Haven't got much feed back on my trivia test & am wondering why.
e.g. what is TParty25 ? You have a good shot of it, so someone ought to be able to ID it.
e.g. can you find the British Leyland ... now that's a hard one ?
e.g. hints exist for on 627 & 6169
So that's 4 of the 10 you need to win !
More hints: They have White, Mack, Twin Coach, AFC & GMC coaches in their collection ....
I thought you folks would have fun with this ????
Well, I'll give you to Tues. AM to submit your guesses.
Mr t__:^)
Thurston, what test? Did you post a website? I must have missed it.
Last night I was driving by the depot when I saw two of there buses on the street outside the depot with a new Paint job. The bus had a three tone strip. (Red - Gray(or Silver) - Red) The patten look like a lighting Blot. I could not stop to see if there were more inside the depot becouse I had my wife and a screeming baby in the back seet.
Does anyone know if this is going to be the new paint job on all of there buses or what.
Robert
For the past year, Triboro Coach has been giving this paintjob to their buses. Here are the buses that have this paintjob:
657, 674, 719, 721, 726-727, 735, 739, 761, 770, 786, 793, 2067, 2803-2804, 2806, 2808-2809, 2812, 2814-2815, 2817, 2820-2821, 2824, 2827-2828. I believe that all of Triboro Coach buses will be receiving this new look in the near future.
Q18#2828Gary
Speaking of 735, I saw it going up 48th Street. When it signalled to turn onto 48th Avenue, I noticed that it had those LED lights on the turn and brake lights in the back. Is this a new feature soon to be on all Triboro buses?
All the buses will feature this eventually. I saw it on 2805.
Q53#2828Gary
When I went to LGA late Thurs. night, I saw this new paint scheme on a Q33 bus.......
B46M Limited
How many passengers can get on this fancy-painted couch?
Mine only seats 3 (uncomfortably)
-Hank :)
LOL!
Who would have thought a misspelling would turn into a joke!
46 seated with 35 standees.
The "loveseat" version can fit fewer people.
The new scheme is great.
However, I prefer the traditional brown hue with cream that Triboro had years ago!
Check out this article from today's Post. A Metrobus driver activated the "EMERGENCY - CALL POLICE" signboard and helped capture a murder suspect. Police found clothes and a handgun on board.
The bus involved was #2218. Is this one of the new Orion Vs or Orion VIs? I'm not familiar with their numbering as yet.
Click here for the Post article.
Chris
2218 is a new Orion V.
Maybe you got a little too fancy with the formatting of your post. It was completely blank on my screen.
Tom
Scroll down
Peace,
ANDEE
You mean the sign worked.That is surprising.
Just to fair and to show that my race comments of a week ago were pretty made tongue-in-cheek, I just learned that for some reason JG began transferring 5230-5249 over to ENY (5233, 5238, 5240 and 5245 are in service there now). That will give them 125 1999 Nova RTS's, and 220 buses that are 1994 or newer. Thats the most in the city (except for CAS and YUK), and more than the entire JAM fleet.
NOTE: ENY is a depot that opertates the last 6V-71 bus in the city, 3009. As of Wednesday, that bus was still in service.
Mark
I don't care where they go just as long as they stay out of Fresh Pond!
Why???? I thougth JG was going 5230-5249, the 8500's and the CNG's???? What are they (JG) getting in return????
B14#5238Mike????
This is the basic problem of bus assignments, nothing is etched in stone. One "week" there is one way of thinking, next "week" that thinking is changed.
Hey keep sending the 5200's to ENY.We also still have our original 8100 order intact and the 1st 15 to 20 buses of the original hi 3900/lo4000 order and all of your 8600's still.BTW 3009 is still in its original paint job pratically(except for New York City Bus on back
09/01/2000
Spotted tonight on the N19 not far from Sunrise Mall on Merrick Rd. was a new LI Bus Orion #336. In the dark you could tell by the paint that it was brand spanking new. Add to this, the aluminum wheels.
I noticed the larger LED front, side and rear signs. Does this spell the end of those beloved Gillig Phantoms ? BTW, what the hell was LI Bus thinking? On the 600 series Orions, were the large front signs making it easy to read with room for imformation. Then on the 100 and 200 series "CNG" buses, they opted for the smaller front sign with less space for imformation. Now it seems with the ndew Orion CNG's, the larger sensible sign has returned. What were they thinking?
Bill"Newkirk"
It's LI Bus. I think the concensus of those that follow LIB religiously will agree that LIB doesnt think very well.
I have been living in Crown Heights for most of my life and on Monday there will be some bus diversions due to the Labor Day Parade. The ones I can think of off my head.......
B12: Runs on Winthrop from Utica to Remsen. Left on Remsen to Rutland. Will run on Rutland to Rock Pkwy. Left on Rock Pkwy to ENY. Right on ENY, then continue n regular route.
B14: Will terminate in the area of Ralph Av and Eastern Pkwy.
B17: Will terminate in the area of ENY and Troy Ave.
B41: Will run on Bedford and Washington Aves in the Crown Heights area.....
B45: Regular
B46: Southbound will run down Schenectady Ave from St. Johns Pl to ENY Ave. Northbound direction will run on Utica Ave.
The B43 might be affected as well. This is going on personal knowledge and not the TA. Things might change..... FDNY probably will have better info.
I hope everyone will come out and take part of the festivities..........
B12#9063Mike
B14#8687Mike
B17#5222Mike
B41#4444Mike
B43#837Mike
B45#4975Mike
B46#5100Mike
I am going to get better info on Tuesday Steve
Will look out for it. Early this morning I was out on the streets of Flatbush and spotted the B43 using the B12 stand on Parkside and Flatbush. It was bus #965. So all buses that run through Crown Heights, Flatbush, and E. Flatbush will have some diversions. Theses buses are:
B12, B14, B15, B16, B17, B35, B41, B43, B44, B45, B46, B48, B49, B65, and definitely the B71 will have some type of bus detours due to the parade, B78
B14#9036Mike
B43#965Mike
B46#8146Mike
B78#9422Mike
as i recall from two years ago working the 41 line, northbound on Flatbush, right on Caton, right Ocean, to Empire, wait for soiuthbound time at Flat-Empire, back south.
Most of these routes are all pull ins and pull outs, deviating rom the scheduled reliefs.
Hi
I will be publishing all details within the week for those interested parties
Steve
NYC Fire Dept
Im definitely interested.....
B46M LTD
B54 Jay St ,,for Myrtle bet Flatbush and Ashland Place
B54 via Myrtle,Ashland,Dekalb Flatbush Myrtle,and Reg
B54 Ridgewood via Flatbush,Fulton ,Ashland Pl,Myrtle,and Reg
Seot 2,2000
B70 8 Av bet 52 and 60
VA Hospital via 8 av,50,9 Av,60,8 Av,and Reg
1 Av via 8 Av,60 ,9 Av,49 St,8 Av and reg
Sept 2,2000
B43 Box St via Kingston Av,Eastrn Pwy,Troy ,Bergen ,Kingston and Reg
B43 Lincoln Rd via Brooklyn Av,Dean St,Albany Av,Empire Blvd and Reg
B44 Plaza via NY Av,Empire Blvd,Troy Av,Bergen St NY Av,and Regular
Sept 2,2000
B44 Avenue U via Nostrand,Dean St,Albany Av,Empire Blvd ,Nostrand Av and Regular
B45 Court St via St Johns Place,Troy Av,Bergen St,Nostran Av St Johns pl and regular
B45 Ralph Av via St Johns Place,NY Av,Dean St Albany A,St Johns Place,and Regular
B48 Meeker via Empire,Troy Av,Bergen St,Classon Av, and Regular
B48 Lincoln Rd via Franklyn ,Dean ,ALbany,Empire,Washington Av,and Regualr
B49 Fulton St via Rogers Av,Empire Av,Troy ,Bergen B49 McKenzie Loop via Beford,Dean,Albany,Empire Sept 2,2000
B26 Cadman via Halsey,Malcolm X,Hancock,Stuyvestant,Halsey and Regualr
B26 Ridgewood via Halsey,Stuyvestant,Macon St,Malcom X Blvd,Halsey St and Regualr
Sept 4,2000
B14 Utica Av via Pitkin,Howard ,St Johns Pl,to temporary Stand on Ralph Av
B14 Drew via St Johns Place,Buffalo Av,Park Place,Ralph Av,St Johns Place,Saratoga Av,Pitkin Av
B15 JFK via St Johns Place,Saratoga ,ENY Av,Saratoga Av,Sutter Av,Ralph Av,
B15 Marcus Garvey via Ralph ,Sutter,Howard,St Johns Place and Regualr
B16 Empire via caton ,St Johns Place,Parkside Av,and terminate at B16 stop on Parkside and Ocean Av
B16 Shore rd from Temporary Stand via Caton
B17 Easten Parkway via Remsen Av,Empire Blvd,Schenectdy to stand at Schenectady and ENY Av
B17 Rockaway Pwy via Schenectady ,ENY Av,Remsen Av
B41 SOUTHSIDE SHUTTLE
From Kings Plaza via Flatbush ,Empire Blvd ,Washingtn Av,LEfferts Blvd,and Flatbush Av and regular
B41 NORTHSIDE SHUTTLE
from Cadman Plaza via Flatbush,,last stop atProspect Place,,return via Fltbush ,7 Av,PARK Place,Flatbush Av,make a left turn and regular
Sept 4,2000
B43 NORTHSIDE SHUTTLE
from Wburg via Brooklyn Av,St Johns ,Kingston ,to stand at St Johns Place
B43 SOUTHSIDE SHUTTLE
via Kingston,President St,Brooklyn ,to stand at Carroll
B44 NORTHSIDE SHUTTLE
via Nostrand ,St Jhns Plce,NY Av,to stand at Sterling Place
B44 SOUTHSIDE SHUTTLE via NY Av,President ,Nostrand ,to temporary Stand at Carroll
B46 from Washington Plaza via Utica ,ST Johns Place,Buffalo ,Sterling ,Rochester,St Johns Place,Utica av to St Johns Place
B46 frmo Kings Plaza via Utica ,Presidnt ,Schenecatday Carroll ,tica to temporary Stan at Carroll
B48 NORTHSIDE SHUTTLE
via Franklin ,to stand at Sterling Place,,then sterling place,,Classon Av and regular
B48 SOUTHSIDE SHUTTLE
via Classson ,Union St,Frankin ,to stand at Union St
B49 from Fulton St,,via Bedford ,St Johns Place,Rogers ,to stand at St Johns Place
B49 from McKenzie Loop via Rogers ,President,Bedford,,to stand at Carroll
Sept 4,2000
B69 Sand St via 8 Av,Flatbush A,Carlton St,Park Place,Vanderbilt Av and Regualr
B69 via Vanderbilt ,Bergen St,Flatbush Av,7 Av,9 St,Prospect Park West,and Regualr
B71 Rogers Av
via Union St,8 Av,St James Place,Flatbush Av,GAP,for temporary Stnad
B71 Hamilton Av via regualr route to GAP Stand
Sept 5,2000
B7 Broadway via Saratoga,,Dumont ,Thomas Boyland,Blake,Saratoga and Regualr
B7 Kings Hwy via Saratoga,,Blake ,Boyland St,Dumont Av,Saratoga Av and regualr
Thank you FDNY, this is very helpful........
B46M Limited
Please keep in mind,,EVERYTHING I publish comes from official sources,,,,
Steve
too bad this wasn't posted on the buses. All I saw was a little poster which said to expect delays and to try to use the subway!
Saw this bus Wed @ Boro hall. The rear was lifted up and sand on the bottom of the bus covering up a leak. There was a maintenance truck behind it and I was talking to the maintenance worker. It was some type of fuel leakage. It look like it was in a tough spot since he was struggling to tighten the valve........
B41#5100Mike
Fuel leak in the rear??????? Wouldnt that be out of the right side???
Wednesday morning around 1AM, I witnessed a white SEPTA bus parked in our garage. There were also 2 of those low-floor CNG buses out of JGL parked on our pull-in rail.
Does anyone know why these 3 buses were stored at QV overnight? Everyone I asked had the same "answer":
"I dunno".....
:-)
The SEPTA bus, along with four NYCTA buses (907 and 917 low floor, Orion V 540 and RTS 2697) are being used for practice by the NYCTA drivers (MTA Long Island Bus did not have a Roadeo this year) who have qualified for the Bus Roadeo finals to be held in San Francisco later this month. The four NYCTA buses are currently stored at MTA LI Bus' garage in Mitchell Field (at this very moment, 907 and 917 are outside facing Oak Street, and easily photographed), while the other two units are in the garage. The SEPTA bus is stored each day in the NYCTA's Queens Village Depot. During the day, all five buses are driven to the Nassau Coliseum parking lot, where the Roadeo cones are set up, and the Roadeo-eligible drivers practice.
Thanks for the update. Now I know why I saw the two low floors sitting outside the depot while driving on Oak Street this afternoon (Sat, Sept. 2).
I drove by there this afternoon also and spotted 907 and 917 as well. I had thought initially that they were there because LI Bus had CNG capability and were to be filled between transports to Atlantic Diesel.
BTW, speaking of LI Bus, I haven't yet seen any of their new Orions as reported here on Bus Talk.
B53Rich, I spotted both buses 287 and 292 in service in Queens over the past couple weeks. Bus 287 was on the N4 on a Saturday (which means Mitchell Field) and 292 was on the N2 (Rockville Center).
Mark
OK, will keep looking. BTW, isn't 287 from the last order?
Which SEPTA bus is there?
Thanks for the explanation. The SEPTA bus, which is still the first bus parked on track 13 at QV, visible from 97th Ave (which is a public street) is bus #5086. The number on the run box reads "635" if that means anything.
Both of the low-floor buses were gone when I got back, but they were indeed the numbers posted earlier. I didn't expect they would be around too long, as we cannot fuel CNG buses. The SEPTA (appears to be) a standard 40-foot diesel.
From the fleet number, I can tell that it is one of the NABI buses.
#5086 is assigned to Comly. I don't know which line that 635 corresponds to, though. I believe it's the 84 between Frankford and Franklin Mills/Torresdale or 70 between Fern Rock and Torresdale, but don't hold me to it.
What kind of SEPTA bus was it? was it a Neoplan, NABI...?
I really don't know what kind of but it is. If it's still there tomorrow, I'll jot down the info and post it here. Also, as I said, you can view the bus from public property on 97th Avenue. It's the first bus parked on track #13, and doesn't look like an RTS lol!
I'll let you know what it is tomorrow :-)
I have a SEPTA bus roster, and according to the fleet number that someone put up, it was one of the NABIs, but thanks anyway.
I checked out the bus this morning. According to the ID panel, the bus was manufactured by American Ikaris, August 1996. Aside from the duct tape holding the horn in place, the bus appeared in relative good repair. The farebox accepts both "fare cards" and paper money, as well as coins (and tokens if applicable). I noticed the standard fare is $1.60, and that they charge .40 per transfer! The farebox is similar to the old farebox we had when our fare was $1.25 (which had the "swipe across the top", rather than the "dip" we currently use).
There are 2 ICC brakes, a brake override switch, and a more convenient toggle-style 4-way flasher switch away from the main console.
Apparently each SEPTA operator must document their 19-A pre-trip inspection, as well as document any relevant defects on a separate OVCR card. There were 2 cards for such notations affixed to the transfer cutter bracket.
Both right-side and left-side mirrors are electric, and both have mirror heat. The wheelchair lift is at the front door. Evidently, SEPTA operators must demonstrate to an intending WC passenger that the lift is defective (if it is defective). The word of the BO isn't enough, as there is a sticker affixed to the panel above the drivers window that requests compliance.
There are dual heat and AC zones, and a variable-speed booster-blower for the operator (L,M,H).
The seating area has 2 sets of forward-facing benches, then separates to form an open area at the front with benches on either side, and singular-seats facing the side. Apparently, the WC seats are single-seats that fold.
The bus itself is gleeming white, with a single red stripe around the top sides which includes a red, white, and blue decal on the front left. There is a blended blue-to-red stripe across the front which includes white lettered SEPTA between the front headlights. The rear lights are set horizontally.
The license plate reads "Pennsylvania Mass Transit" set on a dark-blue plate with gold lettering, and the keystone logo raised in the bottom-center.
There you have it. Bus #5086 parked on track #13 at Queens Village Depot. For how long? Who knows..... :-)
HTH
Yeah. The top red stripe you were talking about blends from red to blue. At the back of the stripe there is the fleet number written in white and at the back it blends from blue to red again, like at the front. This is what all the SEPTA buses and trolleys are being repainted as, in contrast to the old red white logo blue white logo and red again that it used to be. Yeah, the transfers are .40, as well as the additional zone charge. The "fare cards" are the trail passes and transpasses, sort of like the metrocards in New York.
Here you go, Info current as of 9/1/00:
Ulmer Park:
67 1996-97 NovaBUS RTS-06 Suburbans
60 2000 MCI 102-DL3SS Cruisers
1 2000 New Flyer D45S Viking Cruiser
Retiring All 1982, 1984 and 1985 RTS Suburbans. Buses 4497, 4742, and all of the 48xx Series buses will be reconverted back to Transit-style seating. 12 Reman GMC RTS-04s (70xx) and 18 NovaBUS RTS-06 Suburbans will be sent elsewhere.
_______________
Castleton:
Keep All 1998 & 1999 MCI 102-DL3SS Cruisers
20 2000 MCI 102-DL3SS Cruisers
1 New Flyer D45S Viking Cruiser
20 1995 Orion V Suburbans will be sent elsewhere.
_______________
Yukon:
Keep All 1998 & 1999 MCI 102-DL3SS Cruisers
20 2000 MCI 102-DL3SS Cruisers
21 1993 Orion V Suburban
1 New Flyer D45S Viking Cruiser
20 1993 Orion V Sububrbans will be sent elsewhere. The surplus 20 Express coaches at Yukon is to suppliment the new four (4) South Shore lines set to premier this October.
_______________
This also means that the first 20 year 2000 MCI DL3SS Cruisers will be delivered to Yukon dead first with the following 60 to be sent to Yukon, then the last 20 being sent to Castleton.
The other 70 MCI 102-DL3SS Cruisers in this order will not premier onto the TA property until Spring of 2001.
As for the other equipment involved in this shift includes:
20 1993 Orion V Suburbans
20 1995 Orion V Suburbans
18 1996-97 NovaBUS RTS-06 Suburbans
12 1981-82 GMC RTS-04 Suburbans (CMF Remans)
will be evenly distributed between the following depots:
Jamaica (Having 9 Express Buses that need to be replaced)
Queens Village (Having 13 Express Buses that need to be replaced)
Quill (Having 18 Express Buses that need to be replaced)
As you can see the total buses needing to be replaced doesn't not equal the amount of buses left over (40 needed buses leaving 30 left over). This leaves room for the TA to up service on certain (X) routes with that surplus of 30 or so buses.
Stengel will not have any changes as the already have the 14 buses at thier garage required to meet thier rush hour standards.
Hope this info is valuable to you!
Trevor Logan
www.transitalk.com
<"delivered to Yukon dead first with the following 60 to be sent to "Yukon", then the last 20 being sent to Castleton. >
That second Yukon should've been Ulmer Park.
Trevor Logan
www.transitalk.com
I'm baffled! Is this just a "paper" roster or an "actual" roster? Where have all these Model Year 2000 MCI Cruisers been stored pending usage all this time? Certainly, they all didn't arrive overnight! Unless I'm missing something!
I believe he means this roster will be current AFTER they have all been delivered. BIG AL
We all know that the TA suits who make up bus assignments are well known to change their collective minds quite often! If JAM & QV can't fit the MCI's into their buildings, then these 2 depots should have their entire fleets composed of the 1996/97 NOVA coaches transfered from UP. Kind of like a payback for suffering with those 1982's for such a long time. Let UP keep those CMF remans. With them getting MCI's and still keeping some 1996/97 Nova coaches for themselves, their average age for coaches will still be lower than the Queens depots. In addition, aren't fewer coaches required for PM service? If so, then UP can get by running those rebuilds in the AM only.
So, JAM & QV will need 85 NOVA's?? Thought they only needed about 40. What do you plan to do with the other 45, use them for spares. Why should Up be punished just because Queens has not revieved new busses lately?
In addition, 60 MCI's arent doing the job for Ulmer Park. We need 120 busses to meet AM service. So keeping just MCI's and the Remans and the MCI's would give us 72 busses, about 50 short.
BTW, we need slightly less busses at night, about 10 less.
To me the plan that Trevor outlined makes the most amount of sense with the way the busses will be moved and everything.
Shaun
I did not say send 85 Nova's to Jam & QV. Re-read my post! I said that their fleet should be composed exclusively of the Nova's. I didn't say to send more than what they needed!
Trev, you may need to double check the Queens assigments. JAM actually needs to replace 16 buses--not 9. They have 23 expresses assigned, of which only 7 of them are 1996/97 Novas.
Mark
It is nice to hear that Jamaica is getting 1740. On which route will it be used, and which depot gave it up? If anyone knows, does it have a 6V-71 engine in it?
1740 is from Queens Village Depot. I don't know the engine of the routes it'll be used though I believe 3009 is the only NYC bus with that engine.
1740 will probably be used on the rutes that the other remaining 1700's are used.
It's the oldest bus in the fleet and you should ride it before it's retired, which will probably be soon.
1740 has a Detroit Diesel 6V-92TA engine.
Peace & Blessings
DaShawn Pretlow
www.transitworld.org
We have many more left! Please, don't stop there.... come on by, kick a few retreads, pull the tape off the engine doors, hop on up over the boards on the first step and take 'em for a spin!
Glide your fingers over the newly melted plastic "globs" which indicate 'repair'...... stick a few maps between the farebox and radio...... slam the overhead sign door until it lashes down on your forehead (free roaches included).... admire the 3 colors of blue paint used and the 'scratchitti' at the rear windows!!
Get her out on the highway and open her up! Both hands on the left side of the wheel though.... you'll need to pull er hard to keep er straight :-)
17's you want? 17's we have!! Come one, come all....
How many 17** buses are left in QV?
QV has about 9 1700/1800's left.
1742, 1745, 1757, 1767, 1773, 1819 and 1852 are left at QV.
Q46#1819Gary (I remember riding all the buses but 1852 on the Q46!)
#1852 didn't retired because i saw that bus running on X64 on Madison Av this past Friday
I know that 1852 is still around. All I was saying was that I didn't ride on 1852. I rode all the other "1982 Express buses" on the Q46.
Q46#1767Gary
1852 is a QV depot bus but the X64 line runs out of Jamaica depot so unless they did a swap which I doubt, I don't see how that's possible. BIG AL
Maybe it is X68 but i couldn't tell which routes & i couldn't see the LED Sign because it was not clear to see the LED Sign. Maybe u right Big AL this bus could be QV.
Peace Out
David Justiniano
Most if not all of you on bus talk may not be aware since this never made it to the newspapers or TV but on 8/26, while driving bus 9073 on the Q4 from Jamaica depot, bus operator Ronnie Oden suffered a massive heart attack at the wheel. The bus was quickly brought under control by a quick thinking passenger all though it did hit a pole. Nobody was injured. However paramedics were not able to revive Mr.Oden. He was only 43. I would like to extend my deepest sympothies to his wife and children. Mr.Oden did complain to his wife about chest pains for 3 days before the incident. I would like to remind everybody reading this that if you should ever experience unusual pains in the chest for any extended period of time, PLEASE visit a doctor or hospital immediately. It could mean the difference between life and death. In closing, I would like to say: FAREWELL MR. RONNIE ODEN. YOU WILL BE DEEPLY MISSED BY ALL OF YOUR BROTHERS AND SISTERS IN JAMAICA DEPOT. BIG AL
Amen Al. Our condolences extend from QV as well. There's no coincidence that heart attacks are the leading cause of death among bus operators. There was a feature written in last years JAMA which disclosed that bus operators are the highest risk for heart and stress related injuries/death.
Please everyone.... try to relax. Let it go... get through your day without incuident, with your sanity, and enjoy your life and family. Even when it seems "personal", it's not :-)
Play the game.. cash in your chips, and enjoy life. When you're having one of "those days", remember what a wise senior BO once told me when I started out:
"It's just a day like any other day, and the best part about it is- it will end, just like yesterday did".
~ Rest in peace Brother Oden ~
On behalf of everyone at 126th Street Depot I'd like to extend condolences to the Oden family and everyone at Jamaica Depot. May he rest in peace.
I would please like a list on what original engines 1981-1983 RTS were powered by. I believe there were two different engines depending on the bus. Do not include the remanufactured 7000 series on the list. I know 1984-1991 and most 1993 RTS were 6v92TA. Thank you!!!!
There were only two kinds of Deetroit Diesel V6 available for RTS the years you mention. One is the 6V92 and the other was the 6V71.
Also the 8V-71 was available in 1981 but the TA/MaBSTOA did not use those in the RTS, but They did use them in the Grumman 870's that were destined for Ave B & East Bway Bus Company but from what I understand those went to SI. The NYCDOT also used the 8V-71 which was the standard power of choice during those years.
Peace & Blessings
DaShawn
www.transitworld.org
Thank you for that info, but I know that already. I was looking for a list of individual 1981-1983 RTS NYC busses and their engines. Please include whether they are Turbo & Aftercooled, or not. For example:
RTS Bus xxxx-xxxx had 6v71TA
RTS Bus xxxx-xxxx had 6v92TA
Here is the breakdown:
1981 RTS:
1201-1287 6V-71N
1288-1297 6V-92TA
1298-1317(express) 6V-92TA
1318-1658 6V-71N
2201-2280 6V-71N
2281-2300 6V-92TA
2301-2579 6V-71N
1982 RTS:
All 1982 RTS's were delivered with 6V-92TA engines. However, during their careers several buses were retrofitted with 6V-71's. They were, 1717, 1721 and 1743. Buses 1717 and 1721 eventually got their "correct" engines, but 1743 kept the non-turbo engine until it was retired in 1998.
Hope that helps
Mark
Just to add to Q5Merrick's post... The 1983 RTS had the 6V-71N. From 1984 thru 1993 NYCTA/MABSTOA RTS had the 6V-92TA.
Wayne
Tell me more about Houston RTS busses please. What engines do you have there?
I think Green Bus Lines is going to go through a major controversy on News Channel 2 this Tuesday night at 11. They have the oldest buses in the system and they're blowing lots of smoke that's making people sick. And Green Lines is doing nothing about it. So we will see what happens Tuesday night at 11 on Channel 2.
Q60#5514Gary
WOW, we posted about Green's problems at the same time!! I guess you were watching the Jet game too.
Yep, saw them beat Green Bay 20-16. It was a good but dragged out game-with too many penalties. Looks like they didn;t recover from the preseason. But the Jets did pick up the "W" that's all that matters.
R36Gary
Saw 234 on the Q11 doing that exact problem
This is nothing new. This has been going on since the 80's and maybe since the 70's. BTW, GL has 264, 240, 603, 1179 and 5508 at Atlantic Diesel on Long Island. GL sends more buses there for repairs than any other bus company, including LI Bus.
Last I saw 603 on the Q11, she was doing the same.
Q11#603Gary
Why are they just singling out GBL? NYCTA has some of the heaviest smokers on the road. In 126th St alone we have enough smokers to blow a hole in the ozone layer. 4164,4165,4307 are just some of the junkers fouling the air on a daily basis.
In Houston we have buses...
1907
1922
1960
2098
2145
2150 (Very Bad)
These are usually the buses that see the most service. I notice the heaviest smokers, 1922 and 2150, have motors that make this wierd sound like paper flapping through bike spokes or one of those old Caddy's motors. Can nayone diagnose this problem?
Because they have the most 1985-1987 buses of all of the DOT companies. And most of them smoke. They just retired their 1979 RTS this past summer. And the only bus that smoked real bad was 1008.
Among the smoky ones at GBL are: 228, 234, 236, 248, 252, 264, 274, 279, 603, 610, 612, 614, 618, 623-626, 628, 631, 634, 641, 643, 646, 649, 651
These are the worst ones at GBL. QS had some smoky ones too but they are not retired. They are mostly a CNG Depot now except for 294-389 and 900-954. Are there any plans that GBL is going CNG?
Q60#1148Gary
QV Bus 8355- slow and smoky.
Q46#8361Gary
I think a bus tends to be blow more smoke and run slower when the air conditioning is functioning.
You are so right! The 1st problem lies in the Detroit Diesel 6V-92TA. This engine was known back in the early 90's not being able to meet the future federal guidelines for clean air. Detroit Diesel knew this and thus discontined this engine for new bus use in 1994. It is also known that 2 cycle diesel engines in general share this problem and this is why Detroit Diesel does not produce any more 2 cycle engines period. Cummins on the other hand has always made 4 cycle engines from the start. The 2nd problem is the diesel fuel that the TA uses. It is very high in sulfur content and if you notice the newest Nova RTS's are not doing well either! Just take a look at any 5xxx series RTS or even the 1998 series they are very smoky! The sulfur damages their Catalytic Converts thus rendering them useless in so many words! So just imagine what GBL and other DOT companies are using for Diesel fuel. Hopefully if the city gets some of the better grade diesel fuel with much less sulfur content in all depots and not just select ones, we hopefully will all breathe a little easier.
Peace & Blessings
DaShawn
www.transitworld.org
Ah, we'll have to see if Marcia Kramer is aware that high sulphur diesel fuel being used or just wants to make Green Bus Lines look bad! A must watch for all BusTalkers!
Green Bus Line doesn't need Channel 2 News to make them look bad.Everyone at BT(Even our non-metropolitan area posters) knows that they are just plain awful
If they are using High sulfer than they are in violation of the law(federal i think) High sulfer is only for off road use.0.5% is legeal for on road use if caught using high its $10,000 a day fine for each day its in the tank.
in all fairness to GBL, they operate under strict guidlines set forth by the DOT and the city. they cannot just get rid of buses without approval from the powers that be. it is difficult for the private lines to accquire new buses, most of them as you all know come from other fleets. As for cbs, that interview was done 2 weeks ago, they needed do some dirt digging before they decided to air the story. this will be more of a political issue than a true concern.
This Tuesday, Channel 2 News at 11 will be doing a special report on why Green Bus Lines operates buses that spew out thick black smoke a regular basis. Basically, it looks as if they will be focusing on the 1985-87 RTS's (200's and 600's), and, yes, they do blow out a TON of smoke. It looks as though they are going to try and expose the fact that some high exec from the DOT has OK'd these buses for service.
Literally, stay tuned. Just for the record, Triboro's old RTS's (600's and 700's) spew a ton of smoke as well. Jamaica Bus' 1985-87 RTS's (500's) aren't so bad though.
Mark
Is WMATA 2070 an Orion VI? If so, it looks pretty odd. It was on the D6 at 16th and K, NW. Also, I saw 2118, the bus which caught the murderer at Friendship Heights. No bloodshed visible.
Yes, those WMATA 20XX series buses are the Orion VI. I rarely see them in DC. I don't think all divisions have them. In Maryland I see many of them on the F4/6.
Wayne
Of the 288 buses that were delivered between 1981-1983, 190 are left. Metro had two mass retirments of the buses in 1998 and 1999 but haven't been so lucky this year even though 150 New Flyers have just come in. Hell, the Flyers are being buried in favor of the RTS.
There are 6 of 10 1981 RTS buses left.
About 75 1982 RTS Buses
And 109 1983 RTS Buses
NYCTA's situation is not so bad when you look at Houston's RTS Buses.
The 6 19 yeard olds usually see base service, especially 1905 which works everyday for about 10 hours on various routes out of the Polk St. Facility.
I don't know much about the engins but I can get the info for you if you just bear with me.
It was nice to see those RTS's down in Houston when I was there last November. Is New Flyer producing some crapy buses or are the drivers and others just not fond of these new buses? I was staying on Westheimer on the 53/82 line and this line was nothing but Low Floor D40's and the occasional RTS's in the 19xx series which had 6V-92TA's and aluminium wheels. Well Thanks for the update down in Houston and keep us posted!
Peace & Blessings
DaShawn
www.transitworld.org
The RTS buses are one of the longest lasting fleets of buses Houston has ever had besides...
GMC New Looks (5300 Series): 3300-3479 Built 1961, retired 1991. There were the 180 "rehabs" Metro rebuilt in the early 80's.
Grumman-Flxible: 1600-1699, built in 1979 in an order of 326. 226 were retired in 1982 and these 100 were sent back to Flxible. The last 30 0r so were retired in 1997.
The RTS buses are the last non WC accesible buses in the fleet. Some drivers feel they will never be able to get rid of them in the near future. Metro says, that it's fleet will be 100% accessible by next year, so unless they plan to put lifts on the RTS buses they may be in their last months.
The Flyers are very nice and they took over the 82 line when they first arrived in 1996. They tried to do the same on the 53 in 1997-1998 but the RTS reclaimed it until Metro moved all but 10 of West's Facility's 60+ RTS buses to Fallbrook and Hiram Clarke last summer. It's just the RTS buses are the most reliable buses ever and many have not been rebuilt or overhauled in anyway. Many drivers prefer them because they don't breakdown as much and many are still quite fast. Unfortunately, Metro has governed some of them down to 52 mph and they struggle to maintain speed on the freeway. 2153, one of the slowest RTS buses in terms of acceleration can do 70 on the freeway. It also has the worst AC of all the buses. 2088, 2110, and 1229 are the only buses with out aluminum rims now. 2117, 2128, and 2125 just got the new rims added in the past few weeks and some buses have new motors so I don't really know what Metro plans to do with these
I can't believe you saw RTS buses on either the 53 or 82 in November because by then both were totally D40LF territory.
I think some of those Grummans you mentioned were sent to Green Bus Line in the mid 80's(They were renumbered 544-549 and lasted to 1990/1991)
I know 1054 was sent to NJ Transit and operated as 2599. I didn't know about the GBL's though.
They were,they had blue cusioned seats right.
Yep.
Thanks for the information! I only saw the RTS's on the 53 during the PM rush hour. About 7pm maybe but not later than 7:30. The 82 had nothing but D40LF's, not one RTS. I did see alot of them downtown though. And this is also where I saw my first New Flyer Viking D45S! They are interesting and huge! The power of Houston shuttles had everything on them. I can definitly say that Metro has an interesting fleet.
Peace & Blessings
DaShawn
www.transitworld.org
Had you come here in 1997 you would have seen...
The remaining Grumman Rebuilds
Eagle 10's
Flxible Metros
Marco Polo Buses
30ft. Neoplans
Crown Articualted
Alas, they have all been retired. Some of these fleets were whole fleets back then. When you arrived in November they had just pulled the last Flxible Metros and eagles off the road and auctioned them off.
DAMN! I called myself looking for the Flxible METRO's! Do you know what kind and year they were? I have a model that one of my best friends gave me! Were they similar?
Thanks again!
DaShawn
www.transitworld.org
Did you have any low floor bus or double-deck bus in NYC? i'm curious because we got a lot in Hong Kong.
One of our depots has new low floor CNG Flyers. We've hadn't had any double deckers for well over 20 years.
The new Sunday Service In Phoenix is great.
For the month of September Every Sunday Bus Trip (4:05 am - 1Am) Is free.
Is There any other citys transit have free days for all lines?
There are none that I know of, but when I was younger, after 8pm on New Years Eve, NYCTA was free to ride. Also for the whole year of 1990, Capital Metro in Austin, TX was free.
B61 Leonard
Please correct this where needed
N91 JFK Flyer ??
M99 Nassau Hub Shuttle ??
N6 Mitchell Field
N17 Mitchell Field
N20 Mitchell Field ---what is the Flushing routing
and Hicksville turnaound routing
N21 Mitchell Field
N22 Mitchell Field
N22A same
What is the Hicksville Routing
N23 Mitchell Field
N24 Mitchell Field
N26 Mitchell Field
N27 Mitchell Field
N28 Mitchell Field
N35 Mitchell Field
N40/41 Mitchell Field
N45 Mitchell Field
N46 Mitchell Field
N47 Mitchell Field
N48 Mitchell field---what is the Hicksville Routing
N49 Mitchell Field
N50 Mitchell Field
N51 Mitchell Field
N54 Mitchell Field
N55 same as above
N57.58 Mitchell Field
N70/71/72 Mitchell Field
N73 and N74 Mitchell Field==what is the Hicksville routing
N78.79 Mitchell Field
N80/81 Mitchell Field
what is the Hicksville routing
JB87 Jamiaca--Long Beach--= Mitchell field
N90 Medical Ctr Park and Ride-Mitchell Field
N94 Woodbury Shuttle??????
N98 Farmingdle Shuttle----Mitchell Field
ROCKVILLE CENTER GARAGE
N1 What is the Valley Stream Green Acres Routing
N2 Mitchell Field on Weekends
N3 same question as the N1
N4
N14
N15
N19
N25 Mitchell Field on Weekends
N31
N32 Mitchell Field on Weekends only
N33 Mitchell Field on weekends
N36
N37 Mitchell Field on Weekends
N62 Mitchell Field on Weekends
JB88 Freeport to Jones Beach
N97 Lynbrook RR Long Beach
I need your help
The Hicksville Area has changed and the area frmo Valley Stream to Green Acres
Thank you
Steve
I believe N91 is out of Mitchell Field, but I have to cehck on that for you.
B61 Leonard
Spotted on a rerouted B43 at Parkside and Flatbush. Is this highest number in for the low floor?
B16#917Mike
I believe so. The highest that JG will get will be 989. Looks like JG is almost done with this order.
B61#867Gary
970 is at Atlantic Diesel on Long Island. This is the highest I've seen so far.
Isn't it odd for an order to take so long being delivered as these CNG New Flyers have? Why have they dribbled in so slowly?
24 newark elizabeth----o n e
12(part time non contracted)
44 Tremont ---O N E
302 Newark-Newark Airport (AIRLINE)O N E
306 The Loop --O N E
(306 is an INTERNAL Line Code ONLY
O N E is now COACH USA
ACADEMY BUS
2 Secaucus ---Journal Square
18-22 Plainfield ---North Plainfield
Internal line code is the 51)
61 Monmouth Beach ---Newark via NJ 36
88 North Blvd====Journal Square
123 Union City--NY
125 Journal Sq--NY
322 Meadowlands Park and Ride-Meadowlands Plaza-NY
323 Gardens State Arts Ctr Park and Ride---NY
Metro Park Loops 1 to 5
(Internal Line Codes 801 to 805)
M10 New Brunswick-Woodbridge Center
M11 New Brunswick South River
M13 Perth Amboy--Middlesex County College
M14 North Brunswick==New Brunswick-Middlesex CC
M15 New Brunswick---Woodbridge Center
M17 Perth Amboy-Campbells Junction
M18 New Brunswick--Old Bridge
M19 Piscataway-Plainfield--Metuchen--Middlexsex Mall
(M10 to M19 use INTERNAL Line Codes 8__)
TCT TRANSIT
M20 Asbury Park -Pt Pleasent Beach
M21 Red Bank Monmouth Mall--Long Branch
M22 Red Bank Monmouth Mall--Asbury Park
M23 Red Bank-Freehold Raceway Mall
M24 Red Bank-Highlands
M25 Red Bank-Sea Bright
M26 Asbury Park--Freehold
M27 Long Branch -Asbury Park -Seaview Sq Mall
(M20 to M27 use INTERNAL Line Codes 83_)
PABCO
MCM1 Morristown -Boonton
MCM2 Morristown- Morris County Colege
MCM3 Morristown- Livingston Mall
MCM10 Mrristown - Rockaway Mall
(THese use INTERNAL Line Codes 871 872 873 880)
LAFAYETTE AND GREENVILLE
305 Liberty State Station Park and Ride
(305 is INTERNAL Code ONLY)
LION CORP of Bristol ,Pa
976 lawrence --Princetown Junction Rail Shuttle
977 West Windsor -Princetown Junction Rail Shuttle
COMMUNITY
351 Meadowlands Sports Complex--NY
970 Passaic-CLifton --Totowa --Wayne
971 Paterson--Totowa--Wayne
RED AND TAN -COACH USA
978 Newark---Raritan Center
979 Irvington--Raritan Center
SUBURBAN
139 Lakewood--Old Bridge-NY Via Route 9
884 Clinton ---Sommerville Connection
980 Centenial Av Employers Shuttle
986 Murray Hill Connection
989 Hillsborough --Bedminster
TOWN AND COUNTRY
965 County College of Morris-Parsippany
965 Convent Station Employer Shuttle
967 Sparta Diamond Express
973 Downtown Hackettstown Shuttle
TRANS_BRIDGE
250 Allentown ===NY
251 Doylestown--Frenchtown--NY
(250 and 251 are internal Line codes ONLY)
SALEM COUNTY TRANSIT
423 Penns Grove--Pennsville--Wilmington Delaware
468 Penns Grove--Mannington--Woodstown
COMMUNITY TRANSIT
751 North Bergen ==Edgewater--Paramus
752 Oakland--Ridgewood- Hackensack
753 New Milford--Paramus
755 Edgewater---Paramus
756 Fort Lee--Paramus
758 Passaic ===Paramus Park
762 Hackensack--New Milford---Paramus
770 Paterson---Hackensack
772 New Milford---Moonachie--Secaucus
780 Englewood--Passaic
DELAWARE RIVER of Bethelhem,Pa
890 South Main St
891 Hackman St (North Main St)
I recently heard a rumor about Lakeland possibly going under and NJT taking over its routes. Given what this group has already seen with rumors, I gotta wonder....
Still, could there be anything to this rumor? If so, then (1) would NJT operate the routes directly, contract them out, or discontinue them; and (2) what route numbers would NJT assign?
MCMI* 6,9,11 if PABCO takes over. LL 78 would be dropped and MTD service added to Gladstone Branch if Amtrak okays it. MCMI 12 would most likely be a Newark Route and MCM 4 given full service with 11 to Chester. If NJT takes over parts of LL 46 will become PABCO 6 and 9 with the rest dropped and full service given to MCM 5. The D would come in to Morristown and the A to Dover. This is a list of what PABCO would look like if it took over Lakeland
2569-2580 RTS 30'
misc RTS 40'
misc MCI
misc Flxible Metro-B & D Suburban
*Morris County Metro Interstate
Very interesting!
Are there any definate plans for this or when it will be happening?
I've always wanted to ride the Lakeland routes, but never had a chance. Guess I better make a chance soon!
This is in place,,,as of Jan 2000,,,I will be updating this list within the next few days
All of my documents come directly from the Agencies involved
Steve
740 Paterson ----Parsippany----UPS
----unk carrier
Last year ,I printed a Full Listing of all of the NJT Bus Routes
I am going to print the updated material only
ESSEX LOCAL ROUTES
39 Chanceller Av-Kearney Av
40 Kearney===Jersey Gardens
41 Park Av
111 new York ---IKEA---Jersey Gardens IRONBOUND GARAGE
323 PNC Arts Center--Park and Ride
381 Bayonne HBLRT Shuttle=====IRONBOUND
381 is an Internal Number only
502 Atlantic City-Hamilton Mall- Atlantic/Cape Community College
508 Atlantic City ==Richard Stockton COllege-Hamilton Mall
If you have any questions ,,let me know
steve
If you want me to do the WHOLE list,,I will !!!!
Essex Local Lines
1 Newark
5 Kinney
7 City Subway
11 Newark --Willowbrook
13 Broad St-Clinton Av
21 Main St
25 Spingfield Av
26 Irvington---ELizabeth
27 Mount Prospect
28 Newark -Montclair State-Willowbrook
29 Bloomfield Av
34 Market St
37 Lyons Av
39 Chancellor Av--Kearney Av
40 Kearney==Jersey Gardens
41 Park Av
42 18 Av
43 Newark --Jersey City
Union Local Lines
52 Morris Av
56 Elizabeth =Winfield
57 Tremley
58 Elizabth--Kenilworth
59 Plainfield --Newark
Newark Suburban Lines
62 Newark -Woodbridge--Perth Amboy
65 Newark --Somerville
66 Newark --Mountainside
67 Toms River--Lakewood--Newark---Jersey City
68 East Brunswick--Jersey City--Weekhawkin
70 Newark--Livingston Mall
71 Newark -West Caldwell
72 Newark -Paterson
73 Newark -Orange--Livingston
74 Main Passaic
75 Butler--Newark
76 Newark-Hackensack
78 Newark--Secaucus
79 Newark--Parsippany Express
Hudson Local Lines
80 Newark Av
81 Greenville
82 Hudson
83 Hackensack-Jersey CIty
84 Bergenline---Park Av
85 Hoboken --Harmon Meadow-Mill Creek
86 Nungessers--Exchange Place
87 King Drive
89 North Bergen --Hoboken
Essex Crosstown Lines
90 Grove St Crosstown
92 Orange Crosstown
93 Bloomfield -City Subway
94 Stuyvesant Crosstown
96 18 street crosstown
97 East ORange --Montclair
99 CLifton Av Crosstown
Essex Interstate Lines
107 Irvington -New York
108 Newark --New York
Somerset-Middlesex-Union Interstate Lines
111 NY--IKEA---Jersey Gardens
112 Clark--NY
113 Dunellen -NY
114 Bridgewater--NY
115 Rahway-NY
116 Perth Amboy-NY
117 Somerville-New York Express
Hudson Interstate Lines
120 Bayonne =Wall St Express
121 North Bergen -Union CIty--NY
124 Harmon Cove--NY
126 Hoboken-NY
127 Ridgefield-Union CIty --NY
128 Boulevard East -NY
129 Secaucus =NY
Monmouth -Ocean Interstate Lines
131 Sayreville --NY
133 Old Bridge-Aberdeen-NY
134 Browntown --NY
135 Freehold--Matawan --NY
137 Toms River--NY
138 East Brunswick--NY
139 Lakewood-Old Bridge--NY via Route 9
Bergen (PABT) Interstate Lines
144 Fairlaw n -Hackensack --NY
146 Midland Park --Fair Lawn --NY
154 Fort Lee-Palisades Park --NY
155 Bogota--Ridgefield Park-NY
156 Englewood CLiffs-NY
157 Teaneck-Ridgefield Park -NY
158 Fort Lee--Edgewater --NY
159 Fort Lee--NY
160 ELmwood Park --NY
161 Paterson --Passaic --NY
162 Maywood=-NY
163 Ridgewood--NY
164 Midland Park --NY
165 Westwood ==NY
166 Dumont--Tenafly--NY
167 Harrington Prk ==Dumont ==NY
168 Paramus --NY
Bergen (GWBBS) Interstate Lines
171 Paterson --NY
175 Ridgewood -NY
178 hackensack--Ny
181 Hoboken ---NY
182 Hackensack---NY
186 Dumont--NY
188 River Road--NY
Passaic (PABT) Interstate Lines
190 Paterson-NY
191 Willowbrook-Little Falls--NY
192 Clifton-NY
193 Pompton Lakes--Packanack Lake-Willowbrook---NY
194 Newfoundland -NY
195 Willowbrook-Cedar Grove--NY
196 Warwick--NY
197 Warwick--Wayne--NY
Northern Airport and Special Service Lines
301 Vernon Valley--Action Park --NY
303 Newark Penn Station -Broad St Shuttle
304 Pathmark Shuttle
(304 is an INTERNAL Number only )
308 Great Adventure Amusement Park ---NY
Southern Airport and Special Service Lines
313 Cape May==Philadelphia
315 Cape May--Philadelphia
316 Cape May--Wildwood-Philadephia
317 Asbury Park --Fort Dix--Philadelphia
318 Great Adventure AMusement Park---Philadelphia
319 NY ---Atlantic City Express
Northern Park and Rides
320 North Bergen Park and Ride---NY
321 Vince Lombardi Park and Ride--NY
Rail Substitution Services
330 AMTRAK
331 PATH
332 NEC and Princetown Branch
333 North Jersey Coast Lines
334 Raritan Vallley Line
335 Morris and Essex Lines
336 Boonton Line
338 Bergen COunty Lines
337 Main Line
339 Pascack Valley Line
340 Atlantic CIty Line
341 PATCO
347 Newark CIty Subway
Sports Complex and Racetrack Lines
351 Meadowlands Sports Complex --NY
School Services
372 Bloomfield HS Service (372 Internal line number)
362 Linden HS Service (362 internal Line Number)
363 Ridgewood /Paramus Catholic HS Service
(363 is an Internal LIne Number only )
the 372 362 363 are school runs of the 34,62,163-Note this
Contract Services
381 Bayonne HBLRT Shuttle (381 is an Internal Line Number )
Miscllaneous Services
390 Northern Division Mail truck
394 NY LOt Person ----38 St
399 Southern Division Mail Truck
C-Lot NY Lot Person--C Lot
(uses 1190 Internal Line NUmber)
South Jersey Interstate Lines
400 Sickerville -Phil
401 Salem--Phil
402 Pennsville-Phil
403 Turnersville --Lindenwold---PATCO--Phil
404 Cherry Hill Mall--Pennsauken--Phil
405 Cherry Hill Mall-Merchantville-Phil
406 Berlin--Marlton --Phil
407 Phil-Merchantville--Moorestown Mall
408 Milville-Phil
409 Trenton ---Willngboro--Phil via route US 130
410 Bridgetown-Phil
412 Glassboro-Phil
413 Phil--Mount Holly-Burlington
419 Burlington --Riverside -Phil via River Road
South Jersey Local Lines
450 Cherry Hill Mall-Audubon-Camden
451 Echelon Mall--Camden
452 Camden-Pennsauken Av
453 Camden-Ferry Av (PATCO)
454 Lindenwold (PATCO) Haddonfield(PATCO)
455 CHerry Hill Mall---Woodbury--Paulsboro
457 Moorestown Mall--Camden
459 Echelon Mal--Camden County College--Avandale
460 Camden School Service
463 Woodbury ==Avandale Park and Ride
Atlantic Local LInes
501 Atlantic City --Briganline Beach
502 A.C.==Hamilton Mall--Atlantic/Cape Community College
503 A.C. School Service
504 Bungalow Park--_Chelsea Heights--Ventnor Plaza
505 A.C. ---Margate--Longport
507 A.C.--Ocean City
508 A.C---Richard Stockton COllege--Hamilton Mall
509 A.C.--Somers Point-Ocean City via New Road
Atlantic Suburban Lines
551 Phil---A.c.---Ocean City
552 Cape May--A.C.
553 Lindenwold--PATCO--Atlantic City (A.C)
556 Substitute A.C. Rail Line Service
(556 is an INternal Line Number only)
559 Lakewood-Atlantic City
Mercer Local Lines
600 Trenton -Plainsboro
601 Trenton-COllege of NJ--White Horse
602 Pennington --Trenton
603 Mercer Mall--Quaker Bridge Mall--Hamilton
604 East Trenton --Trenton Rail Station
605 Montgomery -Princeton-Quaker Bridge Mall
606 Princeton--Mercerville Hamilton square
607 Ewing-Trenton--Independance Plaza
608 Hamilton --West Trenton
609 Ewing ---Quaker Bridge Mall--Mercer County College
610 Trenton School Service
611 Perry Street Park and Ride
Passaic Local Lines
702 Paterson---Elmwood Park
703 Haledon ---East Rutherford
704 Paterson==WIllowbrook Mall
705 Passaic --Wilowbrook Mall
707 Paterson --Saddlebrook
709 Bloomfield --Paramus
712 Hackensack---Willowbrook Mall
722 Paterson ---Paramus Park
742 Paterson-- Greystone Park Hospital
744 Passaic --Wayne
746 Ridgewood--Paterson
748 Paterson----Wayne--willowbrook Mall
Bergen Local Lines
758 Passaic--Paramus Park
770 Paterson---Hackensack
Operational Training
900 to 920 are Fare Simulation Training Routes
921 to 934
Please keep this list,,the List I did last year was erased from the Bus Talk Files as everything else from that period
If the route is not here,,,it might be a Contracted Route
Steve
The 319 actually goes to Cape May.Some of the buses terminate at the Atlantic City Bus Terminal
If you want a full route Description of the 319 ,,I have it
This list only gives the line"NAMES"
variations
Wildwood --NY
Signs
319 Wildwood
319 via Atlantic Cy
319 New York
319 Wildwood
319 Atlantic City
During non summer months ,Selected trips will terminate at the Atlantic City Bus Terminal ,displaying Atlantic City Destination Signs
During non Summer Months,,trips will operate only between Atlantic City and Wilwood,,,displaying Wildwood Destination Signs
-------------------------------------------
Atantic City Service
to New York
Signs
319 New York
to Atlantic City
signs
319 Atlantic City
---------------------------------------------
NEWARK./JERSEY CITY SERVICE
to Newark /Jersey City
to Atlantic City
Signs
319 Atlantic Cy
319 Jersey City
319 via newark
----------------------------------------------
Newark /Jersey City Broad St Service
to Newark /Jersey City
Signs
319 Jersey City
319 via newark
---------------------------------------------
Lincoln Harbor/Jerzey City & Newark Service
to Atlantic City
319 Atlantic Cy
========================================
Cape May-Wildwood-Ocean City -Atlantic City ---NY Semi Express Service
to NY or Newark-Jersey City
319 New York
319 Jersey City
319 via Newark
to Cape May
319 Wildwood
319 Cape May via
319 Atlantic City
---------------------------------
NY Atlantic City---Wildwood-Cape May--Express Servcie
to Cape May
319 Express
319 cape May
via Wildwood
to New York
319 New York
---------------------------------------------------
Cape May --Wildwood--Ocean City --New York Semi Express Servie
to New York
319 New York
to Cape May
319 Wildwood
319 Cape May
319 via OCean City
-------------------------------------------------
Cape May----Wildwood--New York Expresss Service
to New York
319 New YOrk
to cape May
319 Cape May Exp
319 via Wildwood
--------------------------------------------------
Cape May --Wildwood--Atlantic CIty --New York Semi Express Servcie
to New York
319 New York
319 Atlantic City
to Cape May
319 Wildwood
319 Cape May via
319 Atlantic CIty
--------------------------------------------------
PNC Arts Center Request Servcie
to Atlantic City /Wildwood
319 Atlantic City
Cape May--Atlantic CIty -New York Local Servcie
to New York
319 New York
to Cape May
319 Wildwood
319 Cape May via
319 Atlantic City
Thanks Steve for the codes. Very Interesting stuff!
all from Offcial sources only
all from Offcial sources only
FYI - A couple of corrections on the Atlantic Suburban Lines:
553 - Upper Deerfield - AC
554 - Lindenwold PATCO - AC
Also, under Bergen (PABT) Suburban:
There are a few modifications to the 144/148/164 schedules
145 - Fair Lawn - NY (This is a new route that has been set up to accomodate the reconstruction project at NJ 4/NJ 208 in Fair Lawn)
148 - Midland Park - Fair Lawn - NY (This was listed as 146)
The 144, 164, and 175 are being rerouted due to the new roadway configuration.
I would guess maybe CUSA/Community Coach? ISTR they ran a shuttle between Passaic and Paramus (745) during the NJ 4/NJ 17 reconstruction project last year.
I didnt list a route 745??
I stand corrected. It was the 775, not 745. And, I think that service was only operated as part of the NJ 4/17 reconstruction project.
Citing possible failures of Bendix ABS units installed on some 1998-2000 school buses, Thomas Built Buses has sent a letter to major school systems recommending inspection of brake systems until repair/replacement brake units can be shipped in November.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A805-2000Sep1.html
I have devised this route:
BM34: ENY/Spring Creek Express:
From Linden Blvd/ Drew St to Columbus Circle.
Via: Linden Blvd thru Caton to Prospect Expwy, BBT, Lower Manhattan, M15 route to 57St. Across 57St to Columbus Circle.
The TA version would be the X26..........
Command version: BM34
Thank you
BM34x
I like it!
Peace & Blessings
DaShawn
www.transitworld.org
The following items are currently being offered on eBay; the item number is followed by a brief description: 427404210-New York Susquehanna & Western 1949 Timetable; 427408296-New York Ontario and Western 1945 Timetable; 427411398-Erie Railroad 1945 Timetable;
427713572-Silver Leaf Rapid Transit BMT Standard Subway Car Brochure;
427718580-Silver Leaf Rapid Transit Design Book No. 2; 427722291-Silver Leaf Rapid Transit Design Book No. 3; 427738609-Book “Subway to the World’s Fair 1939-1940” by Kramer;
427744779-Philadelphia Transportation Co. 1964 35th Anniversary Annual Report;
426373704-PATCO Lindenwold June 1969 Timetable;
426377287-PATCO Lindenwold January 1969 Timetable; 424650371-PCC Book, 390 All Color Photos including Brooklyn, Newark and Philadelphia;
428472206-Philadelphia Rapid Transit 1907 Annual Report;
426448796-Philadelphia Rapid Transit Original 1916 Guide;
427413879-New York Yankees and Brooklyn Dodgers 1943 Doubleheader Ticket;
427415791-Book “North New Jersey Rapid Transit” by Quinby;
427446510-Hudson and Manhattan and Gimbels Brochure;
427473034-Timetable BMT Fulton Street Line, Lefferts Avenue Queens pre-IND;
427476464-Timetable Hudson and Manhattan Tubes 1955;
427797772-New Haven Railroad Motorman’s Operating Manual for Electric Locos Circa 1915; original, not a reproduction;
427968957-Timetable BMT Myrtle Avenue Line, Bridge Street 1956.
I was by Queens Center today and saw that 59 Ave by JCPenney's is now 1 way. Traffic is going eastbound on 59 Ave. I saw no signs of either the Q29 or Q38 in either direction. Where do they go? Were they rerouted to 57 Ave both ways? The Q88 goes down 94 St to 57 Ave then goes to 92 St. I saw 1 in the distance.
Q53#3000Gary
The traffic pattern around Queens Center was altered to ease flow and (possibly) accommodate the mall's future expansion. In particular:
* 59 Av: one-way eastbound from Queens Blvd to Junction Blvd
* 57 Av: one-way westbound from Junction Blvd to 92 St, and from 90 St to Queens Bvd; two-way between 92 St and 90 St.
