keep us posted, please Thurston. If it goes through, it will be the start of several moves OUT of Local 100.
Mike Quill, rest in peace, must be turning over. Roger took care of Local 100 all right. How unfortunate, he demands respect but fails to give it. It seems that everyone is beneath him.
The private lines held the vote today, Wednesday, December 4 2002. The results are as follows:
Remain TWU Local 100: 62%
Create TWU Local 100-A 38%
The private lines remain under TWU Local 100.
That's right the Brother's & Sister's will stay in Local 100.
This just in, that group is already gearing up for the next union election, they call themselves "Opposite Directions" < G >
What was interesting about the vote was that at both QSC & Jamaica the numers were about 50/50. The former head of the "private" group is based in cTc. They lost big there 25/75. If George had won big at cTc they would have won. Bet he's kicking himself today.
As an old Teamster I've been thru some of this stuff & like Yogi said it ain't over until it's over.
[As an old Teamster....]
Don't be surprised if the Teamsters take note of TWU-100's internal friction and try to muscle in. They did that a few years ago in Orange County (California) with the promise of lower dues - and promptly gave the store away to management.
They'll come in if they are invited ... been there, done that.
Are the NovaBuses that Dallas has come with DD 50 Series engine?
What is that on the top of the NovaBuses #4300-4999? It's not on buses #5500-5699.
Are they model RTS-06 or RTS-08. The front tells me RTS-08.
Thanks in advance!
#'s 4300-4999 are RTS T80-206 built by Nova Bus. I believe the white "humps " on top of the buses I believe are the A/C units for these buses. I don't know why the change was made for the 5500-5699 group. When I get the chance I'll ask one of the drivers why the A/C unit isn't on top of the 5500 group.
[When I get the chance I'll ask one of the drivers why the A/C unit isn't on top of the 5500 group.]
The 5500 group uses a different air conditioning manufacturer than the earlier group of RTS's.
saw a fishbowl in former NYCT colors (blue top,grey bottom). What is this bus?
also, on Sat. Took Q32 #5--- (I think it was 5190, verify?) cross the queensboro Br. Does the Q60 use the outer roadway on the lower level?
Anyways, got off at 36th st. ran upstairs, and waited 5 minutes ( I counted) for a silverbird 7. Passed the bus at 48th, along with the bus ahead of me, #666 (which I found quite amusing). I have seen countless 32's, and not one orion suburban. When, exactly, do they operate? Accordng to my calculations, 1/16th of the buses on the 32 are Orin suburbans.
thanx
fishbowl had no numbers. spotted going north on Prospect Expy with no passengers. owner?
There isn't any Orion Suburban's on the Q32.Sure Casey Stengel has a few of em but they're used on the other routes instead lot's of times.
Add that the 32 also has buses out of Hudson Pier,if ever an Orion Suburban show's up,it's a miracle.You're more likly to get on one from one of the QV routes.
Actually there are several Suburbans on the q32, They mix them in, have been for about 2 years now. For about a month straight i rode home on 113 to Jackson HEights at about 4:30PM. They should not use them on this run as they get crowded and the load/unload times are long due to the seating configuration.
Some weeks it looks as if most of the Suburbans are scheduled on q32, other weeks there are just a couple.
By the way they are all in very bad shape - The seats are shot.
I have seen a few Orion suburbans on the Q32 as well but I mostly see them on routes like the Q13, Q14 and Q16 and from other bustalkers experiences, the Q44!
On the QV routes, I mostly saw the suburbans on the Q43 and in general, I see Orions [I'm including hard seat Orions as well] including 505-521 on the Q36 and Q43 a lot.
I used to see them on the Q31 quite a bit.
Actually its funny that thi Orion Suburban thing came up the day before we are to see snow. The last time we saw some real snow was a Saturday in January 2001 - and I was on my way to the city on a q32 Orion Suburban.
With NYBS pulling out in January as a result of the NYBS pension fund arent Queens Surface, Triboro, Green, Jamaica and Command in the same situation? What will stop them from terminating there operations as well? What happens to these pension funds in the companies declare bankruptcy? are the funds in escrow?
Has anyone heard any update as to the situation with the franchises? Does the MTA want to take this on without a subsidy from the city and can they afford to?
I don't know about the other depots, but at this one the pension plan is fully funded. The company is run by an individual, just like NY Bus. At Green, Triboro, Jamaica & Command, it's a group of related individuals.
I don't think any of them want to end up in the poor house.
Thurston,
I believe that the ownership of Green,Command,Jamaica and Triboro is as follows:
GREEN BUS-Is a privately held company with various stockholders with the Cooper family owning the controlling portion of the stock
COMMAND BUS-Is completely owned by Green Bus Lines Inc. Command is a division of Green Bus
JAMICA BUS-Is owned by the Cooper family with some partners
TRIBORO COACH-Is owned by the Cooper family with different partners than Jamica Bus.
Unless the company had some mergers within the past this is the current ownership structure. As a privately held company i believe that they have the right to keep the ownership structure private. If the stock was traded then the information will have to be filled with the SEC.
Thank You
All of the "privates" are corporations. My only point was that there are individuals and families from the top to the bottom that will be effected by Mayor Mike's desire to get out of the bus business any way/any how he can.
I have enjoyed employment here because of my working for a person vs. a corporation controlled by CEOs, Directors, Stock Holders, etc. who could care less about the workers. I've been there before, at Pan Am, where at the end one CEO after another arrived to see how much he could line his own pockets with before he was asked to leave. None cared for the future of the company as the founder & his son did.
The DOT Website states that the city owns most of the buses, which we know, but how many buses do the private lines own and what types, I assume that NYBS owns its fishbowls, but what do the others own?, I imagine it is a small number and most likely are the coaches that are
old and due to be replaced?
Any one have the breakdown?
The "Privates" aren't allowed to charter a City bus, i.e. funeral, retirement dinner, etc. so they all tend to buy back a few buses that nycDOT has retired. This also gives them a few bues over and above the min. "spares".
Not "making service" results in a big financial hit to them, so this give them a little cushion.
At this moment the QSC owner doesn't own any buses.
The best that i recall the following companies own no buses
They are Queens Surfice,Liberty Lines Express
The following companies own some buses but they do not run them on their DOT bus routes
They are Command,Jamica Bus,Triboro Coach
Command still owns several 1984 RTS Coaches but they have been retired or the buses are used by its sister comoany Varsity Coach
I believe that Jamaica and Triboro have one ot two fishbowls which are used for funerals etc.
The only company that still has their own equipment on DOT runs are New York Bus Service and i believe Green Bus Line which still operates one RTS #10001. If i recall this bus was a gift to Green Bus from GMC in appreciation to all of the buses that the Green Lines and its affilated companies Command,Jamaica,Triboro and Varsity purchased from GM for its fleet(In case of Varsity ity was schoolbuses)
I am not 100% suree of this
Thank You
[i believe Green Bus Line which still operates one RTS #10001. If i recall this bus was a gift to Green Bus from GMC in appreciation to all of the buses that the Green Lines and its affilated companies Command,Jamaica,Triboro and Varsity purchased from GM for its fleet(In case of Varsity ity was schoolbuses)]
I don't think Green Bus RTS #10001 was a gift. I think it was just one of the buses in the NYCDOT order, but instead of receiving its regular number, it got 10001 because it was the 10,001st RTS produced (I think Long Beach, California, received #10,000). I forget exactly what number it would have been, but 221 or 223 are possibilities.
It would have been GBL 221.
#10001 Q60
I'll admit I wasn't so thrilled about the arrival of the new gas buses since I'm accustomed to diesels. However, I got the chance to drive 839 today because all the diesels, including mine, were at the highway yard plugged into their built in block heaters cause some of them were difficult to start during the recent cold snap. So I got to spend the day with one particular bus that belongs to one of the senior drivers.
While my diesel makes about 525 lb-ft of torque, the V-10 makes a "mere" 425 lb-ft of torque. All that torque, along with 315 hp runs through a five speed automatic on the way to a 4:10 axle ratio. With this powertrain combo, this bus gets off the line about as quick as Bugs Bunny with a hotfoot. Acceleration is nearly effortless, despite the nearly 15,000 lb curb weight with no passengers. The exhaust note sounds like a CNG RTS. Disc brakes are on all four corners with antilock. The driver area is standard fare with tilt wheel and seat adjustments for rake and lumbar support. HVAC controls can be accessed while on the move but it can be a stretch to adjust the coach temperature. Tires are LT 225/75R16 all around with much more agressive tread than the diesels.
Around town, the ride is very good without much drama. The V-10 makes its presence known, snapping your head back if you're too quick with the go pedal.
Thumbs up for the V-10 power, no sweat acceleration, wonderful exhaust note, good riding characteristics, solid highway ride and a black rear bumper that adds a nice touch. Thumbs down for the poor fuel economy and the lack of cruise control. While the gauge cluster would satisfy most drivers, a tachometer and a transmission temp gauge would be welcome. It can be difficult to get into the driver seat from the coach and the lack of body mounted directionals is just inexcusable. Overall, this 2002 bus is a joy to drive, but I like my diesel bus just fine and I would not give her up for a gas version.
how about a pic of the new model?
About two years ago, WMATA put their entire severe weather emergency plan on their website. Naturally, I saved it on my computer. It is complete with train frequencies, number of trains, where trains will turn back if necessary, where scrape and spray operations will take place, station closings, the "Early Out" release plan, and identified problems for buses as well as alternate routes. It is a HTML file which I will send to you if you request it by e-mailing me.
The private lines held their vote today, Wednesday, December 4 2002 on whether or not to leave the current local or create their own smaller local. The results are as follows:
Remain TWU Local 100: 62%
Create TWU Local 100-A 38%
The private lines remain under TWU Local 100.
What does this mean for the future of the Privates?
#1600 BXM6
It means they're better off today than if they'd created a smaller local tomorrow.
I am offering The Bullits Again For Download, Please Send Your Requests To Me By E-mail and I Will Send The File.
So much for going into work today! I was going to and headed out for the 9:05 1C from Ballston to my office in Fairfax. Waited until 9:35 when the 1B was due, which isn't my bus, but I was kind of using it as a gauge. When that one didn't show up after a few minutes, decided my living room was a good place to stay the rest of the day. I called the office to find that only two of our 8 analysts showed up, so that sealed it even more for me. Thank God I have a lot of leave to take. My g/f had to be at work though as the malls are open. I may take the metro out to Pentagon City later to keep her company as I can't imagine it will be too crowded there today.
ah here in philly it is very big mess here .
Hwre I sit at work in Exton, Pa. (30 miles west of Philly).
Why don't they let us go home? I want to play with my snowblower
and spend some time on Bustalk!
Chuck Greene
Its slowing down here quite a bit. About 5 inches so far, maybe another inch or so by the time it ends. I hear that Philly and NYC are about to really get it. They should let you go home! I called my voice mail at work and no messages so far. I usually get about a dozen calls a day, so I think my agencies that I work with heard the weather that DC was getting nailed by the storm and figured nobody would be in. It will make tomorrow go by fast since I'll get to catch up on things.
People really make too big of a deal over these 5-8 inch snowfalls. Head on over to Buffalo and you'll see alot of snow. They laugh at us down here!
Yeah, I agree! My dad is from Buffalo and he tells me stories of horrible snowstorms, but the schools were open and everything else pretty much ran on time. The problem down here in DC is that its such a transiant city with people always coming and going from all over the world, that some may not be used to this type of weather and since its so rare lately that we get any decent snow, they don't have the experience. The rest of the problems are just due to stupidity and people thinking they can fly like its dry out there.
Well the longer we go between snow events, the worse people react whenever the inevitable happens. Snow is part of winter, even back in the 80s when I grew up, people didnt freak out like they do now.
I dont think we had one major snow event last winter. This winter's gonna be different. Also alot of people call this a pre-winter storm, but I consider this Winter, as December is the start of the climatological winter.
i remeber the blizzar of 96 that was a preety bad snowstorm philly got 32inchs from it.
I remember that too. I could not get my Black Neon into the garage, so I parked it at the head of the driveway. It was pretty easy to spot , the contrast of black against 32" of white snow!
Chuck Greene
When I was a kid, there was a really bad storm around 1977. It was the first and only time I saw my street closed for a few days because of snow. There must have been a few feet on the ground. The Q58 used to run on my street (I think it was the B58 back then), so as a bus street they were usually good at clearing my street. I don't know what they did with the Q58 while my street was closed, but it was about three days without cars or buses or anything going through. Parked cars were stuck in their spots for weeks. We haven't had snowstorms like that since. Although there were a few large ones in the 80's, but nothing like the one I remember from the late 70's.
That storm your talking about wasn't 77 it was Feb.78. but do you remember a another storm dropping about 13/14 inches about 2-3 weeks before that.As for the B58,in Feb 83 when had that 20 inch storm it took me 4 hrs(2pm -6pm)just get from John Bowne to Fresh Pond and Metropolitan.
I think it was during the storm of 83 when MaBSTOA's Grumman 137 which was assigned to FP's B53 had gotten stuck on Metropolitan Ave. just before 118 St. It had to sit there for a couple of days with a driver assigned.
I went to the Cloisters with some friends a few days after that blizzard. I called first to confirm that the path through the park from the subway station was clear. The information I was given wasn't quite accurate; the snow covered the park bench seats and some guy went by us on skis. That was an interesting day.
Oh yes the blizzard of '96 basically froze everything in the buses & subways. I remember when I went outside I only saw ONE bus on the B8 in BOTH directions and it was 3697[when the B8 was in UP] and I was outside for about 3 hours. Only the undergronud portions had running subway service but other than that it was frozen, we got hit with 25"[possibly more] of snow here in NYC and I was off from school for a week. I think this winter we gonna have lots of snow sibce snow had "backlogged" over the years.
People really make too big of a deal over these 5-8 inch snowfalls. Head on over to Buffalo and you'll see alot of snow. They laugh at us down here!
My cousin went to school up in Vermont, and 5-8 inches was basically a dusting up there. They do laugh at us. Sometimes we would get 2 inches of snow here, and all the newscasts are reporting on the "Big Snowstorm".
"Big Snowstorm".
hehe the newscast making a big deal over that hehe.
Around here newscaster make a big deal over a coating of snow.
People really make too big of a deal over these 5-8 inch snowfalls. Head on over to Buffalo and you'll see alot of snow. They laugh at us down here!
Yeah, we do laugh here in Syracuse!
Seriously, it's all about experience. Anyone who drives an automobile up here gains experience from driving in the snow/slush/ice so often. DPW administrators and snow plow crews have tons of experience, and usually know just when to dispatch the trucks to keep the roads clear.
It also doesn't hurt that they have these giant snow plow trucks up here with wing plows - those monsters can clear up to three lanes at a time. Pretty impressive, actually.
Jim D.
Syracuse, NY
My sophomore year at Cornell, close to three feet fell in one day. The county declared a state of emergency and closed the roads but the university remained open and classes still met. (But my exam that evening was cancelled. A perfect time slot for traying down Buffalo Street!)
Once when I was getting my car fixed, I was talking with someone who grew up in Green Bay and I asked the people up there probably laugh at us because we panic over 2 inches and he said yes.
I'm eating lunch now, and we have about 6 inches and it's snowing like mad. We'll be lucky to get out by 2 pm , the way this place operates. I'm off tomorrow, so I catch up on things at home. I hope my next e-mail to Bustalk is from home! Oh ,I hate work today...
Chuck Greene
I made it home OK! The roads are horrible. The trucks can't keep up
with the snowfall! I wonder how our "buses" are doing???
At least our boss gave us 1/2 day off with pay!!! The Traction Control in my Windstar finally paid off-it works!
Chuck Greene
Glad to see you made it home ok! Very nice that your boss paid you for a full day too, that makes it a little better. Tomorrow is actually going to be a real challenging day since a lot of this leftover slush will turn to ice. It isn't even going to get much about 30 here, so that will be fun.
Thanks! I appreciate your well wishes and posts. I'm glad I'm off tomorrow..
Chuck Greene
Enjoy your day off! Thanks for your well wishes too with my operation I had. Things are going fine. I have to go to the Dr. every week for the next few to make sure everything is healing up ok. He keeps extending the time to take antibiotics, but they're helping. The best thing is that I can smell things so much better and I'm so much more alert now that my airways have been widened. Its worth the little bit of discomfort.
Well My School left off early like about 11:45 AM today. Shore Road was crawling like hell and so as the hutchison river parkway and the Whitestone Bridge. I-678 in Queens was fine. Queens Blvd is OK but a bit icely since my school bus skid a little to the next lane and thank god she was driveing a bit slow. The Side Streets: OH BLODDY MURDER! ALOT OF SNOW ON THE GROUND AND NOT A PLOW TRUCK IN SIGHT!. My school bus going up the hill on my block(83 Ave) did not had any problems and I wish the driver and driver's helper good luck to getting back to the Jo-Lo Bus Garage as I got off.
BTW My school bus is a GMC Vandala #7713D if anybody likes to know
3 inches on the ground here in Sea Cliff, not a plow or shoveled sidewalk in sight !
Geesh only a few inches on the ground here is no excuse for buses not to be running. LI Bus better be running today!
Are things worse down in Washington??
It depends on where you are. The main roads appear to be clearing up somewhat as the chemicals are kicking in. There was one bus that Channel 4 caught of the Q2 bus in the Wheaton area stopping for a passenger and fishtailed slightly causing the passenger to run for the bus a bit. I'm sure some areas are in pretty rough shape. This morning, I gave up after 30 mintues waiting for my bus. One that was sitting off on the side at the Ballston station took a few minutes to get going as its tires were spinning. I'll probably just take the bus in to work tomorrow as anything that is on the road tonight will just freeze over.
Good luck up there!
Someone called WTOP to complain that the Metro website didn't mention that the D1 and D2 were not operating. It took the D2 45 minutes to show up, and once it did, it only made it a few block before the driver ordered everyone off the bus (an Orion II).
I slept until almost 12:30 so I missed the Price is Right, which I sometimes watch when I'm home during the day. Maybe I will watch Jeopardy! tonight since I haven't watched that in awhile (gameshows are fun!!!).
Hopefully, the evening rush will be a little better. According to WMATA's website now, some staff at the Pentagon are being let out so additional buses are being staged to ferry them home.
I have the Game Show network on as we speak. Just watched a Family Feud from about 20 years ago (great clothes back then!), now Card Sharks is on. This is a little newer one with Bob Eubanks. He seems to be on every game show possible!
I actually don't have cable but thats OK, I'm not much of a TV person to begin with. I have a few things to take care of (so far today I have hda breakfast and read e-mail and message boards) but I will probably take time to work on my website and/or do some BVE.
Sander just went by...
And I already have off tomorrow. Two four day weekends in a row, how do you like that?
I got off @ 1:00 PM today , and I have off Friday, also. A 3-1/2 day weekwend right after a 4 -day last week. I snowblew my driveway, and now I'm all set.
Chuck Greene
I love the game show network. When my wife was alive, she watched it all the time. My favorite (you just watched it ) -"the survey said...) . Richard Dawson was so much fun to watch!
It's still coming down here, and the plow just clogged up my driveway opening. So much for living in the suburbs!
Chuck Greene
Oh man, let me tell you about my commute coming home.
Ok, it starts from school, my teacher was absent for my 11:30 class[most likely from the snow] so I stay at school to chill until 2pm. Anyway, I grab something to eat then I walk to Adams St to catch the B41 LTD around 2:10, doesn't take long for it to come but it was a nightmare being ON IT. I know that it has to have reduced speed b/c of inclement weather so I'm on it and it takes so long to go via Flatbush Av. It took 40 minutes just to get to 7 Av[I'm not kidding] so we sit in traffic for some more time. We FINALLY reach Grand Army Plz at 3:00 and the driver announces that LTD stop service is suspended and he's making all local stops[I was going to Foster Av] so I'm like NO WAY I'm going any further after Empire Blvd with this so it takes 10 minutes to go btw GAP & Empire Blvd and I got to Empire Blvd at 3:10! A trip that normally takes 15-20 minutes between that stretch took 1 HOUR. I get off there and I take the Q local from P. Park to Newkirk, which is there as soon as I went downstairs and it takes only 7 minutes to get to Newkirk Av & then I walk home. Now if I had stayed on the B41, I would probably still be outside so that's my BAD commute.
RTS 9405 B41
R68 2848 (Q)
Well here's what I can tell you here in Sea Cliff. We have 5 inches on the ground and most of the local roads looked as if not one plow went down them. I decided to take a walk down to the N27 bus stop, just to see if it's running. Im glad I had by really high snow boots, since no one shoveled their sidewalks.
Anyway I observed a no-show on the 2:22pm N21. I saw an N27 heading into Glen Cove, running about 20 minutes late. Thats not bad considering the weather. But the N27 went straight down Glen Cove ave, and did not go its usual route.
At this time I was getting hungry, and figured I'd risk the trip to Greenvale. The N27, which would normally arrive at 2:35pm arrived at around 2:55pm, NOT BAD, considering the weather.
Suprisingly, 3 other people beside me were waiting at the bus stop. The ride was pretty slow, I'd say we did no more than 15-20mph. Everybody was going slow, even the SUV's (thank God).
The 3 mile or so trip to Greenvale took about 20 minutes, mainly because of traffic from parents picking up kids at North Shore High school, and the usual Glen Cove Rd traffic jam.
Even Glen Cove Rd and Northern looked bad. I finally saw some plows coming through Greenvale, though the sanders were skimping in sand.
All this time I never saw an N27 coming into Glen Cove, the bus that usually arrives in Glen Cove by 3:15pm hadnt shown up in Greenvale until 3:30pm.
I satisfied my craving (for the best Roast Pork around) and just walked on over back to the bus stop. It was around 3:50pm, an OOS bus passed heading N. The snow was really coming down, with poor visibility at this time. I didnt have to wait long till bus 328 appeared waiting at the light. This mustve been the 3:23pm bus, arriving around 3:55pm. Anyway I saw it shut down (stalled out?) while waiting and start back up. I never saw any N20's.
Going back no real problems, just being careful and keeping speeds under 20mph. There were alot of people waiting for Hempstead bound N27's, presumably waiting for that 3:25pm. When I got off at my stop, it was 4:10pm and I still saw no 3:25pm.
Walking back still no shoveled sidewalks (thank God I got these great boots). I did see an N21 heading to Flushing around 4:15pm (the 3:21pm?) empty with no passengers.
The main problem here though are the roads. The snow is also getting icy (higher water content). So far they are doing a poor job on the roads, but LI Bus has done pretty well under the circumstances.
How many of my fellow operators were or is gonna be out driving in this today?
I WILL!!!!!!
Regards,
Trevor Logan
This snow aint gonna stop me from having "the best roast pork around". If my N27 wont get me there, than I'll huff it.
Drive safely! Good luck to all bus operators on the board and to everyone, for that matter, that have to deal with this mess.
In my case it was more like sliding through the snow. Second Avenue in the 40's was especially treacherous. The RTS has a nasty habit of wanting to slide to the right regardless of which way you turn the wheel. The only way I was able to safely negotiate one particularly icy stretch was to jerk the wheel rapidly from right to left and left to right. Using this odd method allowed the bus to slide straight until I could get to a spot that had some traction. Many M15's were stuck in bus stops and a few others had minor fender benders. Conditions improved later in the day once Sanitation plowed and salted the roads. I observed artics on the M79 & M86 with chains attached to their rear wheels which seemed to help give them traction. On the way home tonight I spotted an artic on the Bx 12 without any chains. You'd think the TA would equip all of it's artics with chains during snowy and icy conditions.
I was out there from 12:30 till 8:40 and I caught hell . The majority of the people who used the Vince Lombardi P/R on Thursday went home between 1:30 and 3:30 : the only problem was that I was the only bus on the line. Normally at 2:30 pm I leave with 20-25 people but today I had 66 on a Flex. I had to leave people in the PABT. When I returned for my 3:30 trip I left with 63 once again leaving people waiting for the 1st bus other than me on the line. Today I earned my money.
Peace
Troy
I know this is bustalk but since I are T/O and is the same tpye of song. Hear I go.
"Dashing thought the Snow in the 8 car silver train. All the rail we go, sliding all the way. I hoping I stop this train. Here come that red Home Ball, while sh–int in paints. Oh no there it goes. Dose anyone have a cup for me. "
If anyone what to fix it up, I'll be happy to see it.
Robert
I was wondering if there exists a website or program that allows "online scanning" of radio transmission. It would be interesting to listen to the Bus Command Center announcements from home, especially whether or not the TA is providing regular service during such weather. Of course, I could just make a phone call, but the idea of listening to the actual announcements piqued my curiousity.
Does anyone know whether one can use their PC (along with WinMP or RA) to hear actual NYCTA radio transmissions?
Thanks.
(cc: SubTalk)
There was Javaradio.com, they used multiband radios across the whole world. These "javaradios" were able to pick up everything in the public service range, commercial radio,etc.
While the service exists, it is no longer free (you have to pay a fee for most sites). Visit www.javaradio.com for more details.
I've been listening to the NYCT Bus Command center for a while now, boy those guys and gals are certainley earning their money today.
The Bus service in NYC has been a real mess today.
John, thanks. I'll check it out.
Fifth Avenue Coach, how have you been listening? Home scanner, or online? If online, please detail.
Thanks
There where no injuries. I heard this form a bus radio. Happen near 149st or 148.
http://www.geocities.com/acelaexpress6250/
http://amtrak182.tripod.com/theamlnewspage/
There are loads of accident reports on the scanner. The roads are covered with snow and ice, and at least here in Sea Cliff, not a plow in sight.
It is too dangerous to take the bus today. Perhaps if the roads were in better shape, it would be safer but from what I hear on the scanner,, there are new accident reports coming in every minute.
I wish all bus operators good luck, especially those in the suburban areas where road conditions are worse. Good luck and be safe!
I had to leave work to deliver some papers in the next town, and the roads are murder. They are slippery as hell. I was only driving 15-20 mph and skid through a stop sign. Luckily no one was near-by. It is a lot more slippery than it looks. It's a sheet of ice under the snow.
Down in NYC, there's also no snow plows out since I believe that they thought we were only going to get a sprinkle 1 inch tops, yeah there were loads of accidents in the metro area. To all drivers be safe out there.
[Down in NYC, there's also no snow plows out]
Mayor Blumberg or his Sanitation Commissioner appeared on one of the 6:00 pm news shows to say they had about 1,000 plows out on the City streets. I'm not sure who to believe!
The plows must have been invisible. Going to work today, I did not see a single plow from my house in Jamaica Queens to Brownsville in Brooklyn. Everybody at work was saying the same thing, no plows. On the streets, everybody was asking me all day, "where are the plows?" I did not start seeing th first plows until after 4pm. Disgraceful. The streets and highways were a disaster all day. I guess this lousy cheap ass mayor NYC voted into ofice figures he can save some money on salt and manpower by sending the plows out late near the end of the storm, at the risk and expense of every driver on the road. I truely hope NYC Democrats wake up and have a heavy turn out at the next election so we can get rid of this knucklehead blooming bloomberg idiot of a mayor.
BIG AL
Well we had the same thing here in Nassau too, didnt see any plows until 4pm. The roads were awful.
Im guessing the plows were "skimped" for the same budgetary reasons.
If it's gonna be a bad winter, we're in for a heap of trouble.
Ok, but they were non-existent until later on, the streets; even major streets were full of slush, causing unnecessary delays. Like my commute yesterday from school it took me 1 1/2 hours [1 HOUR on the B41 btw Adams St and Empire Blvd and it was a LTD!] to get home and it only takes 45 minutes, a hour tops every day [I take 2 buses every day coming from school]. Mayor Doomberg is really a pain in the ass, come on he's saying there was plows [not until 4pm & later] and now we have to suffer for 3 years b/c people voted him, thinking he'll help us in and he's talkin about a 2nd term HA!
Over on SubTalk, TrainDude frequently posts the MDBF numbers for the NYC subway car fleet. Does anyone have these numbers for NYC's different models of buses?
Jim D.
Selling this for a buddy of mine at EBay:
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=1923947726
(The minimum bid is less than what he paid for it....)
SOLD ALREADY!!
That "BuyItNow" Feature at EBay comes in handy.....
I might have another of these buses for sale very soon....will advise.
i read it in the news that the TA might strike by 12/15/02. Im trying to figure out what services would be suspended if this happens. i will probably be in long island that weekend and can get home via libus to green bus lines, but will libus be running at all?
AFAIK, the illegal strike planned by TWU 100 would only affect NYC Transit; LI Bus is operating under a completely separate contract. However, I wouldn't be shocked if LI Buses do not operate from Nassau into Queens, either at Nassau County's request or as a result of a sympathy job action.
Yes if we do strike, it would be an illegal action but consider this, the TA has yet to bargin in good faith, and the way we are treated by management needs to be addressed, I for one do not wish to strike, but if it becomes our only recourse, then so be it. The Taylor law has really taken away our bargining power, but like I said, we'll do what we have to do............
I once asked a driver that querstion, they said LI Bus NOT run in Queens out of sympathy for NYCT drivers.
If a strike is allowed to happen by the MTA, the it is a disgrace. The MTA needs to meet the union at the bargaining table and get a contract done. Its up to both sides to work as hard as possible, to keep NYC's "circulatory system" functioning.
[The MTA needs to meet the union at the bargaining table...]
My understanding is that Transit has met the union's PEOPLE, but not the union's DEMANDS.
What about LIRR and MNRR? Would they be on strike as well?
#1979 X1
No.
Peace,
ANDEE
They wouldn't be on strike. But their trains will be very crowded. Maybe extra trains will be added to handle the crowds that won't be able to ride the subways and/or buses. But don't count on it. The railroad unions may not go for it.
Federal law prohibits strikes by railroad employees. That hasn't stopped commuter rail strikes from occurring in Philadelphia (1982-83) or Boston (1986).
Yeah right, they better think twice before they even attempt to do so. Paturkey already promised he would fine the TWU $1 million a day and each striking member $25,000 for each day [throw in the Taylor Law as well] they strike although I think its just a measure to prevent them from striking. LI Bus should be running should a strike occur but I am not sure of that all I know is that if it actually happens it will affect NYCT and it would strand millons of passengers
Actually, instead of a strike they would probably stage a mass sick out which is one way of getting around the taylor law.
BIG AL
Just remember a couple of things about TWU. First back in 1980 when I walked the picketline at Faltbush Depot, while the higher ups Lawe, Bell, Bracken, and Quinnones told us to walk..they collected pay checks from the TWU. Secondly in 1966 Quill wasn't that great. that strike was a push by Quill to show his strength after unhappy members of Local 100 signed a petition to get the Teamsters in NYCTA. Quill approached Hoffa, a "SETTLEMENT" was reached and Quill pulled the strike to show he was in charge
Remember the current Local 100 is not backed by Sonny Hall...there is a big gap between the International and the Local
So....in a nutshell, what are you trying to say?
BIG AL
In a nutshell..Just remember who speaks for you and what his gain is..thats his first priority...not yours. Touissants personal vendetta for the TA clouds the issues. Talk the last couple of days from Queens and Staten Island is Amalgamated is not ready to walk with him. The privates had a breakaway vote that almost passed. When before any contract has solidarity been in such an uproar.
And remember the Union leadership who went on to management level jobs after negotiating contracts for you, because all their deals were setup ahead of time.
ALWAYS read between the lines. 11days last time got a lot of us the same thing on day 11 we could have had on day 1.
I guarantee you Queens and Staten Island buses will not be on the road in the event of a strike. If anything, the depots will stage a lock out for the ATU employees. They would not be subject to the Taylor law issues.
I know there is much under the table issues that are done to cushion the wallets of all those at the bargaining table on both sides. I would just like to see how far any of this will actually go and how it will be done which could financially ruin the union and many members depending on how such a walkout is carried out.
BIG AL
I think he's trying to say that 34,000 people don't want to dip into "emergency" money to buy gifts and put food on the table on Christmas. The union bureaucracy would benefit more from a strike than everyone else.
However, the absurdness of the MTA's latest offer indicates that they wish to DARE the union to strike. When you're offering a pay cut ten days before a potential strike, it shows that SOMEONE clearly believes that the union has no other option, which is somewhat arrogant in my honest opinion. I know of many businesses that have already paid for three days worth of shuttle bus service.
It's also interesting that the city plan involves very few buses. Mayor Giuliani had over 700 buses on standby last time, while the latest plan makes no mention of auxiliary service other than ferries. Clearly, this is going to multiply the effect that a strike has on the city. If the MTA is still making offers of this nature on December 11, the union should take a 4AM vote on December 16 to strike...before the courthouse opens ;)
They plan on utilizing the National Guard to operate city service equipment. Or so I've heard.
It doesn't matter. Here are the facts:
The TWU Local 100 EB voted to NOT receive any pay during a possible strike.
In 1980, the strike was a wash because you didn't stay out long enough and your union was too weak to sweat it out, where they would have been afforded amnesty.
Today, this union, or should I say, the mass membership as a whole, doesn't give a rats @$$ about the Taylor Law, the fines, the MTA or anything else for that matter. Let them try to collect $25 grand a day from me. LMFAO.
If you could see what this ungrateful city offered us, you'd understand. Or maybe you wouldn't, but that's my problem I suppose.
That's a tough statement from you. I saw the basic terms and it's obviously a non-starter. How is the sentiment different from 1999, when some employees weren't happy about the chance of a strike?
We'll have to wait and see how this plays out over the coming week. I have no problem sharing my personal opinions about the issue, but I won't go as far as to discuss the union particulars on a BBS.
You have to realize that whoever feared a strike in 1999 will most probably fear a strike in the future. The imposition of the Taylor Law penalties, fines and other sanctions are enough to devistate a family, career and the lives of anyone concerned. However, a law is only as good as it's enforcement. PLEASE, let's leave it at that.. for now.
It's not so much the penalties as it is the intimidation factor that the TA is using against the union. They know that they have us in a belly-up position. Because of the Taylor Law, they can come back with anything they please, and we either buck-up and swallow it, or we violate the law. One of the main differences today is the fact that just about everybody knew Willie James wasn't willing to go to prison under any circumstances; thus a strike was never a reality. Unlike Roger, who was elected under the 'militant dissident ticket' that he's claimed to be, and now must live-up to, or be bannished as was the James gang.
Anyway, I'm not going to discuss ANY union business, strategy, politics or actions on this forum. I will share ONLY my personal opinion as a NYCTA B/O and MTA NYCT employee.
If you're interested in the facts, please review the contract area at the TWU website. If you'd like my opinions, please feel free to reply or contact me via email.
Two last items. Food for thought:
1. Last night (December 5th), an officer from the NYPD came to Queens Village to collect a carton of Queens Bus Maps.
2. All NYCTA Surface Line Dispatchers are being scheduled for "Taylor Law Training" over the course of the coming week.
Draw your own conclusions to these facts. Mine are opinions only.
I respect your decision not to discuss union business, lest prying eyes see it.
As an outside observer, they are gearing up for war. I don't know if they'll get the heavy fines proposed last time because this contract is obviously a non-starter. Let's hope that the City's energies are spent more constructively in the next few days.
If there is a mass sick out, Doctors are going to be making money writing out doctor's lines.
I think LI Bus and Green Bus are going to be very overcrowded. You may be able to get a bus. But you may not be able to get on it.
May BLX give his opinion as an ATU-1056 B/O back when we went out over 20 years. We walked in April, the weather was warming up, the kids were off from school from spring vacation. Ed Koch urged the public to walk, hitch, etc. That's when the style of working women wearing sneakers and changing to shoes at the office took hold. Anyway, we were out less than 2 weeks. We got pretty much the same raise before the strike. We lost a day's pay for the day's we didn't go to work and were fined a day's pay per the Taylor law. The union made a big mistake. Roger also made a mistake by keeping out the Queens privates last summer only to settle for practically the same thing. It only showed that he was a radical ready to go to war no matter what his members say. He has some valid points on discipline. They are so quick to 'suspend/pending dismissal' that's it's scary. Do you know how many people get their jobs back going the legal route? Alot, and it's costly to the TA. As for health benefits, it's a new era. Members must understand that they need to pay some co-pays and have caps on certain benefits. Benefits back in the 70's and 80's were like an endless vault of money. Doctor's billed for everything and got paid everything. They screwed it up as well as workers who double dipped the insurance companies (send bills to both husband & wife insurance carrier-get paid twice). BLX says there will not be a strike.
I see your points regarding health issues. Almost everyone has to pay for their health benefits now. My company dropped HMO's and now it's going to cost me plenty this year. I just lost my wife 6 weeks ago to cancer (I posted this before), and I am sitting here thinking how the heck I was going to pay all her bills if she was still alive.
Everything after my $1000 initial pay is only covered 80% with this new Blue Cross plan. When you think about MRI's and CAT-Scans, the hit in your wallet is staggering.
What kind of deal are transit workers getting? I hope it's a better plan than mine!
Chuck Greene
"BLX says there will not be a strike."
Good, and while you're at it, secure my raise.
Springfield, MA -- Peter Pan Bus Lines today announced it has signed a purchase and sales agreement with Coach USA, the first step in Peter Pan's acquisition of Coach's five New England affiliates - The Arrow Line, Bonanza Bus Lines, The Maine Line, Pawtuxet Valley Lines and Coach USA Boston.
According to Peter A. Picknelly, president of the Springfield based intercity bus line, "This acquisition allows Peter Pan to enlarge our footprint in New England and virtually doubles the size of our company by adding complementary elements to our core business. Bonanza's Boston-Providence-New York service and their service between Cape Cod and New York will be added to our existing line run business, and Arrow Line, as a leader in the Connecticut charter business with existing contract service for Foxwoods Casino, extends our charter business.
Bonanza and Pawtuxet are both based in Rhode Island, Arrow Line is in East Hartford, Milford and Waterford, Connecticut, Maine Line is in Portland, and Coach USA Boston in Boston, Massachusetts
Let's try that with Ps instead of Os... :)
In railroad terms, Arrow, Bonanza, etc. would be called 'fallen flags'. Some truly classic names in New England bus history.
Good riddance, Coach USA.
Jim D.
I'm not surprised that Peter Pan picked up Bonanza with their Providence/Cape Cod/Boston/NYC runs (as I speculated in earlier post), but I am surprised that they picked up the other Coach USA New England ops (Arrow,Maine Line, Mini Coach Of Boston). I don't know how much charter business Peter Pan does currently, but Maine Line, Mini Coach Of Boston, and Pawtuxet Valley don't do line runs,Arrow I believe does Foxwoods line runs from several CT cities and towns along with the Foxwoods shuttles as well as charters. I would guess they will be expanding their charter and shuttle business. I can't wait to see if they'll repaint the Nova RTS Arrow uses at Foxwoods, or if they'll replace any of the other coaches owned by these Coach USA companies. Mini Coach Of Boston has mostly Van Hools, the others as far as I know all have mostly MCI's. Peter Pan's current fleet is all MCI.
Mark
[... I can't wait to see if they'll repaint the Nova RTS Arrow uses at Foxwoods ...]
Peter will be rolling the dice & Dinker Bell will be serving the drinks ;-)
Does Arrow own the RTS buses used at Foxwoods?
Jim D.
[Does Arrow own the RTS buses used at Foxwoods?]
The buses were owned by Arrow and/or Coach USA. Some of the RTS's were in service at Rutgers prior to the takeover of that service by Academy from HML (a subsidiary of Suburban, a Coach USA Company).
There were a few Nova LFS's in service at Foxwoods, but I haven't been there for awhile, so I don't know if they are still around.
When I visited Foxwoods last December, there were only RTS buses in service for Coach USA. There was also at least one RTS '03' bus (with the retrofitted squareback air conditioning) painted in a Foxwoods paint scheme - I believe that bus is owned by the casino.
Jim D.
Some of the Foxwoods LFS buses were reassigned to Coach USA's shuttle operation at Philadelphia International Airport, as were a couple of ex-Rutgers Nova RTS coaches. These buses replaced second-hand Neoplan buses that CUSA had purchased from Dallas. The telltale sign at PHL as to which LFS buses were originally bought for PHL and which were transfered from Arrow Line (Ct.) is that the PHL buses are numbered in the 200s while the ex-Arrow Line buses retained their 5 digit numbers.
So, they got rid of all the Flexibles that they had ?
I woke up this morning at about 4 AM, and saw the snow sticking, so I thought when I woke up again that it would be snow to close the malls.
IT WASN'T. CRAP. So I showered and got ready for work. Dug out my driveway (well most of it anyway) and cleaned off my car, including the top. After all of that, headed for work.
As I was traveling down Sheriff Road, saw my first spin out. This dude, was really going slow, but still spun out. His car was wobbling traveling down the road and seemed like he should have just stayed home and leave the driving to REAL SNOW DRIVERS LIKE ME.
After that, saw my first bus traveling in the snow which was 9766, looked like it had no problem going down the street. Next bus was an Orion II. Before I continue, if you are reading this and drinking anything or eating anything, please chew and swallow fully, because this might make you crack up.
It looked like 3731 or 3721, but anyway it had a hard time getting up Sheriff Road, and it wasn't going up a hill. There was one person pushing from the back, putting down what looked like kitty litter to give the bus some traction. It didn't work. There were also about 10 people looking at the bus struggle up the street. I think most of them were probably laughing. They also probably had to get behind the bus to push it further. I had to concentrate on driving and not to crack up too much, lest I lose control and crash into something. THAT WAS HARD TO DO.
Anyways, went further down the street, passed by a New Flyer, no problem. I past the Minnesota Avenue Station and saw a couple of New Flyers and one Flxible running the X2. The X2 was not running any artics, I think it might be because the artics don't have much traction in the snow, could somebody clarify me on this if it is true.
Anyways, continued down Minnesota Avenue, passed by a couple of buses and they seemed to have no problems. I did see a couple of Flxibles breezing up 395 like it was nothing. Got to the mall only to see about four DASH buses stuck behind a stuck tractor trailer, spinning its wheels. Two of the buses backed up and I think went over the divider to continue on. Cursed the fact I had to go to work.
After 12 hours later and about $1200 more dollars than I thought I would do, I headed home. The streets by this time was clear so, I could drive a little faster, but still cautiously. Didn't make too many observations, but did plan to pass by Bladensburg to see if I could see any Neoplans, didn't. So I got any idea to pass by Landover to see if any Neoplans were there, as Landover usually get buses delivered there, and store them before they go into service at other garages. WHAT LUCK. Saw about four there, sitting next five retired MANNs. Out with the old and in with the new. Almost home and saw an A12 diversion and then got home where I am now of course. Pretty interesting day.
I decided to take the bus into work this AM instead of driving since I figured the streets would still be a bit messy. Got Orion V 4245 on the 1C, which was right on time. When we got to Seven Corners, the driver from the 1E coming out of the shopping center told our driver not to go in there because it was too slick. However, it was too late for us to not go in as we had started to make the turn off of Rte. 7. So, we went down the offramp hill that takes you onto Rte. 50 East instead of the normal 45 degree angled hill into the bus stop area, and there is an opening off the service road we used to turn back into the parking lot. Confused passengers started running down the hill after us thinking we weren't going to pick them up. Probably thought we were going to just go back on Rte. 50 and go a different way. So, here we are mired at the bottom of that 45 degree angled hill having to go up since there was no other way. A 22A, Flx Metro D 9783 had also made it to the bottom and our driver told him he shouldn't be there either and to get a running start to make it up the hill. So we sat back while the driver of the 22A floored it up the hill. Our turn was next and the driver gunned it as well while I said a little prayer for us. Our driver was great. When I got off at my stop, there was a mound of slush against the curb, so the driver warned all of us to be careful getting off and he sat there until all of us made it on to the sidewalk safely. I wished him safe driving and on I went.
Always good to get a running start. Well I am off of work today, have to run some choirs, and hoping to take a quick pic passing Landover of the Neoplans. I think I didn't see any bike racks on them, of course it was dark and snow covered and I didn't get a good look. It seemed like other than the Orion II, it didn't seem that any of the buses I saw had problems, some looked like they had no problem at all dashing through the snow.
Enjoy your day off! It should be easier to get around today.
Is it unusual for an Orion II to be in your neck of the woods? Why on Earth would one of those things be on the road? I'm sure that driver was ready to go home after getting out of that mess. Channel 4 was in Forestville most of the day and I caught a glimpse of a "The Bus" 40' Thomas go by.
Almost, where I live it is about ten minutes away from D.C. and about 15 minutes away from the Minnesota Avenue Metro Station. The U4 uses Orion IIs most of the time with a 30' Orion V once in a while.
I also live about 15 minutes away from the Landover garage, and about
15-20 minutes away from Bladensburg garage.
The Bus has about five forty footers, circa 2002 and about 4 thirty footers, circa 2000, was five, one was destroyed by an arsonist, who also destroyed two Champions and one Gillig 35'.
My wish would be for The Bus to step up and purchase some real buses, instead of some of their buses they have. The Thomas buses can stay, they aren't that bad, and I like the SLFs and the Gilligs, but the Champions and the cutaways can go to shredder. They are about to increase one of their higher passenger routes the 20 up to 20 minutes during rush hour. The 20 and 21 are their busier routes, and they are the ones that uses the 35 and 40 footers. The only other route that uses 35' and 40' footers is the 22, and they only use them because those buses go out of service on the 20 at New Carrolton and instead of deadheading, takes over for buses going out of service at what was once Landover Mall. I wish that the 22 would be extended to New Carrolton instead of terminating at Landover Mall. They could get more passengers that way.
Yeah, I'm wondering if they'll get more heavy duty buses now that they are expanding so much. I've seen the Gilligs once or twice, which seem fine for a system like that.
I wish they would stop buying cutaways. When they started buying SLFs, they would be turning the corner into buying real buses, but later that year they still would go back to buying cutaways.
I bet as they get more popular and get more ridership, they'll dump the lightweight buses and go for more heavy duty ones to handle the rigors of the runs.
I'm waiting to see Ride On get popular enough so that they purchase artics in the future. However, a lot of their runs go through such small roads, they wouldn't be suitable. I guess if the I-270 routes became popular enough, they could run them on there, or a route like the 46 that stays on Rockville Pike most of the time.
They have some routes that might be able to use some now, like the 55 and maybe the 62. The 46 could use one or two on some runs, but not all of the time.
The TA came back with their demands, and counter offers. Email me for details.
Hey Bklyn:
Can you email a brotha details also?
"Showing Disdain to the House of Pain."
7 more days to go.
The TWU posted the information on the website. It's all there, with the exception of editorial comments and such.
Enjoy!
Regards,
Trevor Logan
www.transitalk.org
That's better than my X15 did yesterday.
We pulled into the stop on Old Town Road and Richmond Road, and for those of you that don't know there is a small incline up to W. Fingerboard Road. We picked up people and then started to pull out, went forward, but the rear of the bus slid and was 2 inches from hitting a pole - so we were stuck. Another X15 passed us and made it up the small incline while we were stuck.
Keep in mind, NO PLOW OR SALTER had been in the area.
As we were sitting on the bus, in the opposite direction, some cars were skidding and playing bumper cars with the curb. Then comes an MCI going back for trip #2. He goes very slowly and waited for all traffic to cleear before going down the small incline. He made it fine. Then comes along a S76 4XX bus Orion. The bus started slowly down the incline, but started to skid. The driver had the wheels properly turned into the skid. He skidded once and then again, but no accident. Some cars and school buses also skidded. Then comes along another X15, which picks us all up and doesn't even pull into the stop. He starts pulling up the small incline. The wheels were turned but bus kept going straight. So now there were 2 X15's down at the stop.
I said screw it and then walked down Old Town Road to the SIR train, and took the ferry.
So much for that.
Ah, the efficiency of express buses! Of course, when everybody is stuck, they all run to reliable and efficient means of transportation.
Yeah, don't you just love that?
Carlton
Cleanairbus
Transit Is My Drug
Wow....what a night shot on what is admittedly a hard night to shoot!
I espcially like how the snow acts as a reflector to give the bus a bit of a "glow".
Thanks Trevor!
Regards,
Mark Valera
Damn that's a great shot - you definately know how to use a camera!
Hope to experience your driving sometime... I don't ride Rockland Coaches regularly, but would you kindly repost your schedule again?
I printed it out before but I don't know what the hell I did with it, just like all my other papers, they wind up in that black hole...;-)
Thanks.
Wednesday:
3:00p 20 From Harrington Park to W Nyack Palisades Center Mall
4:10p 20 From W Nyack Palisades Center Mall to PABT
6:40p 14E From PABT to Montvale
9:10p 9A From GWBT to New City, NY
11:30p 9A From GWBT to New City, NY
Thursday & Friday:
2:26p 11C From Westwood to Spring Valley, NY
3:30p 11A From Spring Valley, NY to PABT
6:10p 21T From PABT to New Milford
7:20p 84 From Westwood to GWBT
8:30p 14 From GWBT to Harrington Park
9:15p 14 From Harrington Park to GWBT
10:30p 14 From GWB to Harrington Park
Saturday:
3:09p 11A From Westwood to Spring Valley, NY
4:07p 11C From Spring Valley, NY to GWBT
5:45p 11C From GWBT to Spring Valley, NY
7:15p 11C From Spring Valley, NY to GWBT
8:45p 11C From GWBT to Spring Valley, NY
Sunday
4:00p 20 From Harrington Park to PABT
5:15p 9A From PABT to New City, NY with a 5:40p Stop at GWBT via City Streets
7:40p 9A From New City, NY to PABT
9:30p 20 From PABT to Pearl River, NY
That's It!
Regards,
Trevor Logan
I use to ride Red & Tan daily in the early '80s. Do they still run the 11K,this stayed on Kinderkamack Road between Westwood and Hillsdale, or the straight 11 which stayed on Broadway between Hillsdale and Park Ridge?
Peace,
ANDEE
Nope, All we have now is the....
9 PABT to Stony Point, NY with Some Short Turns in Central Nyack and New City, NY
9A GWB to New City, NY
11A PABT to Stony Point with Some Short Turns in Hillsdale, Park Ridge, Montvale & Spring Valley, NY
11C GWB to Spring Valley, NY
14 GWB to Harrington Park with Some Extended to Westwood
14K GWB to Harrington Park via Knickerbocker Road
14E PABT to Montvale with Some Short Turns in Harrington Park
20 PABT to West Nyack, NY (Pal. Ctr Mall) with Some Short Turns in Nanuet, Tappan, Blauvelt & Pearl River, NY, also There is two 20s from the GWB to Tappan, NY in the AM.
21 PABT to New Milford
25 GWB to New Milford
33/45 PABT to Mount Ivy, NY via Washington Township, Woodcliff Lake & Upper Montvale
45 PABT to Mount Ivy, NY via Upper Montvale
45A PABT to Mount Ivy, NY via Woodcliff Lake & Upper Montvale
45E PABT to Mount Ivy, NY Super Express, first stop is Spring Valley, NY
45/47 PABT to Mounty Ivy, NY. This Route is funky because it combines the route 45 and 47 together. It acts like a 45 up unitl Upper Montvale, then it acts like a 47 from Upper Montvale to the PABT.
47 PABT to Stony Point, NY with Short Turns in Nanuet & New City, NY
49 PABT to Sonty Point, NY with Short Turns in New City, NY
84 GWB to Westwood
84L GWB to Rockleigh with Short Turns in Northvale
That's It!
Regards,
Trevor Logan
Thanks, Trevor
Peace,
ANDEE
The straight "11" which ran on Broadway between Park Avenue in Park Ridge and then to Westwood has not run in over 10 years although there are bus stop signs along Broadway. The regular "11A" stays on Kinderkamack Road then turns on Hillsdale Ave, then south on Broadway.
I see you got M/T off. Thanks for the schedule. Ill either IM or email you about joing you for a trip.....
"Showing Disdain to the House of Pain."
7 more days to go.
oooooooooooooooooh, SHINY!!!
Hey Trevor, doesn't that bus have more than 6 tires?
Nice photo though.
BIG AL
Yes it does, 8 to be exact, but if you look back a few post prior to the photo being posted, the title was a continuation from another post.
Regards,
Trevor
Oh...gotcha. I stand corrected. Yow...gotcha.
My six tire sleigh was at the yard staying warm with her block heater plugged in cause the boss didn't want to send them out into the hills of Sound Beach and Rocky Point. So I took a van and picked up a total of two people! Easiest day I ever had. At least my tires didn't get ruined since I had Armor All'd them the day before.
Nice pic...to bad Red&Tan won't wash it for another 2 weeks!!
Er...don't you mean EIGHT-tired sleigh? Not to bust your hoo-ha, but it does have a dually middle axle.
-F.
How do you post pics on here? I've been trying to figure out for a while. Is it hard? Thanks in advance.
I'm going into Manhattan tonight and I'm taking pics and observations! Any requests or anything I should know about? I'll be basically around the area of the Empire State Building and possibly by the Christmas Tree at Rockerfeller Center.
As promised earlier this week, here is my story.
I was in the New York "All-City" High School Marching Band from August 1996 to June 1st 1997. During that time, I was in alot of parades...in particular the New York Yankees parade in 1996! Even though we was behind the Macy's baseball glove and in front of the Guardian Angels...there was something that stood out in that parade. I'm not sure of the number but a bus from New York Bus Service was wrapped in "Pin Stripes" with the Yankee logo. I saw it at home as my dad taped it for me.
What's my point? NYBS is a landmark bus company that will always be remembered by New Yorkers whether you live in the Bronx or Manhattan.
I will miss NYBS!
Let's not count NYBS out yet. Remember what Yogi said, "IT A'INT OVER TIL IT'S OVER."
Three more weeks to 2003 and there was suppose to be getting orion 7 in some depot before the end of the year. Hello where are they? I know we still have three weeks to go but if they were coming wouldn't they be here by now on some roads? I know I'll be saying this Jan 1 2003 too but this is and early start.
Rumor or Facts????
Most of you love these...rts buses. I don't know why but what series?
I sick of them but if they where take all of them off the road the only one I would want to stay is the 5000 series only because of the soft seats ONLY.
lets debate.....
The 1990 RTS's and newer aren't going anywhere for awhile. However, everything that is pre-1990 will be dead within' a short amount of time.
***pre-1990 (RTS's) will be dead within' a short amount of time.***
Don't count on it...
BIG AL
Right. They're all coming to southeast Queens where they'll proivide service for another 15 years.
Are those buses in such a bad condition that they could not be rebuilt as well and kept on the road in NYC? Would it be cheper to replace them? Will they be sold to other operators (RIPT in Rhode Island?) or are they scrapeed?
I read somewhere that many older buses wind up in other countries.
Well the RTS is the rock of the fleet so they aren't going anywhere anytime soon. I really don't have a problem with the RTS, they move people and that's what matters most and they have REAL strength and quality compared to some models now. The remaining GM's and the early TMC's will be goners soon but the later ones built from 1990 are going nowhere near scrap plus selected 1990 and all 1993 TMC's are getting a mid-life rehab. 9250-9349 are the soft seaters, NOT THE 5000'S they just have padding. Looks like I have to tell you what fleet #'s is cushion/suburban seats and what's padded.
4873-4888 Suburban
4900-5249 Padded
9250-9349 Suburban
9350-9534 Padded
I know that what I am about to say may go against just about every bustalker here, but that's okay, it's still my opinion. My favorite RTS buses are the 1981 thru 1987 models.
One of the reasons I feel this way is because of what they represented to me at the time of their delivery: clean, graffiti-free, tinted windows, air-conditioned, forward facing seats, digital roll signs, comfortable riding buses - amenities I never thought I would experience with the MTA's local bus service.
Now granted, the Grummans were the first MTA buses to incorporate all of these features, but they never stayed on the road long enough to appreciate them. The RTS's on the other hand, came on the scene with full force, took everything the city had to offer - big time overcrowding, potholes the size of valleys, vandalism, hill as steep as buildings, ran into the ground 24/7 and still kicked major ass in NYC some twenty years later.
I know that we all love our beloved new looks (GMC or flexible), but let's face it, they were a filthy hot mess by the late 70s and early 80s. I remember many of times while sitting in the back of the new looks, whenever it pulled off, the middle of the floor would rise and would remain this way until the bus came to a stop.
The second reason the 1981 thru 1987 models are my favorite are the engines 6V71 and 6V92. For some reason that even I can't explain, I like these engines. They sound like buses. Unlike these newer engines like the Detroit Series and Cummings, which sound like mack trucks.
I understand and appreciate that these engines are used in order to cut down on air pollution, but they sound like trucks. Now I have gotten used to the sounds of the 8600 - 9600 and 4900 - 5249 series RTS's, but those RTS's that NJTransit operates are the worst sounding things I have ever heard. But I still love them. They are comfortable and man can they move.
To sum it up, there hasn't been an RTS built for any bus company that I didn't like (except the low-floor models), but as I said the '81 thru '87 are my all time favorites.
When did these orion bus bank come out? And where are they locate? I try royal coach no luck and ideas? It's Christmas.
There wre only 2,000 of the Orion bus banks made in China by the manufacturer, and all went to Orion to be distributed ONLY to those bus companies who bought Orion V's.
Not sure if Royal Coach got that contract from Orion to do the striping, but so far I have seen only one in my hands, was with PaTransit (Pittsburgh, PA) striping....one other one on EBay this week, and another in Sacramento RT colors (Sacramento RT got theirs blank white, and an official there sent one down to me to be repainted about three years ago). I did repaint one in PaT colors to MTA NY City Bus recently for a customer.
As they were made about five years or more ago -- and ONLY distributed to bus companies who bought Orion V's -- it is VERY hard to find one out on the open market. If they do show up on EBay, they usually command a VERY high price, generally over $50.00!!!
Well if you know anyone who is looking to sell one please let me know. This is like finding a needed in a hay stack.
Well if you know anyone who is looking to sell one please let me know. This is like finding a needle in a hay stack but I don't give up.
Keep checking EBay...that's the ONLY place you will find one. Most collectors who managed to get them located them on EBay.
Fair warning though, be prepared to pay $$$ for them. They command a very high price.
Yeah...no joke. I tried to get one and it went in upwards of 76.00....completely uncustomized, no less. These things MUST be rare.
Keep checking EBay...that's the ONLY place you will find one. Most collectors who managed to get them located them on EBay.
Fair warning though, be prepared to pay $$$ for them. They command a very high price. The one that was on EBay the past couple days went for $66.00!! (That seems to be about the normal final price.)
DAMN I miss an orion bus bank. Well if you know anyone looking to sell one I'll go as high as 75.00 dollar for an orion bus bank. Please let me know. Thanks
You're in the right ballpark, then. Keep on searching!
-F.
I just sold one on eBay (PAT Pittsburgh) for $76. Still have one remaining NYCTA in my collection, but not for sale.
Decided to do a little exploring and photography this afternoon. Got on the Metro at Friendship Heights (Breda 3237) and went to Rockville, where I took pictures of the trains from the south end of the platform. Went down to see what bus I should take and where. My plan had been to go up to Milestone on the 55 and catch a 70 but that didn't happen. I hadn't factored in rush hour when I planned this so after taking a few pics of the Capitol Limited, I rushed downstairs and caught Orion V 5547 on the 55. This was one hell of a slow trip with lots of stops, we were 4 minutes late when we got to Montgomery College, and who knows how late we were by the time we got to Lakeforest. I had decided somewhere between 370 and the time we reached the Gaithersburg city limits I was not going all the way to Milestone. 5547 and 5558 (59) played one of those whos going to make it there first games to Lakeforest. Also, 5814 broke down along 355 so we had to take some of its passengers. At Lakeforest, I got off, and the J8 came almost immediately. I paid a dollar, forgetting it was only 50 cents, and the driver didn't catch it in time, but he gave me an all day pass (which I really didn't need). The bus was Orion V 4408, in SmarTrip livery, and the trip down 270 was fast. I saw 2 Flxible Metro-Ds on northbound 70s. I had expected us to ues Old Georgetown Road to go from 270 to Bethesda, but we used 355, which was pretty slow. I then waited at Bethesda for the 27 (5113). Saw several buses of intersest go by, 4372 is at Montgomery as is 9384 and 8833. 8855 is at Montgomery. I hope to get the pics up this weekend along with the pictures I took in NYC last week.
Next excursion: 70 (hopefully, I think I figured out the best way to do it)
Why is 8855 there? This bus might have been to more garages than any other bus I have known. Began it career at Bladensburg, then transferred to Western, had a short stint at Royal, then quickly back to Western and now at Montgomery.
I rode 5547 this morning on 46 southbound, the driver of 5547 seemed pretty nice. I got off at Twinbrook and took a cutaway on 45 to my gf's house. Later on, we got on another Cutaway on 45 back to Twinbrook, where i spotted 5705 in service on route 26-Glenmont, it had no banner. We got on a 1999 Gillig to Montgomery Mall, spotted a few Flixes and Gilligs there on Layover. On the way back, I spotted Flixible 9379 at the metrobus Bus Bay at Montgomery Mall with it's wheelchair lift stuck open. It seemed to be trapped in the snow, behind it was a maintainence truck as the driver and a maintainence man tried to free the lift from the snow, I'm not sure if it was mechanically or physically disabled since they had to manually crank it back in. I also got a few pictures of them doing this which I will be more than willing to share via email. I took 57xx towards Glenmont back to my gf's house, at Twinbrook I sighted 5705 again on 26-Montgomery mall.
That is the first time that I have heard that bus number, since Conrad Johnson had his life prematurely taken away.
Let's not forget him
I did see 5705 a couple of weeks ago, but it's the only time I've seen it since those terrible days. I rode 5722 on Tuesday and it still has the "In memory of Conrad Johnson" sign on it. On this same day I decided to some quick bus riding during the evening rush hour. I started out with the 5712 on the 12, then 5604 on the 16 to Silver Spring. It was getting really cold so - I decided that I'd take the F6 to West Hyattsville and then take Metrorail home. I got Orion VI 2045 on the F6 which was a fun and fast ride and some lady was complaining because the B/O moving too fast for her. At West Hyattsville I spotted Flxible 8750 approaching doing some sweet Flxible type leaning as it negoitated the curves. Of course I could resist and it turned out that 8750 was a F6 heading toward Silver Spring so I decided to take it and catch Metrorail another day.
Wayne
The 8700s had a great lean when turning. That's one of the things that I like about the Flxibles. Maybe that lady would like to ride the the "Turtle" driver, I was riding with a couple of months back, that would change her disposition. I don't mind a fast driver, slow is another story. One other thing, in that the Orion 6s seem to have fast take-off and can fly.
I agree with you about those Orion VI's. They do seem be very quick off the line and very fast too. That lady was probably one of those people who can never be pleased or even content. That same evening while I was on Ride-On's 5604 the B/O pulled over for about 2 minutes and many of the people started mumbling stuff. They don't seem to realize (or care) that the buses need to stay on schedule.
Wayne
People never realize that when a bus pulls over and waits, he is running "hot”. Here ln Philly they take great pleasure in watching drivers and nabbing them at time points if they are more than 1 minute ahead. Then you get "wriiten up" and disciplined. The theory of running ahead still appies, if you run 1 minute ahead, you miss all of your regular people,that are used to being on the street at a certain time, and your follower gets bombed with his people and "your" people.
Chuck Greene
But it is very true. While you are susposed to get to the bus stop a few minutes early, if you are running more than 1-2 minutes hot, you are going to miss people. You will run with fewer passengers, since not very many will be waiting, while your follower will have many more people to pick up. Because you will be gaining extra time as you skip stop after stop, your follower will lose time as he picks up the extra passengers.
Always better that the bus be 5 minutes late than 2 minutes early.
Thanks, Oren. I rode with a Philly bus driver in my younger days, and he taught me all the tricks. I loved to change the rollsign at the end of each run. He used to refer the passengers to me on how to get around the city by public transit if he didn't know the answer.
We would stop in South Philly on hot summer nights as he was ending his southbound run, and he'd buy me and him soft ice creams.
Boy was that a good time...
Chuck Greene
Happens all the time. If you go further up in this thread, I make a remark about how once we passed 5814, which had broken down, our stops became endless because there were even more people to pick up. Also, when playing catch up with 5558, whenever it was in front (which wasn't often), we hardly ever stopped but as soon as we passed it, that changed very quickly.
I saw 5722 on the 34 at Bethesda, it had the banner (at least on the left side). It was leaving as I was arriving. Interesting you were on the same bus as I was today, but I doubt we had the same driver. I got on 5547 at 3:58 this afternoon at Rockville. Did you notice it along Rockvile Pike near Montgomery College? I saw several 45s go by while we were at two very long lights.
Nah, I was nowhere near Montgomery college, I got on 46 near Best Buy and got off at Twinbrook. Then I got on 45 and got off before it even reaches Veirs Mill Road, sure i could've walked but i was too lazy and it was too cold and snowy :P
It isn't. I made a typo. I saw it on the N4 which is most definately a Western route.
I finished my bus trips finally a little while ago. After riding Orion V 4245 on the 1C this AM, had to go to Fair Oaks Mall after work. Met my g/f on the 1C as she got on at Ballston and I picked it up by my office. Had Flx Metro B 9396. I couldn't see what happened, but on Rte. 50 and Jermantown Rd. he blazed on his horn for about 10 seconds at the car in front of us. There was a ton of traffic, so I don't know what was going on. Going home, had Orion V 4385, but we needed to stop at Seven Corners. He refused to enter the shopping center, saying it was too slippery. I didn't care one way or the other, so we got off on Rte. 7 only to see every other bus in creation going into the shopping center. What's worse, when we were ready to leave about 45 minutes later, he came back as the 1B and miraculously made it down to the bus stop. I don't know why he couldn't go down there when we were on, but was ok later on when it could have been potentially worse. Oh well. We were going to take the 22A back to Ballston as we bumped into that bus driver, who was very friendly, as we were walking to a store near the bus stops. He was heading to Wendys to get dinner, and we just asked if he was going to pick up there so we wouldn't have to cross the 6 lane Rte. 7 again. He said yes and we were going to wait in a store until he was done with his break, but the next 1C to Ballston came through down that hill. That was Orion V 2160.
Other than the driver I had this AM to work, the three other 1C drivers were grumps. Bah humbug. My g/f purposely was extremely friendly getting off the bus to see if she could get one of them to say goodbye and he actually said it back. It gave us a little chuckle.
Went past Landover to see the Neoplans, but didn't get a chance to take a pic. Anyways, got to see one of the fleet numbers, it was 5304, couldn't get the other three. Also they don't have bike racks (HUH). I guess they also don't have the new fareboxes. Look out 8700s. Actually, I spotted at least one 8800 with the 8700s, stored at Landover, which now numbers about 60. I went to Annapolis and it was nice to see that Annapolis Transit now has Thomas SLFs. The also have those trolley replicas (or trolley buses). Other than that the day wasn't that great. Nothing usual or out of the normal, no stuck Orion IIs or Champions by the way.
From www.mta.info
------------------------------------------------------
Park and Ride is now available at the Arthur Kill Bus Terminal. Effective Mon, Dec 9, 2002. For your convenience, we've opened a Park and Ride lot with 225 commuter spaces at the intersection of Arthur Kill Rd and Richmond Av.
Directions:
You can enter the parking lot directly from the northbound Korean War Veterans Pkwy, or from the intersection of Wainwright and Gurley Avs.
------------------------------------------------------
Routes to serve the lot: X1 X4 X5 X6 X7 X8 X15 X17 X31
What area of the city has the most Orions? Staten Island?, Queens? The Bronx? Manhattan?. I also wondered why it took so long for them to get introduced into Manhattan I think it was the M104 where they first appered or the M1? 3 or 4 years ago?
On the issue of Orion Suburbans on q32- was on 112 this morning into the city at about 6:30am.
Staten Island has the most Orions.There's no doub't about that.Very rarely do you see an RTS in SI anymore and that's mostly on the S79.
SI has the most Orions - they have more than 1/2 of the 1999 Orions (6142-6349), along with 468-504, and some expresses at both depots.
RTSs can still be found on weekdays, on Yukon routes - S61,S79,S55/56, but will occasionally show up on other school trips and Thursday evening, I saw 4897 on the S53.
Say what? An RTS on the S53? I've passed by Castleton Depot a few times within the last month and I sure as hell never saw an RTS there.
Just Orion's and MCI's.
It was Yukon's 4897 - I believe with all the snow problems, they used whatever they could - even if that be 4897 from Yukon.
S53 & S59 have few extra RTS buses from Yukon Depot run in the morning & afternoon.
DNJ
I believe they appeared in Amsterdam before Mother Clara Hale. SI has the most Orions but Queens is not too far away.
Staten Island
-------------
1993:Assorted Orion suburbans CAS & YUK
1995:468-504[36] CAS, YUK
1999:6142-6349[208] CAS, YUK
Bronx
-----
1995:402, 403, 405-412[10] GH
Queens
------
1993:101-119, 227-232, 256-316[87] QV, CS
1994:400, 401[2] CS
1995:404, 425, 505-580[78] QV, CS
1996:611-680[70] QV, CS
1999:6120-6141[22] CS
Manhattan
---------
1993:Assorted Orion suburbans MJQ
1993:173-226, 233-255[77] MCH
1995:413-424, 426-467[54] AMS
1999:6000-6119[120] MCH, AMS
Brooklyn
--------
1994: CNG 317[1] JG
1995: CNG 581-610[30] JG
Queens has the most Orions, albeit barely. All you have to do is count them up. CS has 240 and QV has 40 for a total of 280, while SI Division has Castleton with 229 and Yukon with 35 for a total of 264.
In fact, The Bronx Division has 262, so Staten is close to dropping to third.
Mark
I incorrectly stated that Queens Division operates 280 Orions. They actually operate 266. I mistakenly included the 11 MCI's and the 3 Vikings in my count. However, Queens still barely edge out SI and the Bronx Divisions.
Mark
Yes so SI for now is no longer the "king" of Orions but barely.
But MTA LI Bus beats out every borough with over 300 in service, both diesel and CNG. The oldest in service are 1991 diesels; the newest 2002 CNGs. About 48 more CNGs are on order for delivery next year; this will allow retirement of most if not all of the Orion diesels. Incidentally, three Gilligs are in the reserve fleet: one 35-footer and 2 40-footers.
If the MTA goes out will the private lines work or sit it out?
The private lines work under their own contract and have nothing to do with the MTA, at least right now. If MTA strikes, or walks out or what ever they want to call it, the privates will still be out there in service. If anything, they may have to try to add more service, which is a joke in itself when it comes to dealing with the private lines.
BIG AL
get ready to walk to your destinations. they`ll be plenty of buses parked at the depots to take pictures of.
On my way home from a hard day at work, I was waiting for the M57 at Madison Ave and 57 St. There was an Onion approaching. I thought it was an M30-nope it was an X51. I was like it must be a 1xx Suburban.
THINK AGAIN!!! It was 281. I was like what in the heck is 281, a local hard seat bus doing on the X51??? It startled me so much that I had to take a pic of it. I'll have it soon as I possess a camera with film.
And a 1xx Suburban that could've been used on the X51 was probably on a line like the Q26. Go figure.
#281 x51
#8200 M57
I spotted Orion 101 on Main St. Flushing as NIS and 106 on Roosevelt as a Q26 at around 7:20 PM Friday evening. Perhaps a driver who was doing the local runs took a suburban and they ran out of suburbans for the express routes. Oh well, the TA is screwy.
Before the MCIs arrived in Queens, an occasional hard-seater would show up on the X51. (It seems that a high-seniority driver on the Q74 always got first pick of the buses, and always took a soft-seater, even if that didn't leave enough for the X51.)
I can understand giving the B/O's with seniority first pick. However, I'd think that the person assigning buses would keep enough express buses to cover the express runs and then making the extras available for local runs.
Wayne
I have seen this beofre as well
Hi everyone, I just wanted to know what engines the Orion V CNG's on LI bus use. I know the 100 series is all Cummins L10G Natural Gas, but I have no idea what the other buses have. Any info is appreciated.
Do the other buses sound like this Orion V CNG?
651
If so, then the engine is a Detroit Diesel Series 50G...
Stephen
Where is the movies section on NATRANsit is at.
Where is the movies section on NATRANsit is at?
The NA Transit Movie Section will be up shortly. We are still deciding on how to post them, either a bi-weekly movie of the week or will be like the sound section that clips will be stored online for future references...
Stephen
PS. Here is another clip from Samtran NABI 436 Artic (just newly arrived)
104
Damn you make some pretty allsome movies :).Do you have plan's to record septa buses?
Well, I live in the SF Bay Area, so....
I'm sure there are someone in the East Coast who will be willing to do this...
More sound and video clips can be found on
http://gp.no-ip.com/
ok than what are some good movie/sound clips.
Most clips that are street shots are under 20MBs while the others are on board clips.
Flxible,
155, 8614, 9224, 9335
Gilligs,
163, 631, 960, 2826, 9779, 9823
NABI,
104, 3123(on board) , 3135(on board), 3165
NFI,
912, 995, 996(on board), 2307, 8014(on board), 8025(on board)
Neoplan
9127
Orion
602, 651
Currently, I'm still working on the video clips, I'm hoping to get some more from different models...
Thanks,
Stephen
NA Transit - http://www.natransit.com
Temp Site for Videos - http://gp.no-ip.com (There might be some connection difficulties, sorry...)
Very nice indeed...
Them buses got sound effects! Better than some artics on the Norteast Coast!
Carlton
http://cleanairbus.tripod.com
The Cleanairbus Transit Page
But I'm sure NJ's and WMATA's Neoplan artics will also be nice buses too. :)
The NA Transit Movie Section will be up shortly. We are still deciding on how to post them, either a bi-weekly movie of the week or will be like the sound section that clips will be stored online for future references...
Stephen
PS. Here is another clip from Samtran NABI 436 Artic (just newly arrived)
104
The NA Transit Movie Section will be up shortly. We are still deciding on how to post them, either a bi-weekly movie of the week or will be like the sound section that clips will be stored online for future references...
Stephen
PS. Here is another clip from Samtran NABI 436 Artic (just newly arrived)
104
100-287 is a Cummins L-10G with a Allison B400R World Transmission. 289-393 (?) is a Detroit Diesel Series 50G DDEC IV with a Allison B500R World Transmission. 651 was originally a Diesel which was converted to CNG By Orion and has a Detroit Diesel Series 50G DDEC III with a Allison HTB-748 Transmission.
Regards,
Trevor Logan
Whoa, that's interesting but why?
Hmmm, that is interesting. One bus has a different engine than all the others. And I always thought some LIB CNG's had Caterpillar engines. Guess I'm wrong.
You mean that mpeg video was of 651, which was transferred from LI Bus and given to NA transit?
Queensv Surface Corp., has 184 CNG Orions with Detroit 50's and 2 CNG Orions with John Deere engines (numbers might be 404 and 437). I understand that the John Dere's keep going and going and going and going. They are very rarely down, except for routine maintenance and you may see them bidding on RFP's on any future bus orders.
So statistical wise, which CNG engines are most problematic?
The DDC S50G is the roughest that's for sure.
"Analyze That" (Robert DeNiro and Billy Crystal) came otu yesterday and has bus scenes in it.
It's someone's 35-foot narrow RTS-04 with blue padded seats, painted as NYCTA 2501. While the paint scheme is phony, the destination signs are even more phony. Fake dot-matrix "Crosstown" painted onto the entire widthof the glass in front and the right side. Interior, old MTA logo stickers everywhere.
This is a ex-Hertz Bus, I and few others have seen this bus running around NYC. As a matter of fact, I saw this bus about two weeks ago on Sunday on 10th Avenue when I was doing my 9A Trip.
Trevor
WHOA...since when did the TOR-Nado morph into such an articulated (pardon the pun) handle? Very cool...where did it stem from?
Even worse was the CBS without a trace that which tried to pass off what looked like a toronto or vancover subway car as a Q train complete with phony station sinage which looked like a cartooned version of the real thing
I went to the Empire State Building and saw the Christmas Tree at Rockerfeller Center. Here are my observations from my journey on Long Island into Manhattan:
MTA Long Island Bus
#370 - Not In Service (on LIE eastbound near exit 35)
MTA New York City Transit
#579 - Not In Service (on LIE westbound entering from Springfield Blvd. This might be the Q27 that ends at Horace Harding Expwy going back to Flushing)
#281 - X51 (Must not have enough MCI buses. I thought it was bus #261 but thanks to MTA MCI 102-DL3 #1979...it's now #281 I saw on Horace Harding approaching Main St.)
#9251 or #9351 - Q88
#4332 - Q88
#9569 - Not In Service (and not repainted! This was unusual for me because I thought that bus was repainted along with the rest of the 1997-1998 Novas. Maybe I'm wrong but this bus was from the Fresh Pond Bus Depot.)
#5187 - M102 (repainted)
#4818 - M101
#8242 - M103 (repowered)
#9001 or #9004 - M103
#9613 - M16 or M34
#299 - Q32
#9609 - Q32
#2066 - X10
#2199 - X27
#2804 - X28
#8802 - M5
#8283 - M5 (repowered)
#8463 - Not In Service (resting on 5th Av near W 33rd St
#5127 - M2 (to 26th St)
#5143 - M5
#8804 - M3
#9012 - M5
#4850 - M42
#2706 - X1
#546 - Q32
#6038 - M1
#8787 - M2
#8788 - M3
#4797 - M5
#4810 - M2
#6021 - M1
#1996 - X10
#9617 - Q32
#5030 - M57
#8187 - M31 or M57 (repowered)
#7045 - M31 or M57 (now has local seats)
Command Bus Company
#4954, #4972, #4975 - BM3
#461 - BM1
#480 - BM2
Triboro Coach Corporation
#2819 - Not In Service (getting off the LIE at Junction Blvd
Green Bus Lines
#632 - Q60
Jamaica Bus Lines
#606 - QM21
Queens Surface Corporation
#921 - "Special" (on LIE wsetbound approaching Douglaston Pkwy)
#553 - Not In Service (sitting on Horace Harding Expwy near Little Neck Pkwy)
#558 and #926 - E 37th St going towards 6th Av
New York Bus Service
#1636, #1629, #1701, #18xx, #1673, #1679 (and more but I do not remember)
Liberty Lines Express
#3106, #3029, #3002 (again, and more but I remember the rest)
New York Waterway
I saw this Grumman Flxible bus coming out of the side of the Midtown Tunnel in Queens (maybe from the Hunter's Point Ferry) going eastbound on the LIE. Did not get the number.
Westchester Bee-Line Buses
#9xx - BxM4C
#9xx - BxM4C
New Jersey Transit (all of this at the Lincoln Tunnel but NO PICS ALLOWED)
#3210 - 126
#7895 - 163
#3170 - 154
#7618 - ?
#1126 - 125
#3172 - 154
Why are the QM1A, QM4 and X51 bus using the LIE eastbound to their destinations? I thought it was LIE inbound and Queensborough Bridge outbound? Thanks in advance!
Enjoy!
Queens Surface uses the Queensboro Bridge outbound, for their QM-1, QM-1A, QM-2, QM-2A, QM-3 and QM4. However there are several "Super Expresses" or "Specials" in the evening on the QM-2, QM-1A, and QM-2A. These units make one pick-up only (on 6th Avenue at 36th/37th Street), then express to Queens via the Queens-Midtown Tunnel to the LIE to their designated routes and make all drop-offs. It saves a little time and are quite popular. And there are 3 evening "Specials" on the Wall Street route too.
All of QSC units use the Q-M Tunnel in the A.M. too enter Manhattan.
Don't know about the other Queens privates or NYC Transit.
Yeah, I forgot about the Wall Street buses, but why would the QM4 use the LIE eastbound? Also, why would the X51 as well? QM1 and QM1A I understnad now. Thanks "Fishbowl-474"
Sometimes drivers once get's off the 59 St Bridge Upper Level they go down Thompson then this routeing: Right on Van Dam,Left on LIE service road,bear left onto I-495(Long Island Expressway),bear right Queens Blvd Exit,Back on service road then right on Queens Blvd service road then go's on the Main Roadway.
Like what time you saw the QM1A,QM2/QM2A,QM4 on I-495? If it was off peak(10 AM-3 PM and 7 PM-1AM Weekdays and anytime on weekends)then the driver took that way because of avoiding alot of traffic lights on queens blvd.
BTW the QM2 off peak is the same as above but stays on until the Van Wyck Expressway North Exit
Some drivers on the 3rd Avenue branches of the "QM" routes turn right at 56th Street and go back down 2nd Avenue to the Queens-Midtown Tunnel.
I have waaaaay too many scale models of buses...and MUST thinout the collection before the walls holding the shelves fall down.
So, I'm listing a LOT of stuff -- Corgi, Matchbox, EFE Exclusive First Editions, and some other oddball items at EBay. Low starting prices.
Do a search under seller sjh50....much easier that way than to list all the stuff.
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I had RTS #378 on the QM1A 7 PM to Glen Oaks today. I wounder why a RTS was running on the QM1A today? Can somebody tell me why??
[I wounder why a RTS was running on the QM1A today? Can somebody tell me why??]
Maybe it's because - gasp!! - an RTS was sent out.
It may have been an extra backup bus, covering late buses due to the weekend holiday traffic in Manhattan.
Was the Oyster Bay branch out today?
I saw two LI Buses signed up as LIRR service going up and down Glen Cove Rd this afternoon around 4pm. Not many passengers on board.
Caught part of this film on Flix last night. It was from 1992. The story takes place in 1963 and involves Michele Pheiffer on her way to DC to attend JFK"s funeral.
She is riding up to DC on a Greyhound Scenicruiser. Yep a 4501 in the old blue livery before the gold one. Also caught a glimpse of a PD4103 at a bus station.
Hope this movie runs earlier then midnight next time or it goes to the top of the rental list for a snowy night.
Well it is a month after the traffic referendum got shot down and Like I mention a month ago HRT were having townmeetings about some neccessary changes and improvments to the system. Well it is December and the announcement has been made about the current bus route changes. Many of the changes was brought up in the townmeeting and alot are more shocking than others. The sevice changes will come into effect on Jan 18 however the route map and schedules will be out on Jan 1. Here are some of the key route changes
1) #5 Willoughby: From Wards Corner to Wiloughby Spit via Granby, Tidewater and Ocean view (it will eventually eliminate the Maxi ride, though it was not menton in the gram.) A shocker because #8 (Tidewater) was the proposed route to go to Willoughby Spit.
2) Major changes in Virginia Beach. In short the 25/39 becomes a new 25. (mention) 29 will only go to Pleasure House and TCC. (mention) new 26 Bow Creekroute to replace portions of the 29 (Lynhavenn Mall and 37) 37 discontinued replaced by 33. 33 now runs all season long ** no service to Oceana and Fleet Traing Center**
3)#9 will get a new schedule overall small portion of the route is replaced by #18. (If the #5 fails and the #8 does take over this route might possibly be heading to Amphib Base as mentioned)
4)#6 minor additions in S. Norfolk
5)In Peninsula all Hampton and Newport News buses are going to have "1" added to route. Most of the route in Hampton are split into two routes
The biggest disappointment is the proposed 44 and 45 terminal switch.
And all Norfolk Naval Staion passengers (2,3,15). u might be getting a rude awakening and a laugh. The good news is the 51 (to be renamed possibly the #16) "might" come back. It was not mentioned on the gram but an operator has told me that it is also in Jan schedule. The bad news no 2 and 15 service to/ from (15) the base except after 7pm. I guess more traffic to the gates, huh? The final word will be out on Wednesday. I'll keep u posted
B49 Limited
P.S. I will return to the MTA issues very soon. I am working on a letter to HRT right now...
Some of Queens Surface's destination sign readings seem (at least to me) to be somewhat silly. For example:
QM1A NORTH SHORE TOWERS
QM1A TO 6 AV
QM1A 6 AV TO NORTH SHORE
QM1A TOWERS
QM1A GLEN OAKS TO WALL ST
QM1A WALL ST TO GLEN OAKS
QM2 BAYSIDE TO 6 AV
QM2 6 AV TO BAYSIDE
QM4 164 ST & JEWEL AV
QM4 TO 6 AV
QM4 6 AV TO 164 ST
QM4 JEWEL AV
...and so on.
My point is this: Why does a DESTINATION sign need to emphasize the ORIGIN? When people board a bus on 6th Avenue, DON'T THEY ALREADY KNOW that they're boarding on 6th Avenue? Don't people boarding a bus in Bayside KNOW that they're boarding in Bayside? Are QSC's riders so dumb that they need to be told where they're starting their trips? Does QCS hope to attract MORE riders by calling them idiots?
What happened to the simple "EXPRESS / via 6 AV" readings that the other companies are happy to use?
I agree. My favorite were the roll sign from the GMDD fishbowls that didn't use the route number...
EXPRESS 6 AVENUE
EXPRESS JEWEL AVE
Etc.
Wayne
I rember some of the OLD MCI Classic Headsigns. Only a verry few buses left at QSC have the Older Rollsign and it's in the Black Background. 1 of the buses I know of off hand that still have the old headsign is #938(Still in old paint job too!) The Old Headsign was like this and I rember only 1 of them.
QM1 EXPRESS FRESH MEADOWS-GLEN OAKS
QM1A
This is the one I can rember for now since I saw it
There's also signs like this
QM1A FRESH MEADOWS
QM1A GLEN OAKS
260 & UNION TPK
QM2 6 AVE
QM2 TO BAYSIDE VIA
MITCHELL GARDENS
Okay, as difficult as it is to understand, it is just as difficult to explain. First off, The QM-1, QM-1A are cover a number of routes:
QM-1A North Shore Towers(NST) to 6th Ave
QM-1A NST to 3rd Ave (peak only)
QM-1A NST to Wall Street (peak only)
QM-1A 6th Ave to NST
QM-1A 3rd Ave to NST (peak only)
QM-1A Wall Street to NST (peak only)
QM-1A 260th & Union Turnpike to 6th Ave
QM-1A 260th & Union Turnpike to 3rd Ave (peak only)
QM-1A 260th & union Turnpike to Wall Street (peak only)
QM-1A 6th Avenue to 260th & Union Turnpike
QM-1A 3rd Avenue to 260th & Union Turnpike (peak only)
QM-1A Wall Street to 260th & Union Turnpike peak only)
QM-1 Fresh Meadows (188th St & 64th Ave) to 6th Avenue
QM-1 FM to 3rd Ave (peak only)
QM-1 FM to Wall Street (peak only)
QM-1 6th Ave to FM
QM-1 3rd Ave to FM (peak only)
QM-1 Wall Street to FM (peask only)
Now you see that there are 3 branches of express services, along Union Turnpike, operating from 3 different terminals, travelling to 3 different destinations. Now, the NYCDOT mandates the destination signs be this way, because one passenger complained (once) that she wanted to meet her friend on an a.m. express bus that came from NST, stopping at Union Turnpike and Main Street. But if they all the bus signs just read where it was going instead of also including where it came from, then it would be confusing (for her) and she would not know which bus to board (and NYCDOT agreed with this!!)
So there you have it. It doesn't make sense, just like you all said, but now you know the rest of the story.
This also goes for the QM-2, QM-2A, QM-3, QM-4. I don't know if the other Queens Privates have also been told by NYCDOT to do it this way. This really began when the electromic signs came into reular use. The MCI Classics, with the curtain roll, are left alone because it would cost $$$$$ to change/replace the curtains, and the buses are too old anyway.
[Now, the NYCDOT mandates the destination signs be this way, because one passenger complained (once) that she wanted to meet her friend on an a.m. express bus that came from NST, stopping at Union Turnpike and Main Street. But if they all the bus signs just read where it was going instead of also including where it came from, then it would be confusing (for her) and she would not know which bus to board (and NYCDOT agreed with this!!)]
So all of that came from ONE passenger whose friend couldn't be bothered to just sit next to the front door and wave?
Maybe DOT could have stopped this nonsense of having 3 QM1's and 6 QM1A's by assigning new numbers to each Queens branch (e.g. QM5, QM6, QM7) and suffixes for each Manhattan branch (e.g. "E" for East Side, "W" for West Side, "D" for Downtown). That way, if you want to meet your friend on a North-Shore-to-3rd-Avenue bus, just look for a QM7E.
That has been suggested to NYCDOT. However there is a clause in QSC's CBA prohibiting interlining. Now, if a driver does a NST trip first, he/she may do a 260/Union Turnpike (called Glen Oaks) trip the next. It saves a little on labor cost. But if the route numbers are changed, there is no interlining period (except on weekedds (whuich is soon to cease). And besides, we don't want to confise any passengers now, do we?
one of the little cost saving mesures was to stop buying the long paper Transfers. QSC now issues the MC Transfer. I can now SEE 200 or so interline transfers every week-day.
It is interesting to note that the Destination signs did in fact used to read the way you suggest, i.e.
QM1A inbound "Express - via 3rd Ave"
QM1A outbound "Express - North Shore Towers"
Why, don't know. For purposes of ridership planning it's still important to change to run number.
"QM2 SUPER EXPRESS!!!!!!!!" :-\
That would be code 6024.
And 'New York City?'
Looks like QSC has a lot more to have fun with! :-)
I've just spoke to charles from royal coach and it's seem the transit gift shop hasn't order bus bank for the Christmas season. Does that mean that they will stop with those damn rts bus bank? Or are the getting someone else to make then. I was in the gift shop Saturday and they have like two or three bus banks. What the deals with that?????
Could they be getting ready for an Orion bus bank???? I don't think so because they would've had them for the Xmas selling season. Hmmm, something's up.
So anyone who has the RTS bank now, they will be collector's items soon and that means a higher price.
Well I didn't think that orion bus bank would be coming back, hello. But you are right there something up with the gift shop not buying bus bank and at Christmas time. If the bank are becoming collectable we all be rich because they must have made a million plus of them.
Often I'll see LI Buses have their whole run running 20-30 min late with no relief. Yesterday, the bus that was due to leave Glen Cove for the 4:04pm N27 was running 20 minutes late from the northbound run, due to arrive at 3:57pm.
It saw it passing through Greenvale going south running about 25 minutes late. And consequently 30 minutes late for the 5:51pm N27 Glen Cove at Greenvale.
Again today, there was an N20 running 25 minutes late to Hicksville. Observed the same bus pulling up 25 minutes late at Great Neck for Flushing. Man was it packed, in fact some people were left at the stop.
They seem to allow very little layover time built into the schedule for drivers, so if youre more than 5 minutes late theres no recovery time.
Also why cant they send out another bus to fill in a run that is running very behind schedule? If NYCT does it, then LI Bus should do it (LI Bus rarely puts fill ins for late buses).
I feel real bad for the drivers who are put in this unlucky situation, literally driving for hours and hours on end with no break.
NYCT does not send out a fill in for a late bus..... During the month of December, the buses are especially late and extra crowded on weekends because it is the Christmas holiday shopping season.
Someone else told me they do send fill ins for late buses at NYCT as well some DOT operations. Yes, it is "that time of year" and there is more traffic than usual. The backup at Northern and Searingtown from the Americana store traffic is noticably worse.
I'd imagine its the same way at Roosevelt Field as well.
Who in God's name told you NYCT sends out extra buses to fill in for runs that are late? Is this person on drugs or something? Do you think we can just pull buses out of our hats to fill in for any bus that is running behind schedule? It has never happened and never will. I highly doubt that goes on over at the privates as well. The only thing that NYCT does that is even remotely on the same principle as what this "person" told you is that if we have a b/o that is due to make a relief and the run he is supposed to relieve is running behind schedule, then we may have the relief operator pull out a bus or the sld in the street such as myself may assign him a bus from a run off, assuming such a bus is available at the time to give to the relief operator.
BIG AL
Well the person is another busfan who frequents bustalk. Whatever information they got was wrong. I dont think LI Bus ever switches operators on routes unless a particular bus is down.
But it still aint fair to operators, who usually dont get any relief from running behind schedule and losing breaks.
Perhaps if the bus route is on tight headways, the late bus can be sent OOS to the next terminal where it can get back on schedule??
Having a bus run 30 min late throughout it's entire shift is simply un-acceptable. Unfortunately, on routes with hourly headways, skipping stops is generally not practical.
At Liberty Lines Express they will cover your trip with a shape person or have someone do an extra trip if you are running very late. However on weekends when there are only three shape, you will most likely have to "pick up and go" no matter how late you are.
Peace,
Kevin
What modifications to a pre existing bus route would you make to maximize its usefulness?
My choice is to send the BX22 to Inwood, and have it travel to the corner of Pelham Parkway and White Plains Road and travel with the BX39, thus eliminating it from Bronx Park East. The BX12 would get some relief, and the BX22 wouldn't travel around empty through Fordham.
I'll use your examples.
You know what, bring the RTS's back to the Bx22 or have a mix of RTS's and articulated buses. The Bx12 should be introduced with weekend LTD service, the ridership is comparable to the weekdays.
I say they should add later LTD trips on the B41 weekdays[it ends at 7:30pm why I don't know]. If necessary, bring the B47 to Williamsburg Bridge Plaza.
Does anyone know the ridership figures for the BX22? BTW, the RTS' on the BX22 would be a disaster.
the other day I was riding 5184 to chestnut hill from the mall. As we left the mall, I could tell immediately that the bus engine was shifting in a wierd way. When we were going up the hill on germantown ave to chestnut hill, we were going like 10 or 15 miles per hour, stuck on first gear until it shifted when the hill leveled out. It was like it was skipping 2nd gears...
Also, I rode another L bus, 5174 I think, that had it's gears shift kind of like an El Dorado. It was quite wierd.
Both of these buses were "all white" buses. Is SEPTA, or at least the Midvale depot, tweaking the bus engines somehow?
Yes the overhaul NABI's have a engine that can only go 40mph which make's the gear's closer togather like on the hill. It could also be a tranny problem. Tell me when the 2 gear end @ full accertion how fast was it going.
I was doing some online research about Bus Rapid Transit (BRT), it's various forms and applications and I got to wondering - why is it that the New York metropolitan area--one of the most transit-dependant regions in the country-- does not have this service?
Many other places in the country are looking into, building, or already have BRT systems-- even Los Angeles!
Now I am not advocating bus instead of rail or bus to replace rail, but there are many major and heavily used bus lines and corridors in this region that could benefit from conversion to BRT standards and these could be integrated into the larger subway, light rail, and commuter rail systems.
I also believe that markets exist that could benefit from new BRT systems, particularly in less-dense areas and even more particularly in Bergen County. The interstate lines that run through Bergen County are VERY heavily used. The local lines are not, but the routing of many of them are convenient and would probably gain much more ridership if they ran as BRT on seperated ROW's.
The re-implimentation of commuter or light rail service along the Northern, West Shore, and Cross-County lines and the integration of that into a BRT system would vastly improve transit service throughout the county.
I really think that fully-dedicated busways should be implemented on major highways that Manhattan-bound commuter/express buses use, such as the New Jersey Turnpike/I-95, I-80, NJ-3, NJ-4, NJ-17, possibly the GS Parkway, I-278/Gowanus Expressway, et al. The only one that I know of currently is the XBL on I-495 going into the Lincoln Tunnel.
BRT (basically LRT with buses instead of trains) could also be implemented along major bus corridors throughout the five boroughs and in New Jersey.
For example, the HBLR can be supplimented by BRT - such as from the Hoboken Station up along the Hudson waterfront through Weehawken, Edgewater to Fort Lee (make the "busway" an actual busway and extend it up River Road - the 150-series buses can use it as well).
In New York, somebody mentioned converting the M60 to a BRT operation, and an extensive BRT system on Staten Island - I think that's a great idea.
And what about the possibility of the entire NYCT express bus system (DOT's included, though it may become moot) becoming one large BRT system?
"BRT - Think Rail, Use Buses"
That could also work on LI. If they only built bus only lanes on the LIE, instead of HOV. Personally I'd like to see bus only lanes on the state roads as well, such as 25A(aka the notorious northern blvd), 24 (Hempstead Tpke), 25 (Jericho Tpke), and 27 (Sunrise hwy).
Some aspects of bus BRT will work in NYC and some will not.
Shelters to reduce dwell time.
This is an issue that I go back and forth on. For express buses with only one entrance/exit shelter will not significantly reduce dwell time to justify the cost. The moeny would be better spent on introducing proxy type metrocards on these lines where riders would spend less time dipping cards. These cars could be sold on a subscription basis and require the same deposit currently charged to EZ-PASS (not deposit if hooke dup to credit card. Since most express bus riders currently pay with metrocard this would speed up entry onto buses. The cars would not be needed to be taken out of ones bags which would reduce fumbling around. Of course regular metrocard would still be accepted for those who wish not to subscribe to the service.
The signal delay aspect of BRT would definitly help. Concidering that bus lanes are already in place in manahattan for express buses, BRT would greatly increse uptown, downtown bus movement.
Automated bus lane inforcement would also help
I'm assuming that the bus lanes in Manhattan can be physically isolated from the rest of the street either by a curb, barrier, cones, or whatever else.
Make it similar to the MetroRapid service in Los Angeles - buses get those devices that keep traffic lights green, and enhance the 'stops' to make them more like 'stations'.
It shouldn't be all that difficult. Expensive maybe, but not much actual contruction would be required.
That could be a start toward more sophisticated BRT systems in the region.
>>> Make it similar to the MetroRapid service in Los Angeles - buses get those devices that keep traffic lights green, and enhance the 'stops' to make them more like 'stations'. <<<
L.A. Rapid buses do not have dedicated lanes. The bus stops are distinctive and separate from local stops, so buses do not have to slow down and stop unless someone wants to board that particular bus. Bus stops are generally on the far side of intersections to take advantage of the bus's "green light extenders" (Local bus stops are on the near side of the intersections). The bus stops are about one mile apart. I have found the average speed on these buses (including stops) is 20-25 mph. The streets they travel on, Wilshire Boulevard, Whittier Boulevard, and Ventura Boulevard are all business streets, with a posted speed of 35 mph., two traffic lanes and a parking lane in each direction, but they tend not to be bumper to bumper or grid locked. Because of the light pedestrian traffic, right turning cars do not block the right hand lanes before intersections. They are not commuting corridors. Only low floor (NABI) buses are used to reduce dwell time. In L.A., all passes are sight passes, (no dipping or swiping) so non-cash loading is quick. Fare boxes accept dollar bills and coins.
The system works reasonably well in Los Angeles (not as well as a subway, but much better than limited buses). Whether the operation would translate successfully to the conditions in New York or not would need some study.
Tom
Pardon my skepticism, but if pedestrian traffic is light, I can't imagine that BRT ridership is terribly high. How do the passengers get to the bus stops? Does each bus stop have its own parking lot? (Ugh.)
Probably most of the passengers are connecting from bus routes on the cross streets where the Rapid stops, in addition, both Rapid routes connect with the Metro Red Line, and the Wilshire/Whittier route connects w/ Metrolink.
I don't think Bus Rapid Transit would work in or into the Manhattan CBD. Over-riding signal timing would lead to perpetual gridlock, especially if you have a route with very frequent service. It could be used overnight if buses replace trains, however.
On the other hand, BRT could be used for "crosstown" routes. One option is to make the M60 a crosstown and extend it to Flushing and Jamaica. Reduce the number of stops, increase the frequency of service (once every three minutes) and I'd bet you'd fill the buses.
AC Transit is planning to start a Bus Rapid line, 72-R which operates from Oakland to Richmond using new Van Hool buses.
Quote from AC Transit.org
Improvements begin with new Rapid Bus service, replacing today's Line 72-L Limited in the San Pablo Avenue corridor beginning next summer (2003). Line 72-R Rapid Bus is a greatly enhanced transit option that speeds up bus trips in the corridor by 20 percent compared to current schedules. Essential Rapid Bus elements include:
New low-floor, multi-door coaches that speed up passenger boarding and alighting, greatly reducing the dwell-time buses spend in loading zones
Traffic signal automation, giving Rapid Bus trips priority at congested intersections Extended intervals between Rapid Bus stops, also speeding transit trips through the corridor
Improved service frequency, with trips in both directions every 12 minutes from 6:00 a.m. to 6:00 p.m. daily
With Rapid Bus, local Line 72 buses would continue providing trips between Oakland and Hilltop Mall at 30-minute intervals seven days a week. Line 73-Oakland-Point Richmond (via Macdonald Avenue) would continue at 30-minute intervals seven days a week. Overnight owl trips along the San Pablo Avenue corridor also would continue at 60-minute intervals.
If NYCT strikes on Dec 15th, will LI Bus drivers also go on strike? I heard from an operator whom I spoke to the last time a strike was threatened that they will not cross the city line but will operate in Nassau. But being that LI Bus operators are TWU 252 members, and the strike action in NYC is TWU, they may walk. And thus I'll be walking, 1 hour 10 minutes to Greenvale.
If they do Im gonna be stranded here in the middle of nowhere.
If anybody has any details on how it will effect LI Bus routes please let us know.
I pray both sides can come to a compromise before the deadline.
MSBA will NOT walk, they have absolutely nothing to do with TA contract negotiations. They'll be obligated to operate their full routes, but not to do things like pick up local passengers in Queens.
I believe the last time LI Buses ran non-stop (except for lights) from the Nassau-Queens borders to their Queens terminals.
Nah,don't worry.LIBus has nothing to do with the TA.They'll be running,that's for sure.
that's bad if nymta go on stike becouse i know that mta get as many riders a day as septa get in a week. and i reminder when septa go on septa it was very.
[But being that LI Bus operators are TWU 252 members, and the strike action in NYC is TWU, they may walk.]
Umm...
1. Though both fall under the MTA umbrella, NYC Transit and Long Island Bus are SEPARATE agencies (at least for now).
1. Local 100 has nothing to do with Local 252. I seem to remember from college calculus that 100 and 252 are DIFFERENT numbers.
2. MSBA's drivers didn't walk during the 1980 strike.
FYI, WBAI (99.5 FM) in NYC will have Roger Toussaint as a guest on the "Building Bridges" program tonight from 7pm to 8pm.
Why WBAI?
Because WBAI-FM tends to lean to the left of center on most - if not all - social issues. This is part of a statement by the WBIA GM Don Rojas (the full text of which is linked here).
“The station’s historical role as an independent and uncompromising voice for peace and justice is even more critical today in the context of an imminent war in the Middle East, rampant corporate crime and corruption, rising poverty, assaults on our civil liberties and major media’s capitulation to the right-wing’s agenda.”
Sounds like a perfect fit given Toussaint's recent statements.
Roger Toussaint? Isn't he the guy who represented the Private Bus Lines (QSC, TCC and JBL) when they went on strike? Now he represents the MTA NYCT bus drivers? This man is huge (meaning a popular guy)!
Roger Toussaint is the president of TWU Local 100 which represents the private lines as well as several MTA NYCT departments.
For all you NYC residents, Roger Toussaint will be on channel 1 tonight on Time Warner cable for an interview. I for one will be glued to the TV.
I guess they will be airing the interview over the radio as well.
BIG AL
Forgot to mention: Interview time is same as listed...7:00-8:00pm
BIG AL
roger is scheduled to be on channel 2 on the 5pm show...starting shortly
So he'll be interviewed on WBAI and Ch 1 News at the the same time and be on Channel 2 during the 5 PM newscast. Whatever and wherever he's on, I hope he makes a good showing of himself. I hope he's not like John Law back in 1980 saying something:
"30% and we don't care how TA does it."
im just curuios how everyone here will try to get to work if the TA goes on strike. ill be commuting fom LI if that happens(hopefully LIRR wont go out)-and walk to work from Penn Station. Will everyone here try to get to work?
Luckily the area I just moved to (Norwood in the Bronx) is serviced by Liberty Lines Express routes BxM4A/B and BxM11. I'll take those buses and transfer in Manhattan to the BxM18 to the Wall Street area.
On a side note, on the express bus services, I feel that the people in Queens would be a bit better off than those in Southwest Brooklyn and Staten Island (who stands to be hurt the most if this strike was to occur). Queens still has the privates who run a majority of the express lines in Queens.
Any comments?
Just my two cents
Brian
My sister is planning on taking a Command bus from Starrett City to Manhattan. Of course I have to drive her there from where we live(ENY). I think the BM2 and BQM1 runs from Starrett City and goes by her job in the Rockefeller Ctr area...
>>>Luckily the area I just moved to (Norwood in the Bronx) is serviced by Liberty Lines Express routes BxM4A/B and BxM11.<<<
I live in that area too. Don't kid yourself, those busses will be practically useless, they won't add any service and people will be hanging out the windows. You'll be better off with Metro-North.
Peace,
ANDEE
Well if I have to go into Manhattan. I normally go on Weekends. I normally would take the Q46 to Main St and take the QM1A into Manhattan. So on Weekends I would end up takeing the Q60 to 69 Road and Transfer to the QM4 into Manhattan.
My mom and Dad takes transit alot. My dad,Who normally works at night and takes the E Line. Would have to end up takeing the last Q60 into Manhattan then walk to 55 St and 3 Ave. My mom,Who works doing the day and takes the Q46 Bus. She would end up walking to work but she was thinking about takeing a Taxi but I told her "It's too much money!"
I'll be staying at a downtown hotel that my company will be paying for. It's nice to feel needed. 8-)
Peace,
ANDEE
i did see the following bus banks still there today:
N32
S79
X1
X2
the n32 and S79 are RTS while the X1 and X2 are MCI buses. Also, check out the xmas ornaments they sell. they have models of a rts bus, a old gmc new look plus a articulated model(#1070 with M86 sign)-they are about the same size as the old hot wheels rts models, but made of wood. they selling for $18 each.
Is there a phone number or email address for the store?
www.regionaltransitservice.com
It's New York Transit Museum's store....that's all I know. I don't have their URL handy, but I did look at their site recently (must be a link at NY Subway resources) and these bus ornaments were NOT yet listed...or mayeb they just aren't going to list them on their web site.
I have one of the RTS ornaments. They are solid wood, and photo-printed bus graphics (of a three real buses, you can see 5185 on the front, 8474(?) on the left side and 9528 on the right side!) on them. But $18.00? Wow, didn't realize they were going for that much!!
The number for Grand central gift shop is 212-878-0106 mon-fri 9am-7pm and sat- sun 10am-6pm
Could Roger Toussaint be planning the ultimate "ROGER DODGER"??
First one up for a strike was Liberty Lines Transit/Express. Although it was only a day it was a first for Liberty and for Roger Toussaint.
Second one was the 7-week old strike for the Queens Privates. And what did the membership gain? Absolutely nothing. What a price to pay for nothing. Then Roger tried to blame it on George Jennings, the Vice-President for the Privates.
Next up is the NYCT. Will they strike? What is Roger Toussaint's stragedy?? Who can he "get" this time as his victim or scapegoat??? Let us see.
Suppose, just suppose, a NYCT strike took place. In addition to all the legal stuff like restraining orders, etc., the NYCT would no doubt deny the TWU their "check-off list" whereby Union dues are collected via payroll deduction. The TWU would have to send representitives to each member to collect the dues personally. It would not be deducted automatically and forwarded to the TWU offices. This probably would put TWU Local 100 into immediate receivership.
In receivership, the TWU International would step in to take over and attempt to get TWU Local 100 on it feet financially. During this time, Roger Toussaint would still be recognized as the Prersident of TWU Local 100. However, at subsequent collective bargaining sessions, the International President, Sonny Hall, would become the chief negotiator for TWU Local 100 (as it is in receivership). Have you figured it out yet? Are you still with me??
Whenever a tentative settlement is then reached, it's pretty safe to say that it won't be an ridiculous wage increase (plus benefits), per year, for 3 years, that Roger Toussaint is "demanding". It will be somewhat less and reasonable.
Will Roger then dodge the ball and blame Sonny Hall, his fierce rival, for not getting a package that he (Roger) claims he would've gotten if he were the chief negotiator?? And would Roger gain more support? And might this cause Roger to run for the International President, that he so much desires, just to put his rival out of office? What do you think??
Now before you all re-butt this, I'm do not profess to be a legal person. And I'm sure there are a lot of loopholes. This is just a possible concept that I thought Roger could develop with his support group. My question is, Could it work??
Whenever there are contract talks the unions always ask for a very high percentage for an increase in salary. Roger already knows he will never see 24%. But by starting high, you have plenty of room to bargain and negotiate downward. My question is this, "does NYCT know they will never see a 0% number agreed upon by the union?". My guess is they will probably settle between 5 and 10%, without the productivity clause NYCT seems to be stipulating.
BIG AL
I think TA will give in a little toward the end of the week. But they are also waiting for the Union to sweat and think about what Bleepburg has threatened.
BTW. What does TA mean by productivity? It seems very vague. What can TA expect an employee do to increase it?
>>> What does TA mean by productivity? <<<
Changes in work rules.
Tom
I believe that the TWU will lose public support if they hold out for a high-percentage raise. Too many people have lost their jobs, and a significant number of those who are still employed have gone one, two or more years without a raise.
JD
TWU doesn't care about public support. Most of the public doesn't support them anyway. TWU only cares about it's workers. And I can tell you that most of the other city workers, like the always 'kicked in the head' NYPD are probably praying NYCT workers strike because any raise NYCT workers get becomes a bargaining chip for the other NYC workers under contract.
BIG AL
I was wondering is there anyone who has really old WMATA bus schedules. I have three from 1980-81. They are in practically in good condition with little browning. Does anyone have any that are older?
I used to have a few from the early 80's. One was an old C2 schedule when it ran from Montgomery Mall to Beltway Plaza with short turns at Langley Park. Another one I had was with the old T routes that ran from Rockville to Dupont Circle.
At one time, I know I found an old DC Transit schedule from the 60's at my parents house. It was an old H2, 4 Crosstown one. I'll have to see if I can find that thing.
I just stumbled into an old 1982 MD/DC system map and its been fun seeing the old routes. For example, the C20's in PG County used to be T routes, such as T11, T12. There also used to be an L9 that ran from Aspen Hill to Federal Triangle. Cool stuff.
i have an old P8,9 schedule from 1983
GO TERPS!
I think I might have that schedule, but at a later date. I remember the T11. Right before WMATA change that route to the C20s, I took it to Wild World (before it became Six Flags). Also remember the V14, when it use to go from Penn Marr to Potomac Avenue. I have tons of schedules from the mid 80s.