* Q29 northbound, Q38 clockwise: unchanged.
* Q29 southbound, Q38 counterclockwise: via 57 Av, left Queens Blvd or Hoffmann Pl, right Woodhaven Blvd. New stop on 57 Av, far side of 92 St.
* Q88 westbound: via Horace Harding, right 94 St, left 57 Av, left 92 St, to terminal stand in front of Modells (between 57 Av and 59 Av). No more using the 92 St-Queens Blvd-59 Av loop. New stops on 94 St (at 58 Av) and on 92 St (new terminal stand).
* Q88 eastbound, via 92 St, left 59 Av, then regular.
When I was there on Saturday (Sept. 2), Queens Center security personnel were directing traffic on 92nd Street.
A Statement and a question:
There is no Hoffman Place. The street that goes behind the hospital is called Hoffman Drive.
What do you mean by Q38 (counter)clockwise?
The Q38 is a U-shaped route. From 62nd Drive at 108th Street, it runs along 62nd Drive, 63rd Drive, Penelope Avenue, then snakes around Metro Mall and returns on Eliot Avenue to LeFrak City.
The route is 4 to 5 miles long, but the two legs (and the terminals) are only about a quarter-mile apart. Each leg runs east-west, so eastbound on one becomes westbound on the other. The only accurate way to describe it is clockwise (toward LeFrak City) and counterclockwise (toward Forest Hills).
Buses are using Hoffman Drive,,,not Queens Blvd
Many schools have started today, and more will begin during the week. NYCTA however, is still running a summer (school closed) schedule. The summer schedule ends Saturday, September 9, 2000 upon which we will begin a normal "school-open" schedule starting Sunday, September 10th.
For the next few days, you may experience extremely long waits for your bus, and when it does finally come, it might be too crowded to stop. Give yourself plenty of time for the next few days- leave your home a little earlier than you normally would to be sure you get to work on time. Combine this schedule with all the construction and road-blocks, and you could find yourself at least 45 minutes late for work.
If you experienced "flagging" (a bus that bypassed you because it was too crowded to stop) today, I urge you to call the NYCTA and demand extra buses for the remainder of the week. Rush hour "extras" can be implemented, but only if you complain about the service. Unfortunately for about 50 people, 3 buses in a row bypassed them (mine included) and I'm sure they were all late for work. I did what I could in the way of paperwork submitted to the depot, but the rest is up to you.
Anyway, remember school opens again this week, so drive extra carefully!
Wound up on Doremus Ave in Newark Monday afternoon, and found Nimco's scrapyard. I'm planning another trip down there because someone else's scrapyard has some other interesting things. Anyhow, I got pictures of some QS, NYCT, and MDOT buses in various conditions (mostly on their sides, stacked)
I will post them as soon as I find either the cable to connect my digital camera to my laptop, or a flash-card reader.
-Hank
Oh, you were in the scenic area!
I drove down there not too long ago to check out the scrapyard, but there was a cop standing near by and he stared at me the whole time. He got me uncomfortable so I just turned around and got the hell out of there!
Another time, driving with a couple friends trying to find Jersey Gardens Mall (I wound up in Newark Airport twice), a truck coming the other way splashed buckets of pothole water all over the front of my [daddy's] van. I later found out that it was not just water, but some sort of gunky muck that was encrusted on the paint! It took three trips to the car wash to get it off!
And the smells coming out of some of those facilities are just too funky!
I started waiting for an N20 bus to Hicksville at 5:45pm. The next one was to leave at 5:54pm. But instead, an N21 showed up. So I had to wait some more. About 30 more minutes.
It didn't show until 6:30pm, along with other N20's and N21's behind it.
There was a long line, and an elderly woman who was in pain from standing had to sit in the back (front was taken as usual).
Apparently she forgot to pay, and the driver made a big case of it. After everybody boarded, he refused to move until the woman (in pain at the time) would get up and put her change in the box.
I offered but he wanted HER to get up again and pay. He would not let her pay when she got off.
The bus got delayed 5 more minutes because of the dis-agreement. I know there are rules but the elderly and disabled should be given some leeway.
This was bus number 601, and I do plan on reporting this bus driver. She did finally have to get up and walk all the way to the front of the bus and pay. What the driver should've done was gone back and taken the change from her, that's usually what they do with wheelchair customers.
And when I boarded I asked the driver the reason for delay, he said there was "traffic".
Perhaps the U.S. Open may be adding to traffic in the area, but I find a 30 minute delay unacceptable. I think they need more buses!
Ok John, a couple of points here. While I will admit that the operator did seem harsh towards the elderly woman in pain, a complaint from you will go absolutely nowhere. First of all, the problem did not directly involve you. You are only a third party, which means nothing in the eyes of transit. The only person who can really make a complaint is the elderly woman. Now, this was a problem with an operator doing his job, which is collecting revenue. ALL people boarding the bus through the front doors are obligated to pay upon boarding, which technically does put the woman in the wrong. The operator could even call the police if he wants and have the woman taken off for fare evasion.(How do you know she was really in pain?) Again, pay when boarding, period. I give elderly people slack also but that's the operator's discretion. Another point. Operators are expressly forbidden to handle currency, period. The operators who carry the change up for the disabled can get in trouble for doing that, all though I will admit I do it myself sometimes also. I don't understand why he wouldn't let you pay for her. As long as it gets paid, it really doesn't matter. Next point, about the traffic. Operators ARE NOT obligated to tell the reason why the bus is late. I run late for many reasons also, and yet when someone asks me why I am late I tell them the same thing. TRAFFIC. That's all they need to know. And chances are it probably was traffic. I can recall many times I was 30 minutes or more late because of that. In Brooklyn, I was over an hour late sometimes, especially around the holidays. Yesterday I was 23 minutes late on the Q77 because I had two wheelchairs on my bus at the same time.(they got on at different stops.) Also, there WAS alot of traffic on the road yesterday since people are coming off vacation time after Labor day. So in closing, I would like to say that the most that can happen to this operator is maybe they will lecture him a little about giving nicer customer service and being more sympathetic towards the elderly and handicapped, but he will not get, and I see no reason at all, for any discipline. And since the complaint is not from the elderly woman herself, most likely nothing will be said to him at all. BIG AL
There is another possibility here too. This women might play this game everyday and the driver has seen the act before, unlikely but entirely possible.
Peace,
ANDEE
b/o handling the money is a no-no.
I've also seen them handle Metrocard from Wheelchair customers.
If wheelchair customers can't walk to the front, how are they supposed to pay if the driver isn't supposed to handle the fare?
Unless a passenger boards via the front doors, they are not required to deposit the fare in the farebox. Instead, the BO issues a "fare envelope" in which the fare is to be mailed by the individual. The BO is prohibited from taking a MC from a WC passenger and walking up to the FB, then back to the WC passenger again.
Oh Al, if you noticed that paragraph I described earlier, it doesn't say it's a "rule"... it says to have "compassion". Just follow the bulletins and you'll be fine.
Well I guess at LIB there are no rules, because I've seen wheelchair customers give their fare (usually Metrocard) to the bus driver and he puts it in the farebox. Then again, I've seen many other rules broken at Long Island Bus, like operation of buses with passengers in front of line, picking up and discharging passengers not at a bus stop,etc.
Also it comes to note that on some of the bus, there are missing emergency hatches for the windows, which I believe is a serious federal offense. And not to mention I almost cut myself once on a Long Island Bus with a sharp spot on a severaly cracked seat. And A/C is a luxury in summer.
Well you gotta remember, LIB is a third world operation.
A couple of notes are in order here:
-----
1. Some responders are confusing Long Island Bus with NYC Transit. While both are operating arms of the MTA, they're still SEPARATE and DISTINCT agencies, each with its own rules and policies.
Official NYCT policy DOES NOT allow bus operators to handle fares.
Official Long Island Bus policy DOES have bus operators handle fares paid by those who board through the rear lift.
-----
2. Don't expect any service increases at Long Island Bus. Tom Gulotta froze LIB's budget as part of Nassau County's money-saving "plan."
I'm sure the lovely third world service we have won't improve anytime soon. LIB operates POS buses that probably never see the light of day in NYC Transit, then again, this is LAWWWNNNG ISLAND and you need a car to survive! The attitude of most people on the island is that only crazy people ride the bus and who cares about them!
The attitude of most people on the island is that only crazy people ride the bus and who cares about them!
To make that statement more accurate, replace "island" with "United States."
I do not condone this attitude.
I had assumed that fare handling policies was uniform throughout the MTA. We here at NYCT give wheelchair bound people payment cards to mail back to transit, all though I'm sure most do not bother. I believe however that this policy was discontinued and we no longer have to give them anything, even though I still do anyway if cards are available. The whole payment policy for wheelchairs was really based on the honor system. BIG AL
Get a copy
1=888=NYCT==Bus
Nice little reading booklet
Yeah, I just read through that one a few days ago. Have you noticed the changes between the last edition and this one? Also, more metrocard-related issues.
One thing I don't agree with is this: Our rules dictate one instance, where this guide attempts to override a rule. For example- once a bus pulls away from a stop, we are *technically* prohibited from boarding anyone else. Even if we are at a red light just a few yards from the stop. The guide suggests that we pick up the people out of the "kindness" of our humanity. Remember one important fact: CYA If you are a kind soul, and board someone outside a stop, and that person subsequently falls and gets injured..... customer service wont be there for you. Your GSPT will, along with the rule book. Thats the only problem I have with these "guides".
But anyway.. it was a nice read :-)
If you ever have a person fall down while picking them up away from the stop, and they call you in the office, make sure you shove that page of the guide book right in their face. BIG AL
That won't help. The boss won't give a dame what the book says, that why I don't open my door after I pulled out of the bus stop. I was on the B82 and I had one woman stand in front of my bus trying to get me let her on, I just pulled up my parking brake and sat there. The costmer on the bus tried to get me to get her on the bus but I did not let her on. I did call command to tell tell them what was going on and to get some help. The best part is that there were two cops stading in front for the D train station and did nothing while trafice back up behind me inclouding two other B82 right behind me. Command tolled me two wait five more mins. and then call them back if nothing change. She finel moved after about 8 mins.
Robert
When something like that happens, I simply shut the bus off, dump the doors, and call console via public phone. I explain the situation to the on-board passengers and then get out of the bus. I then explain the situation to console and await their instructions, while looking for any NYPD that might be happening past.
I had an instance on the Q-83 a few years back when a woman seated directly behind me began making "sounds". I didn't think much of it until her sounds began to get increasingly louder. At one point, she started screaming, although I didn't understand what she was saying. I pulled-over, pulled up the brake, turned my head towards her and very respectfully requested that she lower her voice, as it it distracting to my driving. She calmed down, I resumed service. One block later, she began screaming again. Again, I pulled over, secured the brake, and this time explained that the "next time" I have to ask her to quiet down, I was taking the bus out of service. Mind you, I have a swinging rush-hour load here. Well.. after I explained that, she began insults and profanity, but well within the normal converstaion volume range, which I simply ignored and continued on my way.... until... she LEAPED OUT OF HER SEAT, BEGAN STOMPING ON THE BUS FLOOR, SCREAMING ABOUT GOD KNOWS WHAT!!
Well that was the end of that trip. I pulled over at the nearest bus stop, pulled up the brake, shut off the bus, dumped the doors, announced that the bus is out-of-service, and walked to the pay phone to call both console and 911 for police assistance.
The point is, whenever you're in a situation that becomes dangerous to anyone involved, be they passengers, pedestrians, or yourself, the best thing to do is STOP and SECURE that bus. You never know what can happen while your foot is the only thing holding that 40,000 pound loaded vehicle. Mind you, situations such as these are indeed a rarity, but they DO happen, and happen more than you think.
In any event, those officers who stood by were derelict in their duty. Most cops do NOT want to respond to a NYCTA bus call. There's so much liabiliy and responsibility, and compounded paperwork (one officer unofficially told me) that they try and avoid situations involving buses.
CYA is the key... and is also the key where that booklet is concerned. Our rules prohibit opening and boarding passengers outside bus stops, yet that "official" guide tells the general public that we're "showing good customer service" when we do. They don't make any mention that we're *violating the rules* when we do, and as such, are 100% liable for any situation or incident that may occur.....
Ahhh, the many faces of the "suits" that Thurston refers to. I hear ya buddy :-)
That what I did I put the praking brake up and just stood there. But the Passage on the bus just got mad at me and started to yell at me just to let her on.
I also wondering if they chage one thing from the book I have witch is five year old. It is about passage standing behind you look at the back of your head wanting to get off with out saying a word to you. It say that we are to say the stops name and if no one say anything to you just to keep on going. It sayed that "We are not mind readers". I have people diong that all the time and I don't stop unless they say something to me.
I had two woman do that to me on Wensday. They got after I maid my turn off of Ocean Parkway and on to Ave M an the B9. I passed one stop and they said nothing to me so I keep going, I got to Coney Island Ave and no one rain the bell and no one way in the stop so I keep on going. As I went though the stop they both started to screem at me to stop. It was to late of me to stop so I keep on going. I stop at a red light at the next block so they both wanted to get off the bus. I told them that the next stop was on the next block and that when they will be let off.
They both were yelling at me untill they got off. They called the a bad bus driver for not stoping. So they both had to walk back and while they did both B68 passed the stop so they had to wait for the next one.
Robert
Posted by RobertJackieGleason on Fri Sep 8 11:27:23 2000, in response to Re: Bus Operator Guide to Customer Service--just released, posted by Queens_Village_BO on Fri Sep 8 08:43:53 2000
That what I did I put the praking brake up and just stood there. But the Passage on the bus just got mad at me and started to yell at me just to let her on.
Robert, first and foremost, do NOT be intimidated by the riding public. Most of them don't realize the huge responsibility one has when one is a BO. You know your rules, and know how to act during an emergency- like the professional you are. A simple explanation of why you're doing what you're doing will suffice. Then, you're next course of action is seeking official (console) instruction. Many times I've taken the anger and frustration of my riders, and turned it into that of relaxation, using simple reasoning and humor. Everything is situational however. Use your judgement.
I also wondering if they chage one thing from the book I have witch is five year old. It is about passage standing behind you look at the back of your head wanting to get off with out saying a word to you. It say that we are to say the stops name and if no one say anything to you just to keep on going. It sayed that "We are not mind readers". I have people diong that all the time and I don't stop unless they say something to me.
I'll tell you the truth Robert- this is how I get through my day- "What can I do today to not get called into the office"?
When someone approaches the line and stares at my head, it doesn't kill me to utter two simple words: "Getting off?". It's that simple. I don't want to give anyone any reason to feel they should call and complain. If they say yes, then I suggest that the ring the bell next time.
I had two woman do that to me on Wensday. They got after I maid my turn off of Ocean Parkway and on to Ave M an the B9. I passed one stop and they said nothing to me so I keep going, I got to Coney Island Ave and no one rain the bell and no one way in the stop so I keep on going. As I went though the stop they both started to screem at me to stop. It was to late of me to stop so I keep on going. I stop at a red light at the next block so they both wanted to get off the bus. I told them that the next stop was on the next block and that when they will be let off.
It happens. Sometimes, someone will just get up and walk to the read door area and stare at it hoping the bus will stop and the doors will open. Some people aren't very "bus savvy", and don't realize we don't stop (like subways do) at all stops, even when there's nobody in the stop.
You stated you got to CIA but nobody rang. Had you announced "Coney Island Ave next"? If you had, you might have heard the woman say "yes" or "thank you". Those replies mean they intend to alight there. I know announcements can be a PIA, but it is our job, and believe it or not, as in this instance, it would help us. Allowing those women off without incident means no phone call.... which translates into no "See GSPT" slip :-)
If you did announce CIA, and nothing was said or done, there's nothing else you could have done. You did your job. The responsibility of passengers alerting the BO that they want to alight is that of their own.
They both were yelling at me untill they got off. They called the a bad bus driver for not stoping.
Don't sweat it Robert. If you operated according to policy, you have nothing to worry about. You can't please everyone all the time. Close the doors and go about your business. If need be, take a personal at the end, or if truly necessary, right there on the spot. I've done it... close calls... jittery foot.... took 5 minutes out of the seat in the name of safety.
So they both had to walk back and while they did both B68 passed the stop so they had to wait for the next one.
There were 2 ways to avoid that:
1- When they approached the line, you simple ask "Getting Off?"
2- Announce your major stops and listen for any kind of response.
BTW- How long have you been on? You can email me if you prefer. I used to work at Gleason too. Nice garage.
1) I do make my Announcment so that was not the problem. It's that the lines I am on the people don't care about the what they are suppest to do to get off. They think we are they slaves. I don't know about Queens but some Brooklyn passages are like this and they will tell it to your face even if it is not in english.
2) I don't sweat anything anymore. I let it go and not let it bother me after that. I have not been called into the office in about 4 years over any commplants, or for any apples. So I don't care ether way. I feel that tne apples don't halp with getting pomted but commplants can hold you out.
3) I won't have to do this for must longer. I am waiting for a new Moterman claas to start sometime in October or sooner is possable. I failed the first TA check up the Wensday before I claas was starting do to a fast hart beat. They put me down to light work in the dopot. I was put back to full work the next Monday and was told that I got the pomation. My doctor did all the test that was requied be the TA doctors. He say to was do to "White Coat sindro".
Robert
One More thing sorry about the speeling I have learning disablety.
Actually, I very rarely let people on the bus after I have left the stop also. I'm even less inclined to let them on when it's raining because they have a higher chance of slipping while boarding. However I then hear people talking about how mean I am for not stopping to "let that last person on. This used to bother me years ago when I first came on the job, but not any more. I also ocasionally get people screaming and carrying on, on the bus. I do not let this intimidate me as long as they do not get physical. BIG AL
You and I pretty-much operate the same. I agree with most of what you say in this forum.. BTW, what garage are you out of?
Best of luck, and congratulations on your promotion! When you see Dallas Toto.... tell him to get a haircut LOL! I was there when he first came on.
There's a question I have about that book, specifically about freelancing.
I read that basically, you can't freelance, only go on authorized strrets.
Are the only streets that are authorized the ones that bus routes travel on, or are there other streets that routes do not travel on that buses are authorized to go on?
Posted by Tevi on Thu Sep 7 19:50:48 2000, in response to Bus Operator Guide to Customer Service--just released, posted by FDNY on Wed Sep 6 07:13:18 2000
There's a question I have about that book, specifically about freelancing. I read that basically, you can't freelance, only go on authorized strrets. Are the only streets that are authorized the ones that bus routes travel on, or are there other streets that routes do not travel on that buses are authorized to go on?
As I understand it, and I could be wrong, only authorized vans are allowed to run on city streets and charge fares, however they are not allowed to run along streets that are bus routes. They may, at times, run along a certain section of a bus route because of traffic pattern limitations (i.e. one-way streets, dead-ends, etc).
Those vans who are not authorized to run, or run along bus routes are in violation of the law (I belive).
As an aside, and to cover another aspect, all buses have prescribed routes and run-on/run-offs and must not deviate from those prescribed routes unless authorized by NYCTA supervision or the NYPD.
Hello, there. Does anyone know the new dest. codes for the new B6 Limited service? Also, why is there a transferring conflict with the B44 Limited and the B6? Either another fare is deducted, or the mag. reads "wrong bus". Thanks.
I have the readings ,only if you want them ,,see my past posting of a few weeks ago
Steve
Yesterday while in Flushing, I saw 502 on the Q66 run 131- which is a very rare site for QS. I thought they weren't going to do this anymore cause someone got mad.
Q104#529Gary
Does anyone know anything about the Prevost model TS-102 Champion ? Were they the first 102 inch intercity coach anywhere or does the MCI-6 have that distinction ? How many of them were produced and to whom were they sold ?
Research shows that there were only five of these built, with two sold to Asbury Park-NY Transit in 1973 and three in 1974 to the same operator. That definitely makes the MC6 (and Eagle Model 07) the first intercity 102s as both were built around 1969-1970.
Last night, CBS News 2 at 11, air a special report on the Green and Jamaica line buses, and the polution they cause, because they hadn't switched from diesel fuel, which they are required to by law. Today at five, they followed up on the story, saying that an investigation was being made on the Green and Jamaica bus lines.
Clark Palicka
CEO TrAnSiTiNfO
http://www.transitinfo.cjb.net
This investigation is only going to bring out what is already known by all city officals including Peter Vallone. The known facts,the city controlls theses privite lines,the city owns the buses, they tell them when and how many drivers they can hire,second ,they tell them how many new buses that they put on the road as well as how many can be taken off the road,so all this means is that they,the city, knew all along about this problem,but because is is an election year,this smoke problem has become an issue,also as noted in the interview the donations were to Councilman Dear, not Mr. Weiner if the shoe were on the other foot, this would not be an issue.
Also note, as far as the issue of smoke ,you should have seen the smoke that was coming out of the news van.
[... they tell them when and how many drivers they can hire ...]
No, we are "private" companies. We get a very specific amount of cash to cover operatations (not all are guaranteed a profit), but we decide how many drivers, mechanics, mngt., etc. we need to "make service" on a daily basis.
[... the city controlls theses privite lines, the city owns the buses, ... they tell them how many new buses that they put on the road as well as how many can be taken off the road ...]
The "City" does buy the buses for the "privates". The City authorizes a fleet size & works with the privates on which ones get retired as new equipment arrives. Right now there are a couple of problems in that regard: the City needs to order some more NEW express & local buses, and they need to add more filling stations if they are going to switch to CNG (BTW, the TA is exploring OTHER alternates, so maybe this has something to do with the apparent delay).
Also, the "smoke" comes from the engine (oh what a revelation) some of the problem is the result of that engine needing an O/H, but some of it is just because these engines are old technology.
P.S. As many of you know my company still has a bunch of RTS & MCI diesels.
So, some of this yada yada is just politics.
Disclaimer: I don't work for the MTA, TA or nycDOT & am speaking for myself not my employeer.
Mr t__:^)
Thurston writes:
The "City" does buy the buses for the "privates". The City authorizes a fleet size & works with the privates on which ones get retired as new equipment arrives. Right now there are a couple of problems in that regard: the City needs to order some more NEW express & local buses, and they need to add more filling stations if they are going to switch to CNG (BTW, the TA is exploring OTHER alternates, so maybe this has something to do with the apparent delay).
Are you referring to the deisel-start/electric-run prototypes?
Oh, nice disclaimer, BTW :-)
The TA is looking at some "clean" diesels, some hybrids, & some that exhaust water (there was a short clip from Chicago on Transit Transit showing one of these), so CNG isn't the only game in town.
"Oh, nice disclaimer, BTW :-)"
You never know who is reading posts here, might be a "suit" from the mayor's office or some reporter ... I don't want to have my comments end up on the front page of the Daily News ... "Thurston Clark, Spokesman for Queens Surface Corp. AND nycDOT said .... "
As you've probally seen I do get a lot of work related input from the BusTalk side of this site and sometimes I talk about the subjects in detail ... but that's all part of the learing/enjoyment experience that makes Sub/Bus Talk such a great site ... Thanks Dave
P.S. I love it when I find out something here that a mfg. or the TA thinks they are keeping a secret. (ohhh we were just about to tell you all about that ... yea sure they were)
Mr t__:^)
This seems to be the strangest bus # I ever seen. Why is it numbered 10001 when the rest of the RTS fleet is in the 200-600 #'s. Is that number something special, or did someone goof?
It is REALLY bus 225 or 227, I forget.
Long Beach Transit, out in California, made a big deal of receiving the 10,000th RTS (their fleet #4477) in mid-1985.
Green Bus Lines wanted to play the publicity game, and numbered that bus 10001 and claimed it is the 10,001st RTS bus built.
Strange thing is....LBT 4477 is serial FV823075. FV823076 went to GM Coach Sales, then to Strathcona Transit in Sherwood Park, Alberta. Green Bus Lines 221 is FV823077 (and so on up to GBL 268 at FV823124.
I don't know who can't count -- if LBT 4477 really IS the 10,000th RTS, then the 10,001st one is NOT at Green Bus. (Or vice-versa....)
I wouldn't rattle my brains trying to figure that assignment order. It probably is wrong anyway which makes Steve right, (or something like that.) I have always suspected and found out buses are not built in number order. 4901 is the first NYCTA bus built in that series, then 4900 and 4902-5249 were built, so go figure. I remember seeing 4901 running around in the Bronx while I did the Q44 when the 9350-9699 series weren't finished coming out yet. Also, speaking of those buses, ever notice QV's 9351? It has the old style interior lighting, while 9350 and the rest of that series has the new style. So what does that tell you? BIG AL
In 1985 GBL renumbered bus #221 to 10001 to commerate the 10001st RTS bus produced by GMC. It was done as sort of an answer to a transit agency in Cali receiving the 10000th bus.
Mark
And when I worked at Pan Am Wld Airways we got the second 747 produced, i.e. #731, but we had to wait a year while they played with it (we got it for a "used" price).
BTW, Boeing kept #1.
Mr t__:^)
Pan Am was the first customer for Boeing on the 747, and they did get the first PRODUCTION model. All others before there is a customer delivery are prototypes and demonstrators.
-Hank
Pan Am talked Boeing into taking their "failed" bid for the C-5A and re-making it into a passenger AC ... the rest is history.
BTW, the Douglas DC-10 was the other failed bid, but they sized it down a little.
Mr t__:^)
747 is still a pretty successful airliner. Successful enough that Airbus is building a prototype of LARGER proportion, including a full-length second deck.
-Hank
That would be the 777 you are talking about, with 2 full decks. I believe it has a section for sleeping, like a sleeper train car. The prototype has already been built for a while now. I've seen videos of it flying with a big 777 painted on the tail. I believe the capacity it can hold is 575 passengers, not counting the crew. BTW. I have also seen pictures of the very first 747 built by Boeing. BIG AL
777 does NOT have a full-length upper deck. In fact, it has no upper deck at all. Boeing has no such model in the pipeline. Airbus, however, is building a prototype, dubbed the A-3XX. Th largest passenger aircraft to date is the 747-400X/Stretch, at 264 feet long, and a max passenger capacity of 660. The upper deck runs from the nose to just past the front of the wing. The A-3XX will be 239 feet log, have a full-length upper deck, and have a max capacity of 656, eventually.
-Hank
Hank, I think you have it turned around.
The Boeing 747 was never stretched. Its standard length was always 231' 10" overall, except for the 747SP which was in the 180 foot class. The only things separating the 747-400 from other 747s are wingtip fences and a glass cockpit, among other technicalities.
The 747-400X Stretch you are talking about is a Boeing counter to the A3XX. It was not produced yet.
The A3XX is supposed to be 260 some-odd feet.
I got those numbers right off of Boeing and Airbus' respective websites. The 747-400X is a new thing. The 'stretch' part refers to the upper deck, I think.
-Hank
I think the reason that you have 10001 instead of 221 is that when the RTS 221 arrived in the Mid80's,GBL was starting to phase out it's new look Flexibles which were numbered 201-221(these buses were finallay retired when the 600's RTS's and 700 Classics came in)Thus they still had 221 there at the time and she wasn't retired until 87-89
I remember reading about this in Bus World (and the) LBT article in Bus World's first issue. Since LBT had purchased the first production RTS (RTS II-01), LBT #4701-4715, GMC had arranged for LBT to have the 10,000th RTS. Both buses were featured in a later Bus World article.
Wayne
On Sunday, I drove past and stopped to look in JBL's depot and lot. I noticed a few Triboro Coach RTS's parked in the back. I also noticed there were no Grumman Flxible 870's at all in there. Did these RTS's replace the Flx's? The RTS's looked like they weren't put on the road yet, but probably will be soon for the fall schedules. Does anybody else know anything about this recent transfer of buses with the private lines? BIG AL
Four of the "privates" are controlled by one master & are called the "Cooper group". So they can transfer coaches between themselves as they please.
QSC did transfer some RTS & Orion diesels to them when we got the last of the new Orion CNGs in, but that wasn't recently.
Mr t__:^)
I looked at my DOT yard inventory that I jotted down on 8/23. There were 14 JBL Flx 870's in the yard numbered in the range from 401 - 423. Its a good bet there are few if any left at JBL. If you want pics get to DOT ASAP.
Saw the new decal on the buses today. Red white and blue with a skyline and Mike Quill's head at the bottom.
A couple of Queens division operators who post here were recently talking about the crowded conditons on the buses the first 2 days of this week. Well today, the first day of public school, I drove my youngest son to the neighborhood I.S. and I didn't like was I saw. 3 Q58 buses toward Main St. overcrowded. Bus stops packed with CUSTOMERS waiting for super late Q58's going toward Ridgewood, which were super late arriving due to the hords of kids from Elmhurst & Corona delaying the buses on the way to I.S. 73. I'm sure that TA suits read this board. You guys messed up. I posted a certain word in caps for good reason. You done them wrong. Why wasn't the new pick implimented this week? Just run a school closed schedule Tues. & Wed. so you would be able to provide decent CUSTOMER SERVICE this morning! You are causing undue stress on the drivers and customers. And you expect the drivers to act professional at all times with all this stress? Professionalism begins at 370 Jay St. and it carries itself out into the field.
One word for Brooklyn and Queens-Artriculated buses.There are lines out here that need them more logistically than just throwing them on the upper east side X-town runs to keep the money brokers in this city happy
They aren't happy. Everyone I talk to says things are worse on 79th and 86th Street since they've entered service. The buses are bunched and the trip takes longer. These buses should make their way over to the M15 if you ask me.
The "suits" in my depot have been on my a___ for the past month or so because they want to put the rest of the fleet in the yard in service, but I'm still waiting for locks for the fareboxes ... ah for the lack of a nail ... the good news, the vendor says they shipped the missing item.
BTW, our drivers who have to drive to Manhattan aren't happy campers this week.
Mr t__:^)
A couple of notes here:
1. The Q58 operates out of Fresh Pond depot, and is thus a Brooklyn Division route. (Other Brooklyn Q-routes include Q24, Q54, Q55, Q56, Q59.)
2. The pick implementation date is negotiated between management (the "suits") and labor (TWU/ATU); for the Fall pick in any year, it's traditionally the Sunday following Labor Day. To cover any school days prior to that, the depots or divisions themselves have the power to "put out" additional service on an ad-hoc (and overtime) basis.
I couldn't agree with you more, Bill. As I stated earlier (see "School Open - Summer Schedule"), I knew it would be this way for all involved, especially those routes that are dually affected by construction. What we have here, is the TA saving money by implementing the school-open schedule one week after school begins. It's the same when school ends, as well.
I implored all involved to call "Customer Service" and demand additional bus service for the remainder of the week. The squeaky wheel...
I must add, however, that once we are so late, as in 15-20 minutes, there's no making-up that time. The schedule, for all intents-and-purposes is forgotten. Basically, when that happens, we pull-back and operate extra safely. Because the stress built-up in attempting to maneuver in and around traffic while seemingly getting later-and-later increases, the opportunity for an incident is more likely. At that point, we just relax, take it easy, and let the dispatchers do their job (part of which includes placing extremely-late buses "in place"- where they should be at that given time). If they wave us on (without placing us), we'll be even later.. a lost bus wadering through the streets.
There's no excuse for not placing extra buses out there, or starting the fall schedule one week earlier. The buses are there. The operators are there. The schedule is there. Everything is in place....
Call them and express your displeasure. What more can I say?
Best of luck to those who drive in Manhattan. Thurston, I feel for your guys... even though they give me NO professional courtesy up there on the Pike ;-)
Speaking of which.. when are we all going to get smart and move the QSC bus stop from the corner of Union & Utopia 100 feet west so we don't have buses backed-up across Utopia, or have buses "double-loading" and blocking one another in the stop??
It makes NO sense.... we have use of the ENTIRE block, yet we cramp ourselves into that tiny area. QSC routinely comes in there with 2 or 3 buses as we do with local and limited service... many times, during the AM rush, all at once! Let's do all of us a favor... 5 buses can easily fit between that block. We all pull-in, we all load, we all leave.... and without incident.
Thurston, you're our resident QSC voice. Any input? Ideas?
Talk about a mess, how about the fact that on Queens Blvd where the Q46 pulls into the last stop-the fact that it drops its passengers off on that side but to go back to either SpringField Blvd, 260 St or to LIJ, it has to pick up where the Q74 picks up its passengers now. You also have the Q60 stopping there and you have the Express Buses at the PM Rush stopping there also. Thank God I only have to deal with this in the am rush and not the pm-it's a headache now and for the next 2-3 weeks till the construction is over with.
Q46#4943Gary
Posted by R36Gary on Thu Sep 7 23:46:29 2000, in response to Re: Unacceptable Morning (Bill, Thurston, & all), posted by Queens_Village_BO on Thu Sep 7 18:15:02 2000
Talk about a mess, how about the fact that on Queens Blvd where the Q46 pulls into the last stop-the fact that it drops its passengers off on that side but to go back to either SpringField Blvd, 260 St or to LIJ, it has to pick up where the Q74 picks up its passengers now.
Tell me about it, Gary! LOL What they really should have done was move the Q-60 and X-68 bus stop to the Q-46 LIJ stop at the near-side. Then given us the entire block on the far-side where the Q-60 and express buses stop now.
You also have the Q60 stopping there and you have the Express Buses at the PM Rush stopping there also. Thank God I only have to deal with this in the am rush and not the pm-it's a headache now and for the next 2-3 weeks till the construction is over with.
How do you think we feel? Half our guys will miss their lunch/dinner swings. That will be a nightmare for the schedule, but like you said, it's only for a few weeks. They had all summer to do that work, and decided to start the day school opens... TG I'm not there LOL!!!
Except the TA and private bus companies have little input as to where a bus stop goes. It's almost completely up to DOT.
-Hank
That hasn't stopped us from telling them what we think and if a bunch of folks are willing to put their thoughts in writting so much the better. The people in Queens VOTE and the politations know it, just ask Rudy.
Mr t__:^)
First, I'm not an "official" spokesperson for QSC ... sometimes I print off stuff & hand it over to a maintenance or transportation friend, BUT they don't work for me, I'm a little "suit" here, so it's given as input vs. instructions/orders. Sometimes I get a reply & if it appears to be something of general interest I may post a reply.
Sooooo, if you want someone at QSC or nycDOT to "officially" address your concern "Express Yourself", i.e. call or write (incl. e-mail "info@qsbus.com). All letters & e-mail get written replys.
OK enough of the yada yada so I don't get in trouble with some "suit" here or at nycDOT.
- Delayed service ... if you have some spares in the yard & someone left on the "extra board" you can insert another bus ahead of the problem ... of course it will take some time to get the bus there & the problem may be gone by then, but it is an option ... it's called "service" and some operators pay more attention to it then others.
- Professional courtesy .., some "suit" either in the TA or DOT did that, i.e. the "privates" can't ride for free on the TA fleet either, though we get many folks with TA IDs who try to push their way onto our fleet all the time. Also all the guards at Riker's think they should ride for free ... we don't argue with folks carying guns.
Mr t__:^)
Posted by Thurston on Fri Sep 8 08:20:10 2000, in response to Re: Unacceptable Morning (Bill, Thurston, & all), posted by Queens_Village_BO on Thu Sep 7 18:15:02 2000
First, I'm not an "official" spokesperson for QSC ...
No, I suppose not, but you are here in this forum LOL! ;-)
sometimes I print off stuff & hand it over to a maintenance or transportation friend, BUT they don't work for me, I'm a little "suit" here, so it's given as input vs. instructions/orders. Sometimes I get a reply & if it appears to be something of general interest I may post a reply.
Our "suits" all have shiny gold badges, which means their "input" means "do it.... now" LOL!
Sooooo, if you want someone at QSC or nycDOT to "officially" address your concern "Express Yourself", i.e. call or write (incl. e-mail "info@qsbus.com). All letters & e-mail get written replys.
Not my style Thurston. I explained the situation to my immediate supervisor and left it at that.
However, you have ONE guy who I'd really like to talk to, but I'm not sure I should post too much detail about it here. Let's just say he's a dangerous driver, appears to be an old-timer, and always has a new bus, usually 546 or is it 456/7? I don't recall.. but he's come close to taking my LEFT mirror off 3 times. Once, had I not stopped dead, he would have hit my bus. Nobody understands the job of a BO more than a fellow BO. I extend courtesy to your guys at all times, but rarely if ever get the return courtesy. Hey, we're on the same side here... ya know? I'm on vacation this week... I just may discuss my concerns with him down in Glen Oaks. I'm SURE he knows what he's doing.... he has YET to look me in the eye once, and we've been leap-frogging for almost a year now.
OK enough of the yada yada so I don't get in trouble with some "suit" here or at nycDOT.
You need a disclaimer at the bottom of your messages LOL!
- Delayed service ... if you have some spares in the yard & someone left on the "extra board" you can insert another bus ahead of the problem ... of course it will take some time to get the bus there & the problem may be gone by then, but it is an option ... it's called "service" and some operators pay more attention to it then others.
NYCTA rarely will do that unless the bus was in an accident or disabled. We do have "AA" (as assigned) buses that sit at given points awaiting orders from SLDs. Most of them sit by subyway stations and are reserved for rush-hour additions (extra service where needed).
The guys on "report" (those in the garage who sit around waiting for a piece of work) usually substitute for BO's going sick, BO's late for work, or replacing BO's assigned for random drug testing. Only when the SLD is sure all the work is covered, will they send out a report guy on a run fill-in on the road. Many times, a report (or reserve) guy will be held back in anticipation to cover a complete run for the day. The extra piece of work, maybe a few trips, can be covered by an operator clearing for the day. Many times I've received a call on the bus radio by console asking if I can cover a piece. Usually, I'll keep the bus and start that extra run where I'm needed.
- Professional courtesy .., some "suit" either in the TA or DOT did that, i.e. the "privates" can't ride for free on the TA fleet either, though we get many folks with TA IDs who try to push their way onto our fleet all the time. Also all the guards at Riker's think they should ride for free ... we don't argue with folks carying guns.
Thurston, I *really* shouldn't detail this here, but suffice to say, I believe we're on the same side.... ya know?¿
As far as Correction Officers are concerned, TA policy allows them to ride free. I assume QS policy does not?
Anyway, and as always, more clarification from Thurston!
[As far as Correction Officers are concerned, TA policy allows them to ride free. I assume QS policy does not?]
The problem is that for the TA free rides are no big deal, but here they are taking up space & we get on cash for the seat they occupy.
As I alluded to before, making payroll every week sometimes involves some nail biting (did the City check come in, did the deposit clear, did we get the check for carrying the school kids, etc.) No deep pockets here, but it's a nice place to work because it's a small company where the President may invite you to her house for Christmas dinner (I've had that privladge a couple of times with my wife).
Mr t__:^)
I caught a Transportation friend this moring while I was getting my second cup of coffee ...
Oh yea we know about the "problem" at Union & Utopia.
There's some metered parking & a diner down that block that would need to be removed (the meters not the diner). My friend feels pritty strongly that "we" brought the problem to the attention of nycDOT, but as I said (not directed at you personally, but to anybody reading this) "Express Yourself", at least someone will have to write you an answer, and just maybe they might do something about it. I call myself the tail that trys to wag the (TA) dog & enjoy when I make them squirm in there seats when I hand them a problem, then push them for action. I only get away with this because the mngt. here supports me, provide it's a serious issue that should be addressed.
Mr t__:^)
Posted by Thurston on Fri Sep 8 10:08:13 2000, in response to Re: Unacceptable Morning (Bill, Thurston, & all), posted by Queens_Village_BO on Thu Sep 7 18:15:02 2000
I caught a Transportation friend this moring while I was getting my second cup of coffee ... Oh yea we know about the "problem" at Union & Utopia.
There is a true safety issue there, as you know Thurston. I believe if you had one of your SLDs there during the rush, it would help the issue. Both our SLDs working together while our BO's work together isn't necessarily a bad idea. You have one guy just a few blocks away at 188th & Union, but never get's out of his white Jeep. Maybe he could use the Utopia post instead? I don't know.... I don't know the significance of 188 where QSC is concerned. I do know you have buses coming down (southbound) 188, and buses coming across (westbound) Union.
There's some metered parking & a diner down that block that would need to be removed (the meters not the diner).
Not at all! Here's why- there is posted signage on that block which details "No Parking from 7am - 10am". Effectually, that block is as open to a "rush hour" stop just as the stops you use down at 187th/186th where there are meters. Between those hours, your buses utilize those metered parking spots as bus stops. Once parking is permitted, you no longer need them because the rush is over. Same principle at Union and Utopia! Not only that, but it's a much safer area- no cars turning from northbound Utopia onto westbound Union, less pedestrian traffic, and best of all- we're not fighting each other for the stop, or "racing" each other into Utopia. This is an excellent solution to a problem easily corrected from within...
My friend feels pritty strongly that "we" brought the problem to the attention of nycDOT, but as I said (not directed at you personally, but to anybody reading this) "Express Yourself", at least someone will have to write you an answer, and just maybe they might do something about it. I call myself the tail that trys to wag the (TA) dog & enjoy when I make them squirm in there seats when I hand them a problem, then push them for action. I only get away with this because the mngt. here supports me, provide it's a serious issue that should be addressed.
I've spoken to my supervisor. If I see our Transportation manager, I'll speak to him as well. Meanwhile, on your end, if your suits could sit down there one morning, they'll see what we mean ;-)
To me, it matters not whos stop is moved. The only thing that matters is that we are separated to relieve the congestion in an area that holds 2 buses when 5 come in there at once, backing up Union, blocking Utopia, and causing saftey concerns for operators, pedestrians, school kids, and vehicles involved, when all that really needs to be done is to utilize the entire block which is available to us in the first place :-)
My friend you are starting to talk like a "suit" ... better watch out or they are lible to put you in one ;-)
We once had a problem with a sign, actually the lack there of. It announced our bus line & we wanted to put it up so folks would know where to stand (no bus stop shelter exists there). The City said we couldn't because the job was contracted & the contractor was a union shop. The sign sat in our VPs office for quite a while (we had the sign made to expedite the process).
Mr t__:^)
Posted by Thurston on Fri Sep 8 14:13:43 2000, in response to Union & Utopia bus stop problem, posted by Queens_Village_BO on Fri Sep 8 13:34:50 2000
My friend you are starting to talk like a "suit" ... better watch out or they are lible to put you in one ;-)
That may very well be, Thurston, only the "suit" will be white and have black elsatic/leather straps, and my office- nice cozy-n-comfy padded walls ;-)
We once had a problem with a sign, actually the lack there of. It announced our bus line & we wanted to put it up so folks would know where to stand (no bus stop shelter exists there). The City said we couldn't because the job was contracted & the contractor was a union shop. The sign sat in our VPs office for quite a while (we had the sign made to expedite the process).
You see, now there you go doing things the right way. Take our guys, for example. They have the BMBs make-up a sign, and they install it themselves, right there on-the-spot. No red-tape. No politics. Just a sign, where there should have been a sign in the first place :-) Hey, I've seen SPTs standing on the hoods of their Jimmys installing signs!
I recall last year, I questioned one of our SLDs (who recently was promoted to GS) who was painting a yellow line, and installing a bus-stop sign himself about the legal process, and possible ramifications of what he was doing.
He said, and I quote, ""*$%^$*^#*^$#*^$#*^$#^^%#@^$#*&^%)(*&^_(&*^_(&*^*)&%(&$^(%*^#*%^#$*^$#*^#*^%#*&%^)*(&^_(&*^_(&*^_(^_&*(*.... okay"?
See my point?¿ LOL
We made the mistake of telling DOT that the sign got stolen instead of just relpacing it. Sometimes it's real hard to provide the "service" that the public takes for granted :-(
But, when YOU get the thing done YOU feel real good about it, and if the customer says thank you that's OK too.
Mr t__:^)
is the 55x still an exp. bus onthrid ave. and what type bus do they use ,
i remember the the 4800 gmc type busses
If you're referring to the BX55 3rd Avenue bus, the one that replaced the #8 train, yes it still runs as a limited, making all #8 line stops. It now uses those new articulated buses.
#8 line is also, and more commonly known as the Third Avenue Line.
While the Bx55 still exists, the following points are worth noting:
1. It does not run overnight; Bx15 takes over during midnight hours.
2. Fare policy has changed. Originally, the Bx55 offered transfers ONLY to and from the subway at Gun Hill/White Plains, 149th/Third, and 161st/River; there were no transfers to other bus routes. Current policy treats the Bx55 as just another bus route - i.e. it offers transfers to/from subway only with MetroCard, and to/from bus with card or paper ticket).
3. Since it's just another bus route, the "Request-A-Stop" program is available for passengers disembarking after 10:00 PM.
Also take note, eventhough the Bx15 takes over during midnight hours, it never goes north of Fordham Plaza, thus there is no midnight hour service to Gun Hill Road via Third Avenue.
Also there is no more 161St-River Ave branch. It has been discontinued for a couple of years now...........
B46M Limited
I was very young but I do remember...
1 - The Bx55 began service.
2 - Only the new GMC T6H-5309A (4813-4832,4860-4919) operated on the Bx55.
3 - When they (and Bx29) operated NB on Third Ave and SB on Washington Ave.
4 - Dismantling of the Third Ave El.
5 - When The TA actually referred to the Bx55 as an express instead of limited.
Many subway buff can attest to the fact that once the Manhattan Bridge fiasco started... the once fun-to-ride N train became very dull and boring - and I think the Bx55 has gone in the same direction but maybe not as bad.
Wayne
Another interesting note:
The Bx55's ridership initially FELL due to MetroCard - with ALL routes offering bus-to-subway transfer privileges, riders diverted to the Bx15, Bx41, and the crosstowns.
I understand that the Bx55 was a replacement for the Third Avenue El in the Bronx. What I don't understand is why was there a branch to 161 St & River Ave since the Third Avenue did not run there? Does anyone have an answer?
The idea was to give Third Ave. riders a second subway option (the D/C/4 trains @ 161) instead of the just the one, overcrowded station at 149/Third.
On September 8, 2000, one of my routes, the SM37, will be making a test run from Woodrow Road and Bloomingdale Road to Midtown Manhattan via New Jersey.
The bus will run via Richmond Avenue and Woodrow Road.
The fare is $4. More information can be found on the SILive forum (Traffic and Transit) at www.silive.com .
I would love to launch regularly scheduled service on this route, but I must get a good showing on this trip to do so. Please help support the service because this run will have a large effect on how fast South Shore residents will get express buses.
What other routes ,,do you operate ???
Occasionally, Alcorr does some late runs via Richmond Avenue. Other than that, I am not aware of any more routes.
The special arrangement is that I will plan the route and Alcorr will put buses on it. I have also applied for private funding to put together a South Shore system. That would have five routes in it.
It is truely amazing the scope of the folks that post here !
Maybe Hank can get all the folks on his block to ride the SM37 ;-)
Mr t
What company do you represent? Will your buses be there day after day, and not get pulled for more profitable charter runs?
-Hank
I am planning a regular, reliable line run service. The buses, once in regular service, will be there as long as people continue to ride. We only had 3 passengers today, but the test run still continued to Manhattan. If that was an Academy, that bus would not have gone to Manhattan with just three people on it.
Hopefully, we can get more next time.
Please give a street by street description,,inbound and outbound
My wife and I left Suffolk County NY on Thursday 8/31 to go up to Andover Ma. The main reason for the trip was to attend the wedding of a friend's son in the Andover area. Since we got a good rate we decided in advance to go for a week and make a vacation out of it using the hotel as our home for the week. On Friday and Monday we drove to the Andover Commuter Rail Station and went in by train. Similar equipment to the old LIRR diesel stuff but much, much cleaner. MBTA seems to run an all RTS fleet. Major difference to NYC RTS's is that the rear doors are opened by the B/O and the doors are pulled back by wires. They look like the bat wings like the front doors.
While at the Fine Arts Museum on Huntington Avenue, there were some RTS's run by the Paul Revere Tranportation Co. They looked like they are old NYC RTS's. They are white with the blue stripe. PAUL REVERE TRANSPORT is in White block letters in the blue stripe and the rear door is the passenger operated type. You can just picture where the depot decal would go..Did not get close enough to see the numbers.
Tuesday went up to the Seashore Trolley Museum in Kennebunk. It was after Labor Day and very quiet. Saw MBTA 6169 and old Public Service of NJ # K-514 (TGM 4512 serial #225). The 6169 Fishbowl is missing its builders plate. Did not see any of the other buses Thurston referred to because the wife was eager to proceed further north to Freeport and help LL Bean make their payroll for this week.
Wednesday we stopped at a strip mall in Methuen, MA just outside of Andover. Saw an Orion V with "Lawrence" (MA) as its destination on the digital sign. Simple red stripe on sides with a black back. Similar to the new Suffolk County NY transit buses.
Thursday (today)- While waiting for the 3 PM New London - Orient Point ferry - saw an MCI transit bus running on the street next to the dock...From the front and back it looks like the MCI suburbans run by the NYC privates but it has a second door on the side....How common is this ?????
Its always tough coming home from vacation.....
Yes, those Paul Revere buses were formerly the property of NYCT.
My God, People actually buy used NYCT busses!? They must be masochists!
Peace,
ANDEE
Academy Bus Lines has some ex-NYCT buses.
Here's one of Trevor Logan's Academy RTS pictures of their ex-NYCT pictures.
I saw some Paul Revere ex-NYCTA RTS buses earlier this Summer when I was down at Fenway Park.The Boston Red Sox have a contract with Paul Revere to provide a shuttle service from a parking lot near the park to the Ruggles MBTA Orange Line subway station.I wondered if they were ex-NYC buses,as Paul Revere kept the same color scheme.The ones I saw appeared to be in decent shape,at least on the outside.
The MBTA indeed has an all RTS fleet,numbering about 900 buses or so (I don't recall the exact number),all but approx.30 being 40 footers.The others are 35 footers.The oldest active buses are 1985 GMC, the newest being 1997 Nova Bus built.
The 1991 Orion 1 you saw in Methuen is one of 6 in the fleet of Merrimack Valley Regional Transit Authority (MVRTA). 4 of the 6 are still painted in the old color (white w/ red and blue stripe on sides,white w/blue and red stripe on back) and number scheme (709-712).The other 2,including the one you saw, were rehabbed over a year ago and renumbered from 707 and 708 to 9101 and 9102.They also have (16) 1987 GMC RTS 35 foot all rehabbed and repainted from the over the last 2 years,and renumbered from their original numbers (521-539) to 8701-8716 ( I have been told the remaining 3 were taken off the road for parts) and painted in the new color scheme,which matches the color scheme introduced with 26 Gillig Phantoms 35 footers purchased in 1996 (9601-9614) and 9901-9912 purchased last October.They also have 6 Chance trolley style buses that came into service this past April (2001-2006).
[... went up to the Seashore Trolley Museum in Kennebunk ... Did not see any of the other buses Thurston referred to because the wife was eager to proceed further north ...]
To all:
- The bus fleet (depot) isn't quite ready for prime time yet, but if you ask in advance the staff up there will try & find a way to get you over there. Several Seashore members post here. So e-mail them or myself & it will be my pleasure to forward it to one of them.
[While waiting for the 3 PM New London - Orient Point ferry - saw ...]
It was a nice way to end a mini-vacation ! (vs. driving down 95)
Mr t__:^)
[Thursday (today)- While waiting for the 3 PM New London - Orient Point ferry - saw an MCI transit bus running on the street next to the dock...From the front and back it looks like the MCI suburbans run by the NYC privates but it has a second door on the side....How common is this ?????]
New London is served by SEAT (South East Area Transit?), which has about 20 or so 1992 MCI Classic Transit buses. I believe this was part of an order that also included Connecticut Transit buses. Connecticut Transit has many 1990, 1992 and 1996 MCI Classic Transit buses running in New Haven and Hartford, with a few 1996 buses running in Stamford.
MCI Classics in "transit" configuration (as opposed to "suburban") aren't unheard of.
In the New York area, Green Bus Lines has a few. Elsewhere, Santa Monica Municipal Bus Lines, a.k.a. The Big Blue Bus, has several with both rear doors AND rear windows!! (The air conditioner is on the roof.) Plus they're common in some Canadian ciies.
You can also find them in Western New York State (Rochester and Buffalo). They are plentiful in Canada, particularly in the Province of Quebec.
Also in Toronto and Niagara Falls, NY and ONT
The Niagara Falls, NY, Classics are the same as in Buffalo, as the Niagara Frontier Transit Authority (NFTA), which is now using the name "Metro," serves both cities. Toronto has 84 Classics it received in 1987. I don't know if they are all still running, but there's a good chance most of them are.
Remember that all of TTC's Classics are not MCI's they also have GM Classics which I think are the last produced. The Classics that are at CTTransit are not MCI's but TMCI's. These Classics were the first to be final assembled in Schenecatdy. TransitWorld visited New Haven in February of 2000 and the drivers had explained to us that none of the Classics assigned in New Haven were MCI's and they have white steering wheels. The builders plates stated TMCI model TC-40102A and then the serial #. The other sticker right above the drivers window says MCI Greyhound Canada. They exteriors of the buses don't carry the MCI logo. They are quite nice and they are fast! We at TransitWorld.org were quite impressed. The NovaBUS Classic TDS's up their are very nice and ran well. Does anyone know the difference or have information about TMCI and other TMCI Classics running about? Thanks in advance!
Peace & Blessings
DaShawn
www.transitworld.org
[Remember that all of TTC's Classics are not MCI's they also have GM Classics which I think are the last
produced.]
Actually the GM Classics were the first to be produced. Remember - the first 3 (1600-1602) at NYBS were built by GM of Canada in 1984 (or early 1985).
Wayne
Thanks, but I was speaking about the ones at TTC which were part of the same order I think. The first ones were GM's and the rest were MCI's. If I am not mistaken the GM's were delivered in 1986 to 1987 as part of the same order and the transition took place in 1987 from GM to MCI.
Peace & Blessings
DaShawn
www.transitworld.org
You are correct about the 1987 order winding up split between GM and MCI. One of the roster links on Bus Rosters on the Web gives the following information for those TTC Classics:
6210-6266 57 JN87-NO87 GMDD TC40-102N
6267-6293 27 JN87-NO87 MCI TC40-102N
Thank you Sid! I knew you or someone in the Bus Talk community would know for sure. It's hard to keep up on all this great information! LOL! Would you know about the TMCI thing? I am still puzzled about that one! It was quite interesting at the same time. Thank you again for the information.
Peace & Blessings
DaShawn
www.transitworld.org
Hi,
just a few things about the MCI Classic. First built in 1983 at the GM plant in St-Eustache, Qc. The reason why they are so many in Quebec is that the province would only subsidise buses built in Quebec, thus the mass quantity of them. Sold to MCI in 1988, then to NovaBus (Bombardier) in 1993 and to Prévost in 1998.
Available in suburban, single rear and double rear door configuration.
Air conditionners include Carrier (rear mount) and Sutrak (top mount).
The last Classic rolled out of the production line in 1997. It is now in Hull, Quebec, numbered 9705.
It was a great bus.
Sorry about the wait Thurston. I'm about 75% done collecting. If you've been trying to e-mail me, I haven't responded because I can't get into my e-mail at this time. I'll send all the stuff to you as soon as possible.
Message acknowledged ... thanks
Mr t
Shaun (sp?), you asked about our old Flxibles. Here's some info...
Metro ordered their first Flxibles in 1979. They were of course the troubles some 870 moodel. It was an order of 326, numbered 800-1125. 855 burned up and they ordered replacement 1126.
Back in the early 80's Metro was just starting up and was highly reported on bly local media. For the next two years they were highly scrutanized about the poor maintenence of the bus fleet they inherited from Houtran and Rapid Transit before them.
Besides the Grumman 870's, they had the always hot RTS-II's, and the old and worn out New Looks. Thet rehabbed 180 New Looks and retrofitted the RTS's with Sutrac roof-mounted A/C units.
Unfortuantely they felt the 870's had to go. In 1981 they ordered 10 RTS buses, 1901-1910. They were a success so over the next two years Metro recieved over 250 more of them.
In 1983 as the last RTS buses were coming in, Metro pulled 226 870's from the road and placed them at McCarty St. Storage were many were sold for parts. The remaining 100 were sent back to Flxible to be rebuilt to the current Metro model standards. They arrived in the summer of 1983 as 1600-1699 along with the last batch of RTS buses, 2136-2188.
In 1985 Metro tried it's luck with the Flxible's again and purchased 157 in 1985. 2200-2356 were slightly different from the 1600's because they didn't have the roff exhaust pipes and had different engines (I don't know the type). Also, on the inside they didn't have the "jelly roll" seats (the seats that had a little roll on the back where a head rest could be) and they didn't have the little scripted Flxible logo on the window latches.
Flxible harmony reigned supreme until July 1996 when D40LF 4000 arrived. The following month, 4001-4029 made their way into Houston. The 1600's were down to 85% of the original fleet. In 1997 it became worse as Metro retired all but 32 of the 1600's. In the fall of '97 the 1600's were a common sight on the 2-Bellaire(VERY), 4-Beechnut, 53-Westheimer Ltd. 65-Bissonnet and the 132-Harwin Express. The last Grumman I rode was 1607 0n the 2-Bellaire line to Westchase. I was fond of the motor so I'd open the window to catch the sound better. Well, it got stcuk and I never closed it. It was probably retired that way. The last one I saw was 1685 rattling to West Garage. It looked horrible and sounded so as well. By 1998, they were on the auction block just like their 226 cousins 15 years before.
The 22xx and 23xx prospered for a few months unti Metro retired 50 of them unexpectedly and they wound up sitting with the 1600's and some RTS buses awaiting their fate. Early 1999 was no better as Metro decimated the fleet and by summer only a mere 30 were left. By fall, 10. The last one I rode was 2347 on the 46-Gessner line and the last one I saw was 2249 on the 17-Tanglewood line. They were retired in October 1999, two years after the 1600's.