I used to take the T11 a lot when I had family that lived in Kettering. I also remember the F8 being the G8 and the 86 being the G6 growing up as a kid. I also think the E4 used to come down near where we lived at Riggs Road and University Blvd. to its termius in Lewisdale. I vaguely remember boarding on Riggs Road and taking it to the Rhode Island Ave. Metro in the 70's before they rerouted it to its current state. Then, there used to be an F9 that ran from Lewisdale to the Archives and the R4 from Calverton to Crystal City. Ahh, those were the days!
I remember when I lived in Southeast, riding I believe, the U2 (the old U2), from near the D.C. line to Downtown D.C.. Yea those were the good old days. Would be nice if WMATA goes back to the way it was, for two reasons. One is that the subway system is way overloaded, (try getting a spot on a green line train during rush) and two WMATA needs routes that ferry people to point A to point B without ended or even stopping at a train station.
When the group "U2" was just becoming big, I used to laugh when I saw that route. I had thought it would be cool for the group to ride it.
I think as the overcrowding on metrorail becomes more of a problem, we'll see more parallel bus routes. Its a whole lot cheaper to run the buses than put on rail cars. Its just a matter of getting that commuter who hates buses to want to try it. I'm wondering how the new 16Y is doing. That one runs from Columbia Pike to 15th and K. Routes like the 38B can work if they are reliable and advertised well.
F14 reminds me of the fighter jet by the same name. Also there is 4077, I call it the "M*A*S*H" bus because of its relation to the show and the division name in the show. Also their is the 2B ( 2B or not 2B, that is the question )LOL.
LOL, I use that 2B joke all the time, especially if I'm at Fair Oaks Mall and the 1C and the 2B both come by around the same time on its way to Ballston. The other night when we were out there waiting, I said "We can take the 2B or not 2B home". I forgot about 4077 and MASH. There's also the always fun M16, 4H (4H club), X3 which I love to refer to as the triple X. Way too much time on my hands tonight!!
Speaking of WKYS, do you remember the WKYS ads years ago on the buses that had the lips puffed out of the sign? I think this was early 80's. They used to advertise a lot on the RTS buses before they did away with the slopebacks, so they were too tall to touch them, but when I saw them on an AM General on a layover I couldn't resist because it was so weird to see an ad almost 3 dimensional.
Just remembered 2020.
I don't have schedules any earlier than 1980, but I do have a couple of schedules of buses that no longer exist. The 40, 44, 46; A2 thru A8, 87 & 89 (when they used to run all the way to Downtown DC). This was around 1988 to 1989.
Oh the 40 and 44, used to run from Northeast to Northwest. I have all of those schedules plus alot of ones that have been long been discontinued, like the 37, T10, 11,12,14,C23,24 T6, and others routes like that.
SUNDAY 12/08/02
I wanted to see (but didn't think) that if any Neoplans would be in service to run the Redskin employee shuttle and they weren't, saw instead Orion V 4260 and an unknown NABI. As I was going down route 50 towards D.C., spotted 4015 and 4019 heading towards the stadium, most likely to do the shuttle from the US Airways Arena(which is now a shell of itself, literally). Also of note 4015 spent some time at Montgomery during the summer, now back at Southern. Also of note, spotted a WMATA flatbed truck heading onto Pennsy Drive, away from the Landover garage, that peaked my interest. Passed by the Neoplans and again couldn't take a pic, too bright also couldn't read any numbers. Nothing else happened to and from work.
MONDAY 12/09/02
Thought I couldn't see the Neoplans, with the route I wanted to take, thought that I would be late to open my store, which came to be untrue, got to work in plenty of time and I took the scenic route. The first observation of interest came when I passed by 16th Street. As the past the intersection, I noticed in my rear view mirror, that there is now an Orion with chrome wheels. I wonder if it is the bus of the Rodeo winner, or is WMATA going back to chrome(which by the way I like). Anyway, I spent most of my time behind 8910, which at Dupont Circle, caught up with 9371 same route G2. So the doubleheader went down P street with 8910 stopping and 9371 and myself going through the light. I ventured through D.C. and went into Virginia. As I entered VA saw 9317 with a bike rack(must be at Four Mile Run as Royal has yet to get them). Also saw 9232 broken down on 395. As I headed home, saw 9736 broken down at Metro Center.
Nothing unusal heading home.
THINGS I DIDN'T SEE:
Neoplans in service( yea right they were delivered about 10 days ago)
Royal with bike racks (the only garage with none)
2460-62(The John Deere New Flyers). I get a hint, if WMATA likes these engines, they will be the engines in the next CNG bus order, which they haven't disclosed yet.
I am looking for either a MAN or Volvo artic for an upcoming movie in the NY city area. Is there any of these buses for sale or any auctions coming up with these buses in them? The shoot is not untill March but I need to locate a bus soon.
www.regionaltransitservice.com
Bee-Line, in Weschester County (Yonkers), has just about finished replacing their MAN artics. You may want to get in touch with them. Just a hunch, mind you.
Peace,
ANDEE
I saw those Bee Line Artics at the Nimco Scrapyard. Contact them, they may have 1 in one piece. NJT is auctioning there Volvo artics off, But I don't know if any are avialable.
Tony M.
There were a bunch of ex-Minnie Apple Ass MAN artics right down the road from you in Temecula last time I looked.
Try the Westchester County Department of Transportation, One First Street, Mt. Vernon NY 10550. Telephonne 914-813-7777, ask for Rich Stiller.
61 MAN artics were just retired within the past 9 months. All were driven to a storage facility in Yorktown, NY. I don't know if they were auctioned off yet. Give it a try and let me know how you did. Good Luck!!
A friend of mine told me that he saw a bunch of NJTransit Volvo artics in storage some place in Jersey City a couple of weeks ago. From what I understand, they are the suburban bunch. Give NJTransit a call.
That is the caven point acceptance facility. It can be seen from the Hudson-Bergen Light rail Bayonne Branch. the buses are the suburban type from Meadowlands and Fairview garages.
Troy
There are still artics there? I thought that they were gone already. I know that 9215 and another artic I think was 9218 were sold off. I don't know about 9217, It was not at the Meadowlands when I was there when I started there. 9204 was junk! The Destination sign, never works That bus is crap! 9209 I know is at Newark Shops, I think that bus is going to the Museum for the Historic fleet. 9219 I think is junked 9221 as well 9223. I really don't know the current status but if these are the buses at the lot, those buses need tons of work if bought. Wait for the Fairview artics to become retired, those are better.
Tony
I was always curious, did NJTransit retire ALL of the suburban artics, or just the worst of the bunch?
No,we still have about 30-35 of the hunks of junk running. We are waiting for the Neoplan AN-460 to arrive early next year. Meadowlands had theirs replaced with 45ft MCIs and we basically got the hand-me downs.
Troy
That right they got our run down crap! LOL We are enjoying our 45 footer MCI D4501's.
Tony M.
Meadowlands Garage.
Are they really junk? Here in SF, Samtrans is happy with the Volvos. They put the buses on heavily used routes such as 390 and 391. But because of the shortage of parts, they have to replace them with NABI 436...
Maybe it has something to do with....
1. Maintenance.
2. Bus fans'opinions rather than FACT. (All too much of that in here.)
Was handed a flyer last night by the driver of the x1 I take home after class. Starting Monday, buses will only stop at designated locations. some of the existing stops are moved a block, others are eliminated. Used to be, they picked up at any stop, and dropped off at any stop. Officially, there were designated stops. These will apparently be enforced now.
This doesn't affect me much, because my bus gets to SI after 10PM, and I get off at the last stop anyhow.
Oh, the AK Park and Ride was opened on Monday. Lot was full at 7am.
-Hank
Adding 8832 to 8839 inclusive (Metro-Bs) to the roster at Montgomery, saw both 8832 and 8839 on the T2 this afternoon (I came back late today). If anyone wants to correct this and/or make other additions, e-mail them to me or post (with a subject line that will catch my attention).
For you railfans, I got this picture at Grosvenor yesterday, today I didn't get anything spectacular :-(
Can someone in the know answer this:
If TWU Local 100 goes on strike, does the NYCTA Queens Bus Division also strike (I know it's an ATU local)? Does the NYCTA Staten Island Bus Division also strike (another ATU local)? I know that Green Bus will not strike, but what about the other Queens bus companies - Jamaica, Triboro, and Queens Surface - whose drivers are Local 100 members?
Thank you to all who take the time to answer.
Green,Triboro,Jamaica,Command and Queens Surface WILL be running if the TA goes on strike. Cant say the same for Staten Island and Queens MTA bus lines. they would go out in sympathy to the other union. However, back in 1999, SIRT was supposed to keep running if the strike occured.
Queens and Staten Island would not go out in sympathy. Instead, the workers would be forced into a 'lockout' by the depots themselves usually as a safety measure to keep the TWU from literally attacking the buses. Also, TWU themselves may block the depots to keep the buses from pulling out. One way or another the ATU buses will not be on the road. But people like Brooklyn67 have nothing to fear by the taylor laws that NYC's asswipe mayor keeps reminding us of. It will not apply to Queens & S.I.
BIG AL
Yesterday, the MTA website page on strike contingencies stated that Queens and SI NYC TRansit buses would be running, but with altered routes and schedules.
Trust me, they won't be running.
BIG AL
You can tell that drivers dont want to talk about a strike-or to anyone about it at all. A driver i had on the M5 gave me a dirty look when i said good afternoon to him(maybe it was because of my NYPD hat)-the driver on the m2 did talk to me-he doesnt want to go on stike but said that if they do, probably only one day.
clock tick on...
M5-#8265-TMCRTS
M2-#9024-NOVABUS
Actually, he saw a Thomas SLF, that is now running for the city of Falls Church. The new transit system, helped run by WMATA is called
GEORGE, after George Washington (still gets me on that name, but some sense). They have five buses, four clean diesel and one hybrid bus, probably all Thomas SLFs. They will run two routes, one the 26E that runs to and from the East Falls Church Metro Station, and the other the 26W, which runs to and from the West Falls Church Metro Station. Both routes run every rush hour every twenty minutes. This was supposed to run with electric buses, I wonder what happened? Anyone who wants info I got the web address. Sorry I can't provide a direct link, but this is something:
www.ci.falls-church.va.us/george/about.html
I saw that bus too. I saw it at Bladensburg last week Tuesday when I went there to look at tne new Neoplan artics
Wayne
They might be specking this bus(is this a word?) for a future order for routes that use smaller buses, I wish they would dump those DAMN Orion IIs and replace them with SLFs.
Yeah, I was thinking the same thing when I saw that article in the Post! I haven't seen that bus since, but it makes perfect sense that this is why I saw the odd looking bus in the Arlington garage.
Now with Falls Church and Arlington having bus service (allbeit, that Falls Church's is being run by WMATA) it now seems like every jurisdiction has its own bus company.
Fairfax County-Fairfax Connector
Montgomery County-Ride On
Prince George's County -The Bus
Alexandria-DASH
Arlington-ART
Fairfax City-CUE
Prince William County-Omnilink and Omniride
Laurel/Howard County-Connect A Ride
Annapolis-Annapolis Transit
Howard County-Howard Transit
Baltimore County/City-MTA
The only jurisdiction without seperate bus service is D.C. and I don't think they will have any in the near future, they love WMATA too much to implement their own.
The bus systems in Laurel (Connect A Ride) and Howard County (Howard Transit) are actually separate entities, but they are both managed by the Corridor Transportation Corporation.
The AVS hybrid buses they were to use in Falls Church under the "electrek" name had so many problems that they scrapped the project (not necessarily the buses...don't know what became of them).
Either in a couple of weeks or next month is when WMATA makes a lot of schedule changes. It is interesting to see if any routes are getting increases in frequency, any new routes(probably unlikely), what routes are changing route wise and even if any routes are being discontinued. The next major route changes will come when the New York Avenue Metro Station and the Largo Town Center extension opens in about two years(or sooner).
Prolly just some traffic adjustments this time around
Yep, that is what it really was, from what I saw on the ones I clicked on anyway.
Has anyone heard those 5A and B commercials on the radio lately. They are very plain and just saying "IF YOU LIVE IN D.C. AND COMMUTE TO TYSON'S CORNER, or IF YOU LIVE AND D.C. AND WORK AND FLY FROM DULLUS AIRPORT, RIDE THE 5A or 5B". I think they should also have done one for the N11 and 13, I think they never did.
Wow, I haven't heard that one before. I know the 5A is becoming a popular route for commuters who board buses at the Herndon Monroe Park and Ride and take it either to Rosslyn or L'Enfant Plaza rather than taking a bus to West Falls Church and paying more for a metrorail ride into DC. That's why the fare was increased from $1.10 to $2 because more people were taking it into the DC in the AM and out of DC in the PM rather than using it as a reverse commuter bus like it was designed to be. I believe the 5B is still $1.10 since not that many people seem to take that bus. Everytime I see it on I-66, only a few people are on it, but the 5A is more than half full.
They have only been on the air for the past couple of days, but I have heard them on WPGC and WKYS(of course those are the two radio stations I listen to).
I listen to WTOP when I have the radio on and I haven't heard them. I did hear a B30 ad in the past few weeks.
Seems like they have been putting alot of their new express routes on the radio. I guess the next radio commercials will feature the Smartmovers 14A,B,C,D and the N11,13.
They have NEVER advertised the SmartMover, although they should have. Those routes are virtually failures kept going by a small group of regular passengers. The N11 and N13 from what I understand are doing fine by express route standards (15-20 people on most EB PM trips, reverse peaks are empty but thats because they are essentially deadheads passengers are allowed to ride on) and probably won't get advertising.
Well, they weren't advertised radio or tv per se, but when the route first came to being they got press on news reports, including several live reports in front of one of the SMARTMOVER buses, forgot which one, was a 4400 though. WMATA has really never advertised individual routes only for WMATA in general. This is the first time I remember them doing it for individual routes.
Well the 5A at least have some ridership in the reverse peak
The Contractors for the Commuter Service are mostly Charter Complanys?
Well on Satuarday while I was walking up 5 Ave in Manhattan. I saw Dillins MCI D4500 #795. It's with a W/C Lift and a Restroom. I happin to saw a sticker from MTA Maryland by the W/C Lift Door saying:
"This Bus and Commuter Service is funded by MTA Maryland"
Strange is it?
The companies that run many of MTA Commuter routes are Eyre, Keller and Dillons. Yellow Transportation is another contractor they use, but I think they mainly handle their paratransit service.
Not strange at all. Eyre runs the 991 and Dillon runs what used to be called the "Beat the Beltway Blues" buses, I don't know what they got renumbered. I don't know what other routes are contracted, but its mainly 900 express routes I think.
All 300, 400, and 900 series commuter routes operated by MTA Maryland are contracted out to private carriers. The only commuter routes that MTA operates directly are the 120/Whitemarsh, 150/Ellicott City, 160/Eastern Blvd, and 210/Annapolis.
BALTIMORE CONTRACTORS
310/311 to Columbia is operated by Ferguson Charter Bus
320 to Laurel is operated by Yellow Transportation
410/411/412 to Bel Air and the 420 to Havre de Grace are operated by Dillon's/Coach USA
I'll have to get back to you on the DC area contractors...
Free Wheeling Days and The Bus Sale Program has been extended thru March 31, 2003
Montgomery County's Free Wheeling Days and The Bus Sale, the programs of free and reduced fares, has been extended through March 31, 2003.
Six Ride On routes along the I-270 corridor are FREE : Routes 70, 72, 73, 75, 77, 79
The fares on the following Metrobus routes are 50 CENTS EACH WAY:
Z1, Z2, Z3, Z4, Z5, Z7, Z8, Z9, Z11, Z13, Z17, Z19, Z29 - Buses along US 29 Corridor
J8 and J9 - Lakeforest Transit Center to Bethesda Metro Station
SmartMover 14C and 14D - only within Montgomery County
The fares on MTA 991 between Hagerstown, Frederick and Shady Grove Metro Station are $1.00 EACH WAY.
Ride free on 5B Metrobus Express to Tysons Corner from Dec. 16-28
Beginning Dec. 16th and continuing through Dec. 28th, customers boarding the 5B Metrobus Express to Tysons Corner at either the L'Enfant Plaza or Rosslyn stations will ride free. Customers will pay the regular $1.10 fare for trips returning from Tysons to Rosslyn and L'Enfant.
What Tyson's Corner needs more shoppers. It seems if they are doing that, the 5B doesn't have much ridership to Tysons. Metrorail doesn't have much riders past Ballston, especially during Mon-Fri from 10AM to 2PM, as I have seen when I have taken rail trips. Meanwhile, car traffic around Tysons is atrocious, just try driving there now, and getting worse.
I saw on the WMATA website under the timetables section that there are new schedules starting Dec. 29. One has the 5B only running AM and PM rush with no more late night or Saturday/Sunday service and rerouting the 5A to the Tysons Westpark Transit Center during the times the 5B used to run.
I'm wondering what other changes will come other than timetable adjustments. I did see they added a couple of trips to the 24P and will have the C4 leaving PG Plaza every 10 minutes during part of the AM rush with some short turning at Wheaton.
I know Tyson's is busy with shoppers, but I really don't think many folks are going to ride WMATA to the mall.
Wayne
I'd like to know more about the bus picturedHERE. If anyone can provide info. about anything on this Thomas model, I would greatly appreciate it. Thanks
p.s. why can't i still use the html image tags while posting? im not on dial up any more.
GO TERPS!
btw i took that pic, with my ol' Powershot S30.
The Thomas bus in question is a ca.1998-99 TL960.
Does anybody know? I've seen others do this. Thanks in advance!
Simply type (img src="location")(/a) use <> instead the parentesis and the pic will be posted...
Does anyone have photos of the GRTC Flxible Metros in the purple stripe scheme? Please let me know as I need them ASAP. Thanks!
-Fred
Does anyone have pics of the GRTC Flxibles in the purple stripe scheme? If you do, please let me know ASAP. Thanks!
-F.
Past Landover today and saw three more Neoplan artics stored there, bringing the total to seven. There are some (at least two so far) at Bladensburg and not sure any at Montgomery. I think the two at Bladensburg are the test buses. Yesterday, I saw something odd in that heading onto 395 south, saw three 13Bs within 1 minute, two of the three vertually empty, the other I didn't see. I also saw 2124 being towed somewhere, saw it on 495 in Greenbelt being towed south, don't know why. Not much more I have seen, trying to find that Orion V with the chrome wheels, I get the feeling that may be the first Orion V of the 1997 batch to be rebuilt.
The first Orion V's arrived with the "chrome" Alcoa wheels like the ones seen on all Fairfax Connector Orion V's. Shortly after their arrival, though, the Alcoas were removed and replaced with WMATA "stock" wheels, whatever make/model they are. The bus you have seen may have been one they skipped over for intended charter use or for some other reason. Do you know its number? I think it is a bit too early for the Orion V's to be rehabbed already, they do them after 7 1/2 years.
Of course, if you saw it, or perhaps know something I don't, I stand corrected, but I doubt that they'd be rehabbing 5 year old buses right now when they're breaking in 164 new ones, the Four Mile Run fleet of 250, plus camera and bike rack installations and the SmarTrip test AND the new satellite tracking and radio systems -- I don't think they'd have taken on such a project at this time, but again, if I'm wrong I do stand corrected
You mean the second group. WMATA's first group of Orion V's were the 9600 series from 1992.
Wayne
Yep, here come the "I stand corrected"'s, I did mean the 1997/1998's..thanks Wayne..btw did you get my email? (tristanc@comcast.net)?
the real first batch was completed last year, no?
You had asked for a pic of the Neoplans??? If I'm correct... I thought I had sent the pic. Let me know and I'll send it to you.
Wayne
It does seem too early to rehab them. I thought buses got rehabbed after 6 years. I believe all of the 4200s-4400s and the 3900s lost their Alcoa wheels, as well as all of the 4000 series Flxibles. I didn't get the bus number as when I saw it, it was crossing behind and I caught it in my rearview mirror, and it was too far to see it. But I will get that number, I always do and do soon. That bus might have been the bus of the rodeo winner. I remember, and correct me if I am wrong, but the winner(s) of the WMATA rodeo, had their bus fitted with chrome wheels, that is why you didn't see many on the buses, before the 4000s had them. Those at one time were:
9201, 9202, (think also 9203 for a brief time), 9360, 9424, 9425, 9426, 9443, 9444, 9701, 9830-35, 9659, 9660.
Did the trip from Brooklyn to Staten Island Mall today, able to hit Castleton and Yukon depot. Many sights today worth mentioning.
1-Most of the local lines at Yukon are still running RTS Buses. The ones i saw in service were: 8295*,8306,4897,8309,8313*,8314*.
Yukon Orion V Sighting on local lines: 6329,6348,6344.
2-at Castleton, Orion V #490,#491 and #500 still running. Saw them pulling in to the garage this morning.
3 odd things i noticed today. could use help on this please.
1-orion V #470 on the S44 with Yukon stickers and on the call box. I know S44 used to be a Yukon route. Did Castleton get this bus back?
2-Orion V #132 assigned to castleton with Casey Stengel Stickers(repowered)-this one moves a lot.
3-RTS in NYC Police patrol passing Yukon depot. Can tell this bus used to belong to Yukon. Anyone know the number?
B4-#9299-NOVABUS
B1-#9107-NOVABUS
B64-#9297-NOVABUS
S93-#6199-Orion V
S59-#6159-Orion V
clock continuing to tick...
-Orion V #132 assigned to castleton with Casey Stengel Stickers(repowered)-this one moves a lot.
According to the bus roster at transitalk that bus is assigned to castleton - maybe it is going to be sent to stengel. Thats a suburban?
132 is assigned to CAS - has been seen many mornings on S74.
All local routes, except S55,S56,S61,S79 are operated out of CAS.
468-470 are assigned to Yukon (these came from AMS) and 471-504 are assigned to CAS. Occasionally, extras and when buses are needed, they will use YUKON buses - so explains 470 on S44.
NYC Police bus is either 8400 or something else - see Trevor's site for the exact Number - I believe it's a 1985-1986 RTS.
He might be talking about 4796, a 1988 TMC RTS, that may be the one you are talking about as well.
[>>"1-orion V #470 on the S44 with Yukon stickers and on the call box. I know S44 used to be a Yukon route. Did Castleton get this bus back?<<"]
470 [with 468, 469] has been in Yukon for some time although I believe they started their careers at Castleton.
>>"2-Orion V #132 assigned to castleton with Casey Stengel Stickers(repowered)-this one moves a lot."<<
132 with CS stickers in SI?? That's strange, I don't ever recall 132 being in CS, only 101-119.
132 was at CS for a time last year. It has made its way back to CAS. Probably forgot to remove the CS Sticker.
138 is still at CS. Saw it on the Q32 recently.
Had a pic of 249 on M1 with YUK Sticker. Saw it today, it now has a MCH Sticker in the spot where the YUK Sticker once was.
#138 Q32
#249 M1
>>"Had a pic of 249 on M1 with YUK Sticker."<<
Depends on when you took it usually whe a bus gets transferred it usually takes a few days to put depot stickers fot the new depot.
4505 is the police bus. transferred to yukon in 2000 it never saw service there.
What SI buses have been transferred to other parts of the city in the past couple of years?
ORIONS -- Did some go to make room for the MCI's?
RTS -- Where did they go ? And why were they ordered with the double seats when all RTS buses have the single seats?, What depots system wide have RTS with this config?
Stay dry on this nasty evening.
Ulmer park has the double seat RTS's
Ulmer Park has double seaters for locals (4854-4872) and FLA or FP has 4889-4891 and YUK has 4892-4897. 4898-4899 were scrapped prematurely.
4873-4888 were converted to soft seaters.
Orions were transferred to CAS - locals in the 6200-6300 series from YUK. Orions 631-680 from YUK went to Queens. Orions 460-470 went to AMS from CAS, then 468-470 came back to YUK. 233-253 went from split between CAS mainly and YUK to MCH. The suburbans were sent to Queens in the 100 series, while some remained here at YUK and CAS, and some were in storage for a time and now some are at MJQ. Orion Suburbans 611-630 went from CAS to QV.
RTSs went to UP as mentioned before and mostly the olders ones here (the dumping ground for a while) were scrapped. CAS's 8317-8339 went to Flatbush I believe.
Ok, here we go:
Orions
-------
CAS: the arrival of the 1999 Orions moved 227-24x to CS & MCH. The arrival of the MCI's moved 611-630 and some 100's to QV and MJQ
YUK: the arrival of 62xx to 6349 moved 24x-255 to MCH and 631-680 went to CS
I put the x in there b/c I forgot the exact #'s.
RTS
----
CAS: the arrival of 6141-62xx forced the retirement of 1226, 1384, 1603 and the 3700's and 8317-8339 was transferred to FB. The MCI's arrivals led to the reitrement of the 3800's.
YUK: the arrival of 62xx-6349 forced the retirement of their 1700's and 3700's. The MCI's moved the RTS suburbans in the 9200's now in MJQ & QV. The 3800's were retired as a result.
Ulmer Park has most of the 2x2 hard seats but ENY has 4872, which is also a 2x2 hard seater.
Correction 227-232 was not in Staten Island, it was in CS already. Also, FP and UP has some suburbans from 4873-4888 but some have been put in storage and/or scrapped. Back to the 2x2 hardseaters, Yukon & FP has some as well.
Just found out that Bx55 will be Transfer from Kingsbridge Depot to Gun Hill Depot starting 1/6/2003. They will have 35 runs on the weekdays, 23 runs on saturday & 20 runs on sunday also only one extra run @ Kingsbridge Depot. Look to me like Gun Hill Depot will be getting more Artics from Kingsbridge Depot.
DNJ
Can you find out what is happening to the Bx31. Is it moving?
The Bx31 is staying put for now, let's see what happens once WFS opens up.
I heard it would be moving
I think that the Bx55 move makes some sense, looking at its northern terminal.
I just went to NYBS's Website and it show that there won't be no more weekend service on 12/29/2002. So I guessing the NYCDOT is relly getting it thier way. But why they have to do it if they have a budget problem? Once the Budget problem is up,Would they reinstall Weekend Express Service?
I RELLY HATE THIS IDEA! IS THERE ANYBODY HERE THAT IS PROTESTING AND/OR HATE THIS IDEA???
The politicos in Riverdale, which has weekend express service from Liberty Lines, are organizing protest meetings on this issue.
I hope they just cut the QM4 since all other routes in Queens that have Weekend service have good ridership.
Well the QM15 Satuarday service should be expanded to at least a few trips like 3 4 or 5 Roundtrips on satuardays since haveing 1 Roundtrip Satuarday service(10 AM to Manhattan,4:30 PM to Lindenwood)is stupid
Went in late this morning, so my itinerary was different than normal. As a result, I got to see quite a few things.
At Friendship Heights, I saw and photographed C40LF 2409 on the 30. I will no longer deny the fact that Bladensburg runs certain 30s runs since I now have proof (although I didn't get the run number, I have to see if it is visible in the photograph). The driver had the sign set to say HAPPY HOLIDAYS as well as 30 ARCHIVES and it flips rather rapidly between the two, faster than on most buses with these orange signs.
Got on the Metro where I saw a crowd coming up from the platform. The PIMS greeted me with the wonderful news:
RED LINE
SHADY GROVE
6 CAR TRAIN
10 MINUTES
By the time I was going in, 37 service had long ended so I was going to take the 38. I had also checked the Ride Guide and there were susposed to be 6 minute intervals up until 9:10 at which time it would be 3 minutes so trains could drop out. Train to Grosvenor was due in 4 minutes. That was OK, because I could get pictures there. The Grosvenor bound train (last of the AM rush) was led by Rohr 1127. The turnaround at Grosvenor was one of the fastest I had ever seen, it came out as soon as the switches were reset which was immediately after the train stopped in the pocket (you can hear it). The train was in service going to Glenmont within 2 minutes of its arrival at Grosvenor. While on the platform, I saw 4401 and 4370 deadheading to Montgomery on Rockville Pike.
Train came a few minutes later, led by Breda 3142. The operator was the same one who was operating the run I recorded (its on my website) back in October. I got a stare from him (he must have recognized me and was wondering why I didn't have any WMATA stuff on, in October I had my employee shirt on) and I took the train one stop, to White Flint. That run was manual for some reason. I didn't wish to miss the 38 so I hastily walked to the bus stop. In the 5 minutes I spent waiting for the bus, I saw a Silver Spring bound train, a 30 foot WMATA Orion V (most likely 3900) going to Montgomery from the Mid-Pike Plaza shuttle (I believe the stop is in the bus loop but have yet to investigate this), 4375, 9347, and another SmartMover bus. Saw the 38 turn from Nicholson Lane and saw it was a new Orion V, turned out to be 025611 (5611 is a 2002 at Silver Spring, 5612 is a 2001 at Gaithersburg, makes tons of sense doesn't it?). The 38 trip wasn't really special. Usual long red lights at Rockville turning onto Montrose, on Montrose at Jefferson, and it was longer than normal to turn onto Seven Locks at Montrose. A Flxible Metro-D was on the 47 towards Bethesda but I didn't get the number. When I got off the 38, I didn't get a picture since there was no safe place for me to stand, he also left rather quickly.
On an interesting side note, there are quite a few Potomac side streets that have not been plowed, although I saw one no outlet that had been. One car had to swerve to get around me since I was walking in the street (very few Potomac streets have sidewalks to begin with) although he was going faster than he should have been. Anyone else still not plowed?
Forgot to mention Orion Vs 524 and 5716 still have their Conrad Johnson banners. 5712 didn't but I think it may have, I saw a line on the side of the bus I had not ever seen before.
I happened to have rode 5705 yesterday on 34 from Bethesda to Medical Center, it did not have banner.
Anything else different about that bus now?
just plain old ordinary, no banner, nothing on the steps, only a "NOTICE" poster remains.
What does the notice say? They must have cleaned up that bus pretty well if that is the case. Interesting you got it on the 34. I have yet to see it. This morning, I saw more Silver Spring buses than I normally do but it was not one of them.
It was the same notice that appeared on every bus after the incident, i dont remember what it said specifically but it had a commemoration and contribution information.
Saw a bunch of CNGs running the 30s this morning. Saw more of them on those routes than I saw regular diesels. At one time saw about 4 in a row heading towards Georgetown and another one heading towards Southeast. Also saw 5229, one of the last NABIs that was in the old paint scheme, now is rebuilt. Got a pic of it when it was still in the old paint scheme. 5230 was the other old paint scheme NABI, should have been rebuilt by now, as I believe it when in to be rehabbed before 5229. It also looks like Royal is finally about to get their bike racks, saw 9445(ex Montgomery and Landover with holes in the front where the bike rack bolts would go. That is it for now, still have to track down that mysterious Orion with the Alcoas.
While looking at another bus site I can across thr electric RTS #6360. Is it still in service and if, where can I find it?
Since it's been a few months since the B8 change to JG, I was wondering if anyone could update me with information regarding the transfer of buses (Coach #s), number of runs, and any other information.
Thanks!
Fleet transfers:
All of these buses came from ENY on 9/8
4643-4652, 8090-8093, 8095-8097, 8099-8101, 8671-8689, [9440-9443 went back to FB]. As for the # of runs, I don't work for the MTA but the highest run# I've seen was 58. So far, nothing from here has been changed around at JG since 9/8.
eBay Item # 743944312
Also:
1931 IND Subway Photos, eBay #s 746295120 and 746296338
1965 IND Rockaway Division 1965 Timetable eBay #746278026
All close for bidding tomrorrow, December 13
I am not disappointed in Richard White doing the budget or the budget committee. I am disappointed in that the local governments are about to ruin a great opportunity to increase transit ridership more faster than it would now. I won't go on a soapbox about this but here are the lowlights:
1)Reducing bus purchases between 2006 to 2009 from 650 to 380 (42% reduction).
2)Defering the conversion of a third CNG facility for one year (I believe it would have been either Montgomery or Landover, I think Montgomery)
3)Defering rail and bus support equipment, non-revenue vehicle replacement and facility upgrade program( I guess that means no new garages coming any time soon.
4)Also, that 120 rail car option for the Alstom railcars won't be excersised (can you say sardines in a rail car. You better be sure when riding Metrorail, it could get a tad ripe in there soon, if ridership continues to grow)
The federal government can do so much. What we need is a REAL regional transportation authority, with a dedicated funding source or else, we might be in traffic jams during the midday, Saturday or even Sunday. On top of that many corporations might move out if they feel it is not good to do business, if it takes their workers two hours to get to work. I did get on a soapbox sort of afterall.
The soapbox was made of steel,so no I didn't crush it :-)
Hey Guys,
I now need 10 MAN artics on the east coast. I am looking at the Westchester County buses. According to the paperwork I have it says the majority ran for Liberty. Does anyone have any info on these buses as in how many doors, interior colors, seats, exterior colors, etc. I am not a MAN fan so I dont know much about them. I will also be buying 5 MAN artics on the west coast so they all need to look similar if not identical for the exterior. I still have 2 Pittsburgh MAN's (3007,3009) but will be using them for spare parts. Any info would be appreciated.
www.regionaltransitservice.com
You are too late here. They are being crushed at NIMCO shredding, Newark NJ. They were replaced a few months ago and BEE Line had their last ones towed out a few weeks ago. Write them at
NIMCO Maybe they haven't recycled them all yet.
NIMCO: Coaches go in, but they don't come out.
I was at Nimco a couple of weeks ago, I would say like 90 percent of them are in pieces already. They are probably all gone by now.
Tony
I heard that they may be srapped by now, but they were all the 60-foot model with 2 doors. The interior had the standard 2X2 seating. It's been about 7 years since I rode one of the Westchester County Bee Line MAN's but I believe they had the blue padded seats by American. They had dark tinted windows and they were white with a blue and yellow stripe below the window line that went around the bus. These buses were also retrofitted with roof mounted A/C units.
Good luck with your search.
Wayne
Hey,
There are many MAN artic photos @ www.transitalk.org if you would like to see them, including the interior (if you haven't seen them already). AFAIK, most of them are for sale and have not been scrapped.
If anyone watched channel 9 news at 10pm on Thursday night and saw the piece on the MTA strike ( near the beginning ) , they were at the Vince Lombardi Park and Ride asking questions on how people felt about what was going on. I was the operator that was interviewed for that piece. I had my 10 seconds of fame.
Troy
Good for you, even though I hardly watch 'UPN 9's News at 10' segment. IMO, it's the worst out of all of the network news lineups. Still, you got to be on TV! :-D
GO TROY! GO TROY! GO GO TROY! Did they get the Flxible on Camera? LOL........... If you taped it, let me view that!
Tony
Wow,that was you I saw?Cool.Your a lucky guy.
If people remember you after the piece, that is fame.
Howdy folks!
I'm Montigue M. from RIchmond,VA (GRTC territory)
I've read a few of these posts and found out that someone needs photos.
Currently, I have a few pics of Flxibles in the purple and black stripes.
By this comin Feburary, I'll have them in the purple swoosh paint.
I'm gettin a digtal camera for Christmas (as well as a mini-disc recorder for my new fleet of sounds that I'll start postin around Febaury 6th), so it shall be done around then.
Untill next time folks.....
The Virginian At Large
Oh, thank GOD....I had lost all hope!!! THANK you, from one Virginian to another. Do you have a link to these photos, or can you scan them and send them to me? Please e-mail me first to let me know about file size if the latter as I have limited space there. Thanks!
-Fred
Good to have you aboard. Hello here from New Jersey.
Tony M.
NJT Bus Operator
For those of you who don't live in the Bronx, the Bronx Times Reporter came out with an interesting article.
It seems that the NYCDOT in it's infinite wisdom decided to paint bicycle lanes through District 11 of the Bronx (that is the Central/NorthEast area approximately).
The political leaders of the District and the Borough, as well as the Councilpersons, are justifiably angry with this. And there are a few reasons that make this a justified protest.
For one, not one leader was consulted about the designation of a number of the streets as part of the "Greenway" system. The leaders feel slighted. They feel that they were not included in this decision and were not asked for their input. If this doesn't mean much, consider at your workplace how you feel when sudden rash decisions are made without you being a part of the process. Or worse, if you hold some kind of leaderhip position within the company. Or even worse, at home when you're married and your spouse makes a major purchase or decision without talking it over with you.
Secondly, these lanes literally appeared overnight. They were spray painted on a SUNDAY. The leaders would like to know why were they painted in such a "sneaky" way? Plus, how much money was spent on work hours? Were these workers paid for overtime? If there is supposedly no money in the budget for other services, how come there is money to shell out to paint unnecessary bike lanes on a weeekend?
Third, these lanes will be underutilized. They are also deemed unsafe because the streets they are/will be located on really lead to nowhere special. They also pass by or near schools full of busses that load and unload children. There are also a number of hospitals nearby so the streets are full of ambulances and emergency vehicles that speed through the area to get to them. The lanes are then not only a waste of money, but they are a waste of time since no one will use them. I happen to work on one of these bike lane streets. I have a window office and for the last month that these lines appeared, I have only seen one person ride down them. I should also add that this person was riding his bike during a big torrential rain storm so I will leave you with your opinions on the bike rider.
Lastly, and most importantly, if there is no money to continue the New York Bus Service and Liberty Lines weekend service, these leaders would like to know how was the money conjured up to pay for setting up these bikes lanes? Environmental concerns were thrown out the window because taking mass transit to get to where you're working is not exactly chopped liver on the enviromental awareness scale. Hopefully, the polticians will bring this up and use it as proof that there is indeed enough money to pay for express bus service if there is money to setup ridiculous bike trails on city streets that lead to nowhere.
Thanks.
first we had the fish bowl then the RTS series. Between the two, we had the AM Generals, "Square" Flxibles, and now the Orions and New Flyers.
What will the next new bus design look like and when will it be in production and on the streets.
Actually you shouldn't forget before the Fishbowls came the Old Looks and even before that there were older styles as well. The next style? Hopefully it will be more than just a box.
I don't believe there will be any 'revolutionary' new transit bus designs any time soon. The 'New Look' bus was designed when GMC dominated the bus market and was still making a nice profit doing so. The RTS and 870/Metro 'Advanced Design Bus' (ADB) designs came about as a result of the Federal government's Transbus program and other 1970's-era efforts to design a new bus. Meanwhile, in the early 1980's 'new' buses based on traditional designs and manufacturing methods like the Gillig Phantom, the GMDD Classic, and the various Orion and Flyer/New Flyer models became popular because many transit agencies considered the ADB buses to be 'Cadillacs' and were looking for a more economical alternative. Over the past two decades, I think it's safe to say that these 'basic' bus designs have gradually won out over the ADB designs (neither of which is manufactured anymore).
I don't see any push in the industry right now for a 'new' transit bus. The new standard will likely be the low-floor 'deck' design popularized by New Flyer, and since adopted by the other major manufacturers. The closest thing to a truly 'new' bus was probably the Nova LFS, but the market has spoken and I don't believe that many operators are interested in operating fully low-floor buses like that. The popular buses of today represent an 'evolutionary' process of development, and I think that the buses of tomorrow will similarly evolve from today's leading designs. It will be interesting to see where the industry goes.
Jim D.
As a daily Artic user, i feel thet there are seating changes which must be made on the NFI artics which have yet to arrive. I believe that the seats behind the back door need to be changed into benches running along the wall. The problem with the current setup is that the pair of foward facing double seats right behind the back doors becomes a physical barrier when the bus gets crowded, and the pair of foward facing double seats right in front of the engine-top seats block access to and from the engine-top seats directly behind them, which forces the someone to get up everytime someone needs access to/from those seats.
Doesn't anyone think that these changes are necessary???
Just a thought....any time you have a double forward facing seat immediately behind another double forward facing seat, the person in the aisle seat would have to get up to allow the person in the window seat to exit. Would you also change all the other double forward facing seats (besides the ones you mentioned) to side facing for this reason?
I personally prefer as many forward facing seats as possible. While it is true that side facing seats are easier to get into and out of, I find forward facing seats more comfortable to ride in, and I spend more time riding in the seat than I do getting into and out of the seat.....assuming of course that I get a seat to begin with! :-)
I'm not sure if you're visualizing this. The currnet seating setup behind the back doors presents a physical barrier to standees when the bus gets crowded, and prevents people who are exiting the bus who sat behind the back doors from getting out. The rest of the bus is fine.
I am familiar with the setup, as I have ridden the artics a number of times, although not when really crowded. I have no argument with your statement that side facing seats would make for easier passenger movement. However, my personal preference would be to have as many forward facing seats as possible. Just one man's opinion.
OK!
Hey,
Does anyone know when the 1st NABI 45C-LFW buses will be entering service and in what city? Will it be Phoenix, AZ, Tempe, AZ, or Los Angeles?
Also, in that city where they are first starting service, what bus routes will they operate on?
The 1st to the 56th NABI 45C-LFW LNG powered buses will be delivered to the city of Phoenix in 2003. NABI has two further orders for this model from Tempe and Chicago.
Wow! What lines will they run on and what month will they arrive in 2003 in Phoenix?
They May Replace The RTS & New Flyer Disels.
Why the New Flyer D40LFs? They are less then 10 years old (1994-1996?)! I can understand the RTS buses getting replaced, however. I ride one regularly and they are falling apart with bad A/C. I have heard various rumors about the 45C-LFWs. Some people say that they were to arrive before the end of the year, others say January, some say summer 2003, and others say December 2003. Even though BRT starts in summer 2003, will the NABIs be in service before then (January?). If there are any currently in PHX, where are they being stored?
Since The Arrival Of The First NABI 40 FT LF and Neoplan 4001 LF CNG Buses In 1998, Its been Valley Metro's Plan to Elimate all High Floor & Disel Buses Systemwide. However some of the RTS & Flyers Have and will be sent to Valley Metro N & West Operations (Laidlaw Routes 59 59th Avenue, 60 Bethany Home, 67 67th Avenue, 80 Northern Avenue, 90 Olive/Dunlap Avenue, 106 Peoria Ave/Shea Blvd, 122 Cactus Rd/39th Ave, 138 Thunderbird Road, 170 Bell Road & 186 Union Hills Drive)
For those of you who do not know, there was a report that this bus was stripped and used for parts. Well, think again folks. This bus is alive and well.
I rode this bus on the Q32 this morning. Ran quite well. Repowered but smoky and it still supports Queens Village Stickers on it.
However, yesterday I had the most junkiest bus I ever rode from HP. Whoever said 4165 is a piece of junk, boy were they right.
I rode this bus Thursday night on the Q32 run 114.
This bus was super slow, rattled, brakes made the bus jerk-making me nautious, when the front tilted downward, the bus turned off and so did the lights. The rear interlock when on off then on before you can get off and I think the driver had a difficulty with steering. When we turned onto Roosevelt Ave from Queens Blvd EAST we went up on the sidewalk and slammed back down onto the pavement.
Also I thought we were going to stall on the bridge b/c the engine was stuttering.
4165-please go to scrap. For once I can say that an Orion ride was better than an RTS.
#122 Q32
I guess a bus that is super slow etc. should be scrapp! Sound's to me that a little kid may have paste the part's of the bus back togather:)
I can confirm what was said about that bus - I rode to Jackson Heights on it the night of the snowstorm - At every stop the lights would go off and the bus seemed to have a momentary loss of power. The driver filled that bus beyond maximum capacitty as everyone was heading home early - When we croseed the bridge in that weather I was concerned that we would never make it across, the bus was leaning and jerking and sounded mighty sick - I was waiting for it to stall and shut off..but it got us home.
It is in a bad state
Perhaps the lights went off if he was having trouble disengaging the rear door interlock. He would do a quick momentary shut down of the engine, then restart it.
"Whoever said 4165 is a piece of junk, boy were they right"
LOL!!
Fresh Pond would probably love to have that bus!
The really strange thing, is that 4165 has been parked at STENGEL for the past few days, right next to that old Fishbowl, which for some reason was removed from the College Point "Storage Yard."
The following buses are providing T2 service today:
5717 on the T2 with a banner
5609 on the T2
Gillig on the T2, didn't get the number but it appeared to be a 1996 model
Today I got out of my house at 12 and I got on 5815 on 46 to Twinbrook, apparently near congressional plaza, the driver got into a honking arguement with another car (7-8 honks exchanged). At Twinbrook I got on 2118 on C4 which was LOADED with cameras, i sighted at least 5 cameras, 4 of them were around the driver/steps. I took C4 to Wheaton station and got on 2125 on Q2, I took that to Silver Spring Station. At Silver Spring, I boarded a 4000 series Breda car heading for Shady Grove. I got off at Fort Totten, ran down to the Green Line platform and got on one of the new CAF trains. The exterior LED signs were awesome but I was dissapointed that the interior signs did not display anything else besides "GREEN". I got off at Chinatown and got on a 4000 series Red line train heading for Glenmont. I rode it back up to Rhode Island because I wanted to take a glance at the trains at Union Station and Brentwood Yard. At Rhode Island, I got off and boarded 4019 on the other side of the platform. 4019 and 4018 were completely decorated for Christmas. The windows had murals painted on it, all the handrails and poles were wrapped in Christmas tree streamers, there were "toys for tots" and completely dressed christmas trees in open spaces of the trains, as well at sleigh on snow mockups, and icecicle lights dangling from the ceiling, the cars were completely dressed up. I took that train back to Union Square and got out of the system. I walked around Union station for a while before going back into Metro. I got on a 1000 series ROHR train back to Rhode Island to take another glance at the trains, at Rhode island, I got off and Ran across to the other side to catch a 4000 series train for Grosvenor. I took it all the way back up to Grosvenor where the train went out of service, I got on a 3000 series Train on the other side where I rode it back to Medical Center. I got out of the system at Medical center, where I caught 5815 on 46 towards Rockville, I took that up to White flint where i got off to take a glance at Montgomery Depot, no neoplans. I walked back to White flint to board 5812 on 5/Twinbrook, rode that to the rear end of Federal plaza where i did a little bit of shopping, after I was done, I boarded 5546 on 46/Rockville where I rode it home.
Sounds like you had fun. Mind telling me what 5812, an Orion V/CNG, was doing on the 5, which comes from Silver Spring? Yes, buses are soemtimes borrowed by the other garage, but CNGs won't be borrowed by Silver Spring.
oops, i meant 5412, my bad
OK. I rode 5412 on the 37 last year as the 5500s and 5600s were coming in, before it moved down south, I assume you noticed the cameras on that bus.
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The QSC Route QBX1 should be run with a diffent DOT Complany.
I was thinking about sending QBX1 to NYBS but since NYBS is going to close soon,It be a waste of time to do so. So instead,Send it to Atlantic Express and they would get RTS Buses for this service. Man, The RTS's in the Atlantic Express Paint Job would look pretty!
Is it strange to see this bus on the 6 Line???
(img src=)
img src=
(img src=)(/a)
< img src="http://www.nycsubway.org/gif/smlogo.gif"/ >
Make sure there is no space's or it will not work
see
(img src=/a)
Use <> instead of () and it will work.
I cannot type the whole link on my last post because it will show the pic instead of the code, so I have to use ().
You mean this?
Next time, ask someone, offline, of course, the correct way to post pics, or just leave it alone...
And besides, I have seen Flxibles on Bee-Line's #6 line...they are very rare, but they do pop up once in a while...one AM rush hour, I saw a Startrans bus running from Yonkers RR to the South Westchester Corporate park! I dunno if it's a regular, but I know what I saw when that bus turned off North Broadway coming from Yonkers! Never got a pic of it, but I know what I saw...
Carlton
http://cleanairbus.tripod.com
The Cleanairbus Transit Page
Well. Thank You. I did try but no body I knew that know how to do this was not online last night.
And thanks for telling me. The Line 6 is a W/C Line so it don't make sence to do so
Can somebody help me on how I do post pics on BusTalk? I got it from anouther post on the info and I was trying to post a pic here on BusTalk and I can't! It's under "Flxibles on the 6 Line" I was trying to post a pic there and I did it right by this way
(img src="location")(/a). And Yes, It was from a Website and Yes,I did replace the " with the <> around the Website URL
<img src="http://www.transitalk.org/Photos/TLogan/111502/Beeline_Flxible_796.jpg">
Took that bus today on M31- York Ave it is a nice one...Soft seats but not subrban style. Were these coaches purchased for express service?
What routes would this bus normally operate on -- I dont think 125 has any express routes?
That would be 7040 and 126th Street Depot, and no, 126th Street Depot has no express routes. The bus can operate on any route in the depot. It formerly ran in express service but is no longer needed there with hundreds of MCI over-the-road buses in service.
David
Any one see that great picture of the q60 fishbows fron Green Line in the 60's (Think it was in Thursdays paper)
They looked like TDH-5301's!
Anyone hear that they may send some artics to stengel?
According to TransiTalk, of the 260 artics on order, 28 are supposed to be going to CS. (5742-5769)
Beautiful! What a sharp looking bus.
Chuck Greene
Tony did you write up the headlight? LOL
Troy
LOL.........What are you talking about Troy, they are both on!!!! LOL
Tony
Looks mighty dim tom me.
Troy
LOL............It's the sun Troy! The sun was in her eye!
Tony
I think that left headlight is okay..it's just that the camera was in front of the right one, and using a wide-angle lens, the left one is not aimed to where the camera could record the light with the bright sun.
BTW...nice picture.
I do have a question though -- the destination sign seems to have lines through the glass....what's that??? Never saw it before....
Defroster which rarely works.
Troy
You tried something good. I think it came out great.
Thanks, it is an old pic, I took it back in May I believe.
Tony
Asbury Park Press article
In return for the 139, Academy will give two of their Atlantic City runs from the Bronx and Queens to Coach USA.
The article says the NJT 139 and these AC runs both make money. Maybe it's me, but why would a company bleeding money (CU) want a leisure run like NYC-AC over a daily commuter run that makes money as well? As the Stagecoach CEO mentioned in his report on Dec 4, Coach USA will supposedly concentrate on line service over the leisure market. Did it dawn on CU that the reason Academy made money on the AC runs is because they're non-union and have much lower operating costs?
Hey all , While i was at BxCCB with my arrest today I noticed a MTA RTS with a Roof Mounted Red Police light bar & 126 decals on it .It was numbered 50?0 and had the destination of Police . Any info on a '99 bus given to P.D. ?
Hope i didnt miss a post about it , enjoy your day all , < Tazz >
They had pics of these in either Newsday or the Daily News.The NYPD is taking buses to be coverted for police mobilization if there is a strike tomorrow .
It's today's NY Daily News that shows about 10 NYCT RTS's with NYPD personnel installing red lights on them.
Wayne
On Saturday I saw at least 6 RTS's from KB being driven by NYPD Sergeants.
-Chris
No
Hey does anybody know what bus carrier serves Edison, New Jersey? And also, could somebody tell me how to get to Edison, NJ from the port authority bus terminal? Thanks.
Academy Express Serves Edison as well as NJ Transit. I would recommend taking the train to Edison rather than the bus from the Port Authority, since no bus route from the port goes directly to Edison, you would have alot of moving around. Edison is just the town over, where do you need to go in Edison, it is a big town? You could either take the NE Corridor Train to Metro Park, and go through a small portion of Edison, or take the NE Corridor to Edison Station which is on the border or Edison and Highland Park. Edison itself, doesn't have alot of public transportation, so you will need to be there on time for the bus unless, you want to wait another hour or so before the next bus comes.
Jason
try this website:
http://www.njtransit.com/sf_routesbycounty_middlesex.shtm
I was at the Friends Meeting House in Flushing today, and on a bulletin board, there is a photo taken from the April 10, 1952 edition of the Long Island Star-Journal of the demolition of the Flushing Female Association schoolhouse. The caption reads (emphasis added):
"PASSING SCENE - Built in 1861, the little red schoolhouse at 136-60 38th Avenue, Flushing, will soon me a memory. Workmen are tearing down the one-story structure to make way for Flushing's municipal parking lot and bus terminal. The Flushing landmark was built by the Flushing Female Association."
What happened to the proposed bus terminal? I've thought for years that a terminal was necessary in downtown Flushing, and that the municipal parking lot site is the obvious place for it. Does anyone know what happened between that article and the parking deck's construction in 1954 - lack of funding? Disagreement among the bus service operators? Political motiavtion?
I think the parking lot was going to be the site of the bus terminal. My guess is Robert Moses had a say in the matter and his preference for cars over mass transit settled that. IIRC there was supposed to have been another bus terminal in Jamaica. Maybe that was replaced by the building of Jamaica Center.
Moses... good point.
There is a bus terminal in Jamaica (165 St).
[There is a bus terminal in Jamaica (165 St)]
There was another bus terminal in Jamaica on Archer Avenue, just east of Guy Brewer (formerly N.Y.) Blvd. Green Lines and Schenck used this terminal, but it has been gone for many years. I recollect it may have been replaced by a parking garage for Gertz Dept. Store.
Yes, there is a large parking garage near Jamaica Center.
As far as Jamaica today, I'd even consider the bus lanes on Archer Ave at Parsons Blvd to be a terminal. There's dedicated space for buses to platform, covers for waiting passengers, and bold signage - Flushing has nothing close.
There was a bus terminal in Flushing on the site of the Gertz/Stern's store on Roosevelt Ave. east of Main Street. Originally built by North Shore bus, it became NYC property after 1947 when the city took over North Shore to form today's Queens Bus Division. The old terminal was razed in 1951 and the site used for the department store because that way valuable commercial property went back on the tax rolls. There was a plan to build a new terminal on the street level of the municipal parking lot on Union St. just north of Roosevelt Ave. The proposal became the victim of perennial city budget cuts, the most recent being in 1975.
BTW, what store occupies the old Gertz/Stern's site today? I lived in that neighborhood from 1973 through 1978 when it was Gertz.
Macy's.
Old Navy took over the Woolworth's that was at the s/e corner of Main and Roosevelt
And Caldor remains unoccupied.
I haven't been there in a while. But you might be right.
Think they'll let us keep 'em after all is said and done?
:-)
Seems like a rash move. So if there isn't a strike, how are we supposed to have full bus service?
Saw 3 88XXs at the BBT this morning - one was with Police cars patrolling the HOV lane, and the other 2 were on the street next to the headquarters. I bleive they were 8819-8821 or 8820-8822.
Anyone got a roster of the policed buses?
8822 was stationed on 59 St at the entrance to the Queensboro Bridge outer roadway this afternoon. Destination sign read EMERGENCY/CALL 911; a placard reading "NYPD Vehicle" was taped on the side, beneath the driver's window.
What exactly will these buses be used for? also, will they keep the red lights on the roof?
The TWU hasn't reached an agreement, and the 12:00 Mid deadline has been delayed. We'll probably have to wait for Monday morning.
NY1 News.
I had heard on the news this AM that the strike indeed has been delayed. A TWU spokesman said that significant progress had been made on "non-economic" issues. Now, let's wait and see who blinks on the "econonic" issues.
More details about the "clock stoppage" from today's New York Post.
There are currently 7 Bee Line Flxibles at the Liberty Lines Express Garage. The fare boxes were removed. Got word from a Liberty Lines Transit Supervisor yesterday that they will be auctioned off.
Peace,
Kevin
Do you know the numbers?
I remember six of the buses: 796,823,849,850,856,866. The seventh bus is 79x.
Peace,
Kevin
The bus I couldnt remember is 794.
Just got word that the Flx Metros in Blacksburg may stick around a little longer. While fixed routes are now all New Flyers, the Metros stayed around for game shuttles during Virginia Tech home games. However, word from a driver there is that they may stay around for VT basketball and other games through Spring 2003.