As for their engines, I preferred the 1600's better. They had a nice sound and reminded me of a variation of the RTS motor. The 1600's rattled a lot and it was LOUD. It sounded like the bus fell of a mountain when it went over a bus. You couldn't even sit in the front without your teeth being rattled out and without needing earplugs, especially downtown where potholes were at their worst. Also, when thwy turned, the chassis leaned far into the street making it seem like the bus was going to tip over.
As for the 22xx/23xx series, they had a modified version of the 1600 engine. It was quieter in a way and a bit faster. The 22/23xx's were very qucik buses. They rattled as well, but had more of a dull sounding thump, than the 1600's sharp popping. Some of the 1985 models near the end of their lives had a very loud engine. 2233's engine sounded like an Eagle's upon acceleration and then made a sound like puckering your lips together and blowing out air. It was a very sharp, crisp sound. It could be hear a few blocks down even in heavy rush hour traffic.
Well, that's the info on the Flxibles. Hope it helped you.
I was waiting at Union Tpke for the Q65 to go to Flushing, and I saw 320 and 437 1 behind the other. I get on the older bus: 320 which rattled like a snake. 437 whizzed by. Sounded a bit different than the other CNG Orions somewhat like 9140-9149 but quieter. Also noticed that it had CNG decals on her. Well, maybe next time I'll catch her.
Q65#417Gary
9140-9149 are MTA Cummins Buses out of FP Depot. I apologize for not mentioning that on the earlier post.
Q58#9141Gary
Gary Deer, You just got GREENed ... get it ?
Mr t__:^)
NEW BUS DEPOT FOR S.I.
Peace,
ANDEE
THE GULOTTA GUILOTINE
Peace,
ANDEE
There was an editorial in this week's News Day that likened the County Exec's press conference to "Ground Hog Day", i.e. we all saw the Ground Hog come out of his hole, but no one knows what it ment.
Mr t__:^)
lol...
Green Bus Lines 5502
NYCB 522
Green Bus Lines 10001
Hybrid buses
And other transit pictures and oddities
All on my Transit Pictures 10 page:
http://nav.to/rmmarrero -> Express Train -> Transit Pictures 10
This past week RTS #1742 from QV and #4448 from Kingsbridge were transfered to Casey Stengal for reserve status. On Tuesday 9/5 they were inspected for service and on Wednesday 9/6 #1742 operated all morning until the farebox gave up. As of 9/6, 4448 did not enter service. Both buses still have there old depot logo's on.
I got 2 words for you: NO WAY! What route were they on? The only way that an RTS will run out of CS is if there's an Orion down. It usually happens on the Q13, Q28, Q44 and Q76.
Q32#522Gary
Sir, I work for DOB in Maint. We monitored the transfer of those buses last week. On 9/6, I spoke with the yard dispatcher at Stengal and he informed me that 1742 was in service that day. CS has about 15-20 Orion buses on the BO line, 1742 & 4448 were sent there to help with the spare ratio. Any RTS can run on any line out of Stengal, there is no specific line they should run on. Also, the RTS's can run through Stengal's bus wash without any adjustment. With the fall new pick this week, 1742 will probably be used on the X32 which is now out of Stengal. As I understand this is only a temporary move of these buses. Look out for those buses in the streets of Flushing.
Jay
1742 was originally out of CS(then FLU)when it arrived with the the 1982 RTS 1700's.It was used on the X51 to replace the 8800 fishbowls they were using when the line originated in the early 80's.The 8800's eventually ended up on the 44VP(now 74)thus starting a trend of using express seating coaches in local service
Ah..the good ol days!
I remember the 1700's running on the CS(FLU) line. 1705-1733 ran on the local routes and 1735-1746 ran on the express. I think they also had 1747-1750 but I am not sure.
Do you happen to know which 8800's ran on the X51 (then eventually the 44VP) when the line originally started?
Come to think of it, if you knew offhand which Fishbowls the RTS' out of CS in 1981 and 1982 replaced, I'd love to know that too. I think it was the 71xx and the 56xx buses)
I think the original RTS' in CS(FLU) were 1267-1272 (they got 1275-1282 later on in the 1980's) and then 1505-1535, and 1536-155x (I think it went up to 1559 but I am not sure)
Any info provided as usual, would be appreciated. Gosh, I miss those days!
Flx7595
It was the 8830's that ran on the Q44VP. What first caught my attention that they were on that line was that there was a winged bus sitting in the VP's bus stop on Queens Blvd.
As for the new look Flxs, FLU (CS) had the upper 7100's to 7204. They also had for a while the upper 7500's which when disappeared early to Fresh Pond, a local Assemblyman I believe by the name of Stravitky (not sure on the spelling) made a big news issue on it stating why did FLU lose all those new buses to recieve older models instead.
In JAM, the 8800's ran on local lines as well. Most notably, 8812 and 8813 were mainstays on the Q5A and the Q42. The rest of the 8800's (8807-8816) ran on the X20 and X24 (now X63 and X24).
JAM also had 6171 and 6184 which ALWAYS ran on the Q5ALS. How many of you remember that route?? The Q5ALS (Laurelton Shuttle) ran from Merrick Blvd and 229th Street via Merrick, 225th Street, 147th Avenue to 243/Huxley Street where it connected with the Q5A. It would have been the Q87, but it was discontinued just when the Queens route number changes took effect.
Mark
Wasn't the 44B(the Malba Shuttle)suppose to be renumbered at the same time but instead was discontinued as well.I remember this cause it on either a old timetable or transfer.
I think the 44B might have become the Q71 ift it had stuck around.
maybe they could revive it as some sort of a shoppers shuttle running middays and weekends from the 20th Avenue shopping area across the Cross island Service Road to the Bay Terrace shopping center.
Just something to help the senior citizens in the area.
Fresh Pond? Wow.
So that's where they wound up going.
I believe FLU had 7590-7604. I did not know that's where they wound up.
What eventually became of the 7100's/7200's (7175-7204) that FLU had? Were they simply scrapped or sent somewhere else after Flushing?
I know that bus 7603 wound up owned by the Post Office. I used to see it in Manhattan every so often in the late 80's/
Thanks again.
Besides the the other RTS's mentioned add 1745 to that list saw it mixed in with the Orions.As for the 8800's fishbowls I think they went to Blitz to be remanufactured as the 5100's
In the early 1980's, FLU had fishbowls 6200-6229. They were moved to JAM in late 1980 when they received 7100's from Brooklyn (Fifth Avenue Depot, I believe). You're right about the RTS original assignment.
Their original Grumman order were PA80-82, 350?-355. JAM followed with PA83-85, 356-363, then QV with PA86-91, 364-380.
The original RTS assignment in Queens were as follows:
FLU: 1267-1272, 1517-1534
JAM: 1273-1275, 1535-1544
QV: 1276-1282, 1545-1559
I hope that helps
Mark
Mark:
Thanks so much for the info. It brings back a lot of memories.
I liked all those old buses. In the mid 1980's Flushing also became a home to old buses - most notably the 6947 and 6948 (with the comfy seats since these were old express buses), 7645 (which had an advertisement above the usual ad in the back of the bus - it was attached to the air conditioning unit. - and my personal favorite - 4095 - and old Flxible that literally felt like it was falling apart at the seams when it moved. It also had other drivers' comments on the destination sign door above the driver.
I actually forgot about the Grummans. They had them twice (intially and then again for a short time after the first recall. Never got to ride one when they first came out.
Thanks again.
[In the mid 1980's Flushing also became a home to old buses - most notably the 6947 and 6948 (with the comfy seats since these were old express buses)]
I don't know about 6947, but 6948 was never an express bus. It was delivered to Flushing new about the same time the 6200 series arrived and saw local service from the very start. I suspect 6947 did the same, but I can't personally confirm that.
I stand corrected. 6948 was around the same time as the 6200's and I do not remember any other 69xx's around at that time - but 6947 came later on in the 1980's.
Were there any other ones like that (one bus from a series all by itself)
Thanks for the additional info
flx7595
That 1973 order was 6200-6349 (T6H-5309A), 6901-6956 (T6H-5310A).
Yes, I remember 6948 running one day on the B61 shortly after Crosstown closed down and Gleason took over the route. I did a double take when I saw the number and looked inside to verify that 6948 had hard seats.
Bus 6948 did run on all FLU local routes when I went to High School 1974-77. It's design, ride and sounds of seats vibrating on potholes were identical to the 6200s, but the seats were fiberglass and GRAY instead of the medium blue used on all fiberglass seats at the time.
A driver said it was originally intended for SI express runs but somehow was fitted with fiberglass seats instead of cushioned front-facing, and hence was assigned to local routes. Not much of an explanation.
Just to add, 7645 also went to Fresh Pond and then later lost that AC ad rack. I think it got damaged. 7645-7659 originally came from 126 St. where they got those AC ad racks.
I think those a/c ad racks were eventually all taken off because it was blocking air flow, thereby obstructing the fan from properly doing it's job.
No problem for the info. Those were the good ol' days for me too. I was in HS in the early '80s (Martin Van Buren on the Q43 line). At that time JAM had the worst maintained buses by far in Queens. One of my favorites was Flxible 4040. This bus which was sent to JAM from 5th Avenue (now JG), had its blue paint peeling from off the roof and sides, exposing the green paint underneath, and the rear windows opened as far as they would allow. It also had a VERY "vacuum" sound to its engine. A fun bus indeed.
Mark
I also remember the signs on the back of the buses. They used to advertise Majorska Vodka (why doesn't the MTA advertise them, The Jerry Lewis Labor Day Telethon - Queens County Savings Bank (of course) and the car guy - Berland - and if memory serves - which had advertisements on only certain buses in the 71xx group (I believe - 7181, 7185, 7188, 7189, and 7199 - and the Berland Ads stayed on those buses for years - until they got repainted or fixed.
The best buses in the early 80's out of FLU was the 5600/5700's.That and when they had the 9140's series from Staten Island for a few months.THe kind reminded me of the NJTransit New Look Flexibles with the seating.
I remember the 5600's (5601-5644 I think) but not the 5700's. What 5700's did they have?
The only 9000 series I remember in Flushing was 9080-9089. I do not recall those others. Were they specific to a certain route?
Then again - I had no idea that FLU had 2051 but I saw a photo of it in the Flushing yard. I only thought they went to 2041.
flx7595
Not sure of the # but they had alot towards the end.And 5630 was transferd to QV in the early 80's cause I caught on the 88 and it still had its green paint
FLU didn't have too many 5700's in the early '80s. QV had them, along with the high 5600's. I recall them having a bunch of ex-JAM fishbowls 2105, 2106, 2107, 2111, 2145, 2151(now a museum bus at Castleton) and 2161 are among the buses that come to mind.
Mark
i remember FLU's 5627 broken down in front of my house many years ago, sat there and watched the whole thing including the tow job.
cheap thrills for a 5 year old
Flx's i recall in FLU (not necessarily at the same time): 7098-7204. maybe not the 7170's. i reemember a number of these buses had unpainted engine doors (just plain stainless steel or aluminum). Some got the new paint of white over blue stripe. i remember that 7645 with the ad on the top rear too.
there were some late 9000's too. 9085 is a number i remember for some reason with black bumpers.
RTS's i recall: 1204,1205,1277,1510-1559,1606, 1607,1667, 1705-1749?, 2277, 2573 (with a big ad for a broadway musical 'noises off' on the drivers side), 2583, 3900-3984. later on early 90's brought an assortment of 1500's, 2200-2300-2500-2600s, a couple 3600s.
I recall runs 1 and 2 on the 44VP years ago each took out 1706 and 2583 every morning.
Then there was the same guy with 3742(an old green fishbowl) - i think his name was seymour. i used to race him with my bike down my block.
Ok i'm starting to feel old........and im only 26..
Mike:
More FLU thoughts:
Didn't all the 908x's have the black bumpers? 9085 did. I think 9088 did as well.
The 71xx's Flxible's started getting those aluminum engine doors. You could always tell because the original doors had either the sign rack with the "M" logo on it or the 'M' logo pasted right on the engine door. 7189, 7191 and 7198 are the ones that come to mind with that aluminum door.
BTW, does anyone miss that 'M' logo in the back?
The only 71xx I remember getting painted white was 7196. I am sure there were others.
FLU also had the 4442-4454. I have seen a picture of 4444 when it was green - when I remember it - it was blue and for the 44xx, only the top two lights stayed on at night - for the flxibles in the 71xx and 75xx, all 4 back lights stayed on. for the 20xx, 21xx and 56xx, the two bottom ones stayed on.
This was in the days when all 4 lights were red.
Damn shame I never took pictures
There was one Flxible that had the wrong engine door back because the number (which used to be on the bottom of the door said "7577" but that was clearly not the bus. I don't recall what bus it was though. May have been a 71xx or a 75xx but I am not sure. Does anyone remember?
You mentioned 1706. I think at one time they had the 1705 run only on the q12 line and in the mornings. I would always get that bus to Main St at 7-7:30. They did that with 8397 too I think.
I remember 2583, 2585 as well. Some years later they also got 2267-2272, 2572 (nicely repainted) and for awhile, Methenol powered 8397, which is now listed in Manhattanville (though I never see her on the road. They also had 1606, 1666 and 1667.
Thanks for the memories.
All of the 9000 series Flxibles (9000-9159 TA, 9160-9309 OA) had the black rubber bumpers. They were the only NYCTA new look buses to be delivered with them.
I didn't live in Queens, but I remember FLU also having RTS 04 #2484 too. This bus originally operated out of Kingsbridge.
[FLU also had the 4442-4454. I have seen a picture of 4444 when it was green - when I remember it - it was blue
and for the 44xx, only the top two lights stayed on at night - for the flxibles in the 71xx and 75xx, all 4 back lights
stayed on. for the 20xx, 21xx and 56xx, the two bottom ones stayed on.
This was in the days when all 4 lights were red.]
I remember this too on many TA fishbowls in Queens. That is having their turning indicator lights also serve as tail lights while the brake light underneath was not a tail light. MABSTOA, especially Kingsbridge did this on nearly all of their T6H-5309A's (4813-4832, 4860-4919) later. Coliseum was pretty much the opposite where all for lights were tail lights (4833-4859).
Wayne
Thanks Wayne.
I think I remember 2484 there for awhile. It wasn't there in Flushing long
Gee- they had 2484 and 2585. Just take every 101st bus and give it to Flushing :)
YOU HAVE A GREAT MEMORY!!! You hit FLU's assignment right on the head! Great job. Yes, 2573 did have the full length Manhattan ad on the driver side, as did 1606 and 1608 (from 126 Street). I do recall some low-9000's visiting FLU for a brief spell---9026 and 9035 in particular. Their 7000's were 7098-7154(ex-5th Avenues and FP), and 7175-7204(original FLU). Buses 7155-7174 were in QV.
Mark
Mark:
When did Flushing have 7098-7154? I vaguely remember 7110-7113, but I cannot remember when. And it's vague. I know FP had some of those.
Any info to jog my faulty memory on this would be appreciated.
flx7595
I remember 7099 at FLU and I've seen it in Brooklyn once, maybe out of UP( both times with the Queens County Savings Bank ad in the rear). FP had all of the 70XX's except 7099, 7008 and 7041. I've never seen 7008 nor 7041 anywhere. Were these scrapped early?
7098-7154 came over to FLU from FP and 5th Avenue (now JG). They were there soon after 6200-6229 went to JAM, around 1981. They stayed in FLU service until 1985 I believe when the 3900-3984 came in.
Mark
FLU had the lower 5700's during the 70's. For some reason I still recall seeing 5741 on the Q44. Later during the early 80's, FLU recieved upper 5700's from SI, I think. I remember seeing 5790 on the Q27 at QCC.
If I remember correctly 5780 or 81 was painted with the Blue/White scheme(The white top with dark navy blue stripe on the side).
Berland Ford and Mercury ads on almost all the buses,usually on the back hood,the guy looked like Frank Cannon
I agree - those were definitely the good ol' days. Many of those same Flxibles at MABSTOA (4600-4727) had peeling paint on their roofs. Also - I'm sure no one can forget their loud engines.
Wayne
So these buses will only be used as extras for school service? What about 3497, 4217 and the few others that are sitting in College Point Storage? Will they be used too?
Q32#680Gary
3497 & 4217 are from Jamaica and from what I'm hearing have serious mechanical problems and will probably be scrapped. BTW, I spoke with one of the foremen in maintainence on Thursday. He told me the engine blew in 4557 and transit no longer wants to do engine replacements on those old buses. So they are being scrapped and buses that are sitting in storage are taking their place. I guess 4571, which just received a replacement engine a couple of weeks ago was the very last bus. So it got lucky and her life was spared. BIG AL
I rode 4557 a few weeks before she was scrapped and boy was she terrible. She was making me sick with the vibrations in the engine.
9546 is another vibrator. I rode on her on Q17 Wednesday and she was also making a clicking noise on top of the vibrating. 9565 wasn't much better-she was very loud and vibrating when I rode on her.
Q17#5159Gary
(PS What I mean by vibrating was that it was making the empty seats shake!)
Bus 1745 is at CS as well
http://www.silive.com/news/advance/0908depot08.html
-Hank
WMATA/RIDE-On Question
Where do the WMATA Flxible Metro Bs such as 5176 run out of? I've seen them on Ride-On 36 the past few days and the route block has M in the first place, indicating Montgomery. The buses still say "Owned and operated by WMATA" on the left side near the front.
WMATA Fishbowl Update
1553 is still at Western Garage.
The 30-foot Flxible Metro Bs now used on certain Montgomery County routes, like the "Bethesda-8" shuttle, are indeed owned and operated by WMATA. These 5100-series buses were operated out of Western garage on Metro neighborhood routes like the M4 and E6 until they were superceded in mid-1998 by 3900-series 30-foot Orion Vs and later 3700-series Orion IIs.
Metro won a contract (it may have been an agreement, not a contract) to operate the new Bethesda shuttle service for Ride-On with its own equipment and drivers. Since the 5100s had recently been pulled from DC service, they were repainted in Ride-On livery and assigned to these routes. They were not renumbered for their new duties.
I think they're based out of some Montgomery County garage, whether Ride-On's or Metro's I don't know. They do not run out of Western Division anymore as they did when running the E6/M4 routes.
Hope this helps.
Chris
[WMATA won a contract...to operate the Bethesda shuttle service for Ride-On with its own equipment and drivers.]
Question: Do those drivers wear WMATA or Ride-On uniforms?
(Most contract operations I've seen have buses labeled for the agency and the drivers in the contract carrier's uniforms. However, when I was in Dallas several years ago, the driver on route 400 mentioned that he worked for Ryder-ATE but had to wear a DART uniform.)
Good question -- I'm not sure, actually. I would guess Ride-On -- the equipment is permanently assigned to this route and painted in its colors, and I think the operators run this route specifically, not switching between this and D.C. duty. So I'd guess, for the sake of professional appearance, that they wear Ride-On uniforms. I'll try to look the next time I'm in Bethesda.
Chris
[Question: Do those drivers wear WMATA or Ride-On uniforms?]
They wear the regular WMATA uniforms. More than once I've seen an actual Ride-On bus on the 28 (Downtown, Silver Spring), but that was at least 2 months ago. I was assuming that these Flxible Metros were operating out of WMATA's Montgomery division.
Wayne
Reports of the GM fishbowl's death have been greatly exaggerated.
Unit 1553 is still at WMATA's Western Division yard for supplementary service, so there is at LEAST one still-active unit in the system.
Noticed it while buying student bus tokens this afternoon.
Chris
Just curious if anyone knows of any other transit systems that still have Fishbowls on their active or reserve rosters. To the best of my knowledge, there are no longer any Fishbowls on any New England transit property.The MBTA retired the last of theirs in 1997.The last New England transit property to have fishbowls comprise the majority of the required number of buses needed for daily service was the Manchester NH Transit Authority.They had a fleet of (30) 35-footers that they purchased new in 1974.They remained in active service until late 1997. I know that some private bus companies ( i.e New York Bus Service) still operate some,but I'm interested to see if any public transit authorities still operate them.
Mark
I was in Alaska about 3 weeks ago and Juneau had a ton of them. Of course, cars last longer up there ... it's accessible only by boat and the sea moderates the temperatures so the winters and attendant road salting isn't too bad.
Chris
Reports of the GM fishbowl's death have been greatly exaggerated.
Unit 1553 is still at WMATA's Western Division yard for supplementary service, so there is at LEAST one still-active unit in the system.
Noticed it while buying student bus tokens this afternoon.
-- Chris
What route and where? Is it always there?
It's at Western Division (a block from Friendship Heights Metro); it's been there the last couple times I've been in the yard. You can see as you walk to the sales office at the back of the building. I suspect they don't run it on a regular route, what with their new Orion Vs, but keep it for supplementary service. Looks to be in good order though. I'll keep the board posted.
C
On a related note, does anyone know if Western Division is slated to get a consignment of Orion VIs? I didn't see any in their lot today.
I knew they did the M4 and E6 before going to Ride-On. Why does WMATA now also operate the 36 is another question? The 36 WMATA runs were run by ATE/Ryder if you want to look at a schedule and figure out which runs they are doing. I still see a county owned bus heading to Holy Child in the mornings.
I guess that would explain why I found pictures of flxibles in Ride-On colors.
According to what I read in the Metro Newspaper, next week is transit week. During transit week, SEPTA staff will meet with riders and commuters taking questions and comments and also holding contests for TransitCheks (like metro cards but paid for by the employer). Are other transit companies doing things like this, and is transit week next week for everyone in the US?
Yeah. Metro's dubbed it "Try Transit Week," I think. I don't know specifically what they're doing but I'm sure there's plenty of hoopla at their website.
Chris
There is Meet the Managers tomorrow morning at various stations (Friendship Heights and Silver Spring are 2 of them). Also, there will be an ontroduction to PIMS (Passenger Information Messaging System) at Rosslyn on Wednesday. Free WMATA Silver Bus Rides on Tuesday, Wednesday, and Thursday and Ride-On is 25 cents tomorrow, day pass is $1.50.
Why is this bus called the Phoenix? I've seen a couple of pictures of it and it has tags all over one of the rear windows. Can someone give me a little info?
Thanks.
The bus burned up early in its service life and was rebuilt by NYCT(A)'s in-house forces. In a sense, it rose from the ashes, and that's why it's called a "phoenix."
David
I saw pictures of that bus after it burned and basically it was nothing but a burnt up shell. Now you would never know anything had ever happened to it so I must say transit did one hell of a fine job restoring and customizing that bus. It really is "THE PHOENIX." BIG AL
MTA #980 is now sitting at Atlantic Diesel on Long Island. The full order of those CNG New Flyers are almost here.
Today there were net that many RTS's running out of Gleason. Look like the rest of the 4600's and 4700's were sitting in one side of the yard. So thit could be the last week for these buses.
Robert
P.S. I had 821 this morning and had to pull it in after my first trip. I seems that these buses have problems with backfiring. 821 backfired on me three time before I pulled into Gleason.
Better keep those 4600s and 4700s on standby just in case if these buses keep backfiring and/or in case if something happens to the gas tanks.
B61#8540Gary
I did a trip with a bus driver friend of mine on the B57 today. Every Gleason Bus I saw was a New Flyer CNG low floor.
In the May picture of the 2000 subway calander, below the elevated tracks is a bus #518.
What company did that bus belong to? At first, it looks like a TA bus, but their RTS's are all numbered with 4 digits, plus there's no 'M' logo on the back. Also, the colored band looks more like a dark gray, silver, or olive green.
If I had to take a guess, I would say this bus was a Green Lines bus because I know their older paint scheme was a solid green band, but this looks a bit dark.
Any ideas?
Thanks.
09/10/2000
That RTS bus you described was in the old Jamaica Bus paint scheme. White body with brown stripe. Jamaica Bus changed their livery to tan with brown trim with broad red stripe on the center of the body.
The "author" of the Subway Calendar.
Bill "Newkirk"
anyone know if the 6259 is going to be at the bus festival on saturday?...
If it was there last year, I bet that it will be there again this year.
R36Gary
I don't think it's been out for the last two bus festivals although it is said to be in working order. I hope it will be shown this year.
The only specific buses "promised" in the announcement at the Transit Museum web site (www.mta.nyc.ny.us/museum/whatsnew.htm) are the 1938 "Queen Mary" and the 1948 "Jackie Gleason" bus. Guess we'll have to wait and see on the Mack!
According, to my sources at the museum it is supposed to be there.
It has been requested.
Peace,
ANDEE
Could it be possible that 2137, 2139, 2143 and 2145 are being converted to diesel fuel and will be used at Jamaica Bus Lines?
Q111#565Gary
With the new pick in effect today, what major changes have occurred. I know they are all brought up on here at various times, but can someone put them all into one mesage?
i.e. any routes change depots??? stuff like that.
is that new Bx25 interlined with another or is it stand alone???
Off-hand, I'm aware of the following:
* Q76: extended to College Point (terminal at 20th Avenue & 131st Street).
* Q76 southbound only: minor reroute through Whitestone.
* X32 split: morning trips at CS, afternoon trips at QV
* New Bx25: worked by Bx26 runs (compare M3/M18 and M96/M106).
Also the Q-88 no longer travels along Queens Blvd, however this
is covered in the thread below, nor was it implemented because of
the fall SO schedule. It was implemented because of traffic
patterns altered by the DOT.
I seen this CNG Orion 666 in service about a year and a half ago out of Mitchell field. For the past year it has been sitting in a Huntington used truck dealership, or possibly storage yard. it is the only bus there, and can be seen from LIRR's P. Jeff branch just west of the Huntington station. Anyone know what the story is with that bus?
I guess it kept breaking down and they decided to junk it. The buses numbered 657-666 I believe were the first order of Orion CNG's at MSBA, and they are getting old and breaking down. And they always konk out with the A/C on.
On another note, I saw 174 broke down in Roslyn, with unlucky passengers waiting on the bus for the next bus, sweating it out with all the windows open.
My bus 204, kept sputtering on hills, on the eastbound N21. Driver had to shut off A/C just to make it up the hills without stalling out.
4666: Now with FP depot. Saw this bus on the B20 @ Linden and Penn Ave. Logos and everything.....
5114: Saw this bus on the B46 @ Flatlands and Utica. I noticed that the rear sign displayed the LTD signage. This was my first time seeing that. Is this common ractice with the limited routes?????
B46#5114Mike Limited
B20#4666Mike
Saw her on Broadway and 63rd Street today. She was either on the m5, m7 or m104 (probably m5 but she stopped for a pickup at 63rd st and M5 limited does not stop there (it was 1pm).
I think she had Kingsbridge stickers on. Was this a new move?
4666: Now with FP depot. Saw this bus on the B20 @ Linden and Penn Ave. Logos and everything.....
5114: Saw this bus on the B46 @ Flatlands and Utica. I noticed that the rear sign displayed the LTD signage. This was my first time seeing that. Is this common practice with the limited routes?????
B46#5114Mike Limited
B20#4666Mike
The rear sign says LTD if you throw up the added text message "LIMITED STOPS" in the destination sign code. That punching in code 007 on the P/R button on the Luminator computer. BIG AL
When did this go into effect?
I used to see the rear sign go from [RT #] to blank and then back when ANY p/r code was put in.
On the Luminator equipped buses the rear sign does go blank. 5114 is equipped with a TwinVision destination sign, and the rear sign is wider than the Luminator. Because of this the rear sign can display messages like "Subway" when the Subway Shuttle sign is used. When you program the PR to say Limited Stop on the rear it will say "B46" then change and say "LTD" . Hope this helps you.
Peace & Blessings
DaShawn
www.transitworld.org
Flxible METRO D#1975
How come some of the new buses have Luminators, some have TwinVisions?
Can anybody tell me the purpose of this route? Is it like the Bx40/42 or is it a rush hour service only? All info will be greatly apprecated?? Thanks
Bx25M
Bx25 is a Direct Service to the Section 5 via Asch Loop,,,Bartow,and Hutch Pwy east
WB 620 AM to 820 AM
EB 5 PM to 7 PM
bx26 routing to Paul/205 st Lehman College
Steve
How do bus drivers, especially those who drive late at night or early in the morning, and/or on trips that involve a highway portion, fight tiredness. I have never come across a bus driver that appeared to be tired (THANK GOD!) and hope I never will, but I'm just curious if there are any tactics that they use. What is the maximum number of hours they are permitted to drive?
Also, what are the chances of a bus to run out of fuel while in service? How often, if ever, does it happen, and what is the procedure if it does happen?
I am asking these questions with transit/commuter buses in mind, though info regarding long-distance buses would also be appreciated.
Thanks in advance.
Well at Long Island Bus our Orion CNG's do sometimes run out of fuel. Usually it happens in summer when the A/C is on.
How old is the 666? Can't be that old. CNG's came out in the mid 90's.
[How old is the 666? Can't be that old. CNG's came out in the mid 90's.]
I don't know how old 666 is, but I was in Hamilton, Ontario, recently and I believe they had some CNG buses dating from 1991 or 1992.
I think #666 as well as 657-665 are 1991 or 1992 Orion CNG buses.
Also the diesel 500 and 600 Orions aren't that new, I believe most of them are 1991 or 1992.
Most of the CNG fleet (100-245) are 1995 buses.
I haven't seen the any of the mid 600 Orion CNG's on the road lately, perhaps they have been retired?
Last time I was on a 600 CNG bus was on the N24, it was last summer and the bus was 657, and there was no A/C and the bus crawled.
With the arrival of the 2000 Orion V CNG's, there have been plenty of buses moving between the two LIB depots. For the most part, Mitchel Field has 1997 CNG's 131-219 (I believe), along with a host of Gilligs and 1991/92 Orions--579-656.
Meanwhile, Rockville Centre appears to be the recipient of the new buses (338 and 339 were on the N4 today), along with 1992 CNG's 657-666, 1995 Orions 101-130 and 1997 Orions 220-245 and 271-287. They, too have a number of Gilligs assigned (mostly 35 footers). I may be a bit off on the model years, but I am fairly accurate on the bus numbers, I believe.
Mark
I was at Great Neck LIRR Station on Monday and saw bus #334 on one of the routes that go north of the Station (N57 or N58). I also thought I saw a diesel or two (in the 580's perhaps) on the N25, which comes out of Rockville Centre, so that garage may still have some Orion diesels.
Well here's the facts, I looked up an old post that I saved from Bustalk eons ago,
"According to the APTA Transit Vehicle Data Book, all of the
Long Island Bus CNG Orions
have Cummins engines, this includes
10 from 1992, 25 from 1995, 115 from
1997, and 18 from 1998."
My mistake, the majority of the CNG's were from 1997.
But the 10 from 1992 must be the old 600s.
I remember when they "paraded" them around the county when they were brand new. Now most of them are slow, dirty, and malfunction. Sad, isn't it?
I haven't seen many of the 600 series CNG's out for awhile, perhaps they have been scapped?
You can find a roster of MSBA (LI Bus) at: http://www.geocities.com/MotorCity/Downs/9036/MSBA.html
09/12/2000
Sid,
I tried but failed numerous times on accessing this web site. Can you supply a link?
Bill "Newkirk"
Sorry, I haven't learned how to do hypertext links yet. The site I mentioned is the MSBA page for Bus Rosters on the Web. Perhaps if you try that site's main index page, you can get there and then find the MSBA roster. The main index page URL is: http://www.geocities.com/MotorCity/Downs/9036/index.html
How do bus drivers, especially those who drive late at night or
early in the morning, and/or on trips that involve a highway
portion, fight tiredness.
It takes some getting used-to. Basically, we alter our natural
sleeping patterns where we'll sleep during the day. Many hawk
operators will either sleep from mid afternoon until report, or
when they get home in the morning and awake around 5 or 6.
This still leaves time for a somewhat close-to-normal lifestyle.
When I worked a hawk, I found that sleeping from 2pm-10pm worked
best for me. I'd then report at 12:30 or so, and work until 9:00
or thereabouts. I'd then have the day to do whatever I needed to
do, getting to sleep anywhere between 2pm and 5pm, waking around
9pm to 11pm depending on what I had to do that day, or how late I
needed to be up.
It's definitely not for everyone. Usually an operator with a
clean record is afforded lienency because of the time of report,
so long as it isn't a recurring thing, and no trips were lost.
Most of the work I pick involves early AM reporting, usually
between 3am and 5am. I like being home in the early afternoon.
When we feel sleepy, we nap at home. Most of us may also nap in
the garage on our swing. We have cots in the locker rooms, and
store portable wind-up alarm clocks and such. A shower is also
helpful at times, and may be taken on ones swing as well. I've
done that as well.
I have never come across a bus driver that appeared to be tired
(THANK GOD!) and hope I never will, but I'm just curious if there
are any tactics that they use. What is the maximum number of
hours they are permitted to drive?
Whoa! I wouldn't bet the house on that one! Our bodies may be
tired, fatigued, stresses, and we may feel sleepy at times,
however no different than those who feel "blah" during their work
day. Many of us work doubles, or RDOs, which tend to get to you
after a while. But we rarely show tiredness. I have known a few
BOs to fall asleep while at a terminal. It happens (although the
TA says it can't). Anything is possible....
As defined by Article 19-A, CDL drivers MUST have at least 8
hours between shifts. We could work an 11 hour double run, but
then must have 8 hours off between the next run. Operators who
are tired after working 11 hours may stop driving at that time.
Also, what are the chances of a bus to run out of fuel while in
service? How often, if ever, does it happen, and what is the
procedure if it does happen?
It's happened to me twice in the last 6 years. Once in Manhattan,
and once in Brooklyn. If we run out of fuel, a road truck will
pump enough to get it back to the garage, or a tow truck will be
called if necessary.
That bus should have been drilled. Someone, usually the Yard SLD
will be questioned about this. It shouldn't happen because buses
are assigned according to mileage (or at least they're supposed
to be assigned that way). But again.. Things happen!
I am asking these questions with transit/commuter buses in mind,
though info regarding long-distance buses would also be
appreciated.
HTH?
Thank you, Queens Village BO, for a most helpful and very detailed explanation!
Thank you, Queens Village BO, for a most helpful and very detailed explanation!
My hat off to you and all other bus operators who work wacky shifts and have to put up with all sorts of abuse from passengers -- (this pretty much describes all bus drivers, doesn't it!)
Yes, a bus operator is certainly not a good job for the impatient or short-tempered.
I second the thanks for you very informative reply.
You didn't talk too much about the "swing" job, so for those that don't know ... many drivers show up in time to take all those sleepy customers to work ... get a couple of hours off mid-day and are back on the job to take them home ... makes for a very long day.
My point, they earn every penny of their pay.
Mr t__:^)
After reading the explanations from Queens Village BO, I have a question that has been on my mind for years. Why late-night drivers drive SOOOOOOOO SSLLLLLLOOOOWWWWWW? It is VERY annoying!!!! Can someone please answer me this. Thank you very much!
B61 Leonard
I'd like to thank you all for your great supportive replies! Apparently you haven't ridden with me ;-) LOL! Only kidding!
Anyway, Thurston mentioned something called "swing runs". Briefly, because I want to answer Leonards post in detail: A swing run is a run which has a longer than usual break between first and second halves. For those who didn't know, every run is separated by a "meal" period called a "swing". A swing may be taken by pulling into the depot once reaching a terminal (hence buses "Not In Service") or on the road mid-run (as in when another BO takes the bus from someone at a bus-stop). Swings are pre-determined by the schedule when we pick, and is part of the run itslef. Runs that have swings of 59 minutes or less are paid in full. Runs that fall between 1 and 2 hours pay one hour only, and finally, those runs which have a swing greater than 2 hours, pay half the swing itself.
A swing run will usually report early in the morning, and operate during the AM rush hour. The operator will then be on his swing until the beginning of the PM rush hour. For example:
Run 5 Q-99
Report: 5:07 AM
Pull-Out 5:17 AM
Pull-In 9:22 AM
Pull-Out 3:55 PM
Pull-In 7:44 PM
Clear: 7:54 PM
As you can see in this hypothetical run, there is a swing from 9:22 AM to 3:55 PM, which translates into 6:44 minutes. The operator of this run would be paid for only 3:22 minutes of that swing. Don't use this formula as a guide for calculating pay, however! There are many other formulas which dictate pay procedure, and this probably isn't the best place to post it! Not only that, but if I do, it will cost you the rate it costs me to take the SLD classes!!
-----------------------------------------------------------------
Posted by B61Leonard on Tue Sep 12 10:56:16 2000, in response to Re: A Couple Questions, posted by Thurston on Tue Sep 12 07:55:45 2000
After reading the explanations from Queens Village BO, I have a question that has been on my mind for years. Why late-night drivers drive SOOOOOOOO SSLLLLLLOOOOWWWWWW? It is VERY annoying!!!! Can someone please answer me this. Thank you very much!
Disclaimer!!
The following reply is offered as opinion of the author only, and is NOT an official reply from the NYCTA...
Here we have an excellent question, and one from someone who apparently hasn't ridden with me LOL!
Usually, on most routes, the time given to get from terminal A to terminal B is 30 minutes (give or take depending). So a round trip would equate to 60 minutes- the headway between buses (unless there is a second hawk as in the Q43).
Late at night, and into the early morning, there simply aren't too many people waiting around for buses. The 60 minute headway (time between buses) places a bus in every stop at least once per hour, which looks good on paper. The trip itself might take only 17-22 minutes, however we are not permitted to be early, especially late at night when the next bus is.... me. Late-night customers plan their bus trips carefully so as not to stand on the streets for very long, and who can blame them?
We have a rule which also states we cannot leave a terminal late (purposely). This is called "Theft of service" or "Delay of Service", and is prohibited by contract. So, if a trip actually only takes 20 minutes, but we are forced to drag it out to 30 minutes, we must operate slowly. Has anyone ever heard the term "Drag the Line?"
At any rate, my customers knew exactly when I would be at their particular stop- some even waiting inside a 24 hour store for safety reasons. They were never late, and always reached their destination *on time* :-)
HTH
Thank you Queens Village BO for the response. Now it makes sense!!!!!
B61 Leonard
Hey Ya'll:
If any of you are regulars the the sites:
www.transitalk.com
www.transitworld.org
or
www.geocities.com/nyctransitrans/
You've noticed that you cannot access the sites, this is because Geocities (Our crappy server) is continually experiencing technical problems. Apologies for that.
Also if you are considering doing a web page for yourself, DO NOT USE GEOCITIES. As you will be sorry and very disappointed with the crappy service provided!
Trevor Logan
www.transitalk.com
Due to the following reasons, the 75 Low Floor Italian-Built Breda Bus order set for the TA for FY2001 has been cancelled until further notice because:
1) The TA requires a double windowed windshield for thier buses while Breda designs thier buses with a single window windshield and some other little design issues.
2) There is also a political issue trying to get a Breda facility built in upstate NY.
Trevor Logan
www.transitalk.com
so what happened to the Vikings ?
The Vikings will be in service by October!
Trevor Logan
www.transitalk.com
It's kinda nice walking down Madison Ave. and still seeing the GM fishbowls still running for New York Bus Service during the rush hour (I counted 4 on Tuesday in 10 minutes). I should get on one of those when I have some spare time while I still can. AND SO SHOULD YOU!!!
I am planning to do just that.
Wayne
ROUTE CHANGE FOR BX 41
Peace,
ANDEE
As many of us are planning to attend the 8th Annual Bus Festival in Brooklyn this Saturday, I propose a way for BusTalkers to meet others there. Because many of us will be coming and going at various hours, let's just have an informal "meet" every hour on the hour beginning at 10:00 a.m. As it appears that the 1948 "Jackie Gleason" GM old-look (#2969) is supposed to be there, let's use this bus as our hourly meeting place.
the b6 limited service was kind of from what i saw lacking. I was wondering if by any chance flatbush will help out woth their b6 rush hour buses? the service seemed kind of lacking. granted there were enough local buses to remedy the problem. also why is there stops at east 823nd and 78th is it to link with the b82 bm2 and b103? saving 5 minutes is good but is this nessesary. all these years and I could have sworn the 49 would be next for ltd service ,guess i was wrong.
The first day is not really the best time to evaluate Limited service. The Operators aren't used to it, the Dispatchers aren't used to it, and the riders aren't used to it.
E. 82nd Street is a Limited stop because Bildersee JHS is an important destination on the line. E. 78th Street serves South Shore HS (as does Ralph Avenue).
David
Last time I checked, Ralph Ave(Rock Pkwy bound) was not a limited stop. However, the Bensonhurst stop had the LTD sign..........
B6#3691Mike Limited
Here's the list that's posted on the MTA Website (http://www.mta.nyc.ny.us):
-------------------
Hours of service
To Rockaway Pkwy: 5:30 AM to 9:45 PM
To E 16 St: 6:45 AM to 10 PM
Limited Stops
To Rockaway Pkwy
On Av J at E 16 St
On Av J at Ocean Av
On Bedford Av at Campus Rd
On Glenwood Rd at Flatbush Av
On Glenwood Rd at Nostrand Av
On Glenwood Rd at Albany Av
On Av H at Utica Av
On Ralph Av at Glenwood Rd
On Flatlands Av at Ralph Av <-------
On Flatlands Av at E 80th St
On Flatlands Av at Remsen Av
On E 96 St at Flatlands Av
On Glenwood Rd at E 98 St
To East 16 St
Rockaway Pkwy Station
On Flatlands Av at Rockaway Pkwy
On Flatlands Av at Remsen Av
On Flatlands Av at E 82 St
On Flatlands Av at Ralph Av <------
On Glenwood Rd at Ralph Av
On Av H at Utica Av
On Av H at Kings Hwy
On Glenwood Rd at Albany Av
On Glenwood Rd at Nostrand Av
On Glenwood Rd at Flatbush Av
On Bedford Av at Campus Rd
On Av J at Ocean Av
On Av J at E 16 St
Limited-Stop buses make all local stops east of the Rockaway Pkwy station and west of E 16 St.
------------
David
Thanks Dave. BTW, I passed by Ralph and Flatlands about an hour ago and there is no LTD sign on the Rock Pkwy bound bus stop. There is one at E.80th. Maybe DOT did not get around to putting the sign up yet??????
B6#7511Mike Limited
Actually, they did not put any LTD signs along Flatlands Ave. (Rock Pkwy bound). I did see a B6 LTD today. I believe it was a 4700 or 4800 series RTS........
B6#9103Mike Limited
Not that a 25cent ride was such a bad deal, but rides on the Silver 25th Anniversary Bus this week are free ... if you're lucky enough to catch it.
Chris
I already posted that under a Transit Week post. Two things to note. One is that it is now normal fare since the anniversary is long over. Two, is it is only 3 days. One in DC, one in MD, and one in VA. I last saw 9343 on the D6 in August. The D6 runs out of Bladensburg so unless it has moved, go ride the X2, H1, H2, H3, H4, D1, D3, D4, and D6, and routes like those tomorrow. Not sure where it heads after that.
You're right; sorry about that. I didn't notice that you'd already mentioned it until after I'd posted my message and was reading others.
I saw it in July; I don't know what route it was on then. I didn't realize it had moved to normal fares. Thanks for the update.
Chris
I rode this former MJQ Depot bus on the Q46 today-QV Decals on her too.
Q46#4150Gary
4150: Fresh Pond original.
To all BusTalkers,
After working hard for a little over a month, I am pleased to announce that my web site is now online. While I hoped to have it done by Labor Day, I wanted it done before I got tons of schoolwork so I did succeed to some extent. This is the first and last post about my web site. For updates, please read further. The address is "http://www.orenstransitpage.com/". Now before you go and hop on the train, there are a few things you should take note of.
1. When I try to access the site from AOL, it is very sensitive and has to be typed 100% correctly. That means all lowercase and it has to have the slash at the end. If you also have Netscape on your computer, it has worked better from Netscape and I suggest you view the site that way. Also, the JavaScripts are messed up while viewing from AOL. Sorry about that but it will be corrected in time.
2. Because http://www.orenstransitpage.com is a free URL, that means there will be a banner ad. If you want, you can trade in the banner ad for a harder to remember URL. I prefer if you deal with the banner ad since namezero.com is supporting the site and others online as well and if you wind up with a hard to remember URL when and if you build a web site, you might want to take this into account. They pay Network Solutions, the URL registry and they get the money from advertising. More details about what they do are available at http://www.namezero.com/.
3. There are some spelling and grammatical mistkes still on the site. Please go to the contact page from Grand Central to notify me of these things! Also, when you send you question, comment, subscribtion, etc., please title the e-mail as I request. Things are set up so I can deal with questions at one time, comments at another and so on. If you mess up, it's OK. The only downfall is that your request may not be taken care of as quickly.
4. Does the site load too slowly? Your vote does count on the poll which appears in Grand Central and on the R142, R110B, and MARTA photo galleries. If the viewers demand it, I will change the site to text only without the thumbnails. I provide thumbnails so you don't have to click every single image but if it takes too long to load, your voice counts and the Oren Transit Page Transit System Customer Service Department will deal with your comment if you send it (unlike some of the other transit agencies).
5. What's up with Track 1? Track 1 is a brief description of the layout of the pages with 10 screen shots of how they will look. This is very optional and if you don't feel like venturing down to this platform, you may proceed directly to Grand Central.
6. Not all the images show up? Your connection probably timed out. Right click the image and click "Show Picture" or click the link to get the larger view. Again, vote in the poll to have your way.
7. To join the subcription list, go to the contact page (accesible from Grand Central) and follow the instructions. I will not post updates on BusTalk.
If you have any questions, comments, or anything of the sort, e-mail me. Since most of you will return to the site, your e-mails are important! Once again, the case-sensitive site URL is http://www.orenstransitpage.com. Welcome aboard and enjoy the ride!
Sincerely,
Oren H.
Webmaster of Oren's Transit Page
http://www.orenstransitpage.com
--------------------------------
To Subscribe, please send an
e-mail to
o_transit_page_webmstr@hotmail.com
with "Subscribe" in the subject
line and body.
Nice site Oren! You've got a great bunch of large format pictures -- including some rare shots like the WMATA and MTA work trains. Awesome site and I look forward to future updates.
I'd encourage other users of BusTalk to take a look. Beware -- in Internet Explorer, the page wouldn't load unless I typed it as http://www.orenstransitpage.com/ with the closing slash.
I've been meaning to do a WMATA page myself, but yours is pretty complete ... tough to beat!
Chris
The issue of the / is true and unfortunate. Sorry folks.
I have AOL, and when I typed it without the ending / it worked fine.
I have IE 5 and I don't have this problem.
I didn't have it with IE 4 either.
I don't know what version of IE is being used but if it's IE 3 or less, then that's just ridiculous, you shouldn't make web pages to conform to every version of Lynx 1.0 running on a 286.
I'm using IE 5.0 for Win 98 SE. I just tried it both ways and it now works either way. Don't know why the problem occurred before.
Chris
It is my pleasure to announce that 1970 Flxible #699 (ex-Mid Island Transit and Metropolitan Suburban Transportation Authority) will be one of the guest buses this Saturday at the New York Transit Museum’s Bus Festival.
Last year, #699 had an interior exhibit of over 100 photos of historic and contemporary buses from Nassau County. This year, one side of this bus will feature many photographs of Brooklyn’s electric trolleybuses, including the first units in the 1000-series, while the other side will have a large selection of Mack buses, primarily those operated by the New York City Transit Authority (including all series of these units).
8x10” negative-original prints of most of the photos on display inside #699 will be available for purchase, in addition to thousands of other photos of trolleys, subways, elevateds, buses, and all-service vehicles from the New York, New Jersey and Philadelphia area, dating from the mid 1930s to the early 1960s.
The few remaining copies of our 1996, 1997 and 1998 New York Area Bus MegaCalendars will also be available, on a first come-first served basis; each is priced at $24.95.
For those unable to attend the Bus Festival, #699 and a fully restored 1954 Flxible Clipper over-the-road coach, courtesy of Harran Transportation of West Babylon, will be on display at the Merrick Street Fair located at the Merrick Long Island Rail Road station in Merrick on Sunday, September 17.
I was hoping that your wonderful Flxible #699 would be there! Can't wait to see those photos and Calendars! See you on Saturday!
Peace & Blessings
DaShawn
www.transitworld.org
I'm coming down from Utica for this. Now that the Flxible #699 will be there, I will as well! Question:Will you have calendars for 2001 on sale as well?
B61 Leonard
At about 7:20 this morning, Triboro bus 688 passed by the stop at 48th Street & 50th Avenue. Of course, there were people waiting for the Q39, which was the route it was running on. It wasn't very crowded. But it didn't stop. The next bus, 666, stopped at the above stop, and it was more crowded. 666 and 688 ran together for a stretch, and 688 was in front of 666 at Court Square, where I got off. What I want to know is: why didn't 688 stop at the above stop? It was obviously not crowded, and there were 5 people waiting for a Q39 bus.
Posted by R.M. on Tue Sep 12 10:07:45 2000
At about 7:20 this morning, Triboro bus 688 passed by the stop at 48th Street & 50th Avenue. Of course, there were people waiting for the Q39, which was the route it was running on. It wasn't very crowded. But it didn't stop. The next bus, 666, stopped at the above stop, and it was more crowded. 666 and 688 ran together for a stretch, and 688 was in front of 666 at Court Square, where I got off. What I want to know is: why didn't 688 stop at the above stop? It was obviously not crowded, and there were 5 people waiting for a Q39 bus.
He was running late (violation). He was instructed to do so by supervision (permission). He had to go to the bathroom (lax ruling). A police officer instructed him to bypass the stop (public saftety). There was a contraption under the bus where if it fell below a certain speed, sonmething would happen...LOL (sorry....)
Who knows? Only the BO knows for sure. It was most likely one of the first two opinions above. I'd say he was running late, and didn't realize his follower was crowded. He was trying to make-up lost time by not stopping, thereby allowing himself a few minutes to place himself in his proper time slot at the terminal or thereabouts.
While going to SJU Today, I saw 2 starnge sites.
A) I got on 4324 which was very crowded due to the rush of SJU Students going to their 910 classes (me included) and saw WestChester Bee Line Bus 136 (formely a QS Bus?) going towards Jamaica Ave.
B) Next a little further down the road on Union Tpke East, I saw 4448 (couldn't tell what decals the bus had cause the bus was packed and it whizzed by me going onto the GCP. All I saw was the number of the bus. Could it be possible that 4448 was going to JAM/QV? If it's at CS, why would it be going EAST on the GCP?
Q46#4900Gary
Posted by R36Gary on Tue Sep 12 15:02:41 2000
While going to SJU Today, I saw 2 starnge sites.
A) I got on 4324 which was very crowded due to the rush of SJU Students going to their 910 classes (me included) and saw WestChester Bee Line Bus 136 (formely a QS Bus?) going towards Jamaica Ave.
No Idea, Gary. Sorry.
B) Next a little further down the road on Union Tpke East, I saw 4448 (couldn't tell what decals the bus had cause the bus was packed and it whizzed by me going onto the GCP. All I saw was the number of the bus. Could it be possible that 4448 was going to JAM/QV? If it's at CS, why would it be going EAST on the GCP?
Are you sure it was 4448? I've never seen that bus at QV (assuming it was what Im going to describe below):
Many runs on the Q46 invlove short trips to Springfield Blvd, and from Utopia Parkway. Based on your description (you didn't say where on Union you were), I assume you were just before Main Street at the GCP entrance on Union (which almost looks as if it's the GCP service road). Many buses will make a local or limited trip FROM Glen Oaks/LIJ to Kew gardens, and then "dead head" on the GCP to make another WESTBOUND trip. These are the best runs to work because you only "work one way".
The bus you saw was a Q46 dead-heading back to GO/LIJ on the GCP to make another westbound Q46 trip OR to pull into the garage and take his swing. Run-Off from Kew Gardens via Queens Blvd, 78th Avenue, Queens Blvd, Union Tpk, GCP west, Cross Island Parkway South, Jamaica/Braddock exit, Jamaica Ave, 222nd St, 97th Ave.
Please let us know if this is where you were.
I was at 135 ST and Union Tpke right past the Q46/Q74 stop when I saw 4448. And yes it was 4448.
Q46#9374Gary
4448 must have been on the Q74 because it is one of CS's newest RTS's along with 1742 and 1745.
wasnt on the 74 today. i live on the line, saw no RTS.
Well, 4448 IS in CS service, that much is certain.
It wasn't on Q74 because I saw her get onto the GCP Eastbound around 135 St and Union Tpke. When I crossed the GCP on my bus 4324, I saw 4448 on the GCP East.
Q46#4913Gary
Sounds like it's definitely a Q74. It's probably a deadheading AA or tripper. "AA" is an "as assigned" bus placed in service where service is needed as implemented by a SLD on the road. Could be a Q76 with an AM Q74 trip operating in one direction as supplemental service. Remember, this is a new pick. Anything is possible.
Do we have any CS BOs here? If so, check the board and see if you have deadheads from Kew Gardens?
By the way, anybody else lose their cookie? I come on today with no saved info.
4448 could have been deadheading along the GCP for any reason. Perhaps it may even have been running very late from a Q44/20a-b trip and was going back to Flushing out of service. If I was that operator, I would take the GCP also to save some time. BIG AL
Oddly, I too saw a WDOT bus on Tuesday, on the Van Wyck southbound at Liberty Ave. It was a former slopeback, first one I've ever seen. It looks like someone installed a window A/C unit in the back.
-Hank
Several times in recent months, in early evenings, I've seen out of service Orions heading northbound on the Cross Island in the vicinity of the Bayside Marina- that's the long stretch between the Throgs Neck and Northern Boulevard.
I would have to assume that this was a Q12 that went out of service at Northern/Glenwood and is headed back to Stengel. Wouldn't it be more direct for the bus to deadhead to Stengel all the way back on Northern, or even Little Neck Parkway to the LIE to College Point Boulevard? It seems like the Cross Island/Whitestone combo is too roundabout from Little Neck to Stengel. There's also an extremely sharp banked curve where the northbound CIP terminates and merges onto the southbound WE. Buses would have a lot of trouble negotiating it.
If there's a night game starting at Shea, drivers about to go off duty may want to stay off Northern Boulevard AND CPB. But then there's NO WAY to get into Stengel without getting tangled up in the mess.
Maybe I-495 (The world's largest parking lot in my opinion) was backed up as usual and the CIP is the other quickest way to get back to CS. Northern Blvd is a pain in the rear with all of the lights so I think that's why the driver did what he did. The only other way you avoid Shea traffic on Northern is if you go on Northern Blvd and go under the overpass after Prince St Westbound. Make a left at College Point Blvd then at Roosevelt Ave make a right to 126 St to the depot.
Q26#656Gary
Thats the whole idea. Traffic = OT!!!!!!!!
As I left work today, there are signs up for the Bus Fest at the Transit Museum entrances... Hope to see all of you guys there on Sat............
B75#893Mike
Oh yeah!!!!! i will be there at bus fest this saturday & looking forward to meet some of bustalker.
Peace Out
David Justiniano
http://www.geocities.com/justin2669/nyctransitrans.html
Yee Hah! Anyone have an idea yet of what will be there in terms of things on display not only from transit, but perhaps from other providers?
About a decade or more ago, the B69 and B67 switched southern terminals. Why was it done???
B67#912Mike
B69#587Mike
I beleive because they found that most of the people that ride the B69 past Bishop Ford HS were transfering from the B67 to the B69. Mainly because of Methodist Hospital.
B61 Leonard
While I was jogging along Mosholu Parkway in the Bronx this afternoon, I noticed three X32 buses whizz by me. The people inside the buses looked all to be from Bronx Science, obviously returning to Queens from School. I was just wondering if the TA ran this bus as a courtesy to the students of Bronx Science, because even if one or two fare paying passenger rode on these buses, they TA would still lose money.
BTW these buses were all in the 1700's, I think from QV. Are these the only 1700's that QV uses, because, I haven't seen many lately.
Clark Palicka
CEO TrAnSiTiNfO
http://www.transitinfo.cjb.net
Clark: Thoses buses are 17xx from QV & i seen it couple of them going though Bronx River Parkway in the morning & afternoon.
Peace Out
David Justiniano
http://www.geocities.com/justin2669/nyctransitrans.html
The X32 is a $3 express bus, just like any other express bus NYCT operates.
David
But the question has still remains unanswered! Is the X32 an express bus service that mainly serves Bronx Science students and Lehman College students and others of course or what? Everytime I see an X32 it always has Bronx Science Students on it and it is never crowded and it only runs during School times, that doesn't seem like regular express bus service to me or other Bus Talkers.
Thanks & Peace
DaShawn
www.transitworld.org
Yes, the X32 is designed to serve Bronx HS of Science riders, but, as with any NYCT service, anybody who happens to be going that way is welcome to ride it.
David
How can you tell they're Bronx Science students?
-Hank
{How can you tell they're Bronx Science students?]
Good question, really - the one stop in the Bronx (W. 205th Street & Paul Avenue) is near two high schools (Bronx Science and DeWitt Clinton) and a college (Lehman). However, the X32's riders tend to range in age from 14 to 18, and only Bronx Science has a reputation that would lead kids to pay $6 round-trip to get there. The only other people who would think to ride it would be students at the other schools, or teachers.
----
Note 1: Riding is strong enough that a fourth morning trip was added within the past year.
----
Note 2: It's a split route, assigned to Casey Stengel for the morning trips and Queens Village for the afternoon trips.
So the students do have to pay for the bus? They're metrocards won't cover it??
Clark Palicka
CEO TrAnSiTiNfO
http://www.transitinfo.cjb.net
I don't think there are many people that would go there from Clinton as I doubt that any Queensites go there. There are many schools in Queens that have a similar or better reputation.
I always thought the x32 was an Express Bus Service meant to serve Bronx Science Students who lived in Queens. It always seemed like a weird route, with three different routes in Queens and only 1 bus on each.
As far as I know, if its express, a school bus pass would not work on the route and that would probably explain why there are so few students.
Shaun
The X32 was designed specifically with Bronx Science students from Queens in mind. Information was made available on it in Ryan JHS where I went to school. True, if you happen to be going that way and are not a Science student, you are welcome to ride it. However, it was exclusively Science and all three buses usually had standees, but the afternoon runs were rarely beyond a seated load.
A bit of information as best as I can recall, as I took that bus over 10 years ago: Back then, the route was entirely based out of Flushing (Stengel). The morning runs were on regular city buses (then 15xx, 39xx or 1700-1733, and the early (2:40pm) bus was run by Number 1736, until it was removed and replaced by a 39xx when too much vandalism occurred and 1736 couldn't make its more important Manhattan run on the X51 on time. The 3:20pm runs were 15xx, 39xx, or 1700-1733 like the morning run.
The fare was $3.50 each way, payable in tokens, change, or Express Bus Tokens, which were gigantic Y-cut beauties I would love to get a few of to add to my collection. I remember, on several occasions, going to Jay Street and buying bags of 100 of these tokens to use, as they were far more convenient and less prone to loss. Also, they guaranteed I didn't waste the money on junk food or whatever.
The only competitor to the X32 was James M. Gagnon, who ran a private school bus service to Science (I believe it is now called Bronx Science Bus Service). I rode Gagnon for two years before realizing that, for basically the same price on the X32, I could get air conditioning in the summer and heat in the winter, instead of the other way around on Gagnon, who mainly used 10-year-old Thomas buses that were the most uncomfortable vehicles known to man.
I hope this (exhaustively) answers your questions :-)
This morning at about 10AM a fire truck responding to an alarm struck and damaged an NYCTA bus at the intersection of 5th Avenue and 57th Street. The fire truck, a rear mounted ladder truck, assigned to Ladder Company #2 was travelling westbound on 57th Street while the bus, RTS #4515 assigned to the M2, was travelling southbound on 5th Avenue. The collision occured in the intersection with the fire truck striking the left front and left side of the bus. The bus sustained considerable damage. The fire truck sustained damage to it's right front side. The bus driver and approximately 8 passengers sustained injuries although the severity is unknown. It is unclear if any of the firemen aboard the truck were injured. It is also unclear who was at fault. I would assume that 4515's career with the TA is over because of the damage sustained and the age of the bus. However it wouldn't surprise me if the TA decided to repair it.
Which LIBus facility operates this line? I always thought that part-time operators worked this route after having reported to a location other than Mitchel or RVC garages. That would explain the use of mini-buses and Thomas buses on that line. I live right on part of that route and I have been noticing more and more "standard" buses on the JFK Flyer. For the most part Gilligs and Orions from Mitchel Field have been spotted on both weekdays and weekends.
I'm not sure if that is just a summer initiative to provide allegedly air-conditioned buses (I still see Thomas buses every now and again), or is it Mitchel Field that actually operates the "N91".
Someone please help.
Mark
The N91-JFK Flyer normally operates from Mitchel Field Depot. No specific equipment is assigned to this route; all bus operators, part ("limited assignment") and full-time, are trained and qualified to operate all passenger equipment. However, absenteeism for part-timers is considerably higher than for full-time operators, and when a part-time operator is AWOL or calls in sick, the N91 (and all other so-called "limited assignment" routes) run is given to the spare or extra board, which consists entirely of full-time operators. While a full-time operator can be assigned to any route in MTA Long Island Bus, a part-timer may operate only limited assignment routes.
I don't know if you have noticed but arics have (at least daytime) pretty much taken over the M23. Also spotted one on the 1st Ave., probably M15 but waiting for xtown on 23rd Street & 2nd was too far away to be sute.
Arti
OPEN BIDDING ON THE AGENDA
Peace,
ANDEE
How does this affect QSC and the other privates? Would routes effectively be "transferred" between companies based on bids?
Lifted form the Daily News article:
"The authorization was extended to Dec. 31, 2003, from Dec. 31, 2002.
.......
The Queens lines are Green Bus Lines, Jamaica Bus Co., Triboro Bus Co and Queens Surface Co. The Bronx companies are Liberty Lines and New York Bus Tours and the Brooklyn operator is Command Bus Co."
You asked: "Would routes effectively be "transferred" between
companies based on bids?"
Oh no, it could be a whole new group of players, e.g. Laidlaw, etc.
Also the TWU could be out too if they do the bids when the contracts expire ... that's what was planned for the end of this year, but now the contract with the "operators" has been extended, now they & the City can turn to the contract with the TWU.
I believe the TWU was talking it up with the City about how "service" would suffer if they were out & all those out of work members sure wouldn't be voting for the party that threw them out.
So, it looks like you are going to have me to kick around for a while longer ;-)
Disclaimer: I didn't have anything to do with this & haven't even had my tie on all Summer, so am just speaking for myself.
Mr t
They were also discussing how service would suffer with talk of the Regional Bus Company. We'll see.... we at ATU don't have much of a voice anyway. When I attended the December Labor Rally on 44th and Madison back in December, TWU did all the talking. We spoke with the "other unions" represented, LOL!
There's also talk of a union split. That would be devistating, IMHO, to all BOs. There's so much division being discussed today, I just hope I get out before it all comes crashing down.
Oh and Thurston, I've decided to just let the issue slide. If need be in the future, I'll handle it my way, but thanks just the same :-)
If the TWU wanted to make themselves stronger they could do a trade within the AFL/CIO and give the ATU something (equal number of members, right to organize some potential non-union folks, etc.) for you folks becoming TWU. The point is the MTA/TA wouldn't need to have anything to do with it, they would just be informed after the fact.
Mr t__:^)
But who sets the current schedules? D.O.T.? Or the companies themselves? The privates are accused of having poor service. But at least here is Maspeth, the Q39 runs a hell of a lot more often & a hell of a lot more reliable than the Q58 during the rush! But on the weekends: OMG! More frequency is needed! The Q39 runs every 30 minutes and many trips are S.R.O. Q.S.C.'s Q67 ought not run at all as 60 minute headways are offered. The buses are empty because of the headway. Sure schedules are posted in the brochure, but if the bus is late how late is it? If the one bus breaks down, no service at all, so why wait? It seems to me that if the frequency is doubled on both lines, people will come out and ride! I bet even more than double the ridership since you know that the buses run more frequently.
nycDOT sets the service level & provides sufficient buses to accompolish same. If the operator observers a need to change that service level, they can recommend it to DOT, AND as I've said before, the riding public can and SHOULD make their feelings heard "officially" either to DOT or the operator. A letter or e-mail is best because: 1. you'll get a official reply and 2. it is more easily substantiated then a phone call. There are also meetings that are open to the public. DOT has the final say since with each new trip comes the need to pay for it, i.e. make up the short fall in the farebox.
The TA has a bit more flexibility, but the cost still needs to be covered in the end.
I have a friend at the trolley museum who likes to complain to me about the Q66, one of these days I hope to get him to write it down & mail it.
Disclaimer: I don't work for the MTA, TA or nycDOT & am just speaking for myself.
Mr t__:^)
17 INJURED IN FIRE TRUCK/BUS CRASH
Peace,
ANDEE
I've heard stories about this bus (as you may be aware of), and as such, try never to pull it out. What is the true story behind RTS #4429? Thanks
That this bus is a 1986 RTS with a 1982-style destination sign in the front?
Q46#8389Gary
1982-style destination sign up front? OH-BOY, that is a big story! Actually, I've always wondered why that is the only 4400 bus to make it into Queens. I believe it was transferred from Kingbridge a couple of years ago. But why that bus? BIG AL
BIG AL, here's what I mean about the 1982 sign on her:
MTA 4429 on the Q46 @ Kew Gardens.
Q46#4429Gary
It's from Mother Clara Hale depot.
Actually BIGAL, some 4400's were delivered NEW to JAM before the 4500's came to town. In late 1986, JAM's fleet was in such bad shape that the TA temporarily split Walnut allotment of 1986 RTS's with JAM until 4554-4599 arrived. I don't remember the exact numbers but about 20 buses in the low-4400 series did make it to Merrick Blvd before they were sent to their permanenant home in The Bronx
Mark
Apparently nobody here is aware of the history of RTS #4429. I was referring to the accidents it's been involved in, and the outcome of such. I'd heard it was involved in 3 separate accidents at 3 separate garages, and all 3 resulted in *serious* consequences. This bus had even been nicknamed... and as I understand it, BOs from the previous 3 garages refused to pull it out.
Can anyone comment factually on the history of this bus?
Haven't seen this posted before. Last night I saw a classic turning off the Concourse. Wasn't sure what I was seeing from a distance. As the bus got closer, I noticed that the ad signs on both sides of the bus were lit up! The signs were long, and seemed to be in the normal ad frames. But lit up. Anyone know about this?
Also, saw an artic on the Bx31 at 233rd street.
Joe C
Yep. New thing. Runs off either it's own batteries (installed in the bus battery box, a pair of 6v dry cells) or it can be hooked into the bus electrical system by tapping the side marker lights. It's either LEDs, dual-source fiber optics, or a flat-panel flouescent mix that is either greenish or yellowish.
-Hank
I have been noticing that fewer and fewer wrapped busses have been on both Liberty Lines and NY Bus Service.
In the early to mid 90's, wrapped busses were very popular. But now they seem to be a dying breed.
Is there a reason for this? Are the ads too expensive? The wrapping is too hard to maintain? Safety concerns?
Not sure about Liberty, but NYBS is against them; the wraps ruin the paint when removed. Does not sit well with the management up there.
Liberty still wraps, but now, they have at least two buses with these new lit up ad racks on the sides.
Sounds like Bus-O-Ramas to me.
Not quite. But a good replacement.
They are not just at Liberty ... include NY Bus & my favorite Queens bus company ... yes we have 15 signs, that's enough for 7 1/2 buses, I guess the 1/2 is a spare. I'm told that all but two are installed so look for them on our MCI Classics, i.e. the 900s.
In the daylight you can ID them by the white vs. alum. molding on the poster frame.
First busfan to ID which bues have them get a tour of a local bus depot.
Mr t__:^)
Whether or not the MTA operates South Shore express service by the spring, a new express bus service serving Tottenville, Pleasant Plains, Annadale, and Arden Heights will run directly to Midtown Manhattan. The service will run between 6AM-7PM to Manhattan and 12NOON-11PM at full strength, but it will only consist of a few initial test runs to Manhattan and from Manhattan. Test service is expected to begin by the end of September, so watch the board for more info.
The route is called the RM2. Those who have the old Staten Island franchise documents from the mid-1990s will notice that our route follows the Franchise 3 routing.
More info soon.
would you have extra copies of those documents
Steve
I only have a photocopied map that doesn't show everything too clearly when reproduced.
10-4,thanks
Steve
FDNY
While riding the Q66 home yesterday, I saw bus 361 wrapped, but with no upper left grill on the rear side-exposing the engine. Why would she be on the road if this is the case? I also saw bus 389 which looked like she received a new rear destination sign, however someone forgot to fix it. The sign now displays ?X9. Maybe R.M. has seen this bus and he can help me out programming the actual display because IDK how to do it. 419 has a rear sign displaying "4". It was on the Q104 yesterday and 412 was on the QM2 and her rear sign displayed Q101. It appeared to me that a mechanic was driving 437 back to the garage. On the + side, I saw QS bus 914 with a brand new look.
Q66#460Gary
[Maybe R.M. has seen this bus and he can help me out programming the actual display]
I don't know how the sign programming actually works so I can't help with that.
The bus sign I created just creates a sign that looks like those on the buses, but isn't based on any knowledge on how the real things work.
The maint. staff was grabbing the fleet as it came back from the AM runs for a spot check ... hope they caught these probelms.
Mr t__:^)
I saw 389 the other day.
The sign looks more like 7 X 9, with a few pixels on the bottom part of the 7 missing. A question mark would have that point on the bottom.
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##
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Today, I biked (another cool form of public transit which comes in after subways and buses) over to Bethesda Metro to see what the 92 was running since the 36 now had WMATA Flxibles. I saw 5545A on the 92 with the yellow sign on the side. I also saw they took the SmartMover things off Metrobus 4412 and while you would never think the woman was ever on the side of the bus, it was obvious that at one time, this bus said "SERVING TYSONS CORNER, WESTPARK, BETHESDA, ROCK SPRING, AND LAKEFOREST" or something to that extent. A bus was waiting to start the 14A (or that is what it was signed for, I think it was going to start the 14B) and still had the things on top but I didn't get the unit number.
Speaking of repainted buses, does anyone have any information about the aftermath of those WMATA full-bus ads a couple of years back? (The ads were decried as distracting and cheesy, so WMATA removed them from the buses they were on -- mostly original Orion Vs (9xxxs, not the 4200- or 2200-series ones.) Anyway, did WMATA have to then repaint the buses, or did the vinyl peel off a la Saran Wrap?
Chris
Today on my way home from work, I observed at brand new 29' Gillig Advantage Low Floor entering the George Washington Bridge Toll Plaza in Fort Lee. This bus was decked out in the Bee Line System scheme. This bus also had the new Balios "Orange-Type" destination sign (i.e. Green Lines Orion #5503, Command Orion #4961, MTA Orion #522).
I'm guessing that this is a demo bus for a 30' order that Bee Line is seeking for right now. As previous before, they demoed a 25' Orion II, which can still be found in service in the White Plains area.
Keep a eye out for this bus. If you see, you'll know that this is it. It is ver distinctive looking and will catch your eye!
Trevor Logan
www.transitalk.com
I heard that there was an entrance fee for Busfest 2000. Does anybody know how much it's going to cost??
Clark Palicka
CEO TrAnSiTiNfO
http://www.transitinfo.cjb.net
according to the flyer from the transit museum:
adults $5.00
museum members,seniors,children & mta employees $2
subtalk and bustalk regular posters $12
c-49 mack bus enthusiasts free admission
I guess I get in for free then!
you'll have to print out my message and show it to the person collecting the money... tell them you got the info from heypaul, and you'll be surprised at the special treatment that you will receive :-)
It seems The Bronx has more Articulated Buses than the other boroughs. The Bx1 and Bx2 (regular and limited) were among the first lines to get artics...even though most of the route runs above the D/C subway line on Grand Concourse.
Now such Bronx routes as the Bx22, Bx36, even the Bx5 are running with artics. The Bx5 is not that heavy a route! It's not 24 hours and during non-peak hours there are big gaps between buses.
I don't understand how the MTA decides what lines get artics. Manhattan only has artics on M79, M86 and recently began on M23.
By the way, are there artics on Staten Island yet? And what lines in Brooklyn get Artics? Is there any webpage that keeps track of which lines have artic in NYC?
Thanks.
Craig
~
As far as I know, Staten Island does not possess any artics. It is easier to run artics in the Bronx and Brooklyn, then it is to run them in the city. Imagine the M1 having artics?? It would be virtually impossible. I hope the artcis stay in the Bronx where they belong, because it's great being able to know that every time you take a Bx12, it's going to be an artic. they also make for some great pics!!!
Clark Palicka
CEO TrAnSiTiNfO
http://www.transitinfo.cjb.net
It's true.
At one time the line was all-RTS/GMC.
Now, if you catch one it's actually the exception to the rule.
You will see one every once in a while. During the day one or two may appear, and they only run on the Bx12 Limited runs.
When I took a BX12 from Orchard Beach, I rode in the back section of an artic. Some of those turns on that route getting out of that "busway station" are so tight, if you look in the direction parallel to the side walls in that back section towards the front, you would only see the accordion section of the bus!
I dont think SI is getting artics. I believe Bklyn were to get artics but that plan was scratched........
B46M Limited
Queens needs them badly. Especially the Q20A, Q20B, Q43, Q44, and the Q46.
M79#1068Gary
In Bklyn: B6, B12, B35, B41, B44, B46, and MAYBE the B38....
B46M Limited
Hold on there now B46, don't go rattling off potential Bklyn artic routes because once JG goes 100% artic, it will wind up housing about 350 buses, so look for some more routes to be added there. Don't ask me which ones, I have no idea! Your guess will be as good as anyone else's.
Mark
I meant to say once JG goes 100% CNG, they will have well over 300 buses assigned there. My bad!!
Mark
CSJAMQV
But I bet they'll need to have a much higher spare factor vs. what they need with diesel buses.
I dont think SI is getting artics. I believe Bklyn were to get artics but that plan was scratched........
That's because the TA treats Royal Island like a junk yard and all the busses (except at Jackie Gleason) have to be rejects from other boroughs.
Hey Im from Bklyn too. My two home depots: (FLA and ENY) have some new buses, especially ENY but they have some garbage as well...........
B46M Limited
Now Fresh Pond is another story. Replacing 1985's with 1987's is proof positive.
[I dont understand how the MTA decides what lines get artics.]
It's simple:
1. See which depots can accommodate them.
2. Within those depots, see which routes have very good headways now, and will still have very good headways with the substitution.
-----
On a seat-for-seat basis, two artics (2 x 62 = 124) can replace three standard buses (3 x 40 = 120), for a bus substitution ratio of two-thirds or 67%. However, the actual ratio is never worse than 75% (three artics with 3 x 62 = 186 seats replacing four standards with 4 x 40 = 160 seats), so that total seating capacity is still increased by at least 16.3%, even while using fewer buses and drivers. That, in turn, allows for growth on routes which, for whatever reason(s), can't use artics.
Only time u see Bx5 that is heavy routes is mornings & nights rush hours because alot of people get off at Hunts Point Ave & Simpson St Train Station heading to Soundview Area. Yesterday I saw 4 Artic Buses on Bx5 terminal at West Farms Rd at the same time two of them was running late.
Peace Out
David Justiniano
I saw three brand new Orion CNG's on LI Bus today. One was on an N1 going to Jamaica, the bus number was 290. I saw 341 and 346 on the N20/21 also. Sounds like QSC buses, and that large front sign and rear LED lights are easy to see. Unfortunately I never got to ride them, both were running very late. One was supposed to leave Flushing at 5:54pm, but the 6:12pm N21 came first. I got on and it was packed to the front. I had to stand up at the front window, as people were packed in ahead of the white line. He said because the 5:54pm was late, his bus was packed. And he never got a break at layover. He said the N20/21 ridership has went through the roof and as a result buses are very crowded and make alot of stops.
#341 finally did get in front of us before Great Neck, so I was never able to make that one. But I got off at Great Neck and saw 346 going toward Flushing pulling out. I figure after I have a little something to eat I'll catch it on the outbound run.
Well I waited and three N20's came by all, all the older Orions. So the mystery is what happened to #346? He didn't do a return run and just went OOS? I just gave up and got the N21 at 8:30pm to Glen Cove.
Oh well, hopefully I'll get to ride on of the new ones soon.
Also, I saw 149 broke down in Great Neck, looked like it was stuck in the kneeling position. It was still there when I left, no maint. truck yet. Also yesterday I saw 639 (diesel Orion) broke down with maint. truck in Roslyn.
According to the maint. guy, he said "it don't wanna run".
LI Bus..... keep running...... keep running.... you can make it!
I didn't catch the bus number, but at 7:45PM last night I saw a new-looking LI Bus (I noticed the large front sign you described) signed as "N21 Flushing" pulling into the Rockville Centre garage.
The times seem about right for that to have been #346 arriving from Flushing. I have no idea why it was there.
Chuck
Its been over 20 years now. Don't you all think its time the TA changes that drab blue stripe paint scheme? Enough is enough. Its a joke now and with all the different bus models that the TA operates now it makes it even worse. A blue stripe, while being cost effective, is very boring. Its especially sad to see this current scheme on the New Flyer CNG's and the MCI coaches.
CHANGE THE PAINT SCHEME, PLEASE!!
Mark
What go back to green:)
Nah, leave it alone I say.
The TA's paint scheme is a bit boring and it has been around for a long time, but I don't think it's too bad. Now - what I'd like to see is for the TA to use reflective decals and stop making the buses look ridiculous when they get repainted. I'm referring to them slapping white paint on the black areas such as the upper part of the door frames and the opening portion of the drivers window. On the MCI 102DL3's even though they have the stainless steel option they could still look better with a more up-to-date paint scheme. I'm not saying it should be anything fancy (like Academy), but something. These buses are clearly the cream of the crop in the TA fleet - it would be nice if they had a new look. I'm almost afraid to say it because... like I said, I don't feel the TA's paint scheme is bad and knowing those suits at 370 they could easily come up with somthing a lot worst
Wayne
Wayne, I'm very much in agreement with you. In fact, the NYC transit buses never looked better. It is too bad that when all the "choice" buses were around, or what many of us remember as "choice", the buses were the worst of any in the nation.(Although Boston's MBTA ran pretty close.) If they were like that today, I'm sure the press and politicos would have a ball in trying to shut them down, if that could be possible. (The flap wouldn't be directed only at NY Apple.) Today's buses look clean and the stripe, although not too imaginative, is eye appealing in that it flows with the lines of the bus. Nothing garish, no zig-zags or swirls. The "over the roof" diagonal stripe design is surely dated, as is the black window treatment.
Question for posters: what would you come up with if asked to redesign a scheme for NYC transit buses? For me, I'd like to see green and silver or two-tone green again.
Joe C.
It seems that other city agencies have adopted the all-white with blue stripe paint scheme.
The NYPD has been slowly phasing out the older "pepsi blue w/white stripes" painted cars with white Crown Victorias and Impalas with blue stripes.
A 4X4 that belongs to Bus Operations may pass, and if it weren't for the lack of the initials "N.Y.P.D.", you would think the truck belonged to the police.
Compared to some transit agencies I've seen these days, our white and blue scheme is exciting. Check out SEPTA's and MUNI in San Francisco!
Where has all the color gone?
As for the NYPD, there is a state mandate, issue by Rockefeller, that police vehicles have blue somewhere in the scheme if they are bought by the state directly, using state $$$. The change to virtualy all white is in vogue with many police agencies these days. The new white with blue stripes is on all new cars and applied to several older Caprices too. Look carefully, though. Some cars appear to be NYPD, but are actually NYHP (hospitals), among a few others.
>>>The change to virtualy all white is in vogue with many police agencies these days. <<<
This is done merely to save money and increase the resale value of the car when no longer needed by the agency. That special blue paint cost a fortune. I prefered it though. The white NY police cars look like shit.
Peace,
ANDEE
Hey, SEPTA's new color scheme is great! it's just that the stripe is over the windows, instead of just under the window like every other bus company. Besides, red into blue is much more interesting than just a blue stipe, not that I have anything against it. Plus, with the stipe over the windows, that leaves room for decorations and posters, rather than having them cover it. however, I'm not griping, just don't mess with SEPTA :)
Not messing with SEPTA. Just stating the new scheme is hardly that.
The one color fading into the other is neat; think they sort of borrowed the idea from Amtrak? And MUNI's is really the pits. To give up that neat scheme they had is a crime.
What color sheme did MUNI use to have? Today they just have those stipes going down the sides, right? Also, I didn't know that Amtrak had a fading color scheme (SEPTA's started out with the American Ikarus buses that came in 1996, if that means anything). At least, I never saw one train that had a similiar one.
MUNI in San Francisco had a paint scheme the was very similar to the old Houston Astros baseball uniform--different shades of orange from the bottom of the windows all the way down. Quite ugly in my opinion.
Mark
Yeah, I agree, it was very ugly. Also, all the buses had silver linings on their windows, which made the buses even uglier. I actually sorta prefer the new scheme, although it is a bit boring and a copy of the way SEPTA has their scheme.
Huh? Muni only had ONE bus done that way. The rest of them were a basic white body, with imitation gold around the front (with a red pinstripe centered through it. Just behind the front wheels, it waqs reversed -- bright red stripe with gold pinstripe. It was very bold and attractive when it first came out in 1973, designed by Walter Landor & Associates (of San Francisco, of course) -- who also designed the paint scheme for Golden Gate Transit, the older United Airlines three-stripe scheme, original Amtrak schemes, and many others which we all find all too familiar.
Look at the Genesis locos. You'll see it on many.
It was delivered on the first 47 of the Genesis locomotives only, units 800-846. The newer bunch, starting with #1-up, got solid stripes once again....as did any repainted units of the 800-846 series. And then the 101-up came in "Northeast Direct" dark blue/red pinstripe scheme -- which is what they are starting to repaint ALL their locomotives into nowadays.
I don't know about vogue, but the change to white with blue stripes (they were originally planned to be green!) was purely a money-saving thing. It cost an extra $1000 per car (for the Caprice and LTD; it's more or less for the Broncos, ESU trucks, and Phone Booth scooters) for the 2-tone blue and white job. The city buys something like 400-500 vehicles for the police dept each year (this includes all their vehicles), and the savings are significant.
-Hank
I also heard that the reason the NYPD moved from all blue to all white was to save money.
A few years ago the news stations on tv talked about it and even showed a picture of what future police cars would look like.
I didn't know that the use of blue was required in all police cars bought by the state. I guess it was a way to show that the vehicle was purchased using state funds. It also explains why many municipalities other than NYC use blue also. Many of the larger towns in Westchester and Rockland County also use blue in their schemes.
I always wondered who decided on the paint schemes of the busses. It seems that the two-tone blue lived a relatively short life. It was seen for the most part in the 70's but by the end of the decade it was already dropped. Is it possible this was also a means of saving money back then? I guess an all-white bus would be cheaper than a blue painted bus.
When the white began to appear on buses, it was an economy measure. The light blue top became white. Also it was perceived as a way to keep the bus cooler. However, it became evident of what was to come with the intro of A.D.B. buses; all white with a single blue stripe.
Recall that the new looks began looking that way before the RTS even arrived. The Grummans had some class to them. But GM's specs never really allowed for an elaborate paint scheme on the RTS. Not until GM sold the RTS did that bus actually emerge with anything fancy. Not one brochure or paint chart that I have or have seen from GM showed the RTS with anything fancy. Could it be the MTA knew what was in store for us early on?
Joe C
It's quite possible they did.
I remember back then many busses had a "PA" in front of the ID numbers, implying that they were bought by the Port Authority. I recall NYC being in some bad financial times and perhaps they needed some "help" so the agency came to the rescue.
I guess they were looking to cut corners at every point they could since money was probably an issue.
I also recall that the Grumman's blue stripe was slightly darker than those found on the Fishbowls and RTS's. It was more of a royal blue.
[I also recall that the Grumman's blue stripe was slightly darker than those found on the Fishbowls and RTS's. It was more of a royal blue.]
My recollection is that at about the time the Grumman's started appearing, the new look buses began being repainted with a darker blue stripe identical to that on the Grumman's. Many of the 9000 series Flxibles were among the first repainted blue and white. After the initial problem with the Grumman's, the GMC RTS order was placed hastily and these arrived with a lighter blue stripe. It was only after the GMC's started arriving that the repainted new looks began appearing with the lighter blue stripe identical to the GMC-RTS's. It's even possible that the darker blue stripe kept appearing on repainted new looks for awhile even after the RTS's arrived, perhaps until the Grumman's were finally discarded by David Gunn.
The similarity of Philadelphia and San Francisco recent paint schemes is from the fact that the same general manager worked at both systems. Both systems also have major grafitti problems, so the "corporate identity" was moved above the roofline where it rarely if ever needs to be repainted when grafitti is applied to the bus and it needs repainting.
One agency I have to compliment on their choice of a new image is Seattle Metro. The buses have become VERY colorful -- bottom third of a bus is "Metro Gold" (okay, orange-yellow...) and the top half is either teal green, forest green, or a very rich blue. Colors are separated by charcoal grey striping (which IS reflective). Their buses look VERY attractive with the three different colors for the top 2/3 of the bus. (Oh, roofs are white....)
And then right across Puget Sound is "Nominee #1" for the Non-Paint Scheme......Kitsap Transit, in Bremerton. Just paint the bus solid off-white (making it look dirty) and apply a 3" high decal in black that says "Kitsap Transit". Do I hear the birdies singing? ("Cheep, cheep, cheep...")
You know, Steve, it is really interesting to see how different managers present their buses to the public. Take LYNX in Orlando. That system is literally a banquet for the eyes! A photographer would need plent or film down there. The variety of equipment is one tging; the colors and wraps are another. They are tops on my list of exciting companies.
Joe C.
If I'm not mistaken, the head of Lynx who started the rainbowing of the fleet wound up in Pittsburgh. I was out in Steeltown for the first time in many years this past April, and that fleet is becoming very colorful and varied, although not quite as bright and flashy as Lynx is. There must be about a dozen different color combinations for Pittsburgh's newest buses, the low floor Neoplans, and all look very nice.
I, too, was impressed with the new scheme of things, Sid. We had the Metro NY bus trip last year and the Neo's were just arriving. Looked great. As did the repaints. After the flashy '70's paint schemes, things got sort of boring, but in a tasteful way. Good maintenance always makes even a boring bus look good. That type of wrap that they use in P'bgh and LYNX is something fairly new. Many people don't like wraps for varying reasons. If a bus has a "knock-out" paint scheme, I wouldn't like a wrap either. Plus the window situation can't be avoided.
Coming home from Liberty State Park Sunday, I saw a Waterway's ferry with a wrap! It was for American Express and featured one of those tennis players, like a huge metrocard. Now even the boats get wrapped!
Joe
You know, Steve, it is really interesting to see how different managers present their buses to the public. Take LYNX in Orlando. That system is literally a banquet for the eyes! A photographer would need plent or film down there. The variety of equipment is one thing; the colors and wraps are another. They are tops on my list of exciting companies.
Joe C.
LYNX really doesn't do anything for me. I prefer a paint scheme, not wrap jobs. A couple years ago, a bunch of former LYNX buses made it out here to California to a resale lot, and without the wrapping on them, they really were NOT anything worth looking at -- just a solid dip-job of some pastel color (and most were PINK....UGH!)
Though I do find big favor with Seattle Metro's new color scheme (actually it's almost four years old now), most of the other agencies between southern California and the Pacific Northwest have very plain, unimaginitive paint schemes.
As other contributors to BusTalk have mentioned, much of it had to do with the lines of the ADB-type buses not lending themselves to any really innovative, eye-catching liveries.
I love the Lynx buses in Orlando. Some of them even have neon lights on the bottom. I think they are some of the best looking buses in the country. I'm going to be moving to Orlando in a few more years and hope I can get employment with them as soon as I arrive down there. I already have all their employment papers sitting in my closet. BIG AL
Yeah, the lynx buses are unique. I mean, the buses aren't painted a specific color scheme, just random colors, like red and green. They also play music (a friend from Orlando told me that) and I think they are getting this advanced announcement sign system thingy that not only shows the stops, but shows advertisement and also tells you what's going on in Orlando. They also seem to pay well and have good coverage as well. A real LTS (my transit company)
Well, I don't think they should change it. Many other companies are changing their paint scheme, like WMATA and SEPTA. However, that simple and boring blue stipe sort of represents New York buses. When someone sees that blue stripe on an RTS, they might think "New York bus". Also, the MTA in Baltimore has that same scheme, so it must be somewhat good.
The reason we have lost all the great paint schemes in all the big cities is thanks to the taggers.
Blue
This is something I've been thinking about for awhile now. For the first time I kind of disagree with you, Mark. I actually like the paint scheme. I love the way they are painting the older RTS's now, with the white pork chop panels, driver's window frame and door inserts. However I will admit the blue stripe is kind of ho-hum. I would paint it like the way Queens Surface does with their orange stripe. The big thick stripe with the thinner stripes above and below it. Now that would really look good on NYC Transit buses. But I say leave the white. It's far better than the green and blue paint schemes they had in yesteryear. BIG AL p.s. my Lexus is white also!
The introduction of the ADB's, especially the RTS, in the late 1970's, was probably most singularly responsible for the tremendous increase in the use of white in transit property paint schemes. In the new look and old look days, many properties had schemes that did not contain white, including our own TA/OA. But the RTS and Grumman 870 lended themselves to lots of white. As I've mentioned before in past posts, today it's extremely rare to find a property whose scheme does NOT contain white. In the NYC metro area, only Jamaica buses comes to mind.
I was always kind of curious as to how the RTSs, NovaBuses, MCIs, Orions and New Flyers would look with the 1970's paint scheme of two-tone blue, except let the dark blue beltline stripe be a couple shades lighter.
Yecccchhh. I don't think that two-tone blue would be becoming to anything but a GM or Flxible new look. (I did try painting one of those plastic RTS bus banks in two-tone blue, and well, couldn't strip the paint back off fast enough!! Anything that looks like a box (i.e. AM General, Gillig, Flyer, etc.) just doesn't look good in it for some strange reason.
Of course, the two-tone green used on the old looks in later years at NYCTA wasn't the prettiest either. That "Italian Kitchen Green" on the upper half was a bit loud on a freshly painted bus, but it faded faast (as did many colors back in those days as paints weren't as good as they are now....) Actually, many of the early GM fishbowls used that same light green as their interior color at NYCTA (you may have seen it on the interior of Long Beach, CA's 5100 series).
{That "Italian Kitchen Green" on the upper half was a bit loud on a freshly painted bus, but it faded faast (as did many colors back in those days as paints weren't as good as they are now....)}
hmmm So was that the name for that shade of green? Most of my friends' families including my family didn't have that color in our kitchens. :-)
Speaking of the color green, a teacher once told my class that there are people in Ireland who know the name for each of the many shades of green there are out there. I couldn't believe how many there are.
Hey Steve,
We never had that color in our apartments. We must have missed something. In fact I liked the TA's two tone green, and even the Bd Of Transportation's green, and even FACO's green. Please tell me if Binney & Smith had that "Italian Kitchen" green in the boxes of crayons they sold.
Joe
In their Thirtieth Anniversary Booklet, Kings Plaza mentions the bus routes that run to the mall, including: "Pioneer Bus Service from Coney Island to Canarsie."
I'm actually not posting this to complain, but what service did Pioneer run to Coney Island?
Maybe they meant the 100 connecting with the Brighton Line at Kings Hwy
Pioneer also ran the Command BM1 BM2 BM3 and BM4. I don't remember where they run, but I know the BM4 runs towards the Coney Island "area". Did any of the others run to Coney?
I once saw a sign showing BMn (where n is a number) Coney Island on the front of a Command 1985 RTS.
The 4 runs to Gerritsen Beach, the closest Coney Island here is the Coney Island Sewage Treatment Plant on Knapp Street. The BM3 runs to Sheepshead Bay (they call it Kings Bay), the BM2 and B103 (with some BM2s called BM2S going to Starrett City and New Lots on request) to Canarsie, BQM1 to Starrett City and New Lots via Queens and the BM1 and B100 to Mill Basin.
The B103 will go to Starrett City on request.......
B103#4961Mike Limited
Maybe they meant the 100 connecting with the Brighton Line at Kings Hwy
It doesn't stop at Kings Plaza
Even if they did, then why did they call it Pioneer?
Maybe the connection is with the B3 and the subways. Or the B36 to the B3. But the B3 does not go to Canarsie. When are they going to extend the B36 to KP already???
B36#7527Mike
But the B3 does not go to Canarsie.
I've thought that in addition to filling in the creek between Avenue U and Strickland Avenue, that Avenue U should connect to Seaview Avenue with a bridge across the Paerdegat Basin, and Seaview Avenue-Canarsie should cross the Fresh Creek to meet Seaview Avenue-Starrett City.
Saw old TA #1322 at Belmont Park as a parking lot shuttle bus today operated by Jettaway Transit. Still had everything on the exterior except the TA logo. I saw another old TA bus there but didn't catch the number. Anyone have an idea as to which TA buses Jettaway now has?
If you do a search of my posts from about 2 months ago, you'll see I had a post about Jet-Away's buses, including two Flxible 870's at Belmont. I had the mumbers listed on one of the posts......I believe 1248 and 2439 (ex- NYCTA's) were there also.... I try to go there on the way home sometimes in search of the elusive 5200 slope back RTS. Refer to B-T post 17600 for a picture of that bus
1459, 2492 and Red and Tan 2202 are the others there.
R36Gary
While I was waiting for my mom yesterday, I saw Green Bus Lines #616 go eastbound on Queens Boulevard. Its side sign wasn't in its regular Q60-South Jamaica position, but was showing the bottom part of another route. Here's what I could make out:
Q21-A NEW LOTS
What the heck is the Q21-A, and what happened to it?
The Q21A ran from Far Rockaway (Beach 19th & Seagirt) to New Lots Avenue station. It was killed quite some time ago, presumably due to non-ridership.
Like a combination Q22-Q21-B15, eh?
Like a combination Q22-Q21-B15, eh?
(those are the three routes needed now to get there.
more like Ashford New Lotts Cleveland to Linden,,,then the B13,,Q7 route.Q21.Q22 via Rockawa y Beach Blvd between Beach 73 and Beach 35,,then Beach Channel Drive/Cornaga/Mott Av combination
I just discovered that I have a Queens bus map from 1989 that has the Q21A on it. The only problem is that the Brooklyn portion of the route was covered up by the Jamaica inset.
The UTU has called for a strike tonight at midnight. It appears that it
will happen. To read all about it, go to "www.mta.net", or to the LATimes web page.
That just came in.
I saw an interview with one of the MTA directors which lasted about five minutes this evening. There was no union representative there so some of the information may have been one sided.
According to the director, the average B/O for the MTA earns $50K a year, and senior B/O's who get overtime earn up to $80K. If that is true I doubt that their apartments look like Ralph Kramden's. Is this the salary range for B/O's in New York and other big (unionized) cities?
Another figure that was tossed out was that it cost $98.00 per hour to run an MTA transit bus. This was compared to $68.00 per hour for the Santa Monica busses which also run in Los Angeles County. That is obviously not all for salaries. What are the costs per hour to provide service in NYC?
The big sticking point that management and the union have not budged on is management's desire to have some B/Os work a ten hour four day week to provide better rush hour coverage. Management claims that there are a significant number of B/O's now working ten hours a day, five days a week and getting much overtime. They want to reduce the overtime.
The union position is that ten hour shifts, especially when there is a long swing between morning and evening rush hour which could increase the total work day another two hours is too long for safe operation. Any comments?
Tom
Let's say during a shift a driver doesn't feel well. Does he take his bus and drive back to the depot? Suppose it's the overnight shift and buses are running only once per hour? Is there always someone at the depots waiting to fill in for a sick driver (or one who simply doesn't show up for work)?
It seems while I wait for a bus that's listed on the bus stop schedule and it doesn't show up that the next bus on the route arrives the next time another bus is scheduled. Usually the next bus is very crowded...so I guess there really was a missing bus. Either the driver is out that day or maybe the bus had equipment problems.
Craig
^
Its usually the operators decision if he can SAFELy bring the bus back to the depot. They can also have an ambulance called for them if they choose. Most of the time, there are report operators available - assigned to report to the crew at a certain time to be available to cover open work or sit with dead buses. There may be 1 report available at a time or they may be ten. All these people are assigned to the extra list. Most extra list operators are assigned a piece by 3 pm the previous day, so they will know what they are working the next day most times before they leave the previous day.
So these report operators are the first to cover runs of those who go sick, otherwise, other operators who are clearing or pulling in may be asked to work the run - either the first half or the remainder.
Hey, this may be irrelevant, but what are the emergency service buses for (SEPTA has those operating once in a while). Are they for sick drivers or sick buses?
In the event there are no report operators for a night bus in this type of emergency, the crew dispatcher has a book with all the operators and a good crew man knows who would be willing to work the night bus. Also usually theres always a operator who lives close to the depot who can be called also. Another thing thats done is to ask a late run operator who's clearing to do the trick or at least part of it till the morning report operators start coming in around 4 to 5 am.
In the event there are no report operators for a night bus in this type of emergency, the crew dispatcher has a book with all the operators phone numbers and a good crew man knows who would be willing to work the night bus. Also usually theres always a operator who lives close to the depot who can be called also. Another thing thats done is to ask a late run operator who's clearing to do the trick or at least part of it till the morning report operators start coming in around 4 to 5 am.
For Stations there is one of two possibilities:
1- If they are a lunch relief without a booth to open, they'll be released ,EMS(if requested)and Supervision will respond,and the remaining people would get paid for lunch.
2-If they are in a booth then supervision would respond along with EMS if needed/requested until another lunch relief is pulled to man that booth or an extra would be assigned to that booth. Extras who have no job report to their home station and wait at their home station's booth for a job. Overtime is also possible.
The same policy would apply for emergency at home or with a family member. family is instructed to call Stations who will have a supervisor meet the employee and then they'll release the employee.
Alan, Your E. mail does not seem to go through. I received the article on Hampton Luxury Liner. After carefully studying the picture, the bus in question is a 35 foot Sentry model, manufactured by Goshen Coach of Elkhart, Indiana. It is built on a Ford chassis with a Ford diesel engine and mor-ryde suspension. Goshen is primarily an RV manufacturer but they do build mini and mid size buses, as well. There is no way that a Goshen coach can match a Prevost for both, comfort and durability. Therefore, I do not think that Hampton Jitney has anything to worry about as far as the competition goes. KING SOLOMON
This week a few 4400's have returned to Mother Hale. I believe these 4400's were at the depot before the Orion switch over.
IF those were the ones from ENY does this mean ENY will be getting some Orions in return.The depot is large enough for them
Back in the April 1999 when NYCT start delivers Orions Buses from 6000-6349 at the same time MCH Depot had 4408-4414, 4416-4428, 4430-4446 & few TMC 80xx. Why 44xx back at Mother Clara Hale Depot??? Do B/O complaint about the Orions Buses?
Peace Out
David Justiniano
Mother Hale porblemy needed more buses. Since there are only Xamout of Orions in the system and RTS's are still the largest fleet still in the system it would make it the only buses to be sent to increase sevice out of these dopots. So what every buses are left after all the 4600's and 4700's are spilt up out of Jackie Gleason and the 4400's are the oldes buses left and are the next to be retired so there the one that Mother Hale would get untill the Orions 7 get drived to them.
Robert
225 returned to stengel from MCH. saw it on wednesday.
CS I guess is doing the same as MCH is. They have 1742, 1745 and 4448. Maybe they got 1742 and 1745 to avoid running a bus like 538 on the X51. I remember when I passed by CS last year and seeing buses 4571, 4583 ands 5150 from JAM coming out of the wash. The bus I remember riding quite a few times from CS was 1532. Otherwise I didn;t ride that many "old" RTS from CS cause I relied on Grummans on the Q66 to get to and from my HS. PS Saw 4146 on the Q46 today.
Does anybody know if 4198's rear # plate is faded? I saw some QV bus from a distance and it may have been 4198 cause I don't remember any other bus with a faded # plate in the rear.
Q46#3901Gary
Extra runs have been added in Mother Hale since the spring on the M1's and M7's. Also there are some X's in the morning on the M57 and M98's added this pick.
And the operators there hate the 33 digit Orions, not enough leg room. We have a lot of big guys in the Mother Hale. No complaints about the 6000's however.
Buses 4478 and 4494 are both in MCHale, however, they have never run out of there in the past. The lower numbered 4400's now at ENY and FLA are ex-Hales (no pun intended).
Mark
I wasn't sure because when I was an operator in Mother Hale back in 95,96 we had about 40 of them but i didn't remember the numbers.
Rumor has it at the depot as well that Artics will be arriving in January. A maintainer in the depot told me that some space in the back of the house will be concreted and prepared for the Artic maintence lifts. The artics will run the on Bx19's.
Just part of my theory that Artics are the wave of the future and will be all over in the future.
Currently some KB artics come into the depot to fuel up when KB has fuel line problems.
BREAKING NEWS FROM HERE IN PASADENA !!
the MTA bus & rail TRANSIT STRIKE is on the transit dependent be dammed to losing thier employment jobs may will be forced into the UIB & Welfare rolls not having any other means to get to thier place of employment !! Why cant they just pay the transit workers ( all ) of them......,
a good living wage ?? I am mad as hell & I am not going to take it anymore !!
They make between 35k and 55k per year. Sounds like a good living wage to me.
-Hank
At the last second the negotiations took a swing and will be put ff for at least for another 24 hours.
I just overheard the dispatcher give the CODE 1 that the strike will be put off.
Blue
COMPANY CANNED ON BUS GPS SYSTEM
Peace,
ANDEE
The units have been removed from all 30 126th St buses which had them. The standard Motorola radio has been installed in their place. When it worked the GPS system was very accurate in tracking buses. Unfortunately, most of the time the system didn't work and turned out to be another in a long line of TA boondoggles. When is the TA going to learn that high tech isn't always the best solulution for NYC? Systems that work in other cities won't work in a transit system that carries over 6 million people a day.
at least the working poor will still have a way to get to work !!
( for now at least )....
bus festival
i was happy to see that the c-49 mack would be there...
did buses ever have wicker seats?
does anyone know when the buses will get there?
i'd like to tape some of the sounds of the mack in motion.. where is it currently stored? and will it get to the festival under its own power?
Busses start to arrive around 7AM. Mack comes under its own power, do not know where they keep it.
Peace,
ANDEE
thanks andee... i'd love to get some engine sounds of the mack... i know it was being kept at flatbush depot, because i used to spot it in the doorway...
does anyone know about its movements tomorrow?
I am definately going to try to go to the Bus festival. It will be interesting to see the transit museum as well, since I've never been there.
Go to my web site, take the express train to the Transfer Point, then take the Flushing Line to the new voting booths at the Main Street stop. I won't give you the questions here, though.
Join the mailing list!
http://nav.to/rmmarrero
to Express Train
Click on the link that says "Join the Mailing List!" above the map.
BTW, this will be the last post for updates to my site on BusTalk. It'll all be in the newsletter you will get by joining the mailing list.
Yesterday, while riding the B24 bus, I noticed the following:
Effective Monday, September 18, 2000
Bullseye Tokens Will No Longer Be Accepted
YES
NO
Then it gave instructions on how to redeem the old tokens.
I never knew they still accepted the old tokens until now. Then again, the only old tokens I have are in my collection. I won't be using them.
How long has it been since that fare hike that introduced the new tokens?
I ride the subway and base my answer on that viewpoint, but at the booth we do not accept the old tokens and refer the customer o 270 Jay Street and ask them to pay $1.50.
I still get one old Token onec in awhile. This also will keep people from using the Garden State Parkway Token witch counts as $1.25 in the fare box. People put them in with a $0.25 and just walk on by. I can't say anything becouse the fare box drops them down to fast for me to hold it up so I could see it.
Robert
The new token was issued Nov. 1995 & recently this depot was asked "officially" how many we still get.
I said the computer says we get thousdands a month (am always trying to find ways for them to get interested in fixing the data errors).
They didn't like that answer, because everyone else told them what is coming in physically, which is a very few a day. But, that's not going to keep me from trying AGAIN.
The system also still "records" Express tokens, but no value is assiciated with them ... when the number is big the bells go off in my head .... error, error, error.
Mr t__:^)
FYI, the Bullseye token now goes clunk instead of ding in the farebox.
(I got a call this AM from the TA, they were following up on a FAX that was sent Friday ... which I haven't seen yet).
Mr t__:^)
As of right now, I plan to check out BusFest tomorrow. If I'm there, I will be wearing an Orlando Hat. Who else is planning to go? I wonder what other buses will be there? How's the weather gonna be?
R36Gary
I expect to be there. Maybe I'll wear my HONEYMOONERS T-shirt, the closest thing I have in my wardrobe to anything bus-related.
Either that of wear one of those sandwich boards with a print of NYCSUBWAY.ORG's home page on it.
I still haven't decided if I'm making the trip to NYC, but I may be there. Don't know what I'll be wearing, but I'll be sure to introduce myself if I spot any BusTalkers.
Wayne
what is the location and the times
Oh Yeah!!!! i will be there & i might be wearing mets or polo sport hat. Im going to have a good time tomorrow at BusFest.
Peace Out
David Justiniano
I'll be there around 9:30 AM. I'll be wearing a West Florida tennis T-Shirt, and a khaki yankee hat.
Hope to see y'all there!!!
Clark Palicka
CEO TrAnSiTiNfO
http://www.transitinfo.cjb.net
I'm gonna be there, probably wearing a Ben and Jerry tye-dye shirt or a green "I'm a TransiTrinket winner!" Cyall there!
--Clayton Parker--
I'LL BE THERE:
Sporting at pair of Navy Blue Windbreaker pants and a Polo Sport T-Shirt and a MTA "Gilligan Style" Hat with a Navy Blue NYC Subway Line Bag
See Ya'll There,
Trevor Logan
www.transitalk.com
can we all meet somewhere ,,at a certain time
9:30 AM at the Burger King on Fulton Street sound good? Upstairs??
Let me know.
Clark Palicka
CEO TrAnSiTiNfO
http;//www.transitinfo.cjb.net
bling bling
every time i come around your city
bling bling
pinky ring worth about 50
Gosh, sometimes I wish I lived in NYC! Well, I'll be there in spirit, even if I'm actually in Washington, D.C. ... everyone take good pictures and post them on y'all websites!
Chris
Pics taken tomorrow will be on TransiTALK Monday Night!
Trevor Logan
www.transitalk.com
Count Me In! I'll be dressed up as either an ex-QSC 700 Orion or I'll be downstairs as #8013 in the museum. Either eway, I'll have my APS camera with me to take some pics.
I'll be there. Look for me in a white 126th Street Depot shirt with a picture of an RTS in front. I'm looking forward to meeting everyone. See you there.
Ill b there. I will probably have on my 3 Train Shirt.....
B46M Limited
i expect to be there early... i will be wearing brown socks...
I'll be checking it out. I've never been to the transit museum before, so what is the best way to go?
I'll be the short guy with the black bag, probably some of you remember me from the "Redbirds to Stillwell" trip.
The weather should be nice, and it sure will be interesting to see the types of buses that ran years ago.
Since it's a long trip from Sea Cliff I probably won't get there until 10 or 11am. Lets see N21 bus to 7 train, then F train to Jay street.
The longest part is the N21 bus trip, about an hour and 15 minutes to Flushing.
take the 7 to the 4 express stops to boro hall, then walk a block or two south. better than f local
Yeah that sounds better since I think there is no Queens IND express on weekends. I'll take the 7 to GCT and then a 4 to Boro Hall.
Also with major IND G.O. on 6th ave that would be a good place to avoid. Better to stick with the IRT.
Yeah that sounds like a better idea......
There is already one GM Flxible there........
BM34x
I just took a look at www.wmata.com and saw that they have a ton of buses for sale. Several 1978 Flx New Looks, many GM fishbowls from various years and just about all of their RTS II's. Very sad to see all these buses go as this is what I grew up riding on. Oh well, I guess I'll have to get used to these new Orions. At least there are several hundred Flx Metros in the fleet.
Oh no, they are selling those buses now? I grew up with them too! I lost my tooth on one of the New Looks, and I always rode the K6 and RTSs when I was little. That's just awful. I guess I would have to get used to riding the new orions all the time now, whenever I ride these routes. But at least there are the flxibles left.
Poor old GMCs! They look so forlorn and unloved, don't they?
I, too, am sad to see them go. I guess that's progress, but still it's sad to see the faithful old guys go. I've long entertained a fantasy of buying an old bus for personal use, but I've nowhere to put it except the street in front of my house! (gleam in eye) Wonder how much they're going for?
They'll probably all get bought up by some third world government, and I wish them well going into their next life. Farewell, faithful Flxis and RTSs and of course Fishbowls!
Chris (all choked up)
Wow, that truly is a sad sight. You should see what Metr o does to their buses when they;re pulled form service. White primer is sprayed all over the bus and they're sent to McCarty St. for storage. While there, they can be stripped and parted for other buses. At least, the Fishbowls keep a small amount of dignity.
True, though if you noticed from the photo they spray-painted over all service numbers and WMATA markings, and according to the website their tires were removed for re-use by WMATA and replaced by last-legs "scrap tires" which can't legally be used to drive on public roads. In short, according to WMATA: these were pulled out of service working, but they're as is -- you're responsible for towing them off our land. Truly sad.
Chris
If we all chipped in, we could get a SubTalk/BusTalk bus for field trips. Although, Aerotech Shuttle or I would have to keep it in front of our houses on our streets and in my case, my street isn't the best for bus parking, let alone buses themselves!
LOL Oren!! Yeah, NW DC isn't the best place to house a 40-foot vehicle. Wish I had a barn out in the country somewhere to house old buses ... :)
The Fort Totten Service Lot, in answer to your other post, is a chain-link lot adjacent to the Fort Totten Metro Station. You can sort of see it from the Red Line train as you go past. If you get off at Fort Totten, it's near the construction trailers and parking lot. (Been a while since I've been there.) As the auction deadline is October 10th or thereabouts, you've probably got until then to get pictures of them on the lot.
If I go there and take pics I'll scan them and send them to you. Can't promise tho.
Chris
when I was waiting for the metro on the train platform, I saw them, but you can't really get a good shot from there, it is too far away.
So lets do it and find a place too put it,We can only dream right.
I think you should get an Orion I bus, if you get one. It isn't ancient like the New Looks(I'm not a new look enemy, but it is old), but they are nice (Ride on had them and still have more modern models) Also, if you ever wanted a bus, go to www.transitsales.com. That is where they sell all kinds of used buses. (We could also get the T-30, I loved them when I was little.) Anyway, you don't really need a 40ft bus, you could get a 30ft bus, but buses are like 90,000 dollars, so, that isn't very good(we'd have to chip in a Lot). Well, just a suggestion if you guys ever do(I can't-I'm just a kid-I'm broke, and I can't really go on the field trips-out of town).
Heh, LOL.
Yeah, I've been to Transitsales before. Good site ... tons of buses. I'd love to wander around their lot and look at all of them.
Well, we can dream ...
Chris
I was just joking about getting one.
I would love to get one of the old WMATA buses, too, but I don't think my apartment would like to see a bus partially stuck in the garage! LOL. They served us well, and hopefully, some of them get a good second life.
The Fort Totten lot is so hard to see from the platforms because of all the trees. I too tried to see them a couple of weeks ago and could only see a few buses there.
P.S. Had a great time at Busfest yesterday. It was worth it to be two hours late coming home as my train broke down in Philadelphia. Thanks to Amtrak's satisfaction gurantee, I know have a voucher to ride free in the next 18 months.
I am very much interested in buying and restoring another fishbowl from WMATA/DCT. I currently have 6342 and would like to get another 5304. Does anyone know which ones are decent?
http://www.geocities.com/regtransit/
From what the website said, most of the buses are in good condition. If you go to www.wmata.com, go to the surplus materials section and for the buses, they give a contact person to get in touch with to get info on them. I bet they can help you out. Good luck! I wish I could get my hands on one, but unfortunately, living in an apartment doesn't allow me to do so. Maybe I can trade in my parking permit for my car and use it for the bus. lol.
LOL. Maybe I can tell my neighbors that the Fishbowl is "what we traded in the minivan for."
Chris
A few of my coworkers and I were joking that we should all chip in and get one and gut it out and turn it into a mobile unit for my company and drive it wherever we have conferences. Since I still have my CDL, I've been designated as the driver.
But, I do like the thought of trading in the car for the bus. Maybe Metro would be so kind as to let me park the bus at the bus garage across the street from me! Until one day when I come out and it "accidentally" was placed in revenue service and is operating somewhere in VA. lol.
I really don't think a WMATA bus would be more than $20,000. The RTS's on service here in Houston aren't even worth as much as a wheelchair lift. Also, I've seen adds of working RTS buses going for as low as $4,000 and some RTS slopebacks at $10,000 a pop.
One thing about buying a bus at an agency's auction is that you get the bus cheap....but usually then you have to make a deal with the tire people for the rubber on the bus, as most transit agencies have a lease/service contract with one of the tire manufactuers.
My employer sold off some buses a few years ago and they went for an average of $4,000 a piece (I know, cheap -- but they were Gillig Phantoms not worth their weight in scrap metal as far as I'm concerned) plus an additional $1,000 or more a piece for the tires that were still on the bus.
I guess you could bring your own set of tires and wheels and pay off the tire people to switch them....anyone know?
Maybe you should try EXITING the system. Yesterday afternoon, I took 4350 on the E2/ from Friendship Heights to Fort Totten. The bus was talking although you couldn't hear it over the engine. What I did hear was that there are two Conneticut Avenue stops and two 16th Street stops (Missouri + 16th and 16th Street are the same thing for my purposes). Also, Georgia Avenue is not at Georgia Avenue but the next street over (technically).
Upon arrival at Fort Totten, I found the lot immediately. The gate was open but it did say "NO TRESSPASSING" so I try to see how long it was until a WMATA employee found me. Roll signs have been taken out and the word MetroBus and unit numbers are now painted over in black (the stripes are still there). All the buses have their fronts away from the Metro Station and the buses are all at the station end of the lot so there aren't many good photo ops. After spending 45 minutes taking photos, I took the Metro to Silver Spring and went on with my daily life.
I *have* gotten off there before, if that was directed at me. I used to go to school on South Dakota Ave and took either the Red Line or E-bus from Fort Totten every day.
Glad you got pictures, though. This afternoon I had to go to Wheaton and riding past it, as you describe it, there are a ton of buses there now. Much fuller than I've ever seen the lot before. Didn't get off the train to look but maybe I'll drive over there this weekend and get some pictures. I trust the security didn't hassle you?
Chris
There was no security. The gates were open but I saw "No Tresspassing" signs and decided going in to get better pics.
I may have to try that then. Thanks.
-- Chris
I meant I decided against going in. No security means security may arrive at which point you are in big trouble. All my pictures are of the backs and sides of buses except for one bus that is facing the right way and has no obstructions (might b a flx new look, im not good @ identifying buses)
Easiest way to tell fishbowl from new look is the windshield -- the bodies DO look similar, especially under WMATA paint jobs. The flxible windshield has six pieces of flat glass in a sort of "bay window" frame painted body color (white). The GMC fishbowl's windshields indeed look like fishbowls: they have rounded glass and black-rubber weatherstripping forming a cross.