I'm not sure if anybody even cares what's going on there, but I decided to share the update at least for the Flxible fans.
-F.
Ohhh can they auction them off to someone who doesn't have a driver's license but at least a permit? I wanna own a Flexible!And a Bee-Line Flex is just what I want.
I don't think there is a problem with an unliscensed person owning a motor vehicle, you just can't drive it. Also, you need a CDL to drive buses.
You don't need a license to own any vehicle; just don't get caught driving it without a proper license. Why not buy one and fix it up while you are training for your CDL? That is what I plan to someday.
-F.
They are not being auctioned off. They are being kept at LLE garage because there is no more room at either LLT facility. Westchester County DOT just purchased 10 more Neoplan artics, and are expecting 14 more Orion V 30-foot buses to be delivered very shortly (one has already arrived). And all of these new units are being delivered to the LLT facilioty.
These Flex's will be kept just in case of a fleet defect on either model, and then if the MertoCard arrives in Westchester, and the ridership goes up, there wuill be buses to use to handle the extra ridership.
Oh, I see...so they will be kept more or less as trippers? But for how long?
-F.
Oh, NO...more Flxibles going out of service! Thank goodness these are being auctioned, and not NIMCOed out of existence. So what is replacing the Flxes at Bee Line?
-F.
HINT: DDC S60.
Flyer artics?
Just to update you on the Bee Line Flxible situation there are now a total of 10 Flxibles stored at the Liberty Lines Express Garage.
Eep...this doesn't sound good. How many Flxes are at Bee Line total?
-F.
The above flick was shown yesterday on AMC cable channel. Although best known for two subway scences, the next time you see it look in the background and try and count how many buses are in the movie.
The first Brooklyn scene has Gene Hackman and Roy Scheider casing a bar known for drug dealing....In one shot looking down under the el, you see a Flxible New Look in the dark green livery and behind it a GMC old look in the light green roof / red stripe / dark green body.
Another scene shot on Third Ave, three Bat-Winged New Looks pass by. Two plain, one A/C.
A third scene takes place on a side street by an embassy. While Hackman is casing the building, his view is interupted by bus # 866.
There are probably other scenes with buses. Be on the look-out for them.
Believe there was a brief view of a GMC New Look, probably a T6H5301 of 1972 vintage in two tone blue, under the West End El on 86th St. during the famous chase scene. The bus was stopped for a light when Gene Hackman roared past in the opposite direction.
I vaguely remember seeing the top of a TDH-5303.
Andy - The TDH-5301 was built from 1959-1962 and the NYCTA GMC new looks were the T6H-5309A/10A and they were blue when delivered.
Wayne
Andy...
If it helps....a "5301" would be a TDH5301, the "6" or "8" denoting cylinders in the engine didn't appear in GMC bus model numbers until 1969 when the 5305/5306/4521 series started production.
Also, the TDH5301's were made from 1959 to early 1963...so if it was a 1972 bus, it would have been a different model.
If the GMC old look was the two-tone green with a red stripe...wouldn't that be the one and only bus 9000???? I thought that was the only one delviered with the red stripe.
Today, while passing by the Gun Hill Road Bus Depot, an MCI Express Bus Cruiser (like those used in the Staten Island routes) was parked on bus grounds in the front of the yard.
I wonder if this bus was in for repairs at this depot? Or if it had something to do with the strike? Or if it was a foreshadowing of things to come if/when the MTA takes over the express bus routes in the Bronx.
Seeing one of these busses in the Bronx is certainly a rarety since they are not used in the borough.
I heard from a friend that he rode an Express bus on the BX39, the 39.I didnt believe him but I guess so.
An MCI Cruiser on the BX 39 would be an interesting thing indeed.
That's the White Plains Road line.
Liberty Lines shares this route from East 241st to Pelham Parkway.
Perhaps they were testing to see how well such a bus would maneuver itself under the train el if the LL route were taken over by the MTA.
Just speculation at this point. But it does raise the question, if the MTA does indeed decide to take over Bronx Express Routes, what busses will be used?
I am wondering if they will simply repaint all the LL and NYBS busses to MTA livery (since they belong to the city anyway). Or will they also use some MCI cruisers like those used in Staten Island and Brooklyn? Again a what-if scenario. But the deadline for the end NYBS express service is getting closer so I can't help but wonder.
Knowing the TA they'd repaint the Classics and get rid of them a couple of months later. In the event that the TA does take over these routes I'd think they'd be wise to keep the Classics. They probably wouldn't want the Classics because they date back to 1988/89, but I'm sure those at NYBS & LLE are in better shape than many of their buses except maybe the MCI 102DL3/D4500 and the newest Orions. I really like the Classics, but I know they have two strikes against them. One is that most of them do not have w/c lifts and they have the DD 6V92 engine.
Wayne
That's true.
And that would mean that if the MTA does take over the express bus routes, chances are they would like all of the busses at some point to be ADA compliant.
Meaning they would be in the market in the future looking for some more busses. Question is, will they have the suburban (cloth) seating arrangement?
And where would the money to buy these new busses come from? Things look to get interesting in the coming year.
Well... I'm willing to bet that those riders likely be disappointed as I'm sure they don't want to go from the "high-quality" ride of NYBS, LLE buses to a TA Orion or RTS which may or may not be as clean and comfortable. They probably wouldn't need MCI 102DL3/D4500 on all of those routes, but Morris Park Ave and Co-op City routes probably could use them as well as LLE's BxM1 & 11 (and possibly the BxM2). I presonally think the TA's RTS and Orion express buses are not all that bad, but they will never be mistaken for a Classic. Even if the TA were to actually take over these lines and use the MCI Classics and MCI 102DL3/D4500 they probably could never provide the high level of service the LLE and NYBS spoiled their riders with. I always enjoyed riding the subway, but before I moved out of NYC... I often treated myself to a ride on NYBS and LLE. I continue to do so when I come into town for a visit. Of course I'll be there to get those last rides on NYBS's GMDD fishbowls and even one of the GMDD Classics if I'm lucky enough to find them.
Wayne
Meanwhile, 8854 was training new drivers. Saw on Madison Ave at 40 St today.
Also a few other unusual sightings to report:
4842 is now at MHV. Saw it on the M2 Limited this morning.
106 has been repowered and is back home at CS but with a half-half depot sticker (CS-QV).
And 142 was spotted on the M42 today-run 010.
Coaches on the M42???!!!
Thank God there will be no strike. Lets get back to talking about those buses.
#142 M42
#106 Q32
#4842 M2
Yesterday evening whiler traveling on the 7 to Main street I saw RTS # 4524 sitting in front of a white fishbowl bus the RTS has Yukon stickers on it any reason why its at CS?
That's the storage lot. Maybe it's a new NYPD Bus?
Training?
#4524 Q32
No, there aren't any buses in the storage yard as of a few days ago. There is definately an RTS at Stengel, but I think it's 4165. And yes, that fishbowl is parked at CS also.
I am sure all of the D.C. bus talkers saw it and if anyone watched any news broadcast, saw the Capital Center come down in amazing boom.
The Cap Center served alot of important events, including my high school graduation and other P.G. high school graduations, Bullet(now Wizard basketball games, Georgetown University basketball games, Capital hockey games, wrestling, numerous concerts, rodeos, inagaurations and so forth.
I called it the big potato chip in the way the roof looked like a pringle and did get a chance to see some of the events that happened there, and have passed by there on tons of occasions(hell I live right down the road from it).
The last years of its life was spent more as a parking lot for Redskin games, with shuttle buses ferrying people back and forth to Fedex Field and was used as a parking lot for those who wanted to attend the Grand Prix at RFK stadium and had to take a shuttle bus from the Arena to the Grand Prix.
In its place will be a new shopping center, to be completed in 2003, and in 2004 will sort of have its own subway station, when the Largo Town Center Station extension opens in late 2004. I am pretty sure many bus routes that run close to there would be diverted to serve that new shopping center, interestingly enough called the Capital Center.
Interesting, since I saw an arena implode on the opening for ESPN's SportsCenter on Sunday night/Monday morning, but there was never any mention of which arena it was.
i saw the story on cnn. i was so glad i saw that building (the cap center) blow up. it had to be the worst arena i have ever watched a hockey game in . what a dump it was!!!!!!!!
Yes, I had considered taking a spin over to watch, but I forgot and slept-in Sunday AM. I saw it on the news and it was awesome. I'm glad the area will be getting a new shopping center. Hopefully it'll be popular (and nice) like the Bowie Towne Center.
Wayne
They were supposed to have a Magic Johnson movie theather as part of the complex, but that was squashed. Hopefully they add more big names to the shopping center. I also hope that someone will buy Landover Mall and make it into the big to do like it was back in the day.
Hi,
I know New York Bus Service still has some newlook buses running, I
guess on their Bronx-Manhattan routes. Where are some good spots to
get photos of these buses on a weekday? Thanks.
Jon S.
Philadelphia Transportation Page
http://members.aol.com/jonsenk
I think one of the best spots is their layover area(s) along 5th Ave between 23rd and 26th Streets, 23rd Street between Park and Madison and Madison Ave between 23rd and 24th Streets. You can easily find them in those spots as the afternoon rush hour approaches. Of course you can also spot them along the route. One of my favorite bus spotting locations is 57th Street & Madison Ave because of the variety of buses.
Wayne
Whereever you decide to take the pics you had better do it soon.
Barring a last minute agreement with the City, NYBS will be shutting down its commuter bus operation on January 10, 2003.
Do we know for sure that they won't be kept in service with a different operation?
RIPTA42HopeTunnel and I rode one last week. Boy, do they bring back memories.
At this point in time there are no indications from either the DOT or the MTA that someone else will be assuming the routes.
I'm asking about the buses themselves, not the routes.
How was the ride? Also, what kind of power team do they have?
-F.
Fred,
Like all NYBS buses those GMDD T8H-5308A Fishbowls are simply awesome. Their powertrain is the Detroit Diesel 8V-71N/Allison 3-speed. These buses are soooooo fast. If you can make to NYC soon you should definitely take a ride. I'll be getting what will likely be my last rides when I head to NYC next week.
Wayne
Wayne, I hope they are still there in March. It's not set in stone, but if The Police have their reunion concert, I will be coming to NYC.
-F.
I thought they were going out of service around Dec. 12th? That's GREAT news...I hope they keep Fishbowls in other service a little longer. I sure would like to ride one should I go up to NYC in March...rumor has it that The Police will have a reunion concert there as they are being inducted into the Rock And Roll Hall of Fame.
Also, does NYCTA's historic fleet go out to do anything around the first half of March? If so, I want to ride the Grumman and the old Flxible New Looks!
-F.
sorry no one rides the museum fleet. they come out twice a year in the spring/summer for the rodeo and bus festival. nyct wasnt even letting anyone in drivers seat at rodeo but at festival you could sit behind the wheel.
So no excursions whatsoever? I thought busfans could ride the Grumman and others, including one of the 9000s?
-F.
Groups occasionally charter one or more of the museum buses -- I've been on several such charters. Usually, though, when they're seen in public they're only static displays.
David
david i believe is a transit manager. as far as the general public ive never heard about charters. we have no 9000 series buses in the museum fleet. 7340 a 1974 flxible is the closest youll get.
At the 2001 BusFest, I practically begged one of the NYCT B/O's for a ride back to the depot (even though Staten Island isn't quite en route from Brooklyn to Manhattan), but he steadfastly refused. I had to settle for Triboro Coach.
Bike Racks Should Be Placed On All Buses Operated By MTA BUS (NYCTA, MABSOA, LIbus) & The Bus Services Of NYCDOT (Liberty, Triboro, Green, Acadmy, NYBUS, Jamaica ECT...) To Open up more options for getting around. (Queens Blvd would be safer to bicycle commuters if the bikes were allowed on the Q60) And not just seasonal like on the QBx1, All Year Round Service.
Folks don't use them, that's way no additional ones were installed.
>>> Folks don't use them, that's way no additional ones were installed. <<<
A circular argument. Unless a bicycle rider is sure when he takes a bus somewhere that there will be a bus later equipped to take him back he will not go in the first place. Until they are really widespread, they will not be used very much.
They are on most buses in L.A. and get regular use, but even then it is only about 10% of the buses at any one time that have a bike on board, more near the ocean on warm days.
Tom
From April 15 to December 1 of each year a "grand total" of 2-3 bicycles are used on the bike racks on the QSC QBx-1 route. Figure out the cost of each rack, then the maintenance on them and figure out, is it really worthwhile?? I say no.
It is also somewhat (more) difficult to drive the bus with a bike rack on the front. A driver could not over-steer the front end in tight quarters.
Yeah, right! That's all we need. Between loading and unloading wheelchairs and kneeling the bus it already takes forever to go down the line. Add in loading and unloading bicycles and I might as well pack a lunch because it's going to take even longer to get to the end of the line. Save this bike rack stuff for the left coast. It won't work in NYC.
And if the rider fails to secure the bike properly or it falls off the bus for any reason, no matter whose fault, and if the bus runs over the bike destroying it, you're going to sue the TA for the damage. Forget it pal, the TA wants no part of that eventuality!
As a follow-up to the Thanksgiving weekend incident on a Greyhound bus in Monmouth County, the operator of the bus who made a sarcastic remark about the Taliban pled guilty to a disorderly persons charge in Marlboro Twp Municipal Court. The operator, who no longer works for GLI, was fined $500.00 for the November 30 incident.
Bunch of pussy paxs
Don't they know he was joking?
Also got lost on the way to court, was close to an hour late
Judge had issued a warrant , then canceled it when he showed up.
If I had a nickel for every Greyhound staffer who should be fined for a disorderly persons charge, I could buy out the company and make it respectful again. They really have become a turd outfit when it comes to customer service. Very rude folks indeed.
-F.
According to the news media one concession that the TA got from the TWU was the right to merge MABSTOA with the TA Surface operations. Does this mean that MABSTOA's seniority list merges only with 126th St Depot's list, or that MABSTOA, 126th, and all of Brooklyn's depots merge into one list? And do the Staten Island and Queens divisions still remain separate seniority lists and two separate ATU locals?
Thank you to all who answer.
For now, all seniority rights remain. It isn't clear whether 126th Street will engage in a system pick. Queens and Staten Island are, thus far, immune from the consolidation. However, I haven't seen the actual RBC/CB fine print. Has anyone?
[And do the Staten Island and Queens divisions still remain separate seniority lists and two separate ATU locals?]
Yes and Yes; there's no change in ATU representation.
Actually, Queens ATU has separate seniority lists for each depot. As a result, drivers are NOT permitted to "follow" a route that's moved from one depot to another, as they are under TWU.
This afternoon at Friendship Heights, saw 8833, 4344, and 9644 (dark and hard to see) all on Montgomery routes. It was 6 PM at the time so numbers were hard to catch. Didn't note any Western buses we didn't already have. This morning, I saw a decorated Orion II on the E6 but didn't see the number. It was wrapped all white and was ugly IMO.
Hopefully between now and the end of the month, I will compile all the buses UNACCOUNTED for on our depot by depot roster. Please be on the lookout for this and keep the observations coming!
Also saw 5409 (silver bus) on the 37 this afternoon, I was on 5540 myself and one of the 35 foot Orion V/CNGs for Ride-On on the 46.
Saw an Orion II on the D8. Even though this route runs from Bladensburg and would use this kind of bus, this is the first time I have seen this type of bus on this route. This route usually uses Orion V 30 footers, Flxible 30 footers and an occasional CNG.
Also saw on Sunday 2209 with a bike attached to it running towards Southeast. The first time I have seen a WMATA bus with a bike rack in use. It was on a thirtysomething route, not sure which one.
Still haven't seen.
New Flyers 2460-63 and
Bike racks on Royal buses (it is coming soon-trust me)
Also of note I believe some of the Neoplans are being used for training, one was shifted out. Now there are eight. Don't be surprised to see at least one at the on a Redskin shuttle. Most likely will run the employee shuttle from what used to be Landover Mall.
Something I didn't mention was that two weeks ago my old high school
football team won the state championship (Maryland 4A) for the first time since 1974 ( I was one back then). Nice to see a team I follow actually win something, OH YEA OTHER THAN MARYLAND WINNING THE NATIONAL CHAMPIONSHIP IN BASKETBALL.
Congrats on your high school team!! In 1987 while I was a sophomore at Northwestern, we won the 4A basketball tournament. In a fit of jubilation, Jay Bias, younger brother of Lenny Bias, both of whom were taken from us WAY too soon, hung on the rim of the backboard at Cole and ripped the whole thing down, glass and all. The following Monday, Jay comes up to us in line at the cafeteria with a bucket asking us for donations to fix the thing. I looked at him and just busted out laughing and told him good luck to getting that money! He was a teachers assitant in my Junior Algebra II class the next year. He was a cool guy.
Haven't seen anything too interesting bus-wise. However, I drove home a little differently today and when I passed the Arlington garage on the Quincy St. side, saw two of the Thomas SLF "George" buses sitting there.
Those were two tragic loses, especially Len who would have had an outstanding career in the NBA. My cousin went to school with Len back in the day.
I went to school with Parkdale's football coach and he was an intense football and basketball player, so I wasn't surprised they were in the championship or that they won it. I was pretty DAMNED happy on both happening.
I saw Len once when I was still in Middle School at Nicholas Orem. He stopped by one day because Northwestern's former principal was then Orem's, so they were good friends and he came by to visit. I remember walking out of the cafeteria and he was out in the hall all alone leaning against the windows. (Why can't I remember what I had for dinner last night, but I remember this? lol) I just kind of waved to him, then ran back in. I was a geeky 12 year old with nerdy plastic glasses at the time, didn't know what to do then!
Its great to see someone you grew up with do well! I've lost track of all my high school friends.
I haven't talked to him in a while, nor have I visited my high school in a while. I did remember that one time he came to a store that I was an assitant manager at and asked for a part time job, unfortunately we didn't have any to give.
Which depot had Grumman buses?
At NYCTA nearly all depots had Grumman 870 buses except a few that did not receive any ABD's. Those that didn't get any ADB's were WF, OHS, XT and FI. Later after the Grumman 870's were returned the service and the 1981 GMC RTS were delivered... the TA started creating RTS and Grumman depots. The Grumman depots were COL, AMS, FFS, QV, FP, UP and CAS.
At NYCDOT Green Bus Lines, Triboro Coach, Jamaica Buses, Queens Transit and Steinway Transit also had Grumman 870's as an add on to the NYCTA order. MSBA had both the Grumman 870 and Flxible METRO.
Wayne
Flatbush never had Grummans.
David
As David correctly pointed out Flatbush never had Grummans assigned to them. I would like to add that 100th Street also did not have them either.
The reasons were as follows:
In 100th Street- the buses could not fit
In Flatbush- At the time of the Grummans arrival Flatbush buses were involved with a Tire test
Thank You
Thanks - but RE:David's post.... I forgot about FLA and with your post I did list 100 Street depot (OHS) as one of those that did not get any Grumman 870's. I tend to still use the old depot abbreviations that used to be on the old TA/OA fareboxes.
Wayne
Will someone tell me what is the different between the Grumman and the Orion buses?
There's a huge difference between the Grumman Buses and the Orion buses. The "Grummans" that BusTalkers always talked about were the 1979-82 FLXIBLE 870's (the forerunner of the METRO). Grumman bought Flxible fron Rohr, then when they maunfactured the buses, placed their "GRUMMAN" nameplate on the buses instead of the actual brand name of the buses, FLXIBLE.
Orion was a Canadian company that made mostly small buses in that country. Originally they licensed the design to Greyhound's manufacturing arm TMC. In 1984, Orion established Bus Industries of America, which manufactured the brand name ORION bus. There are 5 different types of Orions in service I, II, V, VI, and VII.
The Grummans/Flxible kept their basic styling over the years, while the Orions frequently changed every few years.
[There are 5 different types of Orions in service I, II, V, VI, and VII.]
There may still be a very few Orion III's in service in Toronto and/or Ottawa. And I'm quite sure the Orion IV's are still in service in Niagara Falls.
Actually Sid, there is ONLY ONE Orion 04.501 and that's a motor home.
[Actually Sid, there is ONLY ONE Orion 04.501 and that's a motor home]
I am fairly sure that the large, futuristic vehicles that are used in Niagara Falls, Ontario, for the tourist shuttles along the road on the Canadian side of the Falls are designated as Orion IV's. Hopefully, another BusTalker will know for sure whether or not this is the case.
they are called people movers and ive been on them last summer. dont know who makes them but they look too sophisticated to be an orion product.
Yep, those are Orions alright. They look like sci-fi iterations of two RTSes joined at the butt, but they sure are neat-looking.
-F.
EVERYTHING. Grummans are more sleek and shapely, while Orions are more boxy and utilitarian. And there is a BIG difference in the driver's windshield; while the Grumman has a flat pane slanted back, the Orion has a large bubble-like rounded window...and the wild cant of the left body side to accomodate the window gives the Orion a unique look. This is all assuming you are referring to the modern Orion V.
There are similarities; for one, the round fenders, the slanted-in sides, and the woodgrain inside of most examples give a similar feel.
-F.
I read in the paper today that the TA plans to merge two of the bus divisions as part of the new contract. Which two are they talking about?
Larry, RedbirdR33
They speak of OA (other authority) & TA. Those in Mabstoa have totally different sick, discipline, etc. policy then TA b/o's. Having one policy for all NYC b/o's makes sense for management. Also, Mabstoa is not civil service so it would be interesting to see how that works out.
BLX: Thanks.
Larry, RedbirdR33
MABSTOA never was subject to the Taylor either.
>>>MABSTOA never was subject to the Taylor either.<<<
They weren't? Then explain howcome, during the 1980 strike, my father, who was a MaBSTOA employee, was fined under the provisions of the Taylor law?
Peace,
ANDEE
They were, are and will always be constrained under the Taylor Law.
Bill from Maspeth obviously thinks not. Thanks for assuring me I wasn't going crazy. 8-)
Peace,
ANDEE
You're not crazy. Neither is Bill. The language of the Taylor Law, while governing civil service employees, extands to subdivisions which are not titled under CSL but which extend as an arm of a municipal agency, as OA is to the MTA:
5. The term "employee organization" means an organization of any kind having as its primary purpose the improvement of terms and conditions of employment of public employees, except that such term shall not include an organization
(a) membership in which is prohibited by section one hundred five of this chapter,
(b) which discriminates with regard to the terms or conditions of membership because of race, color, creed or national origin, or
(c) which, in the case of public employees who hold positions by appointment or employment in the service of the board and who are excluded from the application of this article by rules and regulations of the board, admits to membership or is affiliated directly or indirectly with an organization which admits to membership persons not in the service of the board, for purposes of any provision of this article other than sections two hundred ten and two hundred eleven of this article.
6. (a) The term "government" or "public employer" means
(i) the state of New York,
(ii) a county, city, town, village or any other political subdivision or civil division of the state,
(iii) a school district or any governmental entity operating a public school, college or university,
(iv) a public improvement or special district, (v) a public authority, commission, or public benefit corporation,
(vi) any other public corporation, agency or instrumentality or unit of government which exercises governmental powers under the laws of the state, or
(vii) in the case of a county sheriff's office in those counties where the office of sheriff is an elected position, both the county and the sheriff, shall be designated as a joint employer for all purposes of this article.
http://www.perb.state.ny.us/stat.asp
[Also, Mabstoa is not civil service so it would be interesting to see how that works out.]
AND... It'll be even more interesting to see how the combined TA/OA is merged into Long Island Bus. Will B/Os for the new "MTA Bus" fall under the STATE's civil service rules?
We fall under the states civil service laws allready.
As I pulled in to 126th Street Depot this evening following my shift on the M15, I was surprised to see brand spanking new New Flyer artic # 5511 sitting inside the depot. The bus is factory fresh and is without a farebox or a radio. I took a quick peek inside the bus and besides the new bus smell the only difference I saw between it and previous generation artics was that the drivers compartment has a door instead of the usual railing. I believe that these are the first NYCTA buses to have a door seperating the drivers compartment from the rest of the bus. Now if only they would install a plexiglass shield on top of the door and totally isolate us from the public! :^) Also, the manual engine fire extinguisher button is right next to the driver on the left hand side of the dashboard. It's unclear at this time how many of the new artics 126 is scheduled to get. One person I spoke to said 5 while another said 20. I'd be surprised if # 5511 or however many of it's siblings arrive at 126 remain there for any extended period of time. MaBSTOA has a habit of snatching anything new from 126 as soon as it can.
For those of you keeping score, RTS's #'s 4840 and 4843 were transfered into 126 from MJQ. They are the only 4000 series buses currently in the 126 fleet.
How about the headsign? What headsign it have?
Correction:
The Orion VII CNG and hybrid buses have a driver compartment door that separates the bus operator from the passengers...though the space in the drivers' compartment doesn't seem to compare to that of a New Flyer articulated bus...it seems a great deal higher and smaller than our artics...
Carlton
http://cleanairbus.tripod.com
The Cleanairbus Transit Page
Looking for a little education here....would 5511 have been delivered to 126 if it's actual home was supposed to be elsewhere? Is there anything that needs to be done to the bus (such as installing the farebox, etc.) that has to be done at 126 before the bus goes to it's "home depot"? (Pardon the pun!) Or does the delivery to 126 mean that this bus will for sure operate out of 126?
articulated buses for nyct are delivered to atlantic diesel in lodi nj by transporters for new flyer industries. from there they are picked up by operators of the respective depots to which they are assigned. so it appears this bus will be assigned to 126 st. the plan called for 81 buses to be assigned there.
126 st depot does not have room for no 81 new artic. Even in that parking lot across the street
Remember though that in order for 126 to accomodate 81 artics an equal or greater number of RTS's will have to be displaced in some way shape or form.
Hey hey,use proper English.You just used a double negative in the same sentence and that's a no no
Don't not never be using no double negatives!!!
0.0 you just used a quaddruple negative in the same sentence,whats up with that!?
I know, it is a joke. It is an improvement upon the phrase "Don't use no double negatives." I could also say "Don't not never be using no quadruple negatives" because the quadruple negative thing doesn't make no sense ;-)
It's hard to say whether # 5511 is destined to remain at 126 or if it's just been assigned there temporarily. We've had artics in the past but they've usually only stayed at the depot for a few months and then have been transfered out.
There's nothing special that 126 would do to the bus other than installing a farebox and radio. As of tonight it was sporting a 126th Street Depot logo so I guess it'll be ours for at least a little while.
What happened to #5510?
It's unclear where # 5510 ended up. Perhaps it's still in Lodi awaiting pick up.
You thoughts may be right about MaBSTOA snatching it up because the "original" New Artic assignment was supposed to be:
#5510-5539 (30) for Kingsbridge
#5540-5620 (81) for 100th Street
#5621-5701 (81) for 126th Street
#5702-5741 (40) for Quill
#5742-5769 (28) for Stengel
BUT again this is the TA and they may have changed the assignments.
Regards,
Trevor Logan
www.transitalk.org
Lol! That's so true about the TA. It's anybody's guess how this new order of artics is going to be assigned. We'll just have to wait and see what happens.
Is there any chance that they fixed the seating behind the back doors? That area is a serious pain in the ass ( and a hazard) to standees such as myself.
When I took my quick peek inside the bus I mainly concentrated on the drivers compartment since that's where I'd spend the bulk of my day. I really didn't look at the passenger compartment but will do so next time I'm in the bus.
I called my contact over at Atlantic DDC, I will be over there today shooting up some photos to post here, they'll be posted tonight or tomorrow morning!
Regards,
Trevor Logan
www.transitalk.org
eBay Item #2150575136
Tonight I was on the 12:15AM BxM11 and a notice was up saying that weekend service will terminate on 1/1/03 on all LLE routes due to the city's decision to not subsidize the service. Then it says ..."Is your night service next?" What a shame.
What's going on with NYBS and all the other companies (Command, Green, Queens Surface and Jamaica)?
[What's going on with NYBS and all the other companies (Command, Green, Queens Surface and Jamaica)?]
Mayor Mike is gradually getting out of the "guaranteed-profit-no-matter-how-sucky-or-underutilized-the-service-is" bus business.
Well I would miss Weekend Express Bus Service on the QM1A,It's sad to see it go. It's better then dealing with the GO's going on in the Subway.
I saw a sign while riding on Command bus on the B-103 saying that all Saturday express service will be discontinued as of 1/1/03 as per the NYC Department of Transportation
Thank You
Just checked both Command and Green Bus Lines web sites
Both companies have service changes posted about end of weekend service under service notices
Interesting that Jamaica Buses do not. If i recall the QM-21 does operate on Saturdays
I know that Triboro does not operate weekend express service.
Also no notice is posted on the Queens Surfice web site
Thank You
The QM21 runs by my house so here's the real deal.
There's no Weekend service on the QM21 so there's nothing to worry about for the QM21 Line
About 18 yrs ago when i lived in Briarwood the QM-21 did run on Saturdays.
I presume Jamaica Buses discontinued Saturday service then
Thanks for the update
You Welcome.
And besides you ever rode the QM21 Satuarday Service and what buses where used back then?
I recall that back in the early 1980's Jamaica Bus used mostly Fishbowls. At that time they had some 1979 GMC 2 doors and some older surburban GMC's. They also used the Grumman's
I recall one ride in early 1984 when i rode a Grumman on the Queensboro Bridge after the TA pulled their Grummans off the road that I thought that the bus would fall apart on the bridge.
Thank You
Seems like Liberty Lines is unhappy about this. Watch Out the Unemployment Office,You have more people comming and alot of Drivers would end up going there
Actually none of Liberty's Drivers were layed off. Some of the drivers from Express went to the vans and a few others to transit.
Peace,
Kevin
I don't think anybody's basic transportation is being taken away. (Will any parts of the city be left with neither subway service nor local bus service on weekends?) All that's being taken away is a cushy-seated ride for those who can afford a double fare, which is nonetheless very heavily subsidized by the rest of the city.
Most city residents don't have express bus service or can't afford to use it. Why should they pay for the bulk of your cushy-seated ride?
If you think the ride is really worth what it costs, I'm sure you won't have any reservations paying for it yourself. Nobody's stopping LLE from running unsubsidized weekend service. Maybe you should tell LLE how high a fare you're willing to pay; if enough people are willing to pay, say, $10, the service will continue.
Well The Express Buses provide 1 Seat Rides to/from Manhattan from points where the subways don't serve and also where there is a long local bus ride to get to a Subway Station.
The Older People and people with a Disability finds it easier to get a Express Bus to/from Manhattan rather then takeing a Local Bus to the Subway. And also people who hates rideing the Subway(I know a few people that is like that)uses it too. And people who just likes to look out and see something rather then a dark tunnel
I know some people prefer the express bus. They're welcome to get together and pay for express bus service out of their own pockets. I still see no reason that the vast majority of city residents, who don't have the option of riding express buses (either because they don't live in areas served by express buses or because they can't afford the double fare), should pay two-thirds or more of the cost of the service they don't use.
If I don't want to take the subway or local bus for whatever reason, my only luxury option is an unsubsidized cab. I very rarely take cabs; they're too expensive. Maybe I could afford an occasional cab ride if I didn't have to pay for express bus service that I can't use.
Let's see how much less you'll pay now that the weekend express bus service is ending. I sure hope you'll save a lot!!
If the city doesn't save money by cutting a heavily subsidized luxury service, it'll have to get that money some other way.
The withdrawal of subsidized express service by NYCDOT operators may be justified. I haven't seen any ridership figures, but if the number of people who used the service was very low, ending the service may be in order. However, there is still talk of many other mass transit service reductions in the NYC area, especially if the fare is raised to only $1.75 and not $2.00. While cutting out some service that is utilized very little may make sense, the general tide of service cuts will, no doubt, lead to many more cars on city streets (even with toll increases). Government can't have it both ways: if it wants less auto polution, it has to do more to promote mass transit. If it continues to cut back its support of mass transit, the result will be far more auto polution.
Its not like these passengers having all mass transit cut off
They have options such as the bus and the subway
Granted it takes longer and will cause problems especially for senior citizens .
It is unfortunate that these cuts have to be made. Maybe government will finally live within its means and stop wasting our money on offices and unnecessary layers of management
Thank You
THATS MY OPINION ONLY
SEPTA New-Flyer DE40LF 5601H was seen in revenue service on Rt. 17 this afternoon. The bus was seen at 15th and Market St around 3:10 PM.
At least from the onset, it seems that the bus engine makes very little noise, just like the MTA Orion 6 I rode in Manhattan a few weeks ago.
I hope that I might get a short ride on the vehicle either later tonight, or later this week if possible.
That thing FINALLY made it to Philadelphia?
I rode it three months ago in Las Vegas of all places -- at the APTA Expo.
5601H had been at Southern Depot for a couple months after arriving in mid-October. I'm stunned that it took that long to get it into revenue testing.
Mdlbigcat wrote
it seems that the bus engine makes very little noise
Well as you can see did it pick up fast?
Not on Market St around City Hall. The traffic there moves SLOWER than an overweight turtle.
For the last several days, everytime I board an RTS QS bus in the early morning commute, the bus itself is dead freezing! What is up with that? On the other hand, whenever I find myself on an Orion, it's nice and toasty warm! The RTS' are already breaking down, eh? ;)
Maybe they turned the heat off. Or may be the system is broken.
Lack of heat within the RTS fleet at this depot is NOT a general problem, at least that's what our Transportation department told me, so the next time it happens please write down the bus number & contact the company at 718-445-3100 or info@qsbus.com and report it.
Ah, thank you! I sure will.
The first commercial was for the boys and girls club where a teenager gets off a NABI low floor painted in green and then goes to a boys and girls club center. The second was a local channel 7 commercial featuring weather and showed people trying to push out Ride One Orion One 5520 out at the Friendship Heights station.
Today, since I was off, I was going to only go and get some pictures developed, but it turned into me going past garages. Here are some observations:
Southern:
It looks like the temporary repairs at Southern are done. Saw a lot more buses, only in the back part anyways. The front part had only WMATA service vehicles. Didn't get to see any numbers of any buses.
Bladensburg:
I didn't see any Neoplans there, nor saw 2460-63. I did see a 9600 series Orion there and also an Orion VI and saw 5233 which looks like it just looks like it came out of the rehab shop @ Bladensburg shop. Both Orions look like they might be there for a while.
Landover:
Saw Neoplans still there, parked next to the retired MANNs. It maybe soon that at least a couple enter service. As I said earlier, it looks like one is in training. Nothing else to see here.
Other observations:
Was not surprised to see any Neoplans in service, the MANNs are still running hard, but their days are numbered. I saw what looks to be 4065 heading away from Southern to the Anacostia Station. It seems that some of the buses at Southern were temporarily transferred out. 2163-69 were briefly at Arlington and are now back at Southern. I am not sure if 2170-72 is back at Southern, since they were tranferred out to Northern. I didn't see anything else today.
I used to see 4065 running around on some Four Mile Run routes. I'm curious what's down at Four Mile Run these days. Arlington is boring as its small and has mainly 9600, 4380's and 2150's Orion V's, along with all of the 35' Flx Metros and scattered 9300's there. I believe 9210 is there as well.
Was down there a couple of weeks ago, and saw basically the same buses. I don't think they have started to build the CNG facilities probably in the next months, when it gets warm again. There is no rush, since WMATA has yet to award their next CNG bus contract. They should include some 30' and maybe even some 35' to replace the 30' that will be displaced when the CNGs arrive.
Also spotted 4239 with its bike rack in use, the second time in less than a week I have seen this.
This is what Washington area transit agencies are running, including Baltimore MTA and Howard County Transit
WMATA-Mostly Flxible Metros and with Orion Vs, and some Orions VIs, IIs, Neoplan and NABI artics and New Flyer CNGs
RIDE ON-Mostly Gilligs and Orion Vs, with a few Orion VIs, Flxible Metros, Orion Ones, and International Cutaways(provided by private contractors)
FAIRFAX CONNECTOR-Almost all Orion Vs, with some TMC RTS, and a few Orion Ones.
DASH-Mostly Gilligs, with some Orion Is, and Vs
CUE-Mostly Gilligs, with dwindling Orion Ones
PRTC-Mostly MCIs of various vintages, the newer ones being MCI DL4500, and also some Orion Vs and some GMC RTS(including one ex WMATA 9112).
THE BUS-Growing amount of Thomas SLFs, with Champion Contenders and Startrans cutaways, and some Thomas TL960s.
UNIVERSITY OF MARYLAND-Mostly still Flxible Metros, with Gilligs and Thomas TL960s
HOWARD COUNTY TRANSIT-Mostly International cutaways, with a couple of Orion Is and a couple of Flxible Metros
BALTIMORE MTA-Mostly Flxible Metros with some NABIs and Neoplans due to arrive, also with recent arrival of MCI cruisers.
I didn't know Howard County had Flxibles! Other than passing through - I don't go to Howard too often, but I'll have to now that I know they have Flxible METRO's there. How many do they have??? ...I'm guessing that they're 30 foot METRO's????
Wayne
I remember seeing a couple of their 30 foot Metros when it was called "ColumBus". This was several years ago, though. I'm glad they still run them!
PRTC has ex WMATA 9112?? Is it in service? I was on that one once when it was on the K6 going to White Oak. It was cool to see a true suburban style RTS with the high back seats.
I believe I heard it somewhere that, that bus is there. I believe that one has a white back on the sides with a black grill on the sides.
That one is a 30' Metro, 9101. I saw it at BWI Airport and even I was in shock. I think this one was bought by Baltimore MTA. It had a Cummins L10 engine.
Also, I believe that PRTC has three or so MCI Classics. I know these seem out-of-character for the Washington area, but I have seen them in rosters and I also vaguely remember spotting one in person. From what I remember, they are one-door suburbans with deeply tinted windows, not unlike the NYCDOT Classics.
I've seen the Classics here and there at the Pentagon. They definitely are uncommon around here.
I forgot about the Classics. I wish they were more common-place here in the DC area.
Wayne
Has anyone seen these buses recently. I haven't seen them since the first of the MCIs started arriving.
I haven't seen them in quite a while now, but that doesn't mean much since I'm rarely in north VA during peak hours.
Wayne
In the spite of WMATA's budget crisis, it might be a long time before a new WMATA garage is built, but I will still post this:
Northern Prince George's County(perfect spot would be @ the Greenbelt Metro Station:
B30, R1,2,3,4,5, T16, 81,83,86,87,88,89,89M
Southern Prince George's County(perfect spot would be at the Branch Avenue Metro Station, would replace the Annex bus garage)
D12,13,14, C11,12,13,14,18, H11,12,13, K11,12,13, W13,14,15,17,19 and maybe the F14 and V12 (I think the F14 will stay at Landover
Eastern Montgomery County:
C2,4,7,9, K6, Y7,8,9, Z1,2,3,4,5,7,8,9,11,13,17,9,29 with the J1,2,3 and the Q2 using buses from here also during rush hour
Fairfax Western:
2T,3T, 12C,D,E,F,L,M,R,S, 15L,K, 20F,W,X,Y, 28T
Fairfax Southern(probably near where Fairfax Connector has its bus garage: 17A,B,L,M, 18E,F,G,H,J,K,L,P,R,S, 21A,B,C,D,F, 29K,N
These are just my opinion and not of course the opinion of WMATA. Also there are planned garages to take place of the Arlington Garage and Southern garage. Washington is also planned to get a new garage as well as Montgomery County to get another one. The one I see for Montgomery County maybe very far in the future because, Montgomery isn't used to its full capacity and Ride On has a strong presence in Montgomery County and they would be building any new garages before WMATA builds two new garages in Montgomery County. There will be one most likely, but not two. Here is the order of the bus garage building, again this is just my opinion:
1)Southern replacement or Southern Prince George's County
-The one left behind will use the Annex(the Annex might continue as a bus garage, most likely being an annex for either Bladensburg or Southern(even if a new one is built)
2)Fifth Washington garage(I have no clue on where this one could be so I didn't post on what bus routes would go there.)
3)Western Fairfax County
4)Eastern Montgomery County
5)Arlington County replacement
6)Southern Fairfax County
7)Northern Prince George's County
THIS IS JUST MY OPINION, AGAIN :-)
I think a new WMATA garage in Northern PG or Eastern Montgomery (or somewhere in between) would be a good idea. It could really cut down on deadheading time/miles for some current Montgomery, Bladensburg and Landover routes.
Wayne
Especially the Bladensburg routes, some buses from Bladensburg have to go as far north as Calverton to run the R routes and 86.
I keep hearing things that Western garage in Chevy Chase could be put underground so that developers can build on the property. Always great to see a bus garage with a Saks Fifth Ave. in the background.
The Arlington garage is definitely on its last legs. Its one of the last undeveloped pieces of land in Ballston and as much as I love having it there for my personal likings, it is an eyesore. I have no idea where they could put it without running into serious NIMBY's, especially in Arlington. Its built up so much that there aren't any industrial area to put something of that magnitude. I'd bet they'll have to put it underground as well, maybe even under whatever would go atop the current Arlington facility. Its probably a historical landmark as the maintenance garage and surrounding facility looks very old.
Fairfax would definitely be a great idea for a new facility. Right now, they use Arlington buses, so there is some serious deadheading when they have to start and end in Chantilly and Centreville. Although, undeveloped land is scarce out there now too.
That is a pain in the ass when they have to go onto I-66 enroute to and from Vienna during rush hour. I know Arlington was going to replace it and those buses that used that garage would run from Montgomery, now that would have not made much sense at all. I heard that all of Arlington County has been developed, so there is nowhere to put a new garage.
They are supposed to start construction a little over a year from now and during that time, Western's buses would be relocated.
As Southern is replaced and a new garage is built for Southern Prince George's county, the Annex might go one of four ways:
1)Would be an annex for Bladensburg, until another garage is built
2)Would be still an annex for Southern, which would be unlikely since they would build the new Southern big enough not to need it
3)Would be a storage lot
4)Would close indefinitely
God I love me the Flxible!
Sorry guys this server sucks! I will try another one and get to you soon!
Tony
Nice pictures. Where were they taken?
Peace,
ANDEE
Yes they were. You can see them. I can't I wonder what is wrong!
Tony
I went into "view source" and copy/pasted.
Peace,
ANDEE
Why are some people so hell bent on cutting in front of buses?? A small car was nearly T-Boned by a NFI D60 at the intersection of East Tremont and Unionport Road this evening at around 5:24 Pm. The bus was leaving the stop, when the small car speeds up alongside the bus and throws the car direcly in front of the bus and onto unionport road. The back of the car spins out, and at this point the car is semi perpendicular/ head on with this ( Still moving) bus. The driver of the car floors the gas and squeels down unionport road. Everyone on the street who saw this was in awe/ shock, and the bus sat in that very same position for 10 seconds before moving on.
Isn't there a thing called waiting?!?!? WHAT KIND OF F-CK UP DOES SOMETHING LIKE THIS, ENDANGERING THEIR OWN LIVES AND POTENTIALLY HURTING OTHERS SERIOUSLY??? Jesus.......
[The bus was leaving the stop, when the small car speeds up alongside the bus and throws the car direcly in front of the bus and onto Unionport Road.]
That kind of bus-car conflict is part of why NYCDOT prefers to place a bus stop at the far side of (i.e. after) an intersection.
With the Car Wash there and the heavy bus transfering pedestrian traffic , the car driver is one lucky ass soul .He couldve killed someone .
I really think they just don't care. Like many drivers I don't like to get caught behind a bus either, but I'm certainly not going pull any of those stupid moves. I just don't understand it because if you're behind the bus... we all know it won't be long before the bus pull to the right and you can safely pass it. I don't see it much since I moved out of NYC, but I think a bit a driver discourtesy is all over. Sometimes people complain about buses being aggressive, but if they don't they'd never get anywhere because it seems like no one wants to give them a break.
Wayne
I put up with that same nonsense every day with my bus. I'm convinced people want to see my bus get wrapped around a telephone pole and I get sent to the hospital.
If there was a collison, the TA would rule that the accident was a preventable one. The operator is always guilty.
Apprantly there are some people who think they can drive as they want and the buses that they cut off will stop so as to be able to avoid them.
Became aware of this "Public Notice" being put in our fleet:
"(at QSC) ... All Express Bus Service on Saturday and Sunday will be discontinued effective January 4, 2003 ..."
"... Comments you may have about this policy change should be directed to (nycDOT) 212-487-8300"
Disclaimer: I am not the spokesperson for nycDOT or my employeer.
Those poor senior citizens living in North Shore Towers. Of course, the number of passengers might not justify the service, but these seniors consider QS their lifeline to New York.
The QM1A do get pretty good ridership on weekends. Alot of times theres only like about 3-5 Seats left when it leaves Manhattan and when it leaves Main St/Union Turnpike Stop for Manhattan. Sometimes there's standees on the QM1A,That don't happin alot normally once in awale.
Those poor senior citizens living in North Shore Towers. Of course, the number of passengers might not justify the service, but these seniors consider QS their lifeline to New York.
Don't they have local bus service to the subway or LIRR?
JD
[Don't they have local bus service to the subway or LIRR?]
North Shore Towers has only the QM1A, and allows it only because NYCT doesn't operate it.
But North Shore Towers have a Shuttle bus going to the Glen Oaks Shopping Center. It's runs by NST theirself. NST Runs all Champion Cutaway Buses
[But North Shore Towers have a Shuttle bus going to the Glen Oaks Shopping Center. It's runs by NST theirself. NST Runs all Champion Cutaway Buses.]
I was unaware of NST's own shuttle.
However, the rest of my post stands. NYCT's bus planning people have approached NST about extending the Q46 and/or rerouting the Q79 through the complex. The answer: No to both, because NYCT operates them.
Why would North Shore Management differentiate between QSC and NYCT? What is the reasoning behind their decision to allow QSC but not NYCT?
[Why would North Shore Management differentiate between QSC and NYCT? What is the reasoning behind their decision to allow QSC but not NYCT?]
Presumably, it would be a perception of Queens Surface Corp. (a private company) as "good" and NYCT (a public agency) as "undesirable." The fact that QSC's buses are owned by the city would be irrelevant, since only QSC's name appears prominently on the buses.
So? Why MTA Buses can't go to NYCT? The Owner Hates NST?
If the Q46 was to go to NST, It would be the Glen Oaks Branch and the Glen Oaks Branch is Weekdays Only since 9/8/2002 so that means the Glen Oaks Branch would have to get back weekend service
[If the Q46 was to go to NST, It would be the Glen Oaks Branch and the Glen Oaks Branch is Weekdays Only since 9/8/2002 so that means the Glen Oaks Branch would have to get back weekend service.]
Why couldn't it be the 24-7 LIJ branch? Buses could loop through the hospital grounds, then exit and follow the QM1A on Lakeville Road and Marcus Avenue to NST.
No, the better way would be for dual service to LIJ. The first as is, while the second via North Shore (260th Street, Little Neck Parkway, Marcus AVe/GCP Service Road, Lakeville Rd to LIJ).
I lifted this from this week's "Straphangers Compain" electronic newsletter. There's one error ... all week-end Express service offered by nycDOT franchised operators ends, not just in the Bronx.
" On Thursday, Bronx Borough President Adolfo Carrion and hundreds of
protestors gathered at three Bronx locations to protest pending service cuts on Bronx express buses. According to budget restrictions in Mayor Bloomberg’s new budget, the weekend and holiday service on Liberty Buses and all New York Bus service are scheduled to end in Jan. 2003 ..."
Reminder: Express bus service is a big money looser, i.e. subsidized much more then local (some local routes almost make money). Mayor Mike is a business man. Do you think any in the MTA have figured out W-H-Y he is cutting week-end Express service ? How much could the TA save by doing the same ?
Two nights ago around midnight, a bus , Orion or Rts tore off their right front wheel quarter panel, wheel well molding , right turn signal ,and a lot of fiberglass pieces on the toll island of the BWB . What probably happened was the right front side of the bus was probably to low to clear the foot high toll island when it entered the EZ-Pass lane .
The chalk writings on some of the pieces had 444 on it .
wonder what excuse the driver said when he /she turned that bus in with the damage.
Yes QS does have #444 it is a 1999 Orion V and it sounds like she was on the QBx1.
Well , i guess its in the shop now.
Well, #444 wasn't in the yard at 12:30 & Dispatch says it's out there making money. If the damage is as extensive as you say it should be in the Maint. area somewhere.
Hello everyone,
This is my last post. I'm graduating Southampton College tomorrow. My graduation ceremony will be on May 19th (no ceremony for December Graduates in December). As will be looking for work and therefore I will have no time for BusTalk.
I do remember appearing on BusTalk back in 2000 as "mta1765", then "Orion V 295", "Orion V 93087", "NYCT NovaBus RTS-06 #8948 and finally "LI Bus Orion 05.501 #270". There were some good posts on here. Without you guys, I would not know as much about buses as I do now.
Special thanks to BIG AL, Q5Merrick, DHF60, Ctrbs74, Flxible, Joe Saitta, V train B47 bus, W.E.S., Wayne Johnson, Brooklyn67, Thurston, Newflyer7, Gotham Bus Co., Q46 Nova RTS-06 #9288, J-Woodhaven/Nassau Express and so much more I can not even think for ALL your information. Thanks to David Pirrman for letting me into BusTalk. Most importantly, I really want to thank "Da Bus Battallican"(forgive me if I spelled that wrong) for not just for info but as a friend!
I posted my e-mail on here so please keep in touch, please! I also have MOST of your AOL IMs on my buddy list. I would love to hear from you guys. I love you all you guys and gals!
From your friend and Transit fan,
Ray from Southampton,Long Island, N.Y.
P.S. I'm not Michael Jordan. So If I do come back, it will be like about a year or two from now...LOL!
Good luck with the job search.It is tough out there right now.
Ray,
First, congrats to you on graduating from college. Be sure to enjoy the day as it's great feeling and I'll never forget my college experience. I wish you well on your job search. I don't have to tell you that it can be a bit rough these days, but things will work themselves out.
Remember... Here at BusTalk we're a family and we welcome (and encourage) you to drop in whenever you have an opportunity to do so.
Once again.. Congratulations and happy trails.
Wayne
Congratulations, Ray. Much success in all your future endeavors.
Regards,
Perry
Ray, its a big world out there. Just go for it. Dont let rejection get you down. Dont let success make you forget who you really are.
Your life is ahead of you so go and enjoy it.
Education is a wonderful thing.
Ray, congratulations. Times are tough and it's hard to find a job in our current economy, but that education will get you further up the list when your application is on file, especially if you seek civil service jobs. Keep plugging away, and keep in touch; you are warmly welcomed here always. Happy Holidays!
Sincerely,
Fred Donaher
(Flxible)
Hey Ray!
I didn't know you but I sure wish you well. Hope you "break a leg". Besides good wishes for the Holidays, my Great Wishes to you for Life. Congratulations on your graduation, It took a lot of work and you deserve every bit of praise. Good Luck.
Ray,
I'll miss reading your posts and talking with you via AOL "Instant Message". Congratulations on your impending graduation and best of luck in whatever field you choose to work in.
Take care and keep in touch.
Regards,
Dan
Congratulations. I'll bet you'll pull a Jordan much sooner than you think -- BusTalk and SubTalk as well as busfanning and railfanning are addictive.
What kind of work are you looking for? There's people who frequent the Talks from all walks of life -- and those people know people (and so on and so on...)
Good luck!
CG
Congratulations on graduating college, and good luck with your job search. The perfect job of course is the one that pays a lot and you don't have to work that hard or that much. Drop in from time to time to see us here, and you have Merry Christmas and a Happy New Year.
Sincerely,
Wes E. Samuels
Lets start a list of ways the city and the MTA can save money and improve bus and subway service to the riding public.
The first bus change i would make
1-Consolidate the B-2 Flatbush-Ave R route with the B-100 Fillmore Ave/East 66th Street operated by NYCDOT/Command Bus.
This is a wasteful duplication of service
Thank You
All of QSC's Q-34 branch can be eliminated. The Q-44, Q-20 and the Q-14 cover this entire area.
[All of QSC's Q-34 branch can be eliminated. The Q-44, Q-20 and the Q-14 cover this entire area.]
The Q34 loops through Mitchell Gardens, while the others don't. I'd eliminate the Q14 instead, and extend the Q34 north to Whitestone. (Yes, it would stay weekday-only.)
First thing would be to have Command Bus give up their B-100 route. I don't think they'll do that anytime soon.
[First thing would be to have Command Bus give up their B-100 route. I don't think they'll do that anytime soon.]
The B100 is not Command's route to "give up"; it's NYCDOT's route to take away. Command is nothing more than a contract carrier, to be retained or released if the client (DOT) so desires. Ditto for the six other companies.
There is something that seems hard to figure out. With the MTA claiming a defecit of billions, and the need to raise subway, bus and railroad fares, where is the $$$$ coming from to take over the Queens Privates, the Bronx Express Operators, the Westchester County Transportation network and who knows what else??
Or will they just go deeper in debt? I guess with billions in the minus column, several million more (plus) doesn't mean that much.
The way I see it, if Mayor Mike wants the TA to take over the private lines, there has to be some financial incentive for the TA to do it. For the TA to take over the privates out of the goodness of their heart just to give the city DOT a financial break, and have the TA lose money in the process, well as a businessman, Mike should know better!
Seem to be having some trouble on my end so I am making a test post. Sorry for any inconvienence.
Starting on January 6, all MetroBuses in Montgomery County will offer free rides to students between 2 and 7 PM weekdays including when school is not in session, just like on the Ride-On buses. Normal fares apply at all other times. Montgomery County will reimburse MetroBus for all kids fares.
Press release available at www.wmata.com, sorry for not including this in the original post.
YES! Very good for me :) no more need to use my 20 trip to get a transfer to get on a metrobus :)
It'll be nice if it can expand to metrorail also, then I could fly between Rockville and Twinbrook in no time.
Never. No way to regulate it unless they get student passes for Montgomery.
It didn't take long for # 5511 to begin earning it's keep. The bus is being utilized as a training bus in order to familiarize 126th Street Depot drivers in it's operation. Your's truly is scheduled to be trained this coming Monday. Watch your local news station that day and learn about the first articulated to be split in half.:^)
You can't split an artic. The Articulated joint is part of the frame, and as such will be in place for the life of the bus.
Oh Yeah, you can split a Articulated. I saw one split when I made a visit down to Houston earlier in the year. Not A Pretty Sight Might I Add!
Trevor Logan
Did you get the number?!
A WMATA NABI Artic stalled on a RR crossing and got split. I don't believe it ever entered service again but I am not sure.
Yeah, I think that one is spare part fodder. Funny you mention that as I was just talking to a contact I have a WMATA for a report they do that I analyze and we were talking about that bus.
When I toured MTA facilities a couple of years ago, one of their artics was being repaired as well. The middle portion was being worked on which was neat to watch, but I'm sure a pain to deal with.
I meant MTA in Baltimore
Don't tell that to WMATA. One of their NABI's was split by a train a couple of years ago when it stalled (on the tracks of all places) while it was deadheading to the depot. I saw both sections side-side at Bladensburg division, but I don't remember the fleet number.
Wayne
What is there to familiarize the drivers with? Is it that different from the artics already there?
Please tell me it doesn't have one of those hideous orange signs every TA now seems to like.