Looking forward to seeing the photos on the site!
Chris
Also a way to tell them apart is by that little cresent shaped window next to the front door and the driver's window. The GMC fishbowls have them, and the Flxible New looks don't. Also, the middle tiny window on the left side of the bus(right accross from the back door) is rhombus shaped like the other big windows (Flx new look), or a regular square with right angles (GMC).
You're right -- good catch! And one more distinguishing characteristic (!) -- The Flxibles have a slightly inset back window with flat glass; the fishbowls have wraparound 3-pane back windows that are larger. Another easy way to tell them apart is headlight position (Flxis are wider, lower; GMCs are closer together) and headlight bezel shape (Flxis are vertically/horizontally symmetrical; GMCs are only vertically symmetrical and have a slight teardrop shape to them)-- but for all of that, we could just look at the front and see if it says "GMC" or not!
Chris
Thanks for the help. I just got some photos back (the others aren't ready yet) and among those just returned we have some WMATA Orions, Flxibles, Ride On Gilligs, a few trains, a PIMS that isn't in testing, pics of Fort Totten Station, and 2 New Looks, an RTS, and 2 Fishbowls. While I may upload the photos gradually, the official update will occur when I change the HTML.
just the new subway schedules
Steve
Just noticed that all the buses are being held at the Fort Totten Service Lot. Maybe I'll head out there with my camera this weekend on a pilgrimage and pay my last respects...
Chris
Where exactly is the Fort TOtten Service Lot and how long do I have to get pictures before they go?
We now have 4175 in QV from KB. Saw it on the Q83 this afternoon with an ad for Montefiore Hospital on the side. In Casey Stengel, is another new addition, bus 4191. This is another one of the TA's seat conversion specials so look for it on the X51, Q26 and Q74 lines, which is where soft seaters at CS tend to show up.
Meanwhile, new deliveries continue to pour in with New Flyer C40LF's 939, 954, 958, 963, 964, 972, 977, 980 and 981 making their JG debuts. New artics in service this week are 5451-5454.
Mark
I thought 4191 had been scrapped. I thought I read it was on a truck out of town or something. I do recall it being listed as stored on one of the rosters on the internet. Well, it's great to see you guys in NYC know the difference between stored and retired, Metro doesn't seem to.
All dead buses are placed in service at QV or JA before being scrapped. We're just lucky that way...
We've even got buses that should have been scrapped twice (7000s). Once, when their lives as MaBSTOA 2600s expired, and one week after issuance from CMF when they were reborn as "new" buses.
Here's a hint: If it's on a truck, it's on it's way to QV or JA..
:-)
Well said QV operator. I agree with you 100%. They should just make QV & Jam the official scrap yards for NYC since that's where all the garbage winds up anyway. TA's motto should be: "A BUS'S CAREER IS NOT OVER, UNTIL IT HAS SERVED S.E.QUEENS". BIG AL
According to the union at Ulmer Park, the MCI's which were supposed to arrive first will now be sent to Staten Island and ours will not arrive till January 2001. This is, according to them, because of the new Staten Island routes that will be starting soon. Supposedly, UP is slated to get the 3 Vikings as well.
Bus 2080 has been sitting in the garage all week, however today, it was washed -- maybe for a trip home. No training schedule has been announced either.
Can anyone comfirm if this is accurate.
Shaun
It was probably washed for a trip to the Bus Festival.
2080 did return to Yukon.....I rode it today on the X19.
Peace,
Kevin Barsky
transitworld.org
4149: Saw her in front of 130 Livingston. It is a Mobile Command Ctr bus.
7512: Saw her on Flatlands Ave. It look it came from ENY and heading back to UP. It had a paint job and there were no depot logos on the bus........
B46#9419Mike Limited
old business... we still have no idea of what service changes to make as well as no idea of where we can get extra equipment
new business... the following plans are being discussed strictly for the benefit of railfans... from week to week, we will change terminals, route designations, and amount of service to be provided solely to drive railfans crazy...
last weeks plan to run the "v" as a rush hour train on prime numbered days has been reworked to run the "v" as a non rush hour train to be run only on those days of the month that are divisible by 3 ( please consult a math textbook to determine the divisibility rules for "3" )... in place of the rush hour "v" service, we now propose to take those "t" trains leaving chambers street on the 8's and turn them either at myrtle ave or broadway junction depending on the flip of a coin...
now we have to discuss a plan to close several stations on the brighton line for random periods of time for the no apparent reason... customers who normally use these stations will be provided with a shuttle bus to take them to the nearest stop on the "f" line so as to ensure overcrowding and general confusion on that line...
we are still debating whether to make the new r-143 cars a uniform 60ft, 67 foot, or 75 foot... a new proposal made by the committee for innovative ideas is to have each car in the new order built to a random length...
Is this like, a joke or something?
You're hired! ;-)
[... being discussed strictly for the benefit of railfans... ]
Will you please get your BOARDs streight ... this is BUStalk !
Mr t__:^)
Thurston
Of course the rail planners would be only overheard by the bus people.
If you need rail info you need to see the bus planners.
HPS is beginning to infect the whole site :0)
I our friend heypaul had been realy good he would have edited the his text, that he also posted on SUBtalk, & made the BusTalkers think he wrote it just for them.
Mr t
Thank you ,,I also need directions,,
Steve
Let me know if you want me to post the NEW readings
Steve
35 and the 77 are now one route --the 77
77 White Plains to Carmel Bowl
Deviation to FDR State Park ,,former 35
27 Skyline to White Plains
Deviation to 500 Executive Blvd Loop
Route Numbers
1 242 st Subway
1W
1C
1T
1X
2 242 st Subway
3Express 242 st Subway
4 Bedford Av Bronx
4C 5 Av,,,5Av/Wall St,,,Wall St
4D 5 Av
5
6
6U
7
8 Mt St Vincents
10
11
12
12x
13
13B
14
15
15x
16
17
18
19
19G
20 Bedford Park
20X
21X Bedford Park
24
25 238 St Subway
26 238 St Subway
27
30
32
36
38
39
40 241 st subway
41 241 st subway
42 233 st subway
45 Pelham Bay Park
45Q
52 Secor housing
53
54
55 Dyre Av Subway
60 Fordham
61 Fordham
62 Fordham
63
63C
63G
64
65
66
72
75
76
77
78
84
84X
90 Fordham
91
92
93 Coop City or Coop City/Pelham Bay
94
95
96
99
400
401
402
403
404
405
450
451
452
453
454
458
459
460
461
462
463
464
465
466
467
469
490
491
Loop A
Loop B
Loop C
Loop D
Loop E
Loop F
Loop G
Loop H
Loop I
Loop J
Let me know which readings or route descriptions you need,
Steve
What are the 400-series routes?
Where do Loops I and J go, and from which railroad stations?
These are proposed routes--the Loops
the 400 series routes are the school routes
NOT IN SERVICE
COUNTY
AIPORT
BEDFORD PARK
SUBWAY STATION
PELHAM BAY STA
COUNTY CENTER
THE BEE - Line
DRIVER TRAINING
FORDHAM
GLEN ISLAND PK
KENSICO DAM
SPECIAL
MOUNT VERNON
NEW ROCHELLE
WESTCHESTE
COUNTY
YONKERS
PLAYLAND PARK
RYE BEACH
WESTCHESTER
COMM COLLEGE
WHITE PLAINS
YONKERS RACEWAY
NYC SUBWAYS
TIBBETTS BROOK PK
The BEE -LINE
THE WAY TO GO
PLATINUM MILE
SHUTTLE
Some questions might be answered here
95 White Plains
95 Port Chester
95 Greenwich
99 Fishkill
99 Poughkeepsie
400 Sargent Pl.& Columbus Av
401 Mt Vernon HS
401 Sanford Blvd via 11 Av
402 Mt Vernon HS
403 Kinsbridge
403 Mt Veron HS
404 Mt Vernon HS
405 Mt Vernon HS
405 Kingsbridge via Fleetwood
406 Mt Vernon HS
450 New Rochelle HS
450 Pelham R
451 new Rochellle HS
452 Sycamore Park
453 North Av & Wilmot Rd
453 New Rochelle HS
454 New Rochelle HS
454 Wilmot Rd & Stratton Rd
458 Iona Prep
458 Main & Church
459 Isaac Young
459 Emerson & Man
460 ALbert Leonard
460 Main & North
461 Albert Leonard
461 Webster Av
462 Albert Leonard
462 5 Av & City Park
463 Albert Leonard
463 Forest & Woodlawn
464 Albert Leonard
464 North & WIlmot
465 ALbert Leonard
465 Stratton & Grand Blvd
466 North & WIlmot
467 ALbert Leonard
467 North & Wilmot
469 Ward School
469 Tuilip Lane
490 Stepinac HS
490 Yonkers
491 Maria Regina HS
491 Yonkers
Loop A
The Shuttle
Loop B
the Shuttle
Loop C
the Shuttle
Loop D
the Shuttle
Loop E
the Shuttle
Loop F
The Shuttle
Loop G
the Shuttle
Loop H
the Shuttle
Loop I
the Shuttle
Loop J
the Shuttle
New Route
78 Stew Leonards
78 Getty Square
Emergency
Call Police
Expresss
Local
Tibbertts Brook Pk
Special
Bee-Line System
the Way to GO
Discount Tuesday
Glen Island
Fare -Free
Fare-Free
Happy New Year
Readers Digest
Hommock s School
Gorton H S
Iona Prep
ALbert Leonard
Maria Regina HS
Mt Vernon HS
Lincoln HS
Roosevelt H S
Sacred Heart HS
Saunders Trade
Stepinac H S
Ward School
White Plains HS
Limited Stops
Welcome Aboard
Skyline Drive
Caramoor
Playland
The Shuttle
Via Bradhurst
County Fair
Connecticut Expansion routes
13B Stamford
via Portchester
19 Somers===extension???
84X White Plains
84X Fishkill
M4: That extreme uppermost stretch from the entrance to Fort Tryon Park to the Cloisters themselves. Margaret Corbin Drive is narrow, hilly and extremely wooded, not characteristic of Manhattan. Love the loop around the Cloisters with the stone-arch bridge.
M5: Long stretch of Riverside Drive with lots of curves, little traffic, great views of Jersey, and terrific bridge over 125th Street valley.
M60: Triboro Bridge, of course- especially Manhattan-bound, around winding ramps of Randall's Island bulb interchange. Also, fun trip through LaGuardia's intricate and outdated (1946) system of feeder roads, ramps and PA-maintained roadways. Bus you're on dwarfs surrounding taxis, giving you feeling of power. Manhattan-bound you ride parallel and north of Grand Central between 94th and 82nd Streets right smack dab next to planes idling on tarmac.
M66/72/79/86/96: The transverses through Central Park are among the only places in Manhattan where it's possible to go over 20MPH. That they're depressed in a trench only enhances the feeling that you've suddenly left the city. Nothing but trees and those charming stone-arch underpasses. Somehow, it doesn't seem as much fun on the Artics.
BX1: The extremely narrow, hilly Fort Independence Street and Heath Avenue make this a lot of fun on an Artic. It feels more like San Francisco, especially with the preponderance of attached row houses. It's amazing the Artics can make some of those tight turns in the Bailey-W230 area.
BX8: Runs along Eastchester Bay for a long stretch that debunks all Bronx stereotypes: quiet streets, boatyards, single-family houses, great views of City Island and Great Neck(!) Added bonus is the loop into Edgewater Park, a private co-operative community that is politically part of the Bronx, but bears no characteristics of New York City whatsoever in its light poles and street signs. You could be in a small town in the Midwest.
BX10: Norwood-bound makes great downhill breakneck run along Johnson Avenue, which runs along the side of a cliff from Kappock Street down to West 230th. Great views of Marble Hill, Kingsbridge and Fordham. Whitestone and Throgs Neck Bridge visible on very clear days.
BX12: It has to negotiate several interchange ramps, including a tight cloverleaf from the Bruckner onto the Pelham. This is very entertaining on an Artic! After the Fordham-bound bus does this, it fairly flies down the brief stretch of the Pelham that resembles a limited-access parkway (and was intended as such) across the Hutch and Amtrak into Stillwell.
BX14: Runs on some incredibly narrow, curving residential streets in the little-known Spencer Estates, a neighborhood bearing more of a resemblance to Nassau's South Shore than the Bronx. Even the street names are offbeat: Radio, Rawlings, Ampere, Library, Research. Nary an apartment building in sight; this is not your grandmother's Bronx!
BX16: Nice fast run on Jerome Avenue (WITHOUT an el over it!) between Van Cortlandt Park and Woodlawn Cemetery. Then, there's the majestic Nereid Avenue bridge over the Bronx River and its namesake parkway, as well as the Metro North tracks. The Ropes branch crosses the imposing Boston Road bridge over the Hutchinson River- that's the one you see from the Thruway right after Co-op City.
BX26: Amusing jaunt through Bronx Park and Botanical Garden along what the maps call Kazimiroff Boulevard but everyone thinks of as Mosholu Parkway continuing east into Allerton. There's a funny hump bridge over Metro North and a surprisingly tranquil, wooded Bronx River crossing.
BX29: For sheer velocity, this tour of the roads to City Island can't be beat. If unencumbered by weekend traffic, and surrounded by undeveloped parkland, it's easy to hit 50. Bonus is TWO drawbridges and great waterfront views of Throgs Neck, Queens and the bridges that go to it. City Island, while getting more deveoped, still looks as small-town/New England charming as you may have heard.
B8: Good, fast straight stretch along 7th and Cropsey Avenues through Dyker Park. You also get a tour of Fort Hamilton, which you can't just walk or drive onto, it being an active military installation.
B13: The curving, hilly Cypress Hills Street reminds me of the Hollywood Hills for some reason. It could be the dramatic descent from the Interboro down to Jamaica Avenue, and the view of East New York, Jamaica Bay and JFK that would do that. Limited intersections and being surrounded by cemeteries allow for good speed down the glacier.
B15: Good speed along Conduit system, then grand tour of JFK. Approach roads go directly under runways, some with taxiing planes on them. It's fun to ride through an airport when you don't have to park or catch a flight.
B39: The Willy B- need I say more? Can get very intimate with 'J' and 'M' trains running immediately alongside.
B41: Nearly a mile stretch of Flatbush Avenue between Grand Army Plaza and Empire Boulevard is surrounded by Prospect Park and Botanical Gardens, allowing for good speed. It's a gas weaving through the absurd merging patterns of the Plaza itself- as long as you don't have to drive.
B51: Manhattan Bridge. Slow Manhattan-bound traffic can detract from enjoyment, but since you ride on upper roadway, there are great views unobstructed by passing subway trains.
B67: A great, extremely long downhill along McDonald Avenue (no el overhead!) from 20th Street down to Fort Hamilton Parkway. Greenwood Cemetery is on one side, so no cross traffic for long distance. Buses labor mightily and noisily uphill towards downtown.
I'll have to get to Queens, my borough of birth and lifelong residence, another time.
I can give you 2 good examples for Queens routes,The 76(from GCP to HHE)agood straight run thru Cunningham Pk down FLB and the 21 and 53 thru Broad Channel.Oh yea the 54 on two seperates spots on Metro-the strect between 80th st and Cooper ave and the stretch after the Interboro Pkwy (cuse me J.Robinson Pkwy) in to Park Ln S.And the 37 from after Mrytle ave to Park Ln and Union Tpke
I can give you 2 good examples for Queens routes,The 76(from GCP to HHE)agood straight run thru Cunningham Pk down FLB and the 21 and 53 thru Broad Channel.Oh yea the 54 on two seperates spots on Metro-the strect between 80th st and Cooper ave and the stretch after the Interboro Pkwy (cuse me J.Robinson Pkwy) in to Park Ln S.And the 37 from after Mrytle ave to Park Ln and Union Tpke>Guess that 4 actullay
You know I've got to "rep" for the Q-boro!! Sorry Howard for stealing your thunder.
Q3 (JAM): After passing through several "festive" neigborhoods along Farmers Blvd., the Q3 finally makes it into JFK airport, where immediately it goes on a nice speed strecth along North Boundary Road--provided that no one rings the bell. Then after winding through the cargo area, it winds up on the JFK Expressway, and the circuitous ramps which lead to the airport roadway! Due to airport re-construction, the routing within JFK is quite interesting to say the least.
Q5 (JAM): Since Merrick Blvd. reminds one of the moon's surface, not too much speed is generated here. It isn't until Nassau County and Sunrise Highway where good speed can be achieved.
Q10 (Green): Nice residential views in Kew Gardens, followed by a long yet slow run along Lefferts Blvd. The Conduit branch of the Q10 is highlighted by its run along Conduit Blvd, and the Van Wyck Expressway and into JFK Airport. See Q3 for notes once inside JFK.
Q13 (CS): Its terminus at Fort Totten is worth the trip. Great views of the Throgs Neck Bridge, Long Island Sound, and the Bronx can be had here.
Q14/15 (CS): These two routes operate for the most part along residential streets in Whitestone and N. Flushing. While not very fast, it is quite scenic and peaceful.
Q16 (CS): See Q13
Q17 (JAM): Great line! The uphill climb on 188th Street just north of Hillside is a treat as well as the Fresh Meadows traffic circles. Once on Horace Harding Expressway, one can expect good speed as the bus whizzes past traffic on the LIE. Another nice but short stretch is on Kissena Blvd. between Booth Memorial Avenue and Rose Avenue as the 17 passes through Kissena Park.
Q30 (QV): Like the Q17, there is a great uphill climb along Homelawn Street just north of Hillside Avenue (ever wonder how Hillside Avenue go its name just check the streets that run north of it). Great stretches along Horace Harding include: FLB to Oceania Street, where it passes over the Clearview, and the section along W. Alley Raod where we pass the Cross Island Parkway. Another great line.
Q32 (CS/HUD): Slow as molasses so don't look for ANY speed here. Great views of Manhattan are slightly obstructed since it travels along the lower level. Of course, there is never a dull moment along 5th Avenue.
Q35 (Green): GBL's Q35 is as fast as the Q32 is slow. Perhaps it is the fastest of ALL the Queens lines. Great speed can be had anywhere along Flatbush Avenue, especially between Avenue U and the Marine Parkway Bridge. Once in Queens, the speed dowsn't stop as the Q35, whips along the winding ramps to Jacob Riis Park. Along Neponsit Avenue, there are views of some of Rock Park's nicer homes.
Q44 (CS): If I have to explain here, then you aren't a bus fan!
Q46LTD (QV): The Q46 Limited, the city's second Limited route behind the M15, borders on an express route. Once past Utopia Parkway the next eastbound stop is Springfield Blvd! A fast section is the very wooded area (Cunningham Park)along Union Tpke between FLB and Hollis Hills Terrace. Another good section is through Creedmoor State Hospital (where I think I should be for writing this post). Speaking of hospitals the terminus at LI Jewish Hospital is also worth the trip.
Q53 (Triboro): Interesting animal is the Q53. It starts out in its territory in Woodside and takes you on a journey that culminates with two bridge crossings and a run through Jamaica Bay Wildlife Refuge. It ends in the last place you'd expect to find a TCC bus--Rock Park! Great bus buff line.
Q54 (FP): A long and slow ride is broken up by a couple of 'ok' stretches along Metropolitan Avenue. Good views of Manhattan at Washington Plaza Terminal.
Q58 (FP): Another slow line, but has great views of the fairgrounds at Flushing Meadow.
Q60 (Green): See Q44.
Q65 (Queens Surface): Great hill climb on 164th Street north of Hillside, and good speed along College Point Blvd. between Northern Blvd and 27th Avenue, highlight this line.
Q76 (CS): After the obligatory Hillside hill climb on Francis Lewis, nice views of Cunningham Park can be had between GCP and the LIE.
Q84 (JAM): If the bus survives the potholes and divits on Merrick Blvd, a peaceful reward awaits along a long, leisurely stretch on 120th Avenue. Nice homes and quiet neighborhood and yes decent speed here. Then its onto a narrow, residential 238th Street and its unassuming terminus at 130th Avenue. Good line.
Q85 (JAM): This long winding route is highlighted by its stretch along Conduit Blvd and Sunrise Highway where good speeds are achieved. Along with the Q5 this bus serves Green Acres Shopping Mall, so you can go get your "shop on"!
Q88 (QV): Here is a line that combines features from many other Queens lines. Nice hill climb on Springfield Blvd. (Q27), nice run through Cunningham Park, this time on 73rd Avenue. There are the two 188th Street traffic circles (Q17), good runs along the HHE (Q17 and Q30), great views of the Worlds Fair Grounds (Q58), and Queesn Center Mall (Q60). Excellent line!!
Q102 (Queens Surface): The ride on Roosevelt Island is a MUST for any bus fan. Peacful and very scenic tour of the island is treat!
Q1113 (Jamaica): The Q1113 (as it is offically known) is really the Q111/113 and it starts off as a typical Queens route--at a subway station. Then it meanders along Brewer Blvd and 147th Avenue. The Q111 continues along 147th to FLB where it terminates at 148th Avenue. For the Q113 the fun starts after it makes the right turn onto Brookville Blvd (known as "Snake Road" by the locals) and navigates the curves to Rockaway Blvd--good speed here and if you're lucky good views of landing planes at JFK. Once on Rockaway Blvd the 113 crosses into Nassau County, and passes through a series of side streets before re-entering Queens and Far Rockaway. Scenic views along Seagirt Blvd. highlight the stretch to its terminus at B.22 Street. Excellent line.
Well there you have it. Queens in a nutshell, and it took a nut to write it!
Q46 LIMITED'S next stop after Utopia Pkwy is 188 St then Springfield Blvd. I ride this bus toi and froms chool everyday.
Q46#3953Gary
You're right Gary. I forgot 188th. However 188 to Springfield is still a great run.
Especially for a driver who doesn't work those lines on a daily basis, I would think that the routing thru JFK airport is quite confusing and difficult to remember. I rode the Q10 a few times (nice fast trip from the airport to the subway), and the Q3 once (took FOREVER to get to Jamaica after it left JFK territory), and I was completely confused as a rider to its' routing. If I were a driver, even after several "break-in" trips, once I would be out on my own, I would still be afraid I would get lost in there with a load of passengers screaming at me!
[...the routing through JFK Ariport is quite confusing....]
With a "detour-of-the-week" approach to construction, how could it NOT be confusing?! However, I've noticed that, no matter how the roadways are opened, closed, or moved around, the Q3, Q10, B15, and N91 seem to serve all of the Central Terminal Area buildings in strict numerical order - starting with #5 (of course).
So, if you need to be at International Arrivals (Terminal #4), you'd be best served to get off at Terminal #5 and walk instead of visiting #6, #7, #8, #9, #1, #2, and #3 first. Conversely, if your plane lands at Terminal #5, walk over to #4 to avoid sitting through the whole loop AND the layover.
Great post Mark. However, I'm suprised you did not mention the Q4. If you can deal with all the potholes, traffic, double parkers, fires, detours, full loads, drunks, farebeats, school kids, rock throwers, wheelchairs, funerals and nuts from the VA hospital, then you should be able to enjoy the 1/4 mile residential stretch this great bus line does from Marne st. to 179th st. & Linden blvd. BIG AL
How could I forget the great long stretch of 164th Street between the LIE and 46th Avenue? TWO cemeteries and a very long and bucolic uninterrupted downhill through Kissena Park. I always thoight 164th Street should be a named Boulevard or Parkway.
And it ALMOST makes money, so it one of OUR favorite routes too.
Mr t__:^)
[Q102 (Queens Surface): The ride on Roosevelt Island is a MUST for any bus fan. Peacful and very scenic tour of the island is treat!]
Thanks for the kind words, the 101 is a "peacful" ride too because the guy/gail sitting next to you may be carring a gun.
Mr t__:^)
Great job Howard. I look forward to reading your reviews of Queens and Staten Island bus routes. As a lifelong Bronxite I would also like to thank you for debunking the stereotype that the Bronx is one big wasteland.
Ah, Queens- borough of my birth and residence since:
Q11(Green): After it leaves the divided boulevards, it takes some charmingly narrow residential streets through Ozone Park into Howard Beach. The branch to Hamilton Beach runs along 102nd Street directly next to the IND ground-level trackage between the Howard Beach-JFK station and the first bridge over the bay. This involves going over a newly-widened bridge over a tributary from the bay, then passing dead-end 163rd Drive, 164th Avenue, 164th Road, 1st Street- 1ST STREET?! Great JFK action, too.
Q15: A minor distinction, but travels on some very quiet, tree-lined side streets in Whitesone devoid of commercial development or traffic; just large one-family houses. A strange place for any bus, especially a huge, boxy Orion. Ironically, all this tranquility ends in a huge high-rise co-op complex under the Throgs Neck Bridge approach.
Q21(Green): Nothing beats the Cross Bay speedway- two uninterrupted miles of wilderness from Addabbo Bridge to the nature preserve. Even the 1983 GMCs Green Buses still uses must get up to 45. The unnecessarily tolled Cross Bay Bridge gives great views- all the way to the skyline and Verrazano.
Q25(Queens Surface): Some nice College Point side streets that look too narrow for SUVs, let alone Orions. Ends at very scenic park on East River.
Q30: Little Neck-bound, the LIE service road takes a sharp curve away from and back to the mainline to accomodate the many ramps to the LIE-Clearview interchange. With ramps on your left and parkland on your right for a good half mile, you swear the bus is getting on the Expressway. Further east, there's a huge downhill from East Hampton Boulevard to Douglaston Parkway with a stone bridge over the Cross Island halfway down.
Q35(Green): Lower Flatbush speedway from mall down to Hodges Bridge a treat. Bridge itself amusing for unusually long steel grating. Fun continues on lengthy parkwaylike roads through Riis Park, including stone arched overpass reflecting an unfilled Moses legacy.
Q38(Triboro): On 'north' leg, Eliot Avenue narrows to pass through cemetery on top of high ridge with great skyline views. On 'south leg', many twists and turns through narrow Middle Village streets tempt you to ask driver if he's lost.
Q39(Triboro): Travels along Laurel Hill Boulevard directly UNDER BQE and through a cemetery from 48th to 58th. Strange feeling of isolation and congestion simultaneously.
Q43: Fast stretch of Hillside Avenue between Winchester and Cross Island past Creedmoor grounds. Until about 1975, there were rails from an old LIRR service spur embedded in pavement, making for a nice jolt.
Q44: Obviously the Whitestone, but the Bronx-bound approach to it is nifty as well: down a very narrow entrance ramp from 14th Avenue and over the top of three-level stack interchange that must have been quite revolutionary in 1939.
Q46: Nice isolated Turnpike through a wooded Cunningham (FLB to Clearview) and Creedmoor (Winchester to CIP). The branch to 260th takes some funny turns through the large Glen Oaks garden co-op. At the Kew Gardens end, the outbound run starts with a huge downhill from Queens Boulevard, dips under the Van Wyck and begins an equally impressive ascent. Inbound, the bus threads under the VW and over the GCP very adroitly.
Q48: Fun Orion ride through LaGuardia. Also the unique Roosevelt Avenue bridge which crosses the Van Wyck crossing the Flushing River, all while following under the Flushing el. Without Shea traffic, it's very fast from 126th to the portal at College Point Boulevard. Resurfacing the deck takes away some of the fun that was generated by cobblestones AND steel deck.
Q55: A very slow, frustrating ride through Ridgewood and Glendale business/double-parking districts suddenly enlivened by long, straight dash through aptly-named Forest Park.
Q58/88: Uses LIE service road through elaborate interchanges with GCP and VWE. Here the service road feels like the expressway itself, especially westbound from College Point Boulevard when it seems to blend in with the many ramps.
Q66(Queens Surface): Flushing-bound from 114th Street, Northern Boulevard temporarily becomes part of the infamous Shea Stadium interchange until you duck down between the elevated ramps to 126th. The high bridge over Flushing River gets your adrenalin going.
Q76: Three very long stretches of Francis Lewis Boulevard from LIE to GCP almost entirely surrounded by parkland, some very wooded. Also very long uphill from Hillside tests engine's decibel level.
Q85: Jamaica-bound after Brookville Boulevard, very complex separation of North Conduit Avenue from Sunrise Highway mainline while crossing Belt Parkway which curves up next to you on left while LIRR is at eye level on right. Wondefully cluttered and confusing.
Q102(Queens Surface): Roosevelt Island Bridge has nice long grating, then extremely amusing curlique ramp that crosses under itself. The Island always evokes one of those model railroad villages, with its pastel buildings and very narrow Main Street. Orion towers above private RIOC red buses. Some funny semi-secluded curved roads to tram and hospitals at either end. It's hard to believe a few feet of water separate you from Manhattan.
Q113(Jamaica): That Brookville Boulevard stretch through the swamps always feels like a strange place for a bus. At least they paved it-
S51: Great dramatic downhill along Lily Pond from Verrazano down to beach. Father Cap is pretty isolated as it follows the boardwalk, with mostly vacant lots and a few shacks opposite. The shadow of the bridge is always with us. Some rush hour trips detour through Fort Wadsworth, something private cars can't do.
S53/79: Verrazano- what else can I say?? The 53 has the added bonus of traveling the expressway service road between Richmond and Clove Road in the shadow of Grymes Hill. Seeing those houses perched all the way up there is another 'Hollywood Hills' moment.
S54/57: Some of the most rural stretches left on the Island along Breille and Rockland Avenues through the Greenbelt. You even pass a Scout camp!
S60: Incredible curves and hills! This is what you look up at from the aforementioned S53 along SIE. Bridge and skyline views galore.
S74: Arthur Kill Road turns very rural west of the West Shore Expressway overpass. Very good opportunities for speed. Stark reminders of your proximity to New Jersey turn up in form of oil refineries and Outerbridge Crossing over your head. The only city bus route I know that takes a detour loop into a jail.
S78: Hylan Boulevard west of Richmond Avenue is more like a state route in Rockland or Somerset County. Up to a heavily wooded mile between intersections in places. Very scenic bridge over Lemon Creek from which you can see all the way across Raritan Bay to Jersey Highlands.
Surprisingly, Nassau doesn't seem to have too many speedy stretches, probably because the rural northeastern area (the Brookvilles, Syosset, Oyster Bay) has little or no LI BUS service to speak of. Most of the routes are in the heavily developed middle and south shore of the county where a bus can't go less than a minute without passing several strip malls. STILL,
N15: Long Beach Bridge nice greeting to city for which its named. All around you are marinas, the LIRR trestle, and on a clear day, the skyline.
N20: From Roslyn to Jericho, Routes 25A and 107 can still allow speed providing classes aren't changing at the many colleges passed. It's funny when the bus detours through the very narrow driveways of C.W. Post and the hilly approaches to SUNY Old Westbury.
N21: Good stretch along Manhasset Bay from Roslyn to Sea Cliff also a study in contrasts. Exclusive estates in Roslyn Harbor and Glenwood Landing suddenly give way to hulking LILCO sewage treatment plant, then a nice peaceful stretch of beach.
N33: Atlantic Beach Bridge short but scenic, with trumpet interchange at Lawrence end a sign of what was supposed to have been the Nassau Expressway. The trip through Atlantic Beach feels more like a small Flordia coastal town, especially with all the private beach clubs.
Phew! Time to hit the sack!
I like alot of the bus routes in Staten Island. The S74,S78, and S79 are some of my favorites. And the Orions do great speed, especially over the VZ bridge and on Hylan Blvd south of Eltingville.
The S74 is by far the most rural bus route I've been on. It reminds me of some areas around Greenport, especially around the Arthur Kill bridge. Must be something to travel on that road in a storm.
NE Queens has some nice routes too, the Q13,Q25,Q76 just to name a few.
The Orion CNG's used on the QS routes such as the 25 and 66 get some great speed when the opportunity arrises.
LI Bus don't have too many great routes, there's usually alot of stops as bus routes remain in commercial areas, as there isn't any routes in
mainly rural and residential northeast Nassau. The N20/21 (my home route) is pretty slow and boring west of Roslyn. However, one gets treated to a great view on the N21 in Sea Cliff along Shore road. Also if there are no stops it goes pretty fast as well.
The N72 to Babylon is nice and fast along 109, and the N15 is a nice ride through Island Park and across the bridge.
Also the N19 provides a long interesting trip along 27a(Merrick rd) from Freeport to Babylon. The N79 is also a pretty nice route east of Hicksville, goes through nice residential areas in Plainview and then down Jericho Turnpike (where they usually get to go fast) winding up at Walt Whitman mall which is a very nice mall, there just aint anywhere to eat!
[LI Bus don't have too many great routes, there's usually alot of stops as bus routes remain in commercial areas, as there isn't any routes in mainly rural and residential northeast Nassau.]
In the pre-MSBA days, many of the routes that served Jamaica (N-1, N-4, N-6, N-22 and N-24) used to pick up great speed on the main thoroughfares between Jamaica and the NY City/Nassau County line. I suspect the ride today is not as fast because the streets are not in as good a shape as they were then and more passengers get on and off in NY City (other than in Jamaica itself) to and from Nassau County. Those Bee Line old-looks on the N-4 and N-6 could really travel!
What??? No Q53??? I'll chalk up the omission to fatigue.
Oh yeah??? Well here's my list:
Q22A: Has anyone on bustalk ever ridden this bus? It makes one trip each way per weekday probably for a bunch of screaming school kids. If you have ridden this line, I have one question. What were you thinking?
Q101R: Gotta check up on daddy doin' 3 to 6? Just take this line chock full of people who sip tea with crumpets and Wall Street Journal readers.
B15: A message to Rich from the TV show "Survivor". Ride this line and let me know which of the following was tougher;
A. 39 days on a deserted island
B. 39 minutes waiting for the next bus to the airport on New Lots Avenue. Warning: Don't be surprised if one of the local rats comes up to you screaming "YOU BASTARD! YOU ATE MY COUSIN OTTO!!!"
M16/34: I know people who have had to shake off cobwebs after crossing town on this four wheeled snail.
Q69: Gotta love any public bus line that's FREE to ride! (By the way, free is my favorite four letter word that starts with F. What's yours?)
M15 Limited: Now I have a question. Is that limited as in how many stops that it makes or limited as in your patience after waiting 25 minutes for one of these suckers to show up.
947: The amount of bus buffs who actually know what the route numbers in Staten Island stand for(S40 series means it serves the North Shore, S50 series:it crosses the island north to south, S60 series:serves Victory Blvd., S70 series:serves south shore, S90 series:limited stop service).
zero: The amount of regular people who know the same thing. What brainiac came up with this renumbering keerap.
Here are a few rides that I like getting a kick out of in Queens that I've rode on b4 MTA Only!:
Q12: Great open stretch from 223 St to Douglaston Pkwy.
Q13: Northern Blvd is open but a long stretch from 35 Ave-26 Ave on Bell Blvd could be a treat-depends on people and how fast your driver can floor it.
Q16: 29 Ave is a scenic ride through the historical district of Flu-shing.
Q17: Two words: School KIDS! From Queens College-Francis Lewis HS, this ride can be a treat however especially riding along Kissena Blvd, LIE, and the 188 St circle. From Flu-shing to Jamaica the 2 busiest districts in Queens- What could I say?
Q20A/Q20B/Q44 Q20A/Q20B can be slow cause they're local but the Q44 does the trick.
Q27: Open ride on SpringField from Jamaica Ave-Hillside. Then passes 2 schools I forget the public school name there and QCC rrggghhhh mad packed. Trip down 47 Ave can be a fast 1 but Kissena Blvd slows it down.
Q26: A shuttle of the Q27. Only for Francis Prep kids basically, this line only operates on weekdays. If you hate crowds, you'll love this route. From Auburndale-Flu-shing in 10 minutes. This is my preferable route.
Q28: Crocheron Ave is scenic, but the zigzagging in Bayside can be a drag.
Q30: Nice Open stretch along the LIE from Little Neck-Utopia but cxan be annoying especailly if cars are "parked" if you get my drift.
Passes along SJU. But Jamaica holds this buis back.
Q31: Almost the same as the Q30 but goes up Utopia. Nice open stretch from LIE-47 Ave. It'll be confusing now that RTS could possibly run on the Q27-LOL! Traffic up Bell can be a pain.
Q32: What could I say? All depending on the Q'Boro Br and if there's a gridlock alert day if this bus picks up any speed or not. A decent alternate for the rumbling redbirds overhead on Roosevelt. At least you can get on either an Orion or RTS-LOL!
Q36: Jamaica Ave/Jericho Tpke may be a decent ride for some.
Q43 and up will come in Part 2 either later on today or tomorrow. To be continued.
R36Gary-The Master of the Queens Borough
Some of my favorite bus rides:
Westchester County:
#14: The most long-and-winding route from Peekskill to White Plains that anybody ever though up. Nice views along parts of the segment north of Ossining.
#40/41: From noisy and congested Mount Vernon to noisy and congested White Plains, by way of serene and refined Scarsdale. A true study in contrasts.
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Transport of Rockland:
TZX (Tappan Zee Express) 1 thru 5: The bridge itself, at one point seemingly inches above the water.
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Los Angeles County MTA (when not on strike!!):
#2: Sunset Blvd. If you have the patience, take a two-hour tour along the full length of Sunset Blvd. From downtown, see the famous "strip," then Beverly Hills, then loop around UCLA and past the Getty Museum, and then wander into the hills and end up with sand in your shoes at the Pacific Coast Highay.
#218: Cedars Sinai to Studio City via Laurel Canyon Blvd. This contract line (operated by Transportation Concepts, Inc.) uses minibuses due to the steep grades and sharp curves in the Laurel Canyon. Very pretty ride.
#434: Great scenery along the Pacific Coast Highway between Malibu and Santa Monica. A sufficiently friendly driver will even play tour guide and point out the various celebrities' homes. It's their senior pick at the Venice garage - one of my drivers was the "low" man on the line with ONLY 26 years!
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Riverside Transit Agency:
#149: Riverside to Mall of Orange (formerly to Disneyland). Not so much the ride itself, but the use of the tractor-trailer SuperBuses lends an interesting feel.
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Orange County Transportation Authority:
#1: Long Beach to Capistrano Beach via Pacific Coast Highway. I'm a sucker for those ocean views, and this line has about 20 miles of them. OCTA imposes a limit of six surfboards per bus, which means that some would-be riders get left behind!
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Montery-Salinas Transit:
#4/#5/#24: Monterey to Carmel. Each of these routes serves a different part of the town of Carmel, which at some point may even acquire sidewalks. Route #24 continues several (rural) miles east to Carmel Rancho. (Yes, Carmel is the town that elected Clint Eastwood as its mayor.)
#20: Monterey to Salinas. Leaves Monterey to serve several nearby cities along Monterey Bay, then cuts inland through a dozen or so farms before re-entering civilization in Salinas.
#28/#29: Salinas to Watsonville. From Salinas, these lines hit a regional mall and then divide to serve differing rural areas before rejoining in Watsonville in neighboring Santa Cruz County. They're interlined, with each bus going north on one route and south on the other, in order to offer a branch-to-branch ride on a single bus.
A note on routes #20, #28, #29: Many of the farms along these routes were involved in the migrant worker labor movement. Northern Monterey County is where the "Grapes of Wrath" actually grew.
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San Francisco Municipal Railway
Almost every MUNI route has its scenic moments, but I'd like to point out one in particular...
#76: Transbay Terminal to Marin Headlands, Sundays only. This is the "Hikers' Special," making local pick-ups along portions of routes #2, #30, and #49, then venturing into the Presidio, across the Golden Gate Bridge, and winding through the hills to Fort Cronkhite (spelling?). The return offers spectacular views of S.F. Bay and the city skyline; my driver slowed down enough to allow for some VERY nice photos.
With the the Bee-Line runs i always thought the 1 was a nice trip after it gets to US-9(Bdwy)at least up to Yonkers.Some spots you get a good view of the Hudson and the Jersey Palisades.
The following depend on bridge traffic: Like 'em when traffic's light, you figure out the rest.
Be prepared to hear the engine screaming on these, especially on the older buses.
Q44: Toll plaza to 14 Avenue. A shorter version of the QBx1's version below.
QBx1: I especially like the QBx1's run via I678 from the toll plaza to 20th Avenue. Really fast. (depending on traffic, of course)
M60: 2 Avenue to 31st Street.
S53: Toll Plaza to Ft Hamilton & 86 Street, minus the small stretch on 92 Street.
Here are some stretches that don't cross a bridge, and don't run on an interstate.
Q60: 70 Street to Jacoubs Street. FSSR, someone always signals to stop at Jacoubs Street, just outside a "middle of nowhere" part of Queens Boulevard filled with used car dealerships and other car shops.
Q25QC: My unofficial name for Q25 buses that terminate at Jewel Avenue (QC means "Queens College"). Rarely crowded, and no one else seems to want to ride it, unless they're not going further than Jewel Avenue! Much better than the Q25J(amaica)/34 buses that run with it, and the Q17 that parallels it to Horace Harding.
That's all for now.
You guys want a manhattan strech?
Hey, maybe I'm being biased here, but 2 places on the M9 are pretty good. The home stretch on West between Vesey and W. Thames (in the morning rush, though, between Vesey + Liberty gets kinda slow), and the M9 (along with the M15, 103, and B51) going through the BB underpass northbound AND southbound (southbound no B51) can get pretty fast.
You guys want a manhattan stretch?
Hey, maybe I'm being biased here, but 2 places on the M9 are pretty good. The home stretch on West between Vesey and W. Thames (in the morning rush, though, between Vesey + Liberty gets kinda slow), and the M9 (along with the M15, 103, and B51) going through the BB underpass northbound AND southbound (southbound no B51) can get pretty fast.
I'm big on speed - so those fast moving routes are my favorites. So that means many Queens routes are favorites of mine, especially the JAM routes along Merrick Blvd. I also like the Q88. Manhattan routes I don't even bother with because you're lucky if the bus gets past 20 MPH and when it does one of those endless lights and the bus stop every other block will force the bus to stop. In the Bronx the Bx3 (former Bx38) is a long time favorite. I haven ridden many SI express routes, but my favorite express route has always been NYBS' Co-Op City route.
Just to name a few - they're many others.
Wayne
Some of my favorite buses are
Manhattan:
M2Ltd,
M98: The stretch along the Harlem River Drive from 126 St until 178 St on a NovaBus. Those buses must be traveling 60 mph.
M101
Bronx:
Bx1, Bx2: I love the Grand Concourse
Bx12: The scenery along Pelham Parkway, extra treat when it travels to Orchard Beach or City Island (now provided by Bx29)
Bx26, Bx28, Bx30: I love the ride through Co-Op City
Bx36: I like how this bus starts by the G.W. Bridge, then travels through some of the not so nice looking areas of the Bronx, then terminates in a nice area of the Bronx (Pugsly Ave) that would remind you of Queens.
Bx41: speeds along Webster Avenue, very frequent service. Riding under the el along White Plains Road from Gun Hill Road until E. 241 St. is an added treat. It was really nice before they tore down the 3rd Ave. El. Then the Bx41 traveled under an el from just north of Fordham Rd. to 241 St.
Brooklyn
B25, B26, B38, B52: For the most part seeing some of the prettiest brownstones in Bed-Stuy Brooklyn.
B49: This route allows you to see some of the greatest collection of old Victorian style houses in the Midwood section of Brooklyn.
Queens
Q21A: Although this bus no longer operates, it was definately one of my favorites. This bus, operated by Green Bus Lines ran between Mott Ave, Far Rockaway to the New Lots Avenue Subway station in Brooklyn. This bus consisted of several fast stretches, 2 in the Arverne Renewal Urban Area (Rockaway), crossing the Jamaica Bay (where it definately hit 60 mph), and along Linden Blvd in Brooklyn. Service was discontinued circa 1990.
Q35: Also operated by the Green Bus Lines. Its speedy stretch along Flatbush Ave south of Ave. U is worth the trip.
Q53: Operated by Triboro Coach, is the only express bus (other than x32) that does not operate into Manhattan. At one time it was a premium fare express route (though not as premium as the express buses that operated into Manhatan) offering no transfers to any other bus lines. This premium fare was discontinued circa when MetroCard Gold was introduced. Eventhough you can transfer to/from the subway (using MetroCard only) to this route, you still can not transfer to/from other bus routes. Also it exclusively operates express bus equipment (plush seat Orion V-CNGs only). Although during the beach season, with increased service, anything is liable to operate on this route. It starts off as a limited at 61 St-Woodside Subway station. The beginning is painfully slow due to heavy traffic along Roosevelt Ave. and Broadway. After Queens Blvd-63 Drive, it operates (at high speeds) non-stop along Woodhaven-Cross Bay Blvd until Broad Channel, then non-stop to Rockaway where it begins limited stop service. This route, next to the "A" train is the fastest thing out of Rockaway. Anyone who wants to ride express bus equipment, with non-stop service without paying express bus fare (only $1.50), then this bargain is definatley for you.
Q113: Operated by Jamaica Buses Inc. the best part of this route is the very sharp curved portion of Brookville Blvd between Rosedale and Lawrence, L.I.N.Y that drivers just seem to fly around given the chance. During the '70s and '80, if you were riding in the back of a Flexible New Look on this portion, you would get the spanking of your life by this bus. Another thing I like most about this route as well as the other 3 Jamaica Bus routes are the condition of the buses. I feel that Jamaica Buses Inc. maintains their equipment far better than the rest of the private bus carriers serving Queens.
New Jersey
70 (Newark-Livingston Mall): Operated by NJ Transit, the best part of this very long route is the portion between Short Hill Mall and Livingston Mall. With the new NovaBuses operating this line, you literally have to hold on to your seat while operating on this portion of the route. Those drivers have to be hitting at least 65-70 mph. This route is definately a must.
For those of you who want a real treat, I would suggest you ride the Monsey Trails bus between Brooklyn and Rockland County. You will have very diverse scenery both city & country. The bus starts out on 18th Ave. & 49th St. in the Boro Park section and travels down narrow 49th St. to Fort Hamilton Parkway. It then travels alongside Greenwood Cemetery on to Macdonald Ave. to the Prospect Expressway. It then goes via the Gowanus & BQE combination to the Williamsburg section of Brooklyn with its distinctive architecture. It then crosses the Willy B into Manhattan going through the lover east side & up Third Ave into midtown all the way to the 47th St. Diamond District. It then crosses Manhattan to the Lincoln Tunnel into N.J. and goes north on the Jersey TPK to Route 80 to Route 17 north, to the Garden State Parkway to the NY Thruway. During this stretch it has been clocked at speeds up to 80 MPH. After exiting the Thruway at Spring Valley it takes Route 59 into the local streets of Monsey. You pass some very beautiful homes along Maple Ave. & Carlton Road. You also go through the heart of the main shopping area on Route 306. It is what the drivers call the "circle of Monsey". The route finally terminates in the Hasidic village of New Square, a very interesting place indeed. You will think that you journeyed into a different country and a different time zone. All this for $7 is a real bargain. Although the scenery outside the bus is quite interesting, inside is quite a different story. There is an opaque curtain down the center aisle which separates the men from the women. Also one word of caution. Remember to use the rest room somewhere else before embarking on this journey. Although all Monsey Trails buses are lavatory equipped MCIs, they keep the rest room locked on all line runs. They are only opened for charter service.
MIDNITE IN LA AND THE DIVISIONS ARE LOCKED DOWN!!!
BLUE
I am a Union Guy
What are their demands???
>>> What are their demands??? <<<
Take a look at my previous Post on this matter.
The strike was averted for 24 hours when management backed down on its proposal to have some B/Os work ten hour four day weeks with a three hour swing.
The big sticking point at this time is that the MTA wants some way to cut overtime now necessary to cover rush hours, by using part time drivers. The UTU does not want to allow part timers. It seems like some of the union members are living on their O/T and do not want to give it up.
Tom
all of MTAs transit dependent will either have to hitchhike walk or become stranded here !!many will lose thier employment wind up on UI
& welfare because they now have no way to ghet to work !!
all of MTAs transit dependent will either have to hitchhike walk or become stranded here ! many will lose thier employment wind up on UI
& welfare because they now have no way to get to work !!
>>> many will lose thier employment wind up on UI & welfare because they now have no way to get to work !! <<<
Salaam;
I think you underestimate the ingenuity of the poorer working classes. Most of them will find alternative methods to get to work, especially with the buffer of having the strike start on Saturday rather than Monday. The strike will be a hardship on them to be sure, but I doubt that it will swell the wellfare rolls.
The general public is going to come to appreciate the value of public transportation if the strike is still in progress on Monday when they see the normally slow freeways become much slower.
Tom
I tell you what OLD TOM .. how will the transit dependent get around?
Please tell me one way the transit dependent will get around & how what alternatives they will have at thier disposal how they will keep thier employment when they cannot get to work the landlords who evict them because of inability to pay rent!! food clothing shelter etc, & please dont get sick & cant catch the BUS to the doctor - dentist !!
If this strike does not last too long the pain, suffering will come to an end for those who are the lowest paid & hardest working !
( maybe?? ) ...!!!?
correction to old tom....
Some might squeeze out of this mess for a little while ( some ) !!!
however MOST will not have a way to keep thier employment !!!
I'm sorry but I'm unable to make this year's BusFest. :( I hope that I can definitely make the 1 next year. I was wishing that I could meet everyone too. Someday I will. Hope everyone took good pics cause I'll be on the lookout for them on the web.
R36Gary
I had a really good time, it was nice to meet all of the long-term future planning comittee:-) (Trevor, Clark, Mike, Mark) Hehehehe, too bad you couldn't sit in the driver seat this year. That sucks, but overall it was tons of fun. I hope everyone enjoyed it as much as I did!
(heypaul, I saw you drooling at that Mack bus, I was the grey shirt with black stripe across it)
--Clayton Parker--
What time were you guys there? I got there around 12:30. I met only a couple of Bustalkers. Was a great day!
Heh I spent like 12:45-1:30 in the back of 5452 with Trevor, Clark, Mike and Mark. I got there at 11AM.
--Clayton Parker--
I saw Howard there with his honeymooners t-shirt. He was talking with some guy.
It was really fun!!!
Clark Palicka
CEO TrAnSiTiNfO
http://www.transitinfo.cjb.net
BTW. Who all went to Hoboken afterwards???
I went to Hoboken at about 1:30. There were several contemporary NJT Novas outside the terminal, along with a Mack. Everything else I saw at Hoboken really belongs in Subtalk.
Most of the buses at the Fest were also at the Roadeo at South Beach this past June, on the only hot weekend of summer 2000. We were allowed in the buses, but not in the drivers' seats, which we were at the Roadeo, so it's a good thing my son didn't come. He'd have been heartbroken- although to be able to 'drive' the two bus mockups downstairs in the Museum would have been some consolation.
I saw Doug, Heypaul, Sid from N.J., John, B53 Rich and Dennis Linsky, and got to talk shop with numerous drivers. An added bonus was the Flxible from LI Bus, which was loaded with photos of street scenes mostly from the forties and fifties. A rather nervous man dressed as a driver threw Rich, Dennis and me out for taking up valuable picture-browsing space (there were many envelopes loaded with photos for sale) for too long a time.
After two and a half hours passed, I realized Hoboken still beckoned, so I headed over to the 'N' and 'R' for a quick hop to the Trade Center and PATH.
Great to see everyone!
howard... you saw a mack bus at hoboken? you don't mean the old look public service bus?... that was a gm...
[An added bonus was the Flxible from LI Bus, which was loaded with photos of street scenes mostly from the forties and fifties. A rather nervous man dressed as a driver threw Rich, Dennis and me out for taking up valuable picture-browsing space (there were many envelopes loaded with photos for sale) for too long a time.]
I made it to Bus Fest too. I was glad that I brought along 5 rolls of film. I was able to take a picture of each bus on the outside from both sides and inside looking forward and looking back. I was dressed in black and had a black hooded jacket.
I noticed that guy also on the LI bus. I wanted to browse the calendars thinking there were others from different years but he closed the box (almost on my hand) telling me they were all the same.
He wasn't "dressed as" a driver, he is a LI Bus driver & sometimes poster here. That is also his bus.
Mr t__:^)
It was 5451, BTW.
(and I was there too! lol)
Was that you guys?? I thought I might have missed everyone since I got there kind of late. I was wearing the blue jeans, blue button down shirt and black sneakers. Needless to say, I didn't even realize I blasted off 75 frames of film until my girlfriend told me afterwards when we had lunch. Now here's hoping they came out OK.
I've been reading all of the posts from you guys and it sounded like busfest was alot of fun. Unfortunately, I had to work and couldn't make it. I would really like to meet alot of you bustalkers someday. Perhaps we can plan to meet up at a mutual place on a Sunday.(I'm off on Sun & Mon now.) Hope to make next years busfest. BIG AL
I second that motion....I too was unable to go to Bus Fest this year. My mom is in a nursing home and they had Family Day at the facility. Although it was a hard decision to pass up BF in my heart I know it was the right one. The facility rented tables and chairs and invited the families of the residents, employees, doctors who take care of patients and the surronding community. They had burgers, franks, chips, sodas, ice cream as well as pony rides and some inflated things for youngsters to climb through. Although I'm straying a little off topic, its nice to see that not all nursing homes have the disregard for patients that (hopefully to be) former Congressman Michael Forbes wants to tarnish all of them with.
Could one of the B-T'ers put up a post with a listing of all equipment and their impressions so that Big Al, myself and all others who couldn't attend can be there vicariously through you ???
I think a group meeting on a Sunday would be great. Perhaps it could be one of the garages (MTA or Privates). I think it will have to be in mid-to late Oct at the earliest. Oct 1 would not be good since its the second day of Rosh Hashannah, Oct 8 would not be good because of conflicts with Shore Line Trolley Museum's New York Weedend. Any Sunday from 10/15 on would be okay for me.
Hart Bus
Yeah, it was really fun, and gave me an opportunity to meet the faces behind BusTalk.
Clark Palicka
CEO TrAnSiTiNfO
http://www.transitinfo.cjb.net
If any of you saw me, I had a red fleece on, with my little brother who also had on a red fleece. I think I saw many of you there. It was really fun!!
Peace out,
Clark Palicka
CEO TrAnSiTinfO
http;//www.transitinfo.cjb.net
Yes, it was a lot of fun. I'm waiting for a post from someone lamenting that 3758 wasn't there! He would have seen it on the recent R33/36 March of Dimes Trip when we went around the loop at 38th St, Yard! It was peeking at us in front of a door. But today's BusFest was mostly a showcase for the new stuff with a little bit of old thrown in. As a NYCT motorman, I had a laugh about the hybrid. Firstly, it was nice to see a bus with a rear window, and as I was walking back there, from a slight distance, it looked like that little cubicle to the right of it was a motormans cab!
clayton said: "heypaul, I saw you drooling at that Mack bus, I was the grey shirt with black stripe across it"
clayton, how did you know it was me? i said i would be wearing brown socks... as far as my drooling over the mack bus, were there any other buses at the festival worth drooling over? i rest my case...
it was fun meeting a whole bunch of people...
all those NYC DOT schedules on the table and not one place to get NYCT skeds and/or sept 2000 maps???. a big minus as far as im concerned, but otheriwse for my first time attending (a spur of the moment trip) not a bad day.
The only NYCT maps I got were Sept 1999 Queens and Bronx that I found on some of the buses. I was looking for a Q10 schedule but that was already gone. Instead I took a Q37 sched dated March 1999. Those maps/scedules go fast so if you didn't get them early, they were already gone.
I was finally able to obtain schedules for Queens Surface. As I said to the people behind the table, "I never find these on the buses, and now I find them here."
Coming soon, some mistakes I noticed on the schedules I obtained, and my report on Bus Fest 2000.
And now, that list I promised you:
QS Local
All buses crossing Main Street, or intersecting the Q44 route in any way:
The Q44 is paralleled by the Q20A until 20 Avenue, and the Q20B until 14 Avenue, and cross the Q25 route at 127 Street at their respective avenues.
Q67, Q104: No B30. That route was killed a long time ago.
Q104: No QB24. Obviously a typo. It should be B24.
Q101: No M35 to Queens. The M35 goes as far as Ward's Island, then goes back to Manhattan.
Q111/113 Northbound Map: Queens and Nassau are on the WRONG side of the lines. This places Guy R. Brewer Blvd, Jamaica, and the Rockaways in NASSAU County! The southbound map is correct, placing the above places in Queens County where they belong. This error appears on both the weekday and weekend schedules.
And now a comment about the Q72:
GBL #5501 says that this route goes to LaGuardia Airport. However, only TWO trips terminate there. They leave the Queens Blvd. terminal at 12:30 AM and 1:30 AM. I don't think anyone in their right mind would wait for that airport-bound bus in the neighborhoods that route passes through. Why mention it when it doesn't go there during the daylight hours?
[Those maps/scedules go fast so if you didn't get them early, they were already gone.]
They are avaiable on-line, e.g. my favorite bus company
Mr t__:^)
What the HELL does LOL!, and BTW mean anyway? I always see this in posts.
LOL is Laughing out loud, and BTW is By the Way. Come on, get with the times!!!
Clark Palicka
CEO TrAnSiTiNfO
http://www.transitinfo.cjb.net
You R also going to C:
NIMBY, IMHO, IIRC, RQA, FYI, & RSN
These R just a few so B4 U spend 2 much time with us U better get up to speed TYVM (thank you very much) :-)
I'm new to the net. Still gotta learn the lingo.
I just learned recently what "LOL" was also.(somebody told me.) "BTW" I figured out on my own. So can somebody else help me also get with the program and tell me what the hell "NIMBY", "IMHO", "IIRC", "RQA", and "RSN" means, since were on the subject. Let's just say I was too afraid to ask. Okey Dokey BIG AL
This lingo goes back a few years to the early days of the internet when everybody had long hair & drank coke. Thanks to Bill Gates you don't have to be a geek to work a PC & the internet. Many started out to be TLA (three letter acronyms):
NIMBY = Not in my back yard
IMHO = In my humble opinion
IIRC = If I remember correctly
FAQ (not RQA) = Frequently asked question
RSN = Real soon now
Here's a few more:
RTFM = Read the F___ manual (this one realy tells you where they came from)
TIA = Thanks in advance
b/c = because
NIMTO = Not in my term of-office (again think geek)
TYVM = Thank you very much
And more recently:
CPW = Central Park West
GCS = Grand Central Station
WTC = World Trade Centre
RFW = Rail Fan Window
ROW = Right of Way
GOH = General over haul
MTBF = Mean Time Between Failures
MTBS/MTBD = Mean Time Between Swipes/Dips
HPS = heypaul syndrome (the act of trying to be funny on this board)
Maybe someone should summarize these for Dave to put in his FAQ section ?
Also there were a whole library of smilies, mine is just one.
Mr t__;-)
Thank you very much. The first 5 you listed were the ones I mainly wanted to know. I always saw them in peoples posts, but could never figure them out. Now, I feel like I'm with the "IN" crowd. BIG AL P.S. Here's one I know that you didn't mention. When programming computers, remember the "K.I.S.S." method. KEEP IT SIMPLE, STUPID!
KISS is an acronym to live by. I try to keep it in mind at work, because it does work !
PFM is another ... how does the Shuttle fly ... Pure F___ Magic
Mr t__:^)
It flies because of people who work and think hard to try to use a number of technologies and mechanism together.
And a space shuttle is certainly not simple, like something stupid is (you see, I DO like your quote).
A few corrections...
"GCS - Grand Central Station"
Grand Central Station is the post office there. The Metro North Railroad (MNRR) and New York City Transit (NYCT) station is called Grand Central Terminal (GCT).
MTBF = Mean Time Between Failures
I've never head of this one. I've heard of Mean Distance Between Faliure (MDBF)
running on...
or
GCS vs. GST ... you are probally correct
MTBF vs. MDBF ... MDBF = Mean Dips Between Failures ...
seriously it depends on how you mesure, i.e. hours, miles.
I worked in the airline industry so it was hours. If MDBF is correct I surprised that The Train Dude hasn't corrected me. MTBF may still be correct for those who want to deal in days/months between failures, i.e. scheduling space in maint. facility.
There is also MTBUR/MDBUR, i.e. Unscheduled Removals.
How about MOM = McLaren's Order Movement
or MAP = Mfg. automated Protocol ... but now I'm straying from transit topics.
Mr t__:^)
I enjoyed seeing alot of familiar faces from BusTalk and meeting some new ones at Bus Fest. Overall, it was quite nice, although I was a little disappointed that there seemed to be fewer "outside" buses than in past years. I think Joe Saitta's #699 Mid-Island Transit (LI Bus) Flxible new-look was the only outside bus. In the past, Double A from Rocky Hill, Connecticut, has had one or two, and there was usually at least one other restored, non-TA bus. Also, it would have been great if NYC Bus had brought in one of the New Flyer Vikings! Well, at least I got to ride the R-142 on the #2 while going from Brooklyn to Hoboken!
Sid, you must have left a few minutes after me. I saw the R142 leaving Franklin on my way home. Anyway, Trevor, Dashwan, Clayton, Tevi, Mike, David Justiano, heypaul, Doug, Pelham Bay Dave, and RM it was a treat to see all your faces. We must get together and do some serious bus/railfanning.......
B46M Limited
Today was a great day if you are a transportation buff. The Bus Festival was great although they should have had an Orion V and RTS to round out the NYCTA fleet. Hoboken was also fun and a welcome sight after a long absence. It was good meeting some of the Bus Talkers and being able to put a face on some screen names.
I was hoping one of the LI Bus new CNG Orions would've been there.
LI Bus has been a participant in the past. Don't know why they weren't there this year. Given your description of the state of their fleet in recent months, perhaps they were afraid none of their buses could make it as far as Brooklyn!
Yeah the way LI Bus is running these days I doubt whether any of their buses could make it to Brooklyn without a breakdown.
Also perhaps they really aren't too proud of the fleet, as most LI Buses look in pretty sorry shape.
I had an awesome time at Busfest. There were lots of old and new buses to see. The most interesting buses were the Flxible 699, which was a former MSBA bus, and I was on one once on the N51 back in 1993 (they still had a few left at MSBA then).
Also saw a former NYCT Grumman Flxible, one of the first "new design" buses to be brought into the NYCT fleet. I remember when MSBA had alot of these. Too bad they couldn't take the city, I liked the roomy design and tinted windows (why did MTA do away with tinted windows?).
Also saw the Orion diesel Hybrid, and the New Flyer low floor CNG's.
The museum downstairs was even more interesting, there were some beautiful old trains down there, some of my favorites were the old IND cars such as the R1 and R9.
The old BMT cars were quite warm and romantic.
I was there between 10:30am and 1:30pm, with a black bag, gray shirt and tan pants.
I met up with Howard, though I didn't run into any other bus/sub talkers there. I did however get to talk with a chinese reporter from Ming Pao daily and gave her additional information on buses in the new fleet. Some buses such as the standard RTS and Orions weren't there.
I also gave her the web address of this website if she needed more information.
It's too bad they didn't let you sit in the drivers seat. Figures the first year I go they have to do that!!
[It's too bad they didn't let you sit in the drivers seat. Figures the first year I go they have to do that!!]
Too bad you didn't have time to get over to the Hoboken Festival. There were many buses on display with the driver's seat available for occupancy!
I have fun at the Bus Fest 2000 & i meet Trevor, Clayton, Mike, Mark, Dashawn & other SubTalk, also i saw Heypaul downstair talking to Trevor. It was a great day at BusFest2000. So you guys are great & looking forward to meet u again in the future.
Peace Out
David Justiniano
On the way to BusFest today, I had the sorry experience of riding 9149 on the B57. I have lamented in the past that the entire group of 9140 to 9149 with the Cummings engines just gotta go! They need the series 50 engine like the rest of the 1996 order! From the outside, it didn't sound all that bad, but on the inside the engine sounded sick and had a strong smell of diesel fumes inside the bus. Even though it was a cool day and only a few open windows were needed, ALL the windows were open so as to get some fresh air in and some fumes out. And I had to wait almost 30 minutes for this piece of junk. I had just missed the "previous" bus, and they are on a 15 minute headway. The bus I should have been on showed up and snuck by just as we were loading at Flushing/61 St., and passed us by. After a slight wait for our scheduled leaving time, we had a light riding trip downtown as our leader picked up almost all our crowd. That one came from the depot and either he pulled late or was tied up by traffic coming across Fresh Pond Road (most likely senario). We caught up to that bus at Tillary/Jay. When it opens, hope the B57 moves to Maspeth depot as the pull out would be easier.
Sounds like this bus needs some work on the exaust system. However, if the operators don't write up the bus on the OVCR or defect card, and alot of them don't, then the bus will not get fixed. It is not transit's fault if they are not made aware of the problem. When I write up a bus for a bad exaust in Jamaica depot, it is put on the defect line immediately. BIG AL
Cummins engines suck. They are loud and slow. We have alot of their CNG L10G engines in our LI Bus Orion CNG's. They stall and lose power alot and they are loud as hell.
I sure wish LI Bus would put in Detriot diesel CNG engines like the newest of the fleet in all their buses.
A maintainance guy I spoke to at the Busfest yesterday said Cummins
has a poor service record compared to Detroit diesel.
That was the point of my original post, proving that the Cummings engines just gotta go. Stengel has Cummings Orions o/s longterm as I recall, presumably awaiting series 50 replacement engines. I'm sure they have the same performance problems as the 9140's in Fresh Pond.
I was at BusFest 2000 today, and noticed that Transit Transit News was interviewing people. I saw this Bus Driver, and two kids get interviewed. did anybody here get interviewed???
Clark Palicka
CEO TrAnSiTiNfO
http://www.transitinfo.cjb.net
I assume that was the interviewing I noticed on the way out via Court Street around 12:15 p.m. I slipped by without being approached, as they were in the middle of an interview with a youngster.
On Monday, bus 5034 "the one and only GM artic in the USA" will be forced into regular service along the Wilshire line in Los Angeles for a radio promotion for KFI/KOST. They will be broadcasting live from the bus and picking up passengers along the route. The bus will have police escorts and will be televised live by local FOX affiliates via helicopter. There will be a few fans out there including the infamous MR. BLUE, RTS's Director Of Special Operations. Please contact me or Mr. Blue for more info and pics. Check out the updated website thanks to Mr. Logan..
http://www.geocities.com/regtransit/
OK PEEPS ON THE WEST COAST WITH THE MOST MR.PINK WILL BE RUNNING HIS GM ARTIC ALONG WILSHIRE BL IN LOS ANGELES THIS MONDAY FROM 7-9AM AS PART OF A RADIO PROMOTION AND LIKELY COMMOTION.
GET YOUR CAMERAS READY FOR THIS ONCE IN A LIFETIME CHANCE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
MR.BLUE
>>> AS PART OF A RADIO PROMOTION AND LIKELY COMMOTION <<<
Please explain you post a little more. What radio station? Is the station supporting SCAB operation of busses? What sort of commotion is expected? I would assume the bus will have a police escort.
Tom
The bus is to used for 2 hours on the Wilshire line. The bus will have police escorts front and rear and a live television crew in a helicopter and also doing a live radio broadcast from the bus itself. I DO NOT SUPPORT MTA MANAGEMENT!!! This is a radio promotion for KFI/KOST. The amount of money that I am charging them for the basic 2 hours is so much that I cant turn it down. Basically they are paying a complete day rate for each hour. Trust me, when the 2 hours is up, THAT BUS IS OUT OF LA PROPER! This is not meant as anything to any driver or maintenence departments in MTA, Its all about the money..... Now on a bus fans note..... You will NEVER see a GM articulated fishbowl in regular service in any part of the USA. The picture ops will be great as there are many landmarks along the route. Watch your network news tommorow morning.For pics of the bus to be used or any others in my fleet... http://www.geocities.com/regtransit/
>>> The amount of money that I am charging them for the basic 2 hours is so much that I cant turn it down. <<<
Unfortunately those are the words which have been spoken by SCABS as long as there have been strikes. It is also unfortunate that you have to deal with the radio station KKK-FI, but that is certainly the station I would expect to sponsor such a stunt as running a bus in revenue service during a strike.
I do not wish you any physical harm, but if the bus is damaged, it would be poetic justice if you had to use all of your large fee to repair it.
Tom
Cute retort there dude but the insurance will cover any damages!
:-) HAHA
Blue
Very cute -- one of the better lines in here in recent memory. :) Due respect to both of you, of course.
One question, 'Blue' -- seeing as movie/tv bus provision must be a fairly small industry -- did you guys supply the Fishbowl and RTS for Lauryn Hill's "That Thing" video from about 2 years back? Remembered noticing that at the time.
Chris
The fishbowl, TDH 5304 - 222 ex DCTransit # 6342 was mine and the RTS belonged to another bus supplier. That bus was repainted about 5 years ago for the shows NYPD Blue and New York Undercover
Gotta question.....
Will whoever is going to drive the bus "in service" possess the required commercial driver license with passenger endorsement AND the required "Verification of Transit Training" (CA DMV DL260) forms?
Might wanna be careful if someone driving the bus does NOT have the proper documentation.
The operator for this particular job is fully licensed with all the proper endorsements and tack ons. The insurance is thru the radio station and is what is required by the state.
Good show hun let them try to hassle us!!!
:-)
Blue
Okay, I'm sure you're aware of that "DL260" form....a couple years back, I was with someone was didn't know a thing about it, and was driving a transit-type bus up north when an over-zealous CHP commercial officer, who had nothng better to do, pulled the bus over just to see if the driver knew of it. (Unfortunately, he did not.)
The CHP officer threatened to impound the bus, but for some odd reason asked ME if I had one, so I produced it and he said I was to drive the bus to wherever it was going, as long as it was hauling passengers (all one of them, me).
There's another gung-ho CHP commercial officer who works LA-Orange Counties, and he has a raging hard-on against buses. He was actually pulling over transit buses at the agency where I work and setting up the portable scales a few years ago whenever he saw a bus with standees!! Push came to shove, and there was an exemption written into the law about transit buses and weight so now they are legal up to the GVWR on the VIN-plates (which usually isn't much more than normal axle-loading weights for the state anyway).
Good luck in your venture today, and hopefully everything went smoothly.
Todays epic adventure sponsored by local radio station KFI brought Missasauga,Ontario 5034 to Wilshire Bl where artics last ran some 10+ years ago!
It was an amazing sucess and amazing to see few if any people out during the Strike.
Gypsy wagons were making plenty of cash along the busy and busless corridors of Los ANgeles.
Metrolink commter rail has former RTD RTS 04s running for thier feeder line.
For more info and the whole write up email me for a copy.
Mr.Blue
>>> Todays epic adventure....It was an amazing success <<<
Was that bus in such poor shape that operating it for a two hour charter became an epic adventure? And was it amazing that it ran for two hours without breaking down? I would think you would take better care of your busses.
Tom
Dear Tom,
The radio station hired that particular bus for 3 hours, one for setup, 2 for driving. They were running late and when they did decide what they wanted to do thier time was almost up. Once the bus was on the road doing what they payed for....... the bus was flawless.
In my business I am the maintenence, management, paint, bodywork and office person. Thats the way I LIKE IT. I think before you make comments about someone elses fleet.. you should do some investigating. You can call me personally at (909) 684-5926 or email me. Please dont make comments on a fleet that you know NOTHING about. I take great pride in almost all of my 21 buses. Yes.. there is a few that need some sort of major work (NYCTA 6149), but they are used for storage and thats all. I would not hesitate to hop into any of my buses and drive them anywhere, EVEN TO NYC to show you the rolling truth. Dont be such a bitter man. We are all in this hobby together.
Hehehe, what was the delay? Bill Handel's bagel delivery running late again?
THANK YOU Steve, and yes.... thru the 20 years or so we have had many differences of opinion and other things. I have no hard feelins towards and of the old clan. You know and understand that it takes alot of money, time and effort to keep a used bus going. Now add 20 others to the artic and it all adds up quickly. Considering the way some of these buses have arrived here I think I do an acceptable job keeping them going. Maybe one day Mr. Tom would like to come to Riverside and see for himself. And a note to you Mr. Tom....... Go thru the pics on my website. NOT ONE bus arrived the way they look today. In fact.. not many were even driven here. But they all operate and are ready to go anywhere. Next time you feel like running at the mouth......DO YOUR HOMEWORK first. My offer to you stands on you visiting my yard and shop.
While I don't always argee with "gmartic" on issues here, one thing I will say is that he does know how to keep a bus in good, safe running condition. While the bus may not "appear" to be a showroom display model, I am sure that mechanically it is in very good shape. (For one thing, it wouldn't have made it from Mississauga to southern California if it were NOT in good shape.
It takes TIME and MONEY to restore the appearance. It doesn't happen overnight, and doing a charter, such as was done, helps to bring in some money to further the appearance of the bus.
If you doubt Mr. gmartic's expertise, I can supply you with references.....
THANKS STEVE!!!
For the words you had to support me and Mr.Pink's (Gmartic) adventures yesterday.
It was truly a busfans wettest dream come true!
If this OLD.... person has anything to do all day besides talk unpleasentley about all the HARD ASS work Pink has done with his bus fleet he must be a very sour individual.
Pink has worked his ass off on this artic I should know I rode th bus with him from Buffalo,NY to LA! Not to mention Pinks years of preperation work on this project.
BTW Pink ran a UTU shuttle after the radio show moving picketting drivers from the downtown divsions to MTA headquarters. CALL THAT A SCAB!
PEACE OUT!
Blue
for the information of the rest of the subtalkers ....
KFI TALK RADIO IS A REAL LOSER with marchia clark the two time loser with the OJ case mr handel who does not know law rush limbauh!!
for you use KFI as a source of useless mis-information has me @ LOL.
next time find a more reliable source of information !!!!
Well Slamalamadingdong thanks for the write up and dis-correct spellingments.
No matter how sucky KFI may be we got paid for the gig.
Blue
i hav a rilly long handul tu, and i can spel grat!!!!
abe
Wait a second....you're saying talk radio isn't a good source of information?
-Hank
Earlier this week, while leaving JFK Airport by car after dropping off my son, I saw a bus in United Airlines colors (dark blue and grey) and labeled United Airlines that, from the rear, I was able to identify as a NABI high-floor (or, possibly, low floor) model. I don't know of any other NABI buses in the NYC metro area. Does anyone know anything about this bus?
I saw this bus again yesterday, very briefly. Upon this 2nd look this month, I now think it is a low-floor Neoplan and not a NABI. I'm not positive one way or the other, but I'm almost certain it is a low-floor bus. Next time I go to JFK and have time to look for it, I'll bring my camera!
One thing about the Nabi, Sid, is that it has that strange slanted window in the middle of the body, about where the floor rises. That would be a dead giveaway. United has generally gone with Neoplans around the nation, but that may have changed.
Joe
Unfortunately, I never get a very good or long look at that United bus at JFK. I'm quite familiar with NABI low-floor buses, as I visit Phoenix a few times a year and they've got tons of them out there. I also got to see and ride the Neoplan low-floor buses in Pittsburgh in the spring. If that United bus would just stand still for a second, I should be able to identify it for sure. Right now, my best guess is Neoplan.
I have been in the Nordic countries on business. Low floor transit buses are the norm rather than the exception. The floor rises aft of the rear door so they can use a conventional engine, drop box and transmission. They are a number of models made by Volvo, Scania and Mercedes Benz in 9,12 and 15 meter versions. Why is low floor such a rarity in the USA, anyone care to comment?
I visited Copenhagen and Stockholm this summer for the first time, and marveled at the number and variety of low floor buses in those beautiful cities. I agree that more U.S. cities should be increasing their low-floor fleets, but there has been some movement in that direction. Canada seems to be ahead of us on that. The reasons generally cited for reluctance to go to low-floor are (a) loss of capacity per bus and (b) fear the low-floor buses won't perform well in the snow. It seems like once some transit authorities try out low-floor buses, they frequently decide that they won't buy anything else in the future (e.g., Phoenix, Connecticut Transit, Albany, Broward County - Florida).
Last night while riding the bus into the city, I realized that I lost a CD. I know the numbers that I rode on: 8253 from HP run 120 on the Q32, 1064 run 021 on the M23 and 5172 on the M20 both from MJQ but dk the run. In between, I rode the 6 train #9533. Is there a way to call a lost and found at 1 of the 2 depots cause the case is that IDK where I lost it? I'm pretty sure that I lost it on 8253 cause I realized my stop too late and I may have left it on the seat.
If not then I will just have to get a new cd. Oh Well!
M20#5172Gary
Correction: I didn't realize that I lost the cd while going into the city, I realized it while going home in my friend's car exiting the city. I'm sure that I left it on the HP Bus.
Q32#9500Gary
It's doubtful a CD would be turned-in to the crew, but you can try. Every depot tags and holds lost articles for a length of time before turning the items over to the NYCTA lost-and-found downtown.
You can call the depot and see if anyone turned it in. If so, and if they have it, they will hold it for you until you come into the depot and claim it.
the lost property unit is at 34/8 subway station, north end of station downstairs, open business hours M-F.
Just about every bus company has some sort of "Lost and Found" department, even if it is a desk drawer in the dispatcher's room!
I overheard a rather funny conversation up in Seattle a week ago. i was in a restaurant, and the next table had four guys and the subject got on to umbrellas. One guy said whenever he needed a new umbrella, he just went by the Seattle Metro L&F office downtown and told them he lost one, and gave a vague description, so the person at Metro L&F would bring out a handful of umbrellas matching the description. The guy said he'd then pickone out saying "Oh, that's the one...!"
Our's has a brand new bra that someone left behind, so give them a call.
Mr t__:^)
Now that is something I don't need...unless I'm in the market for a slingshot for hurling grapefruit!!
Here in LA we used to have what were called Load Protection Busses that would sit on various points of the system known as the Line 600s and would await direction from dispatch to go into service at any given point of the system.
Do they have this type of thing in NY?
Blue
During both morning and evening rush hours, we have runs that are called "AA1", "AA2", and so on. These runs, named "As Assigned" pieces, have one trip built-in to the run, then deadhead out-of-service to a particular terminal or subway station and report to the SLD (Surface Line Dispatcher) for further instruction. The SLD would place those buses into service where needed.
HTH?
in regards to "as assigned" pieces---how is the pay structure detmind.
build in the run/o.t./min gurtee/---what happens if one day the operator has a 4 hr. roundtrip vs. next day a 2 hr. trip
are these runs detmined at the beginning of the pick which ones need
help or are use according to weather/traffic/emerg/passg load.
if build in run give idea how much the run will pay 45/50 hrs week?
do these runs tend to be high senority runs.
thanks bctbear
[Here in LA we used to have what were called Load Protection buses....]
The closest that NYC Transit has is the "As-Assigned" work. Each depot has at least one As-Assigned run; the route is designated, for example, as QAA (for "Queens As Assigned") or SAA ("Staten Island As Assigned"). Whoever picks these runs reports to a specified location and awaits instructions.
thanks for the info.
The Line 600s were a great idea here until the drivers did not follow procedure then layed around all day thinking that this assignment was an 8+ hour layover.
The idea is great in theroy but was POORLY excecuted here in LA.
With the LA strike its all but elemetray.
THANKS AGAIN ALL>
Blue
(1) The bus is being hired to do a mobile broadcast about the effects of the strike on people.
(2) It is the radio station that chooses who gets interviewed, its not just a free bus out there saying *UP YOURS MTA*
(3) There is going to be drivers there to talk about the strike, so its not going to one sided.
(4) I believe a scab operator would have buses out there as soon as the strike started. I have no ambition for doing so and the thought never even crossed my mind.
(5)Who would want all that riff raff on thier private collection of buses?
I am being paid by a radio station to drive a bus down Wilshire for 2 hours to pick up people to be interviewed about the strike, INCLUDING MTA DRIVERS. Thats all there is to it. I suppose if you get scab operator out of that, then I must be just a huge festering boil by now.
>>> I am being paid by a radio station to drive a bus down Wilshire for 2 hours to pick up people to be interviewed about the strike <<<
I saw your picture of 5034 on your website. If that bus is driving along and only picking up people to be interviewed rather than everyone with a fare, then it seems to me it has no more effect on the strike than any other private vehicle.
However if it has been repainted in MTA livery, and has front signs with the regular number and destination signs for the Wilshire line, it is a definite provocation, which is what one could expect from a sleazy station like KFI.
Tom
Your present post is much less inflammatory than your post of Saturday (19686) in which you stated "bus 5034 ‘the one and only GM arctic in the USA' will be forced into regular service along the Wilshire line in Los Angeles," and Mr. Blue's post of early Sunday morning (19692) which included in its title "GM ARCTIC TO RUN IN A IN ACTUAL SERVICE!!"
Driving up and down Wilshire Boulevard for two hours to find people to be interviewed for a radio program is a far cry from running in "regular service" or "actual service." If you will not be picking up everyone waiting at each bus top and collecting fares for the MTA it is neither "regular" nor "actual" service. It is a charter assignment. There was no need to make the original inaccurate inflammatory statements.
Tom
I thought the photo display on the Flxible 699 was fantastic. It was great seeing all those pictures of trolley buses, Bingham Macks and Twins, the lost buses of Brooklyn which I barely remember from childhood. The back of the bus was kind of crowded and awkward for browsing. Is this picture collection accessible for viewing at other times? I'm sure there are some photos which I'd like to buy if I had time to look through the collection in a more relaxed way than was possible at the Bus Festival.
Of course seeing 6259 again was the high spot of the Festival this year!
Why were 6259 and 3100 leaning so far to the left? Could the street have been that sloped or is there something weird about the suspension system of these buses? The 9000 series 1958 GM was sitting awfully low also. Can anyone explain this?
eric...i am glad to hear someone else say that 6259 was really the main attraction there yesterday... are you old enough to have ridden in the c-49's?...i grew up with them on the b-68, b-1, b-21, b-6, and b-8... i really love the macks... i would have loved to have been around ulmer park, back when it was all c-49's... it would have great to see them coming and going out of ulmer park.... does anyone have photos of ulmer park when it was inhabited with the macks?
i also noticed 6259 listed pretty badly...subway surf told me that the mack had problems getting to the museum yesterday and was really belching out black smoke... i wonder whether the air suspension bags are still intact on the macks... i remember riding in them a couple of years ago, and it had a very hard ride...
heypaul -- I remember the C-49s when they were brand new. I lived in Queens where the TA ran all GMs at the time. Some of the Binghams came out Jamaica Avenue and terminated around 170th Street B56?). They also ran on Atlantic Avenue and terminated at Parsons Blvd (B22). I think the C-49s may have had a brief run out of ENY on these routes at the beginning of their career before they went south. I remember seeing C-49s on Coney Island Avenue and waiting in Grand Army Plaza. Was that the B68? I hardly ever got to ride on any of the Macks but I always enjoyed seeing them. When Jamaica got new buses in 1957 I hoped that they would be C-49s. They turned out to be the GM 7000s. Too bad. I hope 6259 is OK and working for a long time to come. Is there ever a fan trip on this bus? Several years ago, before I knew of the museum collection, I saw it heading west on 23rd street, Manhattan, followed by a Flxible new look. They both had people on them but were obviously not in regular service. I couldn't believe my eyes seeing an operating C-49! Would love to ride on it.
hey eric... the b-68 ran along coney island ave and went to bartell pritchard square which is on the west side of the park, sort of midway between the north and south ends of the park...
i really don't know what the condition of the mack is... appearance wise it looked good... i don't even know where it is garaged... i used to see it in flatbush depot...
i think there is a bus group that did run a trip with the c-49 mack a couple of years ago... i think joe c. belongs to that club, so maybe he might know...
i was surprised this year to learn that greyhound ran c-49's on the west coast as part of a local transit operation they provided... and just the other day, robert redden put up a picture of a
c-49 in new england greyhound livery... i don't know if their buses went over the road, but i would have loved to have been on one of those fearsome looking buses on the highway... imagine what a motorist would feel, seeing one of the c-49's about 3 feet from his rear end doing 60 or 65....
I am not 100% shore witch day it was but New Flyer 950 had a very bad accdent. It is sitting in the back of JG on the 5th ave. wall. I was told that it hit a poll on third ave. The door side of the front of the bus is pushed back and bucked up into the front wheel. The wheelchaig ramp is gone. The right side of the bus driver side is cracked right down middle of the windsheld. Both windshelds were poped out and all the windows in the front doors are out. The floor in the driver area is also buckel up. The fare box was already taken out of the bus. 950 have only been on the road for 5 days at the most. The driver was a NEW diver, he/she has already been fired.|
I was tolled that it might go back to New Flyer to be fixed. They will have to cut off the old front end and put a new one on if there is no frame dammang in the middle of the bus. But it look very bad for 950 to be back into sirvice any time soon. If at all.
I wounder if it is tolled out will the TA buy a new one and call it 950 or will it be the first missing New Flyer Low Flour # missing.
Robert.
At least it didn't explode.
-Mark
Aman to that.
Robert
99% chance Transit will send it back to New Flyer for repairs. From what you are saying, it sounds like an entire new front module will have to be put on the bus. (Similar to changing the nose on a car) It will probably be out for awhile but when it comes back, I guarantee you, it will look like nothing ever happened. If you go into the transit museum, those fronts from the RTS and Fishbowl sitting downstairs that people can go into are the front modules. Also, if the bus was completely demolished from front to back and not repairable, that number, 950, would not be assigned to another bus.
Also, where did you hear the operator was fired? If this is true, I wonder if he or she would have been fired if that was an old bus. Makes you think. One's job should not hang on the line because of the type of bus he or she is operating at the time. BIG AL
I hear this from seval people the the driver was fired. The driver probley would have been fired if it was and RTS's. The accdent was just that bad.
What happened to cause the accident? Then maybe we can better determine what happned with operator. I'm glad it wasn't an RTS, but I do thik that the bus being new had something to do with the punushment.
All I know is she/he hit a poll that it's.
Robert
All that damage from hitting a poll? I'll bet it was a support beam for elevated train tracks. That would really do extensive damage like that, even hitting it at a low speed. BIG AL
CLose, but not quite. It hit one of the beams that holds up (poorly) the Gowanus.
-Hank
Oh, for goodness sakes, it's _poles_. A _poll_ is when you get peoples opinions on a question, ie, presidential contenders.
-Hank
Hey, a poll could do that type of damage.
Imagine a bunch of surveyors trying to scramble onto a bus so fast that they practically crushed some of it?
Well, maybe a long shot, but still, it could happen.
Well, exuuuuuse me! Poll, Pole. I hope we didn't confuse you too bad, Hank. Give me partial credit. A beam that supports a railroad track isn't much different from a poll, err pole that supports a highway is it? I've seen this type of damage mentioned before on buses, and it was from the beams that support tracks. That's how I had a good idea what it was. BIG AL
no to nitpick, but it could also have been called an 'el' pillar, much like the ones they make you slalom on westchester avenue when youre on the training bus.
Jackie Gleason are now only sending out CNG's on the weekends. The RTS's are only going out if needed.
Robert
Saw what I believe to be 4460 on the M104 this afternoon. I was at 42St and 8Ave. The bus was making the right on onto 8Ave.
M104#403Mike
Could be, some 4400's have emerged at Mother Hale last week as posted previously, and some have observed them in Queens out of Casey.
It would be good if Fresh Pond got a few. 4709,4659, and 4723 at FP need new engines. They should scrap those buses and send 4400s to replace them.
Good observation Mike! The UTC roster dated 9/14/00 lists 4460 as being the only RTS at Amsterdam depot. 4478 and 4494 are listed at Mother Clara Hale.
Yes, I saw the info on Trevor's roster as well........ Without my glasses, I was not sure if it was 4460. She did not have on any depot logos so she was fresh.......
M104#4460Mike
i like list of bus garage and route that come out of them.
Click Here For Roster
Trevor Logan
www.transitalk.com
thank you fixible metro b #3511 you been a good help to a guy from utah
The Massachusetts Bay Transportation Authority (MBTA) will be implementing it's first fare increase since 1991 tomorrow,Monday Sept 18th on all bus,subway,commuter rail and commuter boat lines. Local bus fares will go from .60 to .75, with the zone fares ranging from $1.00 to 1.75, depending on number of zones travelled. Express bus fares will also increase to a maximum of $2.75.
Some local community groups are not happy with the fare increase. According to a local TV news report I saw tonight, a group of folks are planning a protest tomorrow morning.They intend to board a T bus and pay the old fare and refuse to pay the difference.They haven't indicated which bus route they plan to do this on.The T's general manager's response is that the T's fares are probably the lowest of any U.S. major city public transit system,and is necessary to keep up with the rising costs of fuel,salaries,maintainance,etc.
Information on the T's new fare structure can be found on the MBTA website www.mbta.com
Mark
What are they complaining about? Houston fare is $1.00 to $4.00 depending on where you're going. NYC is even more expensive. They shpild be thankful.
The NY fare is not that bad considering it is $1.50 and for that you can travel through out the system and into the burbs. I think we may be due for an increase next year though. Its been a while.
Also, keep in mind that if you buy a Metrocard for $15 or more, each ride is only $1.35 (versus $1.50), an even better deal.
In todays Daily News, there is an employment ad regarding hiring of new MaBSOTA Bus Operators. There is something new in the hiring process called the "Bus Operator Selection Survey" (BOSS).
Does anyone know what this is? I didn't participate in such a program(?) when I was hired by MaBSTOA.
Thanks!
Its a fancy name for a psych test - i believe it was thought by the APTA - to make sure we dont have psychopaths driving our buses on the road. Questions about how drivers behave on the road and the test takers opinions on it (agree with the staement, disagree with theh statement, etc).
A certain amount of negative opinions will DQ you from the rest of the process. But if you know what theyre looking for you canb pass easily.
Yeah, but don't take the obvious approach. If you don't reply realisticly, they'll toss it.
-Hank
MTA-NYCT is having troblem hiring people & i did got a call last year for "Bus Operator Selection Survey" (BOSS) but i fail also at that time i didn't have a CDL. Well not too many people didn't get a job for B/O & it not easy to hire.
Peace Out
David Justiniano
I assume that they tend to get a lot of applications, so the first step is to make two piles ... those out (missing something) & those that need to be reviewed further.
If you didn't have your CDL, get it & tell that you have it, I believe they'll give you a second look, PROVIDED you have a clean license.
Disclaimer: I don't work in the personel department of any bus company, so I don't realy know what they do.
Mr t__:^)
So now the TA has instituted their own "psychological" it seems. Interesting. Well, for those of you who don't know how the TA works, in relation to answering questions, here's a hint:
Answer every question thinking "SAFETY". Include in your answer, "What can I do to PREVENT AN ACCIDENT or a possible lawsuit". Never answer with a hostile approach. Passiveness in the name of SAFETY of all concerned is your best recourse.
We don't "get even" with other (passenger car) drivers who cut us off, or with customers who don't pay. We are ALWAYS DEFENSIVE when we operate our bus. We always yield the right-of-way to pedestrians NO MATTER WHERE THEY ARE.
Whatever the questions, just remember to answer them with kindness, compassion, understanding, and patience.
Thank God I didn't have to take one of those! I'd still be on the unemployment line!! LOL :-)
As far as obtaining your CDL before-hand, it's an expense you might not want to undertake before you are officially in training class. All you need to be appointed is your CDL Learners Permit. One word of caution- the TA vision test is NOT like the DMV test. If you even THINK you MIGHT need glasses, take this advice and GET THEM BEFORE YOU'RE CALLED TO MEDICAL. If not, you'll lose seniority because you'll be passed-by while others are placed in front of you. Everything you do from this point is seniority based. That means the difference between working holidays, picking off weekends, overtime, etc.
Make sure you're not held back by Medical. The TA vision test is computerized and is a 15-20 minute procedure testing near and far-sightedness, peripherial vision, color vision, depth perception, and double vision. Remember, when you go to medical, THERE IS NOTHING WRONG WITH YOU! These doctors are not there to help you. They are there to prevent you from obtaining a job.
One other important factor: Do NOT LIE about your driving record. NYCTA and MaBSTOA have direct access to the NYS DMV license and registration departments. If you have a license problem, get a DMV or municipal disposition and answer truthfully with an explanation. If you lie, and they find out, and the WILL find out (possibly years after you've long forgotten), you're terminated....instantly.
If any of you are on the list, or are taking the test and need some help, I can provide some basic info and web links. Lemme know :-)
BTW- As Thurston said, obtaining your CDL beforehand can't hurt, but I don't know that I'd get the licence before actually being hired. All I needed was the Permit, CDL Class B with Air-Brakes and Passenger endorsements, and NO restrictions. (CDL-BP). As part of your training, the TA goes with you for your road test appointment and provides the bus.
Another note: the DMV Road Test is MUCH easier than the NYCTA Road Test. If you continue with the TA past "Day 10", you'll pass the DMV road test with ease.
Good luck!
Next they will screen for "POW" (postal organization workers)so the operators can be screened before they go postal. Wait I know lets eliminate anyone who has a type "A" personality.
Where was Everyone Today??
Today was the first weekday that the Los Angeles MTA was on strike. They claim to carry 500,000 riders a day, so I expected the roads to be jammed with bus and train commuters finding an alternate way to work.
I had to be at an appointment in downtown L.A. at 11:00 A.M. I monitored the morning news shows on TV between 8:00-9:00 A.M. to see how crowded the freeways were. What a surprise. The helicopter views of the freeways showed them to be lighter than usual. The only backups were behind traffic accidents.
Not wanting to take any chances, I left home at 10:00 A.M. for the fourteen mile drive. The freeway turned out to be lighter than it usually is on a weekend, so I arrived in downtown about sixteen minutes after I left. Traffic on the downtown streets was light. Parking lots were no more full than normal. The D.O.T. mini busses (which were not on strike) were no more crowded than usual, and running on their regular schedules.
The only noticeable difference was that the streets were much more quiet. At the corner of First Street and Spring Street during a regular day, there are always seven or eight busses in view, stopping with squealing brakes, and starting up with a roar. Today they were missing and the difference in the sound level was astonishing. There were more pedestrians than usual, but they were walking along streets on which the D.O.T. mini busses were running.
MTA was running a few SCAB busses, mostly small twelve passenger models, but one or two 40 foot busses. They had announced that they would be running busses along the Red Line subway route, and these busses had "Red Line" signs pasted to the front doors and in the windshields. I saw four busses pass by, one with only one passenger, and none with more than four passengers.
So, the big question is Where was everyone? Did many people take the day off to avoid the expected crowds? The afternoon TV news shows are showing the expected stories of one woman who walked ten miles to work, and people taking taxi cabs, and others saying how the trike is such a hardship, but it did not seem that way today for anyone with an automobile.
Tom
Most of the commuters probably extended their weekends in the hope of a quick settlement. It will probably become more difficult as people need to travel.
Sounds like it did during a strike over a decade ago -- I used to drive for a tour/charter company in Los Angeles then, and it was a genuine pleasure to drive around during the strike. No SCRTD buses in the way causing street traffic!!!
With the transit buses gone & stored on the yards it is eiser to get around in your private vehicle !!!
MAN THEY SHOULD HAVE KEPT THE PE & TROLLEY SYSTEM HERE !!!
record high heat in the 100s here making things worse !!
all other bus systems continue to run !!!
your reporter ( salaamallah) live & local here !!!.......out...
STEP BACK PEASENTS
MR.BLUE RUNS LA!
>>> MR.BLUE RUNS LA! <<<
What does that mean?? A small man with a big Napoleon complex??
Tom
I think he should check with Mr. Pink first. I don't think he likes Mr. Blue.
-Hank :)
A big Neoplan complex perhaps Mr.Old.
Blue
If NYC Bus really believes that its plan of recent years to have as few types of equipment in each depot makes sense, why is it suddenly adding a few old RTS's to a few Orion-only depots, like Amsterdam, Hale and Stengel? Wouldn't it have made more sense to add some RTS's to Yukon, which already has 32 RTS's, and move some of the Yukon Orions to Amsterdam, Hale and Stengel, to keep them all-Orion? Is this just a preview of mixing up the fleet again, like it used to be?
I was thinking the same thing, but one can never figure out the TA mindset.
It's simple really. There aren't enough Orions to go around. However, you DO have a good point, in that, since there are still 32 RTS's in YUK, it would make sense to transfer a few of their Orions over to CS, AMS and MCH, and send a couple of KB's RTS's to Staten Island. Now, maintenance storerooms at those three depots have to carry spare parts for 2 or 3 RTS's, in an otherwise all Orion depot. Overall, the TA would rather not spend the necessary dollars to transfer buses from SI to Queens and the Bronx.
Great point Sid
Mark
Perhaps the busses are not being maintained in the respective depots (ex: if a CS needs repairs - they'll send it over to JAM).
I know this was the case when JG had the x27 and a limited amount of express NovaRTS coaches. What baffled me about that arrangement was that JG had NovaRTS busses at the time.
Shaun
Knowing the TA... They'd probably just buy more Orions.
Wayne
1. Applications were given out at BusFest
2. " " " " in yesterday's and today's Daily News.
3. " are at 130 Livingston Street. Dont know if they are at 370 Jay Street.......
M15#5034Mike Limited
I'm giving up the train operators job and going to MABSTOA. MABSTOA RULES!
PLEEEEEEASE tell me that you're ahead of me in seniority. If you are then I say..........GO FOR IT!!!!!!!!!
I went to T/O in February 1994.
Mike: Don't give up the train operators for MaBSTOA because it not easy to get a job for MaBSTOA because of (BOSS) test. What i heard not many people didn't get a job for MaBSTOA B/O & i took it last year but didn't make it. This is the second time they put on the ads for last 2 years & 3 times in since 1997. By the way TA B/O is not the same an MaBSTOA B/O.
Peace Out
David Justiniano
972: Saw this bus at Smith and Fulton. It was OOS. Look new and pretty.
980: Was on a Southbound B75 at Smith and Livingston....
B75#980Mike
981 just came in on Monday, as well as 4 other but I did not see them to get there numbers.
Robert
In addition to New York, there are posters on this Board from Houston, where the agency is MTA; Baltimore, where the agency is MTA; and Los Angeles, where the agency is MTA. Besides, New York's MTA runs buses under the NYC Transit and Long Island Bus "brands." So...
Could we please identify New York City Transit buses as "NYCT" or something other than "MTA?" It's confusing!
Thanks.
David
david... why hide the fact that the mta runs the transit scene in new york, baltimore, houston, and los angeles?
that is why on subtalk, i urged a boycott of mta buses and subways here in new york in order to help bring this transit-industrial complex to the bargaining table...
[...why hide the fact that mta (sic) runs the transit scene in new york, baltimore, houston, and los angeles?]
As ALL Bus/Subalkers are Very Well Aware, they are not - not - NOT (!!) the same MTA.
(Think for half a second: why would the Governor of New York appoint a board of directors, and a chairman, for an agency in California? Why would Shirley DeLibero move from New Jersey to Texas to run a New York outfit?)
The full names of the 4 MTA's are as follows:
1. New York: Metropolitan Transportation Authority of the State of New York
2. Baltimore & vicinity: Maryland Mass Transit Administration
3. Houston & vicinity: Metropolitan Transportation Authority of Harris County
4. Los Angeles: Los Angeles County Metropolitan Transportation Authority
Our "favorite" MTA is merely an oversight agency, and contains several operating agencies within it. The other MTAs operate their services directly.
Anybody who is unwilling to understand the distinctions among these four agencies should not waste everybody's time by posting messages.
You are taking my friend much too literaly, he was trying to be funny, sorry you didn't get it :-(
Anybody who is unwilling to understand the distinctions among these four agencies should not waste everybody's time by posting messages.
Anybody who is unwilling to understand the distinctions among heypaul should not waste everybody's time by posting messages.
Me personally with all the MTA's in the US, I signify them as such:
NYCMTA - MTA New York City Transit
BMTA - Baltimore MTA
LACMTA - Los Angeles County MTA
so on and so!
Trevor Logan
For example: I saw NYCTMTA Bus 4146 on the Q46 Friday. So that the confused don't get any more confused.
Q46#9365Gary
I do not recognize the LACMTA as an MTA. They are still the SCRTD and decided to "bite" the name off of nyc cause the people in LA couldn't be original to save their life. They even stole the M!!
For cryin' out loud, those frizzy californians invented plastic surgery to AVOID being original. And if they didn't invent it then they certainly perfected it.
As far as the Baltimore MTA, how often does someone post something on that system? Well, at least they're a LEGITIMATE mta.
Trev, getting people to call it the NYCMTA (or NYCT instead of just TA) is like getting a New Yorker to call 6th Av. "Avenue of the Americas". Fat chance.
zman179
www.iaintgotnowebsite.com
[I do not recognize the LACMTA as an MTA. They are still the SCRTD...]
No, they are not. SCRTD no longer exists. Any agency has the right to call itself an MTA if it wishes to, or to change its name if it wishes to.
Plus, what exactly "qualifies" an MTA as such? Does it indicate certain criteria, the way "Class I railroad" does? Or is it a professional designation, like MD or CPA, that entails a specialized course of study and a certification or licensing process?
Los Angeles did not "steal" the "MTA" from New York. Los Angeles had an MTA long before New York did, even before SCRTD existed.
The "M" in the logo is completely different. In fact, the "M" logo at LACMTA looks to be shaped more like Miami's than anything else.
Baltimore, Miami, Des Moines, and possibly others have "MTA". Boston did at one time, too. So it is NOT a "New York thing".
Well I know that they stole the "M" from somewhere. I wish a huge earthquake would detach California from the rest of the country and let it float out in the Pacific Ocean. Maybe it would reach China and they could annex it.
Boy is that wishful thinking.
And all you Californians(mainly LA) in bus/subtalk land please don't take any of this personally. It's just that I spent a hellish two years in LA and I just wanna blow off a little steam.
The rest of the people living in LA that are not affiliated with fellow bus/subtalkers can get swallowed up by an 9.3 earthquake however.
Hehehehe, I'm with you -- maybe what California needs is about a 9.3 to clean the place up!!!
Nothing like some urban renewal now and then. I just got back to southern California from the Pacific Northwest -- and I actually HATED coming back. And my eyes and nose have been in pain ever since, with the shit we have to breath and look through down here.
Wouldn't the correct terminology be "MTA New York City Bus" as it is lettered on the buses? That's how I have seen it listed in the production list printouts that I get from TMC/Novabus in recent years, as opposed to "MTA Long Island Bus" or "NYCDOT/Command Bus" (etc.) to distinguish the other bus operations.
You have to factor in the "DBA" effect, i.e. doing business as.
The bus/subway part of the MTA is NYCTA despite corr. & printing on the sides of the fleet that may say something else, e.g. I got a FAX this AM from "New York City Transit" which included a MTA logo.
LI Bus I think is realy the MSBA div. of MTA
Mr t__:^)
[LI Bus I think is the MSBA div. of MTA]
This is correct. MSBA is still the legal name; Long Island Bus is the "promotional" name.
It could be described as "Metropolitan Suburban Bus Authority, d/b/a (doing business as) MTA Long Island Bus," if people had the patience to say and write all that. :-)
Some of the diesel Orions still say MSBA on them.
Personally I like MSBA over LI Bus for a name, especially
the
/\/\
suburban
(blue M)
Saw 630 Monday night on the N20 still with the M design on her. Also 627 has it-saw her Sunday o/s on Glen Cove Rd.
R36Gary
Talk about confusing how about MARC vs. MART vs. METRA vs. MBTA vs. wMATA.
It does say something GOOD about where this board is going, i.e. county & even world wide ... that is just great. Some of us, myself included, need to create cheat sheets so we know who/what is being talked about.
I for one still refer to the bus operation in NYC as TA & have a "TA" bus operators badge on my trolley hat ... what do you think of that ?
Mr t__:^)
I think by default when some of us see MTA we immeidately think MTA of New York State. If I'm referring to another MTA - I usually indicate it. ex. Baltimore MTA.
As far as the TA goes. I think MTA New York City Bus/Subway (and the others) sound rather awkward and silly. This is probably why I still refer to it as NYCTA, The TA or NYCT(A) - and of course OA and MABSTOA.
Wayne
I'm trying to see the point of this. This board is NYC-centric. Granted, there are posters planet-wide, but unless one of these other places is mentioned specificly, MTA here means New York. I don't recall any posts that led to any confusion. I don't see the problem.
-Hank
Thank you Hank, I could not have said it better.....
B46M Limited
However, I have come to enjoy the posts from our out of town friends, so we shouldn't dismiss their concerns out of hand.
So, lets just say that MTA by default means nyc MTA unless otherwise specified ?
Mr t__:^)
Same thing I said, only in not as many words.
-Hank
The moral of this whole thread is, as Lewis Carroll once said, that one should "never confuse the name of the thing with what the thing is called." The name of the thing is "NYC Transit"; the thing is called "MTA."
-----
Seriously, though, I feel compelled to illustrate David's point: A reference such as "MTA Orion #614" could easily refer to EITHER New York City Transit OR Long Island Bus, because EACH has an Orion numbered 614.
In the bigger picture, names that people "are used to" or "prefer to use" are all well and good, but such names are meaningless if they're outdated or just plain incorrect.
This whole MTA thread is one of the dumbest threads I've ever had to read. Just identify the buses as NYCT because that's what they want to be called. For example, NYCT #8941 (which is a good bus, by the way).
End all of this unreadable nonsense about LA, Houston or whoever the heck else uses "MTA"? Nobody cares--at least I don't.
Mark
I say, everyone should say just MTA or TA for any posts on New York buses. If you are mentioning another city then just put the name in front of the MTA(i.e.Baltimore MTA). 90% of the posts involve New York buses so the majority rules!
And I still say that the Los Angeles MTA is a phony MTA. They're the RTD. Case Closed.
http://photos.yahoo.com/asiaticcommunications
YOU CAN SEE ON THE ORANGE EMPIRE PHOTOS WHERE THE SYMBOL
"""""MTA""""" was used in LOS ANGELES a long time ago !!!
And SCRTD used to be Los Angeles MTA. So there! (Or do you forget that history has happened?)
I don't think that he's denying that Los Angeles used MTA, I think he's just using the word phony as an expression. And I personally agree with him. The name of the site Bus/SubTalk are on is nycsubway.org, not usasubway.org etc... so I think that if you are referring to a NYC bus you should use MTA, and if you're referring to another city, you should state the city before MTA.
Clark Palicka
CEO TrAnSiTiNfO
http://www.transitinfo.cjb.net
According to traffic reports this morning a CNG bus on a flatbed hit the Pinelawn Road overpass of the LIE in Melville last night. There was a three hour closure of the road as there was a fuel spill. Everything was okay for the AM commute.
Anybody have any details as to whose bus, #, etc. My guess that it was E/B going out to Atlantic Diesel in Bohemia (Exit 57).
I saw a LI Bus today at Atlantic Diesel with the CNG fuel tanks damaged. Sorry, couldn't catch the number but will try tomorrow. Another LI Bus, 261 I think, was there also. Also saw 288 on the N79.
To Rich B53 - Thanx for trying...The picture in Newsday was tough to see the number over the front door with my old eyes and a magnifying glass.. It is appears to be 2 x 8. Since you saw 288 on the N79 it might be 228 or 238.
OK, saw the bus today at Atlantic Diesel. It's one of the new ones; number 346.
Why are all the new buses going to Atlantic diesel?
Are they having problems or is something else being done there?
Starting Monday, September 25, the RM2 express bus will operate via Hylan Boulevard and Arden Avenue. More information will be coming within the next 48 hours.
Tell me about this bus, any info is helpful
Q35#227Mike
It's a 1985 GMC RTS. I've rode on this bus before and she runs pretty good. But Mike, what's special about this bus? 603 and 616 are my 2 favorites cause they're fast buses and they sound a little different than the other buses-engine wise.
Q60#616Gary
It looks like crap, but I guess that age does that to you.....
Q35#227Mike
Look at 285- saw her on the Q37 this morning-boy does she look like crap. Also 232, 237 and 262.
Q60#603Gary
I think that the Rockaway GBL are worse......
Q22a#226Mike
Maybe it's me, but it seems like the newer TA buses, the ones with the rug seats, seem to make a lot more noise when they accelerate. That would be the Novas in the 4900-5000 series and the 9300-9500 series. anmd the Orions in the 6000 series. Every time I ride one, the engine seems to be much louder, and the growl much more labored and strained.
This in turn makes the ride feel rougher.
Somehow you would expect newer buses to sound quieter and smoother. Was there a change in engines in 1998 when the seats got softer?
What's the problem. I love those types of RTS buses. But if you want a growl free bus come down to H-Town and ride on old 2153. She screams like a woman in bed. I'm going to miss her.
The new series 50 engines (those in the 6000 series) are more powerful and louder than the 6V-92 in the older buses.
Because it's louder, it may only seem like it's straining.
The new 6000 series Orions are way faster than any of the older Orions in the fleet.
I was on the S79 today with the several 6200 series Orions and they got up to 60mph on the bridge. I'd like to see a 6V-92 do that.
A more powerful bus engine is louder than an a less powerful one.
For instance the 6V-92, which is still being used in some of the Orions at Casey Stengal, mainly the 200s, is quieter and smoother than the new Orions at Stengal. But I hate the 200s, they are very slow.
Especially with the A/C on.
Aren't those Stengal Orions with the 6V-92 going to get the new series 50 engines soon?
The newer buses have Detroit Diesel Series 50 engines, which are four-cylinder and also four-stroke (intake, compression, ignition, exhaust). They fire every other time the piston goes up.
The older buses have the Detroit 6V92 engines which are a six-cylinder, two-stroke (exhaust/intake, compression/ignition). They fire every time the piston hits the top of the stroke.
Today, while driving in Far Rockaway, I spotted what seemed to be a new Orion on the N33 @ Seagirt & B. 17 St at approximately 2:45 pm enroute to Mott Avenue-Far Rockaway. It had a large style dot matrix destination sign in the front, the windows were configured differently from the older Orions. The bus number was 342. Does anyone have any information on MSBA receiving new buses, and if so do they know if the MSBA plans on getting rid of the Phantom Gilligs?
The RM2 will provide rush-hour and late evening express service from Tottenville on Staten Island to 59 Street in Manhattan. The fare will be $4 during rush hours and $3 all other times. Service will commence on September 25, 2000 and will be provided by myself and Alcorr Tours.
ROUTE TO MANHATTAN
The bus will start at Main Street and Amboy Road. The bus will take Amboy Road to Craig Avenue, Craig Avenue to Hylan Boulevard, Hylan Boulevard to Arden Avenue, Arden Avenue to Arthur Kill Road, Arthur Kill Road to the West Shore Expressway, West Shore Expressway to the Staten Island Expressway, Staten Island Expressway to the Goethals Bridge, Goethals Bridge to the New Jersey Turnpike, the Turnpike to the XBL at the Lincoln Tunnel
In Manhattan, the bus will turn left from Dyer Avenue onto 34 Street, 34 Street to 7 Avenue, 7 Avenue to 32 Street, 32 Street to Madison Avenue, Madison Avenue to 59 Street
ROUTE TO STATEN ISLAND
The bus will start at 5 Avenue and 59 Street. The bus will take 5 Avenue to 31 Street, 31 Street to 8 Avenue, connecting with the Lincoln Tunnel. The bus reverses the Staten Island route.
TO MIDTOWN MANHATTAN
Main/Amboy Arden/Hylan Arden/Woodrow Expressway 59 Street
6:38AM 6:55 7:05 7:10 8:20
7:08 7:25 7:35 7:40 8:50
7:33 7:50 8:00 8:05 9:15
TO STATEN ISLAND
59 Street 35 Street Expressway Hylan/Arden Main/Amboy
4:50PM 5:05 6:05 6:20 6:35
5:08 5:23 6:23 6:38 6:53
5:38 5:53 6:53 7:08 7:23
8:00 8:15 9:15 9:30 9:45
TO STATEN ISLAND VIA RICHMOND AVENUE AND ARTHUR KILL ROAD
59 Street 35 Street SI Mall Hylan/Arden Main/Amboy
9:00PM 9:15 10:05 10:40 10:55
10:00 10:15 11:05 11:40 11:55
These buses will exit Staten Island Expressway at Richmond Avenue and follow X17 route to Arden Avenue. The X17 does not run at these times.
Pass this information along to a friend. Buses in Manhattan will make all BxM4C stops in the northbound direction. Initially, buses will make all Academy stops on 5 Avenue towards Staten Island. Once ridership picks up, we will only stop at BxM4C stops on 5 Avenue, with an additional stop at 31 Street/5 Avenue and 31 Street/7 Avenue.
More information can be found by e-mailing me at jazumah@hotmail.com. I look forward to your support, especially the good folks at BusTalk.
The route is an imitation of the Academy routes
Not quite. The Hylan/Amboy Academy uses Huguenot, Amboy, and Hylan as their main running streets, while I use Hylan and Arden.
The big difference lies in the fact that I would like to provide all day service and/or weekend service in the future and just using Hylan would take too long and not serve other parts of the South Shore. The RM2 and future RM3 will be designed to operate longer hours than rush hour because people travel at other times as well.
Do you have something you could send to me ,,via Mail US Mail...showing the RM2 and the RM3..and the old RM1 if any
Just the routings?
Steve
also the turnaround routings in Staten Island and Mannattan for the Buses to reverse their trips
Somebody mentioned last week about the rarity that 4429 is out on the streets, well I rode on her yesterday on the Q46.
Q46#4429Gary
Hello everyone. Just found this site the other evening. Can't even begin to tell you how interesting it is. Looking forward to spending many evenings here. I am an operator for Capital District Transportation Authority (CDTA) in Albany, NY. Thought you might like to check out our website. We are celebrating 30 years this year and the site has a cool picture of one of our new Novas all wrapped up in a cool 70's Flower Power theme. The site is located at www.CDTA.org. Thanks again for such an interesting site.
Welcome!
I happened to be passing through Albany the day after Labor Day and was pleased at the nice, varied fleet CDTA had as I stood downtown in the AM rush hour for about 20 minutes. I applaud CDTA's large move to low-floor buses, with Orions, Novas and NABI's. And some of the older Orion I's still in service look pretty good from the outside. Nice city to visit for busfans!
Welcome Aboard
Today myself and two other bus operators were ready to go to Lodi to bring back three Viking express coaches. At the last minute the union said NO they haven't been road trained on these 45 footers. Three S.I. operators will drive them over to Ulmer Park where they will be tested. I really wanted to drive that bus.
The UP union confirms that the 3 vikings will be tested here at Ulmer Park. Perhaps something that is finally definite??? Who knows!
Shaun
The New Flyer D45S "Viking" Cruiser were still residing at Atlantic Diesel in Lodi when I was there yesterday morning/afternoon (Here are some shots taken September 20th)
Regards,
Trevor Logan
www.transitalk.com
The Viking are now sitting inside Ulmer Park. I just got off working a double up at Jackie Gleason and Park my car infornt of Ulmer Park to go home and I saw All three Viking setting there. I went inside with two Ulmer Park drivers that I know to see how they look. There is a big walkway passed the Fare Box, So big people won't have to squees by it. The bus is nice inside and out.
Robert
P.S. Yes I live right across from Ulmer Park and I work at Jackie Gleason.
A thought occured to me in that these buses have clearance greater than 11'. At least one route uses the Belt Parkway, which has several overpasses with clearances well under 11'. This would also affect the MCIs. So will the routes be changed?
-Hank
The run-off and run-on routes for the x27, 28 and 29 would have to be changed if these busses are being used. There are 2 overpasses that measure 10'-6" that both the MCI's and the Vikings would never make it under. One is a pedestrian bridge near Bay Parkway and the other the old stone overpass under the Verazzano at 4th Ave.