Umm, 126st doesn't have ANY artics. You can't just hand a driver a new type of bus and tell them to have a nice day. Training on equipment is absolutely necessary.
I had overlooked that fact. Who was trained to drive 5509 then? Did they have a select few operators who were and they just ran it on the same runs every day?
When artics #'s 5506 - 5509 were temporarily assigned to 126th Street, about 40 or so operators were trained to drive them.
Hideous, Those orange and multi-colored Destination Signs are best thing to come along since sliced bread, I sure as hell hope they have them.
Trevor Logan
I haven't seen the multicolored ones but in my opinion, the orange ones are not as good. They are slower to change, in some cases display smaller text, and really aren't able to be read from a distance at night. The only thing they do is let you see that a bus is coming late at night.
The orange signs I've seen are generally easier to read than the green ones, and they change very fast. I occasionally see an orange sign on the M7 (MCH) in an ugly font, but the one on the M104 (Amsterdam) is more pleasing to the eye.
(Can anyone tell me where this photo was taken?)
Is that Univ. of Illinois? I know they have NFI Artics there. I have a coworker that's from there as well. He speaks fondly of both the university and the buses they have.
Yep, you got it. The CUMTD New Flyer artics only started running in January 2002, replacing a fleet of awful 1981 Crown-Ikarus beasts.
Here's another shot:
Here's an oldie but goodie:
More available on request.
Nice pics! I'll have to show my coworker these when I get to work tomorrow.
Rode #5517 last night on the M15, WHOA NELLY! I will post the photos when I get home tonight!
Trevor
Exterior Front
Exterior Rear
Interior Front
Interior Rear
Interior Middle
Driver's Cockpit
Enjoy!
Regards,
Trevor Logan
www.transitalk.org
No "hideous orange signs". Yay! Of course, I'd rather see an orange one than a green one saying YANKEE STADIUM. Of course, the orange one couldn't say YANKEE STADIUM either.
Great pics Trevor! I sure hope to see a whole bunch more on the M15 real soon. BTW is CS still slated to receive Artics for the Q44?
Also heard from a friend of mine that they could be used on the Q12 and the Q27 as well.
I also remember seeing 5508 at CS for about a week or 2 shortly after the Bus Roadeo.
#5517 M15
Let the old RTS' @ 126th ST. re-assignments begin. Brooklyn and Queens depots can use those 8000's (just make sure those right side mirrors are fixed!).
Looks like the Fare Box was out of Service
OMG, I've never seen anything SO beautiful!!!!!
Hey, They didn't fix the seating behind the back doors! UGH!!
Ah, splendid...
Can't believe that one was already here and running!!!!!!
Carlton
http://cleanairbus.tripod.com
The Cleanairbus Transit Page
ok, I got my shots of #5511...no need for me to post them here...no reason to...you've already seen the model...question is: why the larger more squared engine compartment? Looks a bit tacky and ugly, if u ask me...
Carlton
http://cleanairbus.tripod.com
The Cleanairbus Transit Page
HAS NYCTA ever concidered the NABI's model 60LFW low-floor design. This may help solve some of the dwell time issues
The problem with a low-floor articulated bus is that it tends to carry fewer people than a standard-floor artic. Thus far, NYCT has rejected low-floor artics, but since that seems to be the way the industry is going, eventually NYCT may either have to relent or decide to do so.
David
I'd be suprised if NYCTA even bought the standard Neoplan AN-460. They tested it years ago (along with the MAN) - I guess they didn't like it.
Wayne
The reasons for the city not purchasing Neoplans has been stated previouly on this board.It has to do with Colorado were Neoplans are made and its anti-homosexuality laws.
Gee! Thanks. Forgive me for not reading every single post on the board.
*Sigh* And I was hoping that somehow these beasts wouldn't make it do NYC. If they were going to go with NFI products, they should have just bought about 600 D40LF's. Oh well. Now, all I can hope for is a massive defect in the articulated joint or the failure of the Orion VII in Gruman like proportions.
Does NYCTA have any plans to begin testing composite frames buses. Composits have been used in airplanes for 20 years and all new airplanes contain composite frames. NABI claims tremedous fuel savings due to the lighter weight.
If NYCTA would test composites I would assume they would want to do a supper long term test to evaluate their durability on our streets.
I don't get it. Are you a BusTalk version of those SubTalk peeps who want the Redbirds to live forever? Why do you hate the newest busses in the fleet?
Perhaps his opinion isn't based on factors other than the age of the bus.
Automatically disliking a new bus is silly, IMO. Automatically disliking an old bus is equally silly.
Anything new sometimes takes some getting used to.
It still seems weird to me that the orions have their seeting configuration (one seaters on the right side of the bus) as compared to the RTS's
To me too! I wonder why it was switched.
You guys never saw the seating configuration of a NYCTA Grumman did you?The Orion V is using an interior design that was used almost 20yrs ago.
I know. IIRC I've seen RTSs with the same seating configuration -- but NYCT RTSs have always had the single-seaters on the left. So why don't NYCT Orions have the single-seaters on the left? The seating arrangement is specified by the ordering agency, no?
nyct likes variety.
Was very young when i road the grumman's on the B3. Did not remember thier seating config
Finally, new buses! It's about time we're going to see some changes.
I'll be patient, and wait for anything interesting to happen in the Brooklyn Division. I just hope I can stay here long enough to see all of these great changes that are going to happen.
I was hanging out at First Ave./Houston St. this afternoon from about 1:30 PM to 3 PM. No artics showed up on the M15.
In due time my friend! In due time!
#5511 M15
As far as I know there were no artics in service today. # 5511 was being used for training and 5517 & 5520 were in the depot all day. # 5511 was in service on the M15 on Sunday night.
#470 is now a Mother Clara Hale route, all of this after it was transferred from Amsterdam to Yukon Depot, and before that, being transferred from Castleton to Amsterdam back in 1999 (?). This bus has gotten around! Also note: I also saw #467 running on the Bx19 today, too...it was going N/B about 10 minutes ago...
This all might be in anticipation or in preparation of the Amsterdam Depot closure and the W Farms and 100th St Depots' openings. BTW, MCH sent bus #6056 to Amsterdam, a friend of mine said he saw that bus on the Bx15 today.
Carlton
http://cleanairbus.tripod.com
The Cleanairbus Transit Page
Bx19 #470 MCH Orion V
Bx19 #467 MCH Orion V
Does this mean that Amsterdam will close for good once 100th St. and West Farms open?
Closing Amsterdam was the plan at one point, but right now keeping it open is under consideration.
David
468 and 469 were also at yukon. have they also arrived at mother hale?
This move is short lived. I Chatted with a my connection at MCH. The Hybrid did well and is currently at Orion. When the actually order comes through, the Only Orion 05.501's that will remain will be the 1999 Orion 05.501s (6000 Series, some 6000s will come from Amsterdam), and the Orion 06.501 Hybrids. Of Course like anything this info could change.
The 400s may be coming over for interim. This is not the first time a 400 has seen life at MCH, I have several photos of the 440s at MCH when MCH first went Orion.
Another thing is that MCH and Amsterdam transfers equipment between the garages QUITE frequently.
Regards,
Trevor Logan
I spoke to an AGM at GH yesterday, I asked him about West Farms Depot, he told me that they will do a "soft" opening in july with one line possibly running out of it until September when it will go into full operation.
Yeah, I have noticed that over the past two years or so...
Carlton
http://cleanairbus.tripod.com
The Cleanairbus Transit Page
I thought 470 was a Yukon bus, saw it recently on the S79 a few weeks ago unless it got transferred.
I saw that bus on the M1 on last Wed night. It has MCH stickers on it Also of note, 467 is now there. Sounds like the 400s are going to MCH.
the entire new contract is available as four PDF files on my site:
www.stationreporter.net
All Bus Talkers are welcome to visit!
Story from the Washington Post here. As you may have figured (since this is BusTalk), the family in this article is that of Conrad Johnson, the Ride-On driver who was the final victim of the DC area snipers.
Kudos To Ride-On and their employees. I know it's a difficult time but I still hope that the Johnson family can enjoy the holidays.
I was happy to see that Ride-On actually permitted those employees to use a bus to deliver the gifts to Conrad Johnson's family. Those sign are slowly disappearing from the buses, but I'm glad to know that Conrad Johnson will be remembered.
Wayne
They had a brief segment on this on the 11:00 news last night (forget which station). Apparently Ride-On operators collected about $1,200 (IIRC) to buy gifts and decorations for Mr. Johnson's children, then pulled up to their house in a 'Santa's sleigh' bus to deliver the goods.
C
I saw a report of this christmas greetings on FOX 5 last night. Unfortunately, i only caught the last 2 minutes of it. Best wishes for the Johnson family.
I share in the grief this Chrismas time with the Johnson family. I lost my wife to cancer this fall,as some of you already know, and it will be a tough one for me. also.
Chuck Greene
I saw that on a couple of news reports. Nice to see that they are looking out for the family. Seeing that brings a tear to your eyes. I also say kudos to Ride On.
I got an e-mail from tlogan@transitalk.com at 12:26 this morning, titled "A powful tool". It has an attached file called "neopoker2.zip". The e-mail says, "Hello,This is a powful tool I hope you would like it." You didn't really send me this, did you? Maybe you better check your system for a virus or somethin'.
Delete it fast!That definantly is a virus! Trevor mentioned bout this already.If something like that happen's,get rid of it,cause it's a virus.
Thought so.
Calm down, as long as you don't open the attachment all will be fine.
Trevor may, however, want to check his system for trojans and might want to contact support@nsclean.com.
Just a thought.
Peace,
ANDEE
That's a bad one. I've been getting similar emails from different SubTalk/BusTalkers. Or at least it seems to be coming from them, even though it really isn't. I contacted one of the Subtalkers (who I knew wouldn't be sending out viruses) who I thought I got an email from (or who it seemed to be from) and told him I thought he may have a virus or something. He sent me the below links for more information.
The addresses that these emails say it's from may not even be the person that has the "infection". This virus/trojan/worm trys to find email addresses on an infected computer. When someone with an infected computer pulls up SubTalk, many of our email addresses get picked up by the infected computer's virus and then sends these emails out. The addresses it uses, doesn't mean that that person's computer is infected.
Just delete them. DO NOT OPEN THEM. Instead of me trying to explain it further, see below.
http://www.wired.com/news/technology/0,1282,52174,00.html
http://www.wired.com/news/technology/0,1282,52055,00.html
It's okay, you can mention my name.
A Sub/BusTalker with a Verizon Internet connection is infected. I don't know who it is; all I know is that he has lots of us in his address book. I even got a copy of the virus "from" our resident virus expert, SelkirkTMO (of course, it wasn't really from him).
If you want to protect yourself from email viruses, don't use an email client that will run any arbitrary program or script that comes in the mail. Outlook Express is the most common offender.
It's okay, you can mention my name.
LOL.
I didn't want to put you on the spot without your knowledge....
While in Georgetown checking out the new Loewes theater, which no big deal in my opinion, saw a few interesting buses go by. Spotted 4398 on the B11 heading to Rosslyn, 4346 on one of the 30's ( I thought this was a Montgomery Bus) and CNG 2443 on the 36 heading to Hillcrest. It was a misty, rainy night, so not much action in Georgetown or too much traffic.
No Flxibles? Where are my favorite WMATAs hiding this week?
-F.
Lets see, did I see any last night? I think it was an all Orion night. Oh, on my way home from work I saw a couple of 35' footers and I did see Metro D 9747 on the 25B. Slowly but surely, Four Mile Run seems to be getting all their old Metro D's back that ended up in Bladensburg for a few years.
4346 has always been at Montgomery to my knowledge. Interesting that 4398 was on the B11, that bus has suburban type seating.
I will add your observations into the roster. Thanks!
Yeah, it was strange seeing 4346. I really wish I saw the route it was on. It was either the D5 or the 30's, but most likely the 30's.
I can't imagine why 4398 was put on the B11! Usually, they use the older 9600's. I don't think anyone was on that bus. I was on Orion VI 2007 at the time, but I could see mainly seats and no people.
I'll be in Old Town tomorrow night, so I'll be on the lookout for anything interesting down there.
Sorry, I meant Western for 4346 and didn't catch it until now. I hate it when I am thinking one thing and type another.
Speaking of 4300s, at about 1:40 this afternoon I saw 4362 on Old Georgetown Rd at Wisconsin Av with a 'EMERGENCY / CALL POLICE' signboard. (I would have, but my cell phone batt was dead.)
c
Did you happen to stay and find out what happened?
No, I just noticed it as I was driving by. It may have just been a false alarm, accidentally activated by the driver -- I haven't seen anything in the news.
C
Well there would be people further down the route
It was towards the end of the route already. Hardly anyone seems to ride that thing. I don't know if there is enough publicity out on it.
Interesting you say that, I sometimes see them on Wisconsin Avenue near Friendship Heights in the morning heading to Medical Center (on the MD side of the line). While they are no where near full, there seem to be enough people to demand service, although I did witness someone looking a little surprised to see a B11 pull up instead of a Ride-On 42 when the route first started. I was on the other side of the street but based on his body language, that is what seemed to be going on. The ridership on the MD side might be from 42 riders.
My suggestions for how to make the route more popular although unlikely they will happen since it seems they are cutting service, not adding it:
1. Run service in both directions during rush hour. The buses deadhead to Rosslyn using the EXACT same route as they do to Medical Center and vice versa. Yes, it would take longer, but it would be an increase in service on the even 30s and there are plenty of people who could use it.
2. Run service middays, weekends, and/or up until 9 PM on weekdays, but don't operate service north of Friendship Heights.
3. Rename the service the 31 or 33 so people associate it with the Wisconsin Avenue MetroBuses. I bet some people just see it go by and figure its not a 30, it isn't going all the way up Wisconsin. For those of you who don't know, 35 is taken, 37 used to run from Tenleytown to Archives via Wisconsin and Mass Aves, and calling it the 39 would be stupid since the last of the even 30s is the 36.
I agree with you. When I took a ride on the B11 a few months ago, only a few people boarded at Rosslyn. Once we got on Wisconsin Ave., we picked up a few people, but we were leapfrogging with a 30 bus, so the ridership along there would fluctuate based on what bus arrived first.
The way this route has been designated "Reverse Commute" is somewhat not correct either. Although it is going into Maryland from VA, its going into an urban area, not in non-rail areas such as Germantown or even parts of Gaithersburg.
I like your ideas about running it both directions. Maybe just terminating it at Frienship Heights altogether might be a good idea since you do have the 42 running from there to Bethesda.
Back when Ride On started that Route 91 on Rockville Pike to offer free rides during lunchtime, it sounded like a great idea, but it was going to kill the ridership on the 46. I remember hearing how great the ridership was on this bus, but nobody dealt with the fact that the 46 probably had nobody on it during the time. Shortly after this happened, the 46 rides were free, too. What were they thinking was going to happen when two buses that travel the same location, one being free and one you have to pay, was going to do? Well, the 91 is gone, but I think a little more research needs to go into planning before something like that occurs.
The B11 has the opportunity for success, but time will tell. Changing it to one of the 30's might be better for recognition too. For you and I and a few others on here, we'd know if we were waiting on Wisconsin Ave. and it was coming, you could get on, but for the oblivious out there, they still need a little handholding.
I never knew the B11 runs along the 30 Series Line and the RO 42 Line. So much for those WMATA Route Maps,They never show what routes to transfer to and they never show what routes also run on the same street
1. The full WMATA system maps are now online for free. Memorize them all you want.
2. It isn't the 30 series line, it is the even 30s!!! NO ONE calls it the 30 series line. They are called the even 30s (and I know 35 is an odd number) or the 30s. The WMATA 42 is called the 42, the 14th street buses are the 50s, the Georgia Avenue buses are the 70s, and so on. No serieses (sp?), period.
3. Washingtonians tend to be smarter people. We use our resources and don't rely on those maps. Anyone who needs to take a bus on Wisconsin Avenue knows that the 30s run there. Any experienced rider will know the B11 might take them where they want to go. If they don't, they will ask (and actually get a decent answer) or they won't get on the bus but won't make a scene like they do in New York. If someone is clueless about how to go, they use the Ride-Guide or call Metro. Then they get a schedule. The maps could use connections listings but then again, most tourists don't use the buses. As for the Ride-On 42, it is a Ride-On route, WMATA doesn't have to take responsibility for it. Finally, you could be resourceful yourself. Go look at an even 30s map, go look at a 42 map, and compare it to the B11.
Ok. I see why. I just think of what would makes more sence for the rideing public
I had never thought about it until you posted it but I still think people can be resourceful and figure it out. If you spend enough time on the WMATA website, you can find quite a few useful things. WMATA cares about their website alot more than the MTA does, but I have a feeling they won't tell ANYONE they put the full system map online so they can still get up to 3 dollars from people trying to buy it.
Write them an e-mail (WMATA actually accepts them) and you will get an automated e-mail back saying your request was received and you might get a response some day.
Well I did. The B11 and the 30's runs along the same street. It can be resourceful just as long as you know where to Transfer.
You only looked after I told you to, right? As for transfering, they share all the same stops on Wisconsin Avenue (the B11 operates on all but about 3 blocks of that street where it carries the Wisconsin Avenue name) so you can transfer wherever you like. There is no reason to transfer from a NB B11 to a NB 30someting, but you might need to make a different transfer. Also, one can take the 38B from Georgetown to Rosslyn as well.
I was meaning the WHOLE WMATA Systerm in General.
Is it possable if I can use a N/B B11 Transfer if like I need to get off and go to the store then I can use it on the 30's,Can I do that?
Transfers can be used on any route of any "participating" authority at any time up until the time they expire. Most systems give transfers good for 2 hours, some give longer. The value of the transfer is punched at the bottom, if the bus being transfered to costs more than the value of the transfer, the rider has to pay the difference. Transfers may be used for stopovers and round trips. The 30 operator will have no idea that you got the transfer on the B11.
The best thing is when you get a transfer that doesn't expire because the operator didn't cut it. Of course whenever that happens, I actually have a need for a bus in more than 2 hours.
To add on to what Oren said. Transfers in the DC are awesome. NYCTA bus transfers are good as well, but their have the advantage is in that you can make free bus to subway transfers and vice-versa. The DC area transfers have the advantage if you're traveling via bus and you're riding more than two buses. Often I'll go out for a short ride and paying $1.10, get the transfer and use it as much as possible. BTW-We can do that because each time you board a bus you only need to show the transfer to the B/O and not surrender it.
Wayne
I agree with you. When I took a ride on the B11 a few months ago, only a few people boarded at Rosslyn. Once we got on Wisconsin Ave., we picked up a few people, but we were leapfrogging with a 30 bus, so the ridership along there would fluctuate based on what bus arrived first.
Well, I have not been on an even 30s bus since August and when I last took one, it was from Georgetown to Friendship Heights at about 2:30 in the afternoon. Needless to say, the B11 wasn't running in any direction, so I can't comment.
The way this route has been designated "Reverse Commute" is somewhat not correct either. Although it is going into Maryland from VA, its going into an urban area, not in non-rail areas such as Germantown or even parts of Gaithersburg.
It is reverse commute because its purpose is to take people from Rosslyn, Georgetown, and Northwest to Bethesda, NIH, and Navy Medical. I guess no one wants to go from Bethesda, Chevy Chase, Northwest, or Georgetown to Rosslyn.
I like your ideas about running it both directions. Maybe just terminating it at Frienship Heights altogether might be a good idea since you do have the 42 running from there to Bethesda.
Well, part of it is personal greed, I might be willing to shell out the 1.10 on some days to save myself half a mile of walking through the elements or because I am simply late. It seems to me though there would be a higher number of riders going from Northwest TO Rosslyn then the other way around. But, I think the route is partially funded by the Governor's Transit Initiative (Glendening's initiative), which is why it runs the way it does. The J4 came about the same way, through the initiative.
Ending the B11 at Friendship Heights is NOT an option. It would have no ridership base whatsoever if it ended there. Now, outside of rush hours, cutting it back to Bethesda or Friendship Heights might work, but not rush hours. I have a feeling whoever is riding the B11 probably goes to Medical Center. I do wonder if discontinuing the 42 and replacing it south of Bethesda with the 34 would be any goods. Right now, there are three "primary" services between Bethesda and Medical Center. They are the J2, 34, and 42. The 34 and 42 run within 8 minutes of each other during the midday hours, so with both those AND the J2 running, it seems like quite alot of extra service. Put the 92 in there and I don't see what good all those routes provide, if any. Having a Friendship Heights to Wheaton route outside rush hours would also be popular as well, and even if it is not, the ridership from Bethesda to Wheaton and Bethesda to Friendship Heights is there, so why not one route? They also run almost identical hours. I wonder if anyone at Ride-On is reading this...
Back when Ride On started that Route 91 on Rockville Pike to offer free rides during lunchtime, it sounded like a great idea, but it was going to kill the ridership on the 46. I remember hearing how great the ridership was on this bus, but nobody dealt with the fact that the 46 probably had nobody on it during the time. Shortly after this happened, the 46 rides were free, too. What were they thinking was going to happen when two buses that travel the same location, one being free and one you have to pay, was going to do? Well, the 91 is gone, but I think a little more research needs to go into planning before something like that occurs.
The 91 was stupid. I never saw more than 2 or 3 people on those buses when it ran. Presumebly, the 46 ridership was not killed by the 91 and it became free because not enough people were on the 91. Making the 46 free didn't help either (nor did extending it from Grosvenor to Rockville, so it ran almost the whole length of the 46), so it was cut back to Edson Lane and eventually cut altogether. Again, I believe the 91 was Glendenning's idea, but this one didn't work out as well as some of his others.
The B11 has the opportunity for success, but time will tell. Changing it to one of the 30's might be better for recognition too. For you and I and a few others on here, we'd know if we were waiting on Wisconsin Ave. and it was coming, you could get on, but for the oblivious out there, they still need a little handholding.
I am really coming to believe that WMATA buses should run with VIA readings on their signs like these:
B11 ROSSLYN
B11 VIA WISC AVE
32 SOUTHERN AVE STA
32 VIA WISC/PENN AVES
N2 FARRAGUT SQ
N2 VIA MASS AVE
N2 VIA WESSLEY HTS
and so on. I would make it the B11 the 31 so not only would it fit in with the 30s in DC, it would be almost like a Ride-On route in MD. I just hope that no one at Bethesda gets on thinking it is going to Glen Echo (like the old 31) or that it is a very confused Ride-On 31 (which runs between Glenmont and Wheaton).
When I saw the service change list for the J4, I was hoping that it was so popular it was running during the midday. I'm thinking that will happen eventually since its supposed to be similar to the routing of the purple line.
I forgot the B11 goes to Medical Center. I only rode it as far as Bethesda. You're right, it wouldn't make sense to terminate it at Friendship Heights.
Hey, if the Smartmover can make it almost 5 years, I suppose there's no reason that the B11 wont be around for awhile. I do think a route number change would be a good idea.
I am just glad they have a limited service between Bethesda and Silver Spring, maybe it can shelve the purple line for a few more years. I haven't ridden it yet but I have seen them and it looks like they get pretty good ridership.
Bethesda has quite alot of restaurants which can be used for lunch. The question is how many people from NW will go there if the B11 ran. They can take Metro since it is only 1.10 from Tenleytown to Bethesda during off peak times.
I am amazed the SmartMover is still alive. Someone must ride it. I think the B11 has a more promising future than the SmartMover.
One interesting thing about the B11, I believe it is the only WMATA route to go operate in all three "states" it serves: Maryland, DC, and Virginia.
The J4 is a fun ride. The time I rode it, the driver flew along E-W Hwy. between Bethesda and Silver Spring. We had a Metro D, which made it even better. It was 97xx, I can't remember the exact number. When we turned off Piney Branch Road to University Blvd., the bus received some strange stares. I guess they're used to seeing the C2, 4, the Ride Ons and the University of MD shuttle, but not this one.
This route might be similar to how the C8 was when it ran from Glenmont to College Park in the beginning, when that was only rush hour service, then was eventually expanded to all day and Saturday service as well as extended to White Flint. I'm sure the J4 will see all day and maybe some weekend service in the future.
You're correct about the B11 being the only bus to travel both states and DC. I don't think that's happened since the metrorail system caused eliminations of a lot of the routes that used to do things like that. For example, the R4 used to travel from Calverton to Crystal City via DC.
I agree the J4 is a fun route. Last time I rode the J4 we had METRO-E 4044. It was actually one of the last Code Red days so the A/C was going full blast. This was a very enjoyable ride because the A/C was awesome for such a hot day and it didn't seem to hold the bus back too much. I still haven't decided if I prefer the University Blvd part or the E-W Hwy portion. It gets some pretty good speed on University, but those hills and curves of E-W Hwy are pretty good too.
Wayne
Yeah, University Blvd. was pretty good too. Actually, I bet after it leaves the University and heads down the big hill on University towards Adelphi, it would pick up a good amount of speed, too. I used to like to let my bus fly down there when I was doing Silver Spring runs or the Adelphi South.
E-W Hwy is always fun because of all the curves. My g/f had fallen asleep when we went on because we had to get up really early to start up with this bus trip-palooza, starting with the 6:30 AM 38B, so when we headed down those curves, I had to put my arm around her waist to keep her from falling off into the aisle!! I couldn't believe she slept through that whole ride. When we arrived at College Park, I told her she missed the best part of the trip. She told me she felt me hanging on figuring she was about to fall off!. LOL
The C8 was extended to White Flint to "guarentee transfers" between the C8 and Ride-On 40. They simply discontinued the 40 and extended the C8.
I'm sure Oren will find 50 ways to make me look like a fool for suggesting this, but I think that Ride-On would be wise to prefix all of its route numbers with a '2'. Keep the current numbers, just slap a 2 in front of them. This would greatly reduce confusion with WMATA route numbers. I'm not all that familiar with Ride-On, but I know that some of its routes come awfully close to WMATA routes with the same or a similiar number.
Think about it. WMATA has no three-digit route numbers, and Fairfax Connector already uses 100-, 400-, and 900-series numbers, so Ride-On could nicely fit itself into this three-digit suburban numbering system. I don't see any reason why The Bus and other smaller suburban systems could not follow.
Regarding WMATA's own route numbers, I know they appear confusing, but I actually find them rather sensical and useful. As we all know here, there is logic behind the numbers; it doesn't even take a transit enthusiast to benefit from this logic. If anyone takes two minutes to understand the numbering system, that person can instantly tell a lot about any route simply by its number. The only thing that might still be confusing is the excess punctuation on the Gultan destination signs, where 0042, -42-, ..42, /42-, 4242 and 42. are all the same route!!
Well, first off, 0042, -42-, ..42, /42-, 4242 and 42 are not all the same. On the schedules, a 42/ indicates that the bus is not serving the full route. Now, this poses its own problems. For example, the 30 runs from Friendship Heights to Potomac Avenue, but only one or two trips a day actually run the full route. Most run from Friendship Heights to Archives, and on the schedules, are designated 30/. None of the operators sign them this way. On the 34, which has some trips ending at Tenleytown, the ones I have seen often use the slashes, and the sign will say /34/ TENLEYTOWN STA (although the first / is uncessary). Most 42 (WMATA here) buses to Farragut Square do not seem to use the slashes, but I haven't been at DuPont Circle during rush hour for years.
The only comlication I see with the current system is is the fact there are no other WMATA routes in the 40s other than the 42. Also, they run close enough to each other (WMATA is Mount Plesant to Metro Center, Ride-On is Friendship Heights to Medical Center) so that some people I know have a need to talk about either one. Often, the 30s are grouped together, so I say I took a 30s bus down to Georgetown. You can't refer to the 42 as the 40s, since there is only one! I have already suggested eliminating the 42 for an entirely different reason but that would solve the problem.
That said, making a regional numbering system is doable, if it was done in phases. My honest suggestion would be to add a letter in front of each system for their routes. Ride-On could be R, WMATA could be W (for Washington), Baltimore could be B, DASH could be AT (as they already are), Fairfax Connector would be F, and so on. All the route numbers could stay the same although the WMATA routes would all have to become numbered somehow.
We would have:
W32 FRIENDSHIP HTS
R27 MEDICAL CENTER
AT4 BRADDOCK ROAD
R37 POTOMAC
and so on.
Now, I was talking to someone I know and only enligthened them about the whole logic in the past few weeks. Once I explained how it all worked, they immediately saw the logic, but hadn't realized it until then. Even so, the fact is most people are not confused, so there isn't really a need to change it.
And one more thing, Ride-On has a route 124. What does that become, the 2124?
Now that would have some problems.
1st off idk like say
WB30 BWI AIRPORT
idk if that would work since people would think it's runs by WMATA and Baltmore MTA. I thinking WMATA would have to end up useing the 3 Digit Route Systerm for a few routes like the MTA NYCT comes into mind,M101,M102,M103 for example
I addressed that.
the WMATA routes would all have to become numbered somehow.
The Letter/Number codes such as B30 and 38B would not work as WB30 and W38B. They would have to be renumbered somehow, although as I have previously stated, no one seems to be overly confused by the current system, so we might as well continue to use it.
WB30 sounds like a television station run by the WB network.
I did think of that when I was typing it. Too bad there isn't a B50 WMATA route, otherwise it would become the WB50.
LOL!!! And put Michigan J Frog on the front of the bus.
On the schedules, a 42/ indicates that the bus is not serving the full route.
I knew you would call me on this. But with the slash as the exception, none of the other marks have any meaning - though I do think they're kind of cool.
I have already suggested eliminating the 42 for an entirely different reason but that would solve the problem.
What's your issue with Route 42? I really like this line a lot. It covers useful territory, it's frequent, fairly reliable, and provides a nice alternate to transfering off Metrorail. I don't see the problem.
Let's first make sure we are discussing the right 42. I am discussing the Ride-On 42 which operates on Wisconsin and Woodmont Avenues between Friendship Heights and Medical Center.
That said, I wrote the following in post #61612:
I do wonder if discontinuing the 42 and replacing it south of Bethesda with the 34 would be any goods. Right now, there are three "primary" services between Bethesda and Medical Center. They are the J2, 34, and 42. The 34 and 42 run within 8 minutes of each other during the midday hours, so with both those AND the J2 running, it seems like quite alot of extra service. Put the 92 in there and I don't see what good all those routes provide, if any. Having a Friendship Heights to Wheaton route outside rush hours would also be popular as well, and even if it is not, the ridership from Bethesda to Wheaton and Bethesda to Friendship Heights is there, so why not one route? They also run almost identical hours. I wonder if anyone at Ride-On is reading this...
That might be more complicated for WMATA numbering all of their routes with a "W" prefix, especially with all of the 12s, 14s, 2s, and 4s running around. That would be a good idea though to make routes easier to understand. I would add to get rid of all of those 12s, 4s and 14s, I would suggest the following:
WMATA only with a prefix W
Washington=W1-199
Maryland=200-399
Virginia=400-599
This routing would give enough room to for route expansion, especially if Charles County, Loudoun County, Prince William County and other outer surburban counties join WMATA, which might be far into the future.
You have to remember that WMATA is a combination of several bus companies: WMA, DC Transit, and AB&W. (I might forgotten some.) Each of them had their own route numbering system. WMA (Maryland) had letters as the base route and #s to show variations, e.g. H12, H11, H14. In Virginia, it was the opposite, numbers as the base route and letters to show variations, e.g. 16A, 16C.
The district just had numbers (80, 70) or letters and numbers (A2, A7, etc.) The numbering system for the streetcars followed a circular system. Starting on the west side of town, the 10 line ran from Key Bridge to Seat Pleasant, 20 line ran from Glen Echo to Union Station, 30 line ran from Friendship Heights to Barney Circle, 40 line ran from Mt. Pleasant to Municipal Center, 50 line ran on 14th Street, 60 line ran on 11th Street, 70 line ran on 7th Street, 80 line ran on N. Capitol, 90 line ran to/from the Navy Yard via Florida Avenue or New Jersey. These route numbers are still used today, except for the 20.
Michael
Washington
Hoping to retire to New York in 3 years
I don't know why they gave this route the B11, I guess maybe for Bethesda, but anyway how about instead of it terminating at Medical Center, reroute it to serve Silver Spring via Bethesda and East West Highway. I would call it the 38,39 with the 39 being limited stop bus service in both directions during rush hours.
The trips would start out at Silver Spring Station, and would get to East West Highway via 16th Street south (I don't know what that road is leaving the Silver Spring Station (I don't mean Colesville Road). The trip would take the Js routing up to Bethesda and then take the B11 routing to Rosslyn. The 39 would only stop at certain stops including all in Georgetown, Tenlytown Station, Friendship Heights Station, Bethesda Station, and Rosslyn and Silver Spring Station. The 38 would run all day with weekend service possible and the 39 would run only rush hours.
The reason why I think this route should be rerouted to Silver Spring in that it might relieve overcrowding on Metrorail, since Silver Spring is a major transit center and that people can transfer to other Montgomery routes or even the Landover routes F4 and F6 to New Carrolton.
Tell me what you think.
W.E.S. - the street leading to the Silver Spring Station is Wayne Ave:-). If you cross Colesville Road (near the McDonald's) it becomes Second Ave.
Wayne
Now how did you remember that? LOL!!!
As some of us know, the JFK Flyer and N90 Hempstead shuttle will be eliminated. But there are signs on the bus of more changes.
The HUB shuttle is more or less gonna bite the dust, except for 3 weekday Mariott Runs (and the fare will be $1.50 now).
Also a new route between Roosevelt Field and Hempstead will be started called the N43.
As far as the cut routes go, they got poor ridership, though I dunno if its justified to cut the Fortunoff loop runs entirely.
OK, I made a mistake, the N43 is between Roosevelt Field and Freeport.
Nothing happened really today, but one striking observation did occur today. As I past by Landover to see the Neoplan artics, there are more of them there, looks like the rest of them have arrived. They are parked at the back of the yard. On Pennsy Drive, you can see face to face 5315,16, and 17 facing the street. There are three more behind, the eight that were there for the past couple of weeks and a couple more next to those. Interesting that the MANNs are still parked next to the Neoplans, I thought they would have moved them into the lot with the 8700s.
One other observation was seeing a 40 footer on the 84. This route usually uses 30 footers, which is something else interesting. I have seen less of the 30 footers, beit the Flxibles or the Orions. I hope they aren't being transferred out. 3922-29 were already transferred out to Southern.
This may be a stupid question, but can a CNG bus be rehabbed. Diesel buses and diesel artics can be , but can a CNG bus be rehabbed and how would they go about doing that. If they can, it probably take longer to do it than with a diesel bus.
There was a legal notice in the NY Post a few weeks ago seeking interested private contractors the opportunity to convert the 31 NYCT CNG Orions (581 to 610 + 317) to diesel.
My understanding is that the buses are to be re-engined but that they are to remain CNG buses. Did the legal notice specifically refer to conversion to diesel?
David
I highly doubt NYCT would put out a notice for any interested vender to simply re-engine a bus. It would have to be a great deal more involved than that. On the other hand, why would NYCT want to convert a CNG bus back to a diesel? Sounds like a step in the wrong direction to me.
BIG AL
"Bill from Maspeth" is correct in that major work is to be done on NYCT's 31 CNG Orion Vs -- that much I've been able to verify. My understanding is that it's simply a re-engining (re-engining???), although it's likely that other stuff (transmission?) is also to be done. "Bill"'s contention is that it's a conversion to diesel, which, like "Big Al," I find unlikely.
David
Arent those the ones with the Cummins L10G? Dont they run fairly OK?
Buses 581-610 are scheduled to be retrofitted with Series 50 gas engines, so they will remain CNG's. This work is to begin once the first 125 Orion 7 CNGs finally arrive (whenever that will be).
Mark
Thanks for the clarification.
When I read in the legal notice of the rehab, and when I read series 50, I automatically thought of diesel. I was unaware there was a series 50 CNG engine on the market.
1) Their website does not display route. Where can I find a route?
2) Will the fishbowls only operate during PM rush? If so, can I get a bus back to the city?
I don't know the answer but doesn't NYBS end within city limits? Can't you take the subway, other buses, or a combination thereof back?
I can never remember NYBS' route numbers because they've never really been into using the route numbers. Basically they are BxM6, BxM7, MxM7A, BxM7B, BxM9 and BxM10. The destination signs on N/B buses will read "MORRIS PARK AVENUE", "PARKCHESTER", "PELHAM BAY PARK", "CO-OP CITY", "CITY ISLAND" AND "THROGS NECK". Going S/B they all display "MANHATTAN EXPRESS". The GMDD fishbowls operate during AM and PM rush hours. If your riding a Bronx bound bus you can certainly get a bus returning to Manhattan and vice-versa except on the City Island route. You can also get back to Manhattan via subway or local bus and subway - all depending on where you get off the NYBS bus. The Pelham Bay branch north terminal is also the terminating point for the number 6 train. The Parkchester bus terminates a few blocks from the 177th Street-Parkchester station of the number 6 line. The other routes terminal points are not very close to subway stations, but there are local buses that will take you to subway stations. It's certainly more than worth the ride. I'll be taking my last rides on NYBS' GMDD fishbowls next week. If you happen to take a bus to City Island you can get back to Pelham Bay station on the Bx29 route.
Wayne
Is there a certain route where the GMDD runs?
I usually see them on each of the routes. I think your best bet is to decide which route you want to ride and then get on the bus at the beginning of the routes at Madison/23rd Street. If you do this you can see the buses while they're wait for their departure times. They'll probably be signed up for the route that they're operating on - and you could always ask the B/O or the dispatcher on duty.
Wayne
The route numbers are as follow:
BxM6 Parkchester
BxM7 Co-op City
BxM7A Pelham Bay via Bruckner Blvd
BxM7B City Island
BxM9 Throgs Neck
BxM10 Morris Park
NYBS's owner, Ed Arrigoni, doesn't like route numbers because they're too "low-class" for his customers. His roll signs omit numbers altogether, while the electronic destination signs flash the number and name SEPARATELY to minimize the number's presence.
When I said rote, I meant map. my bad
Well I do bus trips most of the time but I hardly ever post them. Here we go!
I started off by walking down Queens Blvd to Main St(About a 5 Min Walk) and me and my mom stopped off at the bank on the corner then went out just to see a bus about to turn so we walked up and manage to get it. It was 541 Q20A. Well this time after I put change in I asked for a Transfer and the Driver Hands it to me instead of printing 1 up and the Transfer was good and had the right time(11:07 AM I got on and it said 11:06 AM on it and there was a coin user before me so maybe he just hit the 1 or F1 Button and the person did not need it or hit it by mistake)The trip to Flushing Went Well did get more people on the Q20A but not relly packed(About 35 on it). Got off at Main St/39(AVE? Forgot).
Went shopping and after that at 12:13 PM a RTS on the Q25 N/B comes and it was relly packed but empty out with a few people left. So got on it. It went pretty well just alot of the seats where about 90 % Gone after the Linden Pl/Northern BL stop. The # of that bus was #323. Got off at I-678 North Service Road.
Went to Toy's R Us then went to the other side of I-678 to that shopping center to have lunch then went back to flushing and had Orion V CNG #415 on the QBX1,That went pretty well,Just a few standees since there was like about 9 people waiting to go into Flushing on the Q25 and I told people that bus was going to flushing. The Lights inside the bus where not on but where turn on when it turn on to Main st. So got off at the last stop(Main St right by that church) then went looking around once more then got on a Orion V #564 on the Q44 LTD and it was a bit PACKED but went a bit fast and took it to Queens Blvd/Main St and walked home
That shopping center you went to after Toys-R-Us....where did you eat there? McDonald's? Wendy's? Amore? Uncle Bill's?
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I wonder if theres any building and/or Terminal in the world that can compare to the usage, number of companies and buses that the PABT has. Also the same kind of design. Also anybody have an history on that building as well.
I've only been there once. It was dark and dirty. :-(
[I've only been there once. It was dark and dirty.]
I don't know how long ago you had been there, but after the most recent rehab mentioned in Andy's post, it has become a much more pleasant place to be than it used to be. However, keep in mind that it is still a huge public facility.
Go to the Port Authority of NY and NJ website,www.panynj.gov. There are some interesting stats and some historical photos of the terminal under construction in 1950. If you write to the Port Authority I'm sure there is some additional written info they could send you.
Although the original building opened in 1950, it was expanded twice, in 1962 and 1979, and was rehabbed extensively about ten years ago. It's worth seeing, and has plenty of small shops and restaurants for any ordinary items you might need.
Well, the fall semester at Maryland is over and I now have 6 weeks to relax. Anything noteworthy occur within WMATA, Ride-ON, or any of the other DC area transit agencies lately? I will be hitting the streets during these 6 weeks with my ol' Canon Powershot S30. I hope to catch quite a few Neoplan artics. Thanks for reading.
GO TERPS!!!
Duke is going down on Jan.18!!!
Have a good 6 weeks rest and ride plenty of busses! As I have posted before, my son Jeff Greene, is Asst. Director of the College
Park Scholars Program, so I also say GO TERPS!
Chuck Greene
Well for one you can read the stuff that has been discussed recently on the board. Secondly, help us out with the WMATA Roster Project. If you need more info, let me know. The Neoplans are not in service as far as we know. Go get some shots of the MANs is what I would do, get the Neoplans later! I have a Powershot S30 as well, it is a nice camera. Enjoy it!
The Neoplans have arrived and are currently stored at Landover, awaiting service, it might be a couple of weeks before any are in service. Some bus service changes are about to occur, most notebly, the 5A and B will lose midday and late night service. Oddly enough the 5B, going to Tyson's Corner will be free until Dec. 28. Nothing else of note is going on. One other thing, according to WMATAGMOAGH there is still one or two 8700s (unrehabbed) ones still running, the rest are stored at Landover, along with about four 9600 Orions.
That's it
Wes E. Samuels
I think its only the 5B losing midday and late night service. The 5A will continue to run and will make a stop at the Tysons-Westpark transit terminal during the times that the 5B doesn't run to continue having some sort of service there.
Oh, thanks, for the correction. I thought that both would lose midday service.
No problem! I think that 5A is a really popular route. Its nice to see it so successful.
Have a great holiday. I'm leaving the office in a couple of hours and we're heading up to NJ for the next couple of days. Should be fun coming home on Wednesday if the weather is bad!
Happy Holidays to you also. Be safe out there.
Tis the season to give and recieve. 126th Street is now recieving Articulated buses(as posted here with #5511 and #5517)-what will the other depots get? will UP be lucky to recieve some 8400's or maybe FP? Lets hope for a joyus Christmas gift.
b1-#9336-NOVABUS
[126th Street is now recieving Articulated buses(as posted here with #5511 and #5517)-what will the other depots get?]
They'll get whatever the Department of Buses decides to send them.
As I was making the AWOL list (still in progress), I noticed that Orion V 4245 is listed in being at both Four Mile AND Arlington, and I could not find the post that gave us that info, although it could have been an Instant Message. Can someone locate this bus for us?
AWOL List to be completed within a week listing all the buses we have not yet seen.
4245 should be Arlington. I believe they have 4244-4246. I've seen it running around here the past couple of days and it was laying over at Ballston earlier this AM.
On MTA buses, behind the operator's station is a small metal box very near the ceiling with six colored lights each labeled with a type of fare. One of the lights lights up with every fare paid, corresponding to the type of fare paid.
What's the purpose of this box?
Thanks,
Dan
That's unofficially dubbed the "Beakie Box". It allows undercover TA employees who are watching the performance of the bus operator to ensure that proper fare payment is collected.
However, in my opinion, it's a collosal waste of money because nine out of ten times I dump everything entering the farebox anyway, because with the advent of Metrocard, the system on buses is woefully suceptable to failure.
Hey All,
A few months ago, I recall a post looking for further availability of online transit sounds.
Just thought I'd drop the news that I've added a Transit Sounds Section to the Baltimore Transit Archives Site. From full samples of Flxible Metros to smaller tidbits, there should be some growing goodies on here for the soundbyte fans...
Click Here to Listen to the Sounds!
Wow! Great sounds, thank you! I'm playing one as I type this.
Chuck Greene
Nice sounds, I like that sound from Flxible 8738. Yeah, that whistle sound is from the Voith Transmission the bus has. Any Voith bus will decelerate with a similar sound....
Would like to hear the Series 50 engine sounds from Maryland MTA's Flxibles...:)
Stephen
None of them work for me. It says I'm missing a codec tag 11. Ugh!
I had to right click on the file and do a "Save Target As" to "My Documents" directory. When it finished , I could hit the open box and my Real Player played it. I did not not have to open it from "My Doct's", the box appeared after the file loaded as a saved file.
Chuck Greene
Hey Guys,
Does anyone have information on ex Lakeland bus #5354? I dont have any MCI knowledge and need to know the details of this bus. I am thinking of buying it for a movie and its already here in CA. Any help is appreciated. The bus is still painted in the lakeland scheme and thats also why its important for this movie.
All I know it is a 1987 Mci 9b, Ex NJT Model. Should have the NJT seating. Those are some nice looking buses, they have the bigger destination signs then our older 1983 Mci 9a's. You should check the engine wise. I know that most of the NJT ones, have new engines in them, but check it out.
Tony.
To add to what Tony said. They have DD 6V92 engine, no lav and I think they seat 49 (or possibly 53???).
Wayne
Yes Wayne you are soo right. No, these buses had no lavs, And yes they seat 49 passengers.
Tony
I recently saw a Coach USA bus in Coach USA scheme -- it was a 9B I am almost positive. You could see with the proper reflection the NJTransit Logo and lettering.
Has Coach USA purchased retired NJT units? I thought they only had the ones that they had from the contracted routes - which would be in the private paint schemes?
Actually no, they were not bought I believe they were transfered to Suburban Trails. They have quite a few if those buses. I believe they are 6500's I know 6525-6526 are 2 of them.
Tony
How do you guys record bus sounds? Is it simply taking a tape recorder onto the bus and sitting near the back of the bus?
Yeah, it is as simple as that. I will also try to locate a spot where the sound from the engine is loud. Usually it is near the floor or the gap between the last row of seats and the wall.
Stephen
Does anyone have any insight into the intentions of New York Bus Service regarding the threatened termination of express bus service? Are they really trying to convince the City and/or State to relieve NYBS of its pension obligations? Or is their actual intention just to get out of this business? I wonder about this, because if NYBS truly wanted pension relief, then why set a deadline that they had to know would be overshadowed by a threatened TWU strike and/or the holidays?
Jim D.
NYBS is getting out of the commuter business and staying with school buses.
The pension issue is a fiction. Pension costs are normal business expenses (which a legitimate contractor would incorporate into the contract price prior to bidding) which NYCDOT already reimburses.
It has to be more than the school bus issue, since doing so could potentially put their home base at Conner St in danger of attack from angry Co-Op city residents who would be relegated to the slow bus trips to either the #5 or #6 subways.
From what I hear, it was the Bloomberg administration's refusal to cough up more money of DOT subsidies to NYBS, along with his want to have the city or MTA directly take over the routes. Which in turn would lead to a host of other problems not the least of which has to do with seniority and funding. Besides, apparently some of the sentiment among the b/o's at NYBS is that they would mind being absorbed into the ranks of the MTA and their larger TWU bretheren, but that the brass at the company is not going to take the financial hit sitting down.
If such were to be the case (and with the looming MTA reorganization and the festivities in April), then the school busing business would really begin to look good for NYBS. That is, unless Bloomberg decides to retaliate by denying busing rights for NYBS to Board of Education school (which he does now have control over, BTW).
From what I've heard I think that's about right, i.e. Aragoni at NYBS sees a big financial hit on the horizon AND preceives Mayor Mike ain't going to do anything about it. So, NYBS ain'y bluffing, if the City just treads water he's they're walking away for Express service :-(
In addtion DOI has been investigating for years how certain private operators have been padding thier operating expenses.
The private operators have had a sweet heart deal with the city for years. If they did not properly fund thier pensions it is thier own fault and the city should be under no obligation to bail them out. The operators have taken plenty of profit out of the buisness and put it in thier own pocket
Could be for several reasons:
1. Under the NYCDOT understanding, and the Union Contract, NYBS must give 60 days notice if the Company decides to cease the express operation.
2. With the express off the property, NYBS does not have to be concernecd with any kind of job action or strike that would affect the school buses too. The TWU express bus operators have been working without a collective bargaining agreement at NYBS since 11/30/2000.
3. Maybe, just maybe, NYBS is looking at more school bus work as there will be more room available.
4. The more senior bus operators will no doubt stay on the school bus work. These operators are more loyal to NYBS and will preserve the NYBS tradtion of good, clean, courteous service.
Doesn't do much for morale.
As a Staten Islander, will we see another type of bus other than the orions(which is about 90% of the S.I fleet)and the RTS(which I rarely see)? I would prefer CNGs. I would like to see Articulateds, but there are some routes that would make it unnecessary, such as the S55/56 which is usually crowded during school hours. But CNGs will be an eye-opener especially if its a low- floor. But anyways, does any one have any comments???
there are no changes planned for the si fleet. there are no cng facilities and no need for articulated buses. the rts buses may eventually be replaced by orions from other depots when and if the orion 7 order arrives. there are about 34 rts buses at yukon.
Artics can't run in SI since just about all the roads are way to narrow and alot of the turns are already hard to make using an Orion,so don't expect to ever see an Artic in SI.Although I think the only route which can run artics to me is the S79 since it runs along Hyland Blvd and that has lots of space for artics.
artics ran on the s61 in 1992 and before that on express routes. they are not needed on local routes as ridership levels dont warrant them.
What are you talking about? Artic's never exsisted in 1992.The first artics start running in the Bronx back in 97 or so.
The first artics to run in the Bronx were for Bee-Line around 1980 or so.
Peace,
ANDEE
yeah but I'm not talking about Bee-Line,I'm talking about the TA and that was around 96 or 97,excluding any that ran as a test in earlier years.
Then LEARN to qualify your statements, instead of just shooting your mouth off AND don't backtrack.
Peace,
ANDEE
What about the M*A*N demo in New York City in 1986? A artic FLEET did not exist in NYC until 1997 but I think 1000 and 1001 are 1996 artics then 1002-1109 is from 1997 or 1998.
i should know what im talking about working in yukon from 1987 until 2001. sorry to bore some with an old story but here goes. artics appeared on the island in the mid 80s. they were tested on manhattan express routes. man, volvo and another company lent nyct buses in the hopes they would buy same. in 1992 neoplan did the same with bus 81992. it ran on narrow streets on the s61. the reason for not buying it has been discussed over and over. in 1996 bus 1000 appeared in nyc. i dont know where new flyer artics were tested here or even if they were. the rest is history. perhaps we can close the book on this now ancient history.
No, its ok we now have proof. Was it successful on the test on the S61 or did it fail? As for the New Flyer, I believe it was tested in the Bronx and/or Manhattan in 1996.
it was very sucessful.
Then you should make that clear in your posts, which you don't. You always prefer to shoot your mouth off and ask questions later.
Also your staement:
>>>Artic's never exsisted in 1992<<<
Is totally off base since articulated busses have exsited since the early 50s. Altough, admittedly, they never sold too well.
Peace,
ANDEE
What are you talking about? Artic's never exsisted in 1992.The first artics started running in the Bronx back in 97 or so.
a little off topic, but yukon has gotten about another 7-10 rts from queens village. there were some 3900's, and some 4300's. i didnt get the exact numbers, but will soon.
also, 8302 was in an accident, the whole drivers side was smashed up. does anyone know what happened?
Won't happen b/c the roads are too narrow plus SI service doesn't warrant artics other than the rush hours and the S79 so artics would be a waste.
On Friday 12/20 I took a Long Local Bus trip From my home in Avondale To Mesa Arizona.
Starting from home at 1220 and Bicycling East to Desert Sky Mall Transit Center arriving at 1300.
Paid Fare $1.25 (Dollar Bill & Quater) Recieved Transfer Good To 1600.
Departing Desert Sky Mall at 1329 On Eastbound Valley Metro #41 Indian School #6360 NABI (40ft LF)(Phoenix Transit ATC/Vancom)
Standing Room Only To 59th Avenue, Double Isle Standing Full Till Loloma Station, Scottsdale
Arriving At Loloma Station, Scottsdale 15 Minutes Late At 1505.
Departing Loloma Station At 1516 On Southbound Scottsdale Connection #76 Miller Road #4123 NABI (40ft LF)(Forsythe Scottsdale)
Light Load
Arriving At College & 6th Street, Tempe 2 Minutes Early At 1540.
#30 Operator Allowing For Transfer Due To Bus Being Late.
Departing College & University 10 Minutes Late At 1602 On Eastbound Valley Metro #30 University #6280 NABI (40ft LF) (Forsythe Mesa)
Double Isle Standing To Mesa Senior Center (Downtown Mesa Transit Center), Light Load To End
Arriving At University Drive & Recker Road 10 Minutes Late At 1730.
Then Bicycling North On Recker Road Arriving At Recker & Brown Road At 1742.
Total Distance Traveled: 46.80 ML 75.31 Km
Total Time Including Connections: 5 Hours 26 Minutes
Total # Of City's: 5 (Avondale, Phoenix, Scottsdale, Tempe & Mesa)
Total Fare Including Bicycle: $1.25
1 Fare Paid
1 Transfer Used
Buses Spotted
#4138 El Durado 30 Passenger LF
Tempe BOLT/TIM Route #131 WB Start (Tempe Forsythe)
#6008 NABI 40ft LF
Valley Metro Green Line (To Hayden) (Phoenix Transit ATC/Vancom)
#6236 NABI 40ft LF
Valley Metro Green Line (To Hayden) (Phoenix Transit ATC/Vancom)
#6283 NABI 40ft LF
Valley Metro Green Line (To 56th Street Via Encanto)(Phoenix Transit ATC/Vancom)
#6070 NABI Valley Metro #41 WB (Phoenix Transit ATC/Vancom)
#6355 NABI Valley Metro #41 WB VIA Campbell (Phoenix Transit ATC/Vancom)
#6376 NABI Valley Metro #41 WB (Phoenix Transit ATC/Vancom)
#6362 NABI Valley Metro #41 WB (Phoenix Transit ATC/Vancom)
#6333 NABI Valley Metro Red Line WB (Phoenix Transit ATC/Vancom)
#6060 NABI Valley Metro #41 WB Via Campbell (Phoenix Transit ATC/Vancom)
#6334 NABI Valley Metro #41 EB Via Campbell (Phoenix Transit ATC/Vancom)
#6216 NABI Valley Metro #41 WB (Phoenix Transit ATC/Vancom)
#6307 NABI Valley Metro #41 WB Via Cambell (Phoenix Transit ATC/Vancom)
#4014 New Flyer LF40 Valley Metro #72 SB (ATC Phoenix)
#4018 New Flyer LF40 Valley Metro #72 NB (ATC Phoenix)
#4152 NABI Scottsdale Connection #76 NB (Forsythe Scottsdale)
Scottsdale Roundup Trolly
#4128 NABI Scottsdale Connection #76 NB (Forsythe Scottsdale)
#6241 & #6349 NABI Valley Metro Yellow Line WB (Phoenix Transit ATC/Vancom)
#4101 & 4134 El Durado 30 Passenger LF Tempe BOLT/TIM
Route #30 WB (Tempe Forsythe)
#6239 NABI Valley Metro #44 NB (Phoenix Transit ATC/Vancom)
#4110 El Durado 30 Passenger LF Tempe BOLT/TIM
Route #62 SB (Tempe Forsythe)
#6195 NABI Valley Metro #62 SB (Tempe Forsythe)
#4125 & 4136 El Durado 30 Passenger LF Tempe BOLT/TIM
Route #66 NB (Tempe Forsythe)
#4015 & 4025 Flyer Valley Metro #72 SB (ATC Phoenix)
#4026 Flyer Valley Metro #72 NB (ATC Phoenix)
#6260 NABI Valley Metro #81 NB (ATC Phoenix)
#4142 El Durado 30 Passenger LF Tempe BOLT/TIM #81 SB (Tempe Forsythe)
#104 & 2029 Tempe Neighborhood Flash WB
#105 & 2025 Tempe Neighborhood Flash EB
#6274 NABI Valley Metro #30 WB (Forsythe Mesa)
#2025 Tempe Neighborhood Flash WB
#2427 Greyhound MCI-6
#4012 Flyer Valley Metro #112 SB (ATC Phoenix)
#6285 NABI Valley Metro #104 SB (Forsythe Mesa)
#2910 El Dorado National(Mesa Blimp) #120 SB (Forsythe Mesa)
#6279 NABI Valley Metro #30 WB (Forsythe Mesa)
#6275 NABI Valley Metro #30 WB (Forsythe Mesa)
As a visitor to the Phoenix area once or twice a year, I was interested in your trip and bus spottings. I noted a few NABI low-floor buses in the 4100 series. I had thought all 4100's were 30 foot El Dorado low floor buses, and that all NABI's were in the 6000 series.