What will probably happen is UP will make the routes runoff like they used to -- Gowanus to 92nd street, around Dyker Hts golf course, right on cropsey ave and straight down to the depot. This was the way the x28 and x29 always ran-on and off until the x27 came in and permits were given to use the Belt.
It is a pain and takes more time -- but thats the way it'll have to be -- unless, the department of transportation wants to knock down and replace 2 overpasses in the near future for 3 express bus lines! Somehow, I don't think that will happen.
Shaun
I just heard that if the Vikings pass the 30 day road test Ulmer Park will get a totel of 80 of them. As for the first three it will take about a mouth before they go into service. It will take them that long for Ulmer Park to tranin all the drivers in the Wheelchaire lift and to driver a 45" bus.
There were acouple of things that are not in the driver bay. 1) there is no switch to lock the tag axle. I wounder if it locka when the bus is moving at highway speeds. MCI's drivers tall me that they have to lock it when they are on the highway, or the bus fishtall while turn on the highway. 2) The bus does not have a kneeler system. 3) It look like the driver can control the Temp. of the A/C and Heating system. 4) The door control is a three posions control. The door opens if you push it up or pull it back. 5) The drivesrs seat is not cloth. It is a plaice. 6) The driver has a place to put his stuff over his head. 7) There is pull string for the stop request bell.
Robert
MCI Tag locks automatically above, IIRC, 15 MPH. Some drivers manually lock it.
-Hank
passed ulmer park today and did not see these buses. where in depot are they. btw i used to drive there. it seems strange nyct would be willing to purchase 80 after only a 390 day test. new flyer must have a friend in new bus procurement.
Those buses haven't ever been in service, anywhere. They couldn't possibly have tested or made a decision on a full-scale purchase yet.
-Hank
The busses were sitting next to the wash the last time I had checked. I guess they passed the "fit through the wash" test. I believe that drivers will begin to be trained this coming week on the wheelchair and be taken out for their 10 minute test drive before they can start playing bumper cars with the new toy.
Personally, I really hope this bus fails NYCT's road test. I really believe that the Viking looks really ugly and would prefer seeing 80 more MCI's instead.
Shaun
Why do buses have to be so tall anyway? I've been on buses that barely fit under low overpasses that a regular bus could easily fit under. I've seen over the roofs of many buses that are passed by these 11½ to 12-foot behemoths.
I once heard someone smashed a double-decker London bus under a 3 meter overpass to demonstrate the importance of paying attention to the "overheight vehicles divert" signs. They had cameras aboard on the upper lefel and outside the bus to show how much damage can be done. The bus was going at full speed, too.
Anyway, I think that any diesel bus taller than 11 feet is a waste of space. The CNG buses at Triboro have a warning near the driver:
Warning: This bus is 11'6" high! It cannot go into the [74th Street] terminal, across the Williamsburg Bridge, or under the LIRR overpass at 71st Avenue. Then again, that's a CNG bus. Those are an exception. If it were a diesel bus, it would have a similar warning.
Sometimes those buses turn so fast, you'd think it'd fall on its side. One place where I remember this is on Dry Harbor Road somewhere between Caldwell Avenue and Juniper Blvd North.
"The CNG buses at Triboro have a warning near the driver: Warning: This bus is 11'6" high! It cannot go into the [74th Street] terminal, across the Williamsburg Bridge, or under the LIRR overpass at 71st Avenue."
TCC Orion CNGs regularly use the Williamsburg Bridge; I rode a QM24W across the Williamsburg Bridge (outer roadway) last night. Perhaps you're thinking of the inner roadways?
Also, I've yet to see a RTS or Orion CNG on the Q45; aside from the height problem inside the 74th St. terminal, I think the bus would have clearance problems with the railroad overpass on Calamus Ave between 73 & 80 Sts.
[TCC Orion CNGs regularly use the Williamsburg Bridge; I rode a QM24W across the Williamsburg Bridge (outer roadway) last night. Perhaps you're thinking of the inner roadways?]
I saw this warning on an RTS. The Orions are 11'1" tall.
Isn't it strange that the front license plate partially covers the MTA logo?
Well today I was very stubborn I was determined to ride one of the brand new Orion CNG's at LI Bus. First I went on several routes, N21, N23, and an N24 to Roosevelt Field. Well I two older Orion CNG's and one diesel.
Then the N16 down to Rockville Centre. It was a diesel Orion and boy did we pick up alot at Nassau community College this afternoon. Looks like they need more buses down there.
Pulled into Hempstead just as one of the new ones (298 I think) was pulling out on the N37.
Got to RVC and looked for one of the new ones on the N4. I let several buses pass, all those really slow low 100s.
After thinking I'd have more of a chance in Lynbrook, I took the N4 there. I had the pleasure of riding bus #130 (or 120 according to the number on the inside of the bus). This bus crawled, and it had a double identity (I guess they changed it from 120 to 130).
I got off and walked down toward the N25 bus stop. Unfortunately I saw
making a left onto Sunrise yet another new bus, and it was too far gone for me to catch. But heck I'm crazy, I'm gonna wait until one of the new ones pull up!!
The first N25 was 113, another slow oldie. Then across the street an N31 pulled up, one of the new ones, just finishing his run.
So I asked if he'd be on another run, I told him I wanted to ride on one of the new buses. Well he just shut the door and pulled away.
I crossed the street and went back to the N25 bus stop.
Then finally my wish came true. A big N25 GREAT NECK sign I saw coming towards me. It was bus 293.
So I got on all excited.
Sure enough, the seats were spanking new, and are in the usual LI Bus "aqua" shades and remain plastic but seemed more comfortable. Actually I prefer plastic over the felt like material, because when you're hot a plastic seat is more comfortable.
The engine felt just as I expected, practically identical to those used on the QSC Orions.
The bus had great pick up, and the engine was alot quieter in acceleration than the noisy Cummins. It did shake a bit more, but I believe that has to do with the regenerative braking.
The real test was the hill on Northern Blvd just after Community Drive. It handled alot better than the Cummins, and that's with the A/C on. I was quite impressed with 293's performance, the A/C was very good, and like the other CNG's we had the automated announcements.
The windows are different. It's a much sleeker style with the windows on the top ala Suffolk's new Orions.
I think RVC may have more of the new Orions than Mitchell Field. It seems Mitchell is always stuck with diesels and Cummins Orions.
Another thing to note was there were two rear seats missing on 293, like on all other buses with Detroit series 50 engines.
Also saw several non/AC buses, 629 and 140, both N20. It was hot today but I guess the old 6V-92's and Cummins crap out alot.
"Another thing to note was there were two rear seats missing on 293, like on all other buses with Detroit series 50 engines."
Wouldn't this be only one missing seat? Even though it may seem like 2 seats are being taken out, only one is, but there's a passanger handrail where the middle seat would usually be.
Youre right, only one seat was missing, my mistake.
I HATE those recorded announcements. When I ride the N6, I actually hope that one of the older models comes rolling along so that I don't have to hear that crap all the way to Jamaica.
Here is pics of #302 before at Atlantic Diesel in Lodi NJ before she hits service (Pictures taken September 20th), ENJOY!
Peace & Blessings!
Regards,
Trevor Logan
www.transitalk.com
I noticed some NYCB buses in those pics.
They're still using those 4-panel front doors? That looks weird!
I'm guessing that the exterior signs are like those on the QSC Orions.
I also noticed the interior sign. This is going to be one of those talking buses, right? GPS-based this time, I hope.
Yep, At Atlantic Diesel they work on buses from all over the Metro Area, MTA-NYCDOT-NJT-Everyone!!!!!
And yep, Talking bus it is!!!!!
Trevor Logan
www.transitalk.com
What's u p with the 4-panels? It looks like they ust recycled PCC doors or something....
Hey, dont flixible buses use those kinds of doors?
Yep Both Flxibles and PCCs use that door!
BUT FLXIBLES ARE BETTER!
Trevor Logan
www.transitalk.com
I believe they have 4 panel doors because they have handles for elderly/disabled people to hold on. They are more ADA friendly.
Thanks!!
Well if they work properly the announcements are a BIG help for those who don't know they're way around.
09/21/2000
I don't see any Gillig's anymore (on N19), are they being withdrawn for retirement ?
Bill "Newkirk"
I sure hope the Gilligs will finally bite the dust!
Another thing to note. On the JFK Flyer, I don't see those small school buses, or whatever the hell they were using. I only see Orion's now on the Flyer. And this is everyday for the last 2 weeks since I've been on the Q3. BIG AL
Could it be that people are starting to use the JFK Flyer so that passenger demand now calls for standard buses rather than the former vans and Thomas's? As an aside, has LI Bus ever used a CNG Orion rather than a diesel on the Flyer?
Yes there have been CNG Orions on the Flyer several times. BIG AL is right, I haven't seen any of those cheap looking Thomas buses around. It's been all Gilligs and Orions.
Mark
What type vans were these?
MSBA/LI Bus has a whole bunch of hotel/airport transportation type vans in LI Bus colors, numbered in the 2000 and 3000 series. Most are used in paratransit service, but some of them used to be found on the JFK Flyer and, I believe, some may still be used on the shuttle route the operates in the Roosevelt Field area (haven't been out there for awhile).
LI Bus also uses Gilligs and diesel Orions on "the Hub" shuttle in Westbury/Garden City.
By Hotel/Airport transporation do you mean those Dodge/Chevy/Ford 15 passenger vans, or the short 25/29 feet type made by companies such as Glaval?
According to "Bus Rosters on the Web," they are Ford model E350 Vans. Hope that means more to you than it does to me!
"According to "Bus Rosters on the Web," they are Ford model E350 Vans. Hope that means more to you than it does to me!"
Ford Model E350 Vans could mean Ford vans or just a Glaval bus on a Ford chassis.
Some have fareboxes installed, so there is no reason why not.
(how do I know, the farebox is in a odd location, so I was shown a bus with one just because I'm a curious kind of guy & a LI Bus friend enduldged me)
Mr t__:^)
Yup. Rode 135 on the Flyer about three weeks ago.
LI Bus is starting to run CNG's on the JFK Flyer route.
But when I was on it, the ridership was still pretty low.
Perhaps they just can't keep those old junky school buses (oops, Thomas buses) on the road anymore.
Hopefully those Thomas Builts went to the scrapper!!
Saw one of the Thomas busses on the Flyer on Tuesday evening. I guess you can only continue to hope.
The pilings for the JFK Express are more then half way up the Van Wyke now ... assume LI Bus service will end then.
Mr t__:^)
Can't wait to try out the Airtrain. I betcha it'll cost alot of dough to ride though.(no Metrocard excepted on Airtrain) :-(
09/27/2000
[Can't wait to try out the Airtrain. I betcha it'll cost alot of dough to ride though.(no Metrocard excepted on Airtrain) :-(]
What kind of fare collection system will Airtrain have ?
Bill "Newkirk"
No, I was recently at the Hempstead Bus Terminal and they were all over the place. Also, they seem to provide the bulk of the service on the N91 (JFK Flyer).
The windows on the new Orions reminds me of the old Trailways' Eagle 5.
Yes the windonws on the new LIBus Orions do remind me of those Eagle 5's, too. But, is it me, or is there a blue-ish tint to the windows?
Mark
It does seem like they do have a slight blue-ish tint.
09/25/2000
Finally! is right. It took MSBA/LI BUST a long time to utilize these type windows that have been around for some time. Remember the first Grummans with no windows? How about the 1000 series Metro Flex's with only two opening sliding windows, one behind the driver and the other behind the front door, brilliant idea !
Bill "Newkirk"
"Remember the first Grummans with no windows?"
Do you mean no opening windows, or no windows?
09/27/2000
["Remember the first Grummans with no windows?"
Do you mean no opening windows, or no windows?]
OOPS! I erred ! No opening windows.
Then again I wouldn't put it past MSBA to have a bus with no windows!
Bill "Newkirk"
"Then again I wouldn't put it past MSBA to have a bus with no windows!"
LOL!
Well here's another MSBA mystery. I rode on mostly Orion CNG's today. They are supposed to be clean air buses. Why then when I come home and wipe my face it is covered with soot?
Dirt?
Ever notice the severe problems with double parking in Little Neck on Northern Blvd, especially between Little Neck Pkwy and the city line?
This costs the buses time and explains why there are always traffic delays and bunching on N20/21 routes.
The buses honk at these double parking idiots but they are stubborn to move. Why isn't the NYPD handing out tickets to these double parkers?
It's a big opportunity for the city to make money, because I see it almost everytime I'm going through there.
I was sitting here at my computer when a thought came to me. Why not register subtalk and bustalk, such as subtalk.com, and bustalk.com. You could do it free at NameZero.com. What do y'all think??
Clark Palicka
CEO TrAnSiTiNfO
http://www.transitinfo.cjb.net
First, why does everyone choose NameZero? It's free, sure, but all the pages take forever to load, even with the script that gets rid of the frame. It may look amateurish to have a geocities.com/yourpage address, but it's even more so to have a slowloading idiot namezero page. If you're going to get domains, pay for them ... NameZero's just not worth it. Or at least provide the real address for those who don't want to wait for the load.
Other than that it's an OK idea. Be faster than going through nycsubway.org's home page.
Chris
Why not just have a subtalk.cjb.net and a bustalk.cjb.net?
No banner ad, fast loading, and Pirmann wouls get a anythinghere@sub/bustalk.cjb.net email account.
The way to do it is a refresh - you have your namezero page be blank and then it automatically refreshes to your REAL page
The way to do it is a refresh - you have your namezero page be blank and then it automatically refreshes to your REAL page
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Yes, I realise this. However, it takes a long time just to load this first page for this reason -- the namezero-served pages are GLACIAL. This was what I was railing against in the first place. If people just used their real URLs and forgot about this frilly NameZero stuff, things would go SO much faster ...
Also, when you go through namezero, when you click on a link inside the site, the address bar stays at www.whateverthenamewas.com
Not unless you <BASE TARGET="_top"> your pages.
As David Pirmann said in the SubTalk post of this same subject, you can use bustalk.nycsubway.org to get to BusTalk, as you can use subtalk.nycsubway.org to get into SubTalk.
Since I just found out about this, I feel good knowing I don't have to type
www.nycsubway.org/cgi-bin/bustalk.cgi
to get to BusTalk.
bustalk.nycsubway.org saves 16 keystrokes for those who don't use auto complete.
Besides, bustalk.comhas already been registered. Don't believe me? Click here.
Better yet:
go to Suibtalk and bustalk once and save as bookmarks or favorites. If you dont like the name that pops up you can edit the name of the favorite or bookmark. I suggest you make a folder(netscape or IE) and call iot NYCsubway. Drag subtalk, bustalk, and nycsubway.org into your nerw folder.
e-mail me off-site if you need instructions for editing favorites/bookmarks or in making new folders.
To the experienced users: we always have new users. We were all new users at one time. This way I addressed needs of newbies (newcomers) without taking up bandwidth for experienced users.
The same question came up on Subtalk. Oursuperb wemaster, David Pirmann advised that the names subtalk.com and bustalk.com are already taken! He did not address .org or .net
based on his repsonse I think he prefers the existing arrangement which I agree with.
WITH the disaster here going into the first week what does the gestapo LAPD & police & sheriffs do here ??
Arrest people who offer even FREE RIDES from bus stops !!
Sometimes they may ask for a dollar donation etc... SO what ?????
Then this gives the nazi tow truck & gestapos LAPD with thier awful ( & towing peoples cars away )!!!
""crackdowns"" with no way for the transit dependants to get ot work school etc ?? A NEAR RIOT ALMOST BROKE OUT HERE WHEN THEY ARRESTED SOMEONE WHO TRIED TO GIVE SOMEONE A RIDE TO WORK.........!!!
even if he did this for free !!!!???????????????
fianlly the goose stepping beverly hills police are putting people in jail & a $ 1000.oo fine for feeding.......PIGEONS..!!?????!!!!!!
Now do you understand why I HATE with a passion that festering cesspool called Los Angeles?
well.......its like a lot of other cesspools elsewhere for example;
( one time i lived in detroit ) ..
Question to Salmenelia.
Whats your trip dude?
What are you trying to say in your rambling postings?
Whats with the ridiculos handle?
LA rail is dead and useless as the dodo.
Thanks to your beloved "Los Angeles Rail System" MTA is at the brink of self destruction.
Blue
If you haven't checked out my July "Field Trip" report included are photos of some of the large collection of buses that Seashore has.
Dave has just updated the bus section with the ID of the coaches caught in my photos.
The bus fleet isn't quite ready for prime time (not part of the normal tour), but if you ask in advance of your visit I'm sure they (we ... I'm a new member there) would be happy to find someone to walk you over there.
In any case, enjoy the photos.
Mr t__:^)
It seems that Governor Pataki has asked the MTA to consider operating South Shore express bus service. One of the excuses I have heard is that the MTA has to sit down and plan routes.
I have a deal for all of you. I have already planned an express bus system for the South Shore, a venture you will soon hear about in the Advance. I am willing to give the MTA the routes I have planned in exchange for something of similar value.
What do I mean by similar value? I have projected that my system would turn an annual profit of over $100,000 if it were privately operated once the ridership picked up. This, to me, is NOT chump change and I would like to receive something of similar value. This could range from allowing us to operate a route like the X7, X8, X10, or X12, to 10 New Flyer D45S Vikings, to some other appropriate arrangement. I am flexible and the new routes would ensure that additional work will be available for your members without ANY loss of jobs.
I am extremely serious about this. The routes and schedules are DONE, and I have already asked for venture capital, which is what I am now waiting on. If I do receive the venture capital, and the MTA agrees to a trade, then the money WILL come with the routes because that was its original purpose.
170 new MCI coaches have been redirected to Staten Island from Ulmer Park. If Pataki and the MTA are serious, they could be running buses by November. If you're serious, e-mail me and we could discuss the details.
The ball is now in your court, ATU. If you want to increase jobs for your members AND serve the residents of Staten Island, this is your chance to prove it. I have spoken to some of your drivers and they want the extra work. If you refuse, then we really know what's going on.
What kind of engines do the 1995 500 series buses have. They sound awesome. Also what type do the 100 series, and the new 6000 series have. Thanks for info.
P.S. I mean the NYC Bus, not LI Bus or any other "foreign" MTA's
Here you go:
1993 Orions (101-316): 9.2L Detroit Diesel Series 92 (6V92TA) DDEC II
1993/1995 Orions (581-609): 10.0L Cummins L10-280G CELECT
1994-96 Orions (400-580, 610-680): 8.5L Detroit Diesel Series 50 DDEC III
1999 Orions (6000-6349): 8.5L Detroit Diesel Series 50 DDEC IV
Orion Hybrids: 7.3L Detroit Diesel Series 30 DDEC IV with LM HybriDrive
But but by sometime next year, the 1993 Orions will be 8.5L Detroit Diesel Series 50 DDEC V CRT Engine.
Regards,
Trevor Logan
www.transitalk.com
The other day, traffic was backed up on Queens Boulevard, Greenpoint Avenue, 48th Street, and 47th through 50th Avenues between 48th Street and at least 47th Street.
Anyway, I saw a lot of express buses on 48th Street in the mess. I saw two from Triboro (one QM24 and one QM12), another from Green Lines (5501-2?) I saw another QM24 on 47th Avenue, and B24 and Q39 buses also trying to get through.
Here's my question. Do the drivers of each express bus choose which route to travel while travelling between the last Manhattan and the first Queens stop? Since Queens Blvd. was a mess, the buses tried going other ways. Is this normal?
In Seattle drivers of the 594 Seattle-Tacoma-Lakewood Express are permitted any routing, so long as they serve all stops. Of course the normal routing via I-5 all the way is used when there is no traffic, but under horrible traffic conditions I have seen 594s running via SR-167, which is about 8 miles longer but has HOV lanes all the way to 15th NW, which is about 7 miles south of where the HOVs on 5 end at Kent-Des Moines (if i've lost you look at a Seattle/Tacoma Map). Likewise in horrible traffic 594s will use Portland Avenue and SR-512 between Tacoma and the 512/5 parknride.
This occurence happens on other routes as well - so long as all the stops are served reroutes are the sole choice of the driver...
Abe
Must they be served in order as well?
as we speak a QSC Orion that normally uses Union Tpke is proceeding down my street whicj lies on the Q74 route.Thats twice this week.
You do see them using Park Drive East as well sometimes. Theyre not missing any stops anyway.
Who would have thought that the 20,000th message on BusTalk would come under a thread that I started?
Who would have thought that the 20000 message would NOT come in a thread titled "the 20000 message?"
-Hank
Well, this branch off Express Bus Routings got the title "20000th Message" at Message #20014, which was a response to Message #20000.
It's kind of surprising considering all the hype that surrounded SubTalk's approaching Message #100,000, no one even referred to BT20k until after it was posted.
Hey, for the 10,000th, it didn't come in as "The 10,000th message", even though I made a few posts at 9996 and 9997 to watch for it.
Well, still not as big as Subtalk's 100,000 message. The poster did a great job on that message.
running on...
or
Which routes do you see on Park Drive East
QM 1 and 1A, whichever routes use Union Tpke
The QM1 and QM1A both use Union Turnpike. I can only think of two times when the route went on Park Drive East, and that was so that traffic on Queens Boulevard could be bypassed, to get on the LIE quicker. Each time was on a weekend, and each time the driver said he was trying to get back on schedule, possibly because of equipment troubles.
THank you --Steve
With TA express or local buses, you are not allowed to leave your route for any reason without permission. Don't know about the private lines.
Is it me or does Subtalk have more post per day than Bustalk. I mean there is the same amount of juicy information on buses as subways.
Is it enthusiasm, or just lack of interest.
Is anyone thinking the same thing?
Regards,
Trevor Logan
www.transitalk.com
Yeah, SubTalk get's alot more posts daily cause subways rule and buses suck!!!!
jk
Clark Palicka
CEO TrAnSiTiNfO
http://www.transitinfo.cjb.net
Posted by R142 aka. Clark Palicka on Thu Sep 21 20:51:54 2000, in response to Is it me OR..........................., posted by Flxible Metro B #3511 on Thu Sep 21 20:36:53 2000
Yeah, SubTalk get's alot more posts daily cause subways rule and buses suck!!!!
jk
What kind of reply was that? Show the slightest amount of respect to the people in this forum. If you don't have an interest in buses, don't post here. Simple enough.
For me, I have no intetrest whatsoever in the subway system, and if I wasn't a BO, I probably wouldn't have an interest in buses either. However, being a BO, I enjoy this forum, and am thankful to have the opportunity to discuss issues with everyone. Sometimes I offer help and information as an employee. Sometimes I learn things about bus particulars, and about how the riding public feels about certain things. That's the beauty of a public forum such as this one- those who are interested discuss ideas and learn from one another.
Those who don't have an interest should post elsewhere, IMO.
A forum isn't judged by quantity of messages, it's judged by the quality of contributors. For the most part, excluding such childing replies as in the one above, most everyone else here adds quality to this forum.
If you're thinking of removing BusTalk, I hope you'll reconsider.
Thanks,
QV
Second that, QV.
There *are* significantly more subway posts. Maybe because there's more subway material at NYCSubway.org, or maybe because some people don't see the romance in diesel buses that seems to be inherent in subways.
Myself, I only follow Bustalk, because I really only have time to check once a day. Nycsubway.org's server is fairly slow, and I subscribe to about 30 newsgroups as well, so I really don't have time to follow the Sub forum as well -- too many posts to sort through. But as QV said, the beauty of this system is that it is pick and choose. Bustalk's nice because there are only so many messages in a day, and I can deal with it all in 5 evening minutes.
Chris
First off, what does BO and IMO stand for? Second, I think the reason sub talk has more posts is because there is a lot more interesting things to talk about rail, and they talk about all kinds of rail, not to mention that the NYC subway is huge. Sometimes you should put up more interesting posts once in a while that can start a huge chain, like, I don't know, well, things unlike that bus is ugly or that bus was in a commercial or something like that. The thing is, I have more of a knowledge of buses rather than trains, so, I guess what I am trying to say is that there should be a lot more interesting posts put up, and not just about NYC and LI (make more WMATA, Ride-On, and SEPTA posts-i can actually reply to those). broaden your horizons or whatever. Well, that's what I have to say.
Good thoughts. I do enjoy the non-MTA transit system posts ... often more than the MTA posts, simply because I DON'T live in NY!
IMO is In My Opinion, BTW (By the Way). And BO, I believe, means Bus Operator. Or Body Odor, if you ran out of Right Guard.
Chris
Um, I think I need to inform you all that he posted jk under his message. It stands for just kidding. It was a joke guys. Take deep breaths, we all know buses rule. Especially the beautiful RTS.
I don't think the joke was funny at all. I will admit also, and have known for a long time that subtalk gets more than twice the amount of posts as bustalk. Simply put, there are more train fans than bus fans, mainly because trains are a much broader topic than buses. I try to create posts that will generate alot of responses for a while, like the SLOPEBACK bus I discovered a few months ago. That generated posts for several weeks. But overall, there is only so much you can talk about, without being repetitive. I go into subtalk from time to time, but don't leave messages. And I will admit, I don't even have time to read half of them that's on the screen. But, like QV operator said, this website is for everybody to enjoy. And if there was only 1 post a day left on bustalk, I would still enjoy it the same. BIG AL
Geez, you guys take every post so seriously. I like buses just as much as subways. I EVEN went to BusFest!!! Calm down everybody. I was just kidding, hence the jk under the line that follows my post!!!
Sincerely,
Clark Palicka
CEO TrAnSiTiNfO
http://www.transitinfo.cjb.net
yeah, your right. YOu don't have to spazz out people because of one comment. Geez, give this guy a break.
what does BO...stand for?
Body Odor
>> what does BO...stand for?
>
> Body Odor
>
I already used that line in an earlier post. :) Great minds think alike, I guess.
Chris
Yo man, chill. I posted jk underneath that which means just kidding. I was just messing around. I too like buses, as much as I do subways.
Clark Palicka
CEO TrAnSiTiNfO
http://www.transitinfo.cjb.net
I think SubTalk has pretty much always had more activity than BusTalk. I think that most bus buffs are also rail buffs, but often not vice-versa. I say that because most of us here at BusTalk also post at SubTalk, but many of the SubTalkers (past and present) do not or rarely post on BusTalk. Before Dave launched Bustalk many of us original BusTalkers were regulars at SubTalk. We all participated in rail topics and occasionally we'd (to my delight) have a thread about buses going. I'm thankful that our bus topics were tolerated on SubTalk and I'm even more thankful that Dave decided to launch BusTalk. When BusTalk started I immediately shifted here although I continued to stay "in touch" with SubTalk. SubTalk did seem to slow down a bit, but now there seems to be a whole new generation of SubTalkers.
Wayne
Even when BT was shut down, I put up a question about the B59 on ST.
No. Since SubTalk was around longer, more people are on it. Since there are more people to post, there are more messages. Also, there don't seem to be as many bus fans on nycsubway.org as railfans.
That's the only reason I don't post there!
BusTalk and SubTalk are really complementary and should not be thought of as in competition with one another. Each serves a distinct purpose, with some common elements, and it is a mistake to think one is better than the other, regardless of which has more posts. Those who dislike buses but love trains are entitled to their opinions, and the same with the visa versa case. I suspect a decent majority of all posters are public transit fans, so they probably don't hate either trains or buses. The important thing is that the posts on either board are certainly interesting to a decent number of readers, so the bottom line is that BusTalk and SubTalk are both big winners!
A couple of years ago "bus" topics started creaping on SubTalk. As the volumn grew Dave though it would please both groups to have them in seperate spaces. I view both for completely different reasons and have been very happy with what he did. Thanks Dave.
Now when are we going to have some Bus Field Trips ?
This week-end a friend yelled at me for not doing the Field Trip to the Beaches of Rock & Long again this year ... remember it was a subway/bus trip last summer ?
Well I almost did it and was actually on the boardwalk of Long Beach recently wishing I had invited some friends (I didn't tell my wife, daughter & grandson what I was wishing about, because they wouldn't have understood)
Mr t__:^)
Since most of this site is about subways, I doubt that many people come to nycSUBWAY.org to find info on buses.
Is there any other city besides SAN FRANCISCO that uses the trackless
""trolley bus"" type systems ??
For starters, Boston, Philly, Seattle, Dayton.
Toronto also uses trackless trolleys.
how about philly ??
Sorry - no more electric trolley buses in Toronto. In Canada, ETB's can still be found in Vancouver BC and Edmonton AL. As posters already noted, in US ETB's are in San Francisco, Seattle (two biggest systems), Boston, Philadelphia, Dayton.
Edmonton, Alabama?
No.......Edmonton ALBERTA, a province in Canada
Alberta's two-letter designation is "AB". That "AL" IS the two-letter postal abbreviation for Alabama.
While S.F. and Seattle are the two largerst electric trackless systems in the U.S., I believe Vancouver, B.C.'s system may be the largest in North America.
Once the system was dismantled, were the trolley buses scrapped or sold? Twelve years is generally considered a short service life for a trackless trolley. The CTA operated an identical fleet of 45 St. Louis coaches which, like Brooklyn's, were delivered in 1948. Many of them ran for 21 years.
In NYC at that time there was a anti-trolley attidude, so with the possible replacement being called a trolley-bus, it was guilty by association. There have also been folks who said the mayor at the time and others were encouraged to buy buses by individuals in the rubber & bus industry.
Now the City is being strangled to death by traffic & the politicans say that they aren't going to build or expand any more roads. Does anyone know there is going to be a transit bond issue on the ballot ? Hmmm they're not pushing that either. Guess the City is just going to die a slow death ?????
Mr t__:^)
>>> In NYC at that time there was a anti-trolley attidude, so with the possible replacement being called a trolley-bus, it was guilty by association <<<
I am as much a trackless trolley fan as anyone, and whenever I am in a city that has them I will try to take a ride, but objectively when compared to the internal combustion engine bus their short comings outweigh the advantages.
Advantages:
1. Less polluting
2. Quieter.
3. Individual busses more reliable.
Disadvantages:
1. Fixed routes make it harder to change with changing rider patterns.
2. Inability to detour around obstructions. (Better than tracked trolleys, but still blocked by an accident that closes a street.)
3. Required maintenance of wire along the ROW.
4. Loss of electric power shuts down the whole line rather than one bus.
5. Problems with juveniles pulling the trolleys off the wire.
6. Overhead wire not aesthetic.
If you go back to the time of conversion in NYC the number one advantage (less polluting) was not a high priority (and Con-Ed was probably the city's single biggest polluter). At that time, the noise of horns all over the city was so loud, that the quieter operation would hardly be noticed. On the other side, all electric and telephone wiring was being placed underground in the "modern" city. There was a desire to get rid of the overhead wires necessary for trackless trolley operation which seemed old-fashioned. Although there is no doubt that the GM / Firestone / Standard Oil crowd were all lobbying for internal combustion busses, they did not have to work very hard to convince the elected officials that this was the way to go, and there was no organized opposition to change from the electorate.
Tom
Well said Tom.
One advantage I would add to the list is the ability to climb steep hills with ease. This has served them well in SF.
As a a Toronto transit fan raised on the same block as a trolleybus route, I was sad to see them go in 1993. One of the problems with the system in Toronto was that it was so small (2 divisions and 10 routes). Why invest in trolleybus infrastructure that only serves a small percentage of the TTC's riders (unlike the streetcars and subways)?
Another problem is that most of the trolleybus routes came from lightly patronized streetcar routes. Guess what? The trolleybus routes were lightly used too.
By the end, of the ten routes, only three or four could be classified as important routes.
I hope the same things do not happen in Philadelphia and Boston where many of the same circumstances that ended Trolleybus service in Toronto are now the same there.
Yeah, I hope so too. Teh trolley bus routes in Philadelphia are in not very popular places, like South Philadelphia (just loops) and in the Frankford area. I wish I could ride them before it may be too late.
I always wondered. I believe that at one time NY had busses that looked like they may have been trolley-like. They were green and can be seen on exposition in the Transit Museum in miniature form.
Why didn't they last? And why not bring the concept back? It seems with so many concerns about the high rate of asthma and the "poisoning of the enviorment", these trolley busses would make a come back as running on clean fuel.
Thanks.
oops I meant environment
I guess they aren't as pupular because once you make a trolley bus line, you can only use certain trolley buses for that line. What I mean is that, unlike Desiel and CNG buses, they aren't really that portable and can be taken to places off of the route.
The ones in Vancouver CAN be driven off-route (i.e. not under wire). They operate off the batteries, at low speed, for emergency detours.
When such a detour is in effect (construction, wire work, etc.) a "pole man" is stationed at either end of the detour. At the beginning, the pole man will pull a bus's poles down into the locked position, then the bus travels the detour, and a pole man at the end of the detour will put the poles back up to the wire and normal operation resumes.
The buses will NOT move unless the poles are in the fully locked down position, or up against the wire. If a bus's poles de-wire en route, the interlock activates and the bus stops (the doors also open).
I know San Francisco's ETB fleet does NOT have the battery operation setup. Lose a pole in SF and you stop. (Usually if you are on a Muni ETB and the pole comes off the wire, you hear the brakes lock up, followed by a fairly loud "Aw, shit!!" coming from the driver's seat. Then the driver goes out and re-wires the bus.
The ETB at the Transit Museum is a model of 200 such buses that ran in Brooklyn from 1948 to 1960 on as many as seven routes at one time. In 1932 started a single experimental ETB route, Courtelyou Road (today's B23). In 1948 the NYC Board of Transportation expanded the ETB system to six north Brooklyn routes - B45 St Johns, B47 Tompkins, B48 Lorimer, B57 Flushing, B62 Graham, and B65 Bergen. Additional routes were planned (e.g., B58 Corona, B53 Metropolitan) and appeared in route sign curtains, but after 1948 it was decided to standardize on 40 foot diesel coaches for all surface routes, so no more ETB routes were established.
Between 1958 and 1960 the entire Brooklyn ETB system was replaced with diesel buses.
According to the Trolley Bus Pics on this site,the B58(Q58)was operating Trolley Buses.Also if i remember correctly FP was originally a trolley depot
The 200 1948 trolley coaches had route sign curtains for the B58 in anticipation of further conversions, but that's as close as the B58 (and some other routes, such as the B53 Metropolian and the B72 Junction Blvd) came to running ETB's. The Board of Transportation decided to standardize on 40'diesel buses, so when the B58 (and many other routes) gave up trolleys in 1948-49 the replacements were GM diesels.
Fresh Pond's site was originally a trolley car barn, replaced with a diesel bus depot in 1960.
The Brooklyn ETB's were stored and serviced at two depots - Bergen St. and Crosstown. After a 1952 fire damaged overlead lines and isolated the Crosstown Depot, the entire fleet used Bergen St. till the 1960 closing of the Brooklyn ETB system.
At one web site I heard that SEPTA was going to replace all of it's remaining trolley buses with diesel buses? Is this true, or does anyone know?
With SEPTA, nobody realy knows. Diesels are used on the South Philadelphia lines on the weekends, many of SEPTA's fleet is in storage off the ETB lines. Just like the surface streetcar lines, what's going on changes from moment to moment.
Ride what's running and stay tuned. With SEPTA, anything is a crap shoot.
In the listing of the to 100 bus fleets in North America (Sep/Oct 2000), the flollwing cities are listed as having "Trollybus": SEPTA, King County, BC Transit, MBTA, MUNI, Dayton, and Edmonton Transit. The following properties don't know the difference between their elbow from an _ss _ole, (Property and flet size of "trolleybuses") DART 20, Utah Transit Authority 2, Via (San Antonio) 25, New Orleans 6, Akron 4. El Paso 25, Tampa 6, and Richmond 8.
Being a TT fan, I question METRO magazine on their method of collecting this information three years ago. I asked are these real TT or trolley replicas. Anyway, their 1998 and 1999 annual issue it has been corrected....till this year.
The staff in Metro magazine shoukd hace caught these mistakes and the people in the industry do not know what they have.
In a NYCT related item, NYCT listed as having 620 buses 35 feet and under, 4206 over 35 feet, 260 artics for a total of 5086 buses. Are the MCI 35 feet long? (yea, sure...)
The privates are not listed, however NYC Dept of Transportation is listed with 1288 buses, all over 35 feet. I never saw a NYDOT bus on the streets on NY. I seen Queens Transit, Green, Triboro, Command, but no NYCDOT buses.
This publication is free. You just have to tell them you are part of a consultant group (a little white lie).
www.transit-center.com
They are referring to the Access-A-Ride vans that is now under the department of buses.
Trevor Logan
www.transitalk.com
Green Bus, Triboro Coach, Queens Transit, Jamaica Buses, etc. are all operated by the NYCDOT.
[Green Bus, Triboro Coach, Queens Transit, Jamaica Buses, etc. are all operated by the NYCDOT.]
That would be operated F-O-R nycDOT by them .... also add Command in Brooklyn, and NY Bus Service & Liberty Lines in the Bronx.
nycDOT ownes the equipment, so that's why it was probally listed that way ... sometimes the individual companies are listed ... depends on who is writing the article.
Mr t__:^)
In, the U.S., there are Philadelphia and Seattle, perhaps,Dayton, Ohio, as well.In Canada, Vancouver, and maybe Hamilton, although I cannot be sure about it.
I forgot to mention Boston.
I believe Boston has just over 40 Flyer Inc. trackless trolleys that ply routes in Cambridge, i.e. only one section of the city.
Mr t__:^)
And you also forgot San Francisco!!
Hamilton, Ontario, stopped electric trackless trolley operation quite a number of years back.
Anybody have a guess what is the most irregular bus route?
For me it is the N20/21. The combination of high passenger loads, hills, and lots of traffic and lights make this route rarely on time.
Also saw 635 broke down on Roslyn road this afternoon.
Those diesels are getting worse. They gotta go!
You know, with all due respect, your LI buses are pathetic, especially for buses from the 1990's. I mean, the amount of times they break down, and they can't even drive with the a/c on. Also, you might see a few SEPTA Neoplan buses break down (one overheated on the 20 and I guess one broke down or something on the 104), but these buses are from the 1980's, so you've got to cut them some slack. I agree with you, John, those buses have got to go. I used to think Orion buses were fantastic, but I don't think so that much anymore (Orion Is are my favorite buses, though). Anyway, maybe those buses just need newer engines. You can always improve a bus I guess (LTS motto).
The Cummins L10G is used in most of the CNG's except for the brand new ones. The Cummins L10G is one slow, loud engine. I got a headache from the engine on bus 283 the other day. And 283 was slow and hesitating with the A/C on. This bus is only two years old!
The brand new buses run much better, since they use the much more reliable Detroit diesel series 50.
Of course alot of our diesel Orions can easily outperform the Cummins engines, and that's with the older Detroit diesel 6V-92. But those buses are breaking down too, but most of the diesel Orions came from 1991-1992, So they are at least 8 years old.
Remember, Orion is not the problem. They make great buses that NYCT and Queens Surface use that don't have anymore problems than any of the other buses.
The problem with LIB/MSBA is that they have poor maintainance. And with Cummins engines (notice how very few buses in NYC use Cummins)that spells out BIG problems.
And don't expect it to change, because the LIB budget remains rather bare bones, those crappy Cummins engines won't be going anytime soon. :-(
The worst bus line in the world has to be the Q2. It is the pits. This line is so bad that I regularly pay the fare on the Q110 or the N6 rather than ride the Q2 for free with my pass.
Today, bus coach 3822 was involved in a very bad accident. While dead heading back to the depot, it ran into the back of a flatbed truck which in turn hit a car. The entire front panel between the headlights is demolished and the dash board is smashed in and both winshields are gone. The operator is OK. Says the bus malfunctioned but don't know the details of that. Now it is roped off pending an investigation to see if it is in fact a defect. I'm curious to know if this bus will be repaired since the new coaches are now starting to trickle into the system. I'll leave more posts when I find out the details. BIG AL P.S. I'm talking about NYCT, for all you out of state buffs.
I bet that 3822 will be scrapped. Maybe a 3800 from Crosstown will take her place. If 4588 was scrapped, 3822 will definitely will be too-especially if it was a malfunction on the bus. I saw 8954 in her place but couldn't see what route-cause the rear sign wasn't working.
But good ol 1746 is still going strong. I see her every morning on Queens Blvd while I'm riding the Q60 to go to school. 1740 and 1755 too.
X68#3807Gary
I'm glad the B/O is ok. As for 3822--they should have left that piece of garbage in Edgewater Storage Yard (on Staten Island), so that it could eventually be pushed into NY Bay!
Mark
I think they are refering to the 3822 from Jamaica bus which they got around 1995, not the TA express coach from 1985.
The caption was a little confusing, but it's pretty clear this is NYC Bus #3822 which is/was housed at Jamaica depot. (Jamaica's Bus #3822, not Jamaica Bus #3822)
I forgot to mention that there is no Jamaica Bus Co. numbered 3822; just 3830-3865.
That's right, so it may be the TA 3822, so glad the driver was ok, but the bus was going to be scrapped pretty soon anyway.
If the engine is good, Fresh Pond may take the engine.
Depends on what kind of bus needs the engine. 4500 and older series buses are no longer getting engine replacements in NYCT. BIG AL
I just talk to one of the formans that I know at Ulmer Park. He told me that they are to toll to fit under the overpass of the Belt Park Way. The A/C unit is roof monted. This makes them taller then an MCI. The big boss of Ulmer Park won't let them put the Run on's/off's onto the local streets becouse is would cost theme more time/money and put to much trafice on the streets. Ulmer Park will get the MCI's when ore come in and the Viking will goto SI. To bad they are better looking then the MCI's.
Robert
MCI's won't fit either. They're 11'+ clearance. Several Belt overpasses are a mere 10'6"
-Hank
Exactly!
One way or another, Ulmer Park busses will have to run on & off using the streets from now on (assuming some kind of over-the-road coach is heading there). Perhaps, Robert means that the Viking would not fit under the Belt Parkway bridge that goes over Bay Parkway which makes me wonder if they would fit under the 86st el train. I've never noticed the cleareance on those bridges.
Shaun
mci buses are 11 feet 5 inches tall and will fit under most belt pkwy overpasses except possibly the infamous son of sam bridge. ive driven them on the belt from the verrazano to the gowanus. the roof remained inact. on the other hand vikings are a few inches higher. this is another example of the nyct stupidity.
as per new flyer web page their viking coach is 45 feet 8 inches with a height of 11 feet ten and one half inches. i will be on belt pkwy tonight and wlll check height of overpasses near ulmer park. it seems nyct should have checked the web page before ordering.
NYCT ordered THREE Vikings. If more are ordered, then height restrictions will no doubt be taken into account. Besides, there are ways of getting between Ulmer Park Depot and Fourth Avenue/Shore Road or Manhattan without using the Belt Parkway.
David
we also need to check the height of the battery tunnel.
12'9" is the clearance for the BBT.
R36Gary
Viking can fit under 86th street over passes. I thing that it is 12' 5". As for the hight on the Belt, I sometime drive the Orion CNG's between exit 2 and 1, when running off to Jackie Gleason. I think they are taller then the Viking. Also Command run there CNG's though the Belt Parkway all from Sheepshed Bay, from Knapp Street.
Robret
but neither viking nor mci will fit under the infamous son of sam bridge. its clearance is 10 feet 8 inches. so i guess bklyn will be getting our stinky orions.
Command CNG's are taller then 10'8" and they go under it just fine. Some are the marking are lower then the bridge. So Umler Park will get at less the MCI's when they come in.
Robert
Up is still going to receive the MCI's. The run-on/run-off will obviiously have to be changed. The buses will use Cropsey Avenue and 92nd Street to and from UP.
ZF
Thats how it was at one time and will be again. Thats all. A few extra minutes running off time for drivers.
Shaun
I was crossing 67th street and 5th this afternoon around 3:30, when I saw two southbound M1's in a row, which is not that rare. But what I saw afterwards stupified me. One of the M1's was limited. It had the orange sign in the window, and the message board uptop read M1 South Ferry, LIMITED STOPS. I always thought that M1's made limited stops SB in the morning, and NB in the afternoon. I was away most of the summer, did I miss something??
Clark Palicka
CEO TrAnSiTiNfO
http://www.transitinfo.cjb.net
Probably the dispatcher uptown made it a limited because it was late and he made an adjustment to make it catch up to schedule.
Hi all:
Sorry, I haven't been around in a while to display my love for buses. I thought some of you might be interested in a CATTA Crash. Yes its a New Flyer and communting can only get worse before it gets better.
Here is where the pic can be found
www.collegian.psu.edu/archive/2000/09/09-20-00tdc/09-20-00dnews-.asp
see ya
Ken
I don't expect a lot of responses to this, but I just think its great that DOT is repaving Merrick Blvd.--during the day!! Now it takes the Q5, Q84, Q85 and the N4 about 3 years to go from Baisley to Springfield Blvds. I guess overnight paving is out of the question, huh?
Mark
does anyone here know the final assignment for the 100 mci buses due to begin arriving 10/3/00. yukon is now bulging at the seams with 2 hour pullin lines some nights.
I have been to the last 2 bus fests in Brooklyn. Have yet to see the double deck "Queen Mary". Any reason for its lack of attendance would be appreciated.
My guess is that it needs more mechanical work in order to get safely on the road, since it was built in 1938.
The Queen Mary had been scheduled to be at Bus Fest 2000 but had transmision problems and was pulled at the last minute. It WAS at Bus Fest 1999, on the court street end.
Peace,
ANDEE
lllll
I would like to know on how many of the 100 MCI buses will be assigned to Yukon, Castleton & Ulmer Park Depot.
Please post information on bustalk.
If any of you had taken the promotional Diapatcher exam, you can expect your NYCDCAS results notification card by Monday. I received mine Friday, and lo-and-behold, I passed. When I calculated my score against the Key offered a few months ago, I had failed according to that answer key, however apparently there were errors, so a new final adjustment was made. Due to personal issues, I couldn't attent SLD classes, nor spend much, if any time studying. I doubt I'll get called anyway. I don't think they'll reach the 500's, but at least I knew enough to pass without benefit of study or instruction.
If you took the test, and thought you failed because you matched your answers against the Key in the Chief, you probably passed. Good luck to you all :-)
QV
At the TA's BusFest, I was able to pick up a great book on the GM New Look Buses aka "fishbowls". In it, was a section on SF's Muni fishbowls--the T8H-5305's. I remember visiting SF in the early '80's when these buses were in their heyday, and I must say that they were, by far, THE fastest fishbowls I ever had the pleasure of riding. At the time, they were in their Houston Astro-type paint scheme (different shades of orange), and those large tail-lights that most 5305's had. They were equipped with a DD 8V-71 engine and had no air conditioning, which enabled them to climb those SF hills with ease. I remember riding them on the 38 Geary, 31 Balboa, and the 15 Third (which I took to Candlestick Park for a Giant-Pirate doubleheader). I know they are retired by now, but has Muni preserved any of them? Which buses replaced them, the New Flyer D40HF? I was so impressed by those 5305's! And 10 of them were T8H-5305A's.
Mark
While in Newark or Hoboken 10 or 15 years ago, and I was not dreaming since I was there with one of my friends and we both saw it, on one of those small local company routes was one of those SF muni fishbowls in full Astros paint scheme running in service.
I recollect a company called something like Maria Transportation had 2 of those former Muni fishbowls and ran them in Hoboken-New York PABT service similar to today's Academy route. I believe the Metropolitan New York Bus Association chartered at least one of them for one of its trips back then.
09/25/2000
I was on that fantrip, I believe it was a double header with a Los Angeles MTA fishbowl too.
Bill "Newkirk"
That would have been Maria Transportation. The author of the GM fishbowl book (John McKane) actually drove one of them back to New Jersey, and from the stories he relates, it must have been quite a trip!
Those Muni fishbowls lasted quite a long time in S.F. Originally in a dark marooon color scheme, they were numbered in the 3200's and 3300's as I recollect. Eventually, a good number of them were rebuilt, painted in the scheme you refer to, and numbered in the 3500's and 3600's. Some were replaced when Muni received the New Flyer D900's in the 4800-4900 series. The rest disappeared when the newer 40 foot New Flyers in the 8800-8900 series came in. Some of the fishbowls may have also retired as Muni received new artics. I do remember a few of the fishbowls had air conditioning.
The book had the buses numbered in the low 3000's (3000-33??). The 10 air conditioned buses were originally numbered in the hi-3100's (there was a pic of 3187 in the book with a/c). I was unaware of the number change when they were overhauled.
Mark
The Muni T8H5305's were numbered 3000-3179 and 3190-3390. The ten T8H5305A's were 3180-3189.
Bus 3390 was originally 3112; it was returned to GM Engineering, who used it for testing for a while. They sent Muni a replacement 3112 and when they were done with the original, also sent it to Muni where it was numbered to 3390.
ALL of the buses received the new paint scheme, starting in 1973 when they were 3-4 years old. One bus, 3209, received an experimental scheme which was very similar to one of Chicago Transit Authority's paint schemes (Harold Geissenheimer, General Manager of Muni at the time, came from CTA.)
The Flyer D902's which started to replaced them were the 4500-4679 series. (Muni NEVER had buses in the 4800-4900 series.) The 4500-4679 series replaced the buses NOT rebuilt in the early 1980's. The rebuilding encompassed 150 buses which were renumbered 3500-3649; however, the renumbering was NOT in any order. It was done by Robinson Coach in Minnesota; the buses were flatbedded back and forth to that location for their rebuilding.
The rebuilds themselves were replaced in the late 1980's -- 1988 and 1989 to be exact, with the delivery of the New Flyer D40's in the 8801-8850 and 8901-8956 series.
the SF MUNI Flyer D902 series are numbewred 4500-4674 and are amogst the best 6V92 series engines I have ever experianced!
Blue
Yep, they are the best sounding ones I've ever heard.
But they ARE 4500 to 4679 as I originally posted. Below is the VIN-numbering sequence as provided by productionlists from Flyer/New Flyer. Motor Coach Age also has the same info in an older issue.
The Flyer serial numbers are as follows:
4500 is DP012208 (1 unit - 1983)
1984 units:
4501-4569 are EP012234-EP012302 (69 units)
4570-4573 are EU012303-EU012306 (4 units - note change in VIN digit)
4574-4637 are EU012307-EU012370 (74 units)
(above group began a new Flyer serial sequence, but continued the VIN numbers from preceding group)
1985 units:
4638-4679 are FU012371-FU012412
(Source of above info: Flyer/New Flyer production records)
NOTE:
4574 was wrecked en route toMuni and was replaced with a second 4574; it has a VIN-number of FU012530. There is a photo of both the wrecked and the good 4574 next to each other in a Muni photo book by Jeff Moreau.
While the Muni T8H5305's had the quickest acceleration imaginable, they were not fast as far as a top end speed. They could only hit around 50 miles an hour top speed. This is due to the differential gearing being different. They also had transmission modifications -- the bevel gears in the VS-2 transmission were those normally put in transmissions to be hooked to 6-cylinder engines, from what the author of the GM fishbowl book explained to me. They also had constant drive radiator fans, which made them very noisy; also contributing to the noise factor was that they were equipped with Jacobsen Engine Brakes ("Jake Brakes").
Muni specified these buses to be able to make ANY hill on their route system. That they did, very well!! I remember being in San Francisco in the late 1970's, and the cable car system cable on Powell Street broke -- so out came the T8H5305's to the rescue. I'llnever forget going up the hill onPowell Street in that fishbowl; it was quite noisy, but it surely made it up the hill with a standing load of passengers. (If anyone knows how steep that hillis, you'd certainly think that Muni drivers had BALLS to drive a fully packed bus up it!!!)
Seattle Metro's T8H5305's were built to the same specifications.
As far as preservation of any of the Muni T8H5305's, the Pacific Bus Museum has beautifully restored bus 3270 to its original maroon and light yellow paint scheme. It is in fully operational condition.
Bus 3226 was also restored to like-new condition and is owned by a bus dealer in southern California.
Quite a few of them also wound up south of the border with Autobuses Baja California, in Tijuana, BC. I recently found one in rather poor conditon; it was a home-done motorhome conversion and it is in junk condition in Hemet, California.
Thanks for that great info. I do recall the gear shifts being quite rough. In fact, there was a rather loud sound that was made when the tranny shifted from first to second. That shifting noise added to the greatness of the ride!
The 8V-71 engine was a fun one to listen to, especially on those MUNI's. Around these parts (Queens), the Jamaica Bus Suburbans, and the MSBA 1978 Flxibles stand out in my mind.
Mark
I think that squeak/grunt when they upshifted was due to the power of the engines the way they were set up. Seemed like all of them did it.
As for sound, I thought I heard it all until one day I was on geary Blvd., in 1983, and one of the Muni T8H5305's was working the street and had absolutely NO muffler connected!! What a sound!!! You could hear it for half a mile in either direction. I'll bet it pissed off a lot of people if it worked a late night run....
I actually made an audio recording of one of Muni's T8H5305's back in 1971. It was on the 72 on Haight Street in the wee hours of the night; I was following behind the bus in my car. Didn't even have to stick the microphone out the window, that's how good the sound was!
I just had to laugh when I read that post. Kinda reminds me of a current Series 50 RTS (1994-1999) with muffler problems. They make quite an interesting sound as well, but nothing like the old 8V71's.
Mark
>>> If anyone knows how steep that hill is, you'd certainly think that Muni drivers had BALLS to drive a fully packed bus up it!!! <<<
I think the hairier trip would be the fully packed bus going downhill (especially when the street is wet).
Tom
Funny you should mention that....when I did ride the Muni T8H5305 UP Powell Street, it was working a run of the 60-Powell/Hyde cable car run. Muni carried everyone UP the hill, but when we got to the top of the really steep one on Hyde Street, the driver told everyone that's as far as they could take us, and we all had to get out and walk. That hill is too steep to drive a loaded bus down, safely. I've even been leery of it in my own car.
MUNI fsishbowls sill survivant known to me are:
3000 even presenty under restoration
3182 known as "The Dike"
3153 and 3210 owned by busfans in SF and thatappear regularly in the TV show "NAsh Bridges"
Several MUNI fishbowls were rebuilt nto SFPD busses with 3595 now SWAT commando base a very impresive sight.
3640 became a NYCTA-Police inspired SFPD troop transport.
Also another unit was done as a commando post origially by a group of busfans and Green Tortoise Bus lines for the Eddie Murphy movie "Metro" and was later re-purchased by the city for use as an SFPD bus number unknown right now.
MUNI attempted to restore 3267 which thanks to vandals was un-restored and is used by SF Sherrifs for jury transportation in the original yet tarnished Maroon/Cream.
As for the Maria Transportation units SF 3227 and 3240 along with SCRTD 3166 and 3244 made up their fleet.
I will look up more of my info and see what I can find.
Blue
Thanks for all that additional info!
Green Tortoise had 3004 running around on their "routes" for awhile; someone up in Muni-land gave me a slide of it years ago. Looked rather strange seeing it with a school-bus type luggage rack on the roof and a ladder up its ass. I don't know if it still runs as such, as the only Green Tortoise unit I've seen in recent years was just a few months ago southbound on I-5 in irvine, CA -- it was a GM old look that look like it just came out of the factory. Strange....
I have more Green Tortioise roster info if ye needs it.
Riding the GT regularly gives the busfan needed serial and other info.
The two 5305s you see are of Seattle heritage and the old looks are from all over.
I will compose a roster if ye want.
Advise.
Seeing GT's roster would be interesting.....I didn't know they had ex-Seattle 5305's, but I know for sure that Muni 3004 did go their way ages ago. (Slide by T.McS. if you know what I mean....stillhad "3004" in the GM front plate instead of "GM".
Here is a great trivia question for you West Coast boys:
Which one of the Muni T8H5305's was used in the movie 48 Hours, with Eddie Murphy and Nick Nolte?
Mark
NONE of Muni's 5305's were used in "48 Hours"!!!
Look at the interior shots....blue upholstery on 2x2 seating. That should be a giveaway.
It was actually an ex-Santa Monica bus from what I heard, but the interior could have also been San Diego.
SMMBL 5374 is alledgedley the 48 hours bus.
Does anybody know what type styles were used for numerals on trolleys, busses, and subways cars? There is the type style used by the ENY depot until a few years ago that I am specifically interested in.
If there is a specification available, I could sure use that. Thanks.
The numbers formerly used on TA buses were a different face from those formerly used on subway cars. Both of these faces were far more elegant than the garden variety, generic helvetica which has taken over recently. I hope the future might signal a return to the older style. There was a period during the 2-tone green bus days when numbers were stenciled in contrasting green paint. Then the nicer decal numbering came back and remained in silver, blue and white on buses until recently. Somehow I am not hopeful that these nicer numbers will again be seen on city buses.
METROCARD & CARDHOLDERS COLLECTOR CATALOGUE
This is an 8.5 x 11 inch 20 page booklet printed by the MTA. They later decided not to distribute it. It contains 20 glossy, color pages of actual size photos of 1997-99 commemorative MetroCards & cardholders. Full color photos of the Subway Series 97, Then and Now, Emigrant, JVC Jazz, Healthy City, Ferry Boat, Yankees 98, Subway Cool, Millennial Journeys, Mets International Week plus 63 Cardholders including the complete Great Subway series. All photos are actual size & full color! A beautiful collector MUST HAVE. The supply is very limited. When they are gone, they are gone.
Send $10.00 ea.+ $2. P & H in check or Money Order
Made out to Mike Makman.
To: Prof. Putter
Po Box 755
Planet Station, NYC NY 10024
I seem to recall that Jamaica Buses had a few T6H5305A's that had 3 or 4-speed transmissions. I believe it incluced some of the 1968 and 1970 5305's (numbered in the high 800's, low 900's). I am not talking about the S8H5306's that they had (150-159), I am just referring to the local T6H5305A's. Does anyone have any info on these buses?