Also, was bus #6280 on the No. 30 a CNG bus (rather than an LNG bus)? I had seen a few CNG buses on the 30 last time I was in town. Whether or not #6280 is CNG, do you know which buses are CNG? I recollect they are in the higher 6200's.
Is the 45-foot NABI Compobus in service yet?
Oops! Replace The 4 with a 6. for the NABI
Mesa has fuel for LNG, CNG and Disel #2 at both of their yards. Tempe & Scottsdale only has CNG. Phoenix has Disel #2 and CNG. ATC Has CNG & LNG.
There are no NABIs in the 4100 series. Those are all Eldorado National 30-foot EZ-Rider buses.
Buses 6262-6281 are 2001 NABI 40LFW CNG buses that are owned by the City of Mesa and operated by ATC-Mesa. They are the only NABIs that are CNG. You can find them on lines 30, 96, 104, 120, 128, and 136. The NABIs that were ordered after these are the 2001-2002 NABI 40LFW LNGs for the City of Phoenix and operated by ATC-Phoenix, and the small rarely seen order of 2002 NABI 40LFW LNGs for the City of Tempe and operated by ATC-Tempe. You can catch these on the Red Line (I don't know any other lines where they run).
The NABI 45C-LFW Compobus will run for the City of Phoenix with 56 buses sometime in 2003. They will be suburbans. Also, the City of Tempe is taking delivery of 6 NABI 45C-LFW Compobuses. I don't know much about these bus order.
Wish I had one of the Remaining MAN Artics (70xx) For my #41 Trip Last Week
If you want to catch a MAN on a local route, go to the Sunnyslope Transit Center (Central and Dunlap Avenue in Phoenix) on any weekday afternoon. I know that MANs show up on the 12 (the 2:15 Monday-Friday northbound out of Central Station and the 3:15 Monday-Friday southbound out of Sunnyslope TC are run with a MAN bus) 15, some Greens, some Reds, and I just found out yesterday that they run the 8 line as well. This will probably end in January 2003 though with the schedule change, sadly.
Bolt buses on the 131??? That runs in Avondale and goes NOWHERE near Tempe! But, since that's an ATC RPTA (Forsythe in the past) they run whatever they have from their bag regardless of city (I have seen a Tempe bus running a completely Scottsdale route, the 114, and I have seen a Phoenix bus running on the 72 even though only a tiny bit of that line north of Cactus southbound only runs through Phoenix.
Also, you mentioned bus #6195 on the southbound 62. I saw that bus Tuesday 12/17 at Central and Highland in Phoenix working the Red Line at about 11:30 AM with about 3 police vehicles surrounding it. I did not see it, but I learned from bystanders that there was some kind of fight on it and police attention had to be brought. Anyway, what was it doing in the center of Phoenix far from Tempe? Was that a Tempe Red Line trip?
BTW, did you see any remaining Bolt lettered buses? I see Tempe buses painted for Valley Metro with the little TIM sticker by the front door and the last time I saw a Bolt bus was April 2002 down at Baseline in Tempe. These buses also now say "Operated by ATC-TEMPE" below the back window on the left and right side of the buses. Also, at the front door, there are some faded letters saying "Owner: City of Tempe", and "Operator: Forsythe and Associates", and some say "Manager: Regional Public Transportation Authority" I guess that Forsythe is now ATC-Tempe and ATC-RPTA to get rid of confusion (They are owned by National Express anyway). Are the Flash buses still painted for Flash (the NABI 40LFWs) or are they in Valley Metro colors?
The Flash Buses Still Use The Flash Logo But During School Holidays and summer you may see #41xx Series Buses With Bolt Or Valley Metro Logos.
I ride #131 about once a month, They originate from Forsythe Tempe and store a spare bus at Desert Sky. Usally there is one #41xx and one #6xxx series bus operating on this line. (Need hourly service, whenever (90-130 min service) is useless.
Tempe And Scottsdale Forsythe Operations Had Merged and they share buses from the 1st Street Yard Tempe and The Scottsdale Yards (78st & Pierce and 91st & Via Linda)
Tempe & Scottsdale Are elimating their Logos (Scottsdale Connection And Bolt/TIM) from their buses and replacing them with Valley Metro Logos. Laidlaw Transit still uses the Phoenix Transit (Purple and Orange Pinstripes) on their 9xx series buses (30 Ft Gilligs).
The Gilligs are often seen on #59, #138 & #186 mixed with 37xx and 40xx Flyers and 35xx, 44xx and 45xx RTS
I see a Gillig almost every weekday on the 60-Bethany Home route. They are #961-967 (an odd number for Valley Metro), and I think that there is a #968 (or #960) somewhere in Phoenix running for ATC RPTA. I also saw them on the 122-Cactus route and RARELY on the 106-Peoria/Shea (mostly New Flyers and occasional TMC RTS 35-footers).
Now that artic are coming to 126 and and opening of 100 street depot. Now what new with the five Brooklyn depots? Brooklyn needs new buses too.
This much is certain: Brooklyn's (and other borough's) depots will get what the Department of Buses assigns to them.
Beyond that is anybody's guess.
Looks like Brooklyn will be stuck with more RTS's in the future.
Today was my turn to be trained on the articulated bus. New Flyer artic # 5511 was used as the training bus. It was my first time ever driving an artic and after over 12 years of driving 40 footers, (mostly RTS's UGH! :^( ) I found it to be a very pleasant experience. At first seeing all that bus behind me was a little disconcerting but after a few minutes and a few tight right handed turns I felt very comfortable driving it. It's amazing how well the bus turns and manuevers. The pivot point is the second axle just forward of the articulated joint. As long as you properly manuever the first (35 foot long) section, the second (25 foot long) section follows right behind it. Overall visibilty is excellent and the mirrors are the best I've ever used. After years of being squeezed into that chamber of horrors known as the RTS driver's compartment the artic's compartment was a godsend. There's loads of leg room and every switch and gauge is logically laid out and within easy reach. The retarder works amazingly well and begins to slow down the bus as soon as the accelerator is released. There are two features that I found particularly interesting; The first is the external spotlight located on the right hand side of the second section just behind the articulated joint. This spotlight illuminates as soon as the right turn signal is activated and lights up the road adjacent to the bus and shows you if anyone or anything is along side the bus. The second is the fact that you can check the operation of the headlights, turn signals, marker lights, reverse lights, back-up warning sound and destination sign lights by pressing both turn signal buttons simultaneously after the engine has been started.
My only two gripes with the bus were the chiming turn signals which were kind of irritating and the fact that the bus rattled like crazy. I found the rattling to be quite a surprise considering that the bus only had 1,840 miles on it when I drove it. The builders plate stated that the bus was built in Crookston, Minnesota in October 2002.
I look forward to driving # 5511 and it's siblings in passenger service on the M15.
Sounds like you had a great time, anything is better than that damn RTS. You get out of there in pain.
Tony
I agree. The RTS driver's compartment should be known as the "HOUSE OF PAIN".
How do those new artics pick up and do they sound different than the others?
Acceleration ws pretty good for a vehicle this size. It's not exactly a hot rod from a dead stop but does get up to speed pretty quickly. As far as sound goes, I didn't notice any difference from previous models.It was a little strange having to strain to hear the engine since it sits so far back from the driver.
I used to hate the Neoplan Artics that we have, but now that their engines are starting to deteriorate, they're beginning to have the old RTS groaning/growling sound. 4536 is the most noteable of these. 4555 once was so lous I feared for my life as the breaks were also rubbing together. Sadly, they fixed the bus. Some of artics are still as slow as molasses though and no imitation could beat a real RTS anyway.
Did you notice if there were any flapping light/ advertisement panels on 5511 making any rattling noise? This has become a serious nuisance on the other artics.
It didn't appear as if any of the light/advertising panels were loose. The entire front end of the bus just seemed to rattle excessively when any kind of bump or pothole was struck. I found that odd on a bus this new.
On our artics, there's a circle platfrom in the articulated joint where the middle seating is placed. If it's loose it wil make a lot of noise. That could be contributing to the rattling.
It's more than the articulated joint. It's the way the bus was built and the material (aluminum) that it was built with. Plus the suspension. I ranted about this once in a post some time back, saying that anytime a D60 hits a bump it'll rattle as if its about to come apart. This is especially evident for the farebox; that's why sometimes I see B/Os holding it while the bus is in motion.
The suspension on the artics is pure shit. You'll get used to it, and thanks for responding to my post! One word of optimism: The suspension in the front of the bus is VERY smooth when compared to the suspension for the third axle. You will begin to have problems with passenger distribution because when people realize that standing in the front is alot better than being tossed around in the back, they will begin to congregate near the three single seats in the front half of the bus.
Just speaking from 3 years of artic riding expeirence!
Happy Holidays!
the L.A. Flyers rattled from day 1. it seems to come from that vertical panel just behind the operator's seat.
My only two gripes with the bus were the chiming turn signals which were kind of irritating and the fact that the bus rattled like crazy. I found the rattling to be quite a surprise considering that the bus only had 1,840 miles on it when I drove it. The builders plate stated that the bus was built in Crookston, Minnesota in October 2002.
I can't speak for the rest of New Flyer's models but it always seemed to me that the articulateds rattled excessively.
Now at least there will be a variety in 126 St and you seem VERY happy so good luck in the future.
Thank you. We've had nothing but RTS's since the Spring of 1995 when the last of the Blitz rebuilt New Looks were retired from service. It'll be nice to finally drive something different. Unfortunately we only have 3 articulateds at the moment so it's hard to get one on a daily basis.
Its just the beginning, soon there will be a adequate fleet of artics, just let time go by. If you thought that was bad, look at the Brooklyn depots besides JG, we had nothing but RTS's since 1993 and it is bland but hey the RTS is a very strong bus and they are nowhere near falling apart so I don't mind.
# 5517 arrived over the weekend and # 5520 arrived today.
Does anybody know what purpose the #742 bus line serves?
I checked the schedule online and it really stumped me ... this bus literally runs once a week, with one trip in each direction on Saturdays only
It runs between downtown Paterson and the Greystone Park hospital in Morristown.
With such a level of service, why bother even running it at all?
Who actually uses it?
I heard there was a similar type of service in Bergen County--the 754--which ran between Paramus and Moonachie, again only on Saturdays.
It has since been discontinued, due to (surprise, surprise) Low Ridership.
Thanks.
What about the Morris County Metro rural routes (MCM5,7,8)? Last I heard, they each ran once or twice a week. Judging from the schedules, they seemed to constitute midday work for a driver on the MCM4.
True, I forgot about those.
I rode the 1 a couple times and the 3 once.
The first time was when I was going to summer school at Newark Academy in Livingston back in 1999.
One day I decided to take the long way home, so I took the 3 from Livingston Mall to Morristown, the 1 to Willowbrook Mall, and the 11 back down to Bloomfield.
At that time, the MCM routes were still using the old ex-TA Grumman-Flxible buses.
The second time I rode the 1 was several months ago, this time on a 30' Nova.
On those three MCM bus trips, the ridership wasn't much to write home about, but the demand is there.
Then there's those once- or couple-times per week routes. Very strange.
At least now I know about the 742 and 754. Thanks for the info.
>>>Who actually uses it? <<<
More than likely, people visiting friends in the hospital.
Peace,
ANDEE
The 742 (originally PS/TNJ 82, then NJT P82) has always had that schedule. It is intended as a visiting hours run for friends and relatives. Greystone is a state hospital for those with mental illness, so under normal circumtastances, it is kept secure.
The 754 (originally TNJ/NJT B4) started as a 6-day route. It ran midday weekdays and all day Saturday from Moonachie to the Paramus malls. Ridership was a problem simply because there weren't many people home during the middays to use it, and it took a roundabout way (via Hackensack). For someone in Moonachie, it was easier to just get on 17 and head north. Keep in mind, it was duplicated between Moonachie and Hackensack by the B72/772 which originally ran only during rush hours - the same route duplicates the Hackensack-Dumont portion of the B3/753. The 754 was cut to just Saturdays since that was its prime ridership day until that dwindled as well. It has essentially been replaced by an expanded 772 which now also serves the Secaucus outlets on the other end.
Want to see another really limited route? Check the NJT 43 Newark-Jersey City. It is a shift change route and has just three round trips a day, approximately 8 hours apart.
>>>The 742 (originally PS/TNJ 82, then NJT P82) has always had that schedule. It is intended as a visiting hours run for friends and relatives.<<<
Like I said.
Peace,
ANDEE
It might be just a route for workers for some factory or post office for example.
NJT runs a similar operation between Jersey City and Newark - the 43. From what I understand this route is just for the sole purpose of transporting workers to/from the Post Office in Kearney (I think). It only runs a trip whenever the shift changes.
Hello everyone, just thought I'd check in as my g/f and I are now in Hackettstown, NJ. Middle of Nowhereville, USA! I did happen to see some NJT bus stops along the way. The last time I was up here I saw little NJT buses. I guess those are just neighborhood shuttles. None of the fun NJT buses that reside in other parts of the state.
I'm not looking forward to the drive home tomorrow with all the snow they are calling for. We're in the NW part of the state and I came up through Harrisburg to I-81 to I-78 through Allentown, PA and Easton, then to US22 to get to where we are. I think going home to DC we'll have to trek over to the NJ Tpke and go home that way as I see its supposed to be mainly rain in the southern part of the state and snow through PA and this part of NJ. Fun fun!!
Everyone be safe out there and have a healthy, happy holiday!
I'll be peeking on here when I can. Right now, my g/f's sister took two of her kids to the mall for haircuts and shopping and we're stuck looking after their one year old. Luckily, she's asleep now. : ) Haha, this is good practice for when we have our own. : )
For immediate release:
December 24, 2002
What's new for Metro in 2003
As 2002 concludes, the Washington Metropolitan Area Transit Authority (Metro) is looking ahead to 2003 with new services, new challenges, and a continuing dedication to provide the best level of transportation services found anywhere in the United States.
"As we reach the end of the year, Metro is looking ahead to 2003 with a continued commitment to being an integral part of the national capital region by providing safe, reliable, and convenient transit service despite the significant financial challenge that we are now facing," stated Christopher Zimmerman, Chairman of Metro's Board of Directors.
Here is some of what Metro has planned in 2003:
Metrobus
• In 2003, during the month February, Metro will celebrate the 30th anniversary of Metrobus service to the greater Washington metropolitan area.
• Beginning this spring, and continuing through the summer, Metro will install a new SmarTrip bus farebox system on all Metrobuses. The $20 million contract for the new fareboxes will provide the foundation for a seamless, regional, "smart" fare system with the replacement of the old fareboxes. Similar equipment will be installed on all the local bus systems and the commuter rail systems serving the metropolitan area and the state of Maryland. The new fareboxes will have the ability to accept SmarTrip cards, which are currently available to customers utilizing the Metrorail system. SmarTrip cards are permanent, rechargeable farecards which are plastic -- just like regular credit cards -- and embedded with a computer chip that keeps track of the value of the card. In addition to accepting Metro's SmarTrip cards, the new fareboxes will also continue to accept cash fares.
• In 2002, Metro placed 164 Compressed Natural Gas (CNG) buses in service. In 2003, Metro will continue its efforts to help reduce the emissions in the capital region. Metrobus will begin and complete the installation of the majority of over 600 exhaust after treatment filters on its diesel fleet. These filters will nearly eliminate the particulate matter (PM) emissions. In addition, Metro will repower 100 buses with new engines that meet the latest EPA regulations. These engines will not only nearly eliminate PM, but will reduce nitrogen oxide (NOx) by 40-45% from previous EPA requirements.
• In spring 2003, rehabilitation work at the Southeastern Bus Garage will be completed.
• In spring 2003, Metro will award a contract for a second CNG facility at Four Mile Run Bus Garage in Virginia.
Metrorail
• Metro is continuing to take delivery of its new series 5000 railcars. The cars, which came on line in August 2001, are currently operating on the Green, Orange and Blue lines. Metro has accepted 96 railcars, and expects to have the entire fleet of 192 new railcars in service by summer 2003. This deployment will enable Metro to run all six car trains during peak periods.
• This year, Metro will reintroduce into service its first rehabilitated series 2000/3000 BREDA rail cars. The cars will look very similar to the series 5000 cars. In 2001, Metro awarded a contract to Alstom Transportation Inc., to rehabilitate 364 rail cars. With many of these rail cars in service for nearly 20 years, Metro initiated rehabilitation to modernize these cars.
• Construction for the Red Line New York Avenue Metrorail station, and for the Blue Line extension to Largo, continues. Both projects are expected to be completed by the end of 2004.
• In early 2003, Metro will open its new $132 million Branch Avenue rail yard, located in Prince George's County, Maryland. This new yard will have storage tracks designed for 178 railcars along with a new railcar wash maintenance facility.
• This spring, Metro will open a new expanded entrance at the Mount Vernon Square/Convention Center Station to serve patrons at the new convention center. This new expanded entrance will have new faregates, four new street level escalators, and two new street level elevators.
• This spring, a new parking structure will open at the Shady Grove Metrorail station on the Red Line. The new structure will provide space for 2,140 cars, increasing total spaces available at Shady Grove by 1,530.
• This summer, a new additional 1,000-parking space structure will open at the Franconia-Springfield Metrorail station on the Blue Line, expanding the number of spaces at the terminal station to approximately 5,000.
• This summer, Metro will have completed work on installing a canopy covering the balance of the platform at the Ronald Reagan Washington National Airport Metrorail station.
• In fall 2003, Metro will award a contract to begin access improvements to the Ballston-MU Metrorail station to handle the increasing number of customers in the growing Ballston neighborhood.
• This spring, Metro will award a contract to construct a new mezzanine and canopy enhancements at the King Street Metrorail station.
• In early 2003, Metro will award a contract for a new parking structure at West Falls Church.
• In spring 2003, Metro will award a contract to construct an expanded New Carrollton rail yard facility, and parking structures at the College Park and New Carrollton Metrorail stations.
• In early 2003, Metro will complete Huntington Metrorail station parking garage renovations.
• In early 2003, Metro will start renovations at the Anacostia Metrorail station parking garage.
Escalators/elevators
• This spring, Metro will start construction of canopies at four Metrorail stations (Brookland-CUA, L'Enfant Plaza, Medical Center and Virginia Square) as part of the Comprehensive Escalator Canopy Pilot Program.
• Metro plans to modernize 11 elevators with units scheduled for completion in 2003 at Huntington, Friendship Heights, Arlington Cemetery, Fort Totten, Metro Center, and Mount Vernon. As part of a six-year program to overhaul 32 elevators, Metro will have completed 30 elevator units by the end of 2003. Escalator modernizations and controller upgrades will occur on 44 units throughout the system, including McPherson Square, Clarendon, Crystal City, Metro Center, Farragut West, Ronald Reagan Washington National Airport, Pentagon City, Medical Center, and Rosslyn.
• By the end of 2003, Metro will have completed rehabilitation on 112 escalator units as part of a six-year program to overhaul 170 escalators. 2003 will also see the completion of the systemwide comb plate repairs on 14 remaining units under Metro's multi-year program for this essential work.
• In early 2003, the Vertical Transportation Panel will issue a report on Metro's elevator and escalator program, reviewing Metro's existing policies and procedures for repairing its aging escalator and elevator fleet, and provide recommendations on what can be done to improve this service. The report will also include information and recommendations from Metro's escalator and elevator mechanics.
Safety and security improvements
As part of its ongoing effort to improve safety and security, Metro will implement the following safety and security measures in 2003:
• Increase and enhance police and safety capabilities, by adding 10 police officers to increase coverage and visibility at core transfer stations.
• Install programable intrusion equipment to alert police of the exact location of any unauthorized intrusion into the Metro system. Installation is expected to be completed by fall 2003.
• Metro will continue to install intrusion detection alarms at its rail maintenance facilities. Complete installation is expected by the summer 2003.
• Metro will continue installation of its chemical sensor program to additional stations. Installation is expected to completed by summer 2003.
• 100 Metrobuses have been equipped with video cameras to record incidents on buses and to deter crime. The buses will primarily operate on routes that have higher rates of incidents occurring.
• Provide personal protective equipment and training for 5,000 front line Metro employees in the various operating departments. All front line employees are expected to have this equipment and be fully trained by spring 2003.
• With the installation of a new radio communications system, Metro will add an Automated Vehicle Location (AVL) system to all Metrobuses and its support fleet to pinpoint their exact location at all times. The installation should be completed before the end of 2003.
Technology enhancements
• In 2003, Metro will continue work to complete above and below ground infrastructure enhancements for its fully integrated 490MHz Comprehensive Radio Communications System designed to provide Metro with a complete
radio communications system for the Metro Transit Police, bus, rail, and maintenance departments. By summer 2003, Metro expects complete installation of the Metro Transit Police Department radios and mobile data terminals, and the Metrobus radio system installation is expected to be completed by the end of calendar year 2003.
Project development
• In 2003, environmental assessments and preliminary engineering work will continue on providing rail service to the Dulles Corridor. Metro is preparing this technical work under the direction of the Commonwealth of Virginia.
• In 2003, Metro will continue the development of a draft environmental impact statement on the proposed Purple Line, under the direction of the State of Maryland.
• In 2003, Metro is preparing technical work under the direction of the District of Columbia on proposed transit services within the city.
Operating budget/funding issues
In 2003, Metro's executive staff will be working closely with its Board of Directors to close a $48 million shortfall within the projected fiscal year 2004 annual budget, a $275 million shortfall in its six-year Infrastructure Renewal Program (IRP) beginning in fiscal year 2006, and looking to secure $625 million needed to purchase an additional 120 new rail cars and the necessary support systems to allow us to begin the operation of 8 car trains.
At this time, Metro's executive staff has proposed $24 million in cost reductions, and is developing a plan that will help raise $24 million in revenues to close the budget deficit. To understand the current situation, it is necessary to review Metro's financial situation.
Since 1995, Metro has enjoyed strong ridership growth, with revenue growing faster than the operating subsidies provided by the jurisdictional partners. During the period of fiscal year 1999 to 2002, Metro's total ridership grew by 17.5 percent. This created annual operating budget surpluses totaling $79 million, which were rebated to the jurisdictions. Now that the originally planned 103-mile system is complete, Metro can no longer count on 6 or 7 percent ridership growth.
Besides reduced ridership, the September 11, 2001, terrorist attacks added to operating costs by increasing insurance costs and by raising new security and preparedness priorities. Health care benefits and paratransit services have also become major cost drivers. While local government budgets are stretched to the limit, they have agreed to increase their subsidy levels for FY 2004, as this is a strong vote of confidence.
Background
The Washington Metropolitan Area Transit Authority (WMATA) was created by an interstate compact in 1967 to plan, develop, build, finance, and operate a balanced regional transportation system in the national capital area. The Authority began building its rail system in 1969, acquired four regional bus systems in 1973, and began operating the first phase of Metrorail in 1976.
Today, Metrorail serves 83 stations and has 103 miles of track. A fleet of 862 rail cars provides service from 5:30 a.m. to midnight Monday through Thursday, 5:30 a.m. to 2 a.m. on Friday, 8 a.m. to 2 a.m. on Saturday, and 8 a.m. to midnight on Sunday.
Metrobus serves the nation's capital 24-hours-a-day, seven-days-a-week with 1,455 buses. Metrorail and Metrobus serve a population of 3.4 million within a 1,500 square mile jurisdiction.
A sampling of Metro accomplishments in 2002
• Metrobus riders had the opportunity to catch a cleaner mode of travel as Metro introduced its first new environmentally friendly - compressed natural gas (CNG) low-floor buses. A total of 164 CNG buses were delivered during the year, and the Bladensburg bus garage was upgraded to support CNG operations.
• Metro issued contracts for the continuation of construction of the Blue Line extension to the Largo Town Center and for the new Red Line station at New York Avenue. Both projects are expected to be completed in late 2004.
• Metro unveiled its new emergency training tunnel facility located at its Pennsy Drive site in Landover, Md. The new safety training tunnel provides a realistic environment for fire, police and emergency response departments from local jurisdictions to use for mock fire and rescue exercises, terrorism and disaster drills, and other simulations involving Metrorail trains and tunnels.
• Metro's Board of Directors selected Alstom Transportation, Inc., as the company to build 62 new rail cars known as the series 6000, with an option to buy an additional 120 cars.
• Metrobus officials began testing new high-tech fareboxes that accept SmarTrip cards on buses departing from its Arlington bus garage marking the first step toward extending the use of smart card technology on the entire Metrobus fleet and other transit services throughout the region.
• With safety and security a top priority, Metro installed new bomb containment trash receptacles near the fare vending machines and faregate areas of all Metrorail stations and returned retrofitted newspaper recycling receptacles to all of its 83 Metrorail stations.
• Metro's Transit Police Department introduced eight new explosive detection canine dogs to patrol rail cars, stations, and Metrobus garages throughout the region.
• Metro's Board of Directors adopted a 10-year, $12.2 billion Capital Improvement Plan designed to preserve the rail and bus system and adopted a new Strategic Plan.
• Metro's Board of Directors selected a locally preferred alternative (LPA) under the Dulles Corridor Rapid Transit draft environmental impact statement process, choosing to expand Metrorail through Tysons Corner, into Dulles Airport and eastern Loudoun County, VA.
• Metro released a Regional Bus Study report exploring the efficiency and effectiveness of the region's bus service and documented approaches to double ridership by 2025.
• Despite the downturn in the economy, ridership continued to grow in the Metro system. For the calendar year, total Metro ridership grew by 2.7%, with a 3.6% growth on Metrorail and a 1.6% percent growth on Metrobus. In addition, Metro's paratransit service -- known as MetroAccess -- grew by 39% for weekdays and a dramatic 140% on weekends.
• Metro continued to introduce its new series 5000 rail cars on the Green, Orange, and Blue lines, accepting 96 of its 192 rail cars.
• Bike racks became new fixtures on Metrobuses as Metro officials purchased and installed a bike rack on the front of each of the transit agency's more than 1,400 buses.
• Metro declared its car sharing program a success after a year as the transit agency expanded the scope of service offered to Metro's riders and enhanced their options for travel in the region.
• Metro broke ground on new parking structures at Franconia-Springfield and Grosvenor-Strathmore and completed an environmental report for a new primary structure at the West Falls Church Metrorail station.
• Metro unveiled a new second entrance to the King Street Metrorail station, offering patrons a new direct covered north entrance to the existing mezzanine with access into the station from King Street.
• In November 2002, Metro unveiled the new voice-activated Ride Guide.
• Metrorail recorded its third highest weekday ridership in its 26-year history as it carried 718,747 customers on April 15, 2002 in part due to the pro-Israel Rally at the U.S. Capitol.
Unlike the one for 2002, they didn't say who they are awarding the next CNG bus contract to. I guess they might do that in the middle of 2003 or at the end of 2003, oh well we will wait and see.
I am eager to see the rehabbed subway cars and what they will look like.
I heard the following about the New York Bus Service express routes
1-The MTA is interested in taking over the routes but does not want to begin service on them until March when the new West Farms Depot opens hopefully
2-The DOT is attempting to have New York Bus Service to continue to operate the service until the TA assumes its operation.
These are rumors that i heard from a very reliable source however i do not know if they are true.
IF IT IS TRUE THEN ONLY VERY HIGH UP DOB STAFFERS KNOW ABOUT IT ONLY
Thank You
PS-Have a Merry Christmas to all
Why does NYBS have to be taken over? If anything should be taken over, the Queens privates should be taken over by the TA but back on topic, so you're telling us the source told you that until West Farms opens, the TA will not tplay a role in opreating NYBS express routes. Well nothing is concrete so we'll just have to wait.
Merry Christmas to you too. Barry.
MERRY CHRISTMAS TO ALL BUSTALKERS AND SUBTALKERS!
Why should the TA take over routes (express or otherwise) from NYBS or the Queens privates if they are already money losers? What is in it for the TA in the financial sense if taking over these routes would increase the deficit? Should the TA take over these routes only to be nice to NYC DOT?
[Why should the TA take over routes (express or otherwise) from NYBS or the Queens privates if they are already money losers?]
Because then they'd lose Transit's money instead of the City's money, which is Bloomberg's only concern.
West Farms will not be ready for a March opening. One of my colleagues was there last week for a pre-opening meeting and observed that the facility is nowhere near ready. They're hoping for a "soft opening" (one route) in the summer and full operation in the fall.
As to whether NYCT takes over any of the NYBS routes, that's a decision made at the highest levels, possibly by the Governor (as the guy who appoints the MTA Board, he gets to do these things if he wants) himself.
David
David,
If push comes to shelve it can be done if tthe TA makes it happen.
Thats what happened when Gun Hill was opened in 1989 i belive. I passed by it 2 weeks before it opened and could not believe it will be opening and it did happen
Also when Quill opened in 1998 it was pushed
Hope you had a happy holiday
Thank You
Short of financial incentives for NYBS, IT WON'T HAPPEN. I can't see NYBS doing the MTA and the city a favor for free.
I put this on Subtalk but I think it is appropriate to put it here as well.
I don't know if you guys heard this already but I heard on the news earlier that the MTA is proposing to raise the fare to $2.25, which would be a WHOPPING 50% INCREASE!!! This is just insane, there is no way I would pay that for the current at times slack service the hell with that shit. Paying $1.50 is bad enough but I am very upset at this possible plan. As usual, the passengers have to get hit with this stuff. What do you guys think of this?
It's only 75c, calm down.
Peace,
ANDEE
75cents in some transits is a fare but if nyc mta did raised the prience it will make septa look cheap!
Calm down. Which media outlet did you hear this on anyway?
Heh, heh, heh, I'm not going to waste $2.25 for a damn ride on one of Fresh Pond's 4600's/4700's(what a joke!). I wouldn't really care too much since I usually buy $15 metrocards, or $4 fun passes, but I'm willing to pay a little more for them, but not for any pre-1990 FP bus.
Damn Ridgewood, you and your hatred for those 1987/1988 TMC's won't go away would it LOL. A possible $2.25 for the service currently provided, ha thats a nice joke. Imagine paying $2.25 for waiting a 1/2 hour for lets say the B13 on a weekend; how about that!
There's no way I'd pay $2.25 for a local bus ride-that's insane. $2.00 is not great either but it's better than $2.25.
Express buses will be what 5 bucks? And there will be no weekend service whatsoever on any NYC route?
And service will still be crowded and slow? Hells no!
I hate the idea with a passion!
I sure wish I can move out of NYC!
#1979 X1
Hey it's not ture. The Local Fares are going just up to $2 but maybe like about 3-10 Years after going up to $2 would go up to $2.25 or $2.50
Its just a proposal but I really oubt it would go that high so quickly, too bad it can't stay at $1.50 with the current service :-(. I don't think you'r really serious about moving out of NYC just b/c of the fare its all anger. Unfortunately, the 7+ year run of the fare being $1.50 has to come to a end sooner or later.
As many of you may know, much of The New England Region of the Coach USA's Northeast Divison was sold off to Peter Pan (That would be Bonanza, Main Line, Pawtuxent Valley Coach, Arrow Lines and Coach USA Boston). As per new information, Bonanza will retain its color as Peter Pan is developing a Red Paint Scheme SPECIFICALLY for Bonanza. Also it is understood that Pawtuxent will basically move into the current Bonanza Facility which will soon be called within the Peter Pan circle, The Providence Garage.
As for the Northern District of the Northeast Division with is the Coach USA New York/New Jersey Operations, NO COMPANIES ARE BEING SOLD OFF. The Northern District is a major money maker for Coach USA. The Gray Line Sightseer and the Newark Airport Express is really doing sucessful. Also showing that the New York/New Jersey opearations aren't going anywhere, Coach USA has developed a newer rendition of thier paint scheme which can now been seen on a good portion of the Short Line & Suburban Fleet, also any new buses coming will sport the new scheme. As for the Academy-Sububran Swap, that was purely business and had nothing to do with Coach USA's Liquidations.
I will keep you posted on Current Coach USA dealings....
Regards,
Trevor Logan
www.transitalk.org
Bus Operator
Coach USA Westwood Garage (nee Rockland Coaches Red & Tan Lines)
.
I can't wait to see the new Peter Pan/Bonanza paint scheme.I also wonder if they have a paint scheme in mind for the Arrow Lines buses in CT? Foxwoods shuttles transit buses in Peter Pan colors would look pretty cool!! You mentioned that they plan to consolidate the Pawtuxet Valley operations into the Bonanza facility in Providence. Any word on what they plan for the Boston area, as I do believe Peter Pan does alraedy have a garage in the Boston area, or they did at one time. Several years ago, they took over the Hudson Bus Lines garage in Medford after Hudson closed up shop.Don't know if they're still using that garage currently. Coach USA Boston took over the Mini Coach of Boston facility in Chelsea when they purchased Mini Coach. I've never seen the Chelsea garage, so I don't know if it's a decent size property for Peter Pan's now expanding needs.
Thanks Trevor for all your wonderful bus pics you share with us, those pics of the NYC articulated you posted the other day were awesome!! Happy Holidays!!
Mark
The news about the new red scheme for the Bonanza buses is terrific. I hated how Coach USA simply obliterated the identity of the companies it bought. But Peter pan clearly 'gets it' - no wonder they are still standing, and its Coach USA that is falling apart.
Better yet, I would like to see the Bonanza name retained - just put 'Bonanza Bus Lines - a Peter Pan company' on the buses, in schedules, etc. Bonanza has always run a classy operation, and I would think that the name has great value among its customers and the general public. Plus, retaining the name would be a tremendous morale booster for the company's employees.
Jim D.
Hey Fellow Bustalkers,
I just wanted to wish you all a Merry Christmas and a happy and enjoyous holiday to you all. Have a safe and wonderful holiday.
Tony M.
NJT Bus Operator.
Meadowlands Garage
Thank you!! Same for you and your family.
Troy Beverett
Fairview Garage
Merry Christmas to you too Flxible and to all the Bustalkers. Enjoy your holiday everyone!
Thank You, and all the very best
Merry Christmas everyone!
This is truly a white Christmas.
I've gotten a great gift, a blue valore Phat Farm sweat suit. Its worth $150, but I got it for almost half the price. How? That's my little secret.
But, an even better gift would be for Fresh Pond to get more Novas. Who knows? It might finally happen.
This bus was talked about on NY1 today. It was about a driver putting chrismas stuff inside his bus and even played Chrismas Music over the PA.
Hope they don't run that bus on a local route with those decorations inside!
Well it can run on local routes such as the Q23 and the Q53 where they would least likely to be ripped.
I don't think they won't even dare to destory it on the local routes anyway since the OrionV Suburbans have ran on locals and the seats never got ripped
3025 Is a great bus - It was on the line I use for over a year and I had one hell of a trip accross the 59th st bridge in an ice storm on January night - And she did a hell of a job.
That is one good bus.
You use the QM12? I use the QM12 sometimes myself
Should've put some mistletoe by the front door. :-)
how'd your little gift go?
Went well. She liked it. Now I hope she calls me (I slipped my phone number and email in the CD insert).
Well I'll be back at the bank on Friday anyway!
you DID put that song I told you on there, right?
I was amazed how awesome 3025 looked. Saw that bus on NY1 in the local bar last night. I need to ride on this bus before the decorations come off. What route was it on? I remember seeing 652 right in front of it. I assume there are other buses out there that we do not know about that have the Christmas decorations all over it. I think MTA MCI 2869 had them when I saw it on the X63.
Another good Triboro Orion: 3018. Rode that bus 2x on the Q53 and both times I was on it-it flew. May look horrid though but it's a good bus.
I hope everyone here had a very Merry Christmas and I hope for a very Happy and Healthy 2003!
#3018 Q53
#2869 X63
staten island x17 riders were shocked to find this yesterday morning at the stop on richmond ave and lamberts lane. police said this was not caused by a long wait but rather a body being dumped there.
Here's wishing all Bus Talkers and their respective families the very best for the holiday season.
Yes, and Im hoping Santa bring me someone tomorrow morning.
That's right, someone, not something. :-)
I feel for you - trust me I really do.
Read my post over on Subtalk ("This Christmas Eve") -
you just have to have faith in whatever you believe, whether it's God, another diety or just the spiritual realm...
Have faith, pray, meditate, whatever. As long as you have faith and think positive, good things will happen.
They may happen in strange ways, and God works in mysterious ways, but in the long run, things usually work out.
Although it's a long sob story, what happened to me earlier in the month may have been a blessing in disguise.
If you want an illustrated example, watch the movie "Signs" and you'll know exactly what I mean.
I just wanted to wish all you guys the best!!! And have a great and safe MerryChristmas and a very happy new year!!!!!.....John R QSC BUS OPERATOR #938
Thank You, and all the Best
MERRY CHRISTMAS
From The Family @ TransiTALK
May You & Yours Be Blessed This Holiday Season!
Regards,
Trevor Logan & The TransiTALK Family
www.transitalk.org
I'd like to take this time to wish all of the Bus Talkers and their familes a very Merry Christmas, and a Safe, Prosperous and Happy New Year.
Orlando
Gun Hill Depot
Bronx Division
ill second that.
express bus service to Manhattan on weekends will be eliminated. Forgive me if I'm beating a dead horse here; it's just that I saw it on a sign posted on a Queens Surface bus working the QBx1 yesterday evening.
Some time ago I mentioned sightings of Academy MCI's at Bergen CC several times per day.
Well I e-mailed Academy and according to them, those are drivers in training, I guess familiarizing them with the Bergen County routes for when Academy takes over the 700-series routes from Coach USA.
I guess Academy will be getting the buses currently run by Coach USA. It would be pretty cool seeing a D-series coach on the 756, though! (although every once in a blue moon, a CUSA MC-9A makes a cameo appearance on the 756 and sometimes on other 700-routes)
I just want to take a moment to wish all the Bus Talk members Happy Holidays, Merry Christmas, and a safe, happy, healthy,and prosperous New Year!! And for those bus drivers who may be working on this Christmas Day, you're not forgotten either!! It's just starting to snow here in Lowell MA as I post this,the forecast calls for a foot or more in most of New England away from the coast, so the drivers for the MBTA,RIPTA,Worcester RTA and CT Transit (those are the only RTA's in New England that I know of that are running today) plus drivers on line runs that may be out there today may run into some bad road conditions later on today if the forecasts hold true. Safe driving to all bus drivers who have to work today in these areas. Is this storm expected to dump major snow in the NYC, Philly, Baltimore/DC areas?
Mark Watson
Lowell MA
No here in philly 1-3 inchs is expect reather or not that good or bad news?
We got some accumulation but it really isn't anything noteworthy. I was driving home from Baltimore during the worst of it though.
Wishing a Merry Christmas and a Happy New Year to all fellow bus talkers on behalf of myself and all NYCT workers.
BIG AL
Heavy snow for the past hour here in Nassau county, and there was even some lightning (thundersnow!).
Havent seen it come down like that in awhile. The roads are a mess, and just like last time, not a plow in sight.
WHITE CHRISTMAS
Its about time!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Yeah, it sure does look nice when it's falling.
I feel sorry though for people who have to drive, or go anywhere tonight.
Well no one is goin anywhere on Northern Blvd, it is closed at Community Drive due to a slippery condition on the hill.
Traffic backed up for miles according to PD.
I believe it's you that's said that the N20/21 always have problem's during the rush hours.Well I planned a LIBus trip for any day that I dont feel like staying home and it includes taking the N21 from Glen Cove.My question is,how reliable is the 3:19 out of Glen Cove.Is it always on time?Ever crowded? I would take the one after that but I get the feeling it wouldn't make it to Great Neck before 4:30 like it's supposed to so I'm playing it safe.
My plan is:
N6:179St-Hempstead/1:10-1:50
N27: Hempstead-Glen Cove/2:10-3:10
N21: Glen Cove-Great Neck/3:19-4:02
N26: Great Neck- Jamaica/4:30-5:20
Q1: 165St Term.-QV
Q88:QV-Queens Center Mall
thundersnow! i love thundersnow we have that like 2 years ago in phiily so philly finaly have a white christmas this year first time 30 years!
yeah its coming down again real heavy, near blizzard conditions out there. It sure is beautiful, as long as you dont have to drive in it!
...as long as you dont have to drive in it!
You can say that again! I drove in it from Baltimore to my house last night. I left downtown Baltimore at about 6:30 PM and it was snowing but would melt upon reaching the street. As I passed Camden Yards en route to 95 (wonderful baseball weather), it changed over to freezing rain, although I noticed snow on the ground just outside the Baltimore Beltway. As I was going south on 95 near Route 100 (which is south of BWI Airport near Glen Burnie, MD), I noticed the already hard to see lane markings were no longer there, and instead, there was just a long white strip between the lanes, at which time I realized the temperature was less than 32 degrees. Snowed the rest of the way home. 95 had about 3 usable lanes kept fairly clear due to the heavy usage, 495 had about 2 usable lanes. My exit ramp was covered in snow, Connecticut Avenue and Wisconsin Avenue were both passable as was East-West Highway (although I did see one car that had spun out going on the opposite direction, a Ride-On bus, 5367 IIRC, was there with its flashers indicating that there was a blockage. Traffic was not too heavy and but wasn't very light either. I did not see a single plow during all this because they were not expecting any accumulation whatsoever. WTOP was essentially saying "if you don't need to go anywhere, don't" message in their traffic reports. I did drive in front of one of the Van Go (Ride-On Route 28, bus 5180) buses and was next to 5401 at one point on 495.
My street is a real mess. Not one plow came though, no sanders either. And I'm on a main street!
Not that this is any excuse but I think the DOT/Dept. of Public Works actually got caught with their pants down -
and got a late start with sending out the trucks to plow and spread salt. All day Tuesday the forecasts called for snow and later rain, but I didn't see much rain and I think it snowed more than the weather folks expected. Today I drove down to Waldorf around 3:00 PM and the Beltway was wet in Montgomery County, but the roads were pretty much dry from Greenbelt and points south.
Wayne
They most definately did. I wasn't expecting what we got either. Should make the pictures from tomorrow's bus trip interesting.
Listening in on my scanner to the MBTA buses in the Boston area, they have several buses stuck, many routes detoured or blocked by downed power lines, trees down, etc. They've put their snow plan into effect, all routes that have snow route detours bus operators have been told to use snow routes. Also, one of the trackless trolley routes in Cambridge lost power, so a couple of the trackless trolleys are dead in the road as a result. Near blizzard conditions here at this moment. Glad I'm home nice and warm, but I dread having to go out and move that snow later.....
Mark
Well at least you shovel. Move to Sea Cliff and you dont have to!
Nobody shovels here, so I can look forward to dodging the cars in the street tomorrow.
But the snow sure looks pretty...
Nobody shovels here, so I can look forward to dodging the cars in the street tomorrow.
DOn't feel bad, we don't even have sidewalks in my neighborhood! My street is probably one of the last to get the plow, and sometimes the salter doesn't even come at all. I nearly killed myself after the snow we had a few weeks ago just walking a few houses away to my neighbor's house the day after the snow fell. Now I learned to drive there if I have to go there if it has snowed, although it seems silly to drive to someone if they are only about 5 houses away, but it beats slipping on the ice!
Hey, QS can relate to the MBTA. I had to take the Q25 to Flushing, then transfer to the Q65. Needless to say, I regret getting off at Flushing. The buses were halted for at least 2 hours. Talk about service... >:(
At least the MTA was running their buses! I can always rely on them!
Yesterday afternoon around 5:30 at the height of the storm, I walked home from the Flushing subway because I figured the northbound Q14, 20A and 44 wouldn't be very reliable. My calculations were correct. On Union Street in front of Flushing HS between Northern Boulevard and 35th Avenue, there were about four buses being put out of service, which resulted in loads of angry people being put out into the street. From what I heard, the drivers were ordered not to go any further due to "hazardous road conditions".
One can appreciate concerns for the safety of the drivers and passengers, but stopping service like that only seems to make a dangerous situation even more so. Even more galling is that plenty of people must've paid a fare or Metrocard transfer getting on the buses on Main Street, only to be kicked off two stops later.
I distinctly heard one woman yell that "they're getting back at us because there was no strike". A few other people ranted about a little snow shutting down service, and how there've been plenty of worse storms in which the buses kept running.
In any event, no northbound buses passed me along Union Street as far as 28th Avenue. Several southbound buses did go by in service, however. This morning, buses were running, albeit a bit bunched up. Fortunately, there was no crowding- no doubt due to the holidays.
You told it how it was yesterday, Howard. Stopping service like that was n't exactly a thing many of the commuters fared well with.
i saw 9 buses stuck near Jamaica Center plus 4 buses stuck on Ralph Avenue near Atlantic Avenue going home last night around 10pm-what a commute
Here in Queens it's Snowing relly hard and the wind is kicking.
Union Turnpike Eastbound is close between 141 St/GCP Service Road to Main St. The Q46 and the QM1A is now on a deotur route going by this routeing.
Left 141 St,Right 79 Ave,Right Main St,Left Union and resumes normal route.
I notice this as my QM1A bus(OrionV CNG #505) went this way but I asked the driver to drop me off at the Q74 Bus Stop on 141 St between Union Turnpike and 79 Ave.
The Union Tpke-141 St closure was due to a house fire, not weather-related.
It started about an hour or so ago out here in Suffolk also. I had commented on a thread over at SubTalk about how no snow had fallen, and the minute I clicked "Post Response" it started to snow. It's quite blizzardly out there right now, and quite a bit of snow had fallen in only about an hour. I'm glad I don't have to go on the road.
MTA SURPLUS and THE TENTATIVE AGREEMENT
The only surplus MTA is declaring is its surplus of employees!
A contract without a LAYOFF clause is like working with a thermonuclear weapon pointed at you. ALL of our JOBS are AT RISK! Our jobs are now a Budget Crisis Clause. Remember the alleged $2.7 Billion deficit.
TWU members should have taken the hint when the Contract Surveys were mailed out. Supposedly, these surveys were used to prioritize our general demands. Thousands of surveys reached the homes of the members listing important issues such as; Health Benefit Trust (HBT), wage increase, discipline, pension refund, childcare, MLK Birthday and etc. However, the "NO LAYOFF" clause was excluded! It was not one of the dozen or so choices. Therefore, it was not fought for. Consequently without a job, the "chump" sum payment promised to be given eight months from now; our newly increased HBT co-payments for visits and medicine; the Discipline and Arbitration changes (encouraging you to waive your constitutional rights); and YES - a ZERO percent wage increase means even less!
The "NO LAYOFF" clause, 0% wage, HBT handover (we no longer have a vote on the board of trustees, we only have an opinion now) are major areas of concern but the BUS CONSOLIDATION is tantamount if not more critical to the TWU Local 100 future. The high concern about this concession is creating a vulnerable future for other divisions within our local. Just think… Maintenance of Way, Car Equipment and Private Lines could be combined with/or split up among Stations, Rapid Transit Operations and Buses. Maybe it won't stop until we are only two divisions RTO and Buses. Then what's next? For example, Track Division, and Signals in MOW and Car Mtrs., in DCE could be consolidated with RTO or Revenue Mtrs., and Lighting could be with Stations. And other infrastructure titles to follow suit limiting the representation possibly.
This re-organization should never be negotiable. Restructuring a Labor Organization is not done with an employer influence at contract talks. In our case, it's bad enough we handed over the future decision making of HBT to MTA. (We no longer have a vote on the board of trustees, just an opinion now) get the point? What is this "from confrontation to cooperation" mess?
After reading the 2002 "tentative agreement" over and over, its clear productivity is very important to the MTA. It also appears that Regional Bus Company is even more important. Just think… These kinds of camouflaged givebacks today will become tomorrow's giving ups!
But what's more interesting is that about 10 yrs ago the majority of our newly elected officers elected to sponsor a "NO VOTE" campaign for a very similar tentative agreement minus some HBT issues and Bus Consolidation in which they were successful. Arguably at this point, most feel history will repeat itself. What we do in the present depends on the future.
In 1980 the Executive Board was not in one accord just like today. Therefore, I encourage you to call (212) 873-6000 and ask for our President's office and insist that our contract ratification vote be conducted by American Arbitration Association to protect the Honesty, Integrity and Trust of TWU Local 100. Dignity and Respect is earned not negotiated!
Fraternally
Richard Watson……RWATSON@aol.com
Station Shop Steward
Ps "Happy Holidays!" …………………………….Print this out, and share with other members!
[A contract without a LAYOFF clause is like working with a thermonuclear weapon pointed at you. ALL of our JOBS are AT RISK!]
Gee, that brings Transit's employees right in line with the PASSENGERS!! Welcome to the REAL world!!
- - - - -
[...and YES - a ZERO percent wage increase means even less!]
Again, that's pretty much in line with what the PASSENGERS already face at their jobs. In this economy, the average salary increase has been - gasp!! - close to zero! At some companies, employees had to take PAY CUTS to preserve their jobs, only to get pink-slipped anyway!! To repeat, welcome to the REAL world.
- - - - -
[Maybe it won't stop until we are only two divisions RTO and Buses.]
HELLO!!! That reorganization was announced back in October (check www.mta.info for the press release) and discussed extensively on BusTalk and SubTalk. Transit will be divided into MTA Subways and MTA Bus; the latter will absorb Long Island Bus at first, and may take over other carriers later.
I really hate to resurrect this discussion, but TWU members have a right not to like this contract. You fail to realise something: why would a company lay off people if ridership goes up year after year and new employees are consistently being hired? The same goes for raises. Perhaps the TA is "giving the store away" with all these fare discounts. I think you forget that the cost for a bus + train ride was cut from $3.00 to $1.50 when MetroCard came out. All I know is that I need a raise since I have to pay Bloombergs property tax increase. Or would you be satisfied if I sell my house which I have "owned" for 12 1/2 years and have given 23+ years of dedicated service to NYCT? Finally, why would any worker approve a contract which would increase his prescription co-pays?
With all due respect, Bill, rising health-care costs have been a fact of life for some time for those of us in the private sector. And it's gotten much worse over the past two years.
Jim D.
[why would a company lay off people if ridership goes up year after year and new employees are consistently being hired?]
Many a private company looks to save money by giving pink slips to older, higher paid employees so that the company can hire younger, lower paid employees to take their place. I suspect this is done much more on the private side than by the MTA.
In the case of the MTA they are overstaffed in many areas. Especially in the areas of administration in management at all levels. In addtion Metrocard's automated fare collection has rendered the traditional token sales system obsolete.
Technology reduces the grant work which is generally labor intensive. A good example is that wall street employed 10 times as many administrative staffers when the volume on the stock marker was 10000 less then it is today
(Many a private company looks to save money by giving pink slips to older, higher paid employees so that the company can hire younger, lower paid employees to take their place. I suspect this is done much more on the private side than by the MTA.)
Actually, the government (and most places where unions have clout) screws young and new workers with multi-tier contracts that provide lower compensation for lower seniority employees throughout their lives. I guess age discrimination happens everywhere, with the only difference being who is screwed.
Do it guys. Do it. Unca Ricky knows what he's talking about. You guyz running the rubbah and wheze polishing the steel underground must remain united for a common good. The new contract addresses a lot of specifics in a positive manner but the numbers of union members it may hurt is very large. I say, 'roll the dice again' and see what arbitration has to offer. Car Inspector Peter is OnTheJuice
Loads of power outages, roads are impassible here in Nassau county. Not one plow has come down my street.Oh it just came down. The whiteout continues, as the storm more or less sits off the coast and LI is slammed. 6 inches on the ground now.
I'm predicting 8-10 inches before all is said and done for us here in Nassau, Suffolk could see a foot.
Meanwhile, the NWS is still at 2-3 inches. Maybe 2-3 inches in NYC, but here in North Nassau it is a mess.
There has been alot of thundersnow.
We are lucky it was fairly warm for most of the day. In Suffolk we had some serious downpours all day, if that had been snow it would have been a real mess. It only started to snow here about an hour ago, but alot of snow has fallen already. I can't even see the road from my window it's snowing and blowing so hard!
well, here the snow reached th e 3rd rail last nite. Those M1/3s kept arcing the 3rd rail. Nice lights show.
Tony M.
Tony M.
Also the driver seat was changed, but I forgot the picture of it, I will get it next time. This is the future of the 1995/96 Novabus fleet for New Jersey Transit.
Tony M.
Where are the orion 7 at. Wasn't New york suppose to get them before the end of the year. Well It's 6 days and counting. Don't get me wrong I glad to see the new M15 artic but these where to come before them.
i wouldnt hold my breath. maybe the bus will arrive in 2003.
They will probably arrive at about the same time West Farms fully opens in September 2003.
Come on, you know bus orders usually do not come when they are supposed to, they are NOT here yet and were just going to have to wait OK!
Folks, name the two companies that formed Queens Surface Corp. and win a "Happy Holidays" card with a ACF & Orion stylized buses. It will come in a QSC envelope with your truley's signature (or blank if you prefer).
ID the name these two companies had in the trolley days & win a QSC MC holder with an expired "Travel Card" inside.
Duplicate prizes will be awarded in case of a tie(s) ... I have 30 cards that I grabbed.
I'll be off for a week after today so send me an e-mail and PLEASE don't post the answer here, as this is a little treat for the busbuffs out there who are incurable collectors < grin >
Happy Holidays to all my friends & collegues !
Mr t__:^)
The companies are:
1-Queens Transit Corpoaration
2- Steinway Transit Corporation
Thank You
Barry, I said: "PLEASE don't post the answer here ..."
BTW, I have two winners who have e-mailed me, both knew some of the names before the two you mentioned.
So, for you to win you'll need to tell me, were these two or one company at that time and what was the name of the owner(s).
Sorry for the error
The owner was Muarry Salzberg who passed away and his son Harry and son in law Julian Grow took it over
If i recall Queens and Steinway Transit were merged into Queens/Steinway Transit Corporation before they decicded to close up
Thank You
Almost again ...
Murry had a son Harry who took over after this father's death in 1984, but he didn't like the bus business. That's when Julian took over. Bob Burke was the next owner, his wife assumed control after his death in 1999.
Thurstson,
I remember those (pre QSC) days fondly. In my opinion that's when they had the most intersting fleet of buses. ... the GMC T8H-5308A, GMDD T8H-5307A, Grumman Flxible 870 and even those 2 RTS II-03 (Nos. 1 & 2) weren't all that bad. It was great because you could get most of these on local routes.
I think the CNG Orion V's are good buses and I'm extremely fond of the MCI Classics, but it's just not the good 'ol days.
Wayne
[I remember those (pre QSC) days fondly. In my opinion that's when they had the most intersting fleet of buses]
I agree, and also remember the early new look days of Queens Transit (I didn't follow Steinway much back then). If I recollect correctly, Queens Transit was earlier than most of the other Queens privates in getting new fishbowls. Also, I think QT experimented with air conditioned new looks a little before the other privates did. The new look paint scheme was also changed a few times. It started in orange and creme, then went to all orange, then back to orange and creme, and lastly the black window treatment was added. Also, Steinway contributed to the variety by ordering some AM Generals and then getting those rejected Minnesota buses in the Minnesota paint scheme (buses 3-8 or thereabouts).
I remember Queens Transit well because I lived in Flushing during the mid-1970s. Orange and cream was the predominant paint scheme. I remember the original fleet of 1960-vintage GMC New Looks (low 900 series)lasted till about 1977 or so and were always clean and well-maintained. I also remember clearly that QTC had a fleet of second-hand old-look 102"/40' GMCs (probably 5103s) that ran until at least 1976 (!!) during the rush hours. Does anyone know where these buses came from originally? Interestingly, QTC had an earlier fleet of old look 40' GMCs that had been retired by the late 1960s.
I just emailed the answer a few minutes ago, but I promise I will not tell anyone a hint to get the answer.
As of 3:30 PM I have 3 1/2 winners (Barry's the 1/2).
One of these I had his snail mail address, so that envelope is already for the mail box.
Barry, Send me you snail-mail address & I'll send you your prize.
Just having a little fun, hope you don't mind :^)
Thurston,
I runied your quiz by posting the answers.
E mail me at BarryLV 11510 @yahoo.com .
Thank You
I believe they are Queens Transit and Steinway Transit which merged sometime in the 1980's.
Wasn't Queens Transit the Q65, Q66, Q34 Q65a and
Steinway Transit the Q100 thru Q104?
There was no Q100 on Steinway Transit and you forgot the Q25, QBx1, and all the Express bus routes on Queens surface (QM1, QM2, etc.)
[There was no Q100 on Steinway Transit and you forgot the Q25, QBx1, and all the Express bus routes on Queens surface (QM1, QM2, etc.)]
You both forgot the Q67.
As for the express routes, my recollection is that the earliest ones (e.g., the QM-1) were operated by Steinway. Some of the later ones were run by Queens Transit, until the merger obliterated the separation.
IIRC There was a Q-100 at one time years ago. Steinway abondoned it years ago. I think it was mentioned at one time on Bustalk.
IIRC there were also some routes that belonged to Jamaica Bus. After a strike BOT took away those routes and gave them to TA. I realise that I missed the Q25 and the Q-67. But I wanted to know which routes in general beloned to what companies.
Whoops, this is Bustalk! Sorry about that!
I used to take the 25/34 route in the late 60's. Where did the 34 come from and go to? Who originally ran the route ?
The 25 and the 34 start from the same area. Parsons and Jamaica. They end up in different parts of north Queens. One I believe is College Point and the other Whitestone. I'm probably wrong. But maybe they were 2 lines on the old North Shore that weren't taken over by TA.
To the best of my knowledge the Board of Transportaion never took over any routes from Jamaica Buses Inc.
I recall that the Q-34 may have been operated by North Shore at one time. I believe that the City pressured North Shore to give up the line to Queens Transit as an inducement to switch the Q-25 and Q-65 routes from trolley cars to buses by the company which operated the streetcar routes whose name i can not recall at this time. That company was taken over by the Salzberg family and hence Queens Transit Corp. was started in 1931 i believe.
As an incentive for North Shore giving up the Q-34 it was awarded the Q-44 franchise by the City.
Also i believe that North Shore operated the Q-23 but the route was later switched to Triboro Coach.
The information here is from an article that i read in Motor Coach about the Queens TA bus history
Thank You
Where could I find a history of NYC Surface Lines?
The Motor Bus Society has covered most, if not all, New York City area operators over the years. Go to www.motorbussociety.org. Some of the back issues concerning these operators should still be available.
David
[IIRC There was a Q-100 at one time years ago.]
I seem to remember hearing about a so-called "franchise-keeper" route called Q100: It ran along Northern Blvd from 51st Street to Queens Plaza. It was had only one round-trip a day, for the sole purpose of keeping the franchise.
Isn't that some trips on the Q66.
I remember for the longest time the Q-66 would run along Northern Blvd from Main/Roosevelt to only to 51 St. It was only the last 13 years or so since the 63rd St tunnel was first opened up that the bus went to Queens Plaza.
There was no Q100 AFAIK. And BTW, you forgot about the Q25, Q67 in Queens Transit and express routes between the two companies.
Queens Surface Corp. routes at this time are:
- Local: Q25; Q25A; Q34; Q66; Q67; Q101; Q102; Q103; Q104; QBX-1
- Express: QM-1 Fresh Meadows; QM-1A Glenn Oaks; QM-1A Ext North Shore Towers; QM-1 Wall, i.e. Wall Street; QM-2 Bayside; QM-2A Clearview; QM-3 Douglaston; & QM-4 Jewel Ave.
====================================================================
Still have a few Christmas Cards left, send me an e-mail with the answer & snail-mail address. It will be my pleasure to send you the card.
Mr t__:^)
[Queens Surface Corp. routes at this time are:
- Local: Q25; Q25A; Q34; Q66; Q67; Q101; Q102; Q103; Q104; QBX-1]
Thurston, I think the Q65 and Q65A are missing. And I don't think there is a Q25A.
Opps .... glad I'm NOT the official spokesperson < g >
Thanks for the correction !
Oy..........
anybody have a current update. last update listed cars 8108-8248 in sevice with 8249-8268 being tested.
sorry i meant to post this at subtalk.
I didn't see any new Neoplans on the streets today or anything else new. Did see some interesting stuff today.
As I woke up, at about 5:00am this morning, going to work, to the mall which today opens at 7:00am. Cursing all the way I heading to work. Most of the way saw a Flxible here, an Orion there, New Flyers, NABIs and I also thought a saw a MANN. The first observation was when I headed on 395 when I saw what might be 2068 during the dawn with no marker lights or no taillights on, didn't see if the headlights were working. It was running on the 5A. All of that and still no Royal buses with bike racks.
I left work and saw two more no marker in the dark lights. One was 2072 (at least its headlights were on). I wonder if any of these offending buses were stopped by the police or any WMATA officials, I am pretty sure they were. As I got into D.C., saw another bus with no marker lights on or taillights, this one was a Northern Flxible E, didn't get the number on this one. To be a little off topic here, if anyone has driven up 11th Street before, from Pennsylvania Avenue up to K street, you will stop at least at two lights. This is only the second time that I went from Penn Ave. to K street on 11th street without stopping at a light.
I passed a couple of CNGs, actually alot of CNGs, but still have not seen 2460-63. I passed by Landover to look at the Neoplans and noticed that two of them have moved, one was 5316 the other, if it was in order was 5319. They might be tested or moved to their home garages or just moved somewhere else in the garage. If I were a bus fan and haven't taken a picture of a MANN, I would do it within a couple of days, because they might be on the way to bus heaven.
That's it for now, tomorrow, more stuff to see, and I probably will still see no Royal buses with bike racks. What the hell is up with that.
Regarding the "Headlights on, but no markers" bus observations, here in Baltimore, our 1999 and 2000 NABIs will have their headlights on in DAY RUN mode, but no markers or tails - unlike the 98s and 97s that don't have their headlights on in DAY RUN. It's an easy mistake to leave the switch on DAY RUN, or not even move it to night run at all.
That's what I'm assuming is the deal with the buses you mention.
That would explain it. It was the first time that I have seen three buses with no marker lights on, especially in one day. Usually I would see one, at least once a year.
I believe the buses bought after 1997 have daytime running lamps, but I don't think the pre-1997 buses do.
HERE
This is an old picture that my uncle took years back. I have no idea what the year is. Just thought you guys might want to see this.
GO TERPS!!!
Cool - Thanks for posting it. The Flxible apprears to be one of the newer 82XX-86XX series which I believe came along in the late 70's. I'm guessing that W.E.S. and 1C/Ballston will know the approximate year.
Wayne
The bus on the left is a '74 AMG, the bus on the right could be either a '76 Flx (V8 engines-8000-8144), a '77 flx(V6 eng.-8200-8327), or a '78 Flx (8400-8661 WC lift V6 engine).
WOW...the 78s had lifts? Awesome! WAY ahead of their time. So the 8000-8100s were 1976? Can anyone confirm this? I thought all WMATA units were 77s or 78s.
-F.
The 8000-8144 were 1976 Flxibles. They came out after NJDOT got their Flxibles. They had the Metal bumpers instead of the rubber HELP bumpers on the 82 thru 8600's.
So HELP made those? The same folks that make spare door handles, etc. for cars and trucks? I think the metal bumpers look better on a Flx New Look any day.
-F.
It is definately an 8200-8600 model Flxible New Look. If the camera got that whole Flxible New Look, we could have told for sure if it was an 8200-8300 or an 8400-8600 series Flxible.
Yep...that's an 8xxx-series Flx alright. I know the 8200s were 1977s, and I believe some of those were 1978s. Very cool pic!
-Fred
The AM General on the left was one of a large number that were purchased in 1974. So judging by my fellow poster's message about two hours ago, this picture is probably late 70s-early 80s. As I remember the AMGs were mostly gone by around 1988.
Yes, they were; in fact, we have WMATA AMG no. 7535 in our collection. Its Virginia State Inspection sticker reads 1987 and "EXPIRES 1988". I assume these were replaced by an order of Flx Metros, presumably the 9200s? If anyone can back this up, please do; I need this information for our archives. Thanks!
Sincerely,
Fred Donaher
Curator
Commonwealth Coach and Trolley Museum
www.commonwealthcoach.com
I believe the AMG's were replaced with the 1986 batch of Flx Metros. I don't remember seeing too many of those on the road after the 8700 and 8800's came out.
The last AMG I can really remember was a 74xx being worked on at Beltway Plaza. A maintenance person was driving it around the parking lot and it looked like he was testing out the braking because he'd speed up and jam on the brakes, then do that over and over again.
The Flx New Looks that had W/C lifts were 8400-8661. Some of the 8400's used to have a black plate on the front by one of the headlights that indiated that it was a wheelchair lift bus as well.
yep, you're right. The last of the AMGs were replaced by the first order of Flxible Metro 8700-8925 and 8950-75. The last one I remember seeing was a 35 footer on the H8 about to enter the Rhode Island Avenue Station. I believe that was mid 1986. Also remember seeing at least one AMG painted in WMATA's second paint scheme. As I remember, this one didn't have black around the windows as the first group of Orions had.
W.E.S., this has been discussed here before many a time, but I would like your opinion: Which of the Metrobus paint schemes do you prefer?
I don't like the first version (1974-1982) at all. It was tacky and unimaginative, and those vertical stripes above the front door did not do anything for the rest of the scheme. Some buses wore this scheme until the 1990s? Wow - I thought that WMATA would have slapped the 1983 scheme on to all of the New Looks rehabbed in the mid 80s.
The 1983-1996 scheme is a timeless classic. It was obviously made for a Flxible Metro, but it looked pretty sweet on RTSs and New Looks, too. The addition of that grayish (?) color to the skirt and hubs was a very nice touch. Were the 9500-series Neoplans the first buses delivered in the second scheme? I'd imagine that the RTSs were repainted as they were un-slantbacked; seems kind of odd to think of a slantback RTS in the second scheme. And, in their original colors, the 9600-series Orion Vs were hardass buses that looked like they meant business. Incidentally, which was the last 9600 repainted? My money is on 9653. Any estimates of how many of each batch are still in the 1983 scheme? Seems like fewer buses every time I look... :(
The current (1997+) scheme is sharp, but the buses somehow look less serious about their task in these lighter colors. It looked cool on the lone RTS repainted; also a MAN was repainted but it somehow did not fit quite right.
Does anyone notice that the ubiquitous 9200-series Flxibles seem immune to the new scheme? I'm guessing it's because they were the last ones freshened up before the current scheme was introduced.
Also on the topic, can anyone describe the paint schemes of WMATA's various predecessors?
PS: I love how WMATA labels the back of its buses with its full name - Washington Metropolitan Area Transit Authority. That is so f$&%ing cool!!
KEEP THE METROBUS DISCUSSION COMIN'! I CAN'T GET ENOUGH!
I liked the 1983-96 scheme also. It was a modern but warmer look on the buses. Your statement about the 9500 Neoplans were right, they were the first ones with the new scheme, then the rebuilt fishbowls, and after that, the 5100 MAN's. I remember seeing a few AMG's with the new scheme, but they were on the way out, so Metro concentrated on putting the scheme on the New-Look Flxibles instead. That scheme really took off on the Flx Metros, it was the most perfect mating of paint scheme to bus model that I ever seen.
Yeah, it looked amazing on those buses, especially the Metro E's. The new sheme isn't that good on them, though. It looked decent on the NABIs too. I like the new scheme better for the Orions, though.
I agree the new paint scheme looks better on the Orions than the Flxibles. The paint scheme from '83 to '96 looked great on the New Look Flxibles. That blue bar on the front of them made them look sharp as opposed to the unexciting "M" that was on them before. The AMG's I happened to see in that new scheme looked bad. Those were actually better off in the original paint than trying to update them.
The Baltimore MTA Flxibles look odd with the all white back. It looks unfinished. But, I guess uniformity takes precedence over aesthetics, since the NABI's have all white backs.
Yeah, I agree with you about the uniformity. NABIs here (SEPTA)looked great with black trim, but to look like the other buses, they are all white now. Personally, I think they should've kept the trim, because now the NABIs don't have their uniqueness anymore.
That's right! And Flxibles lose their identity once all the black is gone. Our Grumman 870s were done in all white before their retirement to match our Gilligs, and they looked just horrible...even the DOORS were in all white, which made them look tacky as hell. The first thing our museum president did when we got our Grumman fresh from the fleet was spray the black where it was supposed to be, and what an improvement it was. You should see the fully restored result.
-F.
www.commonwealthcoach.com
Oh, the Baltimore Flxes look HORRIBLE with that all-white back. UGH, I say. Can't they at least wrap them? They DO look unfinished! And WHY would you paint an area white that is the most likely to get dirty? PLEASE tell me they didn't do that to all of them....and how many have they ruined with that tacky flag scheme? Blue MTA stripe is MUCH better!!!
-F.
I agree with you guys about the WMATA (and Baltimore MTA) paint schemes. I've gotten used to WMATA's new scheme bhut I've never been too wild about it. I do believe it fits the Orions very well. In fact I think the 9600 Orions look better in the new scheme although I despise those utilitarian truck LED brake/tail/turn indicators. I don't dislike MTA's new scheme, but it does make the bus appear a bit naked. I think the buses will look terrible once the backs get really dirty.
Wayne
Yup...white-backed buses look cruddy when dirty. I can't get into LEDs on Flxibles..the wraparounds look better any day.
-F.
Yeah...it really doesn't do anything for them. And yes, the Metro Es looked TIGHT in that scheme...Trevor Logan has a rear shot of one that makes me melt every time I see it...like looking at a supermodel!
Are the Es still in the second scheme, or did they get a makeover that looks like the transit eqiuvalent of a bad perm?
-F.
All the E's are in the new scheme to my knowledge. The only Flxibles in the second scheme are all the 9200's, random 8700-8900's as well as 9300-9400's and a couple of the 35' 9400's.
How good to know. I recently did a model of 9301 for a customer, and he specifically ordered the second scheme. He also ordered Baltimore no. 9201 in the blue MTA stripe. Two of my favorite customs to make. :)
-F.
I know that's right! We have AMG no. 7535 in our museum fleet and it is in the second scheme...not bad looking at all. But it was REALLY made for the Flx Metros...funny how the scheme and the bus were from the same era exactly....1983 through 1996. Weird, huh? :)
-F.
I liked the second personally. It looked good on the Flxibles as well as the rest of the buses that had that paint scheme. The worst is the current one. I don't like the blue skirting at all. Looks more purple or lilac than blue, even though the Orions and NABIs look good in them. The New Looks looked better in the original paint scheme. Here is an unusal factoid, in that there is only one bus that has been through all three paint schemes and that is an RTS that is now part of the antique fleet. It was painted before being retired, like 5119 and retired about six months later.
I dont remember seeing any RTS's with the vertical stripe paint scheme. I have seen old AM Generals and GMC/Flxible New Looks with it but never an RTS. I only remember seeing RTS's in the grey skirt scheme. BTW, where is this RTS that you mentioned having all three paint schemes? Is it available for viewing?
The RTSs were delivered in 1979 - four years before the grey skirt scheme. They all wore the "vertical stripe" scheme, though due to the small amount of room between the top windowline and the roofline, the stripes were slanted instead of vertical and it was pretty easy not to see them altogether.
Consider me surprised that an RTS made it into the Metrobus historical fleet. I always got the feeling that RTSs were never all that well-liked in Washington, even though the 9000s lasted an impressive 21-22 years.
Yes, that is amazing; our museum has a photo of one going down the street in 1980 (still in slopeback form) when it was only a year old. I am impressed that one was kept for the historic fleet. Was a Flxible New Look saved as well? And what exactly do they do with the buses in that fleet? I heard their AMG just sits around all day.
-F.
I don't know where that particular bus is, the last time I saw it, it was in front of the Landover Annex yard hidden behind a brick wall. I haven't seen it since. Like RTS T80 206, they were originally delivered in WMATA's original paint scheme. They also came with sloped backs. I am not sure when they got their backs, probably when they were painted in their new paint scheme. I remember riding the slop backs, I thought these buses were awesome, and so did alot of people who rode them at that time.
One final thing, I believe they should have kept two more in addition to the one they kept. One should have been in the second paint scheme and one should have been in the original paint scheme in slopeback form as it was when it was delivered.
Really? Bet that thing looks interesting...anyone got pics of this?
-F.
Say, I wonder what the New Looks would have looked like in the third scheme? Bet it would have been wild!
Unfornately no. I don't know even know what number it is. I am pretty sure when the Largo Town Center extension and/or the New York Avenue station opens, all the antique buses will be there, and I plan to be there.
When will this happen? If they brak out the oldies, I'm coming to DC....any other BusTalkers going?
-F.
That wont be for another couple of years. I'll definitely try to go, though.
Well, here comes more....the second scheme is my favorite. And now that I know the 9200s are still in them, they are my favorite WMATA buses. You're right, Flx Metros were MADE for that scheme. I never saw the 9600 Orions in the second scheme but I bet they looked MUCH better. They looked pretty okay in the third scheme though....I'm just not feeling that new scheme on the Flxes as it took away the black around the windows. The dark blue on the A/C isn't bad though.
And yes, the stripe over the roof did nothing for the New Look Flxibles et al...if they were slanted up to match the windows, maybe it would have worked better.
On a lighter note, we have a 7500 AM General in our local museum fleet that is partially restored in the second scheme. Somewhere I have an 8x10 of Flxible New Look no. 110 in the same. :)
-F.
Cool, 110 was one of the New Look suburbans! I used to love riding those things. The best was when they were put on a rush hour local route like the Q2 back in 1992 and people that were sitting had to squeeze past the ones standing since there wasn't a back door. I also cracked my head on the luggage rack when I got off at Silver Spring. Ingenius putting that bus on. I remember it also on the Calverton-Fort Totten line years ago too with the same problems, however, I didn't bump my head that time.
Ouch! What happened? Too much power or not enough room? And weren't those 96-inch buses as well?
-F.
Not enough room. LOL. I'm so used to riding a bus and being able to stand up without worrying about what's above me. LOL. They were 96 inch buses
I know the feeling; I figured that's what it was! We have all 96-inchers here; now that I ride transit exclusively, I have to carry all my errands on a backpack (paperwork, model buses, eBay items, etc.) and it really gets to be an experience, especially on a full bus. If I had a nickel for every "'Scuse me, Pardon me" that I emit, I could afford to buy my own bus....LOL! That backpack makes ME feel 102 inches wide. I need a CDL just to carry myself!
-Fred
Man, I always wanted to ride one of those, but never got a chance to. At one time all of them were running out of Landover, on the old 87. Some were spotted on the F2 and F8 a couple of times before they were gone. They did spend a brief time in Virginia and then returned back to Landover. One other time, one ran regular on the V14, when I live in District Heights. My apartment was right outside of the V14 line and saw this bus almost every morning. That was the one my mother took to work every morning, couldn't remember the number. That a 35' 3500 series new look were the only buses I remember not ever riding. I also never rode the New Flyer D60LF demo when WMATA was testing it in 1999, even though they practically ran in front of my house.
Yeah, those suburban coaches were pretty cool. I remember seeing them all the time on the 87 to DC. Once, my dad's office hired a coach from WMATA and we ended up with one of those to take to Baltimore. This had to be in the early 80's. It was for a union rally as my dad at the time worked as a claims examiner for one. I remember coming home and we were in downtown Baltimore and some guy tried to get on asking if we'd take him back to DC. Uhhh, NO!
I remember that artic that came to DC as a demo. I never saw it on the road. I'm guessing it was the blue one with an orange roof? I think they ran it on some VA routes, but at the time I was living in Fairfax and wasn't really near any decent public transportation, except for the 20A that WMATA used to run but was taken over by the Fairfax Connector.
They should have made him pay a high fare, LOL!! It did come as a demo, it was in blue and orange and had two doors and had a DD60 engine. It ran on the F14 a for about a week or two then went away. I first saw it on the X2 and it also if I remember it running on the X8, one of the Virginia 20 routes, I guess the 20A, F14 and a couple of other routes. It was more of a test of a low floor bus, because WMATA wanted to buy low floors at the time.
Unfortunately I never did get to ride those WMATA Flxible suburbans. I did see them a few times. The last time I saw one it was S/B on US Route 1 in Beltsville. They look identical to the 1976 Flxible (53096-8-1) suburbans that NJTransit used to have. I rode those many times and I was sad to see them go.
I saw the NF D60LF demo at WMATA only once. Did it stay here long???
Wayne
I think it only stayed about a couple of months.
WHOA...they had 35-foot New Looks in DC? GM or Flx?
-F.
GM. I only saw 2548-2569 and 3503, but I am sure they had more, in fact they did have more.
I remember seeing a few WMATA 35 footer fishbowls. Before I moved to the DC area in '96... about 90% of my rides on WMATA buses actaully took place in NYC when the NYCTA borrowed nearly 200 buses back in the early 80's. I was just starting high school and I always refer to this time as the Grumman crisis. The group that came to NYC was somewhat of a mixed bag, but most of them were WMATA's 6400/6500/6600 series GM TDH-5304. I know there were some 1300 and I think 1700 series buses too. The 1300 being TDH-5302 and I think the 1700 series were T6H-5306A. I recall seeing a few 35 foot TDH-4517 also. And of course there were the Flxible (6800 series), but they were on Staten Island.
Wayne
They must have shipped the entire 1700s to New York, because I have never seen them. I barely remember the 6800s and buses like them. I know when Metrorail began opening, alot of the buses were considered surplus and sent to other transit agencies who needed them. I know Philly and New York got some. I think I remember seeing 2300s, 2400s, 2700s, 3300s, but I also thought that WMATA had 7700s and 7800s series AMGs, must have been the 7000s and 7100s.
WES - I think you're right - WMATA probably didn't have any 1700 series fishbowls. I may have been thinking of a 1700 series because when while the WMATA were in NYC... NYCTA had assinged them temp fleet numbers in the 1700-1800 series. NYCTA kept the buses for a while, but less than 2 years. A couple of years ago when we were enjoying the last days of the new looks at WMATA I often thought that some of those remaining 6400-6700 series buses may have been part of the group that went to NYC.
The WMATA buses had their route number and destinations sign in them, but of course they were of no use to NYCTA - and they operated with a placard in the windshield. The block number sign came in quite handy. Prior to the mid to late 80's the run number sign on MABSTOA buses were not used for that purpose. I often wondered why because NYCTA used theirs, but MABSTOA used theirs to display the route number - which is why the block number sing on the WMATA buses came in handy for MABSTOA B/O's.
Wayne
IIRC, the AMGs were only 7500-series. I may be wrong....
-F.
The AMG 40 footers were from 7000-7499 and the 35 footers went from 7500 to 7619, I believe.
Oh, I see...so were the nos. 7620-7999 ever used for anything in between the AMGs and the Flx New Looks? Just curious.
-F.
From what I can remember, there have been no buses in the upper 7000's. It looks like the 2000's will be used for awhile with the new CNG's coming in the next few years.
Yes...I recall when WMATA 2164 was sent down here as a demo from the Orion people in 2000. In fact, it reminded our TA so much of a Flxible that our 2001 Gillig order almost became a fleet of Orion Vs.
-F.
How old were the 6800s? And what vintage were those?
-F.
I've never seen (or heard) WMATA's 6800 series Flxibles up close and personal... but they appear to be the same (or similar) model as the NYCTA Flxible 111CD51 (4000-4202, 4600-4727) which came along in 1970.
When they were in NYC I saw a 6800 once on Staten Island while I was railfanning on SIRT. Outside of Staten Island two other depots used the WMATA buses, but both (Amsterdam & 54th Street) had all of them were GM fishbowls.
Wayne
Those 6800 series Flxibles are among the filthiest, dirtiest, ugliest buses I have ever seen. I saw pictures of them on this web site and they are just hideous! In fact all buses until the advent of the Grumman 870 and the first RTS seem to attract grime and dirt and mud.
The Old Looks for Ave. B transit company were atrocious. They were not only dirty, but they were falling apart. Many of them looked if they were used as battering rams or crash test vehicles. The TA New looks were not much better. Some of the older Green ones were no longer green, but sludge colored as if they had been bathing in a vat of mud.
Why were all of these pre ADB buses so dirty and ugly?
The WMATA Flxibles, I liked them and to me they seemed reliable, but they had some shortcomings, especially the 6V92 ones. For one the paint at the roofline seemed to chip easily and alot, even some of the 4000 series Metro Es had this problem, especially from Four Mile Run. Also the 6Vs were very slow, they often ran late. According to WMATA, who rehabbed some of their GM New Looks, deemed the Flxible New Looks, unrehabbable. Still it was sad to see them go.
But WHY were the Flx New Looks unrehabbable? I mean, they had the same underpinnings as their GM contemporaries. And personally, I like them better all around! What a shame they let those go.
-F.
That I couldn't remember, but they were actually younger than the GMs when they were rebuilt in the early to late 80's. I thought (from my perspective anyway), they were more durable than the GMs, although it might be an unfair comparison, as most of the GM new looks were approaching 20 years old while the Flxible new looks were barely past 10 years old.
Well yeah, but still...they didn't need to go tossing Flxibles first! EVERYBODY did that...what's up with that?
On a side note, 30-foot Flxible New Looks were built with heavy-duty 35 and 40-foot components, while Fishbowl 30-footers went with lighter duty components. Flx saved money, and built highter quality in the process. :)
Are we talking about the WMATA units? I think a lot of that has to do with the very dark grey color used on the bottom and the wheels...most of the ADBs wore white wheels and that makes a BIG difference. Dark wheels make a bus look grimy especially...until I got on the 3800-series RTS in Detroit, I honestly thought that bus was 20 years old. Those ugly black wheels just made it look old!
-F.
Oh yes...a quick note. The 3800-series RTS buses in Detroit that looked 20 years old? I was shocked to find these were 2002 models and was quite impressed. VERY nice on the inside, and the Series 50 actually sounds good in those, unlike it does in Gilligs and others.
-F.
I believe the 6800s were D.C. Transits that WMATA absorbed when they took over the privates. If I am correct they were purchased in 1968, and I don't know the exact model number, but they were of the FD series. I was very young when they retired and don't remember if I rode any or not. I can't remember the powertrain or transmission. Does anyone out there know this information. They were in service until the early 80s, and I did see a couple years after they were retired, somewhere on 295 and one on Rhode Island Avenue near the Rhode Island Avenue at a firestation, but hasn't been there for a couple of years.
Neat. I always liked the "FD" destination as those are my initials pinned onto my favorite bus of all time. :)
-F.
There were two sets of the 1968 Flxibles. The DC transits were numbered in the 6800's, and the Virginia Lines (DCT subsidiary) were numbered in the 2600's. They ran until 1978 (replaced by the 8400-8661 Flx's), then put into reserve (where some of them went to Philly, then NYC), then were sold off piecemeal until 1983. I think there were about 100 buses spread out between the two groups, 75 for DC and 25 for VA.
There were Flxibles in the 2600's? I know that there were GM fishbowls in the 2600's as well, which were ex DCT units as they had the orange and green seats. I think a few of them were rehabbed into the second scheme with the red seats. Then you had what I called the imitations which painted the outside to the scheme the fishbowls were retired in a few years ago, but kept the orange and green seats.
Yep. There were 2600 Flxibles. I remember seeing them on K st in 1976.
They ran out of the Arlington Garage. In fact to freak you out, I was in DC way back in the day when the shopping center where Ballston Common stood was a old, dull place called Parkington. Or how about this, I was at Landmark when it was an open air shopping center, and Shirlington was one of the most scummiest spots off 395! And last, but not least, remember the time when Wheaton Plaza was an open air shopping Center?
I remember Ballston Commons as Parkington. There used to be a street that separated Hecht's from the rest of the shopping center. Ballston was so much different 25 years ago than it is today. Apts. are all up where you had strip centers. I think the IHOP is the only thing left that hasn't changed here! I can't believe that thing is still standing.
I definitely remember Wheaton Plaza with no roof. Same with PG Plaza. I also remember when White Flint opened up in the late 70's. The food court was really neat back then, too. It was more themed rather than having chains run it.
I used to always have to take a walk by the Arlington garage when I visited Parkington as my mom worked in Rosslyn and we would take the Orange line up to Ballston when it first opened in '79.
Oh, the memories!!!
Don't remember Landmark as an open air shopping center, did remember Prince George's Plaza and Capital Plaza as open air shopping centers. I also remember the old Hecht's building downtown on 7th Street, and how bad the ceilings look. I barely remember Wheaton as an open air shopping center, and although never saw Landmark as an open air shopping center, since I now work there, I have been hearing it alot, in the past couple of months.
Yep, Landmark was an open air shopping center. On my several trips from Oakwood to the shopping center, I nearly got picked off crossing Duke St. Also the buses used to stop in front of the center, not all the way in the back as they do now, but the bus I used to ride, the 11E, never stopped inside the shopping center. Boy, that was quite a long ride to DC back in the day.
At Wheaton Plaza, the buses used to stop in front of the old Woodies Store. The Q and Y buses came off Viers Mill Rd, into the parking lot, stop at the bus stop, then the Q went onto Viers Mill Rd, the Y went onto Reedie Ave back to Georgia Ave. The C2 and the Ride-on 8 and 9 buses stopped in front of Woodies, then went around the center till they went to University Blvd. That changed in the late 80's, then in 1990 the Wheaton Station opened, and all of the buses went into the station.
I wonder where the 2600 nomenclature came about for those? That reminds me of 26xx Flxes elsewhere in Virginia...only these are Metros in Blacksburg. Hopefully they are still there; they were slated for auction soon, but may still be in service as trippers.
-F.
There were only 15 Flxibles owned by the Washington Virginia and Maryland Coach Co. which were re-numbered in the 2600s. These buses were originally WVM #641-655 and were absorbed into the WMATA Metrobus system with the 1973 takeover, retaining their numbers but with a 2xxx added to them (ie. 641 became 2641). The remaining GMs were numbered 501-569 (TDH4512 old looks and TDH4517 fishbowls), 570-640 (TDH5304 fishbowls), and 656-672 (T6H5306A fishbowls).
The Alexandria Barcroft and Washington Transit Co had most of their buses renumbered into the 1000-series; this assignment made sense, as AB&W had begun to recieve their 1001-1030 and 1101-1130/1151-1180 T8H-5307A fishbowls by the time WMATA took over the operation in 1973 (more specifically, the 1151-1180 series was being delivered or in the process of same by the time of the WMATA takeover). The 5307As were purchased by the No.Va Transportation Commission for AB&W.
The Washington Marlboro and Anapolis Transit Co buses were renumbered into the 3000-series in the same fashion.
The DC Transit buses retained their fleet numbers, which were based on the year of purchase.
Thanks for the history! I remember riding a 1000 series GM before they were rehabbed with the blue vinyl seats. These had brown carpets if I remember correctly and the seats were brown and mustard colored, I think.
The 3600 series GM Fishbowls had orange and black seats. I vividly remember riding 3606 and it had those seats. It had no advertisements on it either and had a red number in the windows, a different 4 digit number. Was this by any chance a bus loaned to NYC? The reason I ask is looking at a photo of a WMATA bus on load to NYC in the pictures section, it has a bus with a red card in the window as well.
I also remember the 1400 series Fishbowls had all green seats, but the cushions didn't cover the whole seat, almost making it look like bucket seats becuase you could see the metal supports behind it.
There were 6700 series Fishbowls with interesting pastel plastic seats.
Same thing happened elsewhere in VA when Blacksburg acquired four ex-PenTran Flxible New Looks. 612, 621, 637, and 639 became 3612, 3621, and so on. They were retired from there in late 1999; I am proud to say that our museum restored 621 to original PenTran livery. You may see a glimpse of that coach at www.commonwealthcoach.com.
-F.
I think those were second-hand (from one of the companies that WMATA absorbed) and all the equipment from that area got a "2" prefix.
I know that there were GM fishbowls in the 2600's as well, which were ex DCT units as they had the orange and green seats.
Anything WMATA got from WV&M got a 2 put in front of its number. The 2600 series Fishbowls were ex WV&M not DCT but since DCT bought WV&M in 1965 they were ordered painted DCT colors and with the same DCT interior. The outsides had the round Virginia lines logo instead of the DC Transit lettering.
I think a few of them were rehabbed into the second scheme with the red seats.
Correct. Several went to Blitz for rehab.
Thanks for the history! Those buses were mainstays in VA up until the early 80's. I think towards the end of their lives, a few made their way into MD and VA, but the bulk of them were gone by then.
I wish when I was a kid I thought of the fact that I was riding buses with this history. I guess we don't think of those things that young! I look back on it now and just remember being excited to ride a bus period and not thinking of when it was built.
I think they were 2630-49 or 2640-59, not sure which. Found that information in Motor Coach Age. Years ago, before Channel Five changed the ending, they would show one passing by the White House at night, could never get the number, and didn't have a VCR back then to record it.
The 9600 Orions weren't too bad in the old scheme. Their doors were painted black which I thought was a bit strange.
Wayne
Yeah, I agree the black rear doors, especially, looked odd on the 9600's. It almost cheapened the look. They still keep on kicking though.
Wow...so those were literally 12-year buses? Thanks for the info; I will let the museum know. AMG no. 7535 must have been used as a training coach if it still had a 1987-88 Virginia inspection sticker. Does anyone know history on this specific coach?
-F.
Yeah, those buses disappeared off the streets really quick. I guess some did make it to 1987-88, but for the life of me I just can't remember them. I wish I could remember how the AMG's were divided up between divisions.
Any info on that thing is vital for our website and archives. I basically said "1974 to the late 1980s" and mentioned that Flxibles replaced them, so I was mostly in the zone there. As a curator (and a human being), I learn something new every day.
-F.
That would be about right. When WMATA went to its second paint scheme, beginning around 1983, the Flxible New Looks I believe were among the first to go in that paint scheme, because there were still GM New Looks in the old paint scheme up until the early 90s. Oddly enough, the last ones that were repainted were quickly retired. The RTSs might have actually been the first to entirely repainted, of course I am not sure about this.
Didn't set foot on board MetroRail once today, here is what I did and saw.
Got the 2:25 42 from Friendship Heights. It was Gillig 5416. This bus had the heat turned on VERY high and was most of the seats were taken.
My plan was to take the first 70 trip that had a Metro-D on it. The 2:57 was Orion V/CNG 5569, one of the 35 footers. I wasn't in the mood to ride this bus again (I rode it on the 37 in June) so I let it go. Went to find a bathroom while I waited for the next bus. The 3:27 was Orion V 5619, the bus I take every morning on the 37. Well there was no way I was taking this bus! It went off without me as well. Orion V/CNG 5810 was going to make the next 47 trip, so I decided to take that unless a Metro-D came for the 70, and it did! It was 5702, and I got on. Somewhere before all this I took a ride on the 92 (Trolley Replica 5298) from Bethesda to Woodmont and Norfolk. While walking back to Bethesda, I saw 5402 on the 42 with no passengers. I won't go into why it should be discontinued and merged with the 34 again.
The 70 trip went well. The bus had a good sounding engine, but we were not the fastest vehicle on the road. Many seats were taken but I don't know if that was because of the Free Wheeling Days. Got to Milestone early and Orion V/CNG 5812 was there. This bus seems to suffering an identity crisis. The inside says the bus is a 2000 model but the outside thinks 1999. The back sign said 49 which I knew was wrong so when I checked out the side sign, it said 90 SHADY GROVE. Sweet, I say to myself, and get on. While nothing like the other 90 ride I took in March of 2000, it is still pretty good. This driver is a little slower on some of the curves on Woodfield Road, and when turning onto 370, runs up against the curb and it felt like the whole bus was going to tip over. Needless to say, it didn't. Shady Grove was full of activity, so I took pictures of a whole ton of things. I have to do a little more experimenting late night with the digital so that when I take pictures of moving vehicles, they are either too blurry or too dark. That said, I got good pictures of a few things there and eventually, lo and behold, 5801, the Orion VI/CNG comes off 370! It pulls around for a layover on the other side of the road near the parking garage, so I go over and get pictures of both the front and the back. Since the bus was not in motion, I could use the camera's night setting without any trouble and got pictures of both the front and back.
While at Shady Grove, I noticed that the 75 is now contracted (I think it had been county run before), the 124 is conuty run (it had been contracted), and the 76 is contracted. I walked through the station and took the 63 to Rockville. The Gaither Road detour is interesting, especally the turn around (big circle at a dead end in an office park type place). At Rockville, I found out I had missed a 47 by about 5 minutes or so, so decided to wait until the next T2 showed up. It came about 15 minutes later and was Flxible Metro-D 9712. This was the slowest trip of the day. Normally, the T2 is really fast on Falls and River Roads but not with this driver. Did see a 2002 Orion V waiting to start the 37 at Potomac Community Center. It should have been from Silver Spring. And after I got off the T2, I went home. Pictures from this and my other travels in the past month will be online this weekend.
I was told the following but do not know if the information is correct
That according to the American Disabilities Act (ADA) when a mass transit operator makes service available to the handicapped they can not replace that service unless an alternative service is provided.
When the Transit Authority made the recent bus changes on the B40 and the B78 in forming the B 47 route they did indeed comply with the law because on the parts of the old B40 route which were discontinued an alternative service was provided that did indeed meet ADA standards
However when the B 18 route was combined with the B 13 and B 18 service was discontinued along Cypress Avenue the TA said "Alternate service is provided by the L Train between Ridgewood Terminal and Halsey Street" The L Train is not accesable for the handicap at either Myrtle/Wykoff or Halsey Street Stations. I do know that the TA plans an overhaul at Myrtle/Wykoff which will make the station ADA usable but unless Halsey Street is done then what good is the alternate route
Is the TA in violation of the ADA when the B 18 was discontinued
Anyone please advise
Thank You
Wouldn't the paratransit service just be used instead? I thought the whole idea of paratransit would be to provide service to those that can't access a public bus stop reasonably and would be used to take them to their destination or at least to the nearest rail station so they can complete their trip? That's basically what is done with Metro Access here in DC.
And MetroAccess costs a whole ton of money!
Its definitely not as expensive as it used to be. WMATA used to take the fare that it would cost to get to the destination and then double it. Now, I believe its a flat fare of either $1.10 or $2.20 per trip no matter how far the trip is.
I meant expensive to operate.
Oh, yeah, that's for sure. I worked for Metro Access several years ago and it was incredible to see how much they were charging WMATA to run below standard service. I hated working there and it pained me to see how shabby the supervision was and the impossible schedules the drivers had to run.
Paratransit is supposed to be complementary service, but its nothing like it was designed to be. I don't know there to be many paratransit systems that run that well to begin with.
>>> Wouldn't the paratransit service just be used instead? <<<
No. The ADA requires making regular service available to the disabled as much as possible. Paratransit is for those so disabled that they cannot use ADA compliant vehicles. A separate transit system for the disabled is not permitted by the ADA.
Tom
[Is the TA in violation of the ADA when the B 18 was discontinued]
I do not know much about the specifics of ADA and recognize it is extremely complex, but your question suggests that when a particular bus route is served by ADA compliant buses, the operating authority can never discontinue service on that route. I suspect that is not the case, and an operating authority can terminate service on a bus route any time it wants with respect to ADA. Otherwise, how can LI Bus discontinue service on the N91? Logically, if an authority can terminate service without worrying about ADA, it should be able to similarly alter that route.
Sid,
I am not saying that a transit system can not discontinue a route due to low ridership
What i am saying is that a transit system discontinues a route that is ADA compliant and offers an alternative to the discontinued service then the alternate service must also be ADA compliant.
By the way there is an alternative to the N-91 service.
Take the N-4 and transfer to the Q-3 from Rockville Centre and from Hempstead you can take the N-6 to Jamaica and then transfer to the Q-3
Again it is all ADA compliant
Thank You
There's no violation: (1) The "alternative" L train runs along Wyckoff, not Cypress; and (2) if Wyckoff Avenue is truly an alternate to Cypress, then the B26 qualifies as a suitable replacement.
The key is that a service which is no longer available to persons with mobility impairments is also no longer available to persons without mobility impairments.
You're probably right that this isn't an ADA violation.
But some subway GO's are. I distinctly recall one GO about a year ago that required SB E/F passengers to get off at Briarwood-Van Wyck, climb a lot of stairs, take a shuttle bus to Continental, and reenter the system there. How was a passenger who had entered via elevator at Jamaica Center and had planned on exiting at Herald Square also via elevator expected to pull that off? For that matter, when the 1 is sent express from 42nd to 72nd, there's no ADA access to or from NB 66th (neither 42nd nor 72nd has elevators yet), and when the 2/3 is diverted to the local track at 34th for whatever reason, the elevator on the express platform is unavailable (the local elevators are not yet open, AFAIK).
The discontinuation of a service entirely would seem to me to be a minor problem in comparison.
Not really b/c the people could use the Access-A-Ride that the MTA offers to people with disabilities. Also, you have to know if a lot of handicapped/disabled persons use the B18 since I didn't ride it that much and I didn't know too much passengerwise.
Volume of handicapped ridership is not a factor in determining ADA compliance. The point of ADA is to allow handicapped persons to be as mobile as non-handicapped persons.
I'd say not. The B18 never had that many riders to begin with. The (L) line doesn't follow the B18 after the Myrtle Av./Wyckoff Av.. People near Cypress Av. have the B20 which follows the (L) line closely until Bway Junct..
By the time the B18 came, you could already be waiting for the B13/B20 by walking a few blocks.
I'll admit, the Myrtle/Wyckoff station should be accesable for the handicap, considering it's the most important transportation point in Ridgewood/Bushwick(its also my hangout area). Hell, they closed the escalators that lead up to the (M) station more than a year ago and its been left like that. Once a guy on a wheelchair was coming off of an L Train and he asked me to help him upstairs, so I said sure. So I took him up the 2 sets of stairs up to Palmetto St.. Hopefully there will be an elevator that will fix this problem, I don't know how its going to work though.
12/27/02
B13- RTS# 8139
Q55- RTS# 9597
Myrtle/Wyckoff will be full ADA access. New station house at street level. Elevators:
street entrance(inside fare control) to L mezz, L platform, M mezz, M platform(s).
Saw this DeNiro classic again last night and was determined to see if there were any buses in it. Lo and behold, there were! Outside Palantine's campaign headquarters, a Flxible New Look in NYCTA blue rolls by. This was filmed in NYC in 1976, so I presume this to be a 7300-series. The scene immediately cuts to inside the HQ, and the Flx magically changes into a blue TA Fishbowl with Bus-O-Ramas.
In a diner scene shortly after, an early model Silver Eagle passes outside, complete with the old-style silver framed windows. Later on, as he dines with Iris, another Batwinged Fish rolls by outside, then another in full view through the window rolls up, and the air brakes go off a few times. Even better, a 1960s model Fishbowl pulls up a few minutes later, complete with green and silver paint, "Live It Up" adds all over the Batwings, letting off passengers and then pulling away!
As if this isn't enough, cut to a night scene; a Fishbowl rolls past Times Square with its Bus-O-Ramas lit. What a great scene this was! I'll bet those winged Fish were a beautiful sight to see around that era. Too bad I was busy with being born...LOL!
-Fred Donaher
The "Coach Potato"
Oh yes, and on a lighter note, I introduced my date to transit earlier that evening; she had never rode a bus before, and she enjoyed the ride so much that we rode two of them. :)
Seems like you're on to something good if you and your date enjoyed your transit rides. When Pam and I started dating, she didn't have a car anyway and was so surprised when I didn't give her a hard time about not having one and relying on public transportation. I still tell her that I sometimes prefer taking a bus or subway rather than driving. So, we take transit quite a bit. Only use the car on weekends for grocery shopping or day trips to places. I know I've found my needle in a haystack!
Sounds like it. I am so overjoyed when I meet women that do not mind transit or even enjoy it; they are quite a refreshing change from those who do not. Remember that Washington Post article? If only there were more women like the ones we know...then the Red Line would be a good thing to more people, and a bus ride would be much more fun.
So, BusTalkers, what do you think? Let's hear your thoughts on this issue....
-F.
In my situation, I cannot drive for a while and she does; my car is ready to go, but time and funds must pass. Even when I'm back on the road, I will use transit to avoid traffic, keep wear off the car, and simply to enjoy a bus ride. I would mostly use the car for long trips and/or things that must be done when the buses aren't running.
-F.
This morning, a multi-alarm fire destroyed a candle factory on Liberty Ave. This was a biggie as fires go.
On the 5 o'clock news, they showed the devastion under control via a copter cam above the scene. To the left, across the street looked like a lot filled with city buses. Was this a storage lot for NYCT ? I know of a storage lot that you see on the LIRR at the East NY station. Is this the same lot ?
Bill "Newkirk"
No it wasnt . The News said it was Georgia and Liberty Ave .
The old B40 route . The Lot u probably saw was the one with all the School buses and Paratransit mini buses . I forgot the companys name , sorry . Some excerpts from NY 1 news >>>>>
The fire began about 9:30 p.m. Thursday at the Old Williamsburg Candle Factory on the corner of Georgia and Liberty Avenues in East New York. It quickly spread, engulfing the entire building. When parts of the building seemed in danger of collapsing, firefighters attacked the flames from the air.
As a precaution, a 15-block section of streets around the factory was closed, including Atlantic Avenue to Blake Avenue, from north to south; and Hinsdale Avenue to Pennsylvania Avenue, west to east.
The Transit Authority also rerouted several buses that pass through the neighborhood. The B12, B20, and B83 buses were all detoured
Yeah, that was a serious fire it went to 5 or 6 alarms real devastating but fortunately no one was really hurt or in there they say it is suspicious. As for the lot near Liberty Av, that is a school bus yard for Consolidated Bus Transit, the storage lot for ENY buses is a little bit north of there.
Since the mall is back to regular hours, I left the house later, than usual, but still enough to see a lot of buses. The first bus I saw was 9307 on the W4, so this means that 9301-9307 is at Southern/Annex and 9308-93XX is at Royal. Next interesting bus seen was 2085, a transplant from Southern to Landover. I believe this bus has caught the same problem I have seen on alot of the 9700s in that the rear route number sign is stuck. It still has A4 on it and I believe the A4 was not the last Southern route it ran on. Anyways onward, passing alot of CNGs, Flxibles, Orions, until I caught up with 4356. It now has a bike rack, but 8855 doesn't, I wonder why. Landover's 8800s have bike racks and so do Southern's 8800s. Montgomery also had rehabbed 8800s with no bike racks, at least when I saw them. That was it, got to work, did work stuff, sold crap.
As I was on my way home, I passed by Landover and it looks like the Neoplans might be on the road soon. Now only three are pressing the gate at Landover, the rest are farther away. Next week might be interesting.
One more note. You know it is Christmas week, when I can drive from Landover,into D.C. to Alexandria, via Landover Road, Rhode Island Avenue, P Street, Dupont Circle, near Georgetown, Pennsylvania Avenue, H Street, 11th Street, Constitution Avenue, 395 south, during morning rush, in only less than an hour. This trip would take at least 1 and a half hours.
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=1875952760&category=6728
Aww, what a shame to see them go. I just saw one in service today at 7th and G outside the Auto Show (I want to say it was 5119 just because I see that one all the time, but it might have been a lower number [5104?] -- I didn't make a mental note).
C
5119 is probably the easiest WMATA MAN to spot since it was the only one that rec'd WMATA's new paint scheme.
Wayne
Like I said in the other post.. 5119 belongs in the Museum Fleet
Wow, only 730 dollars? I wonder if the SEPTA Neoplans sell for that low low price.
i saw 5119 pass by the Convention Center yesterday. Unfortunately my camera was still tucked away within my backpack so I couldn't get a picture of it. I also saw another MAN in the old paint scheme pass by the convention center while i was on the balcony of the convention center hoping to catch some MAN's
GO TERPS!!! 3 more days until a Peach Bowl Victory!!
So what replaces them? New Flyer or NABI artics?
-F.
Neoplans actually! They are arriving fast and furiously. Not sure if any have seen revenue service yet, though. WES has been spotting them at the Landover garage and Wayne and Trevor have seen them at the Bladensburg facility as well. Only 20 were ordered though. : (
Not in service yet but some believe people are being trained on them. There is a 1 to 1 ratio for replacement, although I hope someday we order more. No word as to if some will go to Montgomery, highly unlikely any will go to Northern since it only has NABIs now.
I am highly sure Montgomery will get some, and Bladensburg will get the rest. I believe it will be 10-15 for Bladensburg and about 6-11 for Montgomery. I also highly agree with you that WMATA should buy more, in fact I thought they would have at least purchased about 70, if not more, is that an over estimate or what. I also hope they keep the artic order high floors instead of low floors, even though some low floors wouldn't be a problem.
Yeah...high floors are better for capacity. Also, New Flyer is discontinuing their HF model; it's all LF from here on out.
-F.
To update a little more, they might be heading out within a week or so. There is only one by the gate, when I past by Landover tonight (5315). I don't know when they will leave for their respective garages, but any DC busfans who want to take pics of the MANNs do it by this week, because next week, you might be seeing Neoplans back on DC streets.
"Fast and Furious"ly, eh? So they are Neoplan Type "R"? Or do they have 20" rims with low-profile tires and spoiler kits? Maybe a crown on the dashboard? Big oil can-size Monza exhaust tips? Let's hope they don't run under tractor-trailers and send Dodge Chargers flipping over in the air at the end...LOL!
-The "Flx" And The Furious
Ha! They also have a spoiler and an awesome sound system that blasts through all 60'!
When Westchester County DOT (NY) replaced their 1983 MAN artics, they were looking for $1,000 each. They were stored in Yorktown and Valhalla for severasl months, then NIMCO began to remove them via tow trucks. They were all driven to the storage facilities after being removed from service. I am happy to see them go. They never had heat or A/C when either was needed and frequently overheated in the summer time. Don't know what WCDOT eventually received in $$$ for them.
That bus had it's good days! All I can say is that #5119 belongs in the Museum Fleet
Now THAT is one for the Historic Fleet. Also, I have some MAN bus models and considered making an artic in WMATA colors...
-F.
Did some bus depot visiting today. At MTA LI Bus (Mitchell Field Depot), o/s Orion CNG's: 132, 147, 177, 204 & 216. All these probably need substantial work to get them back on the road. All have roof (CNG) hatches and side panels missing to various degrees. It should be noted that it's no big deal to reinstall these, however to get them running could be another matter in accordance to what the various mechanical problems are with each individual bus......Continuing with LI Bus, we saw some Gilligs: 579, 581, 589, and 592 have fareboxes, presumably these can run in an emergency. The following Gilligs have their fareboxes removed, so must be considered o/s: 503, 530, 548, 582, 583, 585, 586, 588, 592, 593, 594, 595, 597 & 599. The following LI Bus diesel Orions appear to be o/s: 604 & 606.......Over at Green Bus, 1165 is in the lot across the depot on Farmers Blvd., o/s with collision damage. Has a tarp on the lower front under the window. 1165 could be totaled....Jamaica Bus still has 2 fishbowls on the property: 915 is stripped, while 3001 is alive and well, apparently used for special company business. Finally, Jamaica Bus has 11 Triboro RTS's stored, one looks worse than the other! We were only able to get 7 out of the 11: 658, 664, 666, 675, 700, 708, and 715. It should be noted that I have seen other "TCC's" at Jamaica Bus in the past and most have eventually have made it back on to the road.
Triboro, Jamaica and Green are all owned by the Cooper family and Command is a subsidiary of Green. So to move equipment around would not be surprising.
JAM # 3001 is a Cooper family owned bus, not a NYC DOT bus. It is a suburban configuration (no back door) and is used for special events, not revenue service. According to production lists at OMOT.org it was first in service by REX Bus Lines of NJ. IIRC the number was 138.
Did you get pics of 915? Don't know where that bus was hiding all these years.
[The following Gilligs have their fareboxes removed, so must be considered o/s: 503, 530, 548, 582, 583, 585, 586, 588, 592, 593, 594, 595, 597 & 599. The following LI Bus diesel Orions appear to be o/s: 604 & 606]
If I remember correctly, the 1988 Gilligs only went as high as #561. The 1990 Orion V Diesels began at #579. Thus, most of the buses you mention are Orion's.
OOPS! LIB's Numbers are right, I mis-spoke on my Orions vs. Gilligs!
If you are able, try to visit the QSC depot. I understand that about 7 MCI Classics are parked "against the wall". They need extensive work and it may not be worth the $$$ to repair them. Don't know the numbers. Don't know if NYCDOT has made a decesion, although they are always so slow with decesions.
Here's a question I pose to all of the Bustalkers here...
Have any of you played many transit operations type games, and which do you find to be the best? What are your own gripes concerning these games? Here are my own thoughts...
Traffic Giant seems to be the most versatile, allowing you to plan bus and rail routes through a bunch of pre-programmed metropoli. The focus here is on making the systems function well from the standpoint of carrying people efficiently while reducing congestion. Overall, I'd have to say it's the best Transit Sim, despite lacking a true light rail mode (streets to p/r/w) or a peak travel cycle. I'd love to see it enhanced and followed up upon.