Mark
DOES ANYONE HAVE A SHOT OF PRT AUTHORITY GLASSTOP GMC 5307 #20???
IF YOU CAN GET ME A PRINT CASH IS YOURS!!!!
Unfortunately, Alcorr Tours and I had a misunderstanding about starting the service. I had told them several times that I wanted to start today, but they were looking for a final go-order which I knew nothing about. Therefore, the RM2 did not run this morning and will not run this afternoon.
Parties who would find the RM2 useful should e-mail me because I will hire a bus to do it if I can find 20 people. Hopefully, this situation will be straightened out soon.
Well today I decided I was going to try three bus routes I haven't been on. The first one was the new Q76 extension to 20av in College Point. I picked it up this morning at Francis Lewis and Northern.
It was a ride through nice quiet residential areas. Also it was very empty, and the ride was pretty fast. This was bus 657, so fortunately no slow 6V-92. And today was cold, so they had heat on the bus.
Then when I got back to Flushing I took a Q44 to the Parkchester 6 station. That ride was also nice, and it was very fast using Cross Bronx service road, and the Series 50 engine did well on the Whitestone bridge.
I got off at Parkchester and got an eastbound 6 train of Redbirds (which won't be around too much longer).
Anyway I took it the Pelham Bay Park terminal, and was planning on getting a QBx1 back to Flushing. So I got on a "QBx1", which was an Orion CNG. We went to Co-op city, which has alot of shopping around there, and a pretty suburban feel to the area. I felt lost as we went around in circles, and saw the NE Corridor w/catenary several times, but no trains.
Anyway after going to Co-op city we went south again and the last stop was where I got on!! I was back at Pelham Bay station, and thought I was going to Flushing. I guess there must be QBx1 buses that just go to Co-op city, but that doesn't make any sense! Queens Surface just does intra and inter Queens routes or so I thought. So I waited for a bus that said Roosevelt ave Flushing in the front sign (now I know I have to look carefully). And I waited. About 4 or 5 buses going to Co-op city came, but not one for Flushing. After waiting about 25 minutes I decided not to wait anymore in the blustery conditions outside, and catch the 6 train to 125th, then a 4 train to 42nd, and then a ride on soon to be retired redbirds on the Flushing express.
As far as the QBx1 to Flushing goes, I guess it runs very infrequently. No wonder whenever I see the QBx1 in Flushing it is always packed.
I was hoping to see how those Orions performed on the bridge but I guess next time I'll have to get a schedule! Stupid me, I only thought you needed them with Long Island Bus!
According to the Qns and Bx bus maps, they operate to Flushing but every 20-30 minutes during non-rush hours...
QBx1#456Mike
According to the timetable, weekday non-rush and all weekend service on the QBx1 over the Whitestone Bridge is on a 30-minute headway. In the rush hours, it's mostly 20-minute headways, with a few runs at 15 minute intervals. I took the Flushing-bound QBx1 from Pehlam Bay Station a month or two back, and I remember a sign indicating where at the QS bus stop you catch the Flushing buses. I believe it was closer to the el station than the spots for the various services to Co-Op City.
30 minute headway off-peak! Geesh, that's a bit too LI Bus like for me. I guess QS feels ridership is light on that route, but as I said before the QBx1 buses that I see leaving Flushing are packed at ALL TIMES.
Also I feel the Pathmark shopping center (with the nearest Wendy's currently to Flushing) on Farrington St in Flushing is underserved by bus lines. Only the QBx1 and Q25 service the street near the shopping center. Sometimes I've waited 20 minutes for a bus in rush hour, that's pretty bad for Queens. Why doesn't NYCT run anything near there?
On a nice day I give up waiting for a QBx1 or 25 and just do the 15 minute walk to downtown Flushing. Considering this is the closest major shopping center to Flushing you'd think more bus lines would run near there.
As a result I'm usually "one of the few" taking the bus to this shopping center and I feel right at home in the usual LI-type "everybody drives" scene. What a contrast from downtown Flushing less than a mile away.
Theres nothing of great substance in that shopping center. If there is it's for neighborhood folks. Why come from LI to go to that place???
Because I take the 7 train and when I get off I want to go to Wendy's, but since the kind folks at Wendy's have decided to desert Flushing I have to go to the Pathmark shopping center to eat in one (I hate McDonald's and Burger King, they're expensive and their food is horrible).
Also there's a chinese takeout there as well as Pathmark. There's no "take-out" chinese resteruant in Flushing, just a sit down full service ones. And Pathmark has a lot of different things under one roof, there aint one store in Flushing that's like that.
Thinking about it, hasn't anyone thought of redeveloping the Caldor site into a movie theater/food court complex like what is being done in Times Square?
John, I've felt your LI Bus pain today. I decided to ride my friend's bus from SJU to LIJ today on the Q46. Realizing that no back-track Q46 buses were coming, I decided to ride on the N25 towards Northern Blvd to go to Flu-shing. Wishing that I would get a 2000 CNG Orion, I got Cummings CNG Bus 235 whih I thought ran pretty good. It was kinda hot on the bus though and the zigzagging after Marcus Ave to New Hyde Park Rd was kinda weird. Overall, she was a good ride. Then I got to Northern Blvd and S Middle Neck Rd which started the disaster. I got on bus 623-which her front sign was broken and the bus was mobbed. It got to the RR Station there and it got much worse. I overheard someone was waiting over 25 minutes for a bus. I was squished in the front and I opened the window. Then someone asked me to close it cause it was too cold for her. And so I did. And I thought that ride was such a drag. It took an hour to get to Main St. 623 is very similar to the 1993 Orion V series which I think is junk. LI Bus made the 7 look like a lounge cause my car (9641) was so empty and tis piece of junk on LI Bus was so full I couldn't wait to get off the thing. Another good part of my day was that I got to finish the day riding one of my favorite buses from QS: 396. Like you say, another typical day for LI Bus- IT STINKS! As far as the QBX1 is concerned, wait till you ride it over the Whitestone Br, it's a real treat. LAst I rode it, I had 341 which was pretty fast. Call up QS for a local schedule: 445-3100 and they'll sned 1 to you. Or you could email info@qsbus.com. Whatever way is better for you. Have a nice day!
Q104#396Gary
I got my QSC local schedules at BusFest a couple of weekends ago.
They are all color-coded, with the color bar on the left side of the front cover, with the front end of #501 on it.
PURPLE BAR: QBx1 Q25/34 Q65 Q65A
GREEN BAR: Q101 Q101R Q102 Q103 Q104 Q66 Q67
ORANGE BAR: QM1(A) QM2(A) QM3 QM4
If you see any color but orange on the schedules on the buses, it's your lucky day. Just hope it's the right color.
Inside, there's a picture of #700, now running on Green Bus Lines. There's also a picture of #388 by the unisphere, and on the green schedule, there's also a picture of #474 with a sign that says "LOCAL."
I did take some schedules at the Busfest. After looking for the stuff I looked through them and found the local bus schedule and the one for the QBx1. Sure enough they have 30 minute headways, but according to the schedule a bus was supposed to leave Pelham for Flushing at the time I was waiting and one never showed. I guess it was late.
Well, next time I'm bringing the schedule and taking it from Flushing!!
Yeah the N20/21 going to Flushing is usually slow and crowded. Because they don't run enough buses. The N20/21 gets the same amount of people at the N22 and N24, yet not nearly the amount of buses the N22 and N24 get.
And the traffic and stops makes it a miserable ride. That's why I think it is the worst LI Bus route.
Orion bus 623, as well as most of our diesel Orions uses that miserably slow 6V-92 engine. A few of Stengal's buses, mainly in the 200 series are slow and use this engine.
But the TA has higher standards and will be getting rid of the old 6V-92 engines and replacing them with series 50. It sure would be nice if LI Bus could replace the old 6V-92's in their diesel Orions with Series 50.
LI Bus is a pretty miserable service to ride. The buses just look so neglected, and this all probably has to do with the county's bull**** budget crisis, which could easily by solved by raising taxes on the wealthy people in Nassau county. It was found that people in wealthy areas like Old Brookville, Manhasset, and Roslyn pay less % in taxes than people in Levittown, Hempstead, and Mineola. It's all because of the faulty county assesment system.
There's plenty of money in Nassau, it's just in the hands of the wrong people.
[There's no "take-out" chinese resteruant in Flushing, just a sit down full service ones.] I've eaten in a sit-down Chinese restaurant along the south side of Roosevelt Avenue, just a few doors west of Main Street. I can't remember the name, but think it's called the Flushing Noodle House or Flushing Dumpling House. The prices are moderate, and they seem to do a huge take-out business.
You'd be surprised- I live within walking distance of the Pathmark center of which we speak and one weekend ran into someone from work who took a CAR SERVICE all the way from South Ozone Park to use the laundromat there!
By every cash register there's a blacklist of people who have passed bad checks, and there are a lot of addresses from all over the city, the island and Jersey.
True, the center is more motorist-oriented, especially since it's on the expressway and the last one before the Whitestone Bridge. Hence, you've got a lot of 18-wheelers pulling in to use McDonalds, Wendy's, Dunkin' Donuts, Italian deli, pizza, diner, two Chinese and Pathmark itself. Its proximity to the Queens Surface offices, DMV and many new office complexes has made it much more than a neighborhood attraction.
Since the multiplex and the Toys/Kids 'R Us opened across the road, it's gotten even busier. Since bus service is mediocre at best, with two QS lines stopping a block and a half away, the area has become very clogged with private car services, legal or otherwise.
Yeah - The QBx1 between Flushing and Co-Op City doesn't run too often. My good friend who live in Flushing used to ask me about the QBx1 when I used to ride it often. He would comment about how it didn't seem to operate often. I explained to him that for every QBx1 he saw in Flushing there was probably at least 2 more in the Bronx the operated between Co-Op City and Pelham Bay Station. This was during the the mid 1980's when the QBx1 used those awesome Grumman Flxible 870 and GM of Canada T8H-5307A's. Once in a while I was unfortunate enough to get an RTS.
Wayne
The QBx1 is a very confusing route.
The basic "northbound" service is Flushing - Whitestone Bridge - Pelham Bay - Co-op City (Sections 1, 2, 3, 4, 5) - Pelham Bay. The basic "southbound" service is Pelham Bay - Co-op City (sections 5, 4, 3, 2, 1) - Pelham Bay - Whitestone Bridge - Flushing. Some short trips run only between Pelham Bay and Pelham Bay, using the New England Thruway exit at Edson Avenue for the 1-2-3-4-5 loop or Palmer Avenue for the 5-4-3-2-1 loop. Some peak hour trips start or end at Bellamy Loop (Section 3) or Asch Loop (Section 4).
The main things to remember are...
I. The Bronx terminal stand is at Pelham Bay Station.
II. Anybody waiting within Co-op City can take any bus in either direction to reach the #6 train.
III. Service to/from Queens is pretty much an afterthought.
IV. When in doubt, ask the driver.
I just read that the subway pusher Julio Perez who pushed a man in the tracks of an oncoming 6 train is set to begin. You can read the stroy Here
Clark Palicka
CEO TrAnSiTiNfO
http://www.nyctransitinfo.com
Interesting, but more appropriate to SubTalk, no? :-)
David
Was Julio Perez himself a MTA worker?
You can read this story
Clark Palicka
CEO TrAnSiTiNfO
http://www.nyctransitinfo.com
Today while at work at the Newark Shops, Lakeland MCI were brought in and repainted (4 MCI 9Bs and 1 MCI 9A). MCI MC-9B #5005 and MCI 9A #6509 came out the paint shop while I was there looking like the day the came off the MCI production line.
Lakeland is still providing service but not for long. Get those Lakeland pics while you can.
Trevor Logan
Are they owned by NJTransit? I thought they were still independent. I last rode on them in December (an MCI from Basking Ridge > Port Authority via Summit, and back, also on an MCI).
Chris
Lakeland is private but does operate NJT equipement, the 1982-84 MCI MC-9As and 1987 MCI MC-9Bs!
Trevor Logan
And a Metro-B Sub. PABCO's 10 goes by the garage.
Trevor - does this mean Lakeland is out of business? Or are you saying that their older equipment is being repainted into NJT colors?
Or for that matter - are you saying that older Lakeland equipment is being replaced with leased NJT equipment?
I'm saying that Lakeland is definately going out of business, NJT is possibly taking over the routes, until decided, Lakeland will continue to operate buses. But not for long!
Trevor Logan
Trevor, Do you know what is going to happen with Lakeland's charter operation ? I know that they have at least 20 lavatory equipped MCIs that are used only for charter service including l coach that is set up as a VIP lounge coach. They also have a line run to Foxwoods Casino in Connecticut.
As mentioned in posts several months back, NJT taking over Lakeland's scheduled routes is a result of the settlement reached in Lakeland's law suit against NJT for the loss of business Lakeland suffered when Midtown Direct Service was instituted on the Morris & Essex line. There were rumors at the time that Lakeland was trying to sell its charter business, but I don't know what the latest is on that.
Any thoughts on what they are doing with some of their old MC9s?
Are they selling or scrapping those?
They'll probably do both, sell some, scrap some!
Trevor Logan
They still have a charter & tour service availiable. They have upcoming tours scheduled for the next several months. http://www.lakelandbus.com
Well if Amtrak plans to operate on the Cutoff it better happen soon.
Motor Coach Industries will no longer use the current naming of coaches, i.e. D3, DL3 and so on.
The new models will be as such:
D3 will become D4000
DL3 will become D4500
EL3 will become E4500
G3 will become G4100
GL3 will become G4500
Example:
"D" being the series, 45 begin the size, and 00 being the year
So the new DL3s coming to the MTA will be noted as the MCI D4500 Cruiser and MCI D4501 Cruiser.
Trevor Logan
www.transitalk.com
I guess this marks an end to 2-axle, 96" wide, MCI's being produced. In which case the model number changes make perfect sense.
Mark
It's pretty straightforward, a lot less confusing. I applaud the change.
Chris
they will all be d4501 as that is the model year currently being produced. our previous mci buses are 1999 and 2000 model year. the exception being 1860-1863 being 1998 models.
The Washington Post ran an article in its Metro section this morning on the Roadeo, focusing especially on WMATA's entry. The story can be accessed online at http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A9372-2000Sep24.html but the print version is better, if you can get your paws on it, as it includes two photos of MUNI buses.
Chris
I sat in the back seat of two LI Buses today (I was cold and LI Bus don't have heat yet). The CNG Orion I had in the morning had alot of heat coming from the engine (that back seat was hot). The diesel Orion I had going back was hardly warm at all. Do CNG engines run hotter or is the Cummins prone to overheating?
I dunno about Cummins running hot....I thought they actually ran cooler than Detroits. i used to drive a Gillig Phantom with a Cummins in it, and that piece of shit wouldn't make heat for anything. Spent many a morning shivering down the route, listening to all the teeth chattering behind me.
The funny thing is, that particular bus had an engine fire and burned to the ground. Maybe someone went back there and thought they could light a match and make some heat....
Perhaps the Gilligs just have a lousy heating system. Our Gilligs at LI Bus are cold in winter and hot in summmer. The vent system in Gilligs suck. There's very little, if anything, positive about the Gillig Phantom.
Agreed one thousand per cent. Gillig Phantoms just plain SUCK. I actually transferred from one garage to another, just to avoid driving the things. The quicker they all get sold off to Tijuana, the better for me.
Who builds those airport mobile-lounge people mover things? I've done a fair amount of digging on the 'Net, but have been unable to find manufacturers. I did meet a fellow, now a charter bus operator, who used to operate the people movers at Washington-Dulles (IAD). He couldn't recall the manufacturer -- I don't think it was a big name company -- but did have some enlightening information about their operation and design.
Anyhow, any idea who builds these? Any leads at all would be appreciated.
Chris
Just trying to see if my new name change went through.
ZF
it appears this will be the first nyct mci to be scrapped. involved in an accident in june it sits in yukon with a scrap sign on it,. the floor of the luggage compartment appears buckled. it saw 9 months of revenue service.
What happened?
-Hank
2098 may have a scrap sign on her, BUT here is the deal, she will be returned to MCI to be completely redone over since under warranty, Just like New Flyer C40LF #950!
Trevor Logan
www.transitalk.com
Besides, why would they scrap a bus that's not even a year old? If 1993 TMC Bus 8485 from HP is repairable, so are New Flyer Buses 950 and MCI 2098. They'll be back!
B61#867Gary
Since when does a warranty cover collision damage?
-Hank
Well in this case it does because these boys are under a contract lease. Believe these words, you'll 2098 again in revenue service!
Trevor Logan
www.transitalk.com
The Vikings will be returned to Lodi some time this week.
Again??? What's Up?? These busses seem to spend more time at Lodi than at New York City Transit Depots! I wonder if they may actually go into service some time this year???
Shaun
Have any one receive Gleen's Bus Roster? I haven't got my almost a months now & i just found out that 30xx to 33xx are gone. Also what up with Glenn's new look Bus Roster??? I thought he already done his new look Bus Roster couple months but never put on the site. So im looking forward to see new look for Gleen's Bus Roster.
Peace Out
David Justiniano
www.geocities.com/justin2669/nyctransitrans.html
BTW: I found out that NovaBus Hybrid #6360 went back to New Mexico.
Glenn is my bud to the end, but his roster needs some serious work.
Check out Mark "5100ZF" Holmes, Very up to date and accurate!
Trevor Logan
www.transitalk.com
Maybe you right Trevor about Gleen's Bus Roster & i did enjoy looking at your Bus Roster. BTW: Artics #5295-#5309 is heading to Gun Hill Depot from Kingsbridge Depot & other day i saw #5304 running on Bx4.
Peace Out
David Justiniano
Yes, 5300 on Concourse as of this morning.
Joe C.
There is a bus roster available on Transit Talk (Trevor's site) It isn't Glenn's--its a lot better, if you ask me. You may want to check that one out. Its updated as of September 21 I believe. That should help.
zf
Can anyone provide me with a list of the old Staten Island (NYC) "R" busroutes before they became the "new" "S" routes. Can anyone explain why the change. I was out of the country (US Army) when the change took place. Thanks. E-mail me the information at haroldyagerman@hotmail.com
The change was in 1975 when the Borough of Richmond officially changed it's name to the Borough of Staten Island.
The numbers on all busses remained the same.
In 1990, the busses were renumbered, but they were already "'S' routes" for fifteen years when the renumbering took place.
The current system uses S40 series for north shore routes, S50 for cross-island routes, S60 for Victory Boulevard routes, S70 for south shore and S90 for limited. A limited bus will have the same number in the ones place that its local counterpart uses. In addition to renumbering, many routes with multiple branches were split. The S107 became both the S78 (Tottenville branch) and S79 (SI Mall Branch, eventually routed into Bay Ridge Brooklyn).
Express bus routes were also renumbered into a more logical pattern, but I don't know what it is.
The 78/79 are the old 103. The 107 was the Forest Ave line, now the 48.
s1=s40
s2=s51 (rerouted after elim of s72)
s3=s46
s4=s59 (rerouted)
s5=Combined with s104 prior to renumbering
s6=s66
s6s=s60
s7=s53
s101=s42
s102=s104
s103=s78(Tottenville)/s79(SI Mall; later rerouted from St. George to Bay Ridge)
s104=s52 (rerouted)
s106=s67
s107=s48
s108 eliminated prior to renumbering
s109=s72, later eliminated. s51 rerouted.
s110=s54 (extended to cover portion of s4 eliminated)
s111=eliminated.
s106/111=s57
s112=s62
s113=s74
s115=s55/56 (later rerouted)
s117=s76
s61 (new route)
The xbus routes were fixed later, with the x9/x11/x13 being split into the x1-x8, with the new x9 added later.
-Hank
How does the pattern for X-busses work?
There's a pattern? Basically, x1-x9 are Hylan Blvd corridor buses. There are no other patterns.
-Hank
Originally, the S.I. Express numbering "pattern" was even numbers (X8, X10, X12, X14, X16, X18) on the North Shore and odd numbers (X9, X11, X13, X15, X17, X19) on the South Shore.
That pattern started to die when the X20 (South Beach P&R) was created, and now is all but gone.
I finally got my scrapyard photos up, look at http://www.quuxuum.org/~nixon/new/ in the 'scrap' directory.
-Hank
Excellent pictures! Are those 1984 Flxibles from MDOT? Continue to keep us all informed.
Peace & Blessings
DaShawn Pretlow
www.transitworld.org
I believe they are. THey had Maryland Department of Transportation on their fronts.
-Hank
Yep - those were our 8400's. We sent those to scrap when the 9900 NABI's arrived, along with our lone remaining 8300.
Thanks for the information.
DaShawn
www.transitworld.org
Nice pictures, where are the bus scrap yards at?
Where is the scrap facility located? Some of these buses look like they just got there recently (i.e. the Queens Surface Transit buses can't be there more than 6-8 months - and the nycta 4524 as well.
Thanks.
Flx7595
Doremus AVe in Newark. It's just off truck 1/9.
And it smells funky over there. If you have a respritory problem, bring your own oxygen supply.
-Hank
There will be a chat tonight, Wednesday, September 27, 2000 at Subtalklive.com. There will be NO chat this Saturday. This is not a permanent schedule change so there may still be a chat next week on Saturday.
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Question are the buses stored at the various yards all headed for the scrap yard or are they there for emergency backup if they needed more buses?
For Both Reasons!
Trevor Logan
www.transitalk.com
I was waiting for the 4:29pm N21 out of Glen Cove to Flushing this afternoon. That bus never showed. So I figured the one out at 4:52pm should arrive ontime. Well wrong again. That bus never showed until 5:15pm. It came in as an N27 to Glen Cove, which must've gotten caught up in construction related delays at the LIE intersection of Roslyn road (if you've seen it, it's a real big mess).
We finally left at 5:15pm, almost an hour since I started waiting. The bus was slow, it's was 276, one of those junky Cummins ones, even though it just arrived a few years ago. It was very jerky and slow on hills. Plus it was crowded, SRO after Plandome Road, when noisy school kids got on.
I finally arrived at Great Neck at 6pm, so I got something to eat (there is nothing to eat in Glen Cove, and several stores there are closing, it's a real dump).
So I figured I'd start waiting for the 6:40pm bus to Glen Cove. But get this! At 6:30pm an N21 to Glen Cove pulls in, which was the bus that was supposed to leave at 6:10pm!
Lately there just doesn't seem to be a schedule for N20/21 during the PM rush. They just come when they come. There were probably a few breakdowns, add that in with the usual stop and go traffic, lights, and passengers waiting at every stop and it's impossible to keep a schedule. The traffic on this route is a nightmere. They gotta do something to widen alot of these north shore roads because they can't handle the traffic. But unfortunately area residents want to pretend this is a rural area by opposing more lanes, which makes the N21 nightmere even worse.
I also saw Gillig 509 earlier in the day broke down at Roosevelt Field. It was on the Hub shuttle and a tow truck arrived for it when I left.
Also I had two nuts bugging me each way on the N70. This is just hell!!
I feel your pain, John! There are so many buses at LI Bus and they don't run many of them at all. That makes no sense. When I rode the N20 Monday, I couldn't wait to get off of it-it was a ride from hell. Every 2 blocks stopping and smudged with people-not a pretty site at all.
N25#235Gary
If I have to ride LI Bus more than 15 mins. to get to my destination from Queens, then I don't go. I know that it's different for you John because you live out there, but there is no way that I could continually put up with service like that without going nuts. I would buy a used car. Either that or take LIRR a lot(if it goes to where I have to go).
Well another wacky thing happened on LI Bus today. I was waiting for the N27 out of Glen Cove. The bus arrived, and the bus driver chatted with one of his friends for 10 minutes. We were supposed to leave at 6:25pm, but didn't until 6:30pm I rang the bell for the bus stop right before Wendy's in Greenvale. The bus didn't stop, and I yelled "STOP". He finally did stop the bus after Wendy's and let me out. There were 5 people waiting at the bus stop who ran over to the bus to get on. After I got off the bus started to pull away with these people running. One guy started banging on the bus, and cars nearby honked their horns to try and get the bus to stop. After around 10 feet it stopped and those shaken up people waiting got on.
This was bus 280 and I noticed that when I boarded the bus I smelled beer. That guy drove like he was drunk, and his actions should be reported. He must have been really, really out of it not noticing 5 people waiting at a bus stop!
Then report them.
David
The Los Angeles Times ran two stories regarding the Los Angeles Transit strike today (9/27/00). The first one titled MTA Strike Talks Collapse; No End to Walkout Seen points out that no settlement is near, and the mayor, rather than urging give and take bargaining, has come out in support of the MTA position.
The other story Study Calls Into Question MTA Claims on Labor Cost debunks some of the early MTA claims about how high the drivers' pay is. It looks like anyone from Boston, New York, or Washington who was packing their bags to get in on the big bucks can start unpacking.
Tom
i really liked the sounds of the macks when they rolled the streets of brooklyn... they had a sound distinctly different from the gmc diesels... did anyone hear the mack running on its way to court street or back?.. did it have a different sound to your ears?
I heard it when it left for the day. It revved up a lot right as it was waiting to make the turn onto Court St. Sounds like a Mack truck to me. I heard Mack always made its own engines, rather than using Detroit Diesel. The Mack fire trucks also always had that non distinct truck sound, where the others (Seagrave, LaFrance) used Detroit Diesel 6V-92, and sounded somewhat like buses. (The Peabody garbage trucks too). But now they have all switched to DD series 50 or 60 4 cylinder engines, and the sounds are no longer as distinct.
Although I was running late leaving Brooklyn yesterday, I figured that with some bright sunlight left, I would go over to Belmont at about 6:15 PM and see if I could find the Slopeback that Trevor Logan had posted (#17600)here. I went to the blue parking area (where a lot of new Chevy's are stored). As I approached I thought I saw it with the setting sun glistening off of it. As I got closer I was right but.....they have repainted it. The top is still white but the body has been painted dirt or s--- brown.
There is a temporary registration in the window, but no plates. The back door appears to open with wires, similar to the straight back RTS's I saw in Beantown recently. I took some pics but there is still some film left on the roll...When developed, I'll sent to Trevor so that with his skills, perhaps he can do a before and after post.
Behind the slopeback was a Flx 870 formerly of NJT #2202. Its been there awhile with a regi for a GMC and the plates not matching the regis. Behind both of them was former NYCT # 1459.
As I got off the CIP onto Hemp. Tpke I glanced in the south lot and saw another former NYCT bus from Jet-Away with the back up...Probably DOA from engine trouble.
I just recieved a picture of 5034 (TA60102N)in service on Wilshire Blvd in Los Angeles for the radio promotion. I dont know how to include the picture in this posting so if anyone wants it, email me and I will send. Also, Trevor has a few other photos that he is scanning for me so when they are done whoever wants them, shall get them.
See my post to SubTalk about articles in Mass Transit.
Mr t__:^)
I have been hearing talk of a $2 fare for express buses on Staten Island, so I want to throw out a couple of ideas for affordable express bus service to Manhattan as well as limited stop service to other points. Please pick the top two ideas or offer your own.
1) $3 peak fare to Manhattan via a reverse X12.
This bus would run in the opposite direction to peak X12 buses and operate to Midtown via New Jersey.
2) $2 peak fare and $1.50 off-peak fare to Manhattan via Victory Boulevard.
This bus would use standard transit buses to Downtown and Midtown Manhattan 5-7 days per week. Buses would run via Victory Boulevard, Clove Road, and the Grasmere SIR Station.
3) $2 peak fare and $1.50 off-peak fare to Manhattan via S74 Limited and S56.
Using standard transit buses, this bus would operate as a limited stop service via the S74 to the Staten Island Expressway. It would also stop at the Grasmere SIR Station. On the South Shore, it would follow the S56 to Woodrow Road/Foster Road.
4) $2/$1.50 off-peak fare to Midtown Manhattan via Hylan Boulevard and Bay Ridge.
Using standard transit buses, this would operate as an S79 Limited to Bay Ridge, where the buses would continue to Manhattan.
I know that the S74 and S79 do not offer limited stop service. That would be part of the pull.
Your reactions, please.
bus 998 arrived at yukon yesterday and encountered these problems. it cant fit under entrance doors thus it cant be fueled or washed. it also only has 2 nd a half inches clearance in battery tunnel. nyct will only send it through lincoln tunnel. that is if they can figure out how to fuel it.
AH Sugar Honey Iced Tea!
Looks like the New Flyer D45S "Viking" is not the perfect bus for the TA, But according to sources at NJ Transit, They are looking at the Vikings also. So if the NYCMTA demonstration doesn't fair well, NJT may take over these three coaches!
This was said back in April and recently again in the past three weeks.
Trevor Logan
www.transitalk.com
You said UP...bah
--Clayton Parker
998 left for casey stengel depot yesterday in this continuing saga. i dont know where 996-997 are. so now we will rely on big al, mark and our other queens bus talkers to keep us informed whether these buse will fit in queens midtown tunnel and ever see revenue service.
I'm pretty suprised they sent it over to CS before they sent it to WS.
I'm pretty suprised they sent it over to CS before they sent it to MJQ.
If any place should have seen the Viking, it should have been Queens Village or Jamaica. I doubt the Viking will fit in the Queens Midtown Tunnel. The tunnel maximum height, according to various signs, is 12 feet, one inch. The Viking, at 149 inches tall, according to the New Flyer website, is a few inches over that. Looks like the "NewFy" is NJ bound unfortunately. I for one would have loved to see a few in the city.
I stand corrected, The New Flyer Site lists the Viking at 142.5 inches tall, barely clearing the 145 inch Queens Midtown Tunnel. I'm not quite sure where I saw that 149" number.
Why would 998 go to CS? It should go to either QV or Jam. That was such a dumb move. I wonder when she'll get to Stengel? Will she ever hit X51 Express Service? I know someone was on the lookout for her today and she wasn't there yet. Neither were the RTS.
Q32#4448Gary
I will say this ONCE. There is absolutely no way that any Viking will see a JA logo--EVER. Jamaica Depot is simply too physically small to accomodate such a large bus. The place would practically have to be rebuilt--fuel stations, bus washes, lifts, heck, even the doorways to the depot itself. QV would even have a problem. While it is a larger depot than JAM, manuevering a long and tall bus in there can be rather tight. Bus 998 went to CS because there is more room there, the fuel stations and bus washes can accomodate different types of buses and the parking is 100% outdoors. The only problem is there are no lifts that can handle the Vikings in CS. Hmmmm, where to next?
Mark
This was the same problem with Ulmer Park. The exhaust pipe touched the top of the pull in door and the rear part of the bus scraped the street alot. Someone also said it could not fit inside the battery tunnel but I don't believe that.
The main boss of the depot said they could raise the sidewalk but that was before the busses were shipped out.
Shaun
4448 was on the 74 on friday (run 1 - 2nd half)
This Viking issue keeps getting better and better by the minute. I don't know if 996 will be able to stay in CS, but I do believe that they will be able to fit in the QMT. I believe that Hampton Jitney and Harran Coachways operate their rather tall Prevost H345's through the tunnel on a regular basis. Are the Vikings taller than the Prevosts and MCIs E-series, Rennaisance coaches?
Mark
The New Flyer D45S "Vikings" are just a smidge shorter than a the MCI E4500 (EL3 Renaissance).
Trevor Logan
www.transitalk.com
Today, a Flxible Metro-E was on the T2 @ Friendship Heights this morning. Also, on Tuesday, they were running a new Orion V on the L2 or L4 (didn't see which nor did I see the unit number) and on the N4. I strongly suggest you go to the Fort Totten Service Lot before the Fishbowls, New Looks, and RTSs are auctioned...
Also, if you go to Fort Totten during weekdays, you can see the RTSs in service! Quick, take photos!
What routes? And how long do I have?
Well, on the K6 for one. It also goes to white oak. I don't know how long they will last though.
WMATA's bus fleet is getting less diverse with the new arrivals and current withdrawals from the fleet. I'm happy that there will be a strong Flxible Metro presence for several more years. While I was sad to see the new looks finally go - I won't really miss the RTS, but even they were pretty good (and fast) buses.
Wayne
Its sad to see the fleet get less diverse. Although, having the Orion VI's running around adds a little difference to it. The Flxible Metros are my favorite and luckily, WMATA has several hundred of those. I've noticed buses getting swapped around though, I guess due to losing the retired fleet and the additions of the new Orions. For example, Flxible's 9780-9785, which used to come out of Montgomery, then I believe had a short stint in Bladensburg, are now operating out of Four Mile Run. Also spotted 8828 and 8836 in Montgomery, which I think came out of either Bladensburg or Southern at one time.
I also wonder why the 20 35 ft. Flxible Metros, 9480-9499 only operate in VA and don't get spread around to some of the MD and DC routes, though.
I saw 5180 and another one of those in VA. Others are operating Ride-On routes such as the 36 from Montgomery.
Yes, I also noticed that WMATA have transferred some buses. Those funny looking Orion II's also keeps the fleet "interesting". I wonder what going to become of WMATA's 31 foot Gillig Phantoms.
Wayne
Originally, I thought I heard that the Gilligs were bought specifically by the DC Government to be used solely in DC. I think that's why they are almost always on the W lines in SE DC as well as some of those other smaller routes. Years ago when there used to be a route from Kennedy Center to Georgetown Hospital, I would see an occasional Gillig on it as well. It seems like a lot of the bus fleet has been put in a bottle and shaken up and dumped on a table and that's how the buses are being dispersed.
Those Orion II's definitely are different. I haven't had the pleasure of riding one of those things. I remember reading an article in the Washington Post about residents complaining about how noisy their brakes were. I guess that has been fixed. I was hoping it would be a problem that would cause them to be sidelined altogether.
orion 2 in a league with eagle as the ugliest bus built.new flyer viking is now competing.
the new flyer viking looks nice in my opinion. But the Orion II is really ugly. Eagle buses aren't ugly.
OK - That would explain it because I've never seen WMATA's Gilligs outside the District. Those Orion II brakes were pretty noisy - I haven't ridden them either. The Orion II's don't seem to be very quick off the line. I'm curious to know if they're fast buses.
Wayne
I'm not sure how fast they go. You'd think they would as small as they are, but probably don't have to hit the highway all that often. I'd be afraid that it would fall apart if it did go on.
Well, to answer your questions --
I ride an Orion II most every time I want to take the subway somewhere, because it's a bit far to walk (2 miles), there's no cheap parking at the station, and the bus runs from a block away from home right to the station. Being threaded through the narrow D.C. streets, this local "neighborhood" route is served almost exclusively by Orion IIs. So I've been riding them almost since the inception.
The noisy brakes have been fixed -- WMATA and Orion settled a dispute about that six months ago; the upshot, I believe, was that all brake pads on all 40 buses were replaced. (On whose dime, I don't recall.) So they're fine now, but they were literally ear-splitting before -- I remember having to cover my ears when waiting at a bus stop; it was very sharp, loud, and high-pitched.
I sort of agree that they're homely vehicles, but in a sort of lovable way. Personally, they've always reminded me of Star Wars Imperial Shuttles.
On the inside, they seat 26 passengers; they also have the capacity for two wheelchairs by folding up rows of seats. They have a wheelchair lift, but it's not really necessary -- the flat floor is almost exactly at curb height. The driver sits on an elevated platform, presumably so that he's at the same level as other bus drivers.
In terms of speed -- I don't think any of them are routed on highways, so I can't answer that question, but I don't think they'd be TOO pokey. The engine sounds pretty small, but there's not a lot of coach to tug around, so it does pretty decently in acceleration.
All 40 buses in WMATA's fleet are equipped with electronic announcements. Two buses are festively painted as "Adams Morgan-U Street Shuttles," with Keith Haring-like outlines of people on the side. One or both can usually be seen parked at Western Division during the day; I'd think most of the traffic on that line would be in the evening, when the bars and nightclubs in Adams-Morgan open up. And some of the other 38 buses in standard paint have full-rear ads -- the buses are of course too small to display standard bus ads on either the sides or rear. These full-rear ads are applied in similar fashion to those WMATA full-bus ads of a few years back -- from the inside, they're more or less transparent.
The bus I would like impressions of is the Orion VI. Anyone ridden in one of these yet?
Hope this helped.
Chris
They run on the 98 every evening and all day Saturday and on the 99 in the morning rush. The 2 buses that do this are 3717 and 3718. Pics on my site.
I've had the chance to ride a few Orion VI's. I believe they were 2003, 2006 and 2007. One was on the 2B from Fair Oaks Mall to Ballston and the other two were on the 23A from Ballston to Tysons Corner. At first I wasn't used to the fact of sitting at eye level to the other cars on the road, but these buses can haul pretty good. There appears to be a lot of wasted space in them, but there were plenty of seats. On the right hand side there are all sideways seats all the way to the back door. The left side has more forward facing seats. I haven't spoken to a driver personally to see if the like them or not, but they appear to handle fairly well.
I noticed on Orion V number 2153 that there was an advertisement behind the driver indicating that this was a brand new Orion bus and that if anyone really liked it, they should call WMATA customer service and tell them about it. I had to laugh at that, but I guess they are proud of these buses.
I remember I always rode the RTS buses. I'll actually miss them more than the new looks, though, since I rode the RTSs more and the destination signs on the new looks were illegible.
I got the docket off Metro's web site for the hearing for October 24 at the Montgomery County Council Office Building. The following changes will be discussed (modified slightly from the docket on wmata.com):
The extension of the C8 from Glenmont to White Flint which would replace Ride-On 40. Same headway would be maintained. This change would be made so it is easier to get from PG County to Rockville and so the connection between Eastern and Western Randolph Road would be guarenteed (in other words, eliminated). Also, the last 3 weekday evening trips and Saturday trips would be eliminated as well as the corresponding 40 trips.
The elimination of the N7 bus. Since the N7 averages 121 passengers on 10 daily trips with an average load factor of 27% (ratio of passengers to seats), the WMATA board guidelines justify service reductions on routes with load factors less than 50%. Also, based on the route history, there is no reason to anticipate an increase in ridership. The line ridership has decreased dramatically since the opening of the red line to Shady Grove in December of 1984 when the route was the N9. Due to the lowered ridership, it was consolidated with the N5 which ran between Glen Echo and Federal Triangle and stops were added in DC for former N1 and N3 riders (the N3 has returned since it was discontinued in March 1995 and now that I think of it, foreshadowed this elimination of service). Alternative service is provided on other MetroBus and Ride-On Routes (the T2, N2, N3, N4, N6, J1, J2, J3 and Ride-On 26, 29, 35, 38, and 47 come to mind immediately).
The elimination of the Q1 bus. The Q1 was incepted in September of 1990 in conjunction of the opening of the Wheaton Metro Station to supplement rush hour service on the Q2 in both directions. It has been underutilized since inception and service has been reduced several times. The Q1 averages 90 passengers on 7 daily trips with an average load factor of 29%. According to WMATA board guidelines, service reductions on radial routes is justified when load factors average under 60%. Based on the route history, there is no reason to anticipate a Q1 ridership increase in the future. Alternative service would be provided on the Q2 which is not scheduled to change.
According to the Chevy Chase Gazzette, WMATA is proposing leasing retail space over the 4 acre Western Depot...
Yesterday I had the distinct pleasure of taking my first ride on LI Bus Route N91, the JFK Flyer (I took a slight detour on my way to Shea Stadium from NJ!). My 12:15 p.m. out of Hempstead was Gillig 35 foot bus #500, which seemed to have permanent JFK Flyer signs where ads normally go on the outside sides of the bus. The same sign was on the driver's side outside on bus #510 going in the other direction. Also saw #513 and #709 (Thomas) in JFK Flyer service. Looks like this may be home for some of the 35-foot Gilligs for awhile.
Hi Sid. Like I posted a few weeks ago, the driver told me the Gilligs would not be around long. They still are, as are the Thomases. My intention to ride the Flyer was to get a Thomas, thinking the Gilligs had been done in. The first Flyer I missed from JFK was an Orion! Then the Thomas came along. A FUN ride, actually! Windows open, drizzle coming in with the breeze. Bouncing. Yes, it was fun. Arriving in Hempstead, I saw a 35' Gillig roll up. A much as I didn't want to ride the Flyer back to JFK, I couldn't resist. The Gillig was slow at first, then kicked "into it". Loud, too. On vacation I shall attempt to grab a 40 footer from Jamaica, perhaps.
Joe
I rode on a few new LI Bus CNG Orions yesterday as I toured Nassau County for a few hours, and thought I noticed those lighted arrows on the side-view mirrors of these buses, like the ones many of the SUV's have. Can anyone confirm the existence of these mirrors?
Yes they have light in the mirrors. This has been possed A few week before on bustalk.
Robert
I was on Green Bus Lines #712 (MCI Classic) on the Q-10 yesterday, and realized that, if you close your eyes, the bus sounds just like a new look fishbowl. Guess you don't have to run up to Canada to experience that wonderful sound! I was surprised to notice that the builder's plate at the front of this bus said, "MCI Greyhound Canada, Inc." Is this the same plate in most of the other NYDOT Classics?
If you want to ride a fishbowl without going up to Canada, New York Bus Service still operates them on their express runs from Manhattan to The Bronx.
Been there, done that! I rode 1489 to Pelham Bay over the summer and she was a real treat.
BXM7#1489Gary
You are correct Sid. The other MCI Classics at the other DOT Companies have the same plate.
Peace & Blessings
DaShawn
www.transitworld.org
According to the TA, the 1990-1993 TMC RTS-06s and 1993 Orion Vs are supposed to be recieving new Detroit Diesel Series 50 engines, but a recent trip to Detroit Diesel in Lodi proved it wrong!
Here is a pic of Orion #303 with a new Detroit Diesel Series 92 Reliabilt Engine with a DDEC IV, Yes, that's right a DDEC IV!
Trevor Logan
www.transitalk.com
You mean they're just getting new 6V-92's? There's got to be a logical reason for this. Perhaps the bus design required to many alterations (like a stupid looking engine compartment extension).
Also I see what looks like a LI Bus in the background.
Yes that was this bus right here:
Trevor Logan
www.transitalk.com
8519, 8547 and i think 8524 all were rebuild within the last frew mouths. They still have seriecs 92 engins in them. So I guest that they are still install them.
Robert
Here in LA we had a similar experiance.
When the Methanol and Ethanol TMC RTS 06s were to begin thier dieselization MTA announced that they would put in BRAND NEW Series 50s as engine testbed 1310 got.
However when it all came to fruition in 1998 they began to start sending them out for Diesel packages and they came back with rebuit 6v92s. As it was a much cheaper move.
Some used parts of the exsisting engine and many used parts cannibalized off of sale ready GMC RTS 04s in the meantime.
Note 1422 stil has its Cummins M-11 test engine.
1273 was converted to CNG with an L-10G but dieelized. Boy what a hanger queen it was.
And 1264 was the first 6v92 conersion for those who are paying attention.
Blue
I saw GBL #647 in Jamaica yesterday, and it was painted in the standard Green Bus livery, but with a green band around the bottom foot of the bus (like Jamaica Bus and the new Triboro liveries have). I thought it looked pretty nice with that band, but don't suspect it necessarily ushers in a slightly different GBL scheme.
Bus #647 has been like this for the past year or so!
Trevor
GBL 647 is a former Jamaica Bus, that is why it has that green band painted on the bottom. Looks interesting and gives it more color.
Here's a rear shot I got of her a while ago:
GBL 647 at Kew Gardens Rd View 1 Q10
And 1 by Kevin Barsky:
GBL 647 at Jamaica Ave View 2 Q8
And Bus 225 is kinda weird too-she has a black bumper in both the front and the rear. Here's a rear pic of her:
GBL 225 Queens Blvd Q37
There are others-so be on the lookout!
Enjoy!
Q60#603Gary
Back in the late 80's a lot of Queens/Steinway Transit RTS also had their bumpers painted black.
Wayne
I remember QS 216 was the last 1 at QS to have the rear black bumper. But I also remember most of the ones that had them in the front: 25-26, 28-29, 37-39, 41-42, 44, 207, 214, 216, 219, 221-222, 227, 232-234, 236, 238-239, and 245. I remember most of the others had them too but they got repainted white shortly before they were retired from QS Service. There are a few at Triboro lurking around with rear black bumpers: 685, 734-(had it but was repainted white) 2136, 2826. As I said earlier, I'll be on the lookout for some more.
Q53#2826Gary
I rode this "dog" on the Q46 today. Not only did she smell like fish sold at Fulton Fish Market but she's slow as a tortuise and smokey. Why would someone have a stinky smelly slow bus out on the street? She's a hazard in more ways than 1. Lucky no one got sick.
Q46#9371Gary
A week or 2 ago, I was summarizing the best rides throughout Queens. I only got as far as the Q36. Now this is part 2 but only the routes that I've been on before will be covered:
Q43: Once out of the traffic on Sutphin Blvd and onto Hillside Ave, this ride can be a speedy treat for some. Martin Van Buren school kids will be your obstacle.
Q44: LIMITED- See Q20A/Q20B
Q46: Now this route, I can fully explain cause I take this bus everyday. From Queens Blvd to Utopia Pkwy is the real headache. Cause at 164 St you have "challenged" people go to a rehab center at Queens General and at 173 St, you have St John's University. My bus in the morning goes from mobbed-empty just at this stop alone. Going towards Queens Blvd you're sometimes waiting 3-4 buses cause they're so packed. After 193 St, this bus goes past Cunningham Park where it can get pretty speedy. It does get a little slow at Springfield Blvd where people either transfer to the LIJ/260 St bus at rush hour. Then it gets speedy past Creedmore- and yes you do get your share of the loony tunes getting off there. After Little Neck Pkwy, the bus will either turn onto 260 St which has some nice apartment houses right next to each other and a circle where the bus goes around a park. Or the bus will continue onto Lakeville Rd LIJ Hospital. Feels strange that an MTA Bus is actually on LI. You go around a traffic circle once in the hospital to drop off and pick up to go back. A nice treat if you're a bus fan.
Q48: Once out of the streets of Flu-shing after College Point Blvd, the Roosevelt Ave Br over the Van Wyck Expwy can be a smooth ride. Passing it's home base and Shea Stadium, and onto 108 St which can be lengthy with the traffic lights at Northern and Astoria Blvd. After Astoria Blvd, the bus goes down Ditmars and into LGA Airport. Going back from the Airport, the bus passes by Triboro Coach yard where you can get a great look at the planes coming in.
Q54: Metropolitan Ave- A Narrow Ave that goes a long way. Between Cooper Ave and 80 St is the best part. TSS Mall past 69 ST can be a pain with people.
Q55: Myrtle Ave- between Woodhaven and Park Row South is the stretch on this route. Otherwise, just a traffic nightmare near Fresh Pond with all the stores there.
Q56: The J/Z Alternate via Jamaica Ave. Not many open strips here. Can be a drag.
Q58: A route that goes a long way but it's worth it if you're a busfan. From College Point Blvd to 108 St on the sideroad of the LIE can pick up speed provided that there's no parked cars along there. The zigzagging past Cornoa Ice King onto Broadway which is a pain cause of Queens Blvd. Then onto Grand Ave where it zigzags into busy Maspeth. 40 minutes from 108 St and LIE to 69 St and Grand Ave where the LIE is. By car it takes as much as 5 minutes. Onto Fresh Pond Rd where the shopping is. Then zigzagging onto it's destination Ridgewood. This line I call "The Snake"
Q59: A shuttle of the Q58 but passes Queens Center Mall and 63 Dr and in Brooklyn, Williamsburg. Lengthy waits for this bus however.
Q74: From Queens Blvd to Queens College, it's a treat for some cause it runs along the Q20A, Q20B and Q44-which are long and draggy and it's actually empty. Melbourne, Main and Union are the only fast strips here.
Q75: 188 St-73 Ave the 2 main streets this bus run on and it's a speedy 1. Again, long wait for this bus.
Q76: Well if racecars were up here, then why not buses? Let's see what they got. From Hillside Ave-Northern Blvd on Francis Lewis Blvd, this bus can floor it. A must for busfans despite it's lack of service. Bad idea-people wise for serving 20 Ave 131 St shopping center-expect more people here.
Q79: Little Neck Pkwy- a bus that comes once in a blue moon. If you like riding buses alone, you'll like this route.
Q88: If speed 3 took place, it would take place on this route. Quite a few speedy strips once out of the Queens Center vicinity. LIE Sideroad, 73 Ave and Springfield Blvd are the main 3. The traffic circles on 188 St in Fresh Meadows are scenic. A treat if you're a schoolkid and/or busfan.
I forgot 1 in previous post:
Q24: Atlantic Ave-very speedy and open. Pass the retired LIRR locomotives and passenger cars. Jamaica Hospital on the side of the Van Wyck puts brings this bus to a screeching halt traffic and people wise.
I will do the DOT Routes soon. Stay tuned!!!
R142A#7215Gary- like the redbirds I will soon be retiring R36Gary!!!
This will probably be my new id. Be on the lookout!!!
>>>Feels strange that an MTA bus is actually on LI<<<
True. When I take the Q5/Q85 to Green Acres, something doesn't seem right.
I just hope that someone doesn't come along to nitpick about the fact that LI Bus is also an MTA service. I betcha someone will.
Gary, conspicuous by their absence are the Q77, Q83, Q84 (one of the more peaceful routes), and the Q85. I'm interested to hear your take on those lines.
zf
I've never rode on these 4 routes before. I only did the routes that I've rode on before. Anyone else can summarize these 4 routes for me, I'd like to know how they are before I ride on them.
R36Gary
Let me wish all Bus-Talker's "L'SHANA TOVAH". May we all have a happy, health and sweet New Year.
To Trevor Logan,
I would like to know on what the express bus fleet reconfiguration will look like at Yukon, Castleton, Ulmer Park, Michael J. Quill, Jamaica, Queens Village & Casey Stangel Depot will be like when NYCT will have the first of the 100 MCI buses that will start arriving next week until early November 2000.
Please post the latest information you have receive from NYCT Department of Buses.
I posted something here a little while back that I got from DOB, I haven't heard anything change except for the fact the SI will recieve thier 40 MCIs first to reflect new SI Express Service then 60 off to Ulmer Park.
Trevor Logan
To Trevor Logan,
Since you just posted about the MCI buses with 40 going to SI first & 60 going to Ulmer Park, which SI depot will the 40 MCI buses be assigned to & I have recently heard about the express bus bill that Governor Pataki hasn't signed just yet which would create 4 new South Shore express bus routes & that a Private operator just started two new routes just recently.
I would like to know if you have heard from the DOB or Operations Planning on the 4 new routes on where will they operate between & there new route numbers but just remember, the Governor HASN"T sign the express bus bill.
I know some of the answers, but I am not Trevor.
-Hank
FOLLO .stop the TO________
To Trevor Logan,
I would like to know if there is anynews to report on the Maspeth Bus Depot & when construction will begin or will the depot be fixed up. If
Fixed up, when will it open & what bus routes would be assigned to Maspeth.
I have at least some of the answers to these questions, but since I'm not Trevor, I'm not going to provide them.
David
Anyone answer, I have too much to do tonight (Site Update) and really can't answer all of these questions, not with my info book not in front of me!
Trevor Logan
This morning while on the way to work I spotted a Q-44 Orion loading passengers at West Farms. What attracted my attention was the bright orange lettering on the destination sign. The bus number was either 522 or 622 I couldn't tell for sure. Is this the only TA bus to have this kind of lettering?
522, and yes.
David
There's at least one bus on the Green Lines that has the same thing. It usually is always on 34th street, waiting.
Clark Palicka
CEO TrAnSiTiNfO
http://www.nyctransitinfo.com
I rode on that bus a few weeks ago. It's one of their Orions. Are the orange signs just being used as a test model (I believe) or will the TA convert to orange signs?
Green has exactly one bus, #5503, with the bright orange sign. It's a WMATA-rejected Orion wrapped in an ad for the American Museum of the Moving Image (how appropriate).
I live along/near three of Green's routes (or, more accurately, three NYCDOT routes operated by Green) - Q10, Q37, and Q60 - and #5503 seems to appear most often on the Q60.
Yeah when I rode 5503 it was on the Q60.
Why was it rejected by WMATA?
Chris
There was a funding crisis. We wnt over this a few months back; the discussion having started with "If DC didn't weant them, why did we take them?" There was nothing wrong with the buses, but WMATA lacked the money to buy them. So NYCDOT got a sweet deal.
-Hank
I believe it was 522, since I've seen that bus before testing the orange sign. It is very bright, I believe the company on that one was Bailios, instead of Luminator.
Thursday I had the 522 on the Q26. I saw 5503 that same day on the Q60. 4961 is the other bus with that type of sign.
Q26#522Gary
The bright orange signs are LED signs and have no moving parts, unlike dot signs. All electronic, the Baltimore MTA got them with our order of 9900 NABI's. Hopefully, besides visability, lower maintenance costs and signs that break a lot less. In a year of operations, there is only one recorded sign failure on a 9900, and that one was a blown fuse.
Hopefully, the signs will be retrofitted to the other NABI's and the Flxibles. Dot sign failures are epidemic, with 60% of the service fleet on the street with non-working signs.
I've seen the orange signs a lot on the NABI's. When I take the shuttle from Greenbelt to the Orioles game once in a while, those are usually the buses used. The LED signs, although not orange, are also used on the Alexandria DASH buses. I've heard from various maintenance people as well that the flip dots are a real pain to keep up. Once in awhile I'll see a WMATA bus with the flip dots all messed up. On one of the old RTS buses, part of the destination "Fort Totten" was stuck on the side of one bus, so no matter what the destination was, it would have "otten" at the end of it, i.e. "Silvotten Sprotten." What a disaster.
[Dot sign failures are epidemic, with 60% of the service fleet on the street with non-working signs.]
You should see GBL's Orions. Some need those new signs BAD! Command Bus runs 4961. Haven't got a pic of that one. I've got pics of 522 and 5503, though. I rode on 522 when it was on the Q74 route. The interior control panel instructs the drivers to change this sign manually (i.e. through the control panel, not the farebox). It displayed the message:
5741
Q74 KEW GARDENS
-------
5741
Q74 QUEENS BL
Inside, the side sign has a label that identifies it as a Bailios sign, has its serial number in French, and a telephone number in the 418 area code. (Quebec, Canada)
That is correct. But now Balios has a plant on Long Island and has a contract with the State of New Jersey and I think the State of New York to place those great orange signs for traffic notification. That information was in one of the trade magazines a few months ago. These signs are currently in place near the GW Bridge and they are spectacular to look at, and they are just as bright as 522, 4961 and 5503.
Peace & Blessings
DaShawn
www.transitworld.org
What are some transit 'trade magazines'? I doubt they'd be in popular bookstores, of course, by definition, but Borders and Tower *do* carry some fairly obscure titles like 'Fire Apparatus Journal' and 'Commercial Shipping' (both of which I am a regular reader of, I might add). I sent away for a free subscription to some transit-industry monthly a couple of weeks ago (forget the name now), posing as a transit paint-scheme consultant, but so far nothing.
Anyway, what are the names of some of these trade magazines? Where can you subscribe/buy them?
Thanks & peace,
Chris
I found "Bus World" at Borders a couple of times. Its not a bad magazine, mainly lots of pictures. Metro magazine is really good.
One of the previous posts a while ago had Metro's website. If I rememeber, it was www.transit-center.com, but if you go to www.apta.com, you will find a ton of resources from all sorts of transit publications, as well as the websites for these publications.
Good luck in your search!
Thanks! I appreciate the help. The APTA Metro publication was the one I'd sent away for, based on that post you alluded to. I'll keep my eyes open at bookstores from now on, I guess.
Thanks for the tips!
Chris
I've seen them along the Long Island Expressway between Maurice Avenue and the Grand Central Parkway, also facing northbound Woodhaven Blvd. at the LIE. The signs on the LIE say:
GCP EAST
USE
EXIT 21
while the sign at Woodhaven Blvd says:
BUCKLE UP
IT'S THE
LAW
Speaking of LIE there, what are they doing? Past Maurice Ave on the sideroad westbound to 58 St has been closed what seems to be forever and I have no clue what they're doing. And all they're doing is digging and making the roads a mess. My Question is what's the project and how long will it go on for? I know it's not related to buses but it has to be asked cause it's a headache for some.
R36Gary
Lessee, are you talking about the area from Woodhaven Blvd to the Van Wyck, or the area from Woodhaven Blvd to the BQE?
The former is for widening and bridge replacement. As for the latter...driving it several days a week, I see no progress, so I couldn't tell you.
-Hank
Another place that's using the bright orange signs is that multiplex cinema place along the Van Wyck Expressway. I've actually seen the light from that sign as far away as the 111 Street station on the #7 (subway) line. If I only had a set of binoculars to read the text of the sign.
>>> What attracted my attention was the bright orange lettering on the destination sign <<<
I saw a similar sign on a DOT bus in Los Angeles last week. It is much more clear than the yellow ones. I assume it will replace the yellow ones through attrition.
Tom
To David,
Can you provide me with information in regards to the Maspeth Bus Depot on when construction will begin on the new Maspeth Bus Depot or if there going to fix Maspeth Bus Depot, if they fix it, when will it be open as a operating depot & what routes will be assigned to the new Maspeth when it's fixed up or when construction.
This question should be addressed to the crowd, not to me. Anyone who knows the answer shouldn't have to feel he or she is butting in by answering the question.
That said, the land on which Maspeth Depot is slated to be sited is currrently occupied by a building. I've seen the place, and it doesn't look like it can be used as a depot. Therefore, it would have to be knocked down and replaced with a new building. The facility is planned to open in 2003 (when in that year, I don't know). As to what routes, some schemes have been looked at, but we're as much as three years away, so things can change.
David
Cut out the To______..it is very rude and annoying to alot of people here
I know you understand what we are saying to you !!!!!
Steve