Bahn is one that I've never played much, as I can't seem to figure it out all that well. Someday, I might take the time to try to decipher it.
Railroad Tycoon II offers a nice transportation sim, though its city transit "light rail" scenario has a lot of compromises, with your light rail trains being headed by electric locomotives, and your riders being cordoned off into cars according to their destination (residential, commercial, etc...). I still do like the main game though (the gameplay dynamic is very deep!), particularly the nicely rendered locomotives that age and become obsolete, and the passing of years.
Sim City allows a decent amount of rail planning but only allows you to place "Bus Depots" about town, from which one can only assume the buses wander the streets like Taxi Cabs. Sim City 4 is coming soon, but doesn't seem to improve on this concession, though it does seem to offer many other gameplay and graphical improvements.
A-Train is an old school sim, but I've never gotten it to work properly on my machine. It seems to have gotten some good reviews however.
Does anyone know if any other transit related games are forthcoming, whether planning or driving?
BAHN is not really a "game" per se. It is a program with which you can lay out any real or fictional transit system, route the trains, and hope they all work. All they will do then is go back and forth on their assigned routings per the schedule you set. There IS a lot of NYCTA equipment available, but it is very crude looking.
I used to dabble with it, but then got tired of it. It was a challenge at first, but then it was always the same thing,no matter which system I'd work on.
And then I sent the author a donation to cover the shareware fees....and after that started getting nastygrams saying Ineed to pay up! Whether his bookkeeping was sloppy or the postal services swiped the donation, I dunno -- but MY conscience is clear.
I'll have to say BVE and Midtown Madness 2, although Midtown Madness 2 isnt really a transit game, it allows me to drive add-on transit busses in a 3d replica of San Francisco and London. BVE is a cab-view train simulator game where routes for various TA's including nycta subway routes are available.
yeah transit giant is great except to the peak hour cycle and lightrail p/r/w, and I have Midtown Madness where one can drive a FlixTS - if you look closely, it's a Chicago Flxible and a Chicago RTS melded together, lol. It doesn't even have a door, though. I don't know what type of bus Midtown Madness 2 uses, though.
Actually to me the back of the Midtown bus looked more like a Flyer or AMG. I'd love to hear the reasoning behind the Microsoft programmers creating this "frankenbus."
In MM2 (or is it MM, I can't recall), I've seen a few different downloadable buses, most notably was a very well rendered Novabus LFS, in MUNI colors, as well as in SEPTA, CTA, and NYC MTA schemes as well. I think the game also has a Double Decker available as well.
wow, really? where do you get this download?
I can't remember where I got it, but I still do have the files in my PC. One is 6mb and the other is 4.9mb, so I could email them to you, but I'm not sure if Yahoo will accept such large attachments. If you have another email address that will work better, email me using the top of this reply, and I'll get the files to ya.
oh, okay, cool. Thanks very much.
The files are coming to you (@aol) as I write this, but be patient - I've got dial-up, so they're going about as as fast as an overloaded 6V71 fishbowl heading up a steep hill with the AC on.
oh, okay. Thank you!
Microsoft Train Sim is a pretty good game but it does get boring. It does not support subway lines that well.
BVE is the best sim when it comes down to NYCTA Routes.
Ultimate Trainz/Trainz is good game. It is more like a Model Railroad Sim but it is really fun.
Some BVE Wbsites for NYCTA Routes are:
http://www.crotrainz.com/
http://www.trainsimcentral.co.uk/
http://groups.msn.com/NYCTABVERoutes/_homepage.msnw?pgmarket=en-us
http://darkdefender187.tripod.com/nycta.html
http://www.vince-black.me.cz/Depot/USA/NYCTA/NYCTA.htm
I've been toying with the idea of getting Trainz, as it sure does look good, but I seem to be afraid that it will be...
a> something that I'll wind up losing interest in eventually, like Train Sim, or
b> something that I'll get obsessed in, and find I don't have as much time as I'd like to play, and wind up going to work dead tired daily from staying up at night playing it.
I'd prefer for it to be (B), but I'd love to hear any other insights you have on the game...
While this is not a transit sim but you can build you own vehical put your sounds in it a program the engine etc and make a vehical such as a bus.
The default bus in the game is pretty horrible. However, I've downloaded user-made add-on busses which are much more accurate and fun to drive, such as a D40Lf, RTS, Vanhools, etc.
1) What does BVE stand for? Where can you get it?
2) How can you get Traffic Giant, Bdway?
While I don't know too much about BVE availability, I'm pretty sure you can Google on "BVE SIMULATOR" to find it easily.
Traffic Giant was in stores, but now is harder to find there. It does show up on ebay regularly, and a check shows one available for sale...
EBAY AUCTION
If you'd like some more info on Traffic Giant, feel free to check out a page I made on it last year, based on the UK Version. The US Version available in the auction is admittedly nicer, with more refreshing tile sets.
My Traffic Giant Page
Traffic giant is available thru amazon.co.uk (UK Version) and thru direct order from the developer jowood.com (All Versions)
What about Old School? This allows you to drive or ride around in New Look GMCs or Flxibles, and possibly a Grumman. You get your choice of drivetrains (both modern and classic) just for kicks. Imagine a Fishbowl with an M-11 and a Voith combo riding down the way!
-F.
Really, I'd *LOVE* to see a transit game come out that combined Traffic Giant and Railroad Tycoon II, sort of like RRTII with a transit emphasis.
Thus, you'd get the historical perspective of transit development in cities over the last 100 years or so, while buying and running the vehicles of your youth through systems that you design.
As to operating them, if only I had the skills and time, I just wish that I could make a Flxible New Look bus for Midtown Madness; it'd definitely have an 8V71 with a VS tranny with Overdrive.
I like your review of Traffic Giant. I can't find the one that I have, but I'm sure it will turn up soon. Its fun to build your own transit system and see what happens. The worst ridership for me was when I had a line go over to the amusement park. I guess people don't take transit to parks? Whatever!
It would be cool to see a tycoon type of transit system. Set the fares like Traffic Giant and see what kind of system you can build. Traffic Giant just got boring after awhile because it was just never ending and when you have an accident, forget it, it messes up the whole thing.
I haven't played Midtown Madness in ages. The RTS buses are just like the CTA RTS that used to have the rear window. Even though they look like the back windows of a Flx New Look.
LOL...how neat it must be to see rear windows in an RTS. There is some video game out there where you can run a GM Fishbowl; it is a blue and grey bus with some kind of funky Mercedes-style wheels on it, and most of them have a hint of an A/C unit. Basically, you wreck into what you want, and steal it. What a game!
-F.
Yeah, I rode one of those RTS's in Chicago a few years ago before they refitted them with the air conditioning units. I was sad to see them retrofitted when I went to Chicago earlier this year. : (
That game with the Fishbowl sounds great! Any game that has wrecking into things is my cup of tea. : )
The ones I have photos of were the 1979 WMATA units; the pics are from 1980, so they are still slopebacks at that point.
Also, yeah...you've gotta love wrecking into stuff. Awful shame to do that to a Fishbowl though!
-F.
Yes, what a concept. I'd LOVE to design a transit game where your create a TA that runs the vehicles you grew up with. Mine would have the following:
-Valley Metro (Roanoke, VA) 1976 Flxible New Look 45096 (6v71/V730)
-""""""""""""""""""""""""" 1979 Grumman Flxible 870 35' """""""""
-Blacksburg Transit (VA) 1986-87 Flxible Metro 35' & 40' """""""""
-PenTran (Hampton, VA) 1976 Flxible New Look 53096 (8v71/V730)
-Valley Metro (Roanoke, VA) 1991 Gillig Phantom 35' (6v92/HT748)
-'''''''''''''''''''''''''' 1994 '''''''''''''''''' (S50/Allison 5spd)
-'''''''''''''''''''''''''' 2001 '''''''''''''''''' (L-10/Voith)
-'''''''''''''''''''''''''' 2001 Thomas SLF 235 (ISB/Allison)
And maybe for kicks, a few Blacksburg Transit RTS T70-206 and T80-206.
I especially like your idea of the Flx New Look with 8v71. What would you run at your TA?
-F.
Which SEPTA paint scheme do you like? I`m gonna list all of the paint schemes since 1969, tell me which one do you like.
1)Tan and White (used only on Fishbolws. Old looks, trolleys, and trackless trolleys kept their PTC colors)
2)Tan, white, with maroon stripe (Fishbowls had a wider stripe than the Flxibles)
3)Red, white, blue (Wide stripe-1977 to 84 on all New Looks, rebuilt PCC's, First scheme on Kawasaki cars, and AMG Trolleys)
4)Red, white, blue (Narrow stripe- RTS's, Neoplans, Volvos/ 1980-96)
#4 scheme was applied to some New Looks/Second scheme on Kawasaki and AMG trolleys. Most AMG's had the black trim around the windows.
5)Same as #4, but without the black around the windows (Neoplans-Volvos, later scheme on the AMG's)
6)The NABI scheme with the black trim on the windows (unrehabbed NABI's) or without the black trim (On everything else, including the rehabbed NABI's)
7)Let's not forget the "Gulf Oil" scheme on the PCC's in the 70's (1971-82)
#7 is one of my personal favorites. I thought it looked great on those PCC's. I wonder what it might have looked like on a new look bus!
I always liked the wide striped Red White and Blue Scheme. Despite being a mostly white scheme, the wide striping on the sides did a lot to bring a sharp look to what was generally a rather simple paint scheme.
Speaking of PCC Schemes, I have to say that I did really like the look of the Bicentennial 2200 Series PCC cars *WHEN* they were reasonably newly painted. The paint on these cars sadly did not age well.
I loved the #6 scheme, with the NABIs in black trim. I thought it was the coolest thing around- then SEPTA had to take the dark trim off them. Ugh, now they are so boring-they have no identity. Also, the trim for #4 was grey, not black.
I feel the same way you do. I hated when then black trim around the windows went
"bye-bye" . The all-white looks too plain.
Chuck Greene
#5 is the best for me i grow up with that Sceme. And i love it. And back in the day it did'nt have no ads cover it up!:)
Yeah, that was a cool scheme too. I grew up with #4 and #5-both were awesome, but 5 looked great on the Neoplans. I think every scheme looked good on them, now that I think abuot it.
This thread is not being started to raise tempers and such, so I thought I'd better mention that first. Just thought it might be interesting to start a dialogue and see if others have noticed the same thing that I have.
But in looking at myself, as well as patterns of many other bus fans out there, I've noticed an interesting tendency among lots of us to pay only modest attention to a particular fleet/series of buses, until that series' numbers have dwindled, and the remaining few coaches are few and far between, when we lavish considerable attention upon these buses, trying to get every shot we can of them, and get every keepsake of such buses before they are retired.
I first got into shooting Transit photography in 1989, when the thought came to me that our Baltimore New Look fleet was nearing the end of its career. I sought out every photo I could muster of the remaining fleet, while largely ignoring the RTS and Flxible Metro fleets then providing the bulk of the service.
Then, when the New Looks were retired here in '92, I knew that I could take a quick cheap MARC ride to DC to still see GMs and Flxibles providing base service there on weekdays, but only occasionally got up the energy to go there, and being pretty passive in my shooting. However, by the end of the decade, when the DC numbers had dwindled, I found myself making much more frequent voyages to DC to scout about the rail stations to get some last shots of the few remaining soldiers.
Now, I'm noticing a great deal of extra attention focused on DC's soldier MAN Artics, as their final days draw perilously close.
And if we look back several decades ago, we'll notice that a significant amount of streetcar photos were taken in the very closing days of those operations.
Has anyone else noticed this "Death Bed" mentality, and admits to being guilty of following it to some degree. I must confess that I largely am.
Yeah, I agree. I think its one of those things you take for granted, just like anything in life. If you have easy access to something, then you figure its just going to be there, then one day its gone.
I guess since these buses are around for so long, it becomes a part of you. I mean, I grew up with the Fishbowls, Flx New Looks and AMG's here in DC, now they're gone. I feel so old when I think back of when I was a kid riding these buses and they aren't here anymore. Same thing with the MAN's. I remember going to my middle school on the school bus back in 1983 and seeing a MAN drive by us on the old R8 (Calverton/Fort Totten Line) and seeing my mom on it going to work. Now, those buses are out of here real soon.
I suppose its a last chance to relive some good memories. But, the great thing is we have nice new buses running around and we should take full advantage of them, whether we like them or not, since nobody on here to my knowledge actually has a say in what bus an agency can buy.
Yeah. when i was younger, I used to always want to ride the new train/bus. One bad thing was that by the time I rode the new train, I'd never ride an old one on that line forever (this happened on SEPTA's route 100 and Market Frankford Line El). Now, I'm complaining how there aren't any new flyers anywhere near us, but I'm more appreciative of my precious Neoplans, the buses I grew up with. Hehe, now that I know they are going to be replaced very soon, I mainly want to ride them, lol.
Man, I haven't ridden a MAN bus in a very long time. When the NABIs came in, I never saw them that much. All I know now is that whenever I'm out riding metro, I only want a MAN bus or a Flxible, especially a Metro D, which I only rode once.
Yeah, I couldn't wait to ride the 'brand new buses' as I used to call it when I was younger. It never would occur to me then that some day, those relics would be longed for as they are being phased out.
I also love the roll signs for destination signs as opposed to electronic ones. I always loved watching them scroll when a bus was switching routes. There were some bizarre ones that I could remember on the WMATA buses. I wish I remembered them all. I do know that sometimes when I was waiting for the Calverton bus at Fort Totten, the driver would stop when it was on "Calvert Bridge" instead. Many times, they just gave up and left it on the blank space.
Oh yea, I remember calling them new buses too instead of calling them by their proper name, when I was younger. When we saw a new bus approaching, we would say look there goes the "new bus" and not hey there goes the new RTS.
I kind of like the roll signs, which was interesting on the F14. Most roll signs said simply "CARROLLTON", with a few saying "NEW CARROLLTON" layered. At first when I saw the first electronic signs I thought they were cool, and even now with the orange signs, I still kind of think they were cool, but the roll ones were cooler. The Gilligs were the last WMATA buses to come with roll signs, before they were changed over to electronic signs in 2000.
Wow, it must be crazy, out living a bus series- seeing them new and then seeing them leave. Luckily, that never happened to me- the NABIs SEPTA has may be the first ones.
What was more impressive was that WMATA's GM New Looks outlasted the AMGs, the 40' Neoplans, the 5000 series MANNs and were retired with the RTSs, and Gillig Phantoms and some of the 5100 series MANNs.
...and that these ranks of long lasting coaches even included GM New Looks dating back to 1963 as well!
Well. When I was starting life out back when I lived in Highland Ave just a block north of Hillside(Where the BUSES Are!) I used to see alot of MTA GM New Looks and GM RTS's. LIBus Flx 870's,Gilligs,And a GM New Look. Then,When my family moved to where I at now at Kew Gardens(Since 1989),I relly grew up with Green Lines and MTA Buses. The Green Line Buses where the GM RTS Ex Slopebacks,GM RTS Squareback,Flx 870,and MCI Classics and also Jamaica Buses Flx 870 and MCI Classics. MTA is GM New Look GM RTS and TMC RTS.
I only rode the Green Lines Flx 870's a few times on the Q60 and the last time I rode one was back in about 1992 I think and the Old GM RTS the last time I rode that was in 2000. It was 1009 on Q60.
The Buses I relly like back I was little at GBL was 1979 GM RTS,Flx 870,and MCI Classic.
And oh yea! I do rember seeing Triboro Coach Buses on the Q23 Line back in 1989. They where Mostly RTS's and Flx 870's
I haven't noticed it as such, but for myself, I will miss the Flxible bus once it fades into the sunset. Its days are sorely numbered.
wayne
I think you hit the head right on the head in more ways than one. Not only am I trying to take pics of buses heading for the bus grave, I am trying to ride them. I have already rode a MANN, and a Gillig for Ride On, I am trying to ride a Baltimore 8500 and 8600 series Flxible and trying to ride an Orion One for DASH and Fairfax Connector. Except for the Baltimore buses, I have ridden the other buses before, liking the Orion One for DASH the best. They have some DAMN good Cummins engines.
Oh, I would love to ride an Orion I again on Ride On. When those buses were brand new, I got to sit in the drivers seat of one as a child. It was a moment to be treasured forever. Also the time I sat in the drivers seat of a SEPTA Neoplan AN440A. It was great.
The Orion 1s are still running strong for Ride On with their last batch being 30 footers arriving in 1992. To my knowledge none of that series 5500-5545 have been retired yet. The DASH Orion Ones might be on their last legs and so may be Fairfax Connector's. The only other two systems with Orion 1s in our area are Cue and Howard County Transit.
You still can! The Orion I is always the bus to show up at the Montgomery County Fair in August. I have never seen a different type of bus. And you can still sit in it:
The exterior shots were taken after the Ride-On "booth" was done for the night.
I don't think the Ride-On Gilligs are going anywhere anytime soon, except maybe the 5300s.
I should have been exact in saying the 30' 5300s. The 35 footers will be running for a long while.
That the main reason I went to NYC this weeekend. I went to ride NYBS' GMDD T9H-5308A fishbowls as they may be gone forever in a matter of days.
Wayne
I agree with others that the tendencies you describe are human nature. The toughest part is when the buses you grew up with as a kid are retired. I'm old enough now to have seen the 'new' buses that replaced some of my favorites be retired themselves. Once you lose your childhood favorites, it's not as big a deal when other vehicles of more recent vintage are retired. Myself, I can't get all that upset when RTS's and Flxible Metros go to the scrapper. Don't get me wrong - I like them, and I've gone to considerable effort to photograph and ride these buses. But to a certain extent, they're 'just another bus' - they'll never be as special to me as the GMC or Flxible New Looks of my youth.
JD
You basically summarize my exact feelings on the issue there.
I too found the last days of the GM and FLX New Looks to be a rather dismal era here, but I'd make the best of it. Back in '91-'92, I'd get up an hour early and take a crosstown 33 across to the radial 3 so as to get 2 guaranteed New Look rides in a commute to work, instead of merely jumping on my neighborhood radial and having a 50/50 chance of getting one.
Were I still commuting the same way today, I'd never do the same to manage 2 rides on 85 and 8600s. Perhaps its because now I've driven them so often that I've gotten my fill of them, but I seem to think that nothing that will ever be created now will ever be as special or intriguing to me as those New Look buses.
I have to admit that I find it pretty interesting that upon coming to the Baltimore MTA in '94, I've driven coaches that I remember being thrilled about seeing entering service when I was only 11 years old (the '82 Grummans), but I still have dreams that I walk onto the property one day to find a handful of New Looks available to be driven. I wish I'd never missed that opportunity.
As the old song goes... "Born, Too Late!..."
I have to agree. While I was a huge Flxible fan growing up, I paid less attention to our New Looks and Grummans when I got my license. Then, one day, looking out on Main Street, they were gone. One day, you saw Flxes running up and down the routes, and the next day, they were drab new Gilligs with no imagination. What a shock that was.
-F.
Does anyone have any new information on the replacement of the Flixibles? Would they order enough buses from NeoPlan or whoever to replace both series of buses or just the Metro B series??
The Flxible Metro D fleet still has at least 3-4 years left in them; many of them have just gone through the overhaul process. The only Flxibles that are being replaced are the Metro Bs.
Neoplan is the likely candidate for the Metro B replacement simply because, now that the RTS is dead, no one else makes a 96-inch 40-foot transit/suburban bus, which NJT needs to get through the Holland Tunnel (same reason they ordered the D4000N from MCI). Neoplan would also benefit by having won the artic bid, and thus NJT will have some familiarity and parts stock with the Transliner series. Successful showings by the artics and the Metro B replacements (if they get that order) would likely give Neoplan the lead for the Metro D replacements in 2007 or 2008. That would give NJT almost as many Neoplans as RTSes, and for a TA the size of NJT, standardization is a plus in keeping operating costs down.
QUESTION: How can you tell the "Square" Flxibles apart? Let's say I see a Flxible- How do I know if it a Metro B or a Metro D or any other Metro Series ( A or C ?)
Metro B series are numbered 30xx-3605 for the suburbans and 1700-1721 for the transit style. The Metro-D series are 175x-19xx for the transit style and 3700'S for the surbans. Also the 37xx have only one door. The d series also have a rear dest. sign.
Troy
Fairview garage
Can't they have went with Neoplan Metroliners instead of MCI D4000/D4500's?
I really do love the old red, white, blue, and grey Metrobus scheme. It does seem a bit dated, especially when they were on the Orion V's, but the new paint scheme just seems to cheaply done. It looked like more care and effort was put into the red/white/blue/grey scheme.
I have seen DC Transit buses before, but I don't remember whether they had an olive green or an orange paint scheme to them.
Also, I do remember seeing the old white Ride-On paint scheme on the TMC Citycruisers with the single door (kind of like the Fairfax County CUE bus system).
If anyone would like to elaborate on this topic feel free to do so.
GO TERPS!!!
I think the orange paint scheme were on one of the private bus company's paint scheme before they were purchased by WMATA. I remember the 1000s and 1100s series new looks with them, that were just bought by Virginia for use on the Shirley Highway routes. I barely remember the old private's paint scheme, as the privates were bought by WMATA when I was born. If anyone has seen or bought the buses video bought by the History Channel, they show a new look and an old look just bought by WMATA with the WMATA logo plastered to the side with their private paint scheme. I think these buses were D.C. Transit.
Which buses in the 70 use to say Civic Center? These are the original fishbowl buses.
1. If by "which buses," the questioner means "which vehicles," then any vehicles assigned to Flatbush Depot at the time would have carried signs with a "Civic Center" reading. Probably Fresh Pond's would have as well.
2. If by "which buses," the questioner means "which routes," then the B26, B38, B41, and B52 seem to qualify.
Did I miss any vehicles and/or routes?
David
I seem to recall seeing at least one bus with a "B45 Civic Center" reading, so maybe East New York should be included.
The following routes had "Civic Center" on them
B-26,B-38,B-41,B-45, and B-52
I know because i went to LIU in Downtown Brooklyn
Thank You
1) Do their fare boxes accept dollar coins or bills ?
2) Does the S-92 charge zone fares for its long run like the old days, or is it simply the base fare ?
Thier fare boxes do accept dollar bills,not sure about dollar coins or about this S92 zone fare you speak of.
All Suffolk Transit routes have a flat base fare of $1.50.
Also forgot to mention they do accept dollar bills as well as the Susan B. Anthony and gold dollar coins.
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OK, now that we are talking about paint schemes on transit vehiches, which of the NYC paint schemes do you like?
1)2 tone green [old looks]
2)Green [new looks]
3)2 tone blue
4)dark blue and white
5)The current blue and white scheme
6)LI bus paint scheme [blue & orange stripe on white]
The two tone blue is tops for me, with the two tone green a close second.
I prefer the green or 2-tone-blue fishbowls, particularly with the rooftop blisters (for hiding radio equipment). Best of all were the GREEN buses with BLUE blisters!!
#5 the current blue and white scheme. Man it was attractive on the GM Blitzes in particular, but overall its a nice scheme on the buses today and it makes them attractive on the exterior.
I think the present livery is the best looking on the present fleet. It is hard to imagine what it would have looked like on the old look busses of the 50s, but that was then and this is now. The old looks looked great in 2-tone green (especially the Macks). Were any old looks ever painted 2-tone blue? It seems to me that some of the Nassau (former Bee-Line) old looks turned blue in their old age, but that was a long time ago. But the present generation of RTS, Orions and New Flyers look great.
<< Were any old looks ever painted 2-tone blue? >>
None that I saw. The Old Looks were gone by 1972, which is around the time the 2-tone blue got started.
The 2-tone blue is my favorite, I remember the first time I saw a 6000-series fishbowl in the new color scheme, it was at night and I thought I had dreamed it at first until I saw one in the daytime (I was living in Illinois at the time, but had come back to NYC for Easter break)
Old looks painted two-tone blue?
YES!!!!
I have a photo of one at Metropolitan Suburban Bus Authority out in Nassau County! It shocked me to see it....but it does have the MSBA orange separation stripe between the blues.
The NYCTA old looks were retired in 1973 with the arrival of the 6200/6300 new looks. The old looks were around for a year or so during the blue repainting but none of the NYCTA old looks that I know of were done up in blue. I have a pic that I got from online of a MSBA old look in two tone blue as Steve had mentioned. The one I have was taken on Hillside Ave. in Jamaica. BTW, I don’t recall any of the TA’s original new look fleet 1-190 being repainted to blue as well. Can anyone correct me on this?
That's probably the samepicture I've seen of the MSBA old look, yes it was on Hillside Avenue.
I concur about the 1-190 series not getting any two-tone blue paint jobs -- I don't think any of the 501-up series got them either. The lowest numbers I've seen in two-tone blue were the 2000's.
Some of the 501-1000's did get the blue paint job. 1112 was the first blue bus I saw out of FP, 699 was the second. An oddity about 1112 was that the bottom of the doors didn’t get painted as the rest of the blue buses had. Also check some of the bus pictures at this website under NYC Buses, Joe Testagrose’s collection. 699 is shown on the M15 as also 715. I also remember some of the 1000's getting the white/blue stripe scheme towards the end of their career. I no longer have my notes of which buses got repainted but I also remember seeing I think 1105 repainted in Brooklyn after its FP days.
Thanks for the info, never did see any of those shots.
1081 and 1093 actually rec'd the White/Blue color scheme. I don't know if they were ever in two-tone blue.
Wayne
Probably not because they went from the NYCTA to the MSBA then back to the NYCTA(were these buses 1057,1060,1081 and 1093 ever painted in the blue and orange MSBA like the 7000 & 7500 Flxibles the TA gave to MSBA in mid/late 80's.
[were these buses 1057,1060,1081 and 1093 ever painted in the blue and orange MSBA like the 7000 & 7500 Flxibles the TA gave to MSBA in mid/late 80's]
MSBA received 10 buses from NYCT in that series. They were numbered 571-580 and did have the MSBA two-tone blue with orange stripe before they entered service.
[Old looks painted two-tone blue? YES!!!! I have a photo of one at Metropolitan Suburban Bus Authority out in Nassau County! It shocked me to see it....but it does have the MSBA orange separation stripe between the blues.]
If I remember correctly, MSBA (formerly Bee Line) bus #619 was the only old-look bus that received the two-tone blue and orange stripe treatment. As others have posted, no NYCT old look received two-tone blue treatment, but I believe at least one of the 1-190 new looks did get blue paint.
I liked the green of the fishbowls with the Script New York City Transit Authority lettering. Second place was the 5th Ave Coach line buses in their shade of green which MaBSTOA ran immediately after the takeover. Those bsues had MABSTOA spelled out in the same script letters as NYCTA used.
I actually have that lettering as a font for the computer...it's called "Chesapeake".
You can get it from railfonts.com
Thank you Steve! I placed an order. You'll be seeing the font on Stationreporter.net
What is the color for "NYCTA Dark Green" and "Fifth Avenue Coach Light Green" as well as current "MTA Blue" if you have the computer value even better
Sorry I don't have that info...but the old dark green was actually a metallic color. I did notice that it varied from factory to NYCTA repaints too.
#3 is definitely my choice. That scheme was hot back in the 80s.
I think paint schemes define eras. When I think of NYC in the 1970's, I think of two-tone blue New Look buses and yellow Checker cabs. Likewise, I believe that the white and blue RTS bus has become an NYC institution in the 1990's and 2000's (so far).
The two-tone blue was classic, especiually on GMC's with 'batwings'. I really like the modern scheme for the RTS and newer buses, but I didn't care for it too much on the repainted and rehabbed New Looks.
JD
Tell me I'm having a bad dream - I saw this on TV, not sure if News12 or local channel, but says that Long Island Bus (Nassau) is planning to cut service and one of the routes to be eliminated is the N6?
Are they serious? How can they eliminate a major trunk route like the N6?
wayne
Nope, its the Nassau hub shuttle, JFK Flyer, and PM N6 limited runs.
And also about 90% of the N6 Limited in the AM would still run but would start/end at 179 St Subway
You heard incorrectly,only the PM Limited run's will be eliminated and those ex-limited's will start/end at 179St station. Also to be eliminated is the N91-JFK Flyer and the N90,93 Nassau Hub Shuttle.
There will be one new addition and that'll be the N43 Freeport-Roosevelt Field. By the way,does anyone know the actual routing that the 43 is gonna have? These service changes,plus schedule adjustment's will be effective 1/5/03.So hop on a Hub Shuttle or on the JFK Flyer because next weekend they won't be around any longer.
I don't live on LI but they can't get rid of the N6, it is one of their main lines, has the best frequency 7 days a week and the only line that runs 24 hours. The JFK Flyer (N91) and the Nassau Hub shuttle (N90, N93) AFAIK is getting cancelled. BTW are they going to ever put a new format [like on NYCT bus maps] for LI Bus maps? They really should, and it needs updations more often, I STILL have a 1994 map and when I wrote a letter for one, they didn't have any :-\.
Was the JFK FLyer getting regular 40 foot buses or some school bus looking thing with luggage racks ?
Who was subsidizing it all this time ? I didn't think it was coming out of MSBA's general subsidy.
The JFK Flyer had those school bus like buses. As for who subsidized it, I don't think LI Bus subsidizied it fully also but then again I really don't know the answer to your second question.
They stopped using both the Orion 2 and the Thomas Cityliners on the JFK Flyer when the new Orion 5 's arrived earlier this year. Both the JFK Flyer and the Hub shuttle were partially funded by external sources. (The JFK Flyer with a grant from the Port Authority of New York and New Jersey and Hub shuttle by the major businesses along the route.
Makes sense. The one time I rode the JFK flyer, there were only 3 of us on the "bus" leaving the airport. Most of the ridership (and not too much at that!) was picked up once we left the facility.
Yeah whenver I took it there was never actually getting on or off at the main terminal with me. Max amt of ppl I saw on a JFK Flyer would have to be 3 or 4.
Now that the economy is in the toilet, businesses say they cant afford paying for the HUB shuttle, and the PA has already taken many budget hits.
I never rode the JFK Flyer that much, as it was a pretty long trip from Hempstead (perhaps it would've suceeded if they ran it along Sunrise Hwy instead of the slower Merrick road way).
Never rode the HUB shuttle much either, as I usually only went to Roosevelt Field, and not the dull Source Mall.
Ok I think I saw bus 413 operating on the Bx29. I am not sure. HAs anyone seen this bus?
AMTRAK MODELIN'
Gun Hill does have Orion V's. They have 402, 403 and 405-412. 413 last time I saw was in Amesterdam.
I just got the DVD of "SPEED". It's really worth owning as the
second disc they give you has all the techs on the stunts, including the "bus jump" and the Metrorail crash. Simply awesome!
Chuck Greene
I'm pleased to announce the opening of my new Yahoo! group--BUS-O-RAMA ! This for all of the bus fans to post their pictures, start discussions on buses and bus issues.
If you want to join, copy and paste this link:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/BUS-O-RAMA
Thanks
Mdlbigcat@comcast.net
Mark De Loatch
When I went check out the site -Yahoo said it didn't exsist
When I went to check out the site -Yahoo said it didn't exsist
Try again! I copied and pasted the link, and it took me right to the site.
Started from Flushing-with the Q44(non repowered yet)-and connected to a Q88. Be warned about #616 if you sit in the front 2 seats, you can feel the springs underneath it. Switched from the Q88 to the N24-went to Mineola,connected to another N24 to Roosevelt Field. From Roosevelt Field, connected to the N22 to the N94 at Hicksville. Did see #659 on the N35 route and noticed #8977 on my connection from the Q44 to the Q88 route-nice paint job.
Q44-#529-Orion V
Q88-#616-Orion V Suburban
N24-#318-Orion V CNG
N24-#630-Orion V
N22-#600-Orion V
N94-#168-Orion V CNG
Yes, 659 is back at Mitchell. Ive been seeing it on the N27 recently.
LI Bus is making major route changes beginning 1/5/03. They niclude the following:
N6-Limited pm trip cancelled. Some trips will start at 179th St.
N43-NEW SERVICE-7 day.
N79-added trips Saturday and Sunday night.
N90/N91-CANCELLED.
N93-3 trips left during weekdays,no service sundays.
Service changes to occur on the N1,N2,N3,N4,N16,N17,N19,N20,N23,N25,N27,N35,N40/41,N45,N51,N54/55,N58,N65/66 (?),N81.
new timetables avaible 12/30/02.
Now all they need is a new map!!
And change the format, get it in the format used for NYCT bus maps.
new schedules avalable tommorow? Then how come I was able to pick up a new N4 schedule on the bus dated 1/5/03? Sounds to me like they're out earlier than you think.
So, if anyone noticed about theese changes, one of the routes to be discontinued is the N91 (a.k.a. the JFK Flyer), which will go down in ashes and be a distant memory much like the old Culture Bus Loops that NYCT had in the 60's and early 70's.
LI Bus still hasn't posted the schedules for the new N43 online -- don't know if they're available anywhere in hard copy (Hempstead? -- but the line isn't supposed to go through the Hempstead Terminal; maybe on board the N40/41 and N45's?).
I guess they aren't really expecting a whole lot of ridership early on...
CG
For those of you who don't cross over on a regular basis, here is the following message I just posted on SubTalk.
Due to popular demand:
A second SubTalkDC trip is in the tentative planning stages. I have done some calendar work and am free to lead a trip on one of the following Saturdays:
April 5
April 12
April 26
Sunday, April 6 is also a possibility but Saturday's have slightly more frequent service.
The April 5th date is during the Cherry Blossom Festival, so the Cherry Blossoms SHOULD be in bloom, but I won't make any guarentees.
I am planning this trip to be a combination of MetroRail and MetroBus in order to cover as much ground as possible. This trip will serve as a compliment to the SubTalk DC Trip that took place on April 21, 2000. My hope is that we will go to the stations we did not go to on the first trip. This way, someone who attended both trips will have been on the entire system at one time or another. Of course, if you attended in 2000, you are not required to come again and if you didn't attend in 2000, you are more than welcome this time around.
Also, if the blossoms are out, we will make time to walk around the Tidal Basin. Unless you wish to part from the group, pedal boating will not be available due to the long lines.
The trip will probably include the following WMATA branches:
Shady Grove
Glenmont
Addison Road
At Wheaton, we will ride the longest WMATA escalator and second longest escalator in the Western Hemisphere.
We also may make an attempt to find the CAF cars on the Green Line
MetroBuses will most definately be used to travel from Shady Grove to Wheaton and possibly from the Tidal Basin area to the Arlington Cemetery Station. The additional cost of bus rides is minimal.
Please e-mail me with input on a date preference, as well as any desires you may have if you were to attend.
Sincerely,
Oren H.
Webmaster of Oren's Transit Page
http://www.orenstransitpage.com
Sounds very good to me...but we'll see if I can go or not...that would be a cool idea for me...as long as we do some bus riding as well, I am good to go, just need the time and the money...time off froms work and school...
Carlton
http://cleanairbus.tripod.com
The Cleanairbus Transit Page
I wouldn't count on more than one bus, maybe two but highly unlikely. They are being used primarily to cover more ground (namely to avoid riding the Red Line from Shady Grove all the way to Glenmont).
I have looked everywhere, and it seems hard to find anything on NJT BUSES! Last time I checked, there weren't any bus schedules inside Metuchen station, and bus stops don't have information either. I've checked Penn Station Newark and New York, and didn't encounter bus information (or probably I'm not looking in the right place).
1) Can anyone tell me of a place where I can pick up bus schedules (like train schedules)?
2) The immediate itinerary I wanted to know was:
A bus from Metuchen/Edison to NY (Port Authority Bus Terminal = 42nd St.) [I see many commuter buses going around the blocks in my hometown, and the coach buses for North Jersey, but what about to NY?]
a) Is this itinerary available?
b) What is the fare?
c) How much time is spent traveling?
Answers would be greatly appreciated.
Thank You.
Go to NJTransit.com and then go to Intenerary planning and type in the info you're looking for.
No buses from the Port Authority to Metuchen. Here are your options take the 116 bus out of Port Authority to Perth Amboy, then transfer to the 813, which will take you to Metuchen right by the train station. And if you need to go to Edison, you can hop right on the 810 bus.
Here is your easiest option, take the North East Corridor train out of Penn Station NY right to Metuchen Station.
You also can check schedules and more information on www.njtransit.com
One more question.
I see the fare is $7.65 with a 50-cent transfer fee. Is this an OW fare or a RT fare? It didn't seem to say on the NJT webpage. If it is a RT fare, I might favor taking the bus to the city, but if not, then I'd rather take the train.
In the last week I have seen two 570 series articulateds on the "Bee Line". Are these additional buses other than those that were ordered originally?
#3 West End Jeff
Those buses are the option order Artics. It's 565 and up. A few weeks ago before I was off from school I saw #568 on the 42 Line without ads and just came in at that time.
BTW saw #501 on the 20 Line and #547 on the 4 Line
Correction: The original order was for 68 Neoplan Artics (501-568). The prototyye was 501. The option for 10 more was taken and those are 569-578. The reason that 568 has no advertising - because one of each model bus has no advdrtising so when picture time comes, these buses are used. They are
825....Flixible Metro
479....Orion V (getting engine work now so 427 is the back-up bus)
568....Neoplan Artic
170....RTS II (Museum Bus)
748....GMC Old Look (Museum Bus)
569 to 578 still have no adverttising because they are brand new. Ther next visit by TDI will no doubt change this. I'm surprised that they don't have advertising yet. Usually TDI puts advertising on the new units while they are being prepared for DOT inspection.
Does the Westchester County DOT have any "Fishbowls" in their museum fleet?
#3 West End Jeff
It would be sad if they don't have a GM fishbowl especially since they had so many of them. Anyone remember the bunch of second-hand TDH-5304 they rec'd in the early 80's???
Wayne
Sadly, there are no fishbowls in the museum fleet. When they were being replaced by the then RTS II's, it was suggested to save one. But no one was interested then. What a shame.
Yes I remember fishbowls in the early 80's. They were numbered 500's, 20 were purchased from Dallas, Texas. They were 1966's but I do not know what model they were. These buses were quite decent. They ran well, were very clean and could pull a good load despite being a V-6. Oh how I wish one (or more) fishbowls were saved.
Bah! There are MORE than enough fishbowls being saved. It's RTS and even more Flxibles that need to be preserved. Thankfully there are TA's like Houston Metro that have an RTS-II-01 and an RTS-04 saved along with a Grumman 870 and a Flxible Metro A. They also have a horrible looking New Look as well.
Too bad that they didn't save a fishbowl. There used to be so many of them. There were the 300 series fishbowls numbered from 300-326. Then there were the 400 series fishbowls numbered from 400-499 skipping some numbers in between. Other than the 1800 series fishbowls which were a motley assortment of older fishbowls, they had buses numbered 220 and 221 for a few years from perhaps an early model of fishbowls (probably pre-1964). Perhaps somebody bought one of the old fishbowls that were once owned by the county and has stored it somewhere. They should ahve saved one of them since EVERYONE was familiar with the fishbowls.
#3 West End Jeff
I hear 6607 is saved, I don't know if it's WMATA that has it though.
I wonder what number the buc carried when it was owned by Westchester County?
#3 West End Jeff
I wonder what number the bus carried when it was owned by Westchester County?
#3 West End Jeff
Can somebody tell me what did the Bee Line 102A2's replaced?
Those Bee-Line MCI 102A2's didn't really replace anything. When they were ordered... the BxM4C was a new operation. Actually the BxM4C started operating before the 102A2's were delivered. During this time a bunch of buses from LLE regular fleet were used on the BxM4C and they had a letter "L" added to their fleet numbers (ex 3907 became L-3907). I always thought that this was a special arrangement between Bee-Line/LLE to temporarily use these buses on a route serving Westchester County.
Wayne
I see. What buses from LLE where used on the 4C?
I'm sorry... I don't remember exactly which buses from LLE were used. This was prior to the MCI Classics arriving - in fact the only Classics in NYC at that time were the 3 1984 GMDD Classics at NYBS (1600-1602). At this time the LLE fleet consisted of a mixed bag of GM suburban fishbowls and an equal number of GM deck-and-a-halfs (1100 series) and a few MCI MC-8 and MC-9's (2000 series). It really was a mixed bag of suburban fishbowls as LLE had all 4 generations. Most had DD 8V-71N engines, but a few also had the DD 6V-71N. They also had two 35-footer suburban GM which were #1001-1002.
Wayne
I remember the bunch of TDH-5304s that Westchester County got in the early 1980s numbered 500-519.
#3 West End Jeff
Remember when they were in the process of repainting the fishbowls into the Liberty Lines color scheme ... and they had installed side destination signs (similar to the NYCTA 1977 Flxible 9000-9309), but I never did see these sings used. The fixture was there and the incandescent bulbs were lit, but the actual signs were never put into place.
Go figure
I miss their old color schemes. My favorite was Club Transportation. Westchester Street Transit wasn't bad either.
Wayne
I remember the unused side destination signs on the fishbowls. Go figure.
I also liked the snappy Liberty Coaches black, red and white scheme with just a touch of tan.
#3 West End Jeff
Around 1990, Liberty Lines rehabbed several suburban Fishbowls and painted them so that they looked like Classics from a distance. Are they still around ?
I'm not sure whether these fishbowls are still extent. Perhaps someone from Liberty Lines that is knowledgeable might know about the fate of these buses.
#3 West End Jeff
They are not around. LL saved one fishbowl and used it as a training bus but that too was eventually sold off.
Peace,
Kevin Barsky
LLE Operator
It is too bad that Wechester County never saved a fishbowl bus since they were so commonplace at one time. I used to like the "slap" that front door would make when it finished opening and the "clank" when the lock for the rear door was released. When at theur best, the 8V-71 engines on the later model fishbowls used to move them reasonably well.
#3 West End Jeff
Saw 568 on the 42 a while ago.
I've seen the 500 series artiks on the 42 in Westchester a number of times.
#3 West End Jeff
This bus has a hole at the upper back where the pipe suppose to go. Is it going to get repowered anytime soon, it looks strange to see it with a hole and no pipe.
Damn, 2 days until New Year's and FP still hasn't broke the drought. How sad. Almost 4 years, and still going.
1/29/02
Q39- RTS #2821
Q55- RTS #8139
Oops, I meant 12/29/02.
Yes, FP hasn't had a fleet change in 4 years and I agree that IS sad. But you thought Fresh Pond had it bad, Ulmer Park hasn't had a new set of local buses that WASN'T transferred from another depot since 1996!
The L shuttle ran between Myrtle/Wyckoff Av. and Bway Junct.(evening).
Here's what I saw:
RTS #9091 -UP
RTS #8549 -JG
RTS #5113 -FLA
RTS #8931 -ENY
I would have waited to see more, but the 8139 had came on the Q55, and on Sunday nights it take 30 minutes+ per bus.
Only 32 more hours until New Year's. Tomorrow, instead of going to Times Square, I'll be at Fresh Pond Depot, standing there to see if they get any changes before 2003.
There were several buses on that shuttle from a few depots. Sense the operators have it tacked onto their work. Not bad for overtime and time and a half.
Many of the runs are covered by regular extra list people making straight time.
With NYBS supposedly going out of business with the express routes, what are the fates of the MCI buses? Will some of them be switched to either Triboro,Jamaica,Green or QS? Definately would love to see.
p.s. Ulmer Park drought also bad-hopefully 2003 brings some 8000's to UP as well.
[Will some of them be switched to either Triboro,Jamaica,Green or QS?]
The buses will go wherever NYCDOT sends them.
It seems to me that someone will operate the routes. With all the rumors flying about Liberty Express, MTA, Academy, Atlantic Express, (WHEW!)taking the routes, doesn't it make sense that whoever operates the routes will be given the buses? Except the MTA. They will run newer buses rhan the MCI Classics. Strangely enough, NYBS's MCI Classics are in better shape that the MTA newer buses (Orion V's).
I doubt very much if the politians in the Bronx would permit a total loss of the routes. It is bad enough that the weekend service is just about gone.
I heard that the weekend issue is not completely a dead issue yett. There is still time....just to this Saturday. We sahll see!
I sure wish NYBS would NOT shut its operation down. They're such a great bus company. Heck they're the only NYC company still running Fishbowls. What does that tell you?
Also getting rid of the Express Routes on the weekends is such a stupid idea for certain companies. Green Lines runs 1 am and 1 pm Express trip on a Saturday. That could be eliminated-fine. But I highly disagree getting rid of QSC, LL, NYBS and Command because they run in areas where there are little or no buses around. Look at Glen Oaks for example. Starting this Saturday, there's no QM1/QM1A Q46 or Q79 in Glen Oaks on weekends only. How horrible for people in that neighborhood? They have no way of getting around.
What will be next? Boy do I wonder.
#504 QM1A
#1489 BXM7
I saw on Ch 7 news last night that NYBS is going out of service on January 12, is it definite I don't think so but its becoming more likely. As for the buses, they may actully go under MTA colors, they will probably take over the routes and this may lead to the retirement of the Fishbowls :-(.
There still debating. However, I was told that Libety Lines would assume operation of the former NYBS routes as well as take in operators from said company. The City knows that customers that use NYBS need service and some kind of bus service must be provided as subways don't serve that psrt of the Bronx and not every one can take subway.
service will continue through 4/1/03 at which time it is hoped nyct will step in.
I just checked the NY Bus service website.
They have eliminated the blurb saying: TERMINATING JANUARY 10, 2003
I guess those signatures bought us some time.
It looks like it will be a happy new year after all.
Thanks.
It's only a 90 day extension.
If anyone here has been to a sports arnea lately (especially the Nassau Coliseum for those in the NY area), you'll know that the edges of the upper levels of the arena now have these multicolor LED boards lining the entire circumference of the upper levels and multicolor LED central hanging displays. How exactly do these LED's differ in operation and specs than the single color LED's that we see on, for example, the destnination signs on the front of the R142-143? Will these make it to the transit scene anytime soon? I persnoally would like to see them represent all 5 line colors on the WMATA Metrorail with these multicolor LED's.
GO TERPS!!! The Peach Bowl is ours Tomorrow!!!
whats even more bizzare are the exterior multi-colored flipdot signs found on WMATA MetroRail cars 1000-4xxx. I have NO idea how they work, unless the cars are permanently assigned to their lines according to flipdot colors, which i highly doubt. Perhaps Oren or Trevor knows more about this??
They probaly used a little something called a GPS system i know i seen them install on buses a i can't believe ppl still don't know what it is.
| RED |
Apparently the wrong dots were flipped over.
Now what I haven't figured out is on the side signs, which cars have a double line and which have a single?
For example:
Some trains say || SILVER SPRING
Other trains say | SILVER SPRING
All the Rohrs do the single line but the Bredas do not.
Themulti-colored LED's have made their way to transit...they were on just about every bus at the APTA Expo 2002 in Las Vegas last September.
The thing is, most states have an ordinance stating that red lights cannot be shown to the front of ordinary motor vehicles (emergency vehicles would be the only exception).
The other thing is that those new signs cost a small fortune.
Precisely. The MTA isn't going to bother with multi-colored LED's when they have to deal with plenty of other stuff right now.
Besides, I think it's best with the LED is red. It's the easiest to view IMO.
In Canada. There's some buses with RED LED Signs!
As somebody already posted, it's illegal for any vehicle to have red lights at the front of the vehicle, with exceptions for emergency vehicles. I dont know how that has RED LEDs
canadian laws may be different
Posted by aznboy4305 on Wed Jan 1 18:35:21 2003, in response to Re: Multi-Color LED's, posted by Q46 Nova RTS#9288 on Wed Jan 1 17:44:37 2003.
As somebody already posted, it's illegal for any vehicle to have red lights at the front of the vehicle, with exceptions for emergency vehicles. I dont know how that has RED LEDs
Uh, he DID say it was up in Canada...that's a different country, so they may have different laws.
You'd have to exclude school buses also, as they have red lights at the top. Nowadays practically all school buses now also have yellow caution lights as well as folding stop signs, with extra red lights.
Montgomery County's school busses are loaded with red lights. They have the classic 8-way lighting system at the front and rear of the bus, as well as dual stop arms with 8 red strobe lights in total, and a roof-mounted white strobe light.
Prince George's County schoolbuses have in the past two years have gotten those strobe lights at the top.
Most of the observations I saw today were of the Orion V variety. The first observation was seeing the bus with the chrome wheels, that being 4294. I also spotted the ex-Landover 4200s have now gotten bike racks, spotted 4277 leaving Federal Triangle with one. The last Orion V observation was 4212, now void of its tribute to Hakim Farthing. A note to this last one, in that I thought there was only one bus that was dedicated to Officer Farthing, but apparently there were about three that were. I got pic of 4272 and 4273 with also the same banners on it. I believe they were, I caught them on the run and the pics were kind of blurry.
Also a bit of a Neoplan update. There is only one at the gate as I passed by Landover tonight, that being 5315. The rest are farther back, maybe ready to leave for their respective garages soon. I thought I saw one heading towards D.C. on route 50, but it was only a CNG, couldn't get the number though, it was dark. Anyways that was all I saw today. I take my last bus trip tomorrow (for 2002).
I remember last year around this time-we were predicting what would happen in 2002?
Well I am back to do it yet again for 2003 so here we go:
1. All of the DOT Operations will cease to exist.
2. West Farms and 100 St will open.
3. 1986 and 1987 RTS will be near extinction. 1984-1985 RTS will no longer be operating.
4. Artics Galore!
5. Orion 7s will arrive for JG MCH and I believe CS. QV will receive rejected 500s from CS.
6. Repowering of TMCs and Orions will be complete.
7. Bye bye Hudson Peuke and Amsterdam!
What do you all think will happen in 2003? Opinions of my lucky 7 predictions? We would like to know!
Happy New Year to All BusTalkers!!!
From MTA MCI 1979 on the X1
Here what I think will happen for the DC area in 2003:
1) The Neoplans will see service during the first full week of 2003.
2) WMATA will annonce who will get the next CNG bus order and it will be for New Flyer C40LF with John Deere engines (that's out there ain't it)
3) The WMATA rail extensions (Largo extension and New York Avenue) will be completed by the end of the year, which isn't usual,since their last couple of extensions opened about three to six months early than they were supposed to.
4) Unfortunately WMATA will increase fares @#%&$!*^
5)Ride On will buy more CNGs, and I will guess they will be Orion Vs
6) Fairfax Connector will buy more Orion Vs (what a surprise)
7)back to WMATA, they will regain their ridership lost after 9/11, that is until they raise their fares.
More orion V's for Ride-On?? *Groans* I'm starting to get sick of them. LOL. It'll be interesting to see Green CNG's with orange Twinvision LED signs. And I wonder if they'll be 35 or 40 footers.
If you think possibly seeing more Orion Vs are bad for Ride On, just think of living in Fairfax Connector country with all of those Orion Vs running around and with (OH NO!!) more possibly coming, that is if they haven't come already. Would be nice to see Ride On buck the trend and go with something like a NABI, Neoplan, or New Flyer(not likely according to WMATAGMOUGH).
Hopefully, 2003 will not bring the demise of any Flxibles in DC. IF they retire any 8700s, at least one in the second scheme should go to the Historic Fleet as they were the first Metros to go to MetroBus.
-F.
I am hoping that WMATA would consider this post when saving buses for their antique fleet. I believe they should save the following buses for their fleet.
Flxibles:
110:Flxible surburban
8200 or 8300 series: non wheelchair lift bus
8400, 8500 or 8600: wheelchair lift bus, with roll sign
8594-8603: one of theses with the electric signs
5000: one from this 30' series
8700-8900 series: One 8700, 8800 unrehabbed in old paint scheme and one 8700,8800 rehabbed in new paint scheme, one 8900 wheelchair and non wheelchair lift rehabbed in old paint scheme
8953: had a experimental paint scheme
8971,72,73,75 and 8974:8974 has been rehabbed and the other four have not.
9200 series: One wheelchair lift, non wheelchair lift with DD6Vs and one with cummins
9300-9400s: One wheelchair lift 9300/9400, non wheelchair lift 9400 and one 35' 9400
5100:one or two from this one. One would be in the old paint scheme and the other would be 5165.
9700: 9701 and another 9700
9800s: One with Cummins M11, C8.3 and a surburban
4000s: one
MANNs 5119 and a 5000 series
AMGs one 35' and 40'
Neoplan: one they could actually repair and have run again
Gillig:one with the electronic sign and one with a roll sign
Orions:
9600s: one surburban, 9652, one regular and either 9659 or 9660
4200-4400s:one regular surburban, one B30 bus and one regular bus
3900: one here
2100-2200s: one here
Orion VI: one here
NABI: one here
GM buses:
RTS: one in the original paint scheme with slopeback, one in the second paint scheme with back and the one they saved for the antique fleet
New Looks: one from the 1000s, 1100s, 1300s, 1400-1500-2600-6400-6500-6600-6700s (one from this batch), one 2500 35 footer, 3503 or one like it, one from the 3600 and 3800s, 3519, 1400(had pleated back doors
If anyone had a bus or a particular series I forgot to add to this list put it here
I forgot to mention that the 9200s- 9400s, 9600s-9800s, the whole 2000s (2000s-2200s), NABIs, 3900s, 4000s-4400s, 5100 Flxible Metros are far from being retired, so I had to put that here.
The 8700s are stored and the 8800s and 8900s are due to be retired when the next group of CNGs arrive in 2004.
They should also save a series of any bus they inherited when they took over the privates, like a Flxible New Look 6800(ex DC Transit) and some old looks. Also they should have a GM New Look saved to represent each of the privates they took over.
DANG!! Those are a lot of buses to save, OH WELL!!
The only New Look that should have been saved was 6607, and only because it had an appearance not only in a book, but in the movie "Private Parts."
6607 is still around and saved. What book was it in?
Thanks
It was in some type of bus book printed in the mid to laate 80's. I'm glad it was saved. Now THAT bus has seen some things. I remember it was running into late 2000 as I asked it's whereabouts and someone reported that they had seen it that very day.
So how exactly do those John Deere engines sound in a bus? Are they running any in NYC? I've seen photo ads for them that feature a NYCTA RTS in the background...any truth in the advertising?
-F.
There are two buses at QSC with a John Deere engine, both Orion CNG's.
Lemme tell you, they run damn good..
The John Deere CNG Orions are from the year 2000. They were the last ones that were delivered to QSC. They're known as #404 AND 437.
They sound a tad different than the regular 1999 Orion CNGs.
I do have to say this-they ARE faster and not as rattly as the 1999s.
#404 Q66
#437 Q104
I'm waiting for 2460-63 to arrive. Have not seen any of them yet.
Fresh Pond and Ulmer Park will receive more crappy "hand downs", while Manhattan and the Bronx get everything new.
Brooklyn will get screwed once again. Things are never going to change.
The Orion VII's are slated for QV not CS;CS is slated to get the last 25-30 artrics of the order coming in now(which like you said QV will probably receive more 500 series Orions).
IF, the MTA does take over the DOT operations, do you actually believe that they will get rid of the numerous 1985-87 RTS that are currently operating? No way. They'll just be repainted in MTA colors and shuffled around the system